From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 12 08:20:09 2025 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 May 2025 12:20:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51096 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uES8e-0001BU-Vi for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:20:09 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:470:142::17]:43142) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uES8X-00016v-I9 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:20:04 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1uES8P-0000aM-0N for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:19:53 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-x42b.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42b]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1uES8J-0002E8-KM for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:19:52 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-x42b.google.com with SMTP id ffacd0b85a97d-3a206845eadso742136f8f.3 for ; Mon, 12 May 2025 05:19:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1747052385; x=1747657185; darn=gnu.org; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=V2Ct7dDs1y03us/ZwYsTNwSBn2vsyNlHmzfjuxoso6k=; b=lqqayfm2rTOmmjCKIJDgmSvlQYVioiLzDbENeNPtAt/nPt4CSFhu8Qe+bFI4VLciin +UqM9ga3zsm+FcIzwbVCmdRdE7/A27Ay/5J9R1vbxI82fl9oL2auyozqor11jhMcCO5Y T8dSBs4wQYdFdd3eU9TaXKGWz5djmzFb+TfIApxN8cyEkrWrrvrsuorTpjo3X0GHO+s4 oxKsfNiaAK0SQPFz7SOdse6SfnrO7dJfLMP2xfPa4XUeSe/lm827P9+FEEVk/qTv7eon dCq5lFHnang+mN4G/VKY6PC47L6/gmpN9E1RxzS/c8kPvIBVd3jDw4IHTTjNqYsoGpjc 6JQw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1747052385; x=1747657185; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=V2Ct7dDs1y03us/ZwYsTNwSBn2vsyNlHmzfjuxoso6k=; b=F1LKGIhM9HU7MJMvpItXp4Xp8SXlKlCpHHahu+4OjovC2cv1g1Rs5578fms9teO+tO Lduk8mzuQWlv29swLF2pJLhdthVwIG/RiXkBhQjiyu5aA/MmgWaHlZtS9mWsgDRZZfB2 wZMt/+DfY+JYRGdTcvIWToG9Mz+4d66GB5DYkXyTv9QhmPAVSpk1qowFZOxuY2nMg20b uR78ZWz501KhSLi3jFfGr3+MIsFu056e+FxsEimnPLCGd9a6T5WpYhf7MV7GH50sQAgT QCXGee6R6D1x5x8yPEecNlIiEc63wCcxBkdKQk7GJsp0n6QKCQt2TjQhbD/7NdtNUCqw TfkQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzfL9Wo311l9t/NPDJ+yMxX4xHb75+PEMu2XL9syyyl5EGh5N+n pbjUE5aHVxafi/xP8AbVO9TcQTa+NLxuopDC3EIZECiRM5tO9l/JBBSERgPonJoiH0ue17LVyGf 5xMO30j5rAlxUOr5gCpUWW226Ss33RHvi X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnctX/7SE7k3rBFMcJgoZTw4k1XueHZaYwqULQCr4CeNAilJxGuMPmtwATdoUn3R riRSHhpCzUe3ek4vu+uSFhgstIe/5SiFwOcz8wqSBlK1bZA23Gv1GZY8srVsyA/3NBW/SKhQbyG TMNOOpXfLrqvuw2+echYTrXJf9JgH+cJMc X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IExvJv7LWczMbWQ/0MH7J1a7hSfPMSI9b5G6J6G+3lppEU1VWREDhGGR8/CV0zx22FDFfPoj1VF/l7WhMVzP8g= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:2902:b0:3a0:aed9:e34 with SMTP id ffacd0b85a97d-3a1f64eecc6mr8762605f8f.48.1747052384602; Mon, 12 May 2025 05:19:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jake Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 12:19:33 +0000 X-Gm-Features: AX0GCFvVkngAT6pEnt54SLJA3nt0wfxy21p8eGUdaPtUdJr44tq-1B2WiS5C_QY Message-ID: Subject: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c9cf8c0634ef5412" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::42b; envelope-from=jforst.mailman@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x42b.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) --000000000000c9cf8c0634ef5412 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello >From emacs -Q, evaluate (keymap-global-set " " #'ibuffer) then C-h f list-buffers RET The docstring includes: "Its keys are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99. Without this remappin= g, it would be bound to C-x C-b. It can also be invoked from the menu: Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers" It cannot be invoked from the menu as the menu item is also remapped. Thanks Jake In GNU Emacs 30.0.92 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.43, cairo version 1.18.2) Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12101015 System Description: Guix System Configured using: 'configure CONFIG_SHELL=3D/gnu/store/m0xdsa8cfq6mq1kxgxmpmpg71la4f0b9-bash-minimal-5.= 1.16/bin/bash SHELL=3D/gnu/store/m0xdsa8cfq6mq1kxgxmpmpg71la4f0b9-bash-minimal-5.1.16/bi= n/bash --prefix=3D/gnu/store/11m3qxg9dc02qm0hv4qsnwdppxic196c-emacs-next-30.0.92-= 0.881d593 --enable-fast-install --with-cairo --with-modules --with-native-compilation=3Daot --disable-build-details' Configured features: ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM GSETTINGS HARFBUZZ JPEG LCMS2 LIBOTF LIBSELINUX LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 M17N_FLT MODULES NATIVE_COMP NOTIFY INOTIFY PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER X11 XDBE XIM XINPUT2 XPM GTK3 ZLIB Important settings: value of $EMACSLOADPATH: /home/jake/.guix-profile/share/emacs/site-lisp:/gnu/store/11m3qxg9dc02qm0hv= 4qsnwdppxic196c-emacs-next-30.0.92-0.881d593/share/emacs/30.0.92/lisp value of $LANG: en_AU.utf8 locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix --000000000000c9cf8c0634ef5412 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello

From emacs -Q, evaluat= e
=C2=A0 (keymap-global-set "<remap> <list-buffers&= gt;" #'ibuffer)
then C-h f list-buffers RET
The docstring includes:

"Its key= s are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99.=C2=A0 Without this remapping, = it would
be bound to C-x C-b.
It can also be invoked from the menu: B= uffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers"

It cannot = be invoked from the menu as the menu item is also remapped.

<= /div>
Thanks
Jake


In GNU Emacs 30.0.92 (bui= ld 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version
3.24.43, cairo version 1.18.2)Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0= .12101015
System Description: Guix System

Configured using:
= =C2=A0'configure
=C2=A0CONFIG_SHELL=3D/gnu/store/m0xdsa8cfq6mq1kxgxm= pmpg71la4f0b9-bash-minimal-5.1.16/bin/bash
=C2=A0SHELL=3D/gnu/store/m0xd= sa8cfq6mq1kxgxmpmpg71la4f0b9-bash-minimal-5.1.16/bin/bash
=C2=A0--prefix= =3D/gnu/store/11m3qxg9dc02qm0hv4qsnwdppxic196c-emacs-next-30.0.92-0.881d593=
=C2=A0--enable-fast-install --with-cairo --with-modules
=C2=A0--with= -native-compilation=3Daot --disable-build-details'

Configured fe= atures:
ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM GSETTINGS HARFBU= ZZ JPEG
LCMS2 LIBOTF LIBSELINUX LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 M17N_FLT MODULES NATI= VE_COMP
NOTIFY INOTIFY PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND SQLITE3 THREADS TI= FF
TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER X11 XDBE XIM XINPUT2 XPM GTK3 ZLIB
Important settings:
=C2=A0 value of $EMACSLOADPATH: /home/jake/.gui= x-profile/share/emacs/site-lisp:/gnu/store/11m3qxg9dc02qm0hv4qsnwdppxic196c= -emacs-next-30.0.92-0.881d593/share/emacs/30.0.92/lisp
=C2=A0 value of $= LANG: en_AU.utf8
=C2=A0 locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

--000000000000c9cf8c0634ef5412-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 12 08:42:18 2025 Received: (at 78391) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 May 2025 12:42:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51208 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uESU5-0002Ow-Lc for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:42:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:54030) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uESU2-0002Od-FH for 78391@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:42:15 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1uESTv-0004T0-7h; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:42:07 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=x8ixMcEUPOrSxudNSeQ4f/fC7zJfi97Qlulg1C81B4M=; b=NbLOld1VRKpTDpwd/xJ2 a7WOQgvsaQAkMhXOUq9oP41gcIbmnBwHnATWBF1/+o0jeAiGT+Pad5L/ONu/fKbLIQYztMsvKmYEG NiMKS+f4TWsz/oVhAmFOYy+3UpliR0FVewkBEtgBVEn0cuhyQ68lbqh5KU0fe0li99rlUYBRNnR28 odkr5C2KunRTJICkx5crsdJsBCj62vJcRXhYayvomFIF+xXlpUTU2NoBOpeN3PBM1qmV0Vsn70X2O RXPMiMuGB097UM+PofwdoKRRwnLcIZIkpw8/Ss7NV9KH5XDwcbwlybprHYnXLMZcvAqH/HQ+ZMh1k lIqPZJfzBKSp4Q==; Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 15:42:01 +0300 Message-Id: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Jake , Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Jake on Mon, 12 May 2025 12:19:33 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation References: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391 Cc: 78391@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jake > Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 12:19:33 +0000 > > From emacs -Q, evaluate > (keymap-global-set " " #'ibuffer) > then C-h f list-buffers RET > > The docstring includes: > > "Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. Without this remapping, it would > be bound to C-x C-b. > It can also be invoked from the menu: Buffers → List All Buffers" > > It cannot be invoked from the menu as the menu item is also remapped. Thanks. Does the patch below give good results? Stefan, any comments? diff --git a/lisp/help-fns.el b/lisp/help-fns.el index e7bbd25..aacdcc5 100644 --- a/lisp/help-fns.el +++ b/lisp/help-fns.el @@ -624,8 +624,11 @@ help-fns--key-bindings (let ((start (point))) (help-fns--insert-menu-bindings menus - (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") - "be invoked from the menu: ")) + (if remapped + (concat "Without the remapping, it could " + (and keys "also ") "be invoked from the menu: ") + (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") + "be invoked from the menu: "))) (fill-region-as-paragraph start (point)))) (ensure-empty-lines))))))) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 12 10:50:40 2025 Received: (at 78391) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 May 2025 14:50:40 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53943 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEUUK-0004tw-FH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:40 -0400 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:38808) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEUUH-0004tX-H2 for 78391@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:38 -0400 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id CCF95801FB; Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:31 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1747061426; bh=0rp4sfOB/CZaoMTlYzszFHxTkoHf1AIDWVrChZt3g/o=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=SQncyA4ezwYLoHXGMmUqCK+Hoo+py/ShM6xj3vZg12LS9CdJV9MbtCRSyY+w14+up mHjaEz5EYW5AfWyYOCI7/Hk7oMWhRwMuDa1hGX1leA8Y45Tj6ly/mgnIcShZTS/3YW bSBw3CUp7hJVLiOrwBPliahjPJxJFolihlpwWYvupX/f7eEmQOMrj6pNNVg4FMPwoQ myF5WhaCGc9U+Dx10PBm394aukD51qnOeZ5No5goh53C4ynbGFqwuHkUQHhVpJTYdP ONOxoJv4LS5NuHcrvNHFLNpsBg0CRoiAttq3Irlp/SeGUgbl/MOVz7ljqv+BepUiMr mCM+sw8hjgcbg== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id D0DE1800C4; Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pastel (104-195-232-56.cpe.teksavvy.com [104.195.232.56]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A48591203DB; Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation In-Reply-To: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> Message-ID: References: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:26 -0400 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.089 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391 Cc: Jake , 78391@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Thanks. Does the patch below give good results? > > Stefan, any comments? > > diff --git a/lisp/help-fns.el b/lisp/help-fns.el > index e7bbd25..aacdcc5 100644 > --- a/lisp/help-fns.el > +++ b/lisp/help-fns.el > @@ -624,8 +624,11 @@ help-fns--key-bindings > (let ((start (point))) > (help-fns--insert-menu-bindings > menus > - (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") > - "be invoked from the menu: ")) > + (if remapped > + (concat "Without the remapping, it could " > + (and keys "also ") "be invoked from the men= u: ") > + (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") > + "be invoked from the menu: "))) > (fill-region-as-paragraph start (point)))) > (ensure-empty-lines))))))) >=20=20 It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping" is used just above for the key bindings. As a user I'd prefer it integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the lines of: Its keys are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99. Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b and to the menu entry Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers - Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 12 11:00:40 2025 Received: (at 78391) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 May 2025 15:00:40 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54020 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEUdz-0007E6-K0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 11:00:40 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-x42e.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42e]:49269) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEUdw-0006sd-G1 for 78391@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 11:00:37 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-x42e.google.com with SMTP id ffacd0b85a97d-3a1b8e8b2b2so2308179f8f.2 for <78391@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:00:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1747062030; x=1747666830; darn=debbugs.gnu.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=+mVXXfYSoLrZl2zoglYEyyS6EB+xat4/yCpSsTUzKGg=; b=SnFnBkyZqTtUijBNDL4EIrLMMa+J5kok8O1zgG7R4PoQjDEDo9RXJzBtd7qWBgiqXl Y78XFgGqagcVrVI+sPlkYNmN5PqpJMKmHL7gmGznB4t1Q9ooWSmCqdtOPNNa+u3rMEO3 Yg2klyuAJjkiKABDFDErJAbQVQODcTQhXAASDyoWX05PzCknN2NmCzoZAmduD+g/MaSs GLWVjNXf7qqSWLnEvErq0Hv1hH5AvoMsWhAApJiukrotWf2i52wtGvOG4+Mo3GSNcKoN zpEwDZpTpwMAq61XW+WPAxZlGxzHnbdqM0BzmeaR/wZcNcD/aR/xlPhnz6KRBpiwX/lc smKg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1747062030; x=1747666830; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=+mVXXfYSoLrZl2zoglYEyyS6EB+xat4/yCpSsTUzKGg=; b=Dk/4fNe5JNObMAdsoyah0swFpxi1nLJfx6JAwwZ/lGt69EdyfgLccG+ivixDcpEa+N 2Mq19LDzqYm1GG03KI6SPcA5J/ADndIdhiGXr0yjFjD08BkxrONyQaapMqqo8Z2by3YI qZN5GvBthPCEYIgt7BgEQI1Fm3n+8lxjgkW9q2LqUDsjXAGC3+SfTH8O4CO6jPfr3er8 9QCKf7IzSCVkQodjw0295nuBAMLdc4vQWUHGapb3PfNI8aZFOhOxoiQLMtjlAj1KUIAg qNYq+heBW0O5yriftStKxIAAUYz3mn0zBIHWli5H/bgXLP8BvoIMlXZfJbKust00SgAT e9sA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCVIurpj2zI+fTlAuzzG7VOMK9JgFqVTFei/7/I0TF4VE3GkCmRUxKsN+Qc+70zyo2knO+vhvw==@debbugs.gnu.org X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzFbifydW/rIHZIYX3xoMgIc8bijvr1Ng2cmpJl2Bmalhx2EGq0 lsWLHLNwwiWS24FfWY9VCl6nO2Yf91uxqydc+SvBS4282Z0RseVGBobSJqOI38hpMcWfeAAcd21 6QqRaBFdVJnCdWAKo/kWmsNLqYgA= X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuPEyEpLg7BATl9DfsEY+GJVMSt++Ax1FqCApXuDgw545q1+kUFR3aDOJcvTlI i4wFEnBxVUNsBltwgElDiSgbLE1JmHgRDAxlrzM7Do53VVlJRRO4FaDp13a1FWNK28bOdbFPF2r rFwUIq7og9/USqeFJlLiH7I3xwJTeFymqW X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEPTewhL/EWHXbBdlAN1EMmV81MX/vOJ/eMOTilmF9bRJLw1EGL+FcskzVfFtIGqX2Fc15CdW8PGll/xLl4uTw= X-Received: by 2002:adf:f40f:0:b0:3a1:fe8f:9c68 with SMTP id ffacd0b85a97d-3a1fe8f9d22mr6093415f8f.16.1747062030059; Mon, 12 May 2025 08:00:30 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> In-Reply-To: From: Jake Date: Tue, 13 May 2025 00:30:18 +0930 X-Gm-Features: AX0GCFvwpA3s9vBfU6vUxeCsofM-aCRaxtws65CClJvRYZpt4ECm-DkvfyB2SOc Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation To: Stefan Monnier Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000b3cccd0634f1930c" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391 Cc: 78391@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000b3cccd0634f1930c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable How about: Its keys and menu entry are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99. Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b and to the menu entry Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers On Tue, 13 May 2025 at 12:20=E2=80=AFam, Stefan Monnier wrote: > > Thanks. Does the patch below give good results? > > > > Stefan, any comments? > > > > diff --git a/lisp/help-fns.el b/lisp/help-fns.el > > index e7bbd25..aacdcc5 100644 > > --- a/lisp/help-fns.el > > +++ b/lisp/help-fns.el > > @@ -624,8 +624,11 @@ help-fns--key-bindings > > (let ((start (point))) > > (help-fns--insert-menu-bindings > > menus > > - (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") > > - "be invoked from the menu: ")) > > + (if remapped > > + (concat "Without the remapping, it could " > > + (and keys "also ") "be invoked from the > menu: ") > > + (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") > > + "be invoked from the menu: "))) > > (fill-region-as-paragraph start (point)))) > > (ensure-empty-lines))))))) > > > > It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping" > is used just above for the key bindings. As a user I'd prefer it > integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the > lines of: > > Its keys are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99. > Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b > and to the menu entry Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers > > > - Stefan > > --000000000000b3cccd0634f1930c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
How about:

Its keys and menu entry are remapped= to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Without this remapping, it = would be bound to C-x C-b
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 and to the menu entry Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffe= rs


On Tue, 13 May 2025 at 12:20= =E2=80=AFam, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote:
> Tha= nks.=C2=A0 Does the patch below give good results?
>
> Stefan, any comments?
>
> diff --git a/lisp/help-fns.el b/lisp/help-fns.el
> index e7bbd25..aacdcc5 100644
> --- a/lisp/help-fns.el
> +++ b/lisp/help-fns.el
> @@ -624,8 +624,11 @@ help-fns--key-bindings
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (let ((start (p= oint)))
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (help-fn= s--insert-menu-bindings
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0me= nus
> -=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0(concat= "It can " (and keys "also ")
> -=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0"be invoked from the menu: "))
> +=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0(if rem= apped
> +=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0(concat "Without the remapping, it could "
> +=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0(and keys "also ") "be in= voked from the menu: ")
> +=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= (concat "It can " (and keys "also ")
> +=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0"be invoked from the menu: ")))
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (fill-re= gion-as-paragraph start (point))))
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (ensure-empty-lines)))= ))))
>=C2=A0

It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping= "
is used just above for the key bindings.=C2=A0 As a user I'd prefer it<= br> integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the
lines of:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Its keys are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 and to the menu entry Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers


- Stefan

--000000000000b3cccd0634f1930c-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 12 12:01:18 2025 Received: (at 78391) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 May 2025 16:01:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54230 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEVaf-0003DQ-JI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 12:01:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49340) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEVad-0003D2-5R for 78391@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 12:01:16 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1uEVaW-0001R8-Mm; Mon, 12 May 2025 12:01:08 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=6T6SW+8MRVGXpEYsxcCB45WWSvLlLFSiz5JEGrYaA9o=; b=Yfhfk3eFsVITHxm9YEDi jOInqm7f/sY2q2iRR8ykErl+MdvtqMaq00LL2lh0TEeW9pUWhN2Zjdp+uZlvnLHKC9eMhLy4Rn9fg N4y1lIO7rOw8FBSdawIe9pfXf4vKFa2+28vNa0ckZsUG/sDoW/PUR2ur6xPss7o7Z1lAIgo6eXEIK 4AGF1hEvQhomaqItc0OEQB3jkP/Pw9p/QxEfvy3+HA+thg7JMwoBUdYTttv7x7u1xUud9QKi1/57u Bo1AszmrDdrXPY4y9NIHDCd09KsyoBzXyZLLsglzp3Fb1RPnl0C3EEnTrhBzEVP+mPA3xPgKHhhot Qu8iBIpP+juasw==; Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 19:01:05 +0300 Message-Id: <86a57h7r9a.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:26 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation References: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391 Cc: jforst.mailman@gmail.com, 78391@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: Jake , 78391@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 10:50:26 -0400 > > > Thanks. Does the patch below give good results? > > > > Stefan, any comments? > > > > diff --git a/lisp/help-fns.el b/lisp/help-fns.el > > index e7bbd25..aacdcc5 100644 > > --- a/lisp/help-fns.el > > +++ b/lisp/help-fns.el > > @@ -624,8 +624,11 @@ help-fns--key-bindings > > (let ((start (point))) > > (help-fns--insert-menu-bindings > > menus > > - (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") > > - "be invoked from the menu: ")) > > + (if remapped > > + (concat "Without the remapping, it could " > > + (and keys "also ") "be invoked from the menu: ") > > + (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") > > + "be invoked from the menu: "))) > > (fill-region-as-paragraph start (point)))) > > (ensure-empty-lines))))))) > > > > It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping" > is used just above for the key bindings. As a user I'd prefer it > integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the > lines of: > > Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. > Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b > and to the menu entry Buffers → List All Buffers The problem with this is that there could be additional text in-between, in which case the sentence would become a mouthful: (if (and (eq function 'self-insert-command) (vectorp (car-safe keys)) (consp (aref (car keys) 0))) (princ "It is bound to many ordinary text characters.\n") ;; Which non-control non-meta keys run this command? (dolist (key keys) (if (member (event-modifiers (aref key 0)) '(nil (shift))) (push key non-modified-keys))) (when remapped (princ "Its keys are remapped to ") (princ (if (symbolp remapped) (format-message "`%s'" remapped) "an anonymous command")) (princ ".\n")) (when keys (princ (if remapped "Without this remapping, it would be bound to " "It is bound to ")) ;; If lots of ordinary text characters run this command, ;; don't mention them one by one. (if (< (length non-modified-keys) 10) (with-current-buffer standard-output (help-fns--insert-bindings keys)) (dolist (key non-modified-keys) (setq keys (delq key keys))) (if keys (with-current-buffer standard-output (help-fns--insert-bindings keys) (insert ", and many ordinary text characters")) (princ "many ordinary text characters.")))) (when (or remapped keys non-modified-keys) (princ ".") (terpri))) (with-current-buffer standard-output (fill-region-as-paragraph pt2 (point)) (unless (bolp) (insert "\n")) (when menus (let ((start (point))) (help-fns--insert-menu-bindings menus (concat "It can " (and keys "also ") "be invoked from the menu: ")) (fill-region-as-paragraph start (point)))) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 12 13:22:10 2025 Received: (at 78391) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 May 2025 17:22:10 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54497 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEWqv-0007Bq-RK for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 13:22:10 -0400 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:15066) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEWqs-0007BC-68 for 78391@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 12 May 2025 13:22:08 -0400 Received: from pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 1B530441413; Mon, 12 May 2025 13:22:00 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1747070519; bh=hKel+lmhzKl2aq8OEbz/WnNSsTI/anv9Nyl+STqXbd0=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=O3YXN6KOiC7bgxhLhl6bs5ZWZ36M8vxRXbd4obK5oxv1ahdqlA9MagQSZyJ9jxs3i KoTyo6/yozdM9ypM4BjpAyMiGM7zcfBnQXRs8vh7+1SFrJWxpMZytZ1zUxMAQcpMLK 4RfWWWvF9bfMg+ijpp0L1/aCcmzaPuHAbvy7oWSeA0dzpZ8RYGEEfFZnakJy0pcXo2 TYKrKciLjBbEEKR+jsRSn9jc0qJAzxFu7fZZa7a86Ye8SZz8ZvxGglBPdFTe4qyMYx Da3xOQJpY5hNEnmm/Wpp2A8cIUViSwjtbuFnsCw6T7ir6THgQb/6uL3Y7BfcItvtvg KNZ52s28SAfag== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id F26A2440FA8; Mon, 12 May 2025 13:21:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from alfajor (bras-base-mtrlpq42zf4-grc-13-70-24-234-232.dsl.bell.ca [70.24.234.232]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D4D6812022D; Mon, 12 May 2025 13:21:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation In-Reply-To: <86a57h7r9a.fsf@gnu.org> Message-ID: References: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> <86a57h7r9a.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 13:21:58 -0400 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL 0.090 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391 Cc: jforst.mailman@gmail.com, 78391@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) >> It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping" >> is used just above for the key bindings. As a user I'd prefer it >> integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the >> lines of: >> >> Its keys are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99. >> Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b >> and to the menu entry Buffers =E2=86=92 List All Buffers > > The problem with this is that there could be additional text > in-between, in which case the sentence would become a mouthful: Maybe take the "Without this remapping" out of the two sentences into a separate prefixed note, as in: Its keys are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99; if it weren't for t= his remapping: It would be bound to C-x C-b ... It could also be invoked from the menu: ... Or maybe: It is bound to C-x C-b ... It can also be invoked from the menu: ... Note: these bindings do not actually run this command because the command's bindings are remapped to =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99. Since I'm no fan of using actual sentences in such things, tho I understand this is the tradition in Emacs (it reminds me of the odd habit in North America of using road signs with text whereas European road signs prefer symbols and pictograms instead), I'd actually prefer something more ... dry like: Key bindings: C-x C-b ... Menu bindings: ... Remapped to: =E2=80=98ibuffer=E2=80=99 - Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue May 13 11:55:47 2025 Received: (at 78391) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 May 2025 15:55:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32803 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uErys-0008VF-Li for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 13 May 2025 11:55:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:36828) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uEryq-0008V1-Mu for 78391@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 13 May 2025 11:55:45 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1uEryl-00015j-2X; Tue, 13 May 2025 11:55:39 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=c1OORtotlQuc55dnFx/TH6pYE+/QBzQXc4FKtEbtWgI=; b=r9QcIrRwOyZG+Ebqi2vr cEvtieZo69vslPm1WjmT7PrCcTJI84K1sCIFvNCZUf11eVUWW2Yigmmk5qFIrLPO3H9ho+rdmFL+i Kb/TDv18hglAbTLBBTkx6Li9IQ6wFwo0TapskrNYouz/6Fou4b1qp4+EJ7Fw8FYD5Ja1ScAunvxHU CXQI9F3bcXtUXndhTsqPCVUXWiC8Uqe7GoIrXNilavIe8aVDTpfs/kL/rK9kOL+cuWNWcC9CtP/Mp iWyMLnVb+7A2ejd+8LdHVKmCCtff4UuGZC923I9SMq1e0MlEgaVrzYoAlFBPq1eFam5xVvs11vVJl iRrBU+IzYtffTg==; Date: Tue, 13 May 2025 18:55:37 +0300 Message-Id: <86sel85wue.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Mon, 12 May 2025 13:21:58 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation References: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> <86a57h7r9a.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391 Cc: jforst.mailman@gmail.com, 78391@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: jforst.mailman@gmail.com, 78391@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 13:21:58 -0400 > > >> It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping" > >> is used just above for the key bindings. As a user I'd prefer it > >> integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the > >> lines of: > >> > >> Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. > >> Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b > >> and to the menu entry Buffers → List All Buffers > > > > The problem with this is that there could be additional text > > in-between, in which case the sentence would become a mouthful: > > Maybe take the "Without this remapping" out of the two sentences > into a separate prefixed note, as in: > > Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’; if it weren't for this remapping: > It would be bound to C-x C-b ... > It could also be invoked from the menu: ... > > Or maybe: > > It is bound to C-x C-b ... > It can also be invoked from the menu: ... > Note: these bindings do not actually run this command because the > command's bindings are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. > > Since I'm no fan of using actual sentences in such things, tho > I understand this is the tradition in Emacs (it reminds me of the odd > habit in North America of using road signs with text whereas European > road signs prefer symbols and pictograms instead), I'd actually prefer > something more ... dry like: > > Key bindings: C-x C-b ... > Menu bindings: ... > Remapped to: ‘ibuffer’ Thanks for the ideas. They were not trivial to implement without some major reshuffling of this delicate code, so I went for something simpler: Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b. It could also be invoked from the menu: Buffers → List All Buffers, but that was remapped to ‘ibuffer’as well. I hope this is good enough. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 24 05:08:43 2025 Received: (at 78391-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 May 2025 09:08:43 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56983 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uIkry-0007it-Ox for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 24 May 2025 05:08:43 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:60668) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1uIkrw-0007iQ-I4 for 78391-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 24 May 2025 05:08:41 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1uIkrr-0000qk-2I; Sat, 24 May 2025 05:08:35 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=VYiACVx3SWSAKIxUqzrL0twetCpYVwy/S8A8OMJqLGk=; b=j0tTJM5VLwGGj7TU9nU4 +qdRNyYRdJEF6yCjkR5YK6gF8h/UyMbgvTP/uQY+1R7ZiqxJJbz0Z4JD6aBdkEd+iwXTKxiy14Rsy 6UmhVrfCvHpLl1Fp9ZdgbGATtU2zbUqBqP1EKRv30Dg265K+Z4iOjblUseQcNtccGlnsITHQLd1oV nxmetJBA6tPFNd/68mLLw7SYYjmI5IAfzSoWE1C0rkUnuNKMQPt0dSjcGSlB4/joTADGli169/b94 39iJiXK94gnR2ridd/ZJybKyMV9OhFqhQfCAhU+wo8xgYuU38MiaLqtIPMASO+5EW2GDMBhfeU8eX RBbZ1bQSvSmMKA==; Date: Sat, 24 May 2025 12:08:33 +0300 Message-Id: <86v7pq1ilq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, jforst.mailman@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <86sel85wue.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Tue, 13 May 2025 18:55:37 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#78391: 30.0.92; remapped command's docstring still claims to have menu invocation References: <86msbi6lwm.fsf@gnu.org> <86a57h7r9a.fsf@gnu.org> <86sel85wue.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 78391-done Cc: 78391-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: jforst.mailman@gmail.com, 78391@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 13 May 2025 18:55:37 +0300 > From: Eli Zaretskii > > > From: Stefan Monnier > > Cc: jforst.mailman@gmail.com, 78391@debbugs.gnu.org > > Date: Mon, 12 May 2025 13:21:58 -0400 > > > > >> It gives a rather redundant text since the same "Without the remapping" > > >> is used just above for the key bindings. As a user I'd prefer it > > >> integrated into that previous sentence to end up with a text along the > > >> lines of: > > >> > > >> Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. > > >> Without this remapping, it would be bound to C-x C-b > > >> and to the menu entry Buffers → List All Buffers > > > > > > The problem with this is that there could be additional text > > > in-between, in which case the sentence would become a mouthful: > > > > Maybe take the "Without this remapping" out of the two sentences > > into a separate prefixed note, as in: > > > > Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’; if it weren't for this remapping: > > It would be bound to C-x C-b ... > > It could also be invoked from the menu: ... > > > > Or maybe: > > > > It is bound to C-x C-b ... > > It can also be invoked from the menu: ... > > Note: these bindings do not actually run this command because the > > command's bindings are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. > > > > Since I'm no fan of using actual sentences in such things, tho > > I understand this is the tradition in Emacs (it reminds me of the odd > > habit in North America of using road signs with text whereas European > > road signs prefer symbols and pictograms instead), I'd actually prefer > > something more ... dry like: > > > > Key bindings: C-x C-b ... > > Menu bindings: ... > > Remapped to: ‘ibuffer’ > > Thanks for the ideas. They were not trivial to implement without some > major reshuffling of this delicate code, so I went for something > simpler: > > Its keys are remapped to ‘ibuffer’. Without this remapping, it would > be bound to C-x C-b. > It could also be invoked from the menu: Buffers → List All Buffers, > but that was remapped to ‘ibuffer’as well. > > I hope this is good enough. No further comments, so I'm now closing this bug.