From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Jonas Bernoulli Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 15:16:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.16641189377992 (code B ref -1); Sun, 25 Sep 2022 15:16:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Sep 2022 15:15:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48350 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ocTM1-00024q-1c for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 11:15:37 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:55406) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ocTLy-00024h-Hr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 11:15:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56526) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ocTLv-00046l-Ic for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 11:15:32 -0400 Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([212.243.197.30]:41412) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ocTLs-0005D1-Ua for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 11:15:30 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67F0016586 for ; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:20 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bernoul.li; h= content-type:content-type:mime-version:message-id:date:date :subject:subject:from:from:received:received; s=sel2011a; t= 1664118920; bh=kEq59QTshYoMm6PTAO2ZIvrBSuR2+5OnPnqxEgEOjTY=; b=V MyCCQqc0Hxd+nzWAiFe7LwTMXmlPI9Et4YKf0ioxM0DJGzKtYUs/0OJ/V83PYGAE 4bVJztNNUOiwGsvbGkUGFpsOwIL6D8maY+q2NhsVhUpPMScRQrg87OsqUcdUZ3AR 2aO5EzM3JY1krwSs3EDy2Wj6sPKCmzlIqcSTExOgKQ= X-Virus-Scanned: by Hostpark/NetZone Mailprotection at hostpark.net Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail0.hostpark.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10224) with ESMTP id HRuWand7jeZ8 for ; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3049616574 for ; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:20 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:18 +0200 Message-ID: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: none client-ip=212.243.197.30; envelope-from=jonas@bernoul.li; helo=mail.hostpark.net X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) I usually run emacs without installing it, via a symlink, which is placed on PATH and which points at the executable in the checkout. Due to reasons that aren't important here, I recently had to replace the symlink with a wrapper script, and that resulted in these messages being send to stderr. Loading loadup.el (source)... Dump mode: nil Using load-path (...) Loading emacs-lisp/debug-early... ... Finding pointers to doc strings...done Running the executable directly also results in these messages. I then changed my wrapper script to use an intermediate symlink, with the resulted that the messages were not being shown for a while again, but today I updated emacs again and now the messages are always shown. Using a symlink no longer suppresses them. Are this messages shown intentionally? Is it already possible to suppress them? If not, could something be added to allow suppressing them? (I prefer to run the uninstalled executable, because that allows me to jump to a definition and then immediately view its history.) Thanks, Jonas From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 16:03:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Jonas Bernoulli Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.166412176913134 (code B ref 58073); Sun, 25 Sep 2022 16:03:02 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Sep 2022 16:02:49 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48392 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ocU5g-0003Pk-VH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 12:02:49 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43340) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ocU5e-0003PB-6J for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 12:02:47 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:51644) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ocU5X-0003iL-Ur; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 12:02:40 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=gesrcieKv6hvc4sOG2eSW36RYlB2duKD9W8RlkhN0X0=; b=rN8VlrIlkaXv Y32PWTVGh286dQTb3xHc5VCjHZY/2r6BE9EA0ziQwIjUXD2XXYZOzlzLj9S+pSguBylWBagyuinIE 3HUPSVILC5RmK8LVx99r2H+Pv17MtmXsGDYdGh3GQVusdlpYQV4JUJfsJJH9HCNtfr5vGnd6KzHMD GC1z2cwxmbFtcFwnHwtJMTJT/7QZYMqFKOTuUpZj9qCsuQ6hfvRKViaKSpDN+xyxG8n7JQc/rMruO h6DyeZGe5aN100xm10bqRNyMFPhTT6kxUv8yK/h1nkIapa+bjv5MCT3ngKRUf2ktjKZWt4RC5xM1t fmFnCIrCg3WI6Nk7SEHRDA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4156 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ocU5X-0005V7-3J; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 12:02:39 -0400 Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 19:02:28 +0300 Message-Id: <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> (message from Jonas Bernoulli on Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:18 +0200) References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jonas Bernoulli > Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:18 +0200 > > I usually run emacs without installing it, via a symlink, which is > placed on PATH and which points at the executable in the checkout. > Due to reasons that aren't important here, I recently had to replace the > symlink with a wrapper script, and that resulted in these messages being > send to stderr. > > Loading loadup.el (source)... > Dump mode: nil > Using load-path (...) > Loading emacs-lisp/debug-early... > ... > Finding pointers to doc strings...done > > Running the executable directly also results in these messages. > > I then changed my wrapper script to use an intermediate symlink, with > the resulted that the messages were not being shown for a while again, > but today I updated emacs again and now the messages are always shown. > Using a symlink no longer suppresses them. > > Are this messages shown intentionally? Is it already possible to > suppress them? If not, could something be added to allow suppressing > them? Is your Emacs built with or without native-compilation? The messages mean that Emacs either cannot find its pdumper file, or cannot find the preloaded *.eln files, and therefore loads all the preloaded files explicitly during startup. The question is why. My guess is that the way you invoke Emacs is not supported by the startup code. This became more complicated with the pdumper build, and yet more with the native-compilation build, because where formerly Emacs needed only to find its executable file, it now needs also to find the pdumper file and all the preloaded *.eln files. > (I prefer to run the uninstalled executable, because that allows me > to jump to a definition and then immediately view its history.) Then may I suggest a shell alias? Emacs has special support for running from the build tree, but in your case it somehow doesn't realize that. From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Jonas Bernoulli Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 18:31:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.16641306134613 (code B ref 58073); Sun, 25 Sep 2022 18:31:02 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Sep 2022 18:30:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48521 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ocWOK-0001CK-SJ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 14:30:13 -0400 Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([212.243.197.30]:57348) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ocWOG-0001C7-K7 for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 14:30:11 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5174A163CB; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 20:30:06 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bernoul.li; h= content-type:content-type:mime-version:message-id:date:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:subject:from:from:received :received; s=sel2011a; t=1664130606; bh=CBoSFnNDj0XpzvGdaOXIDP5P 7kA4t/I2ebUsEsIpMwo=; b=zPRJPvvIKFqWnum1MH7wLhR30OZ1ktN56oI7yn/r AlpIweaaUlivL2mnWQnl6xr8Y/Q8sxZpXeGkzqQKc7meveaVBne6hzCjLSQxM3pg FTCbbGAI6z8+Za+4qPDM0TUv5SmRYITb6zKxcmgGwYLUIN9N6q0bjoyMYjOfBT9e JDA= X-Virus-Scanned: by Hostpark/NetZone Mailprotection at hostpark.net Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail1.hostpark.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10224) with ESMTP id 6rcVTkdqC_Zc; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 20:30:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1BE9116483; Sun, 25 Sep 2022 20:30:06 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli In-Reply-To: <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 20:30:05 +0200 Message-ID: <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) >> Due to reasons that aren't important here, I recently had to replace the >> symlink with a wrapper script, and that resulted in these messages being >> send to stderr. I was very wrong about that not being important here. Installing emacs using guix sets EMACSLOADPATH in a file that is sourced by the shells startup file. To me it looks like they are abusing this variable; it makes it impossible to use an emacs that wasn't installed using guix, without something to counter their modification. I did that with a wrapper script. The value that is set somewhere in the shell's init files is something like "/home/jonas/.guix-home/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp". It doesn't contain an empty element, which would "stand for the default value of `load-path'", according to (info "(emacs)General Variables"). The side startup file is located inside this directory and contains (when (require 'guix-emacs nil t) (guix-emacs-autoload-packages) (advice-add 'package-load-all-descriptors :after #'guix-emacs-load-package-descriptors)) The file "guix-emacs.el" is located in the same directory. So the purpose of setting EMACSLOADPATH seems to be to allow using `require' to load that file. This doesn't seem right to me, they could just as well extend the load-path inside "site-lisp.el", or load their additional init file using `load'. To deal with the incomplete EMACSLOADPATH, as set in the shell environment, they use a wrapper script named "emacs" and located on PATH: #!/gnu/store/4y5m9lb8k3qkb1y9m02sw9w9a6hacd16-bash-minimal-5.1.8/bin/bash export XDG_DATA_DIRS="/gnu/store/h6qdfd4sjdg28jq16600hcjky0cfw9gx-shared-mime-info-1.15/share:/gnu/store/bnsf9il448hl5xjavbhq3rcx355svz2v-glib-2.70.2/share:/gnu/store/7njbpmsgwmx59xn2r6q097iy2wwscb44-gtk+-3.24.30/share:/gnu/store/w0ssipd06il3kvyvqihpmw4lwbhwwfq3-emacs-28.1/share${XDG_DATA_DIRS:+:}$XDG_DATA_DIRS" export GTK_PATH="/gnu/store/7njbpmsgwmx59xn2r6q097iy2wwscb44-gtk+-3.24.30/lib/gtk-3.0${GTK_PATH:+:}$GTK_PATH" export PATH="$PATH${PATH:+:}/gnu/store/0c1yfbxyv877mlgychfgvmk5ha2jqh52-gzip-1.10/bin:/gnu/store/8fpk2cja3f07xls48jfnpgrzrljpqivr-coreutils-8.32/bin" export EMACSLOADPATH="$EMACSLOADPATH${EMACSLOADPATH:+:}/gnu/store/w0ssipd06il3kvyvqihpmw4lwbhwwfq3-emacs-28.1/share/emacs/28.1/lisp" exec -a "$0" "/gnu/store/w0ssipd06il3kvyvqihpmw4lwbhwwfq3-emacs-28.1/bin/.emacs-28.1-real" "$@" I am under the impression that they should stop setting EMACSLOADPATH and should either invent their own variable to replace that or load "guix-emacs.el" using simpler means as I suggested above. What do you think? I intend to raise the issue with the guix folks but would first like to hear your opinion. If I unset EMACSLOADPATH, then everything works as expected. > Emacs has special support for running from the build tree, but in your > case it somehow doesn't realize that. As a side-note, the wrapper script that I previously used looked like this: #!/bin/sh export EMACSLOADPATH="\ /home/jonas/.guix-home/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp:\ /home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/lisp" exec -a "$0" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" The build tree is at "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs"; I think the value I set above is correct (correct me if I am wrong), so it seems that when running from the build tree EMACSLOADPATH has to be unset; explicitly doubling down on the defaults doesn't work. I also tried with an empty element. From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2022 07:57:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Jonas Bernoulli Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.16641789932471 (code B ref 58073); Mon, 26 Sep 2022 07:57:02 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2022 07:56:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49192 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ociye-0000dn-FD for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 03:56:32 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:42450) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ociyc-0000da-UT for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 03:56:31 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:52336) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ociyU-0001xw-TW; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 03:56:25 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=Dcbk0fLFC39lc7rpRbkGUkK4/2Y4zzCwTk2Vl4EIMVE=; b=nOQ5L8UPZuXM E0qFGzudIvhMs9eBv82drKNn4rzTJ4PJ9qw1l8eF7z9qlMkQcQWAEb2nGlGQbIG6gQ66oW5or1X15 zBotgwRoNPO+Dy8OP+nogxQXa9eUOmkTBZlwRvzKXsjW6Bn68NCiteebKvivT+ghiHZUHqxwY1HpA DgRuwWybqHNbylREEbjU1U69img5bU5TcnV8l0Tz09NuT9jmGAUf+JFlwcgbzWybBedRmY778sz2r 5lOTk9ZT66pnoLLlxqR9K9MKSfpL22BTjG2dcSLOCS9rj6Yw8owY7CpZw7jmudrVPareEzms8qwU4 P+mg9kT/85mabXVpyvBQug==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=2528 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ociyS-000842-O0; Mon, 26 Sep 2022 03:56:22 -0400 Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2022 10:56:10 +0300 Message-Id: <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> (message from Jonas Bernoulli on Sun, 25 Sep 2022 20:30:05 +0200) References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jonas Bernoulli > Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 20:30:05 +0200 > > Installing emacs using guix sets EMACSLOADPATH in a file that is sourced > by the shells startup file. To me it looks like they are abusing this > variable; it makes it impossible to use an emacs that wasn't installed > using guix, without something to counter their modification. I did that > with a wrapper script. > > The value that is set somewhere in the shell's init files is something > like "/home/jonas/.guix-home/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp". It doesn't > contain an empty element, which would "stand for the default value of > `load-path'", according to (info "(emacs)General Variables"). > > The side startup file is located inside this directory and contains > > (when (require 'guix-emacs nil t) > (guix-emacs-autoload-packages) > (advice-add 'package-load-all-descriptors :after > #'guix-emacs-load-package-descriptors)) > > The file "guix-emacs.el" is located in the same directory. So the > purpose of setting EMACSLOADPATH seems to be to allow using `require' to > load that file. This doesn't seem right to me, they could just as well > extend the load-path inside "site-lisp.el", or load their additional > init file using `load'. > > To deal with the incomplete EMACSLOADPATH, as set in the shell > environment, they use a wrapper script named "emacs" and located on PATH: > > #!/gnu/store/4y5m9lb8k3qkb1y9m02sw9w9a6hacd16-bash-minimal-5.1.8/bin/bash > export XDG_DATA_DIRS="/gnu/store/h6qdfd4sjdg28jq16600hcjky0cfw9gx-shared-mime-info-1.15/share:/gnu/store/bnsf9il448hl5xjavbhq3rcx355svz2v-glib-2.70.2/share:/gnu/store/7njbpmsgwmx59xn2r6q097iy2wwscb44-gtk+-3.24.30/share:/gnu/store/w0ssipd06il3kvyvqihpmw4lwbhwwfq3-emacs-28.1/share${XDG_DATA_DIRS:+:}$XDG_DATA_DIRS" > export GTK_PATH="/gnu/store/7njbpmsgwmx59xn2r6q097iy2wwscb44-gtk+-3.24.30/lib/gtk-3.0${GTK_PATH:+:}$GTK_PATH" > export PATH="$PATH${PATH:+:}/gnu/store/0c1yfbxyv877mlgychfgvmk5ha2jqh52-gzip-1.10/bin:/gnu/store/8fpk2cja3f07xls48jfnpgrzrljpqivr-coreutils-8.32/bin" > export EMACSLOADPATH="$EMACSLOADPATH${EMACSLOADPATH:+:}/gnu/store/w0ssipd06il3kvyvqihpmw4lwbhwwfq3-emacs-28.1/share/emacs/28.1/lisp" > exec -a "$0" "/gnu/store/w0ssipd06il3kvyvqihpmw4lwbhwwfq3-emacs-28.1/bin/.emacs-28.1-real" "$@" > > I am under the impression that they should stop setting EMACSLOADPATH > and should either invent their own variable to replace that or load > "guix-emacs.el" using simpler means as I suggested above. I tend to agree. I don't understand why they "invade" EMACSLOADPATH: that is supposed to be left to the users. > > Emacs has special support for running from the build tree, but in your > > case it somehow doesn't realize that. > > As a side-note, the wrapper script that I previously used looked like > this: > > #!/bin/sh > export EMACSLOADPATH="\ > /home/jonas/.guix-home/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp:\ > /home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/lisp" > exec -a "$0" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" > > The build tree is at "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs"; I think the value I > set above is correct (correct me if I am wrong), so it seems that when > running from the build tree EMACSLOADPATH has to be unset; explicitly > doubling down on the defaults doesn't work. I also tried with an empty > element. Your EMACSLOADPATH is not entirely correct, I think: it doesn't include the subdirectories of /home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/lisp. All in all, when you run Emacs either from the source tree, or from the place where it was configured to be installed, there should be no need to set EMACSLOADPATH, and doing so without being VERY careful could indeed get you in trouble. From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Jonas Bernoulli Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 14:51:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.16647222259461 (code B ref 58073); Sun, 02 Oct 2022 14:51:01 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Oct 2022 14:50:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47799 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of0IS-0002SX-Ns for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 10:50:25 -0400 Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([212.243.197.30]:39946) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of0IQ-0002SK-PW for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 10:50:23 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D0AB165FF; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 16:50:20 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bernoul.li; h= content-type:content-type:mime-version:message-id:date:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:subject:from:from:received :received; s=sel2011a; t=1664722219; bh=8uNCNLTcLSsWFwe/3Qado3xr 4W9gFDS52JhYBACDbRg=; b=bdhVqGjZhlxqwjPwjxtFxXCd/z1aZixnM3NIGDp8 io9x38du8VNE/4lO3qcZiP+3O54wekwWjyPRNYs3hMAfnOI7MUKrBum+OJNomJl3 d0sQR0bREJwvNB8AaiCh4FTwzAmOJxTalhDye21WD/mfx0SNE7tADscrvStDpeU3 QXQ= X-Virus-Scanned: by Hostpark/NetZone Mailprotection at hostpark.net Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail0.hostpark.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10224) with ESMTP id L9i27SM8Ibrw; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 16:50:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E09E7165A6; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 16:50:19 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli In-Reply-To: <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 16:50:19 +0200 Message-ID: <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> I am under the impression that they should stop setting EMACSLOADPATH >> and should either invent their own variable to replace that or load >> "guix-emacs.el" using simpler means as I suggested above. > > I tend to agree. I don't understand why they "invade" EMACSLOADPATH: > that is supposed to be left to the users. > >> > Emacs has special support for running from the build tree, but in your >> > case it somehow doesn't realize that. >> >> As a side-note, the wrapper script that I previously used looked like >> this: >> >> #!/bin/sh >> export EMACSLOADPATH="\ >> /home/jonas/.guix-home/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp:\ >> /home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/lisp" >> exec -a "$0" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" >> >> The build tree is at "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs"; I think the value I >> set above is correct (correct me if I am wrong), so it seems that when >> running from the build tree EMACSLOADPATH has to be unset; explicitly >> doubling down on the defaults doesn't work. I also tried with an empty >> element. > > Your EMACSLOADPATH is not entirely correct, I think: it doesn't > include the subdirectories of /home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/lisp. > > All in all, when you run Emacs either from the source tree, or from > the place where it was configured to be installed, there should be no > need to set EMACSLOADPATH, and doing so without being VERY careful > could indeed get you in trouble. It probably will be a while until I submit a patch for Guix (am very new to the distro). Meanwhile I'll keep using a wrapper script. In case someone else runs into the same problem until I get around to it, here is what I currently use: #!/bin/sh unset EMACSLOADPATH exec -a "emacs" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" One problem with that approach is that the wrapper cannot be named "emacs". If it is named "emacs", then that somehow trips up Emacs and it loads all the preloaded files explicitly during startup (so it appears that it cannot find the pdumper file in this case). Eli, this isn't terribly important, but I was wondering if there is something you could do so the name of the wrapper does not matter? There might be other legitimate uses of a wrapper around the binary from the build directory, other than "I currently have not other choice because of what my distro does". From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 14:56:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Jonas Bernoulli Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.16647225049964 (code B ref 58073); Sun, 02 Oct 2022 14:56:01 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Oct 2022 14:55:04 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47811 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of0Mx-0002ae-QH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 10:55:04 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:34798) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of0Mu-0002a2-KS for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 10:55:02 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:58456) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1of0Mo-0001Rb-Sr; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 10:54:55 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=tF81FoEK9h3MUJXZzlHzmdhjzenBQyW6CdVRgC61uoI=; b=WelcyAm/LKl2 Jz5wEeTN8FrjLAknsgJ3zPGNCXoRif8Es14yrKPcpR3W108xERP2KgfpdALl4GBvlMQyFrlTR0Xf+ bG7Sv+elIvNltAnCzTqQiZwLCPUtFidGhPVslcznw72D3E412QRG53IyKJBky+ddeWJR90+KP8dPY /2RX9+I57UpZjHUAy0S1UTvUbaJajxKyLySw7FJlfL4BlACuRzGVvafiEn9oCl3yYJzCqVVdO94M5 n91N2Xb9rh5ia0jE6UpvkWtvBGYi1HSODNS0Cgt7vOvZU5A1fWIxcCXi/75bTv/mrZMpHUg3j3ylj TUxD70T4bqxIY3kusUgy7A==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=2803 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1of0Mo-0004UK-BP; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 10:54:54 -0400 Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 17:54:43 +0300 Message-Id: <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> (message from Jonas Bernoulli on Sun, 02 Oct 2022 16:50:19 +0200) References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jonas Bernoulli > Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 16:50:19 +0200 > > #!/bin/sh > unset EMACSLOADPATH > exec -a "emacs" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" > > One problem with that approach is that the wrapper cannot be named > "emacs". If it is named "emacs", then that somehow trips up Emacs > and it loads all the preloaded files explicitly during startup (so > it appears that it cannot find the pdumper file in this case). > > Eli, this isn't terribly important, but I was wondering if there is > something you could do so the name of the wrapper does not matter? > There might be other legitimate uses of a wrapper around the binary > from the build directory, other than "I currently have not other > choice because of what my distro does". One thing I can suggest is to use the --dump-file=FILE command-line option inside the script to direct Emacs to its .pdmp file. If you don't do that, Emacs tries to intuit it using the value of argv[0] it receives from the OS, and I guess your naming somehow trips that? From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Jonas Bernoulli Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 20:57:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.166474416722872 (code B ref 58073); Sun, 02 Oct 2022 20:57:02 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Oct 2022 20:56:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48199 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of60M-0005wq-SJ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 16:56:07 -0400 Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([212.243.197.30]:39950) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of60G-0005wM-Sh for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 16:56:04 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0660165A6; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 22:55:58 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bernoul.li; h= content-type:content-type:mime-version:message-id:date:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:subject:from:from:received :received; s=sel2011a; t=1664744158; bh=ReXOWp5s1hMMpPJqnLtEqp0q SRo1LfU99NbEof+9WSA=; b=O7h7d7ai9jJ2N+r/SCkbPvW5AP01dnV30FAynUve mpOwEefeK+65OGoAa+PKXSYLwc9V9so0d6gV2MjuBAoKFswDDuXgWz5gJBSaDizz 3r26BMMx5zTB13OPbjNICDZeNX0DmSOEPiGzv/19OuJeaWGLhgqhPJPCkWt70IB7 Cmk= X-Virus-Scanned: by Hostpark/NetZone Mailprotection at hostpark.net Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail0.hostpark.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10224) with ESMTP id mo1gQe88rhKb; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 22:55:58 +0200 (CEST) Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C4A9B16595; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 22:55:58 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli In-Reply-To: <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:55:58 +0200 Message-ID: <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> >> One problem with that approach is that the wrapper cannot be named >> "emacs". > > One thing I can suggest is to use the --dump-file=FILE command-line > option inside the script to direct Emacs to its .pdmp file. If you > don't do that, Emacs tries to intuit it using the value of argv[0] it > receives from the OS, and I guess your naming somehow trips that? Thanks for the hint, that might come in handy. However, I think I made a mistake when testing earlier; it now works when the wrapper is named "emacs", despite not using --dump-file=FILE. Please close, and sorry for the noise. Cheers, Jonas From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.505 (Entity 5.505) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: Jonas Bernoulli Subject: bug#58073: closed (Re: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr) Message-ID: References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 58073 X-Gnu-PR-Package: emacs Reply-To: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:16:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1664748962-6544-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1664748962-6544-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr which was filed against the emacs package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 58073@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 58073: https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D58073 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1664748962-6544-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 58073-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Oct 2022 22:15:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48262 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of7Eo-0001gK-Gx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 18:15:21 -0400 Received: from mail-oa1-f42.google.com ([209.85.160.42]:43783) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1of7Em-0001fX-Le for 58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 18:15:04 -0400 Received: by mail-oa1-f42.google.com with SMTP id 586e51a60fabf-1324e7a1284so2525666fac.10 for <58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 15:15:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; 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Sun, 02 Oct 2022 15:14:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 00:14:58 +0200 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Hashcash: 1:20:221002:58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org::Ja66cxgNh5kNFgP8:pL2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2022 00:14:58 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr To: Jonas Bernoulli , Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 58073-done Cc: 58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Jonas Bernoulli writes: > Please close, Done. ------------=_1664748962-6544-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 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Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:20 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:15:18 +0200 Message-ID: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: none client-ip=212.243.197.30; envelope-from=jonas@bernoul.li; helo=mail.hostpark.net X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) I usually run emacs without installing it, via a symlink, which is placed on PATH and which points at the executable in the checkout. Due to reasons that aren't important here, I recently had to replace the symlink with a wrapper script, and that resulted in these messages being send to stderr. Loading loadup.el (source)... Dump mode: nil Using load-path (...) Loading emacs-lisp/debug-early... ... Finding pointers to doc strings...done Running the executable directly also results in these messages. I then changed my wrapper script to use an intermediate symlink, with the resulted that the messages were not being shown for a while again, but today I updated emacs again and now the messages are always shown. Using a symlink no longer suppresses them. Are this messages shown intentionally? Is it already possible to suppress them? If not, could something be added to allow suppressing them? (I prefer to run the uninstalled executable, because that allows me to jump to a definition and then immediately view its history.) Thanks, Jonas ------------=_1664748962-6544-1-- From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 02:31:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Jonas Bernoulli Cc: 58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org id=D58073.166476422815576 (code D ref 58073); Mon, 03 Oct 2022 02:31:02 +0000 Received: (at 58073-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Oct 2022 02:30:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48492 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofBDw-000439-4J for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:30:28 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43872) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofBDs-00042c-Ta for 58073-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:30:26 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:48412) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ofBDm-0001op-Tn; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:30:18 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=EMxo5ABRpEVjdnB5iaPRQ0X+uZYmIgD1GTzJf8OBwTw=; b=RhQjoS2xELc0 1lQULu1e9Ov5lh+RV0LCzgWr36Aj/VOiGLZQcdeE5OyYGaj2C37oVlOrLNgYTiO39yvMvnyQONWOG lGsY60Ui8Sg4NRY1/Ify7ZuJXEmbsF+oOGzpqxs7kDnHHMDOGhy6v68w5bSW82I3kLg8YBJtCZ/94 iBSoNora54GTWVD0GnzSi2O/00HRylHqpt98hkuznSv3zTIldEF3t4eLUspxAYjxKloR01TzLrccN l9hA921tAnUd7HmZaxUzOGzGD0c8EOsp8xkfm6JAcaxUiec2mRiWw+FeppCy40nurF8KKQDAKhqGv 3gzQ2tJmCVLLUtMfLuNrOw==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1654 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ofBDl-0005Ms-TM; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:30:18 -0400 Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 05:30:10 +0300 Message-Id: <83czb9zljh.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> (message from Jonas Bernoulli on Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:55:58 +0200) References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jonas Bernoulli > Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2022 22:55:58 +0200 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > >> > >> One problem with that approach is that the wrapper cannot be named > >> "emacs". > > > > One thing I can suggest is to use the --dump-file=FILE command-line > > option inside the script to direct Emacs to its .pdmp file. If you > > don't do that, Emacs tries to intuit it using the value of argv[0] it > > receives from the OS, and I guess your naming somehow trips that? > > Thanks for the hint, that might come in handy. However, I think I made > a mistake when testing earlier; it now works when the wrapper is named > "emacs", despite not using --dump-file=FILE. > > Please close, and sorry for the noise. Done. From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Jonas Bernoulli Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 16:04:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.16648130358612 (code B ref 58073); Mon, 03 Oct 2022 16:04:01 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Oct 2022 16:03:55 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51584 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofNv9-0002Ep-8F for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 12:03:55 -0400 Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([212.243.197.30]:57564) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofNv7-0002Ef-Gm for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 12:03:54 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30AE316550; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 18:03:51 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bernoul.li; h= content-type:content-type:mime-version:message-id:date:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:subject:from:from:received :received; s=sel2011a; t=1664813031; bh=LNyalaKSJMANBEU+rLb43sTc TTQe7MTx514xebMVljY=; b=tJfWbj0+Gpy2lAtF2QO48TgLk20jUQBiJjcINu3L G9HqK4Dp8Q0tZ5DgAX043mkSaTj9bJOp/FU9f6xsCpwnF0akqc+Zyd1A0HpyC46f s+BN2c6CiX9/et2lqNUKA7LHFGlKTZ7Q+SRkLVPvjg06R3ztctjZSoysdHRt/Im0 0qA= X-Virus-Scanned: by Hostpark/NetZone Mailprotection at hostpark.net Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail1.hostpark.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10224) with ESMTP id o8ChIZvevr_I; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 18:03:51 +0200 (CEST) Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 009F0162BF; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 18:03:50 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli In-Reply-To: <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 18:03:50 +0200 Message-ID: <877d1grj15.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Jonas Bernoulli writes: > Eli Zaretskii writes: >>> >>> One problem with that approach is that the wrapper cannot be named >>> "emacs". >> >> One thing I can suggest is to use the --dump-file=FILE command-line >> option inside the script to direct Emacs to its .pdmp file. If you >> don't do that, Emacs tries to intuit it using the value of argv[0] it >> receives from the OS, and I guess your naming somehow trips that? > > Thanks for the hint, that might come in handy. However, I think I made > a mistake when testing earlier; it now works when the wrapper is named > "emacs", despite not using --dump-file=FILE. For the record, I figured out why it "works now but didn't work before". cat #!/bin/sh unset EMACSLOADPATH exec -a "emacs" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" *appears* to work as intended (by me), but in actuality it uses the libraries from where the package is installed, *not* from the source repository. I didn't inspect closely enough before to notice this. Also, the name of the wrapper script does not actually matter. (Use of --dump-file doesn't help.) Of course that doesn't work if Emacs hasn't actually been installed. For completeness sake I should mention that I have once more confirmed that using a symlink works (the libraries from the repo are used), but an alias does not work (the files from the installation are used). > Please close, and sorry for the noise. No need to reopen, as far as I am concerned, but I thought it was worth mentioning this here. From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 17:27:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Jonas Bernoulli Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.166481799816583 (code B ref 58073); Mon, 03 Oct 2022 17:27:02 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Oct 2022 17:26:38 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51668 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofPDB-0004JP-Jw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 13:26:37 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:58782) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofPDA-0004JD-IT for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 13:26:36 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:34988) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ofPD3-0001rl-Nw; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 13:26:31 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=U5khge1MLUZztaGC+eJplSBUtNkD6b1iwY/Q8aDoi4E=; b=N1HQnuoVj1hS r8SYsC6wIhwrpkNzhdjoYl+sbLIsj2e3yOscbMoKn8YALhQUkP2rCiVbK0w517KGp/5Qf8YKtMptU 10KeZD2Pb/v0llcBfvhV/8s9Wib2grNO6EQZzf3YC/XV6dpc3kswKKe7Z7ykiDenqmFoDToe6B7gJ uyE7DllTwLNC9/w5IcRTE3Tu4cEzl+PTYS6NS/U4ntXs7DKy/AeYyUHyjn5o9DkqVGpV6Kn6dV1n/ k4IZ6irZvn3rj3ccdfL45fsNi60jbscTRJUOV/GSy/xEO9NGnvqbms0gHHVG5lwc0z8hjCeE5p1B1 l9EeC+JINqIVC/KM2aG30Q==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4764 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ofPCs-000588-G7; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 13:26:29 -0400 Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 20:26:12 +0300 Message-Id: <83o7usyg23.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <877d1grj15.fsf@bernoul.li> (message from Jonas Bernoulli on Mon, 03 Oct 2022 18:03:50 +0200) References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> <877d1grj15.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jonas Bernoulli > Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 18:03:50 +0200 > > cat > #!/bin/sh > unset EMACSLOADPATH > exec -a "emacs" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" > > *appears* to work as intended (by me), but in actuality it uses the > libraries from where the package is installed, *not* from the source > repository. I didn't inspect closely enough before to notice this. > Also, the name of the wrapper script does not actually matter. (Use > of --dump-file doesn't help.) Sorry, I don't understand: you installed Emacs _and_ invoke it from the source tree? Why would you do that? > Of course that doesn't work if Emacs hasn't actually been installed. > > For completeness sake I should mention that I have once more confirmed > that using a symlink works (the libraries from the repo are used), but > an alias does not work (the files from the installation are used). > > > Please close, and sorry for the noise. > > No need to reopen, as far as I am concerned, but I thought it was > worth mentioning this here. Now I'm confused: is the problem solved or isn't it? From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Jonas Bernoulli Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 18:52:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.1664823073612 (code B ref 58073); Mon, 03 Oct 2022 18:52:01 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Oct 2022 18:51:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51714 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofQX2-00009n-Kl for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 14:51:12 -0400 Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([212.243.197.30]:39976) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofQWz-00009d-R0 for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 14:51:11 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B1CF165FF; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 20:51:07 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bernoul.li; h= content-type:content-type:mime-version:message-id:date:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:subject:from:from:received :received; s=sel2011a; t=1664823067; bh=5Z8nkOTKYoQSh5lT8Z/yj42B A4WZi906s6COFW39Bn8=; b=Tkt2dYedBcRlHoN6//paSTfQWq/2yH7t4zTeJ8zj 8S+7FpyLuJ62vjqVoSzzly7TBDHFo5slNzDWrWl+tX/21CqcX3px7qAOed1y4Jfs tNqDkr8uUxt3FZg8JkdA640euz0+TEGKC24vZ/4xWrMhINdkX+jNiDDL0YudJvAk dAE= X-Virus-Scanned: by Hostpark/NetZone Mailprotection at hostpark.net Received: from mail.hostpark.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail0.hostpark.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10224) with ESMTP id nVj9is_lFCQ1; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 20:51:07 +0200 (CEST) Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.hostpark.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 55BA116586; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 20:51:07 +0200 (CEST) From: Jonas Bernoulli In-Reply-To: <83o7usyg23.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> <877d1grj15.fsf@bernoul.li> <83o7usyg23.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 20:51:05 +0200 Message-ID: <874jwkvizq.fsf@bernoul.li> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Jonas Bernoulli >> Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 18:03:50 +0200 >> >> cat >> #!/bin/sh >> unset EMACSLOADPATH >> exec -a "emacs" "/home/jonas/src/emacs/emacs/src/emacs" "$@" >> >> *appears* to work as intended (by me), but in actuality it uses the >> libraries from where the package is installed, *not* from the source >> repository. I didn't inspect closely enough before to notice this. >> Also, the name of the wrapper script does not actually matter. (Use >> of --dump-file doesn't help.) > > Sorry, I don't understand: you installed Emacs _and_ invoke it from > the source tree? Why would you do that? It's more complicated like that but let's say: if I hack on an Emacs package, then I use Emacs from source, since I might hack to look at the git history of an Emacs function I use in package; but if what I do has nothing to do with Emacs, then I use the installed Emacs. >> Of course that doesn't work if Emacs hasn't actually been installed. >> >> For completeness sake I should mention that I have once more confirmed >> that using a symlink works (the libraries from the repo are used), but >> an alias does not work (the files from the installation are used). >> >> > Please close, and sorry for the noise. >> >> No need to reopen, as far as I am concerned, but I thought it was >> worth mentioning this here. > > Now I'm confused: is the problem solved or isn't it? I no longer need to use a wrapper to unset EMACSLOADPATH, because I now unset that variable in a file that is being sourced not only by my login shell but also by my display manager. I can now launch emacs from a program launcher that does not inherit the environment from a shell but from the display manager. (I had to switch display managers to accomplish that. Previously I used Gdm3 but that has fully embraced systemd and wayland by now and does not source any of the files (such as ~/.xsession) that could traditionally be used to set variable for all of an X11 session. So after the switch to another display manager, I can now use a plain old symlink again, and that works perfectly; the elisp libraries from the repository are being used, when I launch the emacs binary that is located inside emacs.git through a symlink. Before I switched away from Gdm3, I had to use a wrapper script, but as we found out that does not actually work. For some reason that ends up using the elisp libraries from where "make install" put them. Or if that has never been run, then emacs fails because it cannot find the libraries where it (IMO falsely) expects to find them. The same happens when using a shell alias. The question now is whether *you* consider this a bug worth fixing. I would say it is, but I won't insist on it. I hope that is a bit clearer now. From unknown Sat Jun 14 18:41:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#58073: 29.0.50; Uninstalled emacs sends startup messages to stderr Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 19:03:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58073 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Jonas Bernoulli Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 58073-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58073.16648237291750 (code B ref 58073); Mon, 03 Oct 2022 19:03:01 +0000 Received: (at 58073) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Oct 2022 19:02:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51731 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofQhc-0000SA-Oy for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 15:02:09 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:36100) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ofQha-0000Rf-RN for 58073@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 15:02:07 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:37166) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ofQhU-0007yq-Sv; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 15:02:00 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=t1GmvraBaH9uNK8uM/CCOF5dejMwsBsdU4p5wwIjRn8=; b=A63L3rlXEQy/ /dpkvPmnsmaTu+h/RzBncWsqa1w6Os+DKm92ngyMem2TTGRJ1ibQaQWSsyubxuUZ58zkG4L32kWsD g1/DzS3aL99B5ubsQdsp73okoBJOYfKWDA8CZdeZj7NDXBfNdW/e0Alj4nO6WqyinH/frRNAlu0tK QagrJNrWE4VzxVo9rVlOC9V/jvUa/howmj8/TSe9v8jBDAqjHjN7Wg14PKLjSG885QhnbCJB3ASEE em629OMAI8pI8aIpHFWpvzmU1qc4rsa3d0JgSlUoPdX981xoDNjNcg/TFr1yPZNwuZZBFo9yM0u1r US/iAFbKaYhEJlDK8CiYlQ==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=2746 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ofQhP-0007mM-4z; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 15:02:00 -0400 Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 22:01:48 +0300 Message-Id: <8335c4ybmr.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <874jwkvizq.fsf@bernoul.li> (message from Jonas Bernoulli on Mon, 03 Oct 2022 20:51:05 +0200) References: <87pmfjmqnt.fsf@bernoul.li> <83tu4vl9wr.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtanmhn6.fsf@bernoul.li> <83h70ulgbp.fsf@gnu.org> <877d1img9g.fsf@bernoul.li> <83mtae1djg.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwmlzc1.fsf@bernoul.li> <877d1grj15.fsf@bernoul.li> <83o7usyg23.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwkvizq.fsf@bernoul.li> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Jonas Bernoulli > Cc: 58073@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2022 20:51:05 +0200 > > Before I switched away from Gdm3, I had to use a wrapper script, but as > we found out that does not actually work. For some reason that ends up > using the elisp libraries from where "make install" put them. Or if > that has never been run, then emacs fails because it cannot find the > libraries where it (IMO falsely) expects to find them. The same happens > when using a shell alias. > > The question now is whether *you* consider this a bug worth fixing. > I would say it is, but I won't insist on it. It may or may not be a bug; it could be a feature. When Emacs starts up it needs to decide where to find the pdumper file and where to find the *.eln files. It does that by looking at the directory where its executable lives, if it can determine that via argv[0]. But symlinks could trick that, and if you invoke Emacs through wrapper scripts or aliases, that could make the above impossible, because there are no valid leading directories in argv[0]. In that case, the startup code uses Plan B: it goes by its configured installation location. And since you have the same Emacs both installed and uninstalled, you get what you see. Or something like that: to see what really happens, you need to step with a debugger through the code of the load_pdump function, see where it finds the pdumper file, and where it decides to look for *.eln (by constructing the name in emacs_executable, whose leading directory is then used in dump_do_dump_relocation under 'case RELOC_NATIVE_COMP_UNIT').