From unknown Sat Aug 16 18:16:38 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#7925 <7925@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#7925 <7925@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes Reply-To: bug#7925 <7925@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2025 01:16:38 +0000 retitle 7925 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes reassign 7925 emacs submitter 7925 Reuben Thomas severity 7925 minor thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 26 16:49:51 2011 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Jan 2011 21:49:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PiDFO-0000EU-ED for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:49:50 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PiDFL-0000EF-KW for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:49:48 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PiDNC-0003dw-Ls for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:57:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED autolearn=unavailable version=3.3.1 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]:59362) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PiDNC-0003dm-Bs for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:57:54 -0500 Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=39325 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1PiDNA-0008Et-94 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:57:54 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PiDN8-0003bw-Eh for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:57:52 -0500 Received: from exprod7ob107.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.166]:50451) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PiDN8-0003bj-3O for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:57:50 -0500 Received: from source ([74.125.82.45]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob107.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTUCY2/Cc0PNIgGxQ4ItZY90l2iRDp0d1@postini.com; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 13:57:49 PST Received: by mail-ww0-f45.google.com with SMTP id 29so1419502wwb.26 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 13:57:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.227.143.138 with SMTP id v10mr158697wbu.24.1296079066864; Wed, 26 Jan 2011 13:57:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from canta (87-194-87-241.bethere.co.uk [87.194.87.241]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id w25sm239177wbd.17.2011.01.26.13.57.45 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 26 Jan 2011 13:57:46 -0800 (PST) From: Reuben Thomas To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 21:57:44 +0000 Message-ID: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) Pretty much every time I use report-emacs-bug, I get the message =E2=80=9CConvert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?=E2=80=9D There are two p= roblems here: 1. From looking at the code in report-emacs-bug-hook, it really means =E2=80=9Cnon-ASCII characters=E2=80=9D, as it looks for any non-7-bit chara= cter, not just non-7-bit letters. 2. In this age of UTF-8, and, for example, my use of smart-quotes-mode, what do you have against non-ASCII characters? Perhaps you=E2=80=99d like t= o try to make sure that mail to report-emacs-bug is in English, but for that you should be using some form of linguistic analysis. In GNU Emacs 23.2.91.4 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.22.0) of 2011-01-13 on canta Windowing system distributor `The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.10900000 Important settings: value of $LC_ALL: nil value of $LC_COLLATE: nil value of $LC_CTYPE: nil value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil value of $LC_MONETARY: nil value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil value of $LC_TIME: nil value of $LANG: en_GB.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: nil locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix default enable-multibyte-characters: t Major mode: Fundamental Minor modes in effect: shell-dirtrack-mode: t recentf-mode: t show-paren-mode: t savehist-mode: t minibuffer-electric-default-mode: t iswitchb-mode: t icomplete-mode: t global-whitespace-mode: t global-auto-revert-mode: t desktop-save-mode: t yas/global-mode: t yas/minor-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t column-number-mode: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t Recent input: n SPC a SPC t e r m i n a l M-q C-e =20 E v e n SPC i f SPC i t SPC d o e s n ' t SPC w o r=20 k =20 I n SPC a n y SPC c a s=20 e , SPC i t SPC w o u l d SPC b e SPC n i c e SPC t=20 o SPC l o w e r SPC u s e r s ' SPC e x p e c t a t=20 i o n s SPC b y SPC p o i n t i n g SPC o u t SPC t=20 h a t SPC C-h f c d C-p C-p C-p C-p C-n C-n=20 C-n C-n C-n C-SPC C-n C-n C-n C-n C-w C-x b =20 i n SPC t h e SPC c o =20 d o c s t r i n g SPC f d o =20 f o r r SPC c d , SPC a n d=20 SPC i n SPC t h e SPC m a n u a l , SPC t h a t SPC=20 i t SPC d o e s n ' t SPC a p p l y SPC d u r i n g=20 SPC t o SPC i=20 n t e r a c t i v e SPC c o m p l e t i o n . M-q C-x=20 # C-c C-c n y e s C-x b M e s=20 s M-> M-x r e p o r t - e m a c s - b u g=20 Recent messages: Auto-saving...done Type "q" to restore this window. Mark set Read only text copied to kill ring No server editing buffers exist Convert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal? (y or n)=20 Sending... Sending via mail... Sending...done Mark set Load-path shadows: /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/ruby-mode-1.1/ruby-mode hides /usr/share/emacs-snap= shot/site-lisp/ruby1.8-elisp/ruby-mode /home/rrt/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/popup hides /usr/local/share/emacs/23= .2.91/site-lisp/auto-complete/popup /home/rrt/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/fuzzy hides /usr/local/share/emacs/23= .2.91/site-lisp/auto-complete/fuzzy /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/css-mode-1.0/css-mode hides /usr/local/share/emacs/= 23.2.91/site-lisp/css-mode/css-mode /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/dictionary-1.8.7/link hides /usr/local/share/emacs/= 23.2.91/site-lisp/dictionary-el/link /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/dictionary-1.8.7/connection hides /usr/local/share/= emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/dictionary-el/connection /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/dictionary-1.8.7/dictionary-init hides /usr/local/s= hare/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/dictionary-el/dictionary-init /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/dictionary-1.8.7/dictionary hides /usr/local/share/= emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/dictionary-el/dictionary /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/css-mode-1.0/css-mode hides /usr/local/share/emacs/= 23.2.91/lisp/textmodes/css-mode /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/ruby-mode-1.1/ruby-mode hides /usr/local/share/emac= s/23.2.91/lisp/progmodes/ruby-mode /home/rrt/.emacs.d/elpa/css-mode-1.0/css-mode hides /usr/share/emacs/site-l= isp/css-mode/css-mode /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-info hides /usr/share/e= macs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-info /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/context-nl hides /usr/share= /emacs/site-lisp/auctex/context-nl /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/context-en hides /usr/share= /emacs/site-lisp/auctex/context-en /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/latex hides /usr/share/emac= s/site-lisp/auctex/latex /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-mik hides /usr/share/em= acs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-mik /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/dictionary-el/lpath hides /usr/sha= re/emacs/site-lisp/auctex/lpath /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-buf hides /usr/share/em= acs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-buf /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-jp hides /usr/share/ema= cs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-jp /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-bar hides /usr/share/em= acs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-bar /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex hides /usr/share/emacs/= site-lisp/auctex/tex /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/multi-prompt hides /usr/sha= re/emacs/site-lisp/auctex/multi-prompt /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-fptex hides /usr/share/= emacs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-fptex /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-font hides /usr/share/e= macs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-font /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-fold hides /usr/share/e= macs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-fold /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/texmathp hides /usr/share/e= macs/site-lisp/auctex/texmathp /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/context hides /usr/share/em= acs/site-lisp/auctex/context /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/font-latex hides /usr/share= /emacs/site-lisp/auctex/font-latex /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/bib-cite hides /usr/share/e= macs/site-lisp/auctex/bib-cite /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/toolbar-x hides /usr/share/= emacs/site-lisp/auctex/toolbar-x /usr/local/share/emacs/23.2.91/site-lisp/auctex/tex-style hides /usr/share/= emacs/site-lisp/auctex/tex-style Features: (gnus-msg gnus-art mm-uu mml2015 epg-config mm-view smime dig gnus-sum nnoo gnus-group gnus-undo nnmail mail-source format-spec gnus-start gnus-spec gnus-int gnus-range gnus-win gnus gnus-ems newcomment shadow sort mail-extr message sendmail ecomplete rfc822 mml mml-sec password-cache mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mailcap mail-parse rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045 qp ietf-drums mailabbrev nnheader gnus-util netrc time-date mm-util mail-prsvr gmm-utils mailheader canlock sha1 hex-util hashcash mail-utils emacsbug multi-isearch find-func pp help-mode ansi-color shell gud jka-compr info m4-mode autoconf autoconf-mode view inform-mode noutline outline tex-info texinfo tex sh-script executable longlines make-mode vc-git face-remap filladapt flyspell completing-help recentf tree-widget wid-edit uniquify paren savehist minibuf-eldef iswitchb icomplete whitespace autorevert time cus-start cus-load desktop server php-mode etags cc-langs cc-mode cc-fonts cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs speedbar sb-image ezimage dframe lua-mode regexp-opt comint ring ropemacs pymacs etags-update smart-quotes ispell auto-dictionary-autoloads css-mode-autoloads dictionary-autoloads diff-git-autoloads dired-isearch-autoloads full-ack-autoloads guess-style-autoloads http-post-simple-autoloads js2-mode-autoloads magit-autoloads mv-shell-autoloads ruby-mode-autoloads package reporter advice advice-preload yasnippet help-fns derived edmacro kmacro easymenu assoc cl cl-19 muse-autoloads emacs-goodies-el emacs-goodies-custom emacs-goodies-loaddefs easy-mmode bbdb-autoloads preview-latex tex-site auto-loads tooltip ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel x-win x-dnd font-setting tool-bar dnd fontset image fringe lisp-mode register page menu-bar rfn-eshadow timer select scroll-bar mldrag mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax facemenu font-core frame cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev loaddefs button minibuffer faces cus-face files text-properties overlay md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process dbusbind system-font-setting font-render-setting gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty emacs) --=20 http://rrt.sc3d.org/ From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jan 29 18:26:07 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Jan 2011 23:26:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjKBB-0001Dv-Ly for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:26:05 -0500 Received: from vm-emlprdomr-06.its.yale.edu ([130.132.50.147]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjKBA-0001DS-0R for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:26:04 -0500 Received: from furball (dhcp128036226053.central.yale.edu [128.36.226.53]) (authenticated bits=0) by vm-emlprdomr-06.its.yale.edu (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id p0TNYKn7003981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:20 -0500 Received: by furball (Postfix, from userid 1000) id CF17A1603EB; Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:19 -0500 (EST) From: Chong Yidong To: Reuben Thomas Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:19 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> (Reuben Thomas's message of "Wed, 26 Jan 2011 21:57:44 +0000") Message-ID: <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.71 on 130.132.50.147 X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) Reuben Thomas writes: > Pretty much every time I use report-emacs-bug, I get the message > =E2=80=9CConvert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?=E2=80=9D There are two= problems here: > > 1. From looking at the code in report-emacs-bug-hook, it really means > =E2=80=9Cnon-ASCII characters=E2=80=9D, as it looks for any non-7-bit cha= racter, not > just non-7-bit letters. > > 2. In this age of UTF-8, and, for example, my use of smart-quotes-mode, > what do you have against non-ASCII characters? Perhaps you=E2=80=99d like= to try > to make sure that mail to report-emacs-bug is in English, but for that > you should be using some form of linguistic analysis. Maybe this question dates from the days when email was ASCII only. At the least, this check ought to only be applied to the mail headers (MIME is needed for non-ASCII in headers). From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 06:05:08 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 11:05:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjV5e-0000Ky-Oq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:05:07 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjV5d-0000KK-5K for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:05:05 -0500 Received: from eliz by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjVDa-0006WA-0R; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:13:18 -0500 From: Eli Zaretskii To: Chong Yidong In-reply-to: <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> (message from Chong Yidong on Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:19 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:13:18 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) > From: Chong Yidong > Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:19 -0500 > Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org > > Reuben Thomas writes: > > > Pretty much every time I use report-emacs-bug, I get the message > > “Convert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?” There are two problems here: > > > > 1. From looking at the code in report-emacs-bug-hook, it really means > > “non-ASCII characters”, as it looks for any non-7-bit character, not > > just non-7-bit letters. > > > > 2. In this age of UTF-8, and, for example, my use of smart-quotes-mode, > > what do you have against non-ASCII characters? Perhaps you’d like to try > > to make sure that mail to report-emacs-bug is in English, but for that > > you should be using some form of linguistic analysis. > > Maybe this question dates from the days when email was ASCII only. Actually, this was added in Emacs 20 or 21, when Emacs got support for multi-lingual editing. the reason was to make sure bug reports are written in English and not in some other languages that maintainers could not command. Also, various MUAs, even in Emacs, might convert non-ASCII characters into illegible mess. > At the least, this check ought to only be applied to the mail > headers (MIME is needed for non-ASCII in headers). Actually, I think the body is the more important part. If we are willing to allow non-ASCII characters, we should at least limit that to some subset that does not affect the text itself. Linguistic analysis seems to be a bit of overkill (this command should be reliable even in a partially sick Emacs session, remember?). Maybe some kind of list of allowed non-ASCII characters will be good enough. (Not that I understand why it is a problem to use "..." or some such, when one reports an Emacs bug. But that's me.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 07:42:52 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 12:42:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjWcF-0003FH-VV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 07:42:52 -0500 Received: from mail-fx0-f44.google.com ([209.85.161.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjWcD-0003F4-97 for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 07:42:49 -0500 Received: by fxm9 with SMTP id 9so5036170fxm.3 for <7925@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 04:51:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references :user-agent:date:message-id:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Z1F/5UgY7TiJ3U1yhCqAvY/Bsxaoorj0ktYcw8KeIHA=; b=nzeSpzO8a4DynYELdYj18szVVtN930kjGYEnQMQjN8IJjmuEFA5RA3JP1xduUUD6UK e1tfqhavRdyMPlpNZ3aDhd6m+GWR6rs9No8BRMpJ1DLu4ehWcQJBY9OFCYMTu8MWJsAb Gv8oe1gHaGq5TWqVhafFN79/NxK9N21XgGItM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:user-agent:date :message-id:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=OQfB9FoEtYXqq2mKioVC6ZZBS/ZqTm0qdKS+M19q6ZH+v8fCccQW+45IPZ8zLdV/UI UuxPzHzQKyBIg5LaQlmHdUAoLFaSdnv9iNKaO4TKh79X0uIsCauaNvWmGZ2xKcuTOjy4 fTzS2wfWFpTHDxmIv1hRIeaXvYojJJeK9Ny0c= Received: by 10.223.79.74 with SMTP id o10mr4771806fak.63.1296391866498; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 04:51:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (176.119.broadband10.iol.cz [90.177.119.176]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b7sm7012995faa.18.2011.01.30.04.51.02 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 30 Jan 2011 04:51:04 -0800 (PST) From: =?utf-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes In-Reply-To: (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:13:18 -0500") References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:48:46 +0100 Message-ID: <87fwsaeevl.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -3.4 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, Chong Yidong , rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.4 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Chong Yidong >> Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:19 -0500 >> Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org >>=20 >> Reuben Thomas writes: >>=20 >> > Pretty much every time I use report-emacs-bug, I get the message >> > =E2=80=9CConvert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?=E2=80=9D There are = two problems here: >> > >> > 1. From looking at the code in report-emacs-bug-hook, it really means >> > =E2=80=9Cnon-ASCII characters=E2=80=9D, as it looks for any non-7-bit = character, not >> > just non-7-bit letters. >> > >> > 2. In this age of UTF-8, and, for example, my use of smart-quotes-mode, >> > what do you have against non-ASCII characters? Perhaps you=E2=80=99d l= ike to try >> > to make sure that mail to report-emacs-bug is in English, but for that >> > you should be using some form of linguistic analysis. >>=20 >> Maybe this question dates from the days when email was ASCII only. > > Actually, this was added in Emacs 20 or 21, when Emacs got support for > multi-lingual editing. the reason was to make sure bug reports are > written in English and not in some other languages that maintainers > could not command. Also, various MUAs, even in Emacs, might convert > non-ASCII characters into illegible mess. If this is the reason, IMO it is pretty silly. You already say "please write in English" in the template message. If somebody can ignore that, they can certainly ignore this mystery meat message, too -- e.g. I had no idea what it meant and I doubt most other people understand "convert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?" as "please write in English" either. I always just answer "No", FWIW. (And I get the prompt every single time, probably just because my name in the signature contains those naughty new-fangled non-ASCII characters.) =C5=A0t=C4=9Bp=C3=A1n From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 08:24:49 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 13:24:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXGr-00049Z-7S for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 08:24:49 -0500 Received: from exprod7og103.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.159]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXGp-00049N-Ha for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 08:24:48 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.213.44]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob103.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTUVokE+hMWG+/ixUH4KDojdVqK6jHVok@postini.com; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 05:33:10 PST Received: by ywk9 with SMTP id 9so1850159ywk.3 for <7925@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 05:33:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.151.106.7 with SMTP id i7mr403314ybm.193.1296394382958; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 05:33:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.151.102.11 with HTTP; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 05:33:02 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:33:02 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes From: Reuben Thomas To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, Chong Yidong X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) On 30 January 2011 11:13, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > >=A0the reason was to make sure bug reports are > written in English and not in some other languages that maintainers > could not command. In that case, I suggest it be dropped. It's a bizarre way to try to enforce English (I could quite happily write Greek or German in plain ASCII, for example), and as has been pointed out, there is already a clear request to write in English. > =A0Also, various MUAs, even in Emacs, might convert > non-ASCII characters into illegible mess. Then they should be fixed to encode the text properly and specify the encoding. It's a bit late in the day to be working around programs that can't cope with non-7-bit encodings! >=A0Maybe > some kind of list of allowed non-ASCII characters will be good enough. It would be better than nothing, but the list will never be long enough. For example, what's wrong with using symbols such as arrows or smileys, or, in your own example, ellipses? --=20 http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 08:52:49 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 13:52:49 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXhx-0004nd-77 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 08:52:49 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXhw-0004nS-EU for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 08:52:48 -0500 Received: from eliz by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXpt-0001lY-9a; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:01:01 -0500 From: Eli Zaretskii To: =?utf-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= In-reply-to: <87fwsaeevl.fsf@gmail.com> (message from =?utf-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= on Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:48:46 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87fwsaeevl.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:01:01 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com, rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) > From: Štěpán Němec > Cc: Chong Yidong , 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, rrt@sc3d.org > Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:48:46 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > Actually, this was added in Emacs 20 or 21, when Emacs got support for > > multi-lingual editing. the reason was to make sure bug reports are > > written in English and not in some other languages that maintainers > > could not command. Also, various MUAs, even in Emacs, might convert > > non-ASCII characters into illegible mess. > > If this is the reason, IMO it is pretty silly. You already say "please > write in English" in the template message. If somebody can ignore that, > they can certainly ignore this mystery meat message, too -- e.g. I had > no idea what it meant and I doubt most other people understand "convert > non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?" as "please write in English" either. The non-ASCII characters could be part of a Lisp backtrace (from a byte-compiled function). In that case, conversion to hex is a reasonable thing to d. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 08:59:53 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 13:59:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXon-0004x2-Eg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 08:59:53 -0500 Received: from exprod7og114.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.215]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjXol-0004wo-Vw for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 08:59:52 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.218.46]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob114.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTUVwyOpiWQu8RkPg4NB8znyMpDamLD3f@postini.com; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:08:15 PST Received: by yib18 with SMTP id 18so1635756yib.19 for <7925@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:08:08 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.150.238.2 with SMTP id l2mr6455488ybh.364.1296396488214; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:08:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.151.102.11 with HTTP; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:08:08 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87fwsaeevl.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 14:08:08 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes From: Reuben Thomas To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com, =?UTF-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) On 30 January 2011 14:01, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > The non-ASCII characters could be part of a Lisp backtrace (from a > byte-compiled function). =A0In that case, conversion to hex is a > reasonable thing to d. Indeed, so it's sensible to mangle backtraces before including them into an email buffer. That needn't be drawn to the user's attention (though presumably it would help the maintainers to insert a comment to the effect that the backtrace had been mangled?). --=20 http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 09:13:36 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 14:13:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjY24-0005FK-Mu for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:13:36 -0500 Received: from mail-bw0-f44.google.com ([209.85.214.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjY23-0005FB-90 for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:13:35 -0500 Received: by bwz12 with SMTP id 12so5062217bwz.3 for <7925@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:21:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references :user-agent:date:message-id:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=2TrcRBi3zRURJ++q3n3w9iD7sbQCFNnoEPCobNkADZs=; b=HnHhJQwXGiYM/FQAOD2DMbx3NeQFYFvkmGCO92yEKWcI5jO/AkuNFK4esf7xdDshgg o7MHGr2Phek0ixYe/DFGqp9hl9t9fD+WpthHUzsuxiJse/hRuvQfEuSQVAv35gcWaCSj BiSQXUdNFUuJBfn3jIvfB4KzbTtb7RjCvTyls= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:user-agent:date :message-id:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=TjrfgkN8XX9TdaevrqpiGfQPTcxtbmOZHrqZXtcoCmxP6nzEWI0KJaJm5he6l63Rwk b3yEN3SVcRUexV2DvCJWByyeFTgCPF9fgMAWcnwbmOCBxnaDOyOu6SitnFUtES1Ad9zW 1vhh3dj2ba0ccgljyTH5pYgKbxAwQaAvRoeK0= Received: by 10.204.14.202 with SMTP id h10mr2521887bka.182.1296397312597; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:21:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (176.119.broadband10.iol.cz [90.177.119.176]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id a17sm9694137bku.11.2011.01.30.06.21.49 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:21:51 -0800 (PST) From: =?utf-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes In-Reply-To: (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:01:01 -0500") References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87fwsaeevl.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 15:19:35 +0100 Message-ID: <87bp2yeao8.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -3.4 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com, rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.4 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: =C5=A0t=C4=9Bp=C3=A1n N=C4=9Bmec >> Cc: Chong Yidong , 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, rrt@sc= 3d.org >> Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:48:46 +0100 >>=20 >> Eli Zaretskii writes: >>=20 >> > Actually, this was added in Emacs 20 or 21, when Emacs got support for >> > multi-lingual editing. the reason was to make sure bug reports are >> > written in English and not in some other languages that maintainers >> > could not command. Also, various MUAs, even in Emacs, might convert >> > non-ASCII characters into illegible mess. >>=20 >> If this is the reason, IMO it is pretty silly. You already say "please >> write in English" in the template message. If somebody can ignore that, >> they can certainly ignore this mystery meat message, too -- e.g. I had >> no idea what it meant and I doubt most other people understand "convert >> non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?" as "please write in English" either. > > The non-ASCII characters could be part of a Lisp backtrace (from a > byte-compiled function). In that case, conversion to hex is a > reasonable thing to d. I don't see why mangling any kind of information would be reasonable, unless of course you mean proper encoding of non-ascii content which any functional MUA does, but that should be (and is) done automatically without any kind of user intervention. In any case, this reasoning is quite different from the one stated in your previous message (although it doesn't make much more sense to me). =C5=A0t=C4=9Bp=C3=A1n From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 09:18:49 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 14:18:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjY77-0005MW-66 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:18:49 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjY74-0005ML-QY for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:18:47 -0500 Received: from eliz by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjYF1-00035b-Fg; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:26:59 -0500 From: Eli Zaretskii To: Reuben Thomas In-reply-to: (message from Reuben Thomas on Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:33:02 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:26:59 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) > Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:33:02 +0000 > From: Reuben Thomas > Cc: Chong Yidong , 7925@debbugs.gnu.org > > > Also, various MUAs, even in Emacs, might convert > > non-ASCII characters into illegible mess. > > Then they should be fixed to encode the text properly and specify the > encoding. It's a bit late in the day to be working around programs > that can't cope with non-7-bit encodings! The goal is to make dug reporting and analysis as simple and efficient as possible. Not to fix all the possible bugs that are unrelated to the one being reported. > >Maybe > > some kind of list of allowed non-ASCII characters will be good enough. > > It would be better than nothing, but the list will never be long > enough. We have Unicode character properties to help us out (see "Character Properties" in the ELisp manual), and also charset properties. So it doesn't have to be a list of literal characters. > For example, what's wrong with using symbols such as arrows or > smileys, or, in your own example, ellipses? That the fonts installed on the recipient's machine don't support them? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 09:33:53 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 14:33:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjYLh-0005gd-BH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:33:53 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjYLf-0005gO-HC for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:33:52 -0500 Received: from eliz by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjYTc-0003et-LL; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:42:04 -0500 From: Eli Zaretskii To: =?utf-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= In-reply-to: <87bp2yeao8.fsf@gmail.com> (message from =?utf-8?B?xaB0xJtww6FuIE7Em21lYw==?= on Sun, 30 Jan 2011 15:19:35 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87fwsaeevl.fsf@gmail.com> <87bp2yeao8.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 09:42:04 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com, rrt@sc3d.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.5 (------) > From: Štěpán Němec > Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com, rrt@sc3d.org > Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 15:19:35 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > In any case, this reasoning is quite different from the one stated > in your previous message The previous message corrected an assumption that the request to use English comes from the pure ASCII era. This reasoning, by contrast, tried to explain why asking for English does not guarantee 7-bit ASCII text, even if the user strictly abides by that request. > (although it doesn't make much more sense to me). Would _any_ reasoning make sense to you in this matter? If not, we are having a religious argument, and then we better stop. To make more sense out of it (hopefully), think about the various ways a Lisp-level backtrace (or, indeed, any information from the Emacs display) could be brought into the bug report (from the same Emacs session, by copy-pasting via a windowing system, via a file, etc.), and then try to imagine the set of possible encoding related mangling that could cause it to be utterly illegible. Anyway, it's time for me to bail out. Someone asked a question why report-emacs-bug does what it does. I tried to answer, which hopefully helped understand the reasons. I don't have anything else to say on this matter, and I really don't care if non-ASCII characters will be allowed. If a bug report uses non-trivial characters, its submitter should consider the possibility that it will be read by a smaller number of maintainers, in extreme situations not at all. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 30 17:17:36 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jan 2011 22:17:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjfaS-0007Nv-I3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 17:17:36 -0500 Received: from exprod7og121.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.20]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PjfaQ-0007Ni-AP for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 17:17:35 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.218.48]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob121.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTUXlcIWOB9BEVc3fLwLZVadXDdSnTHZd@postini.com; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 14:25:58 PST Received: by yib17 with SMTP id 17so1915404yib.35 for <7925@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 14:25:51 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.151.43.19 with SMTP id v19mr6831497ybj.421.1296425719180; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 14:15:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.151.102.11 with HTTP; Sun, 30 Jan 2011 14:15:19 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 22:15:19 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes From: Reuben Thomas To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) On 30 January 2011 14:26, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > The goal is to make dug reporting and analysis as simple and efficient > as possible. Precisely, and currently report-emacs-bugs is getting in my way and confusing me, and others. I'm a relatively expert user; what's a novice supposed to make of this incomprehensible question? ("ASCII? Hex? What's that? I just want to report a bug!") There are many ways in which a bug report can fail to be useful to the maintainers, most of which Emacs can't hope to detect. Currently, it makes a ham-fisted attempt to detect a couple of types of problem which aren't even demonstrated as being problems the maintainers actually encounter. (How many mails did you get in non-English languages before this check was introduced? How many backtraces were unreadable (and how is a developer supposed to demangle a mangled backtrace?)? How many times couldn't a developer read a message because it used a character they didn't have a font for (and how easy would it have been just to install such a font?)? As it is, report-emacs-bug violates the maxim "Be liberal in what you accept from others", which is especially important for bug reporting (important as it also is to help users provide good bug reports), with no obvious benefit to the maintainers. -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 01 14:50:09 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 1 Feb 2011 19:50:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PkMEr-0006EJ-9O for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 14:50:09 -0500 Received: from pruche.dit.umontreal.ca ([132.204.246.22]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PkMEn-0006Dl-Hy for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 14:50:07 -0500 Received: from faina.iro.umontreal.ca (lechon.iro.umontreal.ca [132.204.27.242]) by pruche.dit.umontreal.ca (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id p11JwQSD031075; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 14:58:26 -0500 Received: by faina.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 80693B404A; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 14:58:22 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Chong Yidong Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes Message-ID: References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 14:58:17 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> (Chong Yidong's message of "Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:34:19 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-NAI-Spam-Score: 0 X-NAI-Spam-Rules: 1 Rules triggered RV3735=0 X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, Reuben Thomas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) >> Pretty much every time I use report-emacs-bug, I get the message >> =E2=80=9CConvert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?=E2=80=9D There are tw= o problems here: >>=20 >> 1. From looking at the code in report-emacs-bug-hook, it really means >> =E2=80=9Cnon-ASCII characters=E2=80=9D, as it looks for any non-7-bit ch= aracter, not >> just non-7-bit letters. >>=20 >> 2. In this age of UTF-8, and, for example, my use of smart-quotes-mode, >> what do you have against non-ASCII characters? Perhaps you=E2=80=99d lik= e to try >> to make sure that mail to report-emacs-bug is in English, but for that >> you should be using some form of linguistic analysis. > Maybe this question dates from the days when email was ASCII only. At > the least, this check ought to only be applied to the mail headers (MIME > is needed for non-ASCII in headers). Why not drop it altogether? Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 06 14:36:50 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Feb 2011 19:36:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmAPi-0004he-Gm for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Feb 2011 14:36:50 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmAPg-0004hR-GB for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Feb 2011 14:36:49 -0500 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PmAY1-0004LF-Ga for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Feb 2011 14:45:25 -0500 Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2011 14:45:25 -0500 Message-Id: Subject: control message for bug 7256 To: X-Mailer: mail (GNU Mailutils 2.1) From: Glenn Morris X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) merge 7925 7256 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 07 10:35:11 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Feb 2011 15:35:11 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmT7P-0007QI-02 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 10:35:11 -0500 Received: from vm-emlprdomr-06.its.yale.edu ([130.132.50.147]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmT7L-0007Pt-PS for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 10:35:09 -0500 Received: from furball (dhcp128036014010.central.yale.edu [128.36.14.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by vm-emlprdomr-06.its.yale.edu (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id p17FhkSC013783 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Mon, 7 Feb 2011 10:43:46 -0500 Received: by furball (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 70544160990; Sun, 6 Feb 2011 10:05:20 -0500 (EST) From: Chong Yidong To: Stefan Monnier Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2011 10:05:20 -0500 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Tue, 01 Feb 2011 14:58:17 -0500") Message-ID: <87ipwxgq4v.fsf@stupidchicken.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.71 on 130.132.50.147 X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, Reuben Thomas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) Stefan Monnier writes: >>> Pretty much every time I use report-emacs-bug, I get the message >>> =E2=80=9CConvert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal?=E2=80=9D There are t= wo problems here: >>>=20 >>> 1. From looking at the code in report-emacs-bug-hook, it really means >>> =E2=80=9Cnon-ASCII characters=E2=80=9D, as it looks for any non-7-bit c= haracter, not >>> just non-7-bit letters. >>>=20 >>> 2. In this age of UTF-8, and, for example, my use of smart-quotes-mode, >>> what do you have against non-ASCII characters? Perhaps you=E2=80=99d li= ke to try >>> to make sure that mail to report-emacs-bug is in English, but for that >>> you should be using some form of linguistic analysis. > >> Maybe this question dates from the days when email was ASCII only. At >> the least, this check ought to only be applied to the mail headers (MIME >> is needed for non-ASCII in headers). > > Why not drop it altogether? Since no one has spoken up in defense of keeping the check, I've done that. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 07 10:35:10 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Feb 2011 15:35:10 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmT7N-0007Q7-PL for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 10:35:09 -0500 Received: from vm-emlprdomr-06.its.yale.edu ([130.132.50.147]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmT7L-0007Ps-NV for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 10:35:08 -0500 Received: from furball (dhcp128036014010.central.yale.edu [128.36.14.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by vm-emlprdomr-06.its.yale.edu (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id p17FhkqW013780 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2011 10:43:46 -0500 Received: by furball (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 6E44F1609AC; Sun, 6 Feb 2011 10:05:35 -0500 (EST) From: Chong Yidong To: control@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: close 7925 Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2011 10:05:35 -0500 Message-ID: <87wrld6w5c.fsf@stupidchicken.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.71 on 130.132.50.147 X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) close 7925 thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 07 10:37:20 2011 Received: (at 7925) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Feb 2011 15:37:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmT9U-0007Tz-6R for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 10:37:20 -0500 Received: from exprod7og126.obsmtp.com ([64.18.2.206]) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PmT9R-0007Tf-Sg for 7925@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 10:37:19 -0500 Received: from source ([209.85.213.176]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob126.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTVATs6fj9DRvIsR8rLSZkDYN7dB/i2aG@postini.com; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 07:46:02 PST Received: by yxm8 with SMTP id 8so1928492yxm.35 for <7925@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 07:45:55 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.110.14 with SMTP id t14mr15923748yhg.57.1297093479314; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 07:44:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.220.2 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2011 07:44:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <87ipwxgq4v.fsf@stupidchicken.com> References: <87oc7372g7.fsf@sc3d.org> <87fwsbp9ms.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87ipwxgq4v.fsf@stupidchicken.com> Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 15:44:39 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#7925: 23.2.91; report-emacs-bug doesn't like curly quotes From: Reuben Thomas To: Chong Yidong Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 7925 Cc: 7925@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Monnier X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) On 6 February 2011 15:05, Chong Yidong wrote: > > Since no one has spoken up in defense of keeping the check, I've done > that. Thanks! -- http://rrt.sc3d.org From unknown Sat Aug 16 18:16:38 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2011 12:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Sep 09 12:22:07 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Sep 2011 16:22:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R23qB-0002VZ-7r for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 09 Sep 2011 12:22:07 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R23q8-0002VN-Ab; Fri, 09 Sep 2011 12:22:05 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R23mA-0000dl-Pt; Fri, 09 Sep 2011 12:17:58 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: Leo Subject: Re: bug#9465: 23.3.50; Convert non-ASCII letters to hexadecimal? References: X-Spook: Delta Force LABLINK ANC NATO 9/11 lock picking lynch LLNL X-Ran: EEE}=wF^3R=K)d;L]qU},xX]ew3!`hc\&C@M:{|]ify8KX6Pcu7OiC&KVkx-&TyWxbq`]D X-Hue: green X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2011 12:17:58 -0400 In-Reply-To: (Leo's message of "Fri, 09 Sep 2011 19:25:43 +0800") Message-ID: <11aaadr8p5.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -6.4 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control Cc: 9465@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.4 (------) unarchive 7925 forcemerge 7925 9465 stop Leo wrote: > In report-emacs-bug-hook, there is this 'converting non-ASCII to > hexadecimal' message. Not in the trunk there isn't. From unknown Sat Aug 16 18:16:38 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sat, 08 Oct 2011 11:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator