From unknown Sun Jun 22 07:50:10 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#7893: HP-UX make causes autoconf timestamp issues Resent-From: Ralf Wildenhues Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-automake@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 10:49:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 7893 X-GNU-PR-Package: automake X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 7893@debbugs.gnu.org, autoconf-patches@gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-automake@gnu.org, autoconf-patches@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.129577970331876 (code B ref -1); Sun, 23 Jan 2011 10:49:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Jan 2011 10:48:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PgxUc-0008I4-44 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:48:22 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PgxUY-0008Hs-Tm for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:48:19 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PgxcH-00025p-21 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:56:18 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, T_TO_NO_BRKTS_FREEMAIL autolearn=unavailable version=3.3.1 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]:59298) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PgxcG-00025k-Vb for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:56:17 -0500 Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=38412 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1PgxcE-0006vT-EA for bug-automake@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:56:16 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PgxcC-00023V-De for bug-automake@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:56:14 -0500 Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net ([213.165.64.22]:60052) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PgxcC-00022f-11 for bug-automake@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 05:56:12 -0500 Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 23 Jan 2011 10:56:09 -0000 Received: from xdsl-78-35-52-200.netcologne.de (EHLO localhost.localdomain) [78.35.52.200] by mail.gmx.net (mp022) with SMTP; 23 Jan 2011 11:56:09 +0100 X-Authenticated: #13673931 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/tDaVNfFTtYftHjNMMSgmPGaDqQDvl3aR/oDQ/Oh 63NlWiwKt75cZw Received: from ralf by localhost.localdomain with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Pgxc4-00025A-4o; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 11:56:04 +0100 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 11:56:04 +0100 From: Ralf Wildenhues Message-ID: <20110123105603.GC7768@gmx.de> Mail-Followup-To: bug-automake@gnu.org, autoconf-patches@gnu.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Organization: Institute for Numerical Simulation, University of Bonn User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2010-08-04) X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Spam-Score: -4.5 (----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.5 (----) http://autobuild.josefsson.org/automake/log-201101181921247117000.txt This HP-UX 11.31 system is fast enough to trigger test failures for at least these Automake tests, besides the ones already fixed: insthook libobj16b output10 posixsubst-data posixsubst-scripts subcond2 subpkg2 suffix13 all due to the bug that HP-UX make considers targets out of date when they have the same time stamp as a prerequisite (cf. pending autoconf.texi patch). The symptom is that autoconf is triggered during `make distcheck' due to aclocal.m4 having same time stamp as configure, which of course then fails in the read-only distdir tree: + make distcheck [...] CDPATH="${ZSH_VERSION+.}:" && cd .. && /bin/sh /tmp/build-ia64-hp-hpux11.31/tests/libobj16b.dir/libobj16b-1.0/missing --run autoconf autom4te: cannot create autom4te.cache: No such file or directory Now, with even faster systems, that problem will only get worse over time, i.e., happen in many more tests, and maybe also in user projects. Question is what to do about it. Possibilities include: - Add $sleep after every $ACLOCAL in problematic cases. Not maintainable. - sleep in aclocal, or even autom4te. Ugh! - Let autom4te not fail if, in a read-only directory, autom4te.cache creation fails but configure is actually up to date (seems doable, but would probably require a number of changes in Autoconf). - Work around it by using a global cache (not so good) or turning off autom4te.cache creation completely, on HP-UX. Modify Autoconf to do so by default, or at least recommend it? The latter point deserves some explanation as to why I think it works: autom4te updates an output file if at least one of its inputs is not older than an existing output file. IOW, the semantics actually match that of HP-UX make. Not using a cache means configure will be updated at the first time $MAKE is run, and since files created after configure are strictly newer than files created before, all will be well; at least until one more dependency level is added to the bootstrap chain. (Boy, am I glad gnulib-tool and aclocal are so slow.) If a global autom4te.cache is used (which IIRC still has some bugs), then autom4te will detect that configure doesn't change, but of course time stamps persist in the problematic state, so several harmless but time-consuming autoconf reruns will be triggered from within '$MAKE distcheck'. So this works reliably, but is a bit suboptimal. My question is, (how) should autotools cater to this HP-UX make wart? Many users might use GNU make for their projects anyway, for them it would not be nice to turn off caching outright. Thus I suggest to document the issue, as below. I'm turning off autom4te.cache for my future testing on this system. Thanks, Ralf Recommend turning off autom4te.cache for HP-UX make. * BUGS: Document HP-UX make bug causing failed autom4te.cache creation during `make distcheck'. diff --git a/BUGS b/BUGS index 82c438e..6c95934 100644 --- a/BUGS +++ b/BUGS @@ -35,3 +35,8 @@ and use with caution an Autoconf with ``Important bugs''. possible that other difficulties will be encountered, whether with shell or platform limitations; help is appreciated in improving parallel testsuite support. + +* The non-Posix time stamp semantics of HP-UX make can cause Automake's + `make distcheck' to fail due to failed autom4te.cache directory creation. + It is recommended to turn off autom4te caching on these systems if GNU + make cannot be used (see info Autoconf 'Customizing autom4te'). From unknown Sun Jun 22 07:50:10 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#7893: HP-UX make causes autoconf timestamp issues References: <20110123105603.GC7768@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <20110123105603.GC7768@gmx.de> Resent-From: Stefano Lattarini Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-automake@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 13:32:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 7893 X-GNU-PR-Package: automake X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: bug-autoconf@gnu.org Cc: 7893@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 7893-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B7893.132507906721211 (code B ref 7893); Wed, 28 Dec 2011 13:32:01 +0000 Received: (at 7893) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Dec 2011 13:31:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rftb1-0005W4-3Z for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 08:31:07 -0500 Received: from mail-wi0-f172.google.com ([209.85.212.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rftay-0005Vw-H0 for 7893@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 08:31:05 -0500 Received: by wibhj6 with SMTP id hj6so6012199wib.3 for <7893@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 05:28:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=5yS8RZucBeOdxIpR3zqFNL5dDgIrWYp0ZTEVYT2twQs=; b=X4U6O7GJHXAHWPfnLDnBK/3YVWtkvBgofZ8e+kebhmQZyfSy1vJcxVONnHlYCTzduI Mx5HX7Mv6yObX9/S/CIpFNnQgmh0A5zT87NWd8rFgzo78neTpkfv0knCmuIrIApQ0xua HA1UFFlp1AlaUsCJPdkLdM/bOXdAC6aLV7t+s= Received: by 10.180.91.201 with SMTP id cg9mr70496846wib.15.1325078899542; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 05:28:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from [87.2.97.164] (host164-97-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it. [87.2.97.164]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id dd4sm74532157wib.1.2011.12.28.05.28.18 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 28 Dec 2011 05:28:18 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4EFB196F.3020508@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 14:28:15 +0100 From: Stefano Lattarini MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -3.9 (---) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.9 (---) Ping: I intend to close that bug report soon as a "wontfix", since the issue is due to such a broken, anti-POSIX behaviour of HP-UX make that it is pointless trying to work around it. Still, it would be nice if autoconf would explicitly document the issue, at least in the BUGS file (and IMHO even in the manual). Hence this ping. Regards, Stefano From unknown Sun Jun 22 07:50:10 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#7893: HP-UX make causes autoconf timestamp issues Resent-From: Paul Eggert Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-automake@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 20:31:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 7893 X-GNU-PR-Package: automake X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefano Lattarini Cc: bug-autoconf@gnu.org, 7893@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 7893-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B7893.132510424029490 (code B ref 7893); Wed, 28 Dec 2011 20:31:02 +0000 Received: (at 7893) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Dec 2011 20:30:40 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rg092-0007fZ-1K for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 15:30:40 -0500 Received: from smtp.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.62]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rg090-0007fQ-Eh for 7893@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 15:30:39 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4E9E39E800E; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:27:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at smtp.cs.ucla.edu Received: from smtp.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id I78d26csl4Vw; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:27:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.10] (pool-71-189-109-235.lsanca.fios.verizon.net [71.189.109.235]) by smtp.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 542C339E800D; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:27:51 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4EFB7BC8.5040903@cs.ucla.edu> Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:27:52 -0800 From: Paul Eggert Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:8.0) Gecko/20111124 Thunderbird/8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4EFB196F.3020508@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <4EFB196F.3020508@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) That issue is now documented in the INSTALL file, as well as in the Autoconf manual. Here's the relevant commit: http://git.savannah.gnu.org/gitweb/?p=autoconf.git;a=commitdiff;h=2d082fa1ca25a16b60fb874e80f51ee79408e1f4 From unknown Sun Jun 22 07:50:10 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#7893: HP-UX make causes autoconf timestamp issues Resent-From: Stefano Lattarini Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-automake@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 20:41:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 7893 X-GNU-PR-Package: automake X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Paul Eggert Cc: bug-autoconf@gnu.org, 7893@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 7893-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B7893.132510480230805 (code B ref 7893); Wed, 28 Dec 2011 20:41:02 +0000 Received: (at 7893) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Dec 2011 20:40:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rg0I5-00080Y-Tw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 15:40:02 -0500 Received: from mail-ee0-f44.google.com ([74.125.83.44]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rg0I2-00080L-D5; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 15:39:59 -0500 Received: by eekc14 with SMTP id c14so13294208eek.3 for ; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:37:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2sYEA2E4XIHnwXv14Kj4e2BIvONaPy6pUtjg57jVY4g=; b=SRdYhkSDVzmnka1MuHi1T68+sI+50HtgkRUd3z4BilsOqPeZKTSNXgYWPKq+Iqp2mD 92s8/h4lWsB8eVf4hQzsZoeHTLwct7QqeFPmFWnyfA4DZDVxyb2IKNnzyFlHaDpzj56d oteuIGcMyAHj2cKXuByE8rezYUjTstH2Lo/zQ= Received: by 10.213.13.220 with SMTP id d28mr6938096eba.98.1325104630291; Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:37:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from [87.2.102.244] (host244-102-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it. [87.2.102.244]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 13sm124970645eeu.1.2011.12.28.12.37.09 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 28 Dec 2011 12:37:09 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4EFB7DF2.1030609@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2011 21:37:06 +0100 From: Stefano Lattarini MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4EFB196F.3020508@gmail.com> <4EFB7BC8.5040903@cs.ucla.edu> In-Reply-To: <4EFB7BC8.5040903@cs.ucla.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -3.9 (---) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.9 (---) tags 7893 wontfix severity 7893 minor close 7893 thanks On 12/28/2011 09:27 PM, Paul Eggert wrote: > That issue is now documented in the INSTALL file, as well > as in the Autoconf manual. Here's the relevant commit: > > http://git.savannah.gnu.org/gitweb/?p=autoconf.git;a=commitdiff;h=2d082fa1ca25a16b60fb874e80f51ee79408e1f4 > > Oops, sorry I missed that! My bad. Closing this bug report now. Thanks, Stefano