From unknown Mon Aug 18 21:29:52 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#67268 <67268@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#67268 <67268@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests Reply-To: bug#67268 <67268@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2025 04:29:52 +0000 retitle 67268 [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests reassign 67268 automake-patches submitter 67268 Karl Berry severity 67268 normal tag 67268 patch thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 18 21:27:57 2023 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Nov 2023 02:27:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49701 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r4XXP-0004N2-M1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:27:57 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:470:142::17]:35008) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r4XXL-0004Mi-6p for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:27:54 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r4XXE-00084g-7M for automake-patches@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:27:44 -0500 Received: from frenzy.freefriends.org ([198.99.81.75] helo=freefriends.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r4XXC-0004om-I2 for automake-patches@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:27:43 -0500 X-Envelope-From: karl@freefriends.org Received: from freefriends.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id 3AJ2Rc0i032146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Sat, 18 Nov 2023 19:27:38 -0700 Received: (from apache@localhost) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7/Submit) id 3AJ2RcMZ032145; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 19:27:38 -0700 Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2023 19:27:38 -0700 Message-Id: <202311190227.3AJ2RcMZ032145@freefriends.org> From: Karl Berry To: michael@i3wm.org Subject: Re: [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=198.99.81.75; envelope-from=karl@freefriends.org; helo=freefriends.org X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit Cc: automake-patches@gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Hi Michael, Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 18:35:53 +0200 From: Michael Stapelberg To: automake-patches@gnu.org Subject: [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/automake-patches/2016-10/msg00002.html Seven years late(r), but I did finally merge (a version of) your suggestion of a portability note in the Automake manual about && vs. test -a, as below. Thanks! --karl doc: mention shell operators preferred over `test` options. * doc/automake.texi (Usage of Conditionals): mention that shell operators (&&, ||, ()) are preferred over `test` options (-a, -o, \(\)). Idea and POSIX url reference from Michael Stapelberg, https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/automake-patches/2016-10/msg00002.html diff --git a/doc/automake.texi b/doc/automake.texi index 51a3c3dbe..635bdd28c 100644 --- a/doc/automake.texi +++ b/doc/automake.texi @@ -11118,6 +11118,14 @@ must arrange for @emph{every} @code{AM_CONDITIONAL} to be invoked every time @command{configure} is run. If @code{AM_CONDITIONAL} is run conditionally (e.g., in a shell @code{if} statement), then the result will confuse @command{automake}. + +For portability, it is best to use shell operators @code{&&} and +@code{||} and parentheses, when constructing a compound +@var{condition} using the @command{test} command, and not the +@code{-a} and @code{-o} options and parentheses as options to +@command{test}, all of which have been marked obsolescent by POSIX +(@url{https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/utilities/test.html#tag_20_128_161}). +The name @code{test} is also more portable than @code{[}. @end defmac @cindex @option{--enable-debug}, example compile finished at Sat Nov 18 18:25:16 2023 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 25 16:36:57 2023 Received: (at 67268-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Nov 2023 21:36:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40389 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r70Ke-0004es-O0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 16:36:56 -0500 Received: from frenzy.freefriends.org ([198.99.81.75]:38950 helo=freefriends.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r70Kc-0004eb-IJ for 67268-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 16:36:55 -0500 X-Envelope-From: karl@freefriends.org X-Envelope-To: <67268-done@debbugs.gnu.org> Received: from freefriends.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id 3APLamCd008227 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT) for <67268-done@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 14:36:48 -0700 Received: (from apache@localhost) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7/Submit) id 3APLamTE008226; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 14:36:48 -0700 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2023 14:36:48 -0700 Message-Id: <202311252136.3APLamTE008226@freefriends.org> From: Karl Berry To: 67268-done@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. 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The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Content analysis details: (3.3 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 2.0 BLANK_SUBJECT Subject is present but empty 2.3 EMPTY_MESSAGE Message appears to have no textual parts -1.0 MAILING_LIST_MULTI Multiple indicators imply a widely-seen list manager From unknown Mon Aug 18 21:29:52 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: Did not alter fixed versions and reopened. Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2023 09:37:01 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # Did not alter fixed versions and reopened. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 02 04:40:55 2023 Received: (at 67268) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Dec 2023 09:40:55 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56644 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r9MUZ-00025V-D8 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Dec 2023 04:40:55 -0500 Received: from mail.gentoo.org ([2001:470:ea4a:1:5054:ff:fec7:86e4]:39227 helo=smtp.gentoo.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r9MUW-00025F-5G for 67268@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Dec 2023 04:40:53 -0500 Received: by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix, from userid 559) id 0EA86335D64; Sat, 2 Dec 2023 09:40:36 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 2023 04:40:34 -0500 From: Mike Frysinger To: Karl Berry Subject: Re: [bug#67268] [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests Message-ID: References: <202311190227.3AJ2RcMZ032145@freefriends.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="rKicS1eabiue7ZrN" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <202311190227.3AJ2RcMZ032145@freefriends.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 67268 Cc: 67268@debbugs.gnu.org, michael@i3wm.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) --rKicS1eabiue7ZrN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 18 Nov 2023 19:27, Karl Berry wrote: > Hi Michael, >=20 >=20 > Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 18:35:53 +0200 > From: Michael Stapelberg > To: automake-patches@gnu.org > Subject: [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests >=20 > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/automake-patches/2016-10/msg00002.= html >=20 > Seven years late(r), but I did finally merge (a version of) your > suggestion of a portability note in the Automake manual about && > vs. test -a, as below. Thanks! --karl >=20 >=20 > doc: mention shell operators preferred over `test` options. is the automake manual the best place for this ? the autoconf manual has a very extensive "Portable Shell Programming" chapter: https://www.gnu.org/savannah-checkouts/gnu/autoconf/manual/autoconf-2.71/ht= ml_node/Portable-Shell.html seems like it'd be better to extend that section and link it from here. -mike --rKicS1eabiue7ZrN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEuQK1JxMl+JKsJRrUQWM7n+g39YEFAmVq+5IACgkQQWM7n+g3 9YHCMhAApYS5CFj3jVWPHITCkgijwzTmWHg9UT9IrSQW0GB7tZOCnJp/+hI1EBYG TZ7TEVbgaY/+brKjheBb+up4eHzAV8OGZ3VZGSMv73iZV4xpQCKeGd6nDfNV3gYz /V2Q8HeiwgR5j0OFQXjOy8tivTWIRG1MDr/CGGg2x84UoKFR90I2UQV9BoiEbv++ L7vh1MAHaNsB6IlNj38lEupY8QWeTGwxlwpc0jsIYxZem0qNSxem2h8vUrwGMbf4 UpY0Q/o1+08tZZDhb070DYno0piQgjaJwIndbsDyZBjcm+0K7xpsu0ZP5harRHry FWYhdSrgZAMULEONl/gthv1wtAivCt2c9R3BOgKRkOHRFyXMfefi2KnyMdS+R+xl qUepnJ7iAk+8/yBwlB7r+lLi6RgKOcrnC5k6Eh2cYQNOJnJkesJALFTGUHGkKbEN hD/mfgwvmerXfFbUXKsLd1+K4ikKr642u+iTdfnhtWQyX5us41l8CEeQz2b6mty5 /1or7ZxwqbTZ/izoQalazaO82GexO0tBZK6E/TmllWVBefDQy9b0HuqbmjnhNWaB 7dEPylnIRHVJqpMnhFnaXdN51LOomXjHDZFlBdTepUpQYsThHP7gokjUZTage5l5 54l8oHEErwSW+/a45PxxsX4Ff59J84eqbUEN5tTH22gsuDUUxmE= =LYpc -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --rKicS1eabiue7ZrN-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 02 17:10:00 2023 Received: (at 67268) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Dec 2023 22:10:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58857 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r9YBU-0001WT-Ms for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Dec 2023 17:10:00 -0500 Received: from frenzy.freefriends.org ([198.99.81.75]:53852 helo=freefriends.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r9YBS-0001WK-LR for 67268@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Dec 2023 17:09:59 -0500 X-Envelope-From: karl@freefriends.org Received: from freefriends.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id 3B2M9ll3018415 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Sat, 2 Dec 2023 15:09:47 -0700 Received: (from apache@localhost) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7/Submit) id 3B2M9l8p018414; Sat, 2 Dec 2023 15:09:47 -0700 Date: Sat, 2 Dec 2023 15:09:47 -0700 Message-Id: <202312022209.3B2M9l8p018414@freefriends.org> From: Karl Berry To: vapier@gentoo.org Subject: Re: [bug#67268] [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 67268 Cc: 67268@debbugs.gnu.org, michael@i3wm.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) very extensive "Portable Shell Programming" chapter: https://www.gnu.org/savannah-checkouts/gnu/autoconf/manual/autoconf-2.71/html_node/Portable-Shell.html I know. The Autoconf manual already describes this issue in detail. The point of the brief mention in the Automake manual is because it is precisely the place and the problem that are rather likely to come up in practice. I see I failed to link to the Autoconf node, though. I'll add that. -k From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 02 20:35:18 2023 Received: (at 67268) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2023 01:35:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58945 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r9bOA-0006pZ-91 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Dec 2023 20:35:18 -0500 Received: from woodpecker.gentoo.org ([140.211.166.183]:49262 helo=smtp.gentoo.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r9bO7-0006pH-US for 67268@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Dec 2023 20:35:16 -0500 Received: by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix, from userid 559) id D2115335CB4; Sun, 3 Dec 2023 01:34:59 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sat, 2 Dec 2023 20:34:59 -0500 From: Mike Frysinger To: Karl Berry Subject: Re: [bug#67268] [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests Message-ID: References: <202312022209.3B2M9l8p018414@freefriends.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="gdizZYw7Y52bgUqh" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <202312022209.3B2M9l8p018414@freefriends.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 67268 Cc: 67268@debbugs.gnu.org, michael@i3wm.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) --gdizZYw7Y52bgUqh Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 02 Dec 2023 15:09, Karl Berry wrote: > very extensive "Portable Shell Programming" chapter: > https://www.gnu.org/savannah-checkouts/gnu/autoconf/manual/autoconf-2= =2E71/html_node/Portable-Shell.html >=20 > I know. The Autoconf manual already describes this issue in detail. > The point of the brief mention in the Automake manual is because it is > precisely the place and the problem that are rather likely to come up > in practice. >=20 > I see I failed to link to the Autoconf node, though. I'll add that. -k breadcrumbs in the automake manual is ok before tossing them to autoconf, b= ut i would make it more brief than we have now. like drop references to the POS= IX state and just leave it as discouraged in favor of the macros for portabili= ty. -mike --gdizZYw7Y52bgUqh Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEuQK1JxMl+JKsJRrUQWM7n+g39YEFAmVr20MACgkQQWM7n+g3 9YHoBhAAy39ViG3hrqclqfgWQ1CaJl6cmTuieh2dcKSMld/9bV4JwPObrSlbGjhX YEKBBIr9S8xHSjFc+Wqa81ciQwOTyMH6DpsXDkiLM5mpS6atxRjzVyuZp1yWIYow 7EuSdyzlMoB7BZR8MHSXRG13i5za1UTt+i7CnwyYb92Pcafmys3xjwwcMbG9dYsN uHgDg5Mbrs6NE4ImLki3DHbjI/Zd1RJA5dyAQa3YvOjB1J7G5+RCUqX+uPED5rOH cXw0SKb2DvW83YIAfnGakhB/4cfVK4X+RFb8KfSgZLSG1OraRRGU8s3j49pSisCX 1TyxL0xGydbk+gdTJFTtB99w/EuOxkQq5+GC5Iob3gg3Q9XQwdZuTtZyJTbJ8Ijo 55B9Dx7CjHij15kj5MiRO1beKcYuCDKfBFx2jRh6fRufZljZ9IsH3VEtjURMHypq UPtf6NRsHHGs+mG0HZeXEZ3V80MLLQdX2hgS8i0VJN0+N8LdfjebTFkzEvaVj52I LOXJBPIpeW3zQbUr/jqyopvXbm+mzHxgmcRslpG3uLX46C4Os9oPNZIP1mqY5SvV IgWxP4OjH1b8Iw7XDmbP8wlBZwjqnO+38HlXpGeOME8zus/BGNRds0vbYHjyHjEb S2Zce/SmMO7yj5dBizy6OlVL4608aMPzeBwX0FpFXZ/ZQPN3DCU= =idE7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --gdizZYw7Y52bgUqh-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 10 12:51:56 2023 Received: (at 67268) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2023 17:51:56 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51741 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rCNy8-00005e-E6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Dec 2023 12:51:56 -0500 Received: from frenzy.freefriends.org ([198.99.81.75]:35396 helo=freefriends.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rCNy5-00005K-3t; Sun, 10 Dec 2023 12:51:55 -0500 X-Envelope-From: karl@freefriends.org Received: from freefriends.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id 3BAHpb8G004987 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Sun, 10 Dec 2023 10:51:37 -0700 Received: (from apache@localhost) by freefriends.org (8.14.7/8.14.7/Submit) id 3BAHpbmi004986; Sun, 10 Dec 2023 10:51:37 -0700 Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2023 10:51:37 -0700 Message-Id: <202312101751.3BAHpbmi004986@freefriends.org> From: Karl Berry To: 67268@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: [bug#67268] [PATCH] texinfo: add pointer about combining tests X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 67268 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) I guess I don't see any harm in keeping the link to POSIX. Perhaps it should be in the Autoconf manual, but either way seems ok to me. Since the OP went to the trouble of looking it up. --best, karl. From unknown Mon Aug 18 21:29:52 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2024 12:24:08 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator