From unknown Mon Jun 23 04:15:38 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#57237: b2sum does not support '-a' options found at https://www.blake2.net/ Resent-From: "Robert E. Novak" Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-coreutils@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2022 03:41:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 57237 X-GNU-PR-Package: coreutils X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 57237@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-coreutils@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.166062124932498 (code B ref -1); Tue, 16 Aug 2022 03:41:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Aug 2022 03:40:49 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44466 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oNnRh-0008S5-9g for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 15 Aug 2022 23:40:49 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:48684) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oNn3c-0007qC-NN for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 15 Aug 2022 23:16:00 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56538) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oNn3c-0008HN-GD for bug-coreutils@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Aug 2022 23:15:56 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-x102f.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::102f]:54980) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oNn3a-000131-MR for bug-coreutils@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Aug 2022 23:15:56 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-x102f.google.com with SMTP id gp7so8605965pjb.4 for ; Mon, 15 Aug 2022 20:15:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:subject:from:to:content-language :user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id:from:to:cc; bh=3eFM9VCEk/hANRS37Egn0wUnqqbKLG5g6qGJqVp5VpQ=; b=o4ggyffBYs4mMMZ5yNt7hMlGlJeWl2XINQCLh+u89X4F5DzEwHzGgZE6RsN3dSPzXW 6oo9h1blSxUz8vxkfgNHecRD3DG/VwCZwyZwyGpCUTrzQtyBvwDpT0l5C3lF9UMlpTNT OCW4urHLBGSOWuqZZGSnXwNqFUzXuchYZqywxNLg1VjDbUDRkt1W1q+BP+tbWHT/cFDz zRCFbFsGQiyWunK4u4/Pb5P63+D07oE/OJJAb4BknCsM7atzeMH8GSHWT4AjrZYNx+n5 oT7UIZDGx8UTVYcyUBSa7apT2DFmnJQu7/Gmli5YGevPikw1r+CNb+LtJeXx8ecwqlDI 0SqA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:subject:from:to:content-language :user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id:x-gm-message-state:from:to :cc; bh=3eFM9VCEk/hANRS37Egn0wUnqqbKLG5g6qGJqVp5VpQ=; b=WKayB2rNU5TzlBzK1kvymWkYug/WSMLc1QQfkwoyS8ejw5R1vNSvzKvbUUhmnBm87V a0WmHvz6voXzkqa35bWP/dwAu51N7LU10yi0SV8tnUQHZ4lwszYUthl80N28AcUzek0R f9eCOo9OTzJn+ZRF9aZgdi01Y/Bk3pYA3QUV+OJJrVENjdEJsFovpEnQxlTYRy7evcz8 u7Knrw+M01uMzXez95zTwYtoRJcC5HtzIoO4TxNad+C+na5968yPjX4//KObGGcWbSs6 JUqwhEX71UTeE2EgL9alPWVv8Vqxs5R0Vzy32ee8viteDGn1nibK57+59bEXSYl9UoCW 62mA== X-Gm-Message-State: ACgBeo2srhWYjmpvWK0wB0qv6ZdnVdecweKOWZ5P4JFwmPjM0fjp38o0 pxSOtgW3xR/JonI4PYTat624U2GT/6tgOQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA6agR7QZlwIdJyo4/cs0BlwehgMBpT7ITbjXTmlOgaJJ9GqtHKdqsKNwITa52Zv8w711kfokqbi0Q== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:ab10:b0:170:9454:e05d with SMTP id ik16-20020a170902ab1000b001709454e05dmr20149700plb.14.1660619752470; Mon, 15 Aug 2022 20:15:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.23] (c-73-151-196-254.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [73.151.196.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n14-20020a170902d2ce00b0016c2cdea409sm7758892plc.280.2022.08.15.20.15.51 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 15 Aug 2022 20:15:52 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2022 20:15:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.11.0 Content-Language: en-US From: "Robert E. Novak" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::102f; envelope-from=sailnfool@gmail.com; helo=mail-pj1-x102f.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 15 Aug 2022 23:40:48 -0400 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) as a result, the Gnu version does not support blake2s (for smaller digests) and blakes2bp for higher performance on multicore systems. Yes, I know about Blake3, but there are many reasons to support older hash algorithms. The real problem is that you have co-opted the b2sum binary so that the testing required to find out if is system's b2sum application is the open source b2sum from https://www.blake2.net/ or the Gnu coreutils.  I am hopeful that a similar problem is not introduced with a coreutils version of b3sum?  Will you implement the C language single thread version (lower performance) or the parallel merkle tree rust implementation? Since you introduce incompatible differences in the implementation, the least that you could do is to rename the Gnu Coreutils b2sum to gnub2sum so that applications that require different command line semantics do NOT Have to go through machinations to find all installed versions of b2sum on a system in order to select the correct invocation semantics.  Just my $0.02 worth, but I am trying to rationalize the world of cryptographic hash algorithms.  I have two blogs that reference this on linkedin ( * & ** ) so that you can understand part of the reason why this will become more important over time. I realize that Gnu has a long tradition of implementing the Gnu version of commands and that in many cases the Gnu versions have become the "de facto" standards.  However this does not happen if you don't support the semantics of the commands that you are replacing. I have been using Unix/Linux since 1974 (Arpanet node #6 at Urbana, Illinois) and I would never have made the transition to Linux if there were less semantic consistency over time. If indeed you had implemented a superset of the Blake2 semantics, there would be no cause for concern. * https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/canonical-cryptographic-hash-encoding-robert-e-novak/?trackingId=gjy%2FJwsjnJaviUN2ZYtuqw%3D%3D This is a preliminary version and I hope to release a second version after further development. ** https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/thoughts-pragmatic-one-time-pads-encryption-robert-e-novak/?trackingId=3AUdLAGWSsDMYYuCINZuVA%3D%3D From unknown Mon Jun 23 04:15:38 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#57237: b2sum does not support '-a' options found at https://www.blake2.net/ Resent-From: =?UTF-8?Q?P=C3=A1draig?= Brady Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-coreutils@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2022 12:45:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 57237 X-GNU-PR-Package: coreutils X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: "Robert E. 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[95.44.90.175]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id i6-20020a05600c290600b003a5fcae64d4sm5048480wmd.29.2022.08.16.05.44.09 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 16 Aug 2022 05:44:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <2f444c37-7922-fa9b-6677-7bad29e24242@draigBrady.com> Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2022 13:44:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:98.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/98.0 Content-Language: en-US References: From: =?UTF-8?Q?P=C3=A1draig?= Brady In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) On 16/08/2022 04:15, Robert E. Novak wrote: > as a result, the Gnu version does not support blake2s (for smaller > digests) and blakes2bp for higher performance on multicore systems. > > Yes, I know about Blake3, but there are many reasons to support older > hash algorithms. > > The real problem is that you have co-opted the b2sum binary so that the > testing required to find out if is system's b2sum application is the > open source b2sum from https://www.blake2.net/ or the Gnu coreutils.  I > am hopeful that a similar problem is not introduced with a coreutils > version of b3sum?  Will you implement the C language single thread > version (lower performance) or the parallel merkle tree rust implementation? > > Since you introduce incompatible differences in the implementation, the > least that you could do is to rename the Gnu Coreutils b2sum to gnub2sum > so that applications that require different command line semantics do > NOT Have to go through machinations to find all installed versions of > b2sum on a system in order to select the correct invocation semantics. > Just my $0.02 worth, but I am trying to rationalize the world of > cryptographic hash algorithms.  I have two blogs that reference this on > linkedin ( * & ** ) so that you can understand part of the reason why > this will become more important over time. > > I realize that Gnu has a long tradition of implementing the Gnu version > of commands and that in many cases the Gnu versions have become the "de > facto" standards.  However this does not happen if you don't support the > semantics of the commands that you are replacing. > > I have been using Unix/Linux since 1974 (Arpanet node #6 at Urbana, > Illinois) and I would never have made the transition to Linux if there > were less semantic consistency over time. > > If indeed you had implemented a superset of the Blake2 semantics, there > would be no cause for concern. > > * > https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/canonical-cryptographic-hash-encoding-robert-e-novak/?trackingId=gjy%2FJwsjnJaviUN2ZYtuqw%3D%3D > > This is a preliminary version and I hope to release a second version > after further development. > > ** > https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/thoughts-pragmatic-one-time-pads-encryption-robert-e-novak/?trackingId=3AUdLAGWSsDMYYuCINZuVA%3D%3D Discussion on the initial GNU coreutils implementation, including dropping of the -a interface was discussed at: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/coreutils/2016-10/msg00007.html https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/coreutils/2016-11/msg00000.html We broached keeping coreutils simpler using just blake2b with blake2 folks, and there was general agreement. So essentially there were design negotiations in the threads above to present the interface appropriate to most users in the GNU coreutils b2sum implementation, which would become the standard variant available. Which systems are installing the reference version? I presume this is an infrequent issue? I would think the onus on the above systems would be to install the reference version under a different name. Note the GNU coreutils digest tools were refactored recently around a single `cksum -a ...` tool, and there will be no new separate digest specific tools in future (like b3sum etc.). thanks, Pádraig