From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 17:02:47 2011 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 22:02:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu86-0004mw-KM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:46 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu85-0004ml-Jk for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:46 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7u-0007lx-SN for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:40 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED autolearn=unavailable version=3.3.1 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]:50021) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7u-0007lr-P6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:34 -0500 Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=59877 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Puu7t-0002DE-3Y for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:34 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7r-0007kH-ML for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:32 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:41826) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7r-0007kD-Ko for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:31 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:40574) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7r-0003pK-Ep for bug-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:31 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7q-0007jg-0C for bug-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:31 -0500 Received: from exprod7og101.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.155]:54918) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Puu7p-0007if-Mi for bug-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:02:29 -0500 Received: from source ([74.125.83.175]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob101.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW6+cqI83ZDFL6bDA4Wxp1Y8/WRa1wAu@postini.com; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:02:29 PST Received: by pvc30 with SMTP id 30so60027pvc.6 for ; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:02:25 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.200.17 with SMTP id x17mr199421wff.177.1299103345620; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:02:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.199.21 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 14:02:25 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 22:02:25 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: bug-emacs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 199.232.76.165 X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) A comment in files.el says: ;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, ;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload ;; directives in that file. That way is discouraged since it ;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loaddefs.el? If the maintainers agree, then the last sentence should be changed to encourage the removal of the initial values back into the relevant mode files. -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 17:18:37 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 22:18:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuuNQ-00058t-Sz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:18:37 -0500 Received: from mail-ey0-f172.google.com ([209.85.215.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuuNO-00058h-Tm for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:18:35 -0500 Received: by eye13 with SMTP id 13so154788eye.3 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:18:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=abc+5WNKoI0cyQptsy3zZaVgociG9+EgBsufHW0UZb0=; b=G087uRp1TjkkEfA7I8iZQa5YZvvCtzx1aU/GZbi8o+gG0J1ZMT71PvGiPV92qqbKHg ZXTMlKy0eSvzmHOFDOQ++zS2sOT5bcDW1WziCE1uOsPmk9LevFmXfzx6h2msLWL37+za 3pvI4czOBCqABJnrt2jmusJsNpeD1RTvYP0to= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=T1Bt0HW6KqfrnaQUy0U+v9iHZvz/lfmqiGn5SzZ9ZsIyszG2TpFy7RyI6V/IMFyDje fmWcbS63YbxCeQB39pICn17mEe7nxck+vNR93eDOrAuCWaGjcBMnoVxrhW7yeELT+mDF 4T+zx8iIDgwa24bCL69CVPQvNKnwv5msa785E= Received: by 10.213.2.204 with SMTP id 12mr572190ebk.94.1299104309207; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:18:29 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.136 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 14:18:09 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 23:18:09 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Reuben Thomas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:02 PM, Reuben Thomas wrote: > A comment in files.el says: > > =C2=A0;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, > =C2=A0;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload > =C2=A0;; directives in that file. =C2=A0That way is discouraged since it > =C2=A0;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. > > Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loaddefs= .el? > > If the maintainers agree, then the last sentence should be changed to > encourage the removal of the initial values back into the relevant > mode files. I think I disagree. This sort of information must be coordinated so it need to be in a central place. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 17:22:56 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 22:22:56 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuuRc-0005Ej-2X for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:22:56 -0500 Received: from exprod7og126.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.206]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuuRa-0005EW-0S for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:22:54 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.210.47]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob126.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW7DN/uZB5sAyBdNpXYSfK0NWdH7VquV@postini.com; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:22:54 PST Received: by pzk12 with SMTP id 12so78143pzk.34 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:22:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.195.12 with SMTP id s12mr232435wff.6.1299104567119; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:22:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.199.21 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 14:22:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 22:22:47 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: Lennart Borgman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 2 March 2011 22:18, Lennart Borgman wrote: > On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:02 PM, Reuben Thomas wrote: >> A comment in files.el says: >> >> =A0;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, >> =A0;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload >> =A0;; directives in that file. =A0That way is discouraged since it >> =A0;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. >> >> Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loaddef= s.el? >> >> If the maintainers agree, then the last sentence should be changed to >> encourage the removal of the initial values back into the relevant >> mode files. > > I think I disagree. This sort of information must be coordinated so it > need to be in a central place. Why does it have to be coordinated? The most obvious reason seems to me "to avoid clashes", but this is detectable by parsing auto-mode-alist. Generating a warning when there are clashing settings for the same suffix would also be handy for 3rd party modes, which cannot integrate their information in this way. For modes that are part of Emacs, this system is fragile, as it's easy to forget that part of the mode is in files.el. --=20 http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 17:31:01 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 22:31:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuuZR-0005Pw-AL for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:31:01 -0500 Received: from mail-ew0-f44.google.com ([209.85.215.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuuZP-0005Pg-3P for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:30:59 -0500 Received: by ewy9 with SMTP id 9so165639ewy.3 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:30:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=z4rug7Ai2xk2jN4kxww/6e0ng5K5l4RMlp/fzvXtolo=; b=iDsxJMnc9HwSCLHK4u2ZYiL9Ynl7f92IdXXALMuyXfUwK3ORwBMZRBxJcaSh0Z2hkb gSAadVGm9hxMgjDx1YSu30orDSkkIsK1Yh3BevDSu90G3ZMEJCu39pBLxwOnrhfaUf30 INc8Nuue23epYlP4lD4gvM57izVCFJsJJ9C3E= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=FuHZDEGqP9S1P6k/q0jGOcvHopLv7lpXdHKIE8R+kudR8zzAqIANt/+nWWJTnw5SkD STCgsthlG9xhuvNxKtQdYN8D3mo+xPOzR0c6Sx3Kfdhr97Pqd+1cfRsnClx5+jS+IhqD f4cmv0Jlh+USW1KouPs0uLU2nXeJsmKNILlbM= Received: by 10.213.2.204 with SMTP id 12mr578766ebk.94.1299105053221; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:30:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.136 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 14:30:33 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 23:30:33 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Reuben Thomas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:22 PM, Reuben Thomas wrote: > On 2 March 2011 22:18, Lennart Borgman wrote: >> On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:02 PM, Reuben Thomas wrote: >>> A comment in files.el says: >>> >>> =C2=A0;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, >>> =C2=A0;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload >>> =C2=A0;; directives in that file. =C2=A0That way is discouraged since i= t >>> =C2=A0;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. >>> >>> Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loadde= fs.el? >>> >>> If the maintainers agree, then the last sentence should be changed to >>> encourage the removal of the initial values back into the relevant >>> mode files. >> >> I think I disagree. This sort of information must be coordinated so it >> need to be in a central place. > > Why does it have to be coordinated? The most obvious reason seems to > me "to avoid clashes", but this is detectable by parsing > auto-mode-alist. Generating a warning when there are clashing settings > for the same suffix would also be handy for 3rd party modes, which > cannot integrate their information in this way. There are not only file extension clashes (which I suppose is what you think of), but also mode selection clashes. I think the control of this must be given to the user and that requires a central system. The current system is not optimal however. I have tried to implement an addition to it in majmodpri.el in nXhtml. "majmodpri" stands for "major modes priorities" and that is just what it implements. (The implementation is not as easy to use as I would like it to be. Customization features for lists in Emacs is lacking a lot of functionalities IMO.) > For modes that are part of Emacs, this system is fragile, as it's easy > to forget that part of the mode is in files.el. This is true and perhaps part of the implementation should actually be distributed. However it must then be implemented in a way that still leaves control to the user. Just loading a new elisp file should not override old choices. (See above for clarification.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 17:35:46 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 22:35:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puue2-0005Wp-0H for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:35:46 -0500 Received: from exprod7og102.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.157]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puue0-0005Wd-Bw for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:35:45 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.160.49]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob102.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW7GOsF7V+PwRvkKaJgkb15eNfbgMZM8@postini.com; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:35:44 PST Received: by pwi8 with SMTP id 8so116023pwi.8 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:35:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.242.9 with SMTP id p9mr211445wfh.291.1299105337035; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:35:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.199.21 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 14:35:37 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 22:35:37 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: Lennart Borgman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 2 March 2011 22:30, Lennart Borgman wrote: > > I think the control of this must be given to the user and that > requires a central system. >From the point of view of the user, the system is centralised: auto-mode-alist and friends, which can be redefined at will. > Just loading a new elisp file should not > override old choices. (See above for clarification.) Sure, but autoloaded lines from mode files aren't rerun when the mode is loaded, are they? (At least, it seems not, because modes I have autoloaded still only have one entry per file suffix in auto-mode-alist.) -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 18:14:53 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 23:14:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuvFt-0006Op-IJ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:14:53 -0500 Received: from mail-ew0-f44.google.com ([209.85.215.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuvFs-0006Oe-8U for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:14:52 -0500 Received: by ewy9 with SMTP id 9so176484ewy.3 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:14:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=nuvU/Noo4O4XpsquuMHly31OABZ0entclK3e3hyDLfE=; b=KcPKMHDw6FKDW9YSLD592fxkTTikadYYl4UP24M1Jx2zjEM4bbnZd9VJFqDO5ifBFt cjLg9FohYkUXULx7+FwEbKV/6RA7FJodBSYeN4vgx55Y439kVYTDEdQ+PeVZ+PgR/4b0 uQVu8wEVD6UamcGao1H+X038Fs5LAb3VqFyAg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; b=E+DhCD6vUcI/Sjn11kO/PI6NgFNOxVmW+qzlWnMKrZE4ajpE/KhwHFZyzn2uiqckjJ YSGKpvbXptlh/7Xx4Jo7Dy/LrwzGieGvlwn3y5LBqqE9vmubIYpyVhINwrDsmskBb1+W Ixy+BHoQ+XieK1lI22qkxB6wUQbHFItBKZqYE= Received: by 10.213.2.204 with SMTP id 12mr599922ebk.94.1299107686199; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:14:46 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.136 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 15:14:26 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 00:14:26 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Reuben Thomas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:35 PM, Reuben Thomas wrote: > On 2 March 2011 22:30, Lennart Borgman wrote: >> >> I think the control of this must be given to the user and that >> requires a central system. > > From the point of view of the user, the system is centralised: > auto-mode-alist and friends, which can be redefined at will. > >> Just loading a new elisp file should not >> override old choices. (See above for clarification.) > > Sure, but autoloaded lines from mode files aren't rerun when the mode > is loaded, are they? (At least, it seems not, because modes I have > autoloaded still only have one entry per file suffix in > auto-mode-alist.) So you mean that the insertion into auto-mode-alist should be done by autoloading? I think that is too fragile since it will depend on how modules are loading. As I said in a previous message the user must be given some simple control of this. In my opinion that means that some way to prioritize must be used, please see my previous message. That would allow for decentralized additions to auto-mode-alist (but you seem to have missed that point?). From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 18:21:41 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 23:21:41 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuvMS-0006YB-R1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:21:41 -0500 Received: from exprod7og124.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.26]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuvMQ-0006Xx-8k for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:21:39 -0500 Received: from source ([74.125.83.175]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob124.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW7Q/BQk+HEXImcJ662MrjXtl9IJ/cbf@postini.com; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:21:38 PST Received: by pvc30 with SMTP id 30so69074pvc.6 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:21:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.200.17 with SMTP id x17mr256085wff.177.1299108091545; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:21:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.199.21 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 15:21:31 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 23:21:31 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: Lennart Borgman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 2 March 2011 23:14, Lennart Borgman wrote: > > So you mean that the insertion into auto-mode-alist should be done by > autoloading? I think that is too fragile since it will depend on how > modules are loading. I am only saying that this is what seems to happen at the moment, and I have no problem with it. > As I said in a previous message the user must be given some simple > control of this. In my opinion that means that some way to prioritize > must be used, please see my previous message. The user already has a way to prioritize, by removing or adding elements of auto-mode-alist as they see fit, in their .emacs or equivalent. When this is run, emacs has already initialised auto-mode-alist from autoloads, so they will not disturb the user's settings. > That would allow for > decentralized additions to auto-mode-alist (but you seem to have > missed that point?). I may have missed the point, but as far as I can see, everything you want to do can be achieved with the current system, and decentralising the initialisation of auto-mode-alist would not change that: I have no problems with my auto-mode-alist from modes whose settings are not centralised. -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 18:39:46 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 23:39:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvdy-0006xW-FB for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:39:46 -0500 Received: from mail-ew0-f44.google.com ([209.85.215.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvdw-0006xJ-4a for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:39:45 -0500 Received: by ewy9 with SMTP id 9so182204ewy.3 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:39:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=buEKKF9BdLLRfZmkX8AInZ0Y8mM1bus0kGvzxqR651s=; b=aKrONDYLMtGcGN9mQAVdj8IxkSkhPCSK/rX/q+uJkLaxDsvq/ua36iLAroffwcAS0P zWDE2FSWG+tRhFpAFV85/wzxvnE+TEHuwK46UMRqvg2tl1lpU9n2Rf/WyAAH8Owb7Wqk 793lCTmqROKHAE3hXK++wD3BbgK3kjYGJE7l8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; b=sirL7V7RTxdWkjRfNhqXyEj+YW/UGGBEsQ1ZfMpV5jzeczLikFTZSUYgoDuCSECQfs 97OkjXGmtkQYOQoEc694kGGZmNUhNBWe/ZIKE8w9SraZiftGnVyk70ztNdaN+b9ii3qb KnicXT5P3feD/W8L8Zssa45p71NVCEa7iJL+k= Received: by 10.213.26.20 with SMTP id b20mr813132ebc.55.1299109178159; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:39:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.136 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 15:39:18 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 00:39:18 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Reuben Thomas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:21 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: > >> As I said in a previous message the user must be given some simple >> control of this. In my opinion that means that some way to prioritize >> must be used, please see my previous message. > > The user already has a way to prioritize, by removing or adding > elements of auto-mode-alist as they see fit, in their .emacs or > equivalent. When this is run, emacs has already initialised > auto-mode-alist from autoloads, so they will not disturb the user's > settings. > >> That would allow for >> decentralized additions to auto-mode-alist (but you seem to have >> missed that point?). > > I may have missed the point, but as far as I can see, everything you > want to do can be achieved with the current system, and decentralising > the initialisation of auto-mode-alist would not change that: I have no > problems with my auto-mode-alist from modes whose settings are not > centralised. Yes, you have missed it. I wrote majmodpri.el to get around the problem that some elisp files added things to auto-mode-alist. I got some bug reports for nXhtml from some of those users. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 18:41:40 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 23:41:41 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvfo-00070H-Mp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:41:40 -0500 Received: from exprod7og101.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.155]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvfm-000704-Ap for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:41:39 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.160.48]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob101.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW7VrKLauEL9fLKM4JXgWO0e/bU7ZMEN@postini.com; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:41:38 PST Received: by pwi14 with SMTP id 14so141868pwi.35 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:41:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.47.2 with SMTP id u2mr282163wfu.63.1299109291303; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:41:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.199.21 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 15:41:31 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 23:41:31 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: Lennart Borgman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 2 March 2011 23:39, Lennart Borgman wrote: > > Yes, you have missed it. I wrote majmodpri.el to get around the > problem that some elisp files added things to auto-mode-alist. So, are you saying that elisp files with non-centralized settings which are part of Emacs were causing you problems? -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 18:42:50 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 23:42:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvgv-00071y-Uu for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:42:50 -0500 Received: from mail-ey0-f172.google.com ([209.85.215.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvgu-00071n-0q for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:42:48 -0500 Received: by eye13 with SMTP id 13so174422eye.3 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:42:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=9/YSfmauI0QCXT7ALv0z+KFRkCiVafuaIG0om56cgg8=; b=wPvWhWPu7p55Xt+HKqOVntJa9IV1YW0KPp000U6JMt+OKJw6d6cBuVLCNQJDVgwGz8 0m/9GBCqM/1nPl+nu0qKi+FUOJt1buQKpfBA/2/VFkzhe6CrqnQkOH6sR191m8/tanzF hnrQ/V+Ug6xFWNeDnD5q3RSh5AtfbQkTBfLqs= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; b=euOrHVJGFuexVZ/CfhDf1Q/tl0M4Gn5UsUHZyOzaYZ0edWo1HqhHt+RQdaMgF7dR9n kLksbF4vc2DyiKbMCMSzSKsEUHAUmVv9pe/tn80XEEx/7VGZIOmc7/ASmECTfIm/thxp mN37v6+lKEVBsSJ0loRfeE3mfTQEyoIn2tirg= Received: by 10.213.26.20 with SMTP id b20mr814438ebc.55.1299109362215; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:42:42 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.136 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 15:42:22 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 00:42:22 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Reuben Thomas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:41 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: > On 2 March 2011 23:39, Lennart Borgman wrote: >> >> Yes, you have missed it. I wrote majmodpri.el to get around the >> problem that some elisp files added things to auto-mode-alist. > > So, are you saying that elisp files with non-centralized settings > which are part of Emacs were causing you problems? Not me, but a lot of other people. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 18:43:39 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Mar 2011 23:43:39 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvhj-00073L-72 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:43:39 -0500 Received: from exprod7og112.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.177]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Puvhh-000738-7Q for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 18:43:37 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.212.175]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob112.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW7WI2Da/68BXkyKt/oi+EAVPy4+bX58@postini.com; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:43:37 PST Received: by pxi17 with SMTP id 17so85910pxi.34 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:43:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.239.11 with SMTP id m11mr277750wfh.120.1299109410578; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 15:43:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.199.21 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 15:43:30 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 23:43:30 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: Lennart Borgman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 2 March 2011 23:42, Lennart Borgman wrote: > On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:41 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: >> On 2 March 2011 23:39, Lennart Borgman wrote: >>> >>> Yes, you have missed it. I wrote majmodpri.el to get around the >>> problem that some elisp files added things to auto-mode-alist. >> >> So, are you saying that elisp files with non-centralized settings >> which are part of Emacs were causing you problems? > > Not me, but a lot of other people. Sorry, let me try again. Are you saying that elisp files shipped as part of Emacs, with non-centralized settings, were causing your users problems? -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Mar 02 19:31:15 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Mar 2011 00:31:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuwRm-00085q-UT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 19:31:15 -0500 Received: from mail-ew0-f44.google.com ([209.85.215.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PuwRl-00085g-2j for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 19:31:13 -0500 Received: by ewy9 with SMTP id 9so192468ewy.3 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 16:31:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=g/As5rAPkLuqrkI9J3Jc+vrF18zt0AsPqXFWcmqjn/Y=; b=U/N3qVsgEiNAV7f8SjUQIN4ElCMxkNu+aLH8U70Dx1IYL5jOpVPX/O8YoJGEdeSVo0 fkf+LZZbrUyffa4mTT6Dnn0WlRHMczQ4Ackm+e6brAxES3DJ6ycko3M3EdYUkZPXoon+ eATNU2KJ+MxzJQAsn8k6+4jvN770jSOcGFQCg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; b=jTM9UyQJCE7tZWHbPbHEZI95+ebxXLC1NnXa5zfBuTdaigU39693tM3tkRR39IxWhu HrHhVU6bv/6lQivIpnfgTFddhXmMLwM8ln5QPuSBKsGJGnIjwO/BWilqrtHaELT5yrHT 8fGIQcjYtFzh5XcJej06sVl0F2dxnxQa+kQks= Received: by 10.213.23.5 with SMTP id p5mr642639ebb.81.1299112267172; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 16:31:07 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.136 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 16:30:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 01:30:47 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Reuben Thomas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: > On 2 March 2011 23:42, Lennart Borgman wrote: >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:41 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: >>> On 2 March 2011 23:39, Lennart Borgman wrote: >>>> >>>> Yes, you have missed it. I wrote majmodpri.el to get around the >>>> problem that some elisp files added things to auto-mode-alist. >>> >>> So, are you saying that elisp files with non-centralized settings >>> which are part of Emacs were causing you problems? >> >> Not me, but a lot of other people. > > Sorry, let me try again. > > Are you saying that elisp files shipped as part of Emacs, with > non-centralized settings, were causing your users problems? No. It is only with third party files I have seen the problem (since files shipped with Emacs currently does not change auto-mode-alist when they are loaded). From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Mar 03 06:43:26 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Mar 2011 11:43:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Pv6wI-0006oo-Fr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 06:43:26 -0500 Received: from exprod7og108.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.169]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Pv6wF-0006oa-Lm for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 06:43:24 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.214.169]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob108.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTW9+1ZiT7lr5X73E6Tv7Ohr3cytXs50C@postini.com; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 03:43:23 PST Received: by iwl42 with SMTP id 42so942408iwl.28 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 03:43:16 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.16.137 with SMTP id o9mr837730iba.158.1299152596148; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 03:43:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.30.203 with HTTP; Thu, 3 Mar 2011 03:43:16 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 11:43:16 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist From: Reuben Thomas To: Lennart Borgman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 3 March 2011 00:30, Lennart Borgman wrote: > On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: >> On 2 March 2011 23:42, Lennart Borgman wrote: >>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 12:41 AM, Reuben Thomas wrote: >>>> On 2 March 2011 23:39, Lennart Borgman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Yes, you have missed it. I wrote majmodpri.el to get around the >>>>> problem that some elisp files added things to auto-mode-alist. >>>> >>>> So, are you saying that elisp files with non-centralized settings >>>> which are part of Emacs were causing you problems? >>> >>> Not me, but a lot of other people. >> >> Sorry, let me try again. >> >> Are you saying that elisp files shipped as part of Emacs, with >> non-centralized settings, were causing your users problems? > > No. It is only with third party files I have seen the problem (since > files shipped with Emacs currently does not change auto-mode-alist > when they are loaded). Right, but Emacs does not have fully centralized settings. (Many modes set their own auto-mode-alist entries.) So changing things within Emacs does not affect your problem. -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Mar 03 23:22:12 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Mar 2011 04:22:12 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PvMWq-0006CO-Ji for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:22:12 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PvMWo-0006CA-IM for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:22:11 -0500 Received: from [207.96.179.97] (port=46547 helo=ceviche.home) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PvMWi-0001Tx-9Y; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:22:04 -0500 Received: by ceviche.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 4BD12660D6; Thu, 3 Mar 2011 23:22:03 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Reuben Thomas Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist Message-ID: References: Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:22:03 -0500 In-Reply-To: (Reuben Thomas's message of "Wed, 2 Mar 2011 22:02:25 +0000") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) > ;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, > ;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload > ;; directives in that file. That way is discouraged since it > ;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. > Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loaddefs.el? I agree, but I think Richard disagrees. Also, order of entries in auto-mode-alist can be important, so autoloading those entries does not work for all cases. But for 90% of the cases, it's perfectly fine and indeed we do use it already in several cases. Such ordering conflicts are difficult to detect automatically: detecting them when we compile Emacs requires checking which regexps overlap (which is perfectly doable in theory, but we'd need a "regexp-to-DFA compiler" for that, basically), detecting them at run-time is too late (often it'd be wrong to ask the user to resolve such conflicts). Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Mar 03 23:23:08 2011 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Mar 2011 04:23:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PvMXj-0006Dl-SP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:23:08 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PvMXh-0006DF-RZ for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:23:06 -0500 Received: from [207.96.179.97] (port=46548 helo=ceviche.home) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PvMXc-0001Vk-Iv; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:23:00 -0500 Received: by ceviche.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 0346A660D6; Thu, 3 Mar 2011 23:23:00 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Lennart Borgman Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist Message-ID: References: Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:22:59 -0500 In-Reply-To: (Lennart Borgman's message of "Thu, 3 Mar 2011 00:14:26 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org, Reuben Thomas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) > So you mean that the insertion into auto-mode-alist should be done by > autoloading? I think that is too fragile since it will depend on how > modules are loading. Then we need to autoload something like an `add-to-list' supplemented with some ordering info. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 07 01:41:11 2019 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Oct 2019 05:41:11 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47286 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iHLlf-0008W0-Gx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Oct 2019 01:41:11 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.231.51]:57506) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iHLld-0008Vr-AA for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Oct 2019 01:41:09 -0400 Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=marnie) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1iHLla-0006nY-LK for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Oct 2019 07:41:08 +0200 Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2019 07:41:06 +0200 Message-Id: <87r23p6rkd.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #8158 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: tags 8158 - notabug quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) tags 8158 - notabug quit From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 21 16:29:16 2021 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Oct 2021 20:29:16 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58709 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mdege-0000Ht-80 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 16:29:16 -0400 Received: from mail-pl1-f177.google.com ([209.85.214.177]:40801) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mdegc-0000HR-Jw for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 16:29:15 -0400 Received: by mail-pl1-f177.google.com with SMTP id v20so1219076plo.7 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 13:29:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:user-agent :mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=97/ZDngHx5GVFL07uLl/q7mdNMYeHKAHtkIIQpkHu/8=; b=NIPdEUDbv0jQmAWgt2JYuP4RaYNW9xrXs8vAXq9ktweLz80cPxR8FykweMOhtW55Q4 b/zXaFTFG7D+u7oG4XX4bJ1OdtRfywUGxOUaCbHXCf0yOmC4qN4UQ6llpr/QZ4GC6EAe mMSQnZUpyuPxbYowewajTHOIo0tsS3InUX/YoTBXolLhnqmNEG3u7DIrrpwtTkIrBckj 5zxcmAdXJ60jqZCpeqQ8/3Q41CqJPVOfsdLBbc5xpD+ywi710D9OM237NRB+Z+9y3dcd 9orQUpKNbdMwMjRFpPBklnyHIkOILH5oPdBy07Pg8rOHI8gJpFTE6wyIO9boHRyDg7Y6 4ZYQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530VDDemJSRwAYXkU7Vtgu4jxekeQX+kxae/5oovug6dUemfPneD 3Ng85wqdALzbV8cnR9P9LLKM2w8k4fzMLeQl77I= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxlWgCXHSEk/OCwQc8LUFlrRG2+tFQ8sc8eDZxlUpX1/Vg4arsi88T4ZgAOFMgDD/xh3q51jnAQyg/DzJmsC5A= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:b691:b029:12d:2b6:d116 with SMTP id c17-20020a170902b691b029012d02b6d116mr7076086pls.71.1634848149080; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 13:29:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 13:29:08 -0700 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Thu, 03 Mar 2011 23:22:03 -0500") References: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2021 13:29:08 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Stefan Monnier Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org, Reuben Thomas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Stefan Monnier writes: >> ;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, >> ;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload >> ;; directives in that file. That way is discouraged since it >> ;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. > >> Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loaddefs.el? > > I agree, but I think Richard disagrees. Also, order of entries in > auto-mode-alist can be important, so autoloading those entries does not > work for all cases. But for 90% of the cases, it's perfectly fine and > indeed we do use it already in several cases. > > Such ordering conflicts are difficult to detect automatically: detecting > them when we compile Emacs requires checking which regexps overlap > (which is perfectly doable in theory, but we'd need a "regexp-to-DFA > compiler" for that, basically), detecting them at run-time is too late > (often it'd be wrong to ask the user to resolve such conflicts). Does anyone object to just removing the above comment? And similarly for `interpreter-mode-alist', I suppose. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Oct 22 10:31:20 2021 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Oct 2021 14:31:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33438 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mdvZn-0006kV-Q0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 10:31:20 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:44134) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mdvZm-0006kH-BB for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 10:31:19 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=ed8tA1ckiajsy0I2lygZt0v1U88m+ha30vHiry7lrkI=; b=VjXBT6Kc2Re0ZBEfps2HflwkIO ys1LhUVsRcb/N4CIVHYU23W1GxN2hDxcUJP21wTMKaZvpW968CmMKtS1sxOunhlNZsn+4Nyh4aggT sD0LUIehUbCa9GB7fft3+A7e2fph0Fq85Gx57PewIyV8N71K76t8nlHMDIOrH2R9UDiA=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mdvZc-0004yZ-LA; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 16:31:11 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Stefan Kangas Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist References: Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwAgMAAAAqbBEUAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAADFBMVEUjGxotJSZOR07/ //8trI8JAAAAAWJLR0QDEQxM8gAAAAd0SU1FB+UKFg4TLZsxAJ4AAAFASURBVCjPdZKxTsQwDIZt qVmYitQw8DSJRPYW5Y/E7Te0j8EjINrhZopUPyV22uO4gQxNvjr2/8cJ0W04Iv6Fhu6G7/8DdweZ z5iRdwKP0HENthRuxVsHtFXFNnsDOoCooz8Q9oztmkxNIjHRxwoDTZ86wcJNSyOIB1jYgYCUai1W UMHe9HxWSyxz9e3QG2zVJJtZPslqISDozyeRJZi/rOCKiE7o8mB1JpEYwahNAyR2MVQbWmha4JPf LbtSLjEomAhnbFr5hZAYkdy4DTCjVXoSpLhDVh9fIdEKFZ31swVPYmNRqU29jaov73OR76SFHxQ+ 1iKreeMKJ80zyWfdZlCgbeThdTki2XprK8CRHTmWwDj31ngmBP8WbZFblz3VO3UU+r23vZ6RnCYc 7yZZK8NxdU77fbwKZnNgwK219wferm6PhYYHpQAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAyMS0xMC0y MlQxNDoxOTo0NSswMDowMJsQ0mcAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjEtMTAtMjJUMTQ6MTk6 NDUrMDA6MDDqTWrbAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Helen Money's _Atomic_: "Nemesis" Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2021 16:31:08 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Thu, 21 Oct 2021 13:29:08 -0700") Message-ID: <87o87hdtcj.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Stefan Kangas writes: > Does anyone object to just removing the above comment? And similarly > for `interpreter-mode-alist', I suppose. I think removing the comment is fine. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Monnier , Reuben Thomas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Stefan Kangas writes: > Does anyone object to just removing the above comment? And similarly > for `interpreter-mode-alist', I suppose. I think removing the comment is fine. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Oct 22 19:46:15 2021 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Oct 2021 23:46:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33979 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1me4Eo-0008Ag-PH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 19:46:15 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:57014) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1me4El-000843-9i for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 19:46:13 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:41078) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1me4Ef-00032s-ID; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 19:46:05 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1me4EX-0003G3-BE; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 19:45:57 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Thu, 21 Oct 2021 13:29:08 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist References: Message-Id: Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2021 19:45:57 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > I agree, but I think Richard disagrees. What is the question that maybe I disagree about? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Oct 22 20:15:52 2021 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Oct 2021 00:15:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34006 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1me4hU-0001id-AX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 20:15:52 -0400 Received: from mail-pg1-f182.google.com ([209.85.215.182]:38643) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1me4hT-0001iS-Eh for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 20:15:51 -0400 Received: by mail-pg1-f182.google.com with SMTP id e65so4712038pgc.5 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 17:15:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:user-agent :mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=nHZZsz5QWaHpMJPZCN07FHMxa/lRSsZvNHB3guAHCLE=; b=55/pQG0UufRh54oOOtFKdbv/0V2LM779QiQISvnLUu/QHmbA2xSROg7EXDax3vO5IE iNA/BOdjsAHaPqS8ON/D2vFnUbSsdPnnIuVrTb8Ru83nIT+V1A9RHcn4K/76Ie7ZbKCu eYsIUi5SoHdJhzPN5n7YmqmzcrenTklIzRz0lcQnxojpeYfUiwTQR+Pe+bWOz5jfKr2o MWO0qtVN86ZmHjVZ15Z7KZZj7n83NMhNwbgBNUUvsBK7HeyCZtJSdhIqWzd3ZB7wSxjf 5B9QVBzpxVILcFh2mr0fOXcxspfB4JN8lmiEcPmnPiytMqLVQ00srJFNzaoNaK9Bs49D BSsQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530vrriN6MKH4xFEU2JE3wxN9C7nHGp6ELp4a3OlRDYYU4HID/dm n8mpkpcmHSfLn5z4G1kzeFY0c+QY9dOgTrNbcW4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJysWJMX5BsRh7XDsx9r4RhhvMHEWWCsftW2CStPB5h5T9grE6NZGalzhvy5nA7s4fJxR3w/ZGMF3lLKjQ+0gyI= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:978b:0:b0:44c:abf1:a8b8 with SMTP id o11-20020aa7978b000000b0044cabf1a8b8mr3244449pfp.35.1634948145820; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 17:15:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 22 Oct 2021 17:15:45 -0700 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Fri, 22 Oct 2021 19:45:57 -0400") References: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2021 17:15:45 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Richard Stallman Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Richard Stallman writes: > > > I agree, but I think Richard disagrees. > > What is the question that maybe I disagree about? The full initial message was: > A comment in files.el says: > > ;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, > ;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload > ;; directives in that file. That way is discouraged since it > ;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. > > Isn't this a bit unmodular as Emacs continues to grow, and given loaddefs.el? > > If the maintainers agree, then the last sentence should be changed to > encourage the removal of the initial values back into the relevant > mode files. What I propose is to make no concrete change besides removing that comment. This avoids people rushing off to change everything around, which is probably not what we want at this point, but also doesn't very strongly discourage a more modular design. If any problems crop up, we can address them with specific fixes. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 26 22:14:20 2022 Received: (at 8158) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Jan 2022 03:14:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53953 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCvEq-0005EA-1s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 22:14:20 -0500 Received: from mail-pl1-f173.google.com ([209.85.214.173]:42909) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCvEo-0005Dp-11 for 8158@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 22:14:18 -0500 Received: by mail-pl1-f173.google.com with SMTP id i1so1312941pla.9 for <8158@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 19:14:18 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:user-agent :mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=QfMOannflHpbTNAuOo5SZSym7zFf7mUDcrqs8eHQ3m0=; b=iWRlg/VotQec27hDGs69ytw7m4BVJkg6w52D2boNBvXqibfHi3WLywRKY5/yYqrTD7 NwrulVb+mSKFqBAiYYSxd2jrjTTB3A6f8bkFALTnGIR55IGIx57HYRrTKM57/0nILSND IGkY71tIBSXChLJ7CL67lQuWDsruyDRxQ0ME978DdtMfW3eNGONyekNTJyxNjHI1mUEP QALe/O8bx88TTopmbadLcJedK/Pwr25MqWseq+ZL8RlkfBHfvL8W7MJIHydhhAr/+PVu jKbx8HLcgatJLsqqBO/W3h1C0DxqegFVhj38wLBKEUjJxf/uQdUB8hgD8SBt8gekUPpr LY3w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531KqSGWMeGWOhqPyODiE8eTGvCTDPefAW+c+9LMKCwQgdKFACog DMp/WYPgUMPrfO7zv6fFGJIQyBjE7CXBcHhQSqA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyYq0LclR0Yg+fUVUA83l72z/QHcxwZvmR8LMR8rHHNYmgGUsAOchVRi69t/6iePn53jx3RtfRYbPhO89sY6lw= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:384d:: with SMTP id nl13mr2032118pjb.133.1643253252289; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 19:14:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 19:14:11 -0800 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <87o87hdtcj.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Fri, 22 Oct 2021 16:31:08 +0200") References: <87o87hdtcj.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2022 19:14:11 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#8158: Definition of auto-mode-alist To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 8158 Cc: 8158@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Monnier , Reuben Thomas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) close 8158 29.1 thanks Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Stefan Kangas writes: > >> Does anyone object to just removing the above comment? And similarly >> for `interpreter-mode-alist', I suppose. > > I think removing the comment is fine. No further comments here within 3 months, so I've now installed the below change on master. diff --git a/lisp/files.el b/lisp/files.el index aabe8f445e..4ba71e6144 100644 --- a/lisp/files.el +++ b/lisp/files.el @@ -2757,8 +2757,7 @@ auto-mode-case-fold (defvar auto-mode-alist ;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (c-mode, ;; c++-mode, java-mode and more) are added through autoload - ;; directives in that file. That way is discouraged since it - ;; spreads out the definition of the initial value. + ;; directives in that file. (mapcar (lambda (elt) (cons (purecopy (car elt)) (cdr elt))) @@ -3056,8 +3055,7 @@ conf-mode-maybe (defvar interpreter-mode-alist ;; Note: The entries for the modes defined in cc-mode.el (awk-mode ;; and pike-mode) are added through autoload directives in that - ;; file. That way is discouraged since it spreads out the - ;; definition of the initial value. + ;; file. (mapcar (lambda (l) (cons (purecopy (car l)) (cdr l))) From unknown Sun Jun 22 15:23:54 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:24:09 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator