GNU bug report logs - #7196
24.0.50; NEWS item "Selection changes"

Previous Next

Full log

Message #21 received at 7196-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>
Cc: 7196-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#7196: 24.0.50; NEWS item "Selection changes"
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2010 21:44:51 +0200

> From: "Drew Adams" <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>
> Cc: <7196-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
> Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2010 11:45:51 -0700
> 
> > > #1 needs to also say something about the other systems, 
> > > which do not support a separate primary: e.g. do they put
> > > the selection on the clipboard? the kill
> > > ring? Where do they put it?
> > 
> > They do nothing and don't put the text anywhere outside Emacs.
> 
> Who said anything about outside Emacs?

This NEWS entry is about changes wrt exchanging selected/cut text with
other applications.  Anything else that pertains to selections, but
not to other applications, belongs elsewhere.

> When you select text on such a system, where is it saved
> (conceptually), since there is no primary selection?  We're talking
> about the case where it is not automatically sent to the kill ring
> and clipboard.

That's for the manual to describe, and if there are any changes in
behavior regarding that, they should be elsewhere in NEWS.

NEWS does not present a coherent complete description of each topic it
touches.  That is not its purpose.  NEWS is a series of short notes
about changes the user would like to study in detail.  The study
itself should use the manual and the doc strings.

> > > I don't know about the clipboard - is it a list or ring, like the
> > > kill ring?
> > 
> > It's a single buffer.
> 
> That doesn't tell me the answer. Can you put more than one piece of selected
> text there? Can you access those pieces separately, as you can with the kill
> ring?  Or is it a single piece of text, so that "putting into" the clipboard is
> actually setting its value, replacing the previous value?

Putting text into the clipboard or a selection sets their values.

> > I believe every user nowadays knows what happens with text that is put
> > into the clipboard or the primary selection.
> 
> Well, you are wrong. I'm a user, and I did not know that.

Then you will have to learn about that somewhere else, sorry.  NEWS is
not the place to teach such things.  The manual could be a better
place, if we really need to explain that (and I'm still unconvinced).

> > > Please add that info - don't just say what happens for X.
> > 
> > There's nothing to tell.  This functionality does not exist on non-X
> > systems, so whatever happens on X does not happen elsewhere.
> 
> The functionality exists of selecting with the mouse and pasting that text,
> without copying it to the kill ring.

Again, this entry is about copy/paste between Emacs and other
applications.  It is not about text selections in general.

> If you want to divide the behavior changes between those affecting interactions
> with other apps and those affecting Emacs-only behavior, because you think that
> will make the explanation clearer or simpler, fine.  But all behavior changes
> need to be described.

I don't think anything's changed wrt selections inside Emacs.

> You apparently just want to argue and defend your existing text.  Use what you
> want (you will anyway).  I'm just trying to help you.  If you don't want to hear
> about things that are not very clear, fine.

I simply think my job here is done, and bikeshedding over it any
further is not an efficient use of my limited time.  If people think
they can improve what I wrote, they are welcome to it.

> How much detail you give is up to you.  But NEWS needs to let users know what
> has changed in the user-visible behavior.  If you want to give just a summary
> that refers to complete descriptions in the doc, that's OK, but then the doc
> needs to cover it completely.

Please submit separate bug reports if you find the manuals incomplete
or incorrect on these issues.

Previous Next

GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham, 1997,2003 nCipher Corporation Ltd, 1994-97 Ian Jackson.