From unknown Fri Jun 20 07:14:34 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#56582 <56582@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#56582 <56582@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: Installer does not detect or allow detection of other bootable partitions Reply-To: bug#56582 <56582@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2025 14:14:34 +0000 retitle 56582 Installer does not detect or allow detection of other bootabl= e partitions reassign 56582 guix submitter 56582 Peter severity 56582 normal thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jul 15 16:27:48 2022 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jul 2022 20:27:48 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42267 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCRud-0006Q1-Va for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jul 2022 16:27:48 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:33012) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCReQ-0005yr-Sg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jul 2022 16:11:05 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55412) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oCReQ-00073t-7s for bug-guix@gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jul 2022 16:11:02 -0400 Received: from mail-lf1-x136.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::136]:38819) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oCReO-0005SE-KP for bug-guix@gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jul 2022 16:11:01 -0400 Received: by mail-lf1-x136.google.com with SMTP id u13so9574710lfn.5 for ; Fri, 15 Jul 2022 13:11:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=f1kZ2JPCtoiJ+j4nfEIj+3XqVe2oQLMaOaE8uW8vxk0=; b=lsuPsm0efBO6/sY2XgCLCnQUL1tHvTnAl33s/B8KM/KXNDX4ieMFjeckQuLqvL99Ia h0d3kISWYLJl+flXuiBk3jsdtlX7RlfIgOxiG/lprPhGF1GVEwHFXSPH0vVswKcLH/CB dYu/2vqoHG4/Ux4av+ox2ehy5ee1AUeWOuSj8eTXAet88Pd/vJZY0zIG/6MU3ETlhjhq SpH4QWs06nqkQEZusnPbQvaG7cH3QH2dkv3cDqUSTj2dSoZXzNyUfxHumywqbXrJEUzJ lagtpjjOKQlZrM3EXM9DEhVTj+GsHNPXTZIql1beWyW4lk4sI3m2odwbydCKOFdETnHy 3YaA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=f1kZ2JPCtoiJ+j4nfEIj+3XqVe2oQLMaOaE8uW8vxk0=; b=cNo9sMNAaldearo8ytMuudVR0yBE94KvjOdvkWeYPiuTbax1dMl/VJXA/7RxCkEyY+ Xf54PqOUCSqiq/YVzRfryksGQ1IBHTFyItMD26ttP4LK0yWBmG84uMW1PSvzjiKjLoni 2CBTEmJKusOv3iVOLI2aJxt1f1IYQ9Dm52T86E4OSNkMVcHXYnOTgibtXXUbKg+Oefti Oe0SbrOop0ocgXRSnljAnaEg97OeOBUiJcZ6Fg+9Y2aB4YhH8QUnMNsWdrZEEj01BpfX i1S0sNlVJdauCV/6UrLaMbgzy64FqivZ09JLWQEC87UgPtxxvTNKQL9pqujdnhjWm5Dz O9HQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora91pLaLFNnY1ct2UZ14YfghXdGbnrcSQR+R/P8JmuMWmUCHA9x4 7WiX/fsKBqqLATtQGazVQhUBMTvHzFItROf0foUi1ijq X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1unqCFgLqzuOaC3Uaz9XpFtU/QHtixt+HHnuGwx3GP7MkkVHkz37yK+gxEfuE+fQRc21BofVsRjMoIGKu+ruFc= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:3ba1:b0:48a:231a:205b with SMTP id g33-20020a0565123ba100b0048a231a205bmr2691422lfv.74.1657915857947; Fri, 15 Jul 2022 13:10:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Peter Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2022 16:10:46 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Installer does not detect or allow detection of other bootable partitions To: bug-guix@gnu.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c7d1e205e3dd9d99" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::136; envelope-from=sunspark@gmail.com; helo=mail-lf1-x136.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 15 Jul 2022 16:27:45 -0400 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) --000000000000c7d1e205e3dd9d99 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi, This is a particularly AWFUL user experience bug. Installing GUIX to a partition only lists GUIX in the grub boot menu afterward despite the existence of other bootable OSes on the drive. Ok fine thinks I, I will just need to manually run grub's mkconfig to force re-detection. But this command does not exist in GUIX. Installing grub did not create grub2-mkconfig. Installing osprober wasn't helpful. I did not see documentation on how to make GUIX detect and add other operating systems to the boot menu from userland. After much time wasted, I needed to download another distro, install it so it would repair the boot menu, and then be able to boot into my main partition. Recommendation: Installer needs to detect and add to the menu the other OSes. Documentation needs to show how to do it manually via a different method if GUIX does not include grub2-mkconfig otherwise it needs to warn upfront that this distro should not be used on multi-boot PCs. Best, Peter --000000000000c7d1e205e3dd9d99 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

This is a partic= ularly AWFUL user experience bug. Installing GUIX to a partition only lists= GUIX in the grub boot menu afterward despite the existence of other bootab= le OSes on the drive.

Ok fine thinks I, I will just need to ma= nually run grub's mkconfig to force re-detection. But this command does= not exist in GUIX. Installing grub did not create grub2-mkconfig. Installi= ng osprober wasn't helpful.

I did not see documentation o= n how to make GUIX detect and add other operating systems to the boot menu = from userland. After much time wasted, I needed to download another distro,= install it so it would repair the boot menu, and then be able to boot into= my main partition.

Recommendation:
Install= er needs to detect and add to the menu the other OSes.
Docume= ntation needs to show how to do it manually via a different method if GUIX = does not include grub2-mkconfig otherwise it needs to warn upfront that thi= s distro should not be used on multi-boot PCs.

Best,
= Peter

--000000000000c7d1e205e3dd9d99-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 16 01:48:11 2022 Received: (at 56582) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2022 05:48:12 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42764 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCaex-0007Fk-Fy for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 01:48:11 -0400 Received: from lepiller.eu ([89.234.186.109]:44262) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCaeq-0007F4-ED for 56582@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 01:48:09 -0400 Received: from lepiller.eu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lepiller.eu (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 6c50de1e; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 05:48:01 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed; d=lepiller.eu; h=date:from :to:subject:in-reply-to:references:message-id:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=dkim; bh=X9SbCed3PCUc odpLAds6bRDLkzHTsVpsz/WTDGK487c=; b=dvOp8AtyrTw6t0qgHrBv9S+q5qQ+ ad2C3Lj8snhJ30YG3NA7BRwl0hHOaIBX6RezvRD0HgxhRjvxeCIUs2We03rKeebt yEbkCPYlerWNiDX1Q00xoqG/WkTDt8K6K7VyoiWqQi+/2YT9ixC87I114GM3XjEU 0uJurwcJjvhvpHE+idkKseFwRAWA1eua1EcHfMKXc7IEE156tKj7GfShw/IhPeIG +fkqwToyCHTxlqOTMmuD8Ocd7ZG6sZlz8HgO6BtSykD2311Uk7RwCYeLPtTfJIq/ 00GjYwNJHrO0M73XVht+J1/ufGNcjZ5tWlmPqc9lebCy5W6WuW0MmBJuRA== Received: by lepiller.eu (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 0dbc999c (TLSv1.3:AEAD-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO); Sat, 16 Jul 2022 05:48:01 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2022 07:46:18 +0200 From: Julien Lepiller To: Peter , 56582@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: =?US-ASCII?Q?Re=3A_bug=2356582=3A_Installer_does_not_detect_or_?= =?US-ASCII?Q?allow_detection_of_other_bootable_partitions?= User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <93F87F3F-F349-4152-829D-328F4FB078D4@lepiller.eu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=----9LJLFT9UNE81DIKK41AXE0IJEMQALZ Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 56582 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) ------9LJLFT9UNE81DIKK41AXE0IJEMQALZ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Peter, This is indeed not nice=2E Guix does not provide a useful package that wou= ld reinstall boot configuratipn because boot configuration is managed toget= her with the rest of the system configuration=2E You need to update your /etc/config=2Escm to declare more entries, and rec= onfigure=2E Here are the relevant chapters in the manual: https://guix=2Egnu=2Eorg/manual/devel/en/html_node/Bootloader-Configuratio= n=2Ehtml (in particular, see menu-entry) https://guix=2Egnu=2Eorg/manual/devel/en/html_node/Invoking-guix-system=2E= html (see reconfigure) Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the insta= ller to detect other OSs=2E HTH! Le 15 juillet 2022 22:10:46 GMT+02:00, Peter a =C3= =A9crit=C2=A0: >Hi, > >This is a particularly AWFUL user experience bug=2E Installing GUIX to a >partition only lists GUIX in the grub boot menu afterward despite the >existence of other bootable OSes on the drive=2E > >Ok fine thinks I, I will just need to manually run grub's mkconfig to for= ce >re-detection=2E But this command does not exist in GUIX=2E Installing gru= b did >not create grub2-mkconfig=2E Installing osprober wasn't helpful=2E > >I did not see documentation on how to make GUIX detect and add other >operating systems to the boot menu from userland=2E After much time waste= d, I >needed to download another distro, install it so it would repair the boot >menu, and then be able to boot into my main partition=2E > >Recommendation: >Installer needs to detect and add to the menu the other OSes=2E >Documentation needs to show how to do it manually via a different method = if >GUIX does not include grub2-mkconfig otherwise it needs to warn upfront >that this distro should not be used on multi-boot PCs=2E > >Best, >Peter ------9LJLFT9UNE81DIKK41AXE0IJEMQALZ Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Peter,

This is indeed not nice=2E Guix d= oes not provide a useful package that would reinstall boot configuratipn be= cause boot configuration is managed together with the rest of the system co= nfiguration=2E

You need to update your /etc/config=2Escm to declare = more entries, and reconfigure=2E Here are the relevant chapters in the manu= al:

https://guix=2Egnu=2Eorg/manual/devel/en/htm= l_node/Bootloader-Configuration=2Ehtml (in particular, see menu-entry)<= br>
https://guix=2Egnu=2Eorg/manual/devel/en/html_node/I= nvoking-guix-system=2Ehtml (see reconfigure)

Of course this is o= nly a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the installer to detect other= OSs=2E

HTH!

Le 15 juillet 2022 22= :10:46 GMT+02:00, Peter <sunspark@gmail=2Ecom> a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0:
Hi,

This is a parti= cularly AWFUL user experience bug=2E Installing GUIX to a partition only li= sts GUIX in the grub boot menu afterward despite the existence of other boo= table OSes on the drive=2E

Ok fine thinks I, I will just need = to manually run grub's mkconfig to force re-detection=2E But this command d= oes not exist in GUIX=2E Installing grub did not create grub2-mkconfig=2E I= nstalling osprober wasn't helpful=2E

I did not see documentat= ion on how to make GUIX detect and add other operating systems to the boot = menu from userland=2E After much time wasted, I needed to download another = distro, install it so it would repair the boot menu, and then be able to bo= ot into my main partition=2E

Recommendation:
Installer needs to detect and add to the menu the other OSes=2E
=
Documentation needs to show how to do it manually via a different meth= od if GUIX does not include grub2-mkconfig otherwise it needs to warn upfro= nt that this distro should not be used on multi-boot PCs=2E

Be= st,
Peter

------9LJLFT9UNE81DIKK41AXE0IJEMQALZ-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 16 05:59:35 2022 Received: (at 56582) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2022 09:59:35 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42957 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCeaF-0005U6-BM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 05:59:35 -0400 Received: from jpoiret.xyz ([206.189.101.64]:51928) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCeaD-0005Tx-6F for 56582@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 05:59:33 -0400 Received: from authenticated-user (jpoiret.xyz [206.189.101.64]) by jpoiret.xyz (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 8D0DB1851E0; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 09:59:30 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jpoiret.xyz; s=dkim; t=1657965570; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=Hx8w6zc/zbBjSZwf2IpOpKuiFGVTOjF9MIVrQQ4obCc=; b=f0fhJh0QBECIlL4SIoRT1o8HfqZeU1MrSqCigM96e1HiV20iOcq/LdjXIQAP485KWgFWS+ oYQq0pWX/oG36izovQELO1gIlXblPvR2kQGNQA1yBP/Bwv6N790xTVlvi8tFQolqkTJfo+ c+0WFkgfGu4oWUYbxgwgnU8aspas3UQbTAuGmVCjiwc2DfEqqjdtCK5T+y0m0uCMrY5oY0 mgk16PZDbCQkn5ip9i/Nf+BgSYfNfN5gJ8vwajFO8V2EeJEB6DHi292w+3X4IRvExLu2g3 bSB6/yQWgnQ+gNuLKrxFLmrKcM4cuvgpVnIsAYyt1/6LFElVt2OYwXIskU+ydQ== From: Josselin Poiret To: Julien Lepiller , Peter , 56582@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#56582: Installer does not detect or allow detection of other bootable partitions In-Reply-To: <93F87F3F-F349-4152-829D-328F4FB078D4@lepiller.eu> References: <93F87F3F-F349-4152-829D-328F4FB078D4@lepiller.eu> Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2022 11:59:29 +0200 Message-ID: <877d4dz8ce.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Authentication-Results: jpoiret.xyz; auth=pass smtp.auth=jpoiret@jpoiret.xyz smtp.mailfrom=dev@jpoiret.xyz X-Spamd-Bar: / X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hello both of you, Julien Lepiller writes: > Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the installer to detect other OSs. Just adding that we don't have any Guix bootloader en [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 2.0 PDS_OTHER_BAD_TLD Untrustworthy TLDs [URI: jpoiret.xyz (xyz)] 0.0 FROM_SUSPICIOUS_NTLD From abused NTLD -0.0 T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE No description available. X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 56582 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hello both of you, Julien Lepiller writes: > Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the installer to detect other OSs. Just adding that we don't have any Guix bootloader en [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 2.0 PDS_OTHER_BAD_TLD Untrustworthy TLDs [URI: jpoiret.xyz (xyz)] 0.0 FROM_SUSPICIOUS_NTLD From abused NTLD 1.0 BULK_RE_SUSP_NTLD Precedence bulk and RE: from a suspicious TLD -0.0 T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE No description available. -1.0 MAILING_LIST_MULTI Multiple indicators imply a widely-seen list manager Hello both of you, Julien Lepiller writes: > Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the installer to detect other OSs. Just adding that we don't have any Guix bootloader entry field to chainload into another bootloader, needed for some non-free system :) this would need to be added as well. I personally don't mind, and use my UEFI boot menu instead if I want to boot into said non-free OS. Best, -- Josselin Poiret From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 16 06:32:09 2022 Received: (at 56582) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2022 10:32:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42990 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCf5k-0000GB-T0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 06:32:09 -0400 Received: from lepiller.eu ([89.234.186.109]:44296) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCf5g-0000G0-Eo for 56582@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 06:32:06 -0400 Received: from lepiller.eu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lepiller.eu (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id ee0356af; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 10:32:01 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed; d=lepiller.eu; h=date:from :to:subject:in-reply-to:references:message-id:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=dkim; bh=/t5QPjY62zEz JmqiR83IVUxj7YwchJLq/MHHB3cQBSc=; b=CwJZJXl5FXdRvjBtfOA0nkYnd5Jk IPylJnQAaLRYZKh5YS2vz1FTSrlKUO9DefVoh2drnxxwPpSuwsG0h+iVvF8LN5xV UDx36mkXSer5RRbl1/vpxVBg26NKBhCkosb0z7+IUMhDhZ1jCalx9d6HaDGPRJjT rMt2bt/hwC7WxAkA+qhLqURFaby26hWJ0XjIbeeq3AOLn6pHPePqVb0MTDGMLuiS saC7ZnxFlzHwfWFkwZAyem1s4rWB4WPDti6PQ4cAX4AW5MuzxDNZKY3+aK5rQ26B 2KWMzsYc8j5gTLzTTWhzdpL5NRnw1PejpFA4f89EVoicqKGN9e7pidk5tA== Received: by lepiller.eu (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id aba02ede (TLSv1.3:AEAD-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO); Sat, 16 Jul 2022 10:32:01 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2022 12:31:18 +0200 From: Julien Lepiller To: Josselin Poiret , Peter , 56582@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: =?US-ASCII?Q?Re=3A_bug=2356582=3A_Installer_does_not_detect_or_?= =?US-ASCII?Q?allow_detection_of_other_bootable_partitions?= User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <877d4dz8ce.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> References: <93F87F3F-F349-4152-829D-328F4FB078D4@lepiller.eu> <877d4dz8ce.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=----OHL1DY38E9G0X4D0BGW6LF52U3V9U2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: If anything, you also need to chainload to boot on haiku, which is free software. So no reason not to implement it. Le 16 juillet 2022 11:59:29 GMT+02:00, Josselin Poiret a écrit : >Hello both of you, > >Julien Lepiller writes: >> Of course this is only a workaround I'm prop [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 2.0 PDS_OTHER_BAD_TLD Untrustworthy TLDs [URI: jpoiret.xyz (xyz)] 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message -0.0 T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE No description available. X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 56582 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) ------OHL1DY38E9G0X4D0BGW6LF52U3V9U2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If anything, you also need to chainload to boot on haiku, which is free sof= tware=2E So no reason not to implement it=2E Le 16 juillet 2022 11:59:29 GMT+02:00, Josselin Poiret = a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0: >Hello both of you, > >Julien Lepiller writes: >> Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the in= staller to detect other OSs=2E >Just adding that we don't have any Guix bootloader entry field to >chainload into another bootloader, needed for some non-free system :) >this would need to be added as well=2E > >I personally don't mind, and use my UEFI boot menu instead if I want to >boot into said non-free OS=2E > >Best, >--=20 >Josselin Poiret ------OHL1DY38E9G0X4D0BGW6LF52U3V9U2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If anything, you also need to chainload to boot on= haiku, which is free software=2E So no reason not to implement it=2E
Le 16 juillet 2022 11:59:29 GMT+02:00, Josseli= n Poiret <dev@jpoiret=2Exyz> a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0:
Hello both of you,

Julien Lepill=
er <julien@lepiller=2Eeu> writes:
Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we shou=
ld fix the installer to detect other OSs=2E
Just adding tha=
t we don't have any Guix bootloader entry field to
chainload into anothe=
r bootloader, needed for some non-free system :)
this would need to be a=
dded as well=2E

I personally don't mind, and use my UEFI boot menu i=
nstead if I want to
boot into said non-free OS=2E

Best,
-- 
Josselin Poiret
------OHL1DY38E9G0X4D0BGW6LF52U3V9U2-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 16 16:44:38 2022 Received: (at 56582) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2022 20:44:38 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46202 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCoeT-0006eW-Hi for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 16:44:38 -0400 Received: from mail-lj1-f170.google.com ([209.85.208.170]:36448) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oCoeQ-0006eH-46 for 56582@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 16:44:36 -0400 Received: by mail-lj1-f170.google.com with SMTP id o12so9365817ljc.3 for <56582@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 13:44:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=e6zBglruexKzuDydDbzqE6gfjhh/80z2nyGVDuVpRDc=; b=EQrddTobH4RBKRlszYax3+mOXjR5XaRwvTPuDfUN3K0FY0My4/GzJLNgoXRh6Qyohj 7WnyyaQOa6B8/J1lu8ionI6gYPBFMoiJijyl2DYUp4/of0Jd778bOJTGrM1v6Ef7Ij/+ UZx2s3ggF0fKTQvsOTB/vosTZ7P0p4MPHo2ZVcFN6WJzO1wiAnAxSi9rf4nBgMm9ywDr N6R6H7O8NQh9tLDgx438Wg12RiB9c6ghJq8Zn+oWxrK/meWm+ant2Or/Ngyl2rHSpqXQ FRCZKz444qjDwallbMRyKAGUCEmyscLnfaonZn2atql1S8IZUMYH8TBnujOBuqhPObZV yqPQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=e6zBglruexKzuDydDbzqE6gfjhh/80z2nyGVDuVpRDc=; b=VfWkaa+k2r7S2QEP1ZcvpVWdJd2gClwRtmgHB7F+ot5JGCdtbnlr7HL168taWtg80h QlwdzpdN0PLt8ju5xp3HqcOFKURP/28wqO3l9MQjHbkD0lLE4lmOMXng+7B/dtwD6kL6 3Bt41cmEhMvuUtFg5jUpewFtxbHSrgSYEvTkQ8fM6DkL++N8ltLLgw1MjXbzZrEpeOpD 5FYEE1BV9fa15jo1O4o4qbEug/BWO01XxBvJgTU8sgNxUDgt/DBgZmJhYT4ZLmdo1Vbs xzgCkFYqPXXKN3gqa/Q5zStXfw0a+Sb8VB7yPPRadJNW7wwg+koO7ML1TTF91ueAhnt+ OYLg== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora8aS70h7i9ld3TYgQiiqK7R+Gcu24dFLcPp83eb0hH8jobaorRm Sms1Eh9RbyMuyl0FdcGZKYiFfTt/sO+BGz3A6Yg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1vBCiC6GDUh+J8eNafMafBrkiJIeqgwWhN/k9fLvINKLvDyJ3GFSiUx+0W10xMdRCsjcokw/V/eL0a5xp8VB8w= X-Received: by 2002:a05:651c:54a:b0:25d:6c19:448 with SMTP id q10-20020a05651c054a00b0025d6c190448mr10149439ljp.239.1658004267899; Sat, 16 Jul 2022 13:44:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <93F87F3F-F349-4152-829D-328F4FB078D4@lepiller.eu> <877d4dz8ce.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> In-Reply-To: From: Peter Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2022 16:44:17 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#56582: Installer does not detect or allow detection of other bootable partitions To: Julien Lepiller Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006ca1c305e3f2333d" X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi, My concern is that what is written in the manual for bootloader-config and invoking-guix-system does not clearly communicate what needs to be done for those who have no exposure to either Guix or Sche [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 2.0 PDS_OTHER_BAD_TLD Untrustworthy TLDs [URI: jpoiret.xyz (xyz)] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (sunspark[at]gmail.com) -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2 RBL: Average reputation (+2) [209.85.208.170 listed in wl.mailspike.net] -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [209.85.208.170 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message -0.0 T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE No description available. X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 56582 Cc: Josselin Poiret , 56582@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) --0000000000006ca1c305e3f2333d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, My concern is that what is written in the manual for bootloader-config and invoking-guix-system does not clearly communicate what needs to be done for those who have no exposure to either Guix or Scheme. I did actually view those entries at first, but it seemed theoretical at first glance and I kept moving because I was looking for an expected binary. To expand on this, Guix installs GRUB. This is undeniable, and this is where the problem begins.. over many years users are accustomed to GRUB working in a certain way with specific tools.. when they encounter a grub installation without grub-mkconfig, etc. they are at a loss, because it's a binary they expected to find and it's just not present. I think an argument could be made here that this behaviour breaks user space because it's established software, but changed to function differently as opposed to being something entirely new. It's like wearing your shoes on the opposite foot. You can do it, but it feels wrong. The way Debian and other distros manage Grub is via mkconfig, and the boot menu presented is very similar to Guix's, the only difference is that there's an extra row entry in the grub menu for the Windows bootloader to be launched. Personally, I dislike Grub because I feel it complicates things. I would love to use only UEFI and use only the bios boot menu to switch, but for whatever reason in a single internal drive system, this isn't easily done. Giving an example, awhile back, I tried installing a distro to an external usb drive.. it worked.. but the problem is that it installed grub to the internal drive.. and if you removed the usb drive from the pc, things would break because now a device it was expecting to see wasn't there. A workaround suggested was to disconnect the internal drive, do the setup, this way Grub would be on the external drive, then reconnect the internal drive and then I guess use the bios uefi menu to switch between, a lot of bother for a tightly sealed unit. The way MS's bootloader works is nice because one of the menu options it has is to pick a physical device so you can actually boot from a valid bootable USB flash drive device and it launches that device directly. Maybe the solution is just to create an EFI partition at the front of all drives including external as Apple does and then it doesn't matter what bootloader you use or do not use, because you could always just use the UEFI menu to point to a device. Not using a bootloader would reduce complexity of maintenance.. if MS's bootloader is there, people can use it if they want to point to the device, and if it is not there, then they can use the uefi bios menu. In theory. MBR folks would still need to continue using a bootloader of course. Best, Peter On Sat, Jul 16, 2022 at 6:32 AM Julien Lepiller wrote: > If anything, you also need to chainload to boot on haiku, which is free > software. So no reason not to implement it. > > Le 16 juillet 2022 11:59:29 GMT+02:00, Josselin Poiret > a =C3=A9crit : >> >> Hello both of you, >> >> Julien Lepiller writes: >> >>> Of course this is only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the in= staller to detect other OSs. >>> >> Just adding that we don't have any Guix bootloader entry field to >> chainload into another bootloader, needed for some non-free system :) >> this would need to be added as well. >> >> I personally don't mind, and use my UEFI boot menu instead if I want to >> boot into said non-free OS. >> >> Best, >> -- >> Josselin Poiret >> >> --0000000000006ca1c305e3f2333d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

My concern is that what = is written in the manual for bootloader-config and invoking-guix-system doe= s not clearly communicate what needs to be done for those who have no expos= ure to either Guix or Scheme. I did actually view those entries at first, b= ut it seemed theoretical at first glance and I kept moving because I was lo= oking for an expected binary.

To expand on this, Guix in= stalls GRUB. This is undeniable, and this is where the problem begins.. ove= r many years users are accustomed to GRUB working in a certain way with spe= cific tools.. when they encounter a grub installation without grub-mkconfig= , etc. they are at a loss, because it's a binary they expected to find = and it's just not present. I think an argument could be made here that = this behaviour breaks user space because it's established software, but= changed to function differently as opposed to being something entirely new= . It's like wearing your shoes on the opposite foot. You can do it, but= it feels wrong.

The way Debian and other distros manage = Grub is via mkconfig, and the boot menu presented is very similar to Guix&#= 39;s, the only difference is that there's an extra row entry in the gru= b menu for the Windows bootloader to be launched.

<= div>Personally, I dislike Grub because I feel it complicates things. I woul= d love to use only UEFI and use only the bios boot menu to switch, but for = whatever reason in a single internal drive system, this isn't easily do= ne. Giving an example, awhile back, I tried installing a distro to an exter= nal usb drive.. it worked.. but the problem is that it installed grub to th= e internal drive.. and if you removed the usb drive from the pc, things wou= ld break because now a device it was expecting to see wasn't there. A w= orkaround suggested was to disconnect the internal drive, do the setup, thi= s way Grub would be on the external drive, then reconnect the internal driv= e and then I guess use the bios uefi menu to switch between, a lot of bothe= r for a tightly sealed unit.

The way MS's bootloader= works is nice because one of the menu options it has is to pick a physical= device so you can actually boot from a valid bootable USB flash drive devi= ce and it launches that device directly.

Maybe the soluti= on is just to create an EFI partition at the front of all drives including = external as Apple does and then it doesn't matter what bootloader you u= se or do not use, because you could always just use the UEFI menu to point = to a device. Not using a bootloader would reduce complexity of maintenance.= . if MS's bootloader is there, people can use it if they want to point = to the device, and if it is not there, then they can use the uefi bios menu= . In theory.

MBR folks would still need to continue using= a bootloader of course.

Best,
Peter=


On Sat, Jul 16, 2022 at 6:32 AM Julien Lepiller &l= t;julien@lepiller.eu> wrote:
If anything,= you also need to chainload to boot on haiku, which is free software. So no= reason not to implement it.

Le 16 juille= t 2022 11:59:29 GMT+02:00, Josselin Poiret <dev@jpoiret.xyz> a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0: 
Hello both of you,

Julien Lepiller <julien@lepiller.eu> wri=
tes:
Of course this is=
 only a workaround I'm proposing, we should fix the installer to detect=
 other OSs.
Just adding that we don't have any Guix boo=
tloader entry field to
chainload into another bootloader, needed for som=
e non-free system :)
this would need to be added as well.

I perso=
nally don't mind, and use my UEFI boot menu instead if I want to
boo=
t into said non-free OS.

Best,
-- 
Josselin Poiret
--0000000000006ca1c305e3f2333d-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 21 12:01:56 2022 Received: (at 56582) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Jul 2022 16:01:56 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38752 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oEYce-0000z9-4T for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 21 Jul 2022 12:01:56 -0400 Received: from jpoiret.xyz ([206.189.101.64]:60300) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oEYcb-0000yx-2c for 56582@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 21 Jul 2022 12:01:55 -0400 Received: from authenticated-user (jpoiret.xyz [206.189.101.64]) by jpoiret.xyz (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 02A76184F6B; Thu, 21 Jul 2022 16:01:50 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jpoiret.xyz; s=dkim; t=1658419311; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=a039dNmOMRpFJ/ZXBHWz3s9JVQMHIYq7G8Vj2M8meyc=; b=ZqFQalL6u8A1Lckahy84AAM1DU+AFshWQmRrSesjbGCFaTLRZvR5dltoyvTVUKhFfzG42t U8Mz0OwczUJdSz7OxJWvaJVoAYKf6LwBVd26WgigCj+EQPSrdk39lwMVMMAkQrWomlIQ1b k7LWhY2hubV+iO6u1L5GmOwXwBPVVwi7qHRaKirr+f38zXjg1+8H0bQDkrfugBzvuuj3H3 TSJGeMgkfvY6waP/wZLJWcAw3IGStN9R4a7ZpAYb+uwswsvXd5ZtZr5nFUInJKghh9lxId FP9FR6JAffLHUizTV8HQWVOcHc0uyI1sE80Tf3gUg59KLH5os5cVay0VuuGaWA== From: Josselin Poiret To: Peter , Julien Lepiller Subject: Re: bug#56582: Installer does not detect or allow detection of other bootable partitions In-Reply-To: References: <93F87F3F-F349-4152-829D-328F4FB078D4@lepiller.eu> <877d4dz8ce.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2022 18:01:50 +0200 Message-ID: <874jzazc7l.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Authentication-Results: jpoiret.xyz; auth=pass smtp.auth=jpoiret@jpoiret.xyz smtp.mailfrom=dev@jpoiret.xyz X-Spamd-Bar: / X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Peter, Peter writes: > To expand on this, Guix installs GRUB. This is undeniable, and this is > where the problem begins.. over many years users are accustomed to GRUB > working in a cer [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 2.0 PDS_OTHER_BAD_TLD Untrustworthy TLDs [URI: jpoiret.xyz (xyz)] -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 FROM_SUSPICIOUS_NTLD From abused NTLD X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 56582 Cc: 56582@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Peter, Peter writes: > To expand on this, Guix installs GRUB. This is undeniable, and this is > where the problem begins.. over many years users are accustomed to GRUB > working in a cer [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 2.0 PDS_OTHER_BAD_TLD Untrustworthy TLDs [URI: jpoiret.xyz (xyz)] -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 FROM_SUSPICIOUS_NTLD From abused NTLD 1.0 BULK_RE_SUSP_NTLD Precedence bulk and RE: from a suspicious TLD -1.0 MAILING_LIST_MULTI Multiple indicators imply a widely-seen list manager Hi Peter, Peter writes: > To expand on this, Guix installs GRUB. This is undeniable, and this is > where the problem begins.. over many years users are accustomed to GRUB > working in a certain way with specific tools.. when they encounter a grub > installation without grub-mkconfig, etc. they are at a loss, because it's a > binary they expected to find and it's just not present. I think an argument > could be made here that this behaviour breaks user space because it's > established software, but changed to function differently as opposed to > being something entirely new. It's like wearing your shoes on the opposite > foot. You can do it, but it feels wrong. Those tools are unfortunately stateful, like grub-mkconfig using osprober, so wouldn't be a good fit for Guix. You could also argue that the majority of people using GRUB don't even know how to use the grub tools, or what they actually do. I personally think that our GRUB interface is elegant, while a bit incomplete. > The way Debian and other distros manage Grub is via mkconfig, and the boot > menu presented is very similar to Guix's, the only difference is that > there's an extra row entry in the grub menu for the Windows bootloader to > be launched. If we had a way to add menu entries that chainload another bootloader, then that would result in the same exact menu. It shouldn't even be too hard to add. > Personally, I dislike Grub because I feel it complicates things. I would > love to use only UEFI and use only the bios boot menu to switch, but for > whatever reason in a single internal drive system, this isn't easily done. > Giving an example, awhile back, I tried installing a distro to an external > usb drive.. it worked.. but the problem is that it installed grub to the > internal drive.. and if you removed the usb drive from the pc, things would > break because now a device it was expecting to see wasn't there. A > workaround suggested was to disconnect the internal drive, do the setup, > this way Grub would be on the external drive, then reconnect the internal > drive and then I guess use the bios uefi menu to switch between, a lot of > bother for a tightly sealed unit. You can (and should) specify which EFI partition you'd like to install GRUB to. You'd simply need to create a EFI partition on the removable media, and add the --removable option as well so that GRUB is installed in the default boot location (/EFI/BOOT/bootx64.efi) so that booting from the drive actually boots that bootloader. If you want to get rid of GRUB, you can also compile Linux with the EFI stub, so that it can be started as a EFI application directly, and then add a EFI boot entry for it. > The way MS's bootloader works is nice because one of the menu options it > has is to pick a physical device so you can actually boot from a valid > bootable USB flash drive device and it launches that device directly. Your UEFI boot menu should already do that, no need for that in a bootloader IMO. > Maybe the solution is just to create an EFI partition at the front of all > drives including external as Apple does and then it doesn't matter what > bootloader you use or do not use, because you could always just use the > UEFI menu to point to a device. Not using a bootloader would reduce > complexity of maintenance.. if MS's bootloader is there, people can use it > if they want to point to the device, and if it is not there, then they can > use the uefi bios menu. In theory. Without the EFI stub, Linux needs a bootloader to load, and the windows bootloader surely won't support booting Linux. Best, -- Josselin Poiret