From unknown Mon Jun 23 09:37:46 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#73982 <73982@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#73982 <73982@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: GCC Dependency? Reply-To: bug#73982 <73982@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2025 16:37:46 +0000 retitle 73982 GCC Dependency? reassign 73982 emacs submitter 73982 noloader@gmail.com severity 73982 normal tag 73982 notabug thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 24 03:43:14 2024 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Oct 2024 07:43:14 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33478 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sV0-00049b-6O for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:43:14 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:44392) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sUy-00049T-3l for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:43:13 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sUT-0006Ci-9g for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:41 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-xb32.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::b32]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sUR-0003PR-R0 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:41 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-xb32.google.com with SMTP id 3f1490d57ef6-e2e2ef2e906so746441276.2 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 00:42:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1729755758; x=1730360558; darn=gnu.org; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:reply-to:mime-version:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=0YUOFeTTvJf49zxaoOU81xvR4Q0whQwVOcXHN/ZNiIA=; b=Oglwcgki7m7vgV2ka4sZ0j7+A1ZPlE/9WO4VLca3PvK8Gcto/6CKLDtMiYxKRc6EgY Ggv5SIQsDXUxnOQ9jwW2jJnQT8N+PC5l3PS6vq2jtLaHUuJf+TNEZ75b2Hc4s+x8RdlN Z05FCCL9RqvvqvHIv1zz9WqcAwLS6maRyq/iNZT77t+MgEryAeq85zQug0QiJ4edDDnS xA3jr/Ibe1P/QbsR7frYeI0ucIwxlTUhiEPrjQIH3zPypV/4uBipYHYIRzeg2YJ3ohpk SUq3bJUYOpBMZCrXqJcQnD8Y5+PahbKqyNLQUJXh35IztQMoESHu7D/TEpWx3yVI2b/T PxVg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1729755758; x=1730360558; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:reply-to:mime-version :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=0YUOFeTTvJf49zxaoOU81xvR4Q0whQwVOcXHN/ZNiIA=; b=iFG8Cbw+uJLDSnulxqSFGab7akbIx2XyyKTRVUvO1pqL9SL7nYkQL2tUGs6gxys49w KnlnJpiE1IY4aM4Xq9InXv+qOyNns36QVapO71oBEk+gzL+J5LZfmzZ0CFAPXTnSyPGx vJcVwnS0DTdpzl2QqSR9Y7bCQQivDtQX63XaH1BtfSZ6/zsc6yTPWKBoeHd19J82iCTm He2GEQlOT68dcZUPKI4QbhvebXcKCi8mhMqepMLXQtGRSWgTKX3GE62wq4Qx4byNerGF 2GNW3JY7NHPwo43mo1x9uAQublcslGSSBNqjOPl1ZG1JTYESG8NIwhj5E6/m7jDMfUDY tw6Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzW4FXQSM7sC3QDr/tUmNNNXSmqTD82yI8MEICklt580L3uR+Jy xPmRlGFiX5/LZvOORvibGwDS/bLKNiB3IEWqtidhF6HG56RvsG1BcQMKtzsnGfdeHmPcujIY9oQ 5Pv9afczFEJdH6D5evC2QQ85iOPkjsyT2 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFx05EfA6nJQp2w4VPhXpKlin2RSO/1zRKlW/E1dqGWQajiJhhQqFeA4smM13lNFKnWtzjbms19nxpUv4C0X3g= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6902:188c:b0:e2e:45ad:9aba with SMTP id 3f1490d57ef6-e2e45ada119mr3990725276.10.1729755757734; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 00:42:37 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeffrey Walton Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:01 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: GCC Dependency? To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::b32; envelope-from=noloader@gmail.com; helo=mail-yb1-xb32.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: noloader@gmail.com Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Hi Everyone, I wanted to install emacs-nw, a/k/a emacs-nox, on a production Fedora server to edit configuration files. I had to install Zile instead because of all of Emac's dependencies, which now seems to include compilers. Also see Red Hat Bug #2316238, . I think the dev team made a bad architectural decision when it decided to allow the cornucopia of dependencies to grow, which now appears to include compilers. For my use case -- a production server facing the internet -- I do not want extra packages, like compilers and linkers. I am not trying to help an attacker produce executable code on my machine. I think it would be wise to remove the requirement of a compiler for a simple text editor. The team needs to provide a simple text editor (in addition to the other bloated offerings). For completeness: $ dnf info emacs-nw Name : emacs-nw Epoch : 1 Version : 29.4 Release : 9.fc40 Architecture : x86_64 Size : 31 M Source : emacs-29.4-9.fc40.src.rpm Repository : updates Jeff From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 24 04:12:50 2024 Received: (at 73982) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Oct 2024 08:12:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33507 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sxe-0005Wc-IU for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 04:12:50 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:38738) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sxb-0005WJ-UV; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 04:12:49 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t3sx2-0006wR-85; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 04:12:12 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=K3fE5Jq/xmY4+IEp8XEK2Z4BA+V8JtvHpJAPTun5dVA=; b=jKPLvCAcgKkH rQY15Lk655PM/Ww/mliz4M6Vx1lOw4qc3+csa5PIbtbQm+QtSOBn3NYPpTRCmNcrV8P/ut6D+HDM/ b8llm5nZ22ogi+fIYkjLnTEpAIEeiuio2HgxpN4FI3ZD4UYsPf+UFYKws4dsdq6SlXIA1CCGoxV8D 554PlE3//bGTm37kV7pffnQwt77k3pSXcx4V3HYhRpDC/gnYJ9H+k55d85b+po/6OLa0D5Y4dJZMC FpSJhpg7FPt+8vaimxrlWeOVv6VSi8PjJ1R7YuOuI9TnMEmfg1WAghQRgOB14WY3m9g0nh9didhJZ WSHNARMViznry7/kCZi/tQ==; Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 11:12:09 +0300 Message-Id: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: noloader@gmail.com In-Reply-To: (message from Jeffrey Walton on Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:01 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982 Cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) tags 73982 notabug thanks > From: Jeffrey Walton > Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:01 -0400 > > I wanted to install emacs-nw, a/k/a emacs-nox, on a production Fedora > server to edit configuration files. I had to install Zile instead > because of all of Emac's dependencies, which now seems to include > compilers. Also see Red Hat Bug #2316238, > . According to the above Red Hat bug report, this has nothing to do with the upstream Emacs project (us). It's how Red Hat decided to package Emacs, evidently to avoid having too many different Emacs packages. > I think the dev team made a bad architectural decision when it decided > to allow the cornucopia of dependencies to grow, which now appears to > include compilers. That is incorrect. The Emacs build procedure includes the options to build Emacs without native-compilation (which is what requires libgccjit and GCC). Moreover, in Emacs 29 (which is what you seem to have installed) native-compilation is by default _disabled_; we decided to enable it by default only in Emacs 30 (which was not yet released). And even if it's turned on by default, one can disable that when building Emacs. I guess Red Hat decided not to provide a package without native-compilation, for whatever reasons. (They also seem to provide Git, Perl, and Enchant, which are not Emacs dependencies at all.) But that's not our decision, it's theirs. > I think it would be wise to remove the requirement of a compiler for a > simple text editor. The team needs to provide a simple text editor (in > addition to the other bloated offerings). We do allow to configure Emacs without many optional features. In fact, almost _every_ dependency in Emacs can be disabled when Emacs is configured for building. So please take this back with the Red Hat packaging team: it's their decision which Emacs configurations to provide for downloading. Or maybe just build your own Emacs, in which case you will be the one to decide which options to include and which not to include. I see no bug in Emacs here, as we allow to build Emacs with as many or as few dependencies as the user wants, and we don't tell distros how to package their binary distributions. 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[159.149.3.191]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-4318b542d3csm11396545e9.9.2024.10.24.02.15.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 24 Oct 2024 02:15:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Vincenzo Pupillo To: noloader@gmail.com, bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 11:15:45 +0200 Message-ID: <26683860.1r3eYUQgxm@3-191.divsi.unimi.it> In-Reply-To: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> References: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::32d; envelope-from=v.pupillo@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x32d.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Hi, > tags 73982 notabug > thanks > > > From: Jeffrey Walton > > Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:01 -0400 > > > > I wanted to install emacs-nw, a/k/a emacs-nox, on a production Fedora > > server to edit configuration files. I had to install Zile instead > > because of all of Emac's dependencies, which now seems to include > > compilers. Also see Red Hat Bug #2316238, > > . I would suggest you try the cosmopolitan build of emacs. It is a completely self-contained, single-file version of emacs-nox. https://justine.lol/cosmo3/ https://cosmo.zip/pub/cosmos/bin/ Kind regards Vincenzo From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 24 08:49:20 2024 Received: (at 73982) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Oct 2024 12:49:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34014 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3xH8-0001Yl-UF for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 08:49:20 -0400 Received: from mail-wm1-f52.google.com ([209.85.128.52]:58684) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3xH6-0001YV-F3 for 73982@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 08:49:14 -0400 Received: by mail-wm1-f52.google.com with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-4315f24a6bbso8868885e9.1 for <73982@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 05:48:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mavit.org.uk; s=google; t=1729774056; x=1730378856; darn=debbugs.gnu.org; h=mime-version:references:message-id:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from :date:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Ou9zE0kO7g70r9ZaY/jsBl7vccAVPMVllucwPWUUsGo=; b=ZjIhHInP8VD+2mcSS15j4Y0V7tg/cZ+KaW7l/Un3wzevGJ7Vut/Jh/Umd3rUAK5CsN A9F011LfCghOCtRIqUfXeg6XLgFO0fyHnhjMrQr6S+cWlPg5o/CRxsjjpxgYOXSQK/7h Ae2hqSPCFIwjB9hVFmXq6jyVhgg3S9TggAnuQ= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1729774056; x=1730378856; h=mime-version:references:message-id:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from :date:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Ou9zE0kO7g70r9ZaY/jsBl7vccAVPMVllucwPWUUsGo=; b=QGZDaxeCndYU/rWa22NpM/yvHOIlpHgdqdyeLCo1b8c3sU5dok5f24zOSr1M2dToYC N7M/hcHVyAm8YHTwvipp/0ptg9NGPx8nIRV15WqWKQ/FBeDTzCFCNEF/QdG4lq/Fy1+r GzZjJP1dGhTjA/Nr9VKpn6d+r1r7zEPx2rAc+FEzO3AHzjfEvvESzSI9pzGqDP+nGGwr p2hNm9CtX0OsCIqcgSLlSjosZhmW0YMDrOnCwVxhC9TfsJ50dG7BGoqmW7xShJDDqfcm b/NeLzY8P4pwI0G9ZqyeVfRYzZ8Vf+IehEJvQDJxkV1HFZ/mOU4XbiFU3xZqIqQoiyCu nqVw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yzp5EJTqsJeMCqhwBcmiwFn2rM+wxkjLW5HXJWQfi8dHLuziB8A HG/y6J/GBnZnKuCQXIco2lCUG1behYachvbUrAZakdnw+/mntwBVGfrUkMaW0A== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IG3uSJCTFk6XH2JeGdX1tS4RSyIEiLU4G8RXXVHBr/X3FwkNiKteboocuHwpf3P/2QDXJRpOw== X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:1c18:b0:431:43c6:e868 with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-4318c73a43fmr14111165e9.23.1729774055717; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 05:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from froglet.home.mavit.org.uk (dudl-14-b2-v4wan-165806-cust1021.vm31.cable.virginm.net. [82.32.147.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-4318b55f779sm16554395e9.18.2024.10.24.05.47.33 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 24 Oct 2024 05:47:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from froglet.home.mavit.org.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by froglet.home.mavit.org.uk (8.18.1/8.17.1) with ESMTPS id 49OClWI9015979 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 24 Oct 2024 13:47:33 +0100 Received: from localhost (mavit@localhost) by froglet.home.mavit.org.uk (8.18.1/8.18.1/Submit) with ESMTP id 49OClW9L015963; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 13:47:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: froglet.home.mavit.org.uk: mavit owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 13:47:32 +0100 (BST) From: Peter Oliver To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? In-Reply-To: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> Message-ID: <155e5387-82fd-1b17-a91c-1fec2cd82df1@mavit.org.uk> References: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982 Cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On Thu, 24 Oct 2024, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > It's how Red Hat decided to package > Emacs, evidently to avoid having too many different Emacs packages. Although Red Hat sponsor the Fedora project, they do not make these kinds of decisions. Those are made by Fedora contributors. > (They also seem to provide > Git, Perl, and Enchant, which are not Emacs dependencies at all.) Emacs command treesit-install-language-grammar calls git, which is why Fedora recommends it as an optional dependency. Similarly for ispell and enchant2. -- Peter Oliver From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 24 09:08:33 2024 Received: (at 73982) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Oct 2024 13:08:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34066 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3xZo-0002UM-UZ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 09:08:33 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40572) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t3xZm-0002U6-JZ for 73982@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 09:08:31 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t3xZC-00050n-AS; Thu, 24 Oct 2024 09:07:54 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=M5Ye+qf0/AwcFCPb850eoLcSVyg74pDlBzdS5kWeAL0=; b=PerHhWh8ziPC ShvKNkFcTc5O4aUmg02cTgC3ZxkTCmOJjY8llsqaKeMvzET9SGEbWYfh8PxhOZebLM1zYFKwlJVt2 1sOf/0EccsqOr93LoFZa68jy/JsHeGuP673DD7jvBJCv0csKnL4dLaSi4tOiwqEI4QzLIpt5ttdux yG/ER0isCqk8mcwryXaVHUN4caTYrB+cSnzetoWuBZGWBlLMsxTrPy5Vow4g2la+JAf2DE3/LM0V3 gGyHoEd95Yr/jATCyIXPwm6sYWNWI5FRmZ6CAknFSiB8AFK2DzMEdQMXQO+kwH1/0SfW3zEtJVSuI cBUDysfIiANCvP5HJ/w9aQ==; Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 16:07:49 +0300 Message-Id: <86r085d4yi.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Peter Oliver In-Reply-To: <155e5387-82fd-1b17-a91c-1fec2cd82df1@mavit.org.uk> (message from Peter Oliver on Thu, 24 Oct 2024 13:47:32 +0100 (BST)) Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? References: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> <155e5387-82fd-1b17-a91c-1fec2cd82df1@mavit.org.uk> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982 Cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 13:47:32 +0100 (BST) > From: Peter Oliver > cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org > > On Thu, 24 Oct 2024, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > > It's how Red Hat decided to package > > Emacs, evidently to avoid having too many different Emacs packages. > > Although Red Hat sponsor the Fedora project, they do not make these kinds of decisions. Those are made by Fedora contributors. Sorry, I don't know who exactly makes these decisions, and who just sponsors that. I just know it is not the Emacs project. > > (They also seem to provide > > Git, Perl, and Enchant, which are not Emacs dependencies at all.) > > Emacs command treesit-install-language-grammar calls git, which is why Fedora recommends it as an optional dependency. Similarly for ispell and enchant2. There are many Emacs commands that call external programs, but that doesn't yet mean the Emacs package for end users should include them all. Obviously, it isn't my place to decide how should Fedora package Emacs, but if they prefer to err on the side of including all, they should be prepared to deal with complaints such as this one, instead of pointing the users who complain at the upstream project, which has nothing to do with those decisions. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID a6a4aa3b73547dc489d5967848b6cd79; Fri, 25 Oct 2024 01:34:45 +0000 (UTC) From: Po Lu To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? In-Reply-To: <86r085d4yi.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 24 Oct 2024 16:07:49 +0300") References: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> <155e5387-82fd-1b17-a91c-1fec2cd82df1@mavit.org.uk> <86r085d4yi.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2024 09:34:41 +0800 Message-ID: <87y12dothq.fsf@yahoo.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.22806 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Content-Length: 589 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982 Cc: Peter Oliver , 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii writes: > Obviously, it isn't my place to decide how should Fedora package > Emacs, but if they prefer to err on the side of including all, they > should be prepared to deal with complaints such as this one, instead > of pointing the users who complain at the upstream project, which has > nothing to do with those decisions. I should add that git, perl, and the like are weak dependencies of Emacs's in Fedora, and any one can install Emacs without them by providing one argument to `dnf install': dnf install emacs-nox --setopt=install_weak_deps=False From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 26 03:16:44 2024 Received: (at 73982-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Oct 2024 07:16:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40434 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t4b2S-0004rz-DA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 03:16:44 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:53042) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t4b2M-0004rY-V1 for 73982-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 03:16:42 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t4b1k-0002W1-AL; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 03:16:00 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=SF2ZMIaCOzUU/moAGDi9wLdJZeFQu5Ob9q+wqycEaME=; b=bUxbbpZnbkEv Ch1nLKA8Bo0RA46JYke/tx5YY4e1hBA6gnzl9HhUtkdWQle50sClnngr0mSezsrU4vzu1Aa1Y5HuJ LLyJnALy1xfmCHX7q3DM7jKpdCQjWwC8uQO3XBxJBJKFrcXBdDAxjQdwmDi0ORo5ru74zq7uuK7MB shcttAyGgzWAyBIIcRMUHoTsdAxKCrS2nHSKezQjmSIRKsGRWCyj0LNwFVai3+RWILZwhyqNxIsIY UF0Vah7kAT/7qfn7g7Ujc8Uw0qSavLUEHIHehGCD0He1I4B4jS/t/Z11jLeTPhikaSWgT24MN1krq GL1PKtnexYDMExeejmcV/Q==; Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2024 10:15:56 +0300 Message-Id: <86v7xf9vwz.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: p.d.oliver@mavit.org.uk, noloader@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <86r085d4yi.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Thu, 24 Oct 2024 16:07:49 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? References: <86zfmtdina.fsf@gnu.org> <155e5387-82fd-1b17-a91c-1fec2cd82df1@mavit.org.uk> <86r085d4yi.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982-done Cc: 73982-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2024 16:07:49 +0300 > From: Eli Zaretskii > > Obviously, it isn't my place to decide how should Fedora package > Emacs, but if they prefer to err on the side of including all, they > should be prepared to deal with complaints such as this one, instead > of pointing the users who complain at the upstream project, which has > nothing to do with those decisions. Red Hat closed their ticket (without really explaining how they resolve the issue raised by the OP's, but that's not my problem to solve), so I'm now closing this non-bug. The bottom line, from my POV, is that the Emacs project provides configure-time options to build Emacs with or without any combination of the optional dependencies, as well as the --without-all option to build the minimal Emacs without any optional dependencies. Users who download Linux distros of Emacs should understand what they are downloading, and should take any problems with these distros to the respective downstream teams. If the packages provided by the distros do not satisfy the end-user requirements, our recommendation to the users is to build their own Emacs from the source tarballs distributed by us and available from the GNU FTP sites worldwide; then users could control exactly what optional dependencies are compiled into Emacs. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 26 16:24:22 2024 Received: (at 73982) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Oct 2024 20:24:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42706 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t4nKf-00009r-NK for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 16:24:21 -0400 Received: from thaodan.de ([185.216.177.71]:41260) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t4nKZ-00009Z-MX for 73982@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 16:24:20 -0400 Received: from odin (dsl-trebng12-50dc75-154.dhcp.inet.fi [80.220.117.154]) by thaodan.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 67635D00040; Sat, 26 Oct 2024 23:23:10 +0300 (EEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=thaodan.de; s=mail; t=1729974190; bh=p/waitfuTA2kZfH8hu3wf2M3G3PE2bYLLTvY1vaGuYw=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date; b=MG5p0GFP7HkHlpnpHzMDUF8XoekpHE65QDovPY+8EGJjmmTTtB6IX8EKMRGIYrpEq PXSrW5JSRIDswaqYwC/+Bq2udK9MJ1LqDAN5PGtNGa69wykxdX5RIwZ5SQjmFztPRI zBkTU2iPOKmODiGXwbNWKoTJln9TJqw+jX5tvgQu4onS5jMGFFQ59yOx6DS3nuybu8 FqOty1GQv/maNcwCIANHyASj851K/Q911I5FZ6TftfcPvMUTzeSv8WNx1vPI+1W92v hGqyOrTTKyWK3lkmhl0pWYpGCdjdRNxRjA6kVzzcZOUjDNCQoHC0eut4TsAecSXDs1 uKBx5Zg70GpAkrIIRiVHGIL7jGe2mKyEgoqIWgtZa5MqwzB4XJyIS0BfaumVL3pwwv 1p4N3o8p6TS9y1Ry5yvgbg+lpRkk/DtxOGET3QHMHQNCrUZFKC7wLfLEZk7qi/++6T oqEtuk1DdZgnfCKTVh1WfeFF7t1YfPglWTBPEpywEJfbVbIFuRkW2WcbG7QB2eJ4eM fbWzehekkpLTaLH1z4bROfzqG7FRRo0z6UCOT/sw8FNUobcDDOaoyVd8rOjskvCTRZ mfg2oWIIBLehQaSqV1gRBD+pzQmak1UJhT7x66at5ZywQrW+OpqAe9qLs90W/ryV4t zhyO8l5+vXns66s97OmvkoDk= From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar To: Jeffrey Walton Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? In-Reply-To: (Jeffrey Walton's message of "Thu, 24 Oct 2024 03:42:01 -0400") References: Autocrypt: addr=bjorn.bidar@thaodan.de; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEZNfpPhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdACBEmr+0xwIIHZfIDlZmm7sa+lHHSb0g9FZrN6qE6ru60JUJq w7ZybiBCaWRhciA8Ympvcm4uYmlkYXJAdGhhb2Rhbi5kZT6IlgQTFgoAPgIbAwULCQgHAgIiAgYV CgkICwIEFgIDAQIeBwIXgBYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1/YmAhkBAAoJEFwbdKFl HF9oB9cBAJoIIGQKXm4cpap+Flxc/EGnYl0123lcEyzuduqvlDT0AQC3OlFKm/OiqJ8IMTrzJRZ8 phFssTkSrrFXnM2jm5PYDoiTBBMWCgA7FiEEUfF263VHMB6nKairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX6T4CGwMF CwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgcCF4AACgkQXBt0oWUcX2hbCQEAtru7kvM8hi8zo6z9ux2h K+B5xViKuo7Z8K3IXuK5ugwA+wUfKzomzdBPhfxDsqLcEziGRxoyx0Q3ld9aermBUccHtBxCasO2 cm4gQmlkYXIgPG1lQHRoYW9kYW4uZGU+iJMEExYKADsCGwMFCwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwEC HgcCF4AWIQRR8XbrdUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf2FQAKCRBcG3ShZRxfaCzSAP4hZ7cSp0YN XYpcjHdsySh2MuBhhoPeLGXs+2kSiqBiOwD/TP8AgPEg/R+SI9GI9on7fBJJ0mp2IT8kZ2rhDOjg gA6IkwQTFgoAOxYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1+ntAhsDBQsJCAcCAiICBhUKCQgL AgQWAgMBAh4HAheAAAoJEFwbdKFlHF9oBgwA/iQHwe0VL4Df4GGTYlNjMSHFlIkBmN4UfYGLYj3E TrOUAQC51M+M3cjsL8WHdpBz6VAo6df9d+rVwhQ9vQuFHqevArg4BGTX6T4SCisGAQQBl1UBBQEB B0Cbohc3JEfn005/cm0AOGjSsW1ZxAkgaoVNjbpqk4MgNAMBCAeIeAQYFgoAIBYhBFHxdut1RzAe pymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1+k+AhsMAAoJEFwbdKFlHF9ooHABAKGmrGBic/Vys3BBrOQiRB3Z7izO HwhqTRpAqFZtXS2nAQDZhp/5aYw1TZjTzkm1KVt9QiYnjd/MvxRE9iaY6x4mDbgzBGTX6T4WCSsG AQQB2kcPAQEHQAgRJq/tMcCCB2XyA5WZpu7GvpRx0m9IPRWazeqhOq7uiO8EGBYKACAWIQRR8Xbr dUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf71AIbIgCBCRBcG3ShZRxfaHYgBBkWCgAdFiEEUfF263VHMB6n KairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX+9QACgkQXBt0oWUcX2jeSwD6AtWn0cuo8IF35YRo4o3cDRJnUfJnbvJy GxyCDThR+zYBAKG6/jdwmZkBQZKslnDAbMMd2WfiZZT5JW3IWC4EaKMO7HkBAKYPGZ3UbfkRvfFK S+pQ9CgtNfkSJQBtT1Ob7Y6nsacgAQCpyXN7yppmhW/oBgivITPy9Lkg+V4NK9WZYZCU9Q7LBA== Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2024 23:23:09 +0300 Message-ID: <87cyjmtxzm.fsf@> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: I'm not a Fedora user so I don't have an account in the Red Hat bugtracker to comment there. My comment on the Fedora packaging it is one thing to enable native-compilation, it is the other that it requires gcc. Content analysis details: (1.2 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_SAFE_BLOCKED RBL: ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to Validity was blocked. See https://knowledge.validity.com/hc/en-us/articles/20961730681243 for more information. [185.216.177.71 listed in sa-trusted.bondedsender.org] 0.0 RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED RBL: ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to Validity was blocked. See https://knowledge.validity.com/hc/en-us/articles/20961730681243 for more information. [185.216.177.71 listed in bl.score.senderscore.com] -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 1.2 INVALID_MSGID Message-Id is not valid, according to RFC 2822 X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982 Cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) I'm not a Fedora user so I don't have an account in the Red Hat bugtracker to comment there. My comment on the Fedora packaging it is one thing to enable native-compilation, it is the other that it requires gcc. I can take the openSUSE emacs-nox package as an example which has the feature enabled but doesn't pull in the whole GCC package, neither does it pull guile and co. Maybe their packaging around GCCJit is the issue? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Oct 27 01:59:38 2024 Received: (at 73982) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Oct 2024 05:59:38 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43553 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t4wJO-00026U-B0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 27 Oct 2024 01:59:38 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:58684) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1t4wJM-000268-D7 for 73982@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 27 Oct 2024 01:59:37 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1t4wGa-0001iU-Fz; Sun, 27 Oct 2024 01:56:44 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=E2zuI8W1hb27Pl3wciarnBKoSdo51rqVLtTtGHGzJIo=; b=nG8jQVIVXeuJtrF8OPzK mKpRiZ9FLqkiaVbhd1nHoVhkRo23oqaDJhx7Y8gNF0mIMqWog9fnbyib1F8pBiEWqq1SIgjhfGcWM AvSA2/Sj3dzmRHDXDAqCTXyddwEM79dhbgX2gIS6+nWWJ4b0DmkEwDYa18dm6kfbtgVx3fmWi6USU JMscgHEUURSc1zhBl+N8bjFXcbw281GZOcvt5CULG2ftCo2fBj9CjTlHMbkqV1HjQadxZ9tA6NDZv 1nIX9DI5JskColtOMYnsKaXFZ4Lpx5oMLOfWDNQAzGLuvxD3mA2b4AA/8+HIKyBaG4loaUg348Lgh DPzrOEuFY+37vQ==; Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2024 07:56:40 +0200 Message-Id: <868quaay1z.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn?= Bidar In-Reply-To: <87cyjmtxzm.fsf@> (bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org) Subject: Re: bug#73982: GCC Dependency? References: <87cyjmtxzm.fsf@> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73982 Cc: noloader@gmail.com, 73982@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: 73982@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2024 23:23:09 +0300 > From: Björn Bidar via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, > the Swiss army knife of text editors" > > > I'm not a Fedora user so I don't have an account in the Red Hat > bugtracker to comment there. You can easily register an account on their Bugzilla; I did. > My comment on the Fedora packaging it is one thing to enable > native-compilation, it is the other that it requires gcc. > > I can take the openSUSE emacs-nox package as an example which has the > feature enabled but doesn't pull in the whole GCC package, neither does > it pull guile and co. > > Maybe their packaging around GCCJit is the issue? These questions should be asked there, not here. We provide and support all the possible combinations; which ones are realized in downstream packages is the decision and the responsibility of the respective distros. This issue should have never been reported to us. From unknown Mon Jun 23 09:37:46 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2024 12:24:17 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator