From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 04 20:23:59 2010 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Oct 2010 00:23:59 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vK2-0004GB-Fp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:23:58 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vK1-0004G6-8V for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:23:57 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vN1-0004qE-OM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:27:04 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=unavailable version=3.3.1 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]:45515) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vN1-0004q9-Jd for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:27:03 -0400 Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=42665 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1P2vN0-0003GG-Bw for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:27:03 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vMz-0004pt-4L for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:27:02 -0400 Received: from mail-wy0-f169.google.com ([74.125.82.169]:44030) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vMz-0004pg-0J for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:27:01 -0400 Received: by wyb36 with SMTP id 36so7233140wyb.0 for ; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 17:26:59 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.227.144.2 with SMTP id x2mr9018888wbu.76.1286238419229; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 17:26:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.67.195 with HTTP; Mon, 4 Oct 2010 17:26:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2010 20:26:59 -0400 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 1NCzSFP4feOte_TyQeT8BMxX7j4 Message-ID: Subject: `defcustom' manual documentation divergent with docstring From: MON KEY To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-Spam-Score: -5.1 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -5.1 (-----) current through Bzr-101790 in doc/lispref/customize.texi there is this line: ,---- | | @defmac defcustom option standard doc [keyword value]@dots{} | `---- with subsequent references to the parameters '@var{option}' '@var{standard}' appearing throughout the remaining germane portions of the manual's documentation. The argument signature for the `defcustom' macro is: defcustom (symbol value doc &rest args) The docstring refers only to parameter names SYMBOL and VALUE and not those used in the manual, e.g. OPTION and STANDARD. Note too, that the OPTION/STANDARD usage is not in keeping with the signature of function `custom-declare-variable': custom-declare-variable (symbol default doc &rest args) Given the miasma of hairyness one encounters when attempting to grok the horror that is `defcustom' the current disconnect in param names is really disconcerting. This said, it is not immediately clear what is the correct fix for this the problem because there are multiple different semantic uses of "option" throughout the relevant section, such that it is not always clear which semantic is current. This context-conflict is hinted at in doc/lispref/ChangeLog: ,---- | 2006-12-17 Richard Stallman | | * customize.texi: Use "option" only for user options. | For the keyword values inside defcustom etc, say "keywords". | For :options value's elements, say "elements". `---- As such, it prob. not wise to do simply query-replace-regexp over the relevant section exchanging '@var{option}' with '@var{symbol}'. Indeed, nor would replacing '@var{standard}' with '@var{value}' help clarify the docs in so much as VALUE is also such a semantically loaded term given the context. The better fix would be to rename `defcustom's parameters to less loaded terms and adjust the manual accordingly (including those places where the word "option" is used ambiguously - though prob. only Chong Yidong has the sufficient requisite understanding of `defcustom' capable of teasing out those subtle usage anomalies). Maybe instead of the { OPTION/STANDARD | SYMBOL/VALUE } parameter names these would work better: VAR-SYMBOL and VAR-VALUE Note that `defcustom' has had its above referenced signature since at least Bzr-17335 of 1997-04-07. Likewise, `custom-declare-variable' has had its signature since Bzr-19517 of 1997-08-25. It isn't clear from the revision log of customize.texi how long it has used a divergent signature. -- /s_P\ From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 04 21:06:49 2010 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Oct 2010 01:06:49 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vzU-0004Y4-TM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 21:06:49 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1P2vzT-0004Xt-25 for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 21:06:47 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1P2w2U-0006qx-BD; Mon, 04 Oct 2010 21:09:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19626.31458.215887.92812@fencepost.gnu.org> Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2010 21:09:54 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: control Subject: control X-Attribution: GM X-Mailer: VM (www.wonderworks.com/vm), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs) X-Hue: green X-Ran: '|ty*Hjnza=GqpzzFK.OLb/k)cY\(DW%99t]_Xqxq@gwJq\!G=!];PZ('xE^.rG`,,wm!@ X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Spam-Score: -5.2 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -5.2 (-----) forcemerge 3740 7160 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 02 12:23:49 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2011 16:23:49 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd2yz-0001LN-35 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 12:23:49 -0400 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd2yt-0001L5-59 for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 12:23:47 -0400 Received: from cm-84.215.51.58.getinternet.no ([84.215.51.58] helo=quimbies.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd2yi-0008Gx-I9 for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 18:23:32 +0200 Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2011 18:23:31 +0200 Message-Id: To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #3740 X-MailScanner-ID: 1Qd2yi-0008Gx-I9 X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1310228612.61669@7DHcHNqMse8y6KPHjtfHQA X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) tags 3740 fixed close 3740 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 02 12:26:46 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2011 16:26:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd31p-0001R7-Sd for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 12:26:46 -0400 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd31n-0001Qq-P8 for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 12:26:44 -0400 Received: from cm-84.215.51.58.getinternet.no ([84.215.51.58] helo=quimbies.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd31d-0008K9-3d for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 18:26:33 +0200 Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2011 18:26:32 +0200 Message-Id: To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #3740 X-MailScanner-ID: 1Qd31d-0008K9-3d X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1310228793.26496@yGeEMX+k5bAxaIgQY7YYew X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.9 (--) tags 3740 - fixed From unknown Sun Jun 22 00:11:17 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2011 11:24:05 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator