From unknown Thu Aug 14 21:55:53 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#79061: 30.1; Possible documentation bug for isearch-allow-motion (substitute-command-keys) Resent-From: martin Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 18:08:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 79061 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 79061@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.175303484620875 (code B ref -1); Sun, 20 Jul 2025 18:08:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Jul 2025 18:07:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51616 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udYRZ-0005Qd-JQ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:07:25 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:470:142::17]:54712) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udYRV-0005Pr-SS for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; 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Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 27811365622 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700 Received: from 27811365622 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700 From: martin MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700 X-Gm-Features: Ac12FXw2zx_tNYwBPGIahqSBiwHNxvhXMUTPcFttu_-JSKjYFxFrj58LPwFkV-Q Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: none client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42b; envelope-from=law@martinmarshall.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42b.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) When using `describe-variable` to read about `isearch-allow-motion`, the following paragraph is displayed in the *Help* buffer: > Whether to allow movement between isearch matches by cursor motion commands. > If non-nil, the four motion commands <, >, SPC and DEL, when invoked during > Isearch, move respectively to the first occurrence of the current search string > in the buffer, the last one, the first one after the current window, and the > last one before the current window. > If nil, these motion commands normally exit Isearch and are executed. This leads to confusion, because in most buffers those keys, "<, >, SPC and DEL", don't have the described effect "when invoked during Isearch". A check of the source shows that the listed keys are generated by `substitute-command-keys`, and the intended commands are respectively `beginning-of-buffer`, `end-of-buffer`, `scroll-up-command` and `scroll-down-command`. It appears that `substitute-command-keys` inserts those keys because they're bound to those commands in the *Help* buffer's `help-mode-map`. I think it would be best in this case to refer to the commands by name, unless there's some way to exclude `help-mode-map` from the keys `substitute-command-keys` selects from. Martin From unknown Thu Aug 14 21:55:53 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#79061: 30.1; Possible documentation bug for isearch-allow-motion (substitute-command-keys) Resent-From: martin Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 20:39:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 79061 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 79061@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.175304391128779 (code B ref -1); Sun, 20 Jul 2025 20:39:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Jul 2025 20:38:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52232 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udann-0007U5-8k for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 16:38:31 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:470:142::17]:34374) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udanj-0007Tb-Cb for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; 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Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:38:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 27811365622 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:38:16 -0700 Received: from 27811365622 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:38:16 -0700 From: martin In-Reply-To: (martin's message of "Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700") References: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:38:16 -0700 X-Gm-Features: Ac12FXwst70q1orSozesX6GBoRsU7f4B6hkA-fg98RgMTBKowzGYt8JU8LLD9Kk Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: none client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::436; envelope-from=law@martinmarshall.com; helo=mail-wr1-x436.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) martin writes: > When using `describe-variable` to read about `isearch-allow-motion`, the > following paragraph is displayed in the *Help* buffer: It seems I was too hasty in submitting this. I can see now this was already fixed on the master branch, and it looks like the same change was made on the emacs-30 branch (for an eventual 30.2 release, I suppose). Sorry for the unnecessary report. Best, Martin From unknown Thu Aug 14 21:55:53 2025 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.505 (Entity 5.505) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: martin Subject: bug#79061: closed (Re: bug#79061: 30.1; Possible documentation bug for isearch-allow-motion (substitute-command-keys)) Message-ID: References: <86a54xdcos.fsf@gnu.org> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 79061 X-Gnu-PR-Package: emacs Reply-To: 79061@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 11:08:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1753096082-14602-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1753096082-14602-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #79061: 30.1; Possible documentation bug for isearch-allow-motion (substitu= te-command-keys) which was filed against the emacs package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 79061@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 79061: https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D79061 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1753096082-14602-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 79061-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Jul 2025 11:07:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55794 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udoNC-0003nG-8s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 07:07:58 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:42570) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udoNA-0003mx-01 for 79061-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 07:07:56 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1udoN4-0005RM-ES; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 07:07:50 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=v+rVo/fyxUpah5YQwQoigUhzcmeeStRj3/QxbGYxrtY=; b=MSIKtvMGZAFL FpIdbUznYG7EL4TeyErgi/iJQQ2OAFlPJxduMB7uF9ktxAhNTCA5ZRq5H1fkd1larUeVX0TxM3fkN BclzEJIOidxO2sBMWX+aaWEEGz3CQr4PxzuF7AUXC9Alu3YyHT2OnB7i4Kjd7EzuNH0srseVYZRSI YDSeyZ8yedoR2OtvRi6MbDZIzrOoJdet4f15SAO+lq4dIaYWeLeZNeUq58CRqWpB6AdrXdWk/Qfk4 UhJZfZMPopG/YPPz9S6esyHPapfGrSLRrOG+o82moI6XMcL0XEaNm0sSvYBp41F2nJoBQacoqcMp4 6IM0VUqkd5ZuYkDYF+afuw==; Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 14:07:47 +0300 Message-Id: <86a54xdcos.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: martin In-Reply-To: (message from martin on Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:38:16 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#79061: 30.1; Possible documentation bug for isearch-allow-motion (substitute-command-keys) References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79061-done Cc: 79061-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: martin > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:38:16 -0700 > > martin writes: > > > When using `describe-variable` to read about `isearch-allow-motion`, the > > following paragraph is displayed in the *Help* buffer: > > It seems I was too hasty in submitting this. I can see now this was > already fixed on the master branch, and it looks like the same change > was made on the emacs-30 branch (for an eventual 30.2 release, I > suppose). > > Sorry for the unnecessary report. No need to feel sorry. Thanks for double checking and telling us the results. I'm therefore closing this bug. ------------=_1753096082-14602-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Jul 2025 18:07:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51616 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udYRZ-0005Qd-JQ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:07:25 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:470:142::17]:54712) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1udYRV-0005Pr-SS for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:07:23 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1udYRJ-0002ty-QZ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:07:09 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-x42b.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42b]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1udYRH-0004FU-HR for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; 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Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 27811365622 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700 Received: from 27811365622 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700 From: martin MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 11:07:03 -0700 X-Gm-Features: Ac12FXw2zx_tNYwBPGIahqSBiwHNxvhXMUTPcFttu_-JSKjYFxFrj58LPwFkV-Q Message-ID: Subject: 30.1; Possible documentation bug for isearch-allow-motion (substitute-command-keys) To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: none client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42b; envelope-from=law@martinmarshall.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42b.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) When using `describe-variable` to read about `isearch-allow-motion`, the following paragraph is displayed in the *Help* buffer: > Whether to allow movement between isearch matches by cursor motion commands. > If non-nil, the four motion commands <, >, SPC and DEL, when invoked during > Isearch, move respectively to the first occurrence of the current search string > in the buffer, the last one, the first one after the current window, and the > last one before the current window. > If nil, these motion commands normally exit Isearch and are executed. This leads to confusion, because in most buffers those keys, "<, >, SPC and DEL", don't have the described effect "when invoked during Isearch". A check of the source shows that the listed keys are generated by `substitute-command-keys`, and the intended commands are respectively `beginning-of-buffer`, `end-of-buffer`, `scroll-up-command` and `scroll-down-command`. It appears that `substitute-command-keys` inserts those keys because they're bound to those commands in the *Help* buffer's `help-mode-map`. I think it would be best in this case to refer to the commands by name, unless there's some way to exclude `help-mode-map` from the keys `substitute-command-keys` selects from. Martin ------------=_1753096082-14602-1--