From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Nov 15 11:45:59 2024 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Nov 2024 16:45:59 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50666 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tBzSI-0005Vj-EP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:58 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:55812) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tBzSC-0005VW-Mf for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:57 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tBzSB-0006F8-VE for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:52 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tBzS6-00030Z-Si for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:51 -0500 Received: from pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id EA31444051F for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:43 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1731689139; bh=91limI3RDImqyuYkEgAaIDEe/NF1nYQXXraZy3LaMgc=; h=From:To:Subject:Date:From; b=eG/5R8UpbA00jl0ZdZo0+59TSDyfv6TeQWcJEauALsW3sHB5rUtqz1U9Rt6WkTIo+ poYvAYCSwH9JEL5aOh3eQNik067KW/1kRSzI0iWuEBsZd4sXhUfnCfWeZI49D3EgPe 8n28HUqR+gmMrQ8MBJEtyqB6Hbl8/SD5kMkkXr5wMADKFrX43cyCFAvBm4MeJ3gCGW WLq6TgmPViO7Gt9Fd+IlBLdV+it+XhI4hU5NyanDffivSfIvK3XmTudGrJh1e3BzMN Aw1KVNyPpyZW1WJafQ9TR+5z3Utv6ZsbKVtZ1zkUWhVScjiyJorRyugZM8LYyYkGQ+ dRC4HOHVBLioA== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 45AF8440674 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from alfajor (unknown [23.233.149.155]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 30A7E1206CB for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:39 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes Message-ID: X-Debbugs-Cc: Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:45:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-=" X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL 0.073 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=132.204.25.50; envelope-from=monnier@iro.umontreal.ca; helo=mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca X-Spam_score_int: -42 X-Spam_score: -4.3 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_SAFE_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Tags: patch The doc of `c-ts-mode.el` currently recommends things we deprecate. The patch below fixes this. I think this can go into `emacs-30`, but I believe Eli prefers we leave this alone there, so I guess it would go to `master`. If we can install at least part of it into `emacs-30` (such as the removal of the recommendation to `require` or the suggestion to use the obsolete `c-or-c++-ts-mode`), I'll happily split it. Stefan In GNU Emacs 31.0.50 (build 1, i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.43, cairo version 1.18.2) of 2024-10-17 built on alfajor Repository revision: 1df1a3f4a40aa6c49dd29db1b5a7ad47b6b2087c Repository branch: work Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12101013 System Description: Debian GNU/Linux trixie/sid Configured using: 'configure -C --enable-checking --enable-check-lisp-object-type --with-modules --with-cairo --with-tiff=ifavailable 'CFLAGS=-Wall -g3 -Og -Wno-pointer-sign' PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/home/monnier/lib/pkgconfig' --=-=-= Content-Type: text/patch Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=0001-c-ts-mode.el-Adjust-doc-about-how-to-change-default-.patch >From f6cb19d44fe2ff1abdf890c609264f86ee74e2d7 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Stefan Monnier Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2024 11:41:33 -0500 Subject: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes Don't recommend (require 'c-ts-mode) since it's not reliable (loading `cc-mode.el` later on will override that preference) and also it is incompatible with our policy that loading a package shouldn't change Emacs's behavior. Don't recommend customizing `auto-mode-alist` since it's more complicated, only covers some of the ways a C mode can be selected, and those who really want that kind of control probably know about `auto-mode-alist` anyway. * lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el (Commentary:): Adjust recommendation for how to use these modes by default: (c-ts-mode, c++-ts-mode): Don't suggest remapping `c-or-c++-mode` to `c-or-c++-ts-mode` since `c-or-c++-ts-mode` is deprecated since `c-or-c++-mode` already obeys the remapping of `c/c++-mode`. --- lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el | 35 +++++++---------------------------- 1 file changed, 7 insertions(+), 28 deletions(-) diff --git a/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el b/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el index 3823c553fda..19e511bbac3 100644 --- a/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el +++ b/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el @@ -28,36 +28,17 @@ ;; functions that are useful generally to major modes for C-like ;; languages. ;; -;; This package provides `c-ts-mode' for C, `c++-ts-mode' for C++, and -;; `c-or-c++-ts-mode' which automatically chooses the right mode for -;; C/C++ header files. +;; This package provides `c-ts-mode' for C and `c++-ts-mode' for C++. ;; ;; To use these modes by default, assuming you have the respective -;; tree-sitter grammars available, do one of the following: -;; -;; - If you have both C and C++ grammars installed, add -;; -;; (require 'c-ts-mode) -;; -;; to your init file. -;; -;; - Add one or mode of the following to your init file: +;; tree-sitter grammars available, add one or more of the following to +;; your init file: ;; ;; (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-alist '(c-mode . c-ts-mode)) ;; (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-alist '(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) -;; (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-alist '(c-or-c++-mode . c-or-c++-ts-mode)) -;; -;; If you have only C grammar available, use only the first one; if -;; you have only the C++ grammar, use only the second one. -;; -;; - Customize 'auto-mode-alist' to turn one or more of the modes -;; automatically. For example: -;; -;; (add-to-list 'auto-mode-alist -;; '("\\(\\.ii\\|\\.\\(CC?\\|HH?\\)\\|\\.[ch]\\(pp\\|xx\\|\\+\\+\\)\\|\\.\\(cc\\|hh\\)\\)\\'" -;; . c++-ts-mode)) ;; -;; will turn on the c++-ts-mode for C++ source files. +;; If you have only C grammar available, use only the first one; if +;; you have only the C++ grammar, use only the second one. ;; ;; You can also turn on these modes manually in a buffer. Doing so ;; will set up Emacs to use the C/C++ modes defined here for other @@ -1340,8 +1321,6 @@ c-ts-mode (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c-mode . c-ts-mode)) (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) - (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist - \\='(c-or-c++-mode . c-or-c++-ts-mode)) in your init files." :group 'c @@ -1410,8 +1389,6 @@ c++-ts-mode (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c-mode . c-ts-mode)) (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) - (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist - \\='(c-or-c++-mode . c-or-c++-ts-mode)) in your init files. @@ -1513,6 +1490,8 @@ c-ts-mode--c-or-c++-regexp "\\|" "#include" ws-maybe "<" (regexp-opt headers) ">" "\\)"))) "A regexp applied to C header files to check if they are really C++.") +(make-obsolete-variable 'c-ts-mode--c-or-c++-regexp + 'c-or-c++-mode--regexp "30.1") ;;;###autoload (defun c-or-c++-ts-mode () -- 2.45.2 --=-=-=-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Nov 15 16:16:43 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Nov 2024 21:16:43 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51109 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tC3gJ-0000Uu-2p for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 16:16:43 -0500 Received: from mail-ed1-f49.google.com ([209.85.208.49]:42344) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tC3gG-0000Ul-E4 for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 16:16:41 -0500 Received: by mail-ed1-f49.google.com with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5cfa581e6aeso10874a12.1 for <74367@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 13:16:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1731705340; x=1732310140; darn=debbugs.gnu.org; h=to:subject:message-id:date:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=VEjGTo0hVDxvEFDmLyQNGQteGoEsLocMRiOrTdxilTk=; b=J8qhKETuP+sXSadZgBACboTMt6PF7vPDutko9zRA6dd8FlAFs/gBj5pH77mXWOTCT+ 9V24Vl9JDxQDGOaigzhTePuQI87aEhdonCWE7PLzJH9di+mctub2v3sgL9Ru3DSZYNzb TxcJ58//eYEuVM2xJRbeybplMzBM5MrSEP+glAJCylJAnctcgKEmAs6ZLYnMJqOenv1k +qO7G/ybb5oJ2z0M5jbWpDfYCneTWwMW8pjVwY6FvmHhh8DWBm6u3WMFsw0TMypCL6bQ vZNVl1gQ4aUxlFalhLIiegN1/TTu7CoPpz1td8zrMeQ+bSAnb3G+cl3jHPlHXi7tbEQI 2IHA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1731705340; x=1732310140; h=to:subject:message-id:date:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=VEjGTo0hVDxvEFDmLyQNGQteGoEsLocMRiOrTdxilTk=; b=vHjwCFFx0KXa7v/lyysigBiLJXggdacjnq+TdEObwKaej5BcpXWJUn1CVT877ihBsW HiiSgSFh7/fMm8G+qBiGUJWwnDCR5k8m8Zfh4lUfGW6vsT0wnwRlkMI6g9BV3F76rWPp MmFxGO1Xf5B6UdVKCLMkYDXecHVva2dxfQ17QDluH6j9WoEJrxSSsZ8n4hF6qRnMoqOU KjGVMo3w/a2xvOjkJrMp9A+CnC3mkWOLJyr59idRIQZpdpixkKPDMTfxRmUm6+gQ99m5 uAKWAb67OWhGvC/K44o1UcHRpmSxxqRgc9ZYPXjH2DlT0jNzuzr+jarkrabdhSRdhOn1 gdzA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXu8rXRGacl4LvLfJtGSLdEipL2ZENktqohTSekIQxzgKztz+wwtXHEMVmwk00qv0Uut4Mw6A==@debbugs.gnu.org X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yw8x4MRJRApRg/6M32T+AwSftxHvX6n7sQ+CLDrvS3kkv8RdQFR kY6MEyG6vT49v7dcpV248c/9KG53rzL8ztI0tQJOCsGnouPukUCuUrqzb+v+W2evdWBasywLHHX PVUiqDr2wga6m3Nz2WFnvt4XVArg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFYdjzM4FGHkR6oDTMOSQtDRuysKgYp8DA9gRuxs5/K0IjVmmJxDw2dQqXF4Y1iN4pk4WyfXtWWFkcb7O2m17E= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:34d4:b0:5cf:767d:c442 with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5cf8e007e29mr3650440a12.13.1731705339467; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 13:15:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 13:15:38 -0800 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2024 13:15:38 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes To: Stefan Monnier , 74367@debbugs.gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" writes: > Tags: patch > > The doc of `c-ts-mode.el` currently recommends things we deprecate. > The patch below fixes this. > > I think this can go into `emacs-30`, but I believe Eli prefers we leave > this alone there, so I guess it would go to `master`. If we can install > at least part of it into `emacs-30` (such as the removal of the > recommendation to `require` or the suggestion to use the obsolete > `c-or-c++-ts-mode`), I'll happily split it. FWIW, I agree that we should at least remove the recommendation to use `require` on emacs-30, as it encourages bad habits and contributes to an already poor understanding of autoloading among users. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 16 05:59:29 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Nov 2024 10:59:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52244 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCGWW-0004K0-Ki for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 05:59:28 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:42592) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCGWS-0004JR-FM for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 05:59:24 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tCGWM-0002KD-4c; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 05:59:18 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=DG2ceOkldwi9qx1dTDjHpC404kgAjt0VTn+yC36HT4Q=; b=ESBhb07ZksDh Z84CUPEKEo+HAJ6U7LJx0SsAcuY1PsNe8Ny5meRhFxaL6TIMXays9QSw163i4sH7KLVXgLSJrYM+W kXSeqhTYE9OsbXR2tYA0NfN9I+MiSyrjUucUoW6Bt+Qb06oBOPdAGoJ4OtBjl62zQT+FxPSwccoyo DPvA0WtebhHJwQz2OZyK5u42erwiqOuh7mSAiNTuvuwEIUwAZBpxvV+tyN4gbJMpPDXq8Sa12X5oZ zl3hK8CXP4eGlzT246dsdhxpEgHOi4ApTrsMTC/kkVQmUHZatu6TGDquMTzT9Rlhxzolr0+u2l9ZG LdZIer6U1V98Dr5etqYZgg==; Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 12:59:11 +0200 Message-Id: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Fri, 15 Nov 2024 13:15:38 -0800) Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2024 13:15:38 -0800 > > Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of > text editors" writes: > > > Tags: patch > > > > The doc of `c-ts-mode.el` currently recommends things we deprecate. > > The patch below fixes this. > > > > I think this can go into `emacs-30`, but I believe Eli prefers we leave > > this alone there, so I guess it would go to `master`. If we can install > > at least part of it into `emacs-30` (such as the removal of the > > recommendation to `require` or the suggestion to use the obsolete > > `c-or-c++-ts-mode`), I'll happily split it. > > FWIW, I agree that we should at least remove the recommendation to use > `require` on emacs-30, as it encourages bad habits and contributes to an > already poor understanding of autoloading among users. This all should have been discussed when major-mode-remap-defaults was added and c-ts-mode was modified to use it. Not now, sigh. Anyway, I don't want to remove the 'require' part from the commentary, but I think we should modify it to use 'load', not 'require' (given the discussion in bug#74339), and we should make it the second alternative, after the one that talks about using major-mode-remap-alist. I also don't think I agree with these removals: > @@ -1340,8 +1321,6 @@ c-ts-mode > > (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c-mode . c-ts-mode)) > (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) > - (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist > - \\='(c-or-c++-mode . c-or-c++-ts-mode)) > > in your init files." > :group 'c > @@ -1410,8 +1389,6 @@ c++-ts-mode > > (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c-mode . c-ts-mode)) > (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist \\='(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) > - (add-to-list \\='major-mode-remap-alist > - \\='(c-or-c++-mode . c-or-c++-ts-mode)) > > in your init files. The commit log message says > (c-ts-mode, c++-ts-mode): Don't suggest remapping `c-or-c++-mode` > to `c-or-c++-ts-mode` since `c-or-c++-ts-mode` is deprecated > since `c-or-c++-mode` already obeys the remapping of `c/c++-mode`. However, if we don't remap c-or-c++-mode, it will load cc-mode.el, which loads a bunch of other cc-*.el files, which is not clean, since all we need is a single regexp. (And note that c-ts-mode doesn't limit the search for the regexp, whereas cc-mode.el does.) So I think if we want to _really_ deprecate c-or-c++-ts-mode, we should make this variable defined on a separate file, common to CC Mode and c-ts-mode, which doesn't load anything else. Perhaps in subr.el or files.el. P.S. As an aside, I find our handling of this and related issues quite appalling. Variables introduced (or should I say "sneaked in"?), without properly discussing their effects on the users and without properly documenting those effects; unclean tricks to "fight off" changes installed by others, without properly describing those changes and triggering a discussion; etc. This is unbecoming, and almost feels like some kind of court intrigues. We should know better how to deal with controversial changes. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 16 11:52:59 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Nov 2024 16:52:59 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54569 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCM2d-0004Os-8k for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:59 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:62449) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCM2b-0004Oe-1s for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:58 -0500 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id D23E2809C2; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:50 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1731775969; bh=axm3dgXP2migvQIkByGyjFKHAeWI6G5DrSUu8qxf4iI=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=bNT9hY7yGNALQVpbOJ+w2uzLh5hgj5o/mZqeDCYGuuEgeX8feZOI/25qPp7rBmrdu 00TM9liXKgj+Ear1AECLa1GpTAVIC78OMSpn/+N/sN79ubcIQbYcboDsxIjuuVfZg2 XnaUMGMMsALeGTVoDbktby+EqLvBjgPn3pb0kd23aLa93WqvU2tfr6ShyIWjkSRT9e nx16tJV5m2JxMNqIKyri6JteaN5BGJwM+LzcIAhwdVpKCGJ1Ef/fuXWecPGhRc5uMm echioMy5/tVDb/RKodFbmcFIO7ooJhJj6bcEOE8HYXkzT0u7jNn4QGf4LpP7i7nrmu IWobZwRe4V/Kw== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id D48A1804BC; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from pastel (104-195-225-43.cpe.teksavvy.com [104.195.225.43]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9A00F1200BB; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:49 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes In-Reply-To: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 16 Nov 2024 12:59:11 +0200") Message-ID: References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:48 -0500 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.008 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: Alan Mackenzie , 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Kangas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) >> FWIW, I agree that we should at least remove the recommendation to use >> `require` on emacs-30, as it encourages bad habits and contributes to an >> already poor understanding of autoloading among users. > This all should have been discussed when major-mode-remap-defaults was > added and c-ts-mode was modified to use it. Not now, sigh. Yup. I too often focus on the code and skip the doc. =F0=9F=99=81 > Anyway, I don't want to remove the 'require' part from the commentary, > but I think we should modify it to use 'load', not 'require' (given > the discussion in bug#74339), and we should make it the second > alternative, after the one that talks about using > major-mode-remap-alist. `load`? Yuck! But well, better than nothing (tho it likely won't make much difference in an init file: the problem of later loading `cc-mode` will still bite just as much). I don't understand why you insist on suggesting such a "setting" since it's unreliable now and probably even more so in the future. What advantage do you see in it for the user over the `major-mode-remap-alist` option? > The commit log message says > >> (c-ts-mode, c++-ts-mode): Don't suggest remapping `c-or-c++-mode` >> to `c-or-c++-ts-mode` since `c-or-c++-ts-mode` is deprecated >> since `c-or-c++-mode` already obeys the remapping of `c/c++-mode`. > > However, if we don't remap c-or-c++-mode, it will load cc-mode.el, > which loads a bunch of other cc-*.el files, which is not clean, since > all we need is a single regexp. ...and the `c-or-c++-mode` function itself. Good point. > (And note that c-ts-mode doesn't limit the search for the regexp, > whereas cc-mode.el does.) Should we harmonize the two? Do we know if there's a reason other than accidental for the difference? Presumably the `cc-mode.el` one has been more widely tested. > So I think if we want to _really_ deprecate > c-or-c++-ts-mode, we should make this variable defined on a separate > file, common to CC Mode and c-ts-mode, which doesn't load anything > else. Perhaps in subr.el or files.el. BTW, there's a similar issue with the `c-string-list-p` and `c-string-or-string-list-p` functions which are used for `safe-local-variable` which would cause `cc-vars.el` to be loaded for `c-ts-mode` users when a `dir-locals.el` sets some `c-mode` vars. Maybe we should move those things to a small `cc-utils.el` file which doesn't load other CC-mode files? [ Currently, this problem is hidden by the fact that we eagerly load `cc-mode.el` anyway (which also loads `cc-vars.el`) even before we try to look at those vars's `safe-local-variable` setting. ] Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 16 13:35:42 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Nov 2024 18:35:43 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54766 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCNe2-0000dH-De for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 13:35:42 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:50534) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCNdx-0000d2-LK for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 13:35:40 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tCNdq-0004oh-P9; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 13:35:30 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=Y3XsUGI7pV9TPTHZWjjjDVaWnAe/PQTZlSGjw5Wz3Yw=; b=G5hv1E9rw0Mx UWJpsYLkDbaOTOYzTWw9Mknf8gJbHFAgmfEk7LbPiMH7FC3nKjkdmqFZ/Am5egQ4g5z5CWEfSK+bh eg/fieNtcm815rRhVGGCN+wG79GuZ+geq7C6gvcSR+n75NFobw8g7xCWU9gHRJhXUETMnBvMSMwN3 X76JfB8xVAcLObhvwFhWZuxIBGn5D16kwz7SOwz+c8lsldK5/EKHmAMZxUxT30AXW9k8bKZzEsMFJ x6G8Cter9p+XJ498X2YLkeX75bKU8hGPiRFUjPHCqSTGNso0noT6BacFF4ZuCkSFur0m1gc+as8jq S7dKP/iCSbl7X0SdsuR9PQ==; Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 20:35:25 +0200 Message-Id: <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:48 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: Stefan Kangas , 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, Alan > Mackenzie > Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 11:52:48 -0500 > > > Anyway, I don't want to remove the 'require' part from the commentary, > > but I think we should modify it to use 'load', not 'require' (given > > the discussion in bug#74339), and we should make it the second > > alternative, after the one that talks about using > > major-mode-remap-alist. > > `load`? Yuck! > But well, better than nothing (tho it likely won't make much difference > in an init file: the problem of later loading `cc-mode` will still bite > just as much). > > I don't understand why you insist on suggesting such a "setting" since > it's unreliable now and probably even more so in the future. Because that's what users did in Emacs 29. I don't want us to make an impression it no longer works. > What advantage do you see in it for the user over the > `major-mode-remap-alist` option? Since I agreed to make the major-mode-remap-alist the first item, is there still a question of the advantages of 'load' wrt major-mode-remap-alist? > > The commit log message says > > > >> (c-ts-mode, c++-ts-mode): Don't suggest remapping `c-or-c++-mode` > >> to `c-or-c++-ts-mode` since `c-or-c++-ts-mode` is deprecated > >> since `c-or-c++-mode` already obeys the remapping of `c/c++-mode`. > > > > However, if we don't remap c-or-c++-mode, it will load cc-mode.el, > > which loads a bunch of other cc-*.el files, which is not clean, since > > all we need is a single regexp. > > ...and the `c-or-c++-mode` function itself. > > Good point. > > > (And note that c-ts-mode doesn't limit the search for the regexp, > > whereas cc-mode.el does.) > > Should we harmonize the two? Do we know if there's a reason other than > accidental for the difference? Presumably the `cc-mode.el` one has been > more widely tested. I don't mind limiting the search in c-ts-mode, but then we need two common variables. > > So I think if we want to _really_ deprecate > > c-or-c++-ts-mode, we should make this variable defined on a separate > > file, common to CC Mode and c-ts-mode, which doesn't load anything > > else. Perhaps in subr.el or files.el. > > BTW, there's a similar issue with the `c-string-list-p` and > `c-string-or-string-list-p` functions which are used for > `safe-local-variable` which would cause `cc-vars.el` to be loaded for > `c-ts-mode` users when a `dir-locals.el` sets some `c-mode` vars. I think we should have a string-or-list-p function in subr.el, like string-or-null-p we already have there. > Maybe we should move those things to a small `cc-utils.el` file which > doesn't load other CC-mode files? That would also work for me. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 16 15:26:52 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Nov 2024 20:26:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54929 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCPNb-0005em-Uf for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:52 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:5814) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCPNZ-0005eS-Bk for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:50 -0500 Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 1BABA100180; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:42 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1731788801; bh=7sAftMXB5AmrlByumTqXyNIFX/PKKV6y5b2Cwze9Iwo=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=iR4oHKKmiueMifQjA7aYu/NM/3bKBR6NSFkherkWlDdRbomKFIwqV2emEB2TzcTTz pvOBxYLuOl1gzMQPPe5n/FBLQEHkVnpYup8EsYsNiRPMCLB4wjvS6ODcglfS4Y6srH UeWhyVGdJBxLL86ZKlrVgV48wCknH86dOV38QDxHjdSdEwm9hYC/P7KmpePcX3wF5W n34dHMFuoLrqT1eB7CrYFjWJ2ZHNePErnF31XfFUYDL8csHY+LmMrWUWeXrducwwhE 9EIf3N5ucd7hKKtQlMcExrf7meSVLLKTXv+zx44Eo0ybmHNZ9CGc7KIGcO8lMzsbyK vA/InHf0EX+/A== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 455D6100043; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from alfajor (modemcable005.21-80-70.mc.videotron.ca [70.80.21.5]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1E8C512041A; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:41 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes In-Reply-To: <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 16 Nov 2024 20:35:25 +0200") Message-ID: References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:31 -0500 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL 0.199 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) >> I don't understand why you insist on suggesting such a "setting" since >> it's unreliable now and probably even more so in the future. > Because that's what users did in Emacs 29. I don't want us to make an > impression it no longer works. In Emacs-29, it did work, because it modified `auto-mode-alist` and CC-mode never modified it back. In `emacs-30`, it doesn't work reliably any more because loading `cc-mode.el` after `c-ts-mode.el` causes the default mode to revert to `c-mode`. Loading `cc-mode.el` happens when you do `C-h f c-mode RET`, or when you load a file that requires it, e.g.: lisp/cedet/semantic/bovine/c.el:(eval-when-compile (require 'cc-mode)) lisp/generic-x.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/org/ob-C.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/org/ob-fortran.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/antlr-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/cc-mode.el:;; (require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/cmacexp.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/csharp-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/cwarn.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/hideif.el:(require 'cc-mode) lisp/progmodes/js.el:(require 'cc-mode) or: ../elpa/packages/csharp-mode/csharp-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../elpa/packages/electric-spacing/electric-spacing.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../elpa/packages/gnome-c-style/gnome-c-align.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../elpa/packages/javaimp/javaimp-parse.el:(require 'cc-mode) ;for java-mode-syntax-table ../elpa/packages/vcl-mode/vcl-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/arduino-mode/arduino-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/bison-mode/bison-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/d-mode/d-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/php-mode/lisp/php.el: (require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/php-mode/lisp/php-mode-debug.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/php-mode/lisp/php-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/scad-mode/scad-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) ../nongnu/packages/typescript-mode/typescript-mode.el: (require 'cc-mode) Also we're discussing changing `c-ts-mode.el` so loading it doesn't have that effect at all, which means that there's a good chance it will work even less well in the future. So to me it's clear that suggesting the use of `require` or `load` to change the default C mode is doing a disservice to our users. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 16 16:00:21 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Nov 2024 21:00:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54983 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCPu1-0007Hh-Hs for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 16:00:21 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40240) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCPtz-0007HE-Cn for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 16:00:20 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tCPtt-0007E3-VP; Sat, 16 Nov 2024 16:00:13 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=GZICIDxnxusdF54VAX8TTxna2t5RA+PSzA5FuN/JqX0=; b=blpEHUqiZQvx agQSpKuEFQx5T6y/0/mIvcGYO3OAtzeCADvhkxZegOGax9EFHatCV6QjfXLM7VYyDbKlIs+C7Wmw7 HHqfX1bmm+6xjpogxA9C4YW9raL70NgwcoNpUmzXxFTlaW75+xmq5TnmSTxGI0umrl3zfgeXjp3gc e9r7aR/Qa9DNYHKNQ+eeOjwm4iSLkUBdz439b/1ySR0QFmgjGyhzG+CTD84zVtIEXoeI+zDs1sQed pM6cZTFDqKLb7zXH4hHRz1Zfj7Mll8OxiL5unMlmkQAMiv3D5aV76K79IYAfvhloEan2UHBETxp3A YNBnb3BRJCDVrjl4gXtJ8A==; Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 23:00:09 +0200 Message-Id: <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:31 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: stefankangas@gmail.com, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, acm@muc.de > Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2024 15:26:31 -0500 > > >> I don't understand why you insist on suggesting such a "setting" since > >> it's unreliable now and probably even more so in the future. > > Because that's what users did in Emacs 29. I don't want us to make an > > impression it no longer works. > > In Emacs-29, it did work, because it modified `auto-mode-alist` and > CC-mode never modified it back. > > In `emacs-30`, it doesn't work reliably any more because loading > `cc-mode.el` after `c-ts-mode.el` causes the default mode to revert to > `c-mode`. Loading `cc-mode.el` happens when you do `C-h f c-mode RET`, > or when you load a file that requires it, e.g.: This will be better once we fix the major-mode-remap-defaults are handled by the modes involved in this. But yes, the effect of your introduction of major-mode-remap-defaults and the subsequent changes in cc-mode is that loading the mode works less reliably now. Which is why the advice to use major-mode-remap-alist should now be the first one. > lisp/cedet/semantic/bovine/c.el:(eval-when-compile (require 'cc-mode)) > lisp/generic-x.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/org/ob-C.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/org/ob-fortran.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/antlr-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/cc-mode.el:;; (require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/cmacexp.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/csharp-mode.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/cwarn.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/hideif.el:(require 'cc-mode) > lisp/progmodes/js.el:(require 'cc-mode) See https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=74339#38 > Also we're discussing changing `c-ts-mode.el` so loading it doesn't have > that effect at all That's not the change I am discussing in bug#74339. > which means that there's a good chance it will work even less well > in the future. So to me it's clear that suggesting the use of > `require` or `load` to change the default C mode is doing a > disservice to our users. Noted. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Nov 17 17:19:39 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Nov 2024 22:19:39 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58978 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCncI-0001p9-MM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:38 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:28290) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tCncG-0001os-2A for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:36 -0500 Received: from pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 5C3D14441A6; Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:30 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1731881969; bh=saBsqYuo2pnLhbqGxwbnmJlWBWPv67Q0gwbl60qLkg0=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=CcLKfBVcUsBbhu9zAB1StELbN3Jei0uyJJ67lJMVlhc6O8qFZouC1K/vZiWEBnk1Q GbFsK625Hr1gN/DEHlgkD9pUorBJdZ5vt3Tdw+QUaBxM4xWJgTG0/VRycXGo//ueMR C1QP7LMUip7R6/k6cP4FGtwSiX96KF919BuVzAZ0M7JOjr1hpiw4vnV9rg0819Hrp4 +Z8xsgg1rxyeE8vLipxYWXOdRV2x9SnFSVuejaitb5UODgJlrJxcBFKGU1gbPbX5qU t0ZmIrfIdmb5AS7uBg/vFMJirq0jD0qtv1AqGCLllmCV7rAawlUZFfn0MJWxhlVhm3 DjJVHYWAl1Ifw== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 35E97443B01; Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from pastel (104-195-225-43.cpe.teksavvy.com [104.195.225.43]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0078C1205FA; Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:28 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes In-Reply-To: <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 16 Nov 2024 23:00:09 +0200") Message-ID: References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:28 -0500 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.020 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) So, for `emacs-30` I propose the patch below. Any objection? Stefan diff --git a/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el b/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el index 2785e9a6e68..af23cd66d98 100644 --- a/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el +++ b/lisp/progmodes/c-ts-mode.el @@ -35,12 +35,6 @@ ;; To use these modes by default, assuming you have the respective ;; tree-sitter grammars available, do one of the following: ;; -;; - If you have both C and C++ grammars installed, add -;; -;; (require 'c-ts-mode) -;; -;; to your init file. -;; ;; - Add one or mode of the following to your init file: ;; ;; (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-alist '(c-mode . c-ts-mode)) @@ -59,6 +53,12 @@ ;; ;; will turn on the c++-ts-mode for C++ source files. ;; +;; - If you have both C and C++ grammars installed, add +;; +;; (require 'c-ts-mode) +;; +;; to your init file. +;; ;; You can also turn on these modes manually in a buffer. Doing so ;; will set up Emacs to use the C/C++ modes defined here for other ;; files, provided that you have the corresponding parser grammar @@ -1496,7 +1496,6 @@ c-or-c++-ts-mode '(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode))) (when (treesit-ready-p 'c) - (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-defaults '(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-defaults '(c-mode . c-ts-mode))) (when (and (treesit-ready-p 'cpp) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Nov 18 07:09:34 2024 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Nov 2024 12:09:35 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60289 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tD0ZS-0006hY-Ji for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 18 Nov 2024 07:09:34 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45586) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1tD0ZQ-0006hK-1q for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 18 Nov 2024 07:09:33 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tD0ZJ-0006fz-2T; Mon, 18 Nov 2024 07:09:25 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=FFxNRpe+ttTLRfwtWlbL6T7w3xq87UnphUl5fgZa+mU=; b=XBdx2aI8ERT3 HHpjfCBOAXop+a+vP6lOOGTIdbCbUeoZVqrrxzmIlREsyztuKP2IA2PmDd8M5h5hlG2cr0deXEBPR sIigHsoxfE/ChX8nZkfhztRfXgeOl91SepX9P0OEp+ndIj+n/su3MlElkU7r5YnH3Haai1BZoizQ0 SC6FBlob6wqLydJvmBVM5b1YRAW91a9q8NUJL+1SIzC/tPL3KrZSWmDwaGgIEhPJoQiG7qHOdpP3K x3XZw+wb95lpGA3bincgoHWMPLUYcBQj7OySVcGtVRdfzpl307qGKMkHzSfjuee9qvtBWnl0wKC9k b5qympEPVMzuAj0WiR8Pfw==; Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2024 14:09:22 +0200 Message-Id: <86ldxgvj4d.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:28 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: stefankangas@gmail.com, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, acm@muc.de > Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2024 17:19:28 -0500 > > So, for `emacs-30` I propose the patch below. > Any objection? No objections, provided that you replace (require 'c-ts-mode) with (load "c-ts-mode") since, as we now understand, just 'require' might not do anything. > @@ -1496,7 +1496,6 @@ c-or-c++-ts-mode > '(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode))) > > (when (treesit-ready-p 'c) > - (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-defaults '(c++-mode . c++-ts-mode)) > (add-to-list 'major-mode-remap-defaults '(c-mode . c-ts-mode))) > > (when (and (treesit-ready-p 'cpp) Please leave this part alone in the meantime, as long as bug#74339 is being discussed and is not resolved. The resolution of that bug will also handle this nit. 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Tue, 11 Feb 2025 11:17:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 11:17:24 -0800 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2025 11:17:24 -0800 X-Gm-Features: AWEUYZlij7-uYHCn2simCYNM1jFj3kv2Spf-nM-h3cwY5QwUGIEJH0JcmGrGTlw Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes To: Stefan Monnier Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, Eli Zaretskii , 74367@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Stefan Monnier writes: > So, for `emacs-30` I propose the patch below. > Any objection? Is there anything left to do here, or can the bug be closed? Any followup changes on master, for example? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 11 14:28:36 2025 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Feb 2025 19:28:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58717 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1thvvw-0003sh-JP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 14:28:36 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33818) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1thvvt-0003sP-PW for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 14:28:34 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1thvvn-00004r-BD; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 14:28:27 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=XTJ+yiqRtEaxvEIlik309Dnxr2lFJaos2Tb0URmt7fA=; b=VFBdS44chF1A VVrjHTcejzawltsjW4SAa0ySfpXkOFPuYKCmrbY70z+nJcIEo5PeL+/xvlwa91qaY5D6diKbvp5jn ULAyqcSH/SN2fNwBwsHt5d34opfei0XSFTweSljhlnTjDjvmouovHL487QweB5enIOJptDefaiFyG 5xgoeCzqRpH2IlJ6xdZDQDOBpRrXjO4v81d12YE5xBaSWbkDTVMNbFazubDLrgr9ZZ24oD5rWW3sU 1p/nZVPpfQeSD8WiGIWk5SCcAcllH+ztSuZK2WcmKjOzdlhVBTX0FcPfzOk0+IlP0/50NAK4tbQxK 0KdSS+/6Cu0SaXjVBOhvAg==; Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2025 21:27:34 +0200 Message-Id: <867c5wwac9.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Tue, 11 Feb 2025 11:17:24 -0800) Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2025 11:17:24 -0800 > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org > > Stefan Monnier writes: > > > So, for `emacs-30` I propose the patch below. > > Any objection? > > Is there anything left to do here, or can the bug be closed? I think this can be closed, as the changes were done already. > Any followup changes on master, for example? I'm not sure anything else is needed. But let's hear from Stefan Monnier. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 11 15:57:45 2025 Received: (at 74367) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Feb 2025 20:57:45 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59071 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1thxK9-0006gl-G6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:57:45 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:26344) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1thxK6-0006gT-Dk for 74367@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:57:39 -0500 Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id CA2CC10004C; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:57:30 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1739307450; bh=cXCVTFo/jjuSqDl0IEvC7rTBSH8wZtBRlS/6oj2H7IY=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=litttaTL+qhNwjEpd6X+dvWJhhfABe5B+R4RYqwKF6s7Kl0wDbQ88u+itTKjMBSzv lSlV1A7bUQUtCIv26mCsx0/9y8D/9u6mk/mrfCEgtJvOBJzwKhOZOBMnWEP4ZgkpUn IGTNi8WXs1O7LnHecqWlVJp2YZDWPCMiu/SFPF4Yo6TS+CM5j8rNKuZhn1nkGRJyRo vL/msOjL0o4BCHpK795OZ6NDeXbZ5HtPa8KxGeFqjauzJX0pKJVCstQbVuwSp1dGg7 rq77B0PJAcA5eTkH8Hy2NDuh3IhUroObqeC88gArPEvMuMFHCtWCty7vGUoP4iPgKF ayTbGIsx4QNBQ== Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 1973A100034; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:57:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from alfajor (modemcable005.21-80-70.mc.videotron.ca [70.80.21.5]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E0E20120195; Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:57:29 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#74367: [PATCH] c-ts-mode.el: Adjust doc about how to change default modes In-Reply-To: <867c5wwac9.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 11 Feb 2025 21:27:34 +0200") Message-ID: References: <86v7wnh2bk.fsf@gnu.org> <86plmvf2mq.fsf@gnu.org> <86serqx5ba.fsf@gnu.org> <867c5wwac9.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:57:30 -0500 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 74367 Cc: acm@muc.de, 74367@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Kangas X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) >> Any followup changes on master, for example? > I'm not sure anything else is needed. But let's hear from Stefan > Monnier. IIRC I wanted further changes in `master` but there wasn't consensus that it was a good idea (ro at least not yet), so I think we're good (for now). 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But let's hear from Stefan >> Monnier. > > IIRC I wanted further changes in `master` but there wasn't consensus > that it was a good idea (ro at least not yet), so I think we're good > (for now). OK, I'm therefore closing this for now. We can always revisit it later. From unknown Sat Aug 16 15:54:22 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2025 11:24:24 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator