From unknown Mon Jun 23 11:26:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#8353: 24.0.50; Header of *Apropos* buffer needs to explain `(SCORE)' Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2011 22:42:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 8353 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 8353@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.130117927829714 (code B ref -1); Sat, 26 Mar 2011 22:42:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Mar 2011 22:41:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q3cAW-0007jD-ID for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:41:16 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q3cAU-0007j0-D5 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:41:14 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q3cAO-0002JX-Az for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:41:09 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=unavailable version=3.3.1 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]:56206) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q3cAI-0002I5-RI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:41:08 -0400 Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=45148 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Q3c9k-0005he-F9 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:40:29 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q3c9a-0002FO-7f for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:40:19 -0400 Received: from rcsinet10.oracle.com ([148.87.113.121]:27004) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q3c9Z-0002FB-WB for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 18:40:18 -0400 Received: from rcsinet13.oracle.com (rcsinet13.oracle.com [148.87.113.125]) by rcsinet10.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.2/Switch-3.4.2) with ESMTP id p2QMeFkY030829 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 22:40:17 GMT Received: from acsmt356.oracle.com (acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156]) by rcsinet13.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.2/Switch-3.4.1) with ESMTP id p2QMeFT7026984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 22:40:15 GMT Received: from abhmt009.oracle.com (abhmt009.oracle.com [141.146.116.18]) by acsmt356.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id p2QMeEaC005940 for ; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 17:40:14 -0500 Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.60.21) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Sat, 26 Mar 2011 15:40:14 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2011 15:40:13 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcvsBsVEr8cZFoOgQHKeMphXL1erdw== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 X-Source-IP: acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090201.4D8E6B4F.0131,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 199.232.76.165 X-Spam-Score: -6.4 (------) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.4 (------) (setq apropos-sort-by-scores 'verbose) C-h a forward buffer char RET The buffer header needs to explain what the parenthesized numbers mean, e.g. (804). First, explain that these are scores. Second, explain what they mean and how hits are scored. It makes no sense to introduce a new feature like this without describing it to users. In GNU Emacs 24.0.50.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600) of 2011-03-21 on 3249CTO Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 5.1.2600 configured using `configure --with-gcc (4.5) --no-opt --cflags -Ic:/imagesupport/include' From unknown Mon Jun 23 11:26:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#8353: 24.0.50; Header of *Apropos* buffer needs to explain `(SCORE)' Resent-From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 06:54:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 8353 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: "Drew Adams" Cc: 8353@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 8353-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B8353.139192879529476 (code B ref 8353); Sun, 09 Feb 2014 06:54:02 +0000 Received: (at 8353) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Feb 2014 06:53:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59115 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCOGP-0007fL-Uq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 09 Feb 2014 01:53:14 -0500 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:41517) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCOGN-0007fC-0o for 8353@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 09 Feb 2014 01:53:11 -0500 Received: from [204.14.154.233] (helo=building.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1WCOG7-0007PV-U7; Sun, 09 Feb 2014 07:52:56 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen References: Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 22:51:45 -0800 In-Reply-To: (Drew Adams's message of "Sat, 26 Mar 2011 15:40:13 -0700") Message-ID: <87fvns7p8e.fsf@building.gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13001 (Ma Gnus v0.10) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-MailScanner-ID: 1WCOG7-0007PV-U7 X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1392533577.11654@CxupOZsmNqHdlu8xbVuU5w X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) "Drew Adams" writes: > (setq apropos-sort-by-scores 'verbose) > > C-h a forward buffer char RET > > The buffer header needs to explain what the parenthesized numbers mean, > e.g. (804). First, explain that these are scores. The documentation of the variable says that scores are displayed, so I don't think it's necessary to say that. > Second, explain what they mean and how hits are scored. I think that's pretty irrelevant. I think everybody understands that higher scores are "better". And the way the score is derived is liable to change. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/ From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 09 01:53:22 2014 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Feb 2014 06:53:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59118 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCOGW-0007fj-Tr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 09 Feb 2014 01:53:21 -0500 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:41523) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCOGU-0007fX-LG for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 09 Feb 2014 01:53:19 -0500 Received: from [204.14.154.233] (helo=building.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1WCOGG-0007Pe-47 for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 09 Feb 2014 07:53:05 +0100 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 22:51:49 -0800 Message-Id: <87eh3c7p8a.fsf@building.gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #8353 X-MailScanner-ID: 1WCOGG-0007Pe-47 X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1392533585.37729@ktThM6ZctCDHJC2KQcn4Pg X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) tags 8353 wontfix close 8353 From unknown Mon Jun 23 11:26:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#8353: 24.0.50; Header of *Apropos* buffer needs to explain `(SCORE)' Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 18:41:03 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 8353 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: wontfix To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Cc: 8353@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 8353-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B8353.1392057624710 (code B ref 8353); Mon, 10 Feb 2014 18:41:03 +0000 Received: (at 8353) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Feb 2014 18:40:24 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41714 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCvmI-0000BL-PT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 13:40:23 -0500 Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:32538) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCvmG-0000Az-J5 for 8353@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 13:40:21 -0500 Received: from acsinet22.oracle.com (acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s1AIeCPU001693 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 10 Feb 2014 18:40:13 GMT Received: from userz7021.oracle.com (userz7021.oracle.com [156.151.31.85]) by acsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s1AIeAcC003695 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 10 Feb 2014 18:40:11 GMT Received: from abhmp0015.oracle.com (abhmp0015.oracle.com [141.146.116.21]) by userz7021.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s1AIe9tB006446; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 18:40:09 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <48a43024-02b7-4f03-992a-e78843a64fae@default> Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 10:40:08 -0800 (PST) From: Drew Adams References: <87fvns7p8e.fsf@building.gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <87fvns7p8e.fsf@building.gnus.org> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8 (707110) [OL 12.0.6680.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238] X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) > > (setq apropos-sort-by-scores 'verbose) > > > > C-h a forward buffer char RET > > > > The buffer header needs to explain what the parenthesized numbers > > mean, e.g. (804). First, explain that these are scores. >=20 > The documentation of the variable says that scores are displayed, so > I don't think it's necessary to say that. Users do not necessarily see the variable or know anything about it! This is about the apropos output buffer. We show them a number in parens, without saying anything about what it means. That is really bad user interface etiquette. If this is not supposed to be meaningful to users then REMOVE it from the UI - don't show the scores. If showing this is supposed to help users, then let them know what these numbers mean. This should be a no-brainer. > > Second, explain what they mean and how hits are scored. >=20 > I think that's pretty irrelevant. Then remove them. If you show them to users then introduce/explain them. > I think everybody understands that higher scores are "better". If that were the case there there would be NO need for this variable and NO need to show the scores. The fact that we let users sort differently shows that scores are meaningful and=20 higher is not necessarily better, in terms of what the user is looking for or how s?he wants the hits presented. > And the way the score is derived is liable to change. Then the info describing the feature would be updated=20 accordingly. You cannot just throw something like this out there in a UI and offer no information about what it is. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 11 06:26:32 2014 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Feb 2014 11:26:32 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45845 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WDBU0-0006Rn-4g for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2014 06:26:32 -0500 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:39467) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WDBTw-0006RY-OD for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2014 06:26:29 -0500 Received: from [204.14.154.233] (helo=building.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1WDBTi-00068C-Fe for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2014 12:26:14 +0100 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 03:24:58 -0800 Message-Id: <87zjlxlwmt.fsf@building.gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #8353 X-MailScanner-ID: 1WDBTi-00068C-Fe X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1392722775.61304@6HHLvx5LHCVC8xUE0c/zZA X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) close 8353