Package: emacs;
Reported by: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it>
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2025 09:32:02 UTC
Severity: normal
Found in version 30.1
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bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 09:32:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it>:bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 09:32:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org Subject: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 11:30:58 +0200
I usually launch Emacs and do not exit it for weeks. I run the Debian emacs-lucid build running on three terminals: the Screen terminal emulator, an X Windows terminal displayed on two physical side-by-side monitors and a remote X Windows terminal managed by Xpra (a sort of graphic Screen). I use remotely both the terminal managed by Screen and the one managed by Xpra. Starting some months ago (maybe six months?) I have observed that Emacs becomes gradually less responsive to user keypresses, to the point that it slows down my workflow significantly. Restarting it solves the problem. The effect is very gradual, and becomes unbearable after two or three weeks. For example, now I am at the point of having to restart Emacs and I see that ~/.emacs.desktop.lock is dated 18 July, which is 20 days ago. The effect I observe is a noticeable delay from the moment I press a key to the moment I see the effect on Emacs, on any terminal. This is less evident while I am writing without pauses such as in this moment. I observe next to no delay while writing. But after any pause, which may be even one or two seconds long, I observe delays of at least half a second and up to some seconds from a keypress to Emacs reacting to it. This happens with any Emacs command, including self-insert-command. The effect is particularly grave on graphics terminals and complex buffers. I just observed a delay of more than 10s on an Eww buffer after a PgDn keypress. Occasionally I observe an even more wrringoy behaviour. If keep pressing keys when Emacs is stalled, I see that the first keypresses are lost, which sometimes causes unpredictable behaviour. Since the problem builds up gradually in the course of many days, I have never considered reproducing it under emacs -Q, but now that the problem does not go away with ebia ugDpnrades and has gone on for several months at least, I am wondering how I can try to debug it. I need some guidance on that, because I have not programmed in C for at least ten years by now, and while I was used to use gdb, I have never been proficient at debugging complex situations. One possibility would be that Emacs responsiveness degrades even if it is not used. So I may run an emacs -Q process and let it run there, unused, with only some activity running in the background, like for example display-time. If I am not wrong I should follow something along these steps: 1) download some Emacs snapshot and compile it with debugging symbols 2) run it as usual under gdb 3) run inside Screen under gdb one more emacs -Q 4) run inside Screen under gdb one more emacs -Q and M-x display-time Before trying to do that I need to know if the symptoms I describe are somewhat known already and if I can do some debuggiong at the elisp level before resorting to gdb. If I need gdb, I'd use some help with details of the steps 1-4 above. In GNU Emacs 30.1 (build 2, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, cairo version 1.18.4, Xaw3d scroll bars) of 2025-03-30, modified by Debian built on sbuild Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12101016 System Description: Debian GNU/Linux 13 (trixie) Configured using: 'configure --build x86_64-linux-gnu --prefix=/usr --sharedstatedir=/var/lib --libexecdir=/usr/libexec --localstatedir=/var/lib --infodir=/usr/share/info --mandir=/usr/share/man --with-libsystemd --with-pop=yes --enable-locallisppath=/etc/emacs:/usr/local/share/emacs/30.1/site-lisp:/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp:/usr/share/emacs/30.1/site-lisp:/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp --with-sound=alsa --without-gconf --with-mailutils --build x86_64-linux-gnu --prefix=/usr --sharedstatedir=/var/lib --libexecdir=/usr/libexec --localstatedir=/var/lib --infodir=/usr/share/info --mandir=/usr/share/man --with-libsystemd --with-pop=yes --enable-locallisppath=/etc/emacs:/usr/local/share/emacs/30.1/site-lisp:/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp:/usr/share/emacs/30.1/site-lisp:/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp --with-sound=alsa --without-gconf --with-mailutils --with-x=yes --with-x-toolkit=lucid --with-toolkit-scroll-bars --without-gsettings 'CFLAGS=-g -O2 -Werror=implicit-function-declaration -ffile-prefix-map=/build/reproducible-path/emacs-30.1+1=. -fstack-protector-strong -fstack-clash-protection -Wformat -Werror=format-security -fcf-protection -Wall' 'CPPFLAGS=-Wdate-time -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2' LDFLAGS=-Wl,-z,relro' Configured features: ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM HARFBUZZ JPEG LCMS2 LIBOTF LIBSELINUX LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 M17N_FLT MODULES NATIVE_COMP NOTIFY INOTIFY PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER WEBP X11 XAW3D XDBE XIM XINPUT2 XPM LUCID ZLIB Important settings: value of $LC_COLLATE: it_IT.UTF-8 value of $LC_CTYPE: it_IT.UTF-8 value of $LC_NUMERIC: C value of $LANG: C.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=ibus locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: eww Minor modes in effect: TeX-PDF-mode: t server-mode: t desktop-save-mode: t epa-global-mail-mode: t openwith-mode: t display-time-mode: t tooltip-mode: t show-paren-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t tool-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t minibuffer-regexp-mode: t buffer-read-only: t column-number-mode: t line-number-mode: t indent-tabs-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t Load-path shadows: /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/elpa/debian-el-37.19/debian-autoloads hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/elpa/gnuplot-0.8.1/debian-autoloads /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/elpa/apache-mode-2.2.0/apache-mode hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/elpa-src/apache-mode-2.2.0/apache-mode /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/elpa/apache-mode-2.2.0/apache-mode-autoloads hides 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shr pixel-fill kinsoku url-file svg xml mm-url gnus nnheader range js c-ts-common sgml-mode facemenu dom image-mode exif php-mode mode-local find-func imenu speedbar ezimage dframe cc-mode cc-fonts cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align php-face php php-project flymake cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs nroff-mode conf-mode python project compat octave texinfo texinfo-loaddefs vc-filewise vc-rcs log-view easy-mmode pcvs-util server compile sh-script smie treesit executable qp rmailmm message puny rfc822 mml mml-sec gnus-util text-property-search mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader mail-parse rfc2231 generic yank-media markdown-mode color noutline outline cus-start desktop frameset term/screen term/xterm xterm pot skeleton rmailsum ffap thingatpt ange-ftp rmail pcase sendmail rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr epa-mail mail-utils epa derived epg rfc6068 epg-config kmacro view mule-util cal-china lunar solar cal-dst cal-bahai cal-islam cal-hebrew appt diary-lib diary-loaddefs holidays holiday-loaddefs cal-menu calendar cal-loaddefs tramp trampver tramp-integration files-x tramp-message tramp-compat xdg shell pcomplete comint ansi-osc ring parse-time iso8601 time-date format-spec tramp-loaddefs visual-fill-column dired-aux openwith anything-config anything advice woman man cl hi-lock locate add-log scroll-in-place comp comp-cstr cl-extra warnings comp-run comp-common rx ansi-color time jka-compr quail help-mode dired-x generic-x shell-apt disp-table finder-inf w3m-load tex-site cus-edit pp cus-load wid-edit info apache-mode-autoloads bar-cursor-autoloads bm-autoloads boxquote-autoloads browse-kill-ring-autoloads color-theme-modern-autoloads csv-mode-autoloads debian-el-autoloads debian-el dired dired-loaddefs diminish-autoloads eproject-autoloads folding-autoloads gnuplot-autoloads graphviz-dot-mode-autoloads helm-autoloads helm-core-autoloads async-autoloads htmlize-autoloads initsplit-autoloads markdown-mode-autoloads mutt-alias-autoloads muttrc-mode-autoloads php-mode-autoloads pod-mode-autoloads session-autoloads tabbar-autoloads package browse-url url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods url-history url-cookie generate-lisp-file url-domsuf url-util mailcap url-handlers url-parse auth-source cl-seq eieio eieio-core cl-macs icons password-cache json subr-x map byte-opt gv bytecomp byte-compile url-vars cl-loaddefs cl-lib rmc iso-transl tooltip cconv eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type elisp-mode mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd touch-screen tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer nadvice seq simple cl-generic indonesian philippine cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help abbrev obarray oclosure cl-preloaded button loaddefs theme-loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads dbusbind inotify lcms2 dynamic-setting font-render-setting cairo x-toolkit xinput2 x multi-tty move-toolbar make-network-process native-compile emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 49419339 11517180) (symbols 48 42730 67) (strings 32 378829 44104) (string-bytes 1 39212723) (vectors 16 128778) (vector-slots 8 2536475 497247) (floats 8 1403 25599) (intervals 56 25980442 3379) (buffers 992 214))
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 13:04:01 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #8 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> To: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 16:03:15 +0300
> From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> > Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 11:30:58 +0200 > > I usually launch Emacs and do not exit it for weeks. I run the Debian emacs-lucid build running on three terminals: the Screen terminal emulator, an X Windows terminal displayed on two physical side-by-side monitors and a remote X Windows terminal managed by Xpra (a sort of graphic Screen). I use remotely both the terminal managed by Screen and the one managed by Xpra. > > Starting some months ago (maybe six months?) I have observed that Emacs becomes gradually less responsive to user keypresses, to the point that it slows down my workflow significantly. Restarting it solves the problem. The effect is very gradual, and becomes unbearable after two or three weeks. For example, now I am at the point of having to restart Emacs and I see that ~/.emacs.desktop.lock is dated 18 July, which is 20 days ago. > > The effect I observe is a noticeable delay from the moment I press a key to the moment I see the effect on Emacs, on any terminal. This is less evident while I am writing without pauses such as in this moment. I observe next to no delay while writing. But after any pause, which may be even one or two seconds long, I observe delays of at least half a second and up to some seconds from a keypress to Emacs reacting to it. This happens with any Emacs command, including self-insert-command. The effect is particularly grave on graphics terminals and complex buffers. I just observed a delay of more than 10s on an Eww buffer after a PgDn keypress. Occasionally I observe an even more wrringoy behaviour. If keep pressing keys when Emacs is stalled, I see that the first keypresses are lost, which sometimes causes unpredictable behaviour. > > Since the problem builds up gradually in the course of many days, I have never considered reproducing it under emacs -Q, but now that the problem does not go away with ebia ugDpnrades and has gone on for several months at least, I am wondering how I can try to debug it. I need some guidance on that, because I have not programmed in C for at least ten years by now, and while I was used to use gdb, I have never been proficient at debugging complex situations. > > One possibility would be that Emacs responsiveness degrades even if it is not used. So I may run an emacs -Q process and let it run there, unused, with only some activity running in the background, like for example display-time. > > If I am not wrong I should follow something along these steps: > 1) download some Emacs snapshot and compile it with debugging symbols > 2) run it as usual under gdb > 3) run inside Screen under gdb one more emacs -Q > 4) run inside Screen under gdb one more emacs -Q and M-x display-time > > Before trying to do that I need to know if the symptoms I describe are somewhat known already and if I can do some debuggiong at the elisp level before resorting to gdb. If I need gdb, I'd use some help with details of the steps 1-4 above. I don't think GDB is the first tool to try, at least not yet. I'd start from invoking "M-x profiler-start RET RET" (use the "cpu" profile), then press some keys which produce these long delays, then invoke "M-x profiler-report" and post the fully-expanded profile here. Maybe that will tell us something if the profile shows something unusual that takes a lot of CPU. Another thing to look at is the list of timers (use "M-x list-timers") where you might see some idle timers that take too much time before Emacs notices your keypresses and stops them. Yet another aspect is the memory footprint of Emacs: if it is very large, perhaps your system runs out of physical memory and starts paging? And finally, set garbage-collection-messages non-nil and see if Emacs says it's running GC when it becomes not responsive. (FTR, I see no slowdowns in my sessions, which also run for weeks. But then I have only one screen, nothing as fancy as what you describe.)
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 14:58:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #11 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 16:57:19 +0200
>> From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it>
>> Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 11:30:58 +0200
>>
>> I usually launch Emacs and do not exit it for weeks. I run the Debian emacs-lucid build running on three terminals: the Screen terminal emulator, an X Windows terminal displayed on two physical side-by-side monitors and a remote X Windows terminal managed by Xpra (a sort of graphic Screen). I use remotely both the terminal managed by Screen and the one managed by Xpra.
>>
>> Starting some months ago (maybe six months?) I have observed that Emacs becomes gradually less responsive to user keypresses, to the point that it slows down my workflow significantly. Restarting it solves the problem. The effect is very gradual, and becomes unbearable after two or three weeks. For example, now I am at the point of having to restart Emacs and I see that ~/.emacs.desktop.lock is dated 18 July, which is 20 days ago.
>>
>> The effect I observe is a noticeable delay from the moment I press a key to the moment I see the effect on Emacs, on any terminal. This is less evident while I am writing without pauses such as in this moment. I observe next to no delay while writing. But after any pause, which may be even one or two seconds long, I observe delays of at least half a second and up to some seconds from a keypress to Emacs reacting to it. This happens with any Emacs command, including self-insert-command. The effect is particularly grave on graphics terminals and complex buffers. I just observed a delay of more than 10s on an Eww buffer after a PgDn keypress. Occasionally I observe an even more wrringoy behaviour. If keep pressing keys when Emacs is stalled, I see that the first keypresses are lost, which sometimes causes unpredictable behaviour.
>>
>> Since the problem builds up gradually in the course of many days, I have never considered reproducing it under emacs -Q, but now that the problem does not go away with ebia ugDpnrades and has gone on for several months at least, I am wondering how I can try to debug it. I need some guidance on that, because I have not programmed in C for at least ten years by now, and while I was used to use gdb, I have never been proficient at debugging complex situations.
>>
>> One possibility would be that Emacs responsiveness degrades even if it is not used. So I may run an emacs -Q process and let it run there, unused, with only some activity running in the background, like for example display-time.
>>
>> If I am not wrong I should follow something along these steps:
>> 1) download some Emacs snapshot and compile it with debugging symbols
>> 2) run it as usual under gdb
>> 3) run inside Screen under gdb one more emacs -Q
>> 4) run inside Screen under gdb one more emacs -Q and M-x display-time
>>
>> Before trying to do that I need to know if the symptoms I describe are somewhat known already and if I can do some debuggiong at the elisp level before resorting to gdb. If I need gdb, I'd use some help with details of the steps 1-4 above.
>
>I don't think GDB is the first tool to try, at least not yet. I'd
>start from invoking "M-x profiler-start RET RET" (use the "cpu"
>profile), then press some keys which produce these long delays, then
>invoke "M-x profiler-report" and post the fully-expanded profile here.
>Maybe that will tell us something if the profile shows something
>unusual that takes a lot of CPU.
Ok, doing that next.
>Another thing to look at is the list of timers (use "M-x list-timers")
>where you might see some idle timers that take too much time before
>Emacs notices your keypresses and stops them.
I killed all the paren-el and display-time timers, and all the Tramp dired and shell processes and I got some improvements, but no significant change. Here is the current list of timers:
28.0s 1m display-time-event-handler
28.0s 1m appt-check
44m 7.5s 1h url-cookie-write-file
13h 53m 28.0s 1d diary
13h 54m 28.0s 1d sunrise-sunset
* 0.5s :repeat blink-cursor-start
* 2.0s t garbage-collect
* 30.0s - desktop-auto-save
>Yet another aspect is the memory footprint of Emacs: if it is very
>large, perhaps your system runs out of physical memory and starts
>paging?
I have RSS of about 5GB for Emacs and about 6GB for Firefox, which should not be a lot given that I have 64 GB physical memory. Anyway, I killed Firefox and I got some little improvement, but not so much.
>And finally, set garbage-collection-messages non-nil and see if Emacs
>says it's running GC when it becomes not responsive.
I just did that and yes, when Emacs stalls it is always because of the garbage collector.
Ok, I enabled the profiler and I got five garbage collections in few seconds while doing nothing special (writing this email, switching buffers and frames):
24756 98% Automatic GC
165 0% + redisplay_internal (C function)
64 0% + quail-input-method
60 0% + command-execute
6 0% + comint-output-filter
5 0% + timer-event-handler
3 0% + #<byte-code-function 821>
0 0% ...
Then I did it again, I just moved the cursor up and down in the email buffer without scrolling and got this after the first gc message:
4985 97% Automatic GC
129 2% + redisplay_internal (C function)
15 0% - command-execute
12 0% - funcall-interactively
12 0% - previous-line
12 0% line-move
3 0% - byte-code
3 0% - read-extended-command
3 0% - read-extended-command-1
3 0% - completing-read-default
3 0% redisplay_internal (C function)
0 0% ...
Once more, this time only up about twenty lines and down about the same, then stop and wait, in few seconds gc starts and I get this report:
5009 95% Automatic GC
225 4% redisplay_internal (C function)
14 0% - command-execute
13 0% - byte-code
13 0% - read-extended-command
13 0% - read-extended-command-1
13 0% completing-read-default
1 0% - funcall-interactively
1 0% - mail-abbrev-next-line
1 0% - apply
1 0% - format-addresses
1 0% - let
1 0% - condition-case
1 0% - apply
1 0% - #<native-comp-function mail-abbrev-next-line>
1 0% - next-line
1 0% line-move
0 0% ...
Again:
4929 97% Automatic GC
111 2% redisplay_internal (C function)
11 0% - command-execute
11 0% - byte-code
11 0% - read-extended-command
11 0% - read-extended-command-1
11 0% - completing-read-default
8 0% redisplay_internal (C function)
0 0% ...
Here is the output from garbage-collect:
(garbage-collect)
((conses 16 81444277 18789660)
(symbols 48 55477 35)
(strings 32 397453 30037)
(string-bytes 1 40910325)
(vectors 16 133975)
(vector-slots 8 2631311 445393)
(floats 8 1435 25028)
(intervals 56 42472026 201)
(buffers 992 223))
Here is the memory report (took a very long time to complete):
Estimated Emacs Memory Usage
4.9 GiB Total Buffer Memory Usage
3.5 GiB Overall Object Memory Usage
291 MiB Reserved (But Unused) Object Memory
22 MiB Memory Used By Global Variables
6.4 MiB Memory Used By Symbol Plists
134 KiB Total Image Cache Size
Object Storage
2.2 GiB Intervals
1.2 GiB Conses
51 MiB Strings
22 MiB Vectors
2.5 MiB Symbols
217 KiB Buffer-Objects
11 KiB Floats
Largest Buffers
3.1 GiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as*
549 MiB *debug tramp/scp fencepost.gnu.org*
321 MiB *debug tramp/scp casapot*
312 MiB *debug tramp/scp aaloa*
287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL*
181 MiB *debug tramp/scp rootevaal*
125 MiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-eu*
40 MiB *eww*
11 MiB *message-viewer NOTIZIE*
9.7 MiB *code-conversion-work*
6.1 MiB RMAIL
5.2 MiB *info*
3.3 MiB *message-viewer GNU*
1.5 MiB loaddefs.el.gz
1.4 MiB *message-viewer hacker*
1.2 MiB *jka-compr-wr-temp*
1.1 MiB *Buffer List*
1 MiB log
1021 KiB *Messages*
915 KiB dpkg.log.1
Largest Variables
2.2 MiB woman-topic-all-completions
1.4 MiB undo-equiv-table
1.3 MiB anything-candidate-cache
1.2 MiB anything-c-man-pages
1.2 MiB kill-ring
1.2 MiB kill-ring-yank-pointer
1 MiB load-history
1 MiB ucs-normalize-hangul-translation-alist
814 KiB mailcap--computed-mime-data
725 KiB url-domsuf-domains
659 KiB package-archive-contents
618 KiB easy-menu-converted-items-table
399 KiB Info-toc-nodes
314 KiB uni-confusable-table
299 KiB pending-undo-list
269 KiB help-definition-prefixes
251 KiB current-load-list
216 KiB face--new-frame-defaults
203 KiB mailcap-mime-extensions
135 KiB mail-aliases
After deleting all the *debug tramp buffers, the problem seems to have disappeared. I have used Emacs for some minutes after that, and it behaves normally. The huge *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* buffer was relative to a file that was modified, on a shaky Internet connection. So that is the first suspect. All the other *debug tramp buffers were relative to unmodified files or deleted buffers.
This is the memory report after deleting all the Tramp buffers (was very fast):
Estimated Emacs Memory Usage
456 MiB Reserved (But Unused) Object Memory
388 MiB Total Buffer Memory Usage
112 MiB Overall Object Memory Usage
22 MiB Memory Used By Global Variables
6.4 MiB Memory Used By Symbol Plists
73 KiB Total Image Cache Size
Object Storage
51 MiB Strings
31 MiB Conses
22 MiB Vectors
6.1 MiB Intervals
2.5 MiB Symbols
194 KiB Buffer-Objects
11 KiB Floats
Largest Buffers
287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL*
40 MiB *eww*
11 MiB *message-viewer NOTIZIE*
9.7 MiB *code-conversion-work*
6.1 MiB RMAIL
5.2 MiB *info*
3.3 MiB *message-viewer GNU*
1.5 MiB loaddefs.el.gz
1.4 MiB *message-viewer hacker*
1.2 MiB *jka-compr-wr-temp*
1 MiB *Messages*
1 MiB log
915 KiB dpkg.log.1
875 KiB *mail*
753 KiB dpkg.log.2.xz
622 KiB pot.bib
593 KiB *info*<5>
593 KiB *info*<3>
593 KiB *info*<4>
592 KiB *info*<2>
Largest Variables
2.2 MiB woman-topic-all-completions
1.4 MiB undo-equiv-table
1.3 MiB anything-candidate-cache
1.3 MiB kill-ring
1.3 MiB kill-ring-yank-pointer
1.2 MiB anything-c-man-pages
1 MiB load-history
1 MiB ucs-normalize-hangul-translation-alist
814 KiB mailcap--computed-mime-data
725 KiB url-domsuf-domains
659 KiB package-archive-contents
618 KiB easy-menu-converted-items-table
399 KiB Info-toc-nodes
314 KiB uni-confusable-table
269 KiB help-definition-prefixes
251 KiB current-load-list
216 KiB face--new-frame-defaults
203 KiB mailcap-mime-extensions
135 KiB mail-aliases
126 KiB global-map
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 15:38:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #14 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> To: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 18:37:05 +0300
> From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> > Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 16:57:19 +0200 > Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > >Yet another aspect is the memory footprint of Emacs: if it is very > >large, perhaps your system runs out of physical memory and starts > >paging? > > I have RSS of about 5GB for Emacs and about 6GB for Firefox, which should not be a lot given that I have 64 GB physical memory. Anyway, I killed Firefox and I got some little improvement, but not so much. > > >And finally, set garbage-collection-messages non-nil and see if Emacs > >says it's running GC when it becomes not responsive. > > I just did that and yes, when Emacs stalls it is always because of the garbage collector. Aha! > Estimated Emacs Memory Usage > > 4.9 GiB Total Buffer Memory Usage > 3.5 GiB Overall Object Memory Usage > 291 MiB Reserved (But Unused) Object Memory > 22 MiB Memory Used By Global Variables > 6.4 MiB Memory Used By Symbol Plists > 134 KiB Total Image Cache Size > > Object Storage > > 2.2 GiB Intervals > 1.2 GiB Conses > 51 MiB Strings > 22 MiB Vectors > 2.5 MiB Symbols > 217 KiB Buffer-Objects > 11 KiB Floats > > Largest Buffers > > 3.1 GiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* > 549 MiB *debug tramp/scp fencepost.gnu.org* > 321 MiB *debug tramp/scp casapot* > 312 MiB *debug tramp/scp aaloa* > 287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL* > 181 MiB *debug tramp/scp rootevaal* > 125 MiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-eu* That's a _huge_ session. > After deleting all the *debug tramp buffers, the problem seems to have disappeared. I have used Emacs for some minutes after that, and it behaves normally. The huge *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* buffer was relative to a file that was modified, on a shaky Internet connection. So that is the first suspect. All the other *debug tramp buffers were relative to unmodified files or deleted buffers. > > This is the memory report after deleting all the Tramp buffers (was very fast): > > Estimated Emacs Memory Usage > > 456 MiB Reserved (But Unused) Object Memory > 388 MiB Total Buffer Memory Usage > 112 MiB Overall Object Memory Usage > 22 MiB Memory Used By Global Variables > 6.4 MiB Memory Used By Symbol Plists > 73 KiB Total Image Cache Size > > Object Storage > > 51 MiB Strings > 31 MiB Conses > 22 MiB Vectors > 6.1 MiB Intervals > 2.5 MiB Symbols > 194 KiB Buffer-Objects > 11 KiB Floats This is much more reasonable, similar to what I have here. > Largest Buffers > > 287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL* > 40 MiB *eww* > 11 MiB *message-viewer NOTIZIE* > 9.7 MiB *code-conversion-work* > 6.1 MiB RMAIL > 5.2 MiB *info* > 3.3 MiB *message-viewer GNU* > 1.5 MiB loaddefs.el.gz > 1.4 MiB *message-viewer hacker* > 1.2 MiB *jka-compr-wr-temp* > 1 MiB *Messages* > 1 MiB log > 915 KiB dpkg.log.1 > 875 KiB *mail* > 753 KiB dpkg.log.2.xz > 622 KiB pot.bib > 593 KiB *info*<5> > 593 KiB *info*<3> > 593 KiB *info*<4> > 592 KiB *info*<2> > > Largest Variables > > 2.2 MiB woman-topic-all-completions > 1.4 MiB undo-equiv-table > 1.3 MiB anything-candidate-cache > 1.3 MiB kill-ring > 1.3 MiB kill-ring-yank-pointer > 1.2 MiB anything-c-man-pages > 1 MiB load-history > 1 MiB ucs-normalize-hangul-translation-alist > 814 KiB mailcap--computed-mime-data > 725 KiB url-domsuf-domains > 659 KiB package-archive-contents > 618 KiB easy-menu-converted-items-table > 399 KiB Info-toc-nodes > 314 KiB uni-confusable-table > 269 KiB help-definition-prefixes > 251 KiB current-load-list > 216 KiB face--new-frame-defaults > 203 KiB mailcap-mime-extensions > 135 KiB mail-aliases > 126 KiB global-map So I guess the mystery is solved?
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 16:15:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #17 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Michael Albinus <michael.albinus <at> gmx.de> To: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 18:13:51 +0200
Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> writes: Hi Francesco, > Largest Buffers > > 3.1 GiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* > 549 MiB *debug tramp/scp fencepost.gnu.org* > 321 MiB *debug tramp/scp casapot* > 312 MiB *debug tramp/scp aaloa* > 287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL* > 181 MiB *debug tramp/scp rootevaal* > 125 MiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-eu* > > After deleting all the *debug tramp buffers, the problem seems to have > disappeared. I have used Emacs for some minutes after that, and it > behaves normally. The huge *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* buffer was > relative to a file that was modified, on a shaky Internet connection. > So that is the first suspect. All the other *debug tramp buffers were > relative to unmodified files or deleted buffers. I recommend to lower tramp-verbose. At least down to 6, this is sufficient unless you hunt for Tramp bugs. If you are not interested in Tramp internal commands, keep tramp-verbose with its default value 3. Best regards, Michael.
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 17:07:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #20 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 19:06:03 +0200
>> I just did that and yes, when Emacs stalls it is always because of the garbage collector. > >Aha! > >> Estimated Emacs Memory Usage >> >> 4.9 GiB Total Buffer Memory Usage >> 3.5 GiB Overall Object Memory Usage >> 291 MiB Reserved (But Unused) Object Memory >> 22 MiB Memory Used By Global Variables >> 6.4 MiB Memory Used By Symbol Plists >> 134 KiB Total Image Cache Size >> >> Object Storage >> >> 2.2 GiB Intervals >> 1.2 GiB Conses >> 51 MiB Strings >> 22 MiB Vectors >> 2.5 MiB Symbols >> 217 KiB Buffer-Objects >> 11 KiB Floats >> >> Largest Buffers >> >> 3.1 GiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* >> 549 MiB *debug tramp/scp fencepost.gnu.org* >> 321 MiB *debug tramp/scp casapot* >> 312 MiB *debug tramp/scp aaloa* >> 287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL* >> 181 MiB *debug tramp/scp rootevaal* >> 125 MiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-eu* > >That's a _huge_ session. > >> After deleting all the *debug tramp buffers, the problem seems to have disappeared. I have used Emacs for some minutes after that, and it behaves normally. The huge *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* buffer was relative to a file that was modified, on a shaky Internet connection. So that is the first suspect. All the other *debug tramp buffers were relative to unmodified files or deleted buffers. >> >> This is the memory report after deleting all the Tramp buffers (was very fast): >> >> Estimated Emacs Memory Usage >> >> 456 MiB Reserved (But Unused) Object Memory >> 388 MiB Total Buffer Memory Usage >> 112 MiB Overall Object Memory Usage >> 22 MiB Memory Used By Global Variables >> 6.4 MiB Memory Used By Symbol Plists >> 73 KiB Total Image Cache Size >> >> Object Storage >> >> 51 MiB Strings >> 31 MiB Conses >> 22 MiB Vectors >> 6.1 MiB Intervals >> 2.5 MiB Symbols >> 194 KiB Buffer-Objects >> 11 KiB Floats > >This is much more reasonable, similar to what I have here. > >> Largest Buffers >> >> 287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL* >> 40 MiB *eww* >> >> Largest Variables >> >> 2.2 MiB woman-topic-all-completions >> 1.4 MiB undo-equiv-table >> 1.3 MiB anything-candidate-cache >> 1.3 MiB kill-ring >> 1.3 MiB kill-ring-yank-pointer >> 1.2 MiB anything-c-man-pages > >So I guess the mystery is solved? Thanks, Eli, for guiding me till here. Okay, now that I know the cause, I am able to correct the problem once I see it and maybe even to prevent it. But is it normal that I get a warning when reading a file whose size exceeds a given threshold, but not when a hidden buffer grows over 3GB? And is it normal that a 3GB buffer which is occasionally appended to has such a big impact on Emacs, even on a system with 64GB real memory available and largely unused? And is it normal that such frequent garbage collections are not detected and signaled, with possibly a hint of what might be the most common causes and remedies? I can easily see possible mitigations for the first and last issues, but I don't know enough to have an opinion about the second issue.
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 17:11:01 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #23 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> To: Michael Albinus <michael.albinus <at> gmx.de> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 19:10:13 +0200
>> Largest Buffers >> >> 3.1 GiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-as* >> 549 MiB *debug tramp/scp fencepost.gnu.org* >> 321 MiB *debug tramp/scp casapot* >> 312 MiB *debug tramp/scp aaloa* >> 287 MiB *message-viewer RMAIL* >> 181 MiB *debug tramp/scp rootevaal* >> 125 MiB *debug tramp/scp evaalapi-eu* >I recommend to lower tramp-verbose. At least down to 6, this is >sufficient unless you hunt for Tramp bugs. Thank you Michael. Yes, I set it to 4, down from 9 that I had before. I now suspect that 9 includes all the file transfer including the files' contents, is that the case? I would use the highest number that does not log file contents. Is that 6?
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 17:30:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #26 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Michael Albinus <michael.albinus <at> gmx.de> To: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 19:29:11 +0200
Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> writes: Hi Francesco, >>I recommend to lower tramp-verbose. At least down to 6, this is >>sufficient unless you hunt for Tramp bugs. > > Thank you Michael. Yes, I set it to 4, down from 9 that I had before. > I now suspect that 9 includes all the file transfer including the > files' contents, is that the case? I would use the highest number > that does not log file contents. Is that 6? tramp-verbose 6 shows all sent commands and the received responses. In case of scp connections this includes file contents for files with a smaller size of tramp-copy-size-limit (10240 bytes). Do you really need Tramp debug buffers? Best regards, Michael.
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 19:10:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #29 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> To: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 22:09:47 +0300
> From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> > Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 19:06:03 +0200 > Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > But is it normal that I get a warning when reading a file whose size exceeds a given threshold, but not when a hidden buffer grows over 3GB? We could discuss this separately. One problem with the growing buffer case is that the growth is gradual, unlike reading a large file, which happens in one go. So a warning could be too late. > And is it normal that a 3GB buffer which is occasionally appended to has such a big impact on Emacs, even on a system with 64GB real memory available and largely unused? I don't think it's the buffer text itself. Look at your memory report: you also had 2 GB of intervals and 1.2 GB of cons cells. I think it's those that caused the expensive GC, because GC needs to traverse all those objects. Buffer text itself has only a minor effect on GC. > And is it normal that such frequent garbage collections are not detected and signaled, with possibly a hint of what might be the most common causes and remedies? Again, we could discuss the possible ways of detecting this and perhaps warning the user. We never had any such warnings until now.
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Wed, 06 Aug 2025 20:39:01 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #32 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> To: Michael Albinus <michael.albinus <at> gmx.de> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2025 22:38:01 +0200
Michael Albinus: >>>I recommend to lower tramp-verbose. At least down to 6, this is >>>sufficient unless you hunt for Tramp bugs. >> >> Thank you Michael. Yes, I set it to 4, down from 9 that I had before. >> I now suspect that 9 includes all the file transfer including the >> files' contents, is that the case? I would use the highest number >> that does not log file contents. Is that 6? > >tramp-verbose 6 shows all sent commands and the received responses. In >case of scp connections this includes file contents for files with a >smaller size of tramp-copy-size-limit (10240 bytes). > >Do you really need Tramp debug buffers? In fact, I have been looking at them in the past, when I could not understand what was going on with some bad connections. So I'd like to be able to have a look in case of problems. In fact, I have not done that for a long time by now. By the way, would it make sense to put a limit on the number of lines in a debug Tramp buffer?
bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:bug#79182; Package emacs.
(Thu, 07 Aug 2025 11:34:01 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.Message #35 received at 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):
From: Michael Albinus <michael.albinus <at> gmx.de> To: Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> Cc: 79182 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> Subject: Re: bug#79182: 30.1; emacs becomes progressively less responsive up to become unusable Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2025 13:33:42 +0200
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Francesco Potortì <pot <at> potorti.it> writes: Hi Francesco, > By the way, would it make sense to put a limit on the number of lines > in a debug Tramp buffer? For a general fix with too large buffers there is the discussion with Eli. Don't know, whether we will add such a check. For the Tramp case, you might try the appended patch. It fires a warning when the Tramp debug buffer exceeds a limit (tramp-debug-buffer-limit, 3GB by default). Best regards, Michael.
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