From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed May 25 19:12:17 2022 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 May 2022 23:12:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56604 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nu0Ar-00032w-7q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 25 May 2022 19:12:17 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:38768) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nu0Aq-00032o-2N for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 25 May 2022 19:12:16 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52518) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nu0Ap-0001sU-UW for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 May 2022 19:12:15 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-xb30.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::b30]:35601) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nu0Ao-00039F-E7 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 May 2022 19:12:15 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-xb30.google.com with SMTP id v26so292801ybd.2 for ; Wed, 25 May 2022 16:12:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=7QkcxAyYwVeMW5JmNnj3K7lcu8BFWC10VHvKHO31NdY=; b=SM7oKL/PRHfO9l1DOko8fmE4XdluM3xWZfiWWmjXbBJuZ6vhfqAf5lO+XppDEycRxy yBh05YpMKYFx4zvP+HrdbcqWEhmhw3Cpl08Jk0A4iWdnTKbsyQ5WF/gGaY4hKXhar/wl pEwlD7nJFSEdBz+bLYe4dGiUQ6IdWbu9XrA9PTMh+mi9MWa9RcvjQXwY85z8xJFtryNC nosmhCwf0h1Iiv+8sByHZ78QQczSR9bZ/N3dSk1sisyXp2h9MRZ3lIFk4lT543luk6kL KJYTwujcLUwtlumlSb4j+bGrJBZ1x+X2MXUOJ+PFrZeEFG5Uv2WgFKx6Z+XOv+KZmxqn GLaQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=7QkcxAyYwVeMW5JmNnj3K7lcu8BFWC10VHvKHO31NdY=; b=Wzsm4lPx1diAis/nJnQq97Rk52i75OzVMAawnrzMrfkXexRUBIUJd3JZ/+k14/y+iU IovOYCtSuO0XO0cHkkIynm/K/zKBmEu+NZCN3Z41jBc78EH4Qg6mxv6Y4ph6KFjUYWqt 4lAjykcRE7DBIrSgUGzN3vENWumA8wyk+ELT1NRR6VJ2OHNJ/KghQNJWqvWUUoh+Qsor YJWljWyZMdyKq6VkLy+qGgqf1FabUPnRprZ0cTZs+6j6/cJmQYn/Gi4IlvdtuKwFJquG nGbVOfupxgfLNhBWozaXS8oqVeqV9wisJaVHdNKTIxw5uxvad0uwWmtfk8zwyQuLHm+f ISLQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531MJZWdD9UTFnxkzNSOBkjn1KxbkFY9hh4qRiIiUQ4z0Z8kpRKC Ulh8S/VXX9UWaS/mKEGwEluyLj8gWSx+TBthksoOXnJzyys= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzGgosB5cWE4QZjn/C4knTDMgaZPOAYqNgq5qrTEm56NPe3uZlf3KJ+zNWcxAN+ZPN+daqhu9SnCpYJUm8qgqQ= X-Received: by 2002:a25:af4e:0:b0:655:c9a3:affb with SMTP id c14-20020a25af4e000000b00655c9a3affbmr4495807ybj.360.1653520333037; Wed, 25 May 2022 16:12:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Tom Gillespie Date: Wed, 25 May 2022 16:12:02 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Emacs Bug Report Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::b30; envelope-from=tgbugs@gmail.com; helo=mail-yb1-xb30.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) The changes made in 637dde4aba921435f78d0de769ad74c4f3230aa6 make it impossible to use prin1-to-string as the basis for hashing elisp code in a way that is independent of the emacs version. The change completely breaks my orgstrap library across the 28 -> 29 boundary because the checksum computed on <= 28's prin1-to-string and the checksum computed by 29's prin1-to-string no long match in cases where there is a . or a ? in a symbol. As implemented, there is no way to work around the issue, and I suspect that many other users will be surprised and rather upset by this change when they have the misfortune to encounter it. At the very least this change in behavior needs to be configurable so that the old behavior can be retained, preferably this change would be reverted entirely as it does not address the original bug (bug#23130) and is NOT low impact for users that actually use such functionality, whereas the change is completely invisible to those that do not use such functionality. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu May 26 08:03:53 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 May 2022 12:03:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57168 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuCDY-0003th-QI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 08:03:53 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:56536) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuCDT-0003tI-1K for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 08:03:50 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=4xX2dpv8+s6UPt/hnh4ahYHEak0R5gWyXxnsfpmxGEA=; b=YC71xO6PFY6pqMPgeJPfxfvtD0 itria0Kdkdj6Rapnk9DCqiLcqRsXY2bdmsP936MNAxU6+7WF50VwlpKjnSPlWyGnXlxHJfh2dShf0 IcO6b8qUKhfSBVZDV6j3QtmMyGGEMsVpYvGphOuev6rgwb7iIM4JB+evy5iHPxu7UuEY=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nuCDK-0004Gk-Hb; Thu, 26 May 2022 14:03:40 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Tom Gillespie Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: X-Now-Playing: Talking Heads's _The Name Of This Band Is Talking Heads (Disc 2: 1980-1981)_: "Stay Hungry" Date: Thu, 26 May 2022 14:03:36 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Tom Gillespie's message of "Wed, 25 May 2022 16:12:02 -0700") Message-ID: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Tom Gillespie writes: > The changes made in 637dde4aba921435f78d0de769ad74c4f3230aa6 > make it impossible to use prin1-to-string as the basis for hashing elisp > code in a way that is independent of the emacs version. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Tom Gillespie writes: > The changes made in 637dde4aba921435f78d0de769ad74c4f3230aa6 > make it impossible to use prin1-to-string as the basis for hashing elisp > code in a way that is independent of the emacs version. prin1 has never guaranteed that the printed representation would be stable across versions, so if it's worked for you, that's by accident. > At the very least this change in behavior needs to be configurable so that > the old behavior can be retained, preferably this change would be > reverted entirely as it does not address the original bug (bug#23130) and > is NOT low impact for users that actually use such functionality, whereas > the change is completely invisible to those that do not use such functionality. It would be possible to add something to control this details (via the new OVERRIDES parameter), but it doesn't feel like it'd be worth it, because, well, the representation isn't meant to be stable. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu May 26 08:03:53 2022 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 May 2022 12:03:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57170 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuCDZ-0003tj-2G for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 08:03:53 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:56550) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuCDW-0003tN-Oo for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 08:03:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=/6eSAlqFPH6vrH5f6B3OWVo3P7IFKAiFSdc8TDGh3bM=; b=oiMOA5lj5wjHQjdvJhJWXoR0f6 wiYka9WzDy9tkMJiw2RYj3izDmaGL0KkceXgex9qfB02pwPAwZ4JZr+cDg2jOn9ly6a4A0bEhaGUB mh6lG4lX8kTlcAYJuZukmv+k8rIxURnvUBhwLBf2sYGKD1NTCd2D1JZNZ173LWYLO1pk=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nuCDO-0004Gr-HP for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 14:03:44 +0200 Date: Thu, 26 May 2022 14:03:42 +0200 Message-Id: <87y1yobiw1.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #55645 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: tags 55645 + moreinfo quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) tags 55645 + moreinfo quit From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu May 26 11:56:45 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 May 2022 15:56:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59831 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuFqu-0002LD-RR for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 11:56:45 -0400 Received: from mail-yw1-f178.google.com ([209.85.128.178]:46443) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuFqm-0002Ko-4p for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 26 May 2022 11:56:43 -0400 Received: by mail-yw1-f178.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-300beab2b76so19741507b3.13 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 26 May 2022 08:56:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=VqT9L1+Zwtr7k409FTViAInRLIQJ3YcrzD/4NxObUdY=; b=n8yExMxKbU34EFbFm19RicXKlFK9r7RFgsI2/PBy2+S9jz4Qy9m29lQgLgFzVyGcIp SEtrUS8NlJgk/d0/+pJDHYGV+ZMftWWftputAI0EuS8dDR0UzfLxIIrJNcL9VLnXUcS9 BEw67160JWvKx6IB1FCB5fxIVB+nGv/mR2TxsJBUdnlAo08QfkFmWp7s1n33uvOxphx4 RHoAlvWFZEHgBZ2f5BVBTc2MP4riIS9vh9ZeGSX1d7NJjvfdHbKJxpC6a84DIDHf2D62 +T4zJJioPfqrKT16R/FeFRvKeKkcChFrz2zBPDH3YrK1ZbKmOWPDUNbs0/+ADLdR9rHU aiUQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=VqT9L1+Zwtr7k409FTViAInRLIQJ3YcrzD/4NxObUdY=; b=c15A+fNgKHiJa1d0AYdKa0QrZu8IXhbHO8sM1L72GQx5SerwIXitBEy/9aLz2I4eef M5sd+kdp3H0jF4rIVS4at5xEtQzmNydT0AfewfL71VVdtwjkrCpuPqPTvbfH2hsZFt2p PPALpqhYEOwDAc40gvMcJZx1EpHD1FXWNl2jvc7e0TorGOyUp1514VnOaQjTyKvINhTF 5pe2Uke2Sn6Phk3bqtJQQ8l/jkdYuVP2T/GNPgoWvzsn+/SECSSc156mfz3rfY5oKp8p bDdXzec+H0j63jUsdKGzysgn5U5zV0DJ2Q/9LyeBrE+7+9k7GigDMtkuQtZUc8Ov6UYX GKEw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5315QTmdS+BThMPo5TimxmU/ox8+5/MUeVGx2KfenQsAOH9+cpPc zqrYmLhQR6wA+LkGlUfcyz+ssp+GrHVfO9Qw/Pk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwzms9NB2JXIzcjklaxdybqC8loJejv85+syBHNylfowJuTBZZof1/cNo7PouafyYHgS302xyKc5Y0DK7u9gZk= X-Received: by 2002:a81:ed4:0:b0:2f1:c8db:ce23 with SMTP id 203-20020a810ed4000000b002f1c8dbce23mr38123306ywo.95.1653580590387; Thu, 26 May 2022 08:56:30 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Thu, 26 May 2022 08:56:19 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > prin1 has never guaranteed that the printed representation would be > stable across versions, so if it's worked for you, that's by accident. It may not be meant to be stable but this behavior is unchanged since at least emacs-23, and given that xemacs has the same behavior, I'm guessing that this behavior has been stable for nearly 30 years. If prin1 is not stable, is there a print that is expected to be stable? > It would be possible to add something to control this details (via the > new OVERRIDES parameter), but it doesn't feel like it'd be worth it, > because, well, the representation isn't meant to be stable. Whether it is meant to be stable or not it has been stable for at least 30 years. If there is no print variant that does have stability guarantees then I think we do need a dynamic variable that would have the old behavior when it was nil, like those listed in Variables Affecting Output https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/elisp/Output-Variables.html From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 27 06:33:29 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 May 2022 10:33:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32819 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuXHd-00064m-8T for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 27 May 2022 06:33:29 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:38960) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nuXHa-00064X-Pt for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 27 May 2022 06:33:28 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=mNbRchwlEqYdFWPoGxFZHXk8tMKKjP9lDdXle8qrdoA=; b=FsuAyrTIo7rO51TEdHICHEjFG7 oBJ4OqATRZI5wJqDIbjuaQFV+VPdcdi0U7iyDAHskIWgonzzYiAWVau39teue98luafusVwRzdCdw 4Au+OUDewohMkgZ54zYSxrUfid9gybTMiATxt5Yl+X7Cy65DJZ3q47A6RT5XNjoHW1OI=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nuXHS-0006tR-01; Fri, 27 May 2022 12:33:20 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Tom Gillespie Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAGFBMVEWvra3DurvTz86V kZOEe4BmX2c5NT/////DykhKAAAAAWJLR0QHFmGI6wAAAAd0SU1FB+YFGwoON2iYAIYAAAGbSURB VDjLddNLcoMwDABQEZeuDblA8QkcZLruNLBnasQFOuj+R6j8wUPSoJls/KyPsQPQmFfxAdC0JwBV pK79ByJ7PEEUyJYSmwQpmmPouKQmWokIJW6hXQGNxMybGP0ECEupip62VYhp7TPkUOQdRWqfYO0B nVRazBEsvJExGnJvs4+q0DqCsFPD5ZihEIZF2SquPWbowYNDC43sbZ8AFS2IVnI6Y3f4uk4ecUjH 69p63uE7Ag7MfdNUV7+XeusT4LBaUEAtZqh7lQCVlJv6YT7CGAVX/q1nXeA6LWMWmi3YAlpKjIkA 1b4O9fdHGHXEcB+EFgv8dOHD0peT69oQdSk1GxU3W3R3Gbovzb0JTdKlOxzm/YD1dulS/dTJl4zt ZlRKoWUkupfmPLedvKAciy0Z7CujMYvHqvTgzV5Ewsx3lJsMoOT3zuxtmx6DlRvs0nVH2O5hodHh SXcgjBmYMD2G/IqwAEt1qMI4cnR/BKb83V0Y7AgcjrBP/ADpb3CET36MAgpfBTzEP1AnGWelXq27 s97DyboAnsAfc5uzr9+2q1YAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6Y3JlYXRlADIwMjItMDUtMjdUMTA6MTQ6NTUr MDA6MDB6MfV1AAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOm1vZGlmeQAyMDIyLTA1LTI3VDEwOjE0OjU1KzAwOjAwC2xN yQAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: A. G. Cook's _7G (2): Guitar_: "Superstar (Live at Secret Sky)" Date: Fri, 27 May 2022 12:33:16 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Tom Gillespie's message of "Thu, 26 May 2022 08:56:19 -0700") Message-ID: <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Tom Gillespie writes: > If prin1 is not stable, is there a print that is expected to be stable? I don't think so. We tweak the Lisp printers from time to time (for instance, circular objects changed their representation the other day (again)), but admittedly, these changes are usually for more o [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Tom Gillespie writes: > If prin1 is not stable, is there a print that is expected to be stable? I don't think so. We tweak the Lisp printers from time to time (for instance, circular objects changed their representation the other day (again)), but admittedly, these changes are usually for more obscure objects than symbols. > Whether it is meant to be stable or not it has been stable for at least > 30 years. prin1? Stable for 30 years? Nope. (But some objects have had a stable printed representation that long, I'm sure.) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 27 15:19:46 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 May 2022 19:19:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35810 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nufUw-0005t2-4e for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 27 May 2022 15:19:46 -0400 Received: from mail-yw1-f171.google.com ([209.85.128.171]:33391) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nufUt-0005sp-Oz for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 27 May 2022 15:19:44 -0400 Received: by mail-yw1-f171.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-300312ba5e2so57751707b3.0 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 27 May 2022 12:19:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=lP0aK9wJtLGB4Us1gXDUn2nZpjYj4VXHzV5vsqEqU+I=; b=LYaPJtD5PyHPirb9yYVRJGYG50+g8Ra3Mc+aJ5mLsgDoeoBU9r9pTDNqVoT6wCZjPd FR9uMF917KX22Bw5+vZwwJLvf995ff7CjiUE2Ljyfg9N9k/Wt8W4gCxPyStTKXBHBTVv H7Jfe8vt/yZ/igt+saSIgMF1jeeByupk4l3GDTIRZP+Vg0g8BDqMA4uJFKNv11GmZP2Y FamWi/J0GGS0g7a6jmSAsHxNBjl70XknkXdwby/Bp2BNyDFq28kMny3EPSDDxO4xjRaC npYT2pUP2aPz7G8kIM5V4TpV70MVxhy0qXgobmtpmJ6nqA1Rm6sTuGRbdycfMi9+QDAS UaCQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lP0aK9wJtLGB4Us1gXDUn2nZpjYj4VXHzV5vsqEqU+I=; b=m6desaslCN4yIjVonS6GKBEouLt+UNBj/6UVIE1thObzeiUWoggsoe83NS9iMnHx8L gTM3i0VuRBXe7Kugb2fUdQIh3CE8I7VQNxvoQhrnOfKOBAYLz0br5yYJ/QNhW/MFWE0q tKBrHk4/N2L2FznaxvmE26mydWbS2AtYG0LVtyzIjVcaQME+RShHbpYzD1BiJD3LcE2z wgNpJDZ+yAl67Gg2z/hzMKJrjkTD/jbgIb4SrAjnIl5rd23BrO+4znvHURV7iQh2c5kc 6LYUFXN7US9XKa9fJPNXn5Ovr8zOGsJmOWM3rBDqBjx7Bw3A6bliy+P2vQwkww0J8aKr s6Lw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530OJ9Z34c57BDu6X/wM5Ag/mphEbpdvL74m45bP81mDc+MKg7Yg RfWnsdTz+9euuMMORYMDRUs/m2FxcBCgKeKlhlE9ERSL X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxrJ27Y2e6nnFtC/t/lPcDdtEbWvwyAhXXG2zsmLH3seYzlBI6veWw4VUkSp/r78Cx3yd2YPy6NBTTLdjDeDiU= X-Received: by 2002:a81:52d6:0:b0:309:ac63:3c80 with SMTP id g205-20020a8152d6000000b00309ac633c80mr2976308ywb.375.1653679178045; Fri, 27 May 2022 12:19:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Fri, 27 May 2022 12:19:27 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > but admittedly, these changes are usually for more obscure > objects than symbols I was thinking the same. I realize that for many objects where there is no guarantee of homoiconicity the prin1 representation definitely changes all the time. However, I think that symbols fall into a more homoiconic category (namely the category of objects that can appear literally in code). Some time between emacs 18 and xemacs/22 the reader DID change with regard to periods in symbols. In 18 you had to escape the period or the reader throws a syntax error. Thus your point about there being a mismatch between read behavior and prin1 representation is accurate. That being said, I think this is be the first time in the history of emacs that prin1 for symbols has changed, so having a way to preserve the old behavior for things that depend on it would be greatly appreciated. > prin1? Stable for 30 years? Nope. (But some objects have had a stable > printed representation that long, I'm sure.) Er, indeed, I was being overly general, I meant symbols specifically. I went back and checked in emacs-18 and this is what I get: (prin1-to-string '(a b\.c d)) "(a b\\.c d)" (emacs-version) "GNU Emacs 18.59.1 of Sat Jul 31 2021 on localhost (linux)" From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 28 06:40:15 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 May 2022 10:40:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36455 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nutrj-0001rw-8f for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 May 2022 06:40:15 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50338) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nutrf-0001ra-Ba for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 May 2022 06:40:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=EJQ3NkpC26TRGKDJzANo9HVIWIePwZsu+8w+tiJNqnw=; b=hmBhyesn86ceCWtj54QeU0xcwT sahXaruG8pYZIY1oXulHYUgFzRuRxecHLEDmPloHx+vI678UANvG2sLmHwWFqim57Dh8NfGGtcglG kxPO3mpGdEM4w9QjOxlDZ8q7sx8kFpmAfijpPjPCCBxwC5xFCXs9qOw9soVETTGnReZk=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nutrW-0002YB-BJ; Sat, 28 May 2022 12:40:04 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Tom Gillespie Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEXjt9O6bZgnLq2X TGZEJTf////hBHywAAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+YFHAofOUEuNigAAAG7SURBVDjLdZLr dcMgDIXB7gDIMEBLO0BUaYA4Yv+ZqgdxfNKEH20On++VdEVKz6fklPtnT/9P1vscoMRFSgDF/6fk gBCgUqVB0hDiIwOr0NDDIjxoR1Ns/QzYgODDapU2QsKjXq2GCgxk+e2hGMJa/aQA4jHsekgNqxyK ak4iWBVYv31a2fdGBjm4W5UVml4G2FkVsFgkOa1qMdSeSIEoWLzGBKagqnwG5l0hu9Eg+8ADgbJp gJliQAUsLblViq5aNGVzgCacS8yRToAyYUmHwmuI1RDwrvrndiouqtxtHUvvX6b4QD7aBYxuNwcy YnLS5N1qZvUxk0JilcT+FwczRMIKDJdHug3nBgmAy+VhtdIdYMZ8jdqPrHQ8fUXf+RoPa/N2XaGZ V6C13BVYayj05UAdvloA6Ek9ArAUaMzgVhqiXlA8uIGlNTmsbGI2CWlxapGtpWtXJP5XuyVUg8sB wCYxkL2Rq81uYOAcvGpDwwEE2CMqBTXrr5vuY5tASGgHCLDfawxfiCIoPBWzRixkpxoP5gmohGMx N518O4Hj3Ervr8GT1QnAG1CWvpzBntvPayvRuwP0N+ct+AOuNaunVkLiqAAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpj cmVhdGUAMjAyMi0wNS0yOFQxMDozMTo1NyswMDowMN0B8eMAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIw MjItMDUtMjhUMTA6MzE6NTcrMDA6MDCsXElfAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Snapped Ankles's _Forest of Your Problems_: "Forest of Your Problems" Date: Sat, 28 May 2022 12:39:58 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Tom Gillespie's message of "Fri, 27 May 2022 12:19:27 -0700") Message-ID: <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Tom Gillespie writes: > That being said, I think this is be the first time in the history > of emacs that prin1 for symbols has changed, so having a > way to preserve the old behavior for things that depend on it > would b [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Tom Gillespie writes: > That being said, I think this is be the first time in the history > of emacs that prin1 for symbols has changed, so having a > way to preserve the old behavior for things that depend on it > would be greatly appreciated. That's makes sense, but: >> prin1? Stable for 30 years? Nope. (But some objects have had a stable >> printed representation that long, I'm sure.) > > Er, indeed, I was being overly general, I meant symbols specifically. If you're using prin1 as a way to compare stably differences between objects, this only works by accident: You have to be very lucky in which objects you have included in the output so far if you've managed to make this code work over time. We can indeed add something that lets you control how symbols in specific are output by prin1, but I don't really see the utility in general -- because we have changed, and will change, how other objects are output by prin1, and if the objects you're outputting happens to contain these, your algo will break again. So I think this is one of those "don't do that" things, unfortunately. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 28 13:54:44 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 May 2022 17:54:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38864 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nv0eC-00031P-2s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 May 2022 13:54:44 -0400 Received: from mail-yw1-f172.google.com ([209.85.128.172]:42715) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nv0eA-00031D-I2 for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 May 2022 13:54:42 -0400 Received: by mail-yw1-f172.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-2ef5380669cso75263307b3.9 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 28 May 2022 10:54:42 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=GYY8vyhOCZZAKWTF8h20p2i/qxstgi4ljecF2ogeu4E=; b=T0AOeXJvblcmLWPLgCkESxIUqq4V1L0j208bXTipUFNVURfIrrUBXF90CviW01cU33 HYy2cTBIWkbtH3ftZdqjN6cb9xDWbXL5jt32xcHuGudLktA9/psz3OpeageZbjFind// AZzKMqxHwb2pJJM20tPQVg61o7SVMRFA4m9GHO0XqUofA1EvE5tD8+mCQwY2pNKRnU6P DYKzofg1HPRvxvhZKcjSp+ONXFt1E2frCovgkDBnIsDUeGlvtBgxjjXjJ8McTtquJkE3 SkNMUCG1vR0xN+/Rnz1GzpQ5qi91fhTvdmKyop7M4RQT6AcskRTR8fAIA3tf7cPuAv+X Qe2Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=GYY8vyhOCZZAKWTF8h20p2i/qxstgi4ljecF2ogeu4E=; b=O6pmCW9F88jhVOcO9sNouZ+H/AIurp5JNe04QPGinlTilePGJh7Ougw2sc5WcsXlo+ 8ALhe75LB2aT+p8hf2abkuBKHJMxymdSJWxSmJwKMA/NxiZYh4t7I/KHnaxFP4LpLXvN iAX2PmwCO5VuBQ+tuxI5AaABgfggPRzS1/8mapnG5TtYPG8b3w3g8ube7Ak6VNcnDGJ/ iZhH0Aua3W9zVlAlm/rJnw+/seF8LoDN1g98jNCAMDXhK3vLOVtqQSXB1tOZP+tM7g6v yp3rwXfrvkrSsQEqj79AaDb8VxEnl2dlRVBDgvaEx18RRLaUABHdZJFqI4M3nU5yzG2l jhvQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530TjhPfaIRHi1cNb5MoaGqzLo64PFzcyENF8AGc2PvABmd59HK4 CuM2X2uzXPE47N9uzCJIi3J3pDhubXb15GBIPV0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx4dFptHept/icvz77+Rzf/DpKksYfHsTaNExkg5mqneCP2FDd20bMKbgQUGMeW+hSjZwHYKsoRzE1STHaADV0= X-Received: by 2002:a05:690c:97:b0:2f1:9582:6685 with SMTP id be23-20020a05690c009700b002f195826685mr52074663ywb.395.1653760476768; Sat, 28 May 2022 10:54:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Sat, 28 May 2022 10:54:25 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > If you're using prin1 as a way to compare stably differences between > objects, this only works by accident: You have to be very lucky in which > objects you have included in the output so far if you've managed to make > this code work over time. Ah I think I know what is missing here. I'm not trying to compare arbitrary elisp objects. I'm explicitly only trying to compare literal emacs lisp source code and that has been extremely easy since at least emacs 24 (iirc it is also the same in 23). The only issue I have encountered was a change in iirc 27 of the default value for print-escape-newlines or something like that. > We can indeed add something that lets you control how symbols in > specific are output by prin1, but I don't really see the utility in > general -- because we have changed, and will change, how other objects > are output by prin1, and if the objects you're outputting happens to > contain these, your algo will break again. These aren't arbitrary elisp objects, they are only objects that appear in quoted elisp source code. There has been exactly one change in that since emacs 24 (and possibly before), and it was a change where there was already a variable to control the behavior. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 28 19:14:39 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 May 2022 23:14:39 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39056 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nv5de-0002MF-DY for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 May 2022 19:14:39 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:59868) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nv5dd-0002M3-8Z for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 May 2022 19:14:29 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:37082) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nv5dY-0006RH-0W; Sat, 28 May 2022 19:14:24 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=EbeU1GyJJsN41/eb9S1z2RFlgy5Tq8pFQoOKiQmhQZc=; b=lXqlHeY0zjye QqaunwDFhkgQ9EM4IWIYgH42i2yhiNkcWlxDGa9YKciJoXhDUZfaB/7AMQ0lCRjJHQEPnJRsssNzI ra4bl4c9tUpoF3ab6ohA3tFVT3b74emI4BFmDteNfAWM1i0q6d7psHugC/IXuDqMpwOFr82G+Bwiq 4yBFxjAQMxhxVTSyVTrahxOBOzG7crO4s9/6o4tBANBQIl01itjTVxZtS/zh+m9L54K4vAkIoQTJD tFEgGh2U6YZzMClN4hDKQ+Pi4FnUp40ZJmXqvVk0wK/0bbaurEtvwLj9DJ6yQknP6oLTFvsXAWIsd 1crIOFhAHcc2ZUyJckuDpg==; Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nv5dP-0006p0-9T; Sat, 28 May 2022 19:14:15 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Tom Gillespie In-Reply-To: (message from Tom Gillespie on Fri, 27 May 2022 12:19:27 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Sat, 28 May 2022 19:14:15 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > I was thinking the same. I realize that for many objects where > there is no guarantee of homoiconicity the prin1 representation > definitely changes all the time. However, I think that symbols > fall into a more homoiconic category (namely the category > of objects that can appear literally in code). I agree. We have no absolute rule against changing the print syntax of symbols, but we see that it this change is likely to cause a real practical disadvantage for some users. We should treat that as a significant problem, and do what it takes to spare users that practical problem. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 29 09:15:52 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 May 2022 13:15:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39641 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nvIlr-0001S7-Im for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 May 2022 09:15:51 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:33332) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nvIlp-0001KE-KG for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 May 2022 09:15:50 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=1hEoMPCOgiE2/Ryo2LzGDbVHeVJ6TQn1lSJCDe7jFiA=; b=Feb8wy7phRzxyBqh6vVTkLqehR aSI22cVM7Kyx1KqeP0WDSxpLKcUvS7ELMKAeqnXbsg4GoIG520GIT2AmVutToLP3Xvc9cKhV9qoAu ih9FWjPQQgfzRe9hQ5U9xaMxawrRu5dUqbXrOtBMcYwwz5CFgolv1b7p/PhkjZeu9w/A=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nvIlg-0004Hf-Qa; Sun, 29 May 2022 15:15:43 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Tom Gillespie Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAD1BMVEV0L1p1PGCOV3rT yM/////+RlXKAAAAAWJLR0QEj2jZUQAAAAd0SU1FB+YFHQw7E9dMBY8AAAGnSURBVDjLbZTbgcQg CEXBaQCcBgQbmEj/ve3FPHR2l6+Yw0VeCRGRqrLW3lw6GTH38AiKaU3VdchgJSoRowf5NIBajIdV IXrFgALGqqYqbyvjA9Dh+IRCDHEt3pyk9xkKvhUuSEC01uZ6eE9XKDyfcAkhWuvFzzdXqPhoWpVR 3N5xAFCd4NDTzKnUaEuB29O4qfeBzB4QuByZMUv119hBUyGUjfqqtx1kN8CSsO8gMlR2E62obQeH izLCpcx3EC50G9cdDNWHYDILRCO5RbhqA+58K/QLpOYS2C8waFmGWMSQatMLjLIUfueXoZr2+GNO cWCn/gf6j2IYIZNvMO85AX8BSz//q8BcsSiuCWgCfyrBDNHpbENm5XYK2gNMuFh3k/4M5QRYY2G3 M+kx+94dwshxSm7hfUPeiXQHZiA+T3mcTe/pccxBRi62ne9nkkaZhbzvEtLKmGAeXld188A+mzjt vY+2bOC1qs4qFsgZIsdz5XQDnE11VL/24HyqyBcf6LYg17704YYG3aA/oMzJuf0GPH8bQPT4jeWy BJkLAMv9SY+2KX4A1oiDSpoAjkYAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6Y3JlYXRlADIwMjItMDUtMjlUMTI6NTk6 MTkrMDA6MDA8IiopAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOm1vZGlmeQAyMDIyLTA1LTI5VDEyOjU5OjE5KzAwOjAw TX+SlQAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: The Smiths's _The Smiths_: "The Hand That Rocks The Cradle" Date: Sun, 29 May 2022 15:15:38 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Tom Gillespie's message of "Sat, 28 May 2022 10:54:25 -0700") Message-ID: <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Tom Gillespie writes: > Ah I think I know what is missing here. I'm not trying to compare arbitrary > elisp objects. I'm explicitly only trying to compare literal emacs lisp source > code and that has been extremely easy s [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Tom Gillespie writes: > Ah I think I know what is missing here. I'm not trying to compare arbitrary > elisp objects. I'm explicitly only trying to compare literal emacs lisp source > code and that has been extremely easy since at least emacs 24 (iirc it is > also the same in 23). The only issue I have encountered was a change in > iirc 27 of the default value for print-escape-newlines or something like that. I'm just not convinced that there's a compelling use case here that would support the added maintenance burden of adding Yet Another Printing Variable here -- you're using prin1 to implement something that prin1 was never meant to support. If you want to see whether some code is "the same", then I think you really have to read the forms in and compare the forms. But perhaps Eli has an opinion; added to the CCs. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 29 11:14:17 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 May 2022 15:14:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41613 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nvKcT-0004RK-Fd for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 May 2022 11:14:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33776) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nvKcP-0004R3-C9 for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 May 2022 11:14:15 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:47428) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nvKcJ-00076v-R1; Sun, 29 May 2022 11:14:07 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=1OO3sgBLd7O4SAa7egiVGEkZU7kqi6m4omIKZjpID7c=; b=EQjDNnMpEHp2 WLwdUeiUj26VsCPeIfv7iV3F8mBjQwarW+8G0bJ31SAedPHpnUy2W9BLQWreEYx1u4kIYa+TEKbIx BRFcaX2RAe7lIeclq7sWnGx8uvjhffAQWa1hcB+u32vBRJTEMjcJwM8k1NoKUnkTqh48cl86MZ1rL 0YDRNvAQP4JQH4KtRqJ/GtpD914wvUaVhzGnqcxsHMbZoxJgH1fdfFt5X6c7tnLcBovZH81zedZsj x46gl9q6T/ZnNTP2ylv6c98iobzZI2xQhwZeKAsLHdO3uuaqDa1saBrnFLj8FsaevwGtXSUyZEVFh OU/y+Lis/wcNZyDh6mORUw==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1747 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nvKcJ-0001e4-Ay; Sun, 29 May 2022 11:14:07 -0400 Date: Sun, 29 May 2022 18:14:06 +0300 Message-Id: <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sun, 29 May 2022 15:15:38 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: tgbugs@gmail.com, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii > Date: Sun, 29 May 2022 15:15:38 +0200 > > Tom Gillespie writes: > > > Ah I think I know what is missing here. I'm not trying to compare arbitrary > > elisp objects. I'm explicitly only trying to compare literal emacs lisp source > > code and that has been extremely easy since at least emacs 24 (iirc it is > > also the same in 23). The only issue I have encountered was a change in > > iirc 27 of the default value for print-escape-newlines or something like that. > > I'm just not convinced that there's a compelling use case here that > would support the added maintenance burden of adding Yet Another > Printing Variable here -- you're using prin1 to implement something that > prin1 was never meant to support. If you want to see whether some code > is "the same", then I think you really have to read the forms in and > compare the forms. > > But perhaps Eli has an opinion; added to the CCs. I think I'd need an example that demonstrates the issue, to make up my mind. Tom, can you describe the issue in more detail, and provide an example or two? Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 29 17:03:29 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 May 2022 21:03:30 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42033 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nvQ4P-0008Rz-Gx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 May 2022 17:03:29 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-f172.google.com ([209.85.219.172]:44578) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nvQ4O-0008Rn-MY for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 May 2022 17:03:29 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-f172.google.com with SMTP id a64so5921314ybg.11 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 29 May 2022 14:03:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=wC3S8v4gidIBBvRFXeomFTlCS69Y09Mhi5FjsxopoF4=; b=MLTG440KIWgHwfTJJCkyNzhGdZmfo5IMRoSVyqzq4TCweRrd7jsl1+lKnlCV+mAkQy k0Yx/Ox8W//9iZv1pdNTgDArLcv2HHQT2I7jLU0uSve32vaqegw4bAO8K0PygCDgU8qm Ki9cvY0K4CvOnlDeZwwfnd6GXEKyGUmNCijhGs7NCWIJIjSt9Zmyz5LGR6ziPl3jyVrV E9ZATWJLNj5RdLeGG1UlApeFFq5zrRjIdWK72tenTfcrXKCCzLGhvZJ2/VotcT3wW6gb lW06whjKcEajh1PVZ2kvmIPU6I4ZpPuEuGqH+i2wSP5X0mhr7tjHAmzL7kZF8EXPSbDZ DAdA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=wC3S8v4gidIBBvRFXeomFTlCS69Y09Mhi5FjsxopoF4=; b=V29WhKUp8k6Obr/VUuC+4D6w8hc2eE9psrEl9fOz/grPEfvK1q6oB6LWQM6w2Bn+hD RB3e5WcjWrRTxcwgzB9uKqg1Q6+A4xBhs0VujC1VwF2LnOQZeQh+WVCyGaaVGUnacSfJ N93ufeWV7nApYec6qS0q5TbC4/jwhJ50fia0anBtHSK9MBMjWRxa50ZZV7tB9TETlcg5 Ovlkgqum0OCo2DGfNWrqKVnhDzNwI35tnWSJhgd4mhsc2UhsrvSzl92jPQarslHkbZ0D WxnetAfgWYVeCxtobGfosNsB1MoSS5GFiDJ8EJ8Hec46YfYZWwe25zH+cTmSQLpAEe6w 97nA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530+68XvvsSrmQlbcjnnSOKHGgq3ne0o4rSTmsIuPv/EdOkG9+a4 mHH/tjNmn9iA8pzcCvTyWz4iqpscw+dtP9/ahwE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwlUMFRqqbrruchFWCvcjkZFQHJTogmyrfVwbj4BvkW2ffZl2Rxf8qBqYfQOo5ZTF98tV/UgY6dVgkCgSarTRU= X-Received: by 2002:a25:af4e:0:b0:655:c9a3:affb with SMTP id c14-20020a25af4e000000b00655c9a3affbmr21374994ybj.360.1653858202812; Sun, 29 May 2022 14:03:22 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> In-Reply-To: <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Sun, 29 May 2022 14:03:11 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Hi Eli, I have included an example below, with some additional context. Best! Tom I'm using my own use case as an example, but I suspect that there are other users out there who may have similar use cases where stability of the printed representation of read code is important. Some examples from a quick search on github that will or could be affected by this (beyond my own). I only searched for cases matching my own involving secure-hash and prin1-to-string, but there are surely other cases that would be affected that I have not imagined. https://github.com/skeeto/elfeed/blob/162d7d545ed41c27967d108c04aa31f5a61c8e16/web/elfeed-web.el#L73-L75 https://github.com/mrmekon/snitch-el/blob/3b3e7f1bf612c4624764d1ec4b1a96e4d2850b05/snitch-timer.el#L164-L181 https://github.com/radian-software/straight.el/blob/af5437f2afd00936c883124d6d3098721c2d306c/straight.el#L5627 https://github.com/search?q=prin1-to-string+secure-hash&type=Code You can filter out some of the noise by adding the follow to the search -elfeed -orgstrap -quelpa -litable -xah-elisp-mode -subr.el The use case that I have is to store the checksum of a code block to make sure that it has not changed. The checksum needs to be invariant to changes in formatting e.g. whitespace and needs to be backward and forward compatible across Emacs versions. In order to compute the checksum I need a serialized representation of the code. Note when I say "compare" two pieces of elisp code, one of them may no longer be available to be read, because only a checksum was retained, so direct comparison of the two structures in memory is not possible and defeats the point of having something that is simple to audit and store. This is discussed in more detail in the orgstrap readme. https://github.com/tgbugs/orgstrap/blob/master/README.org#normalization-functions https://github.com/tgbugs/orgstrap/blob/master/README.org#specification >From Emacs 18 through 28 prin1-to-string and the existing print variables have been able to provide the needed stability. There is currently no way to compensate for the change introduced in 637dde4aba921435f78d0de769ad74c4f3230aa6 short of reimplementing the old behavior of prin1-to-string from scratch, which would ultimately increase the maintenance load across the whole community. The example below works on emacs-18 (had to remove the number 1.0 example because emacs 18 does not have support for reading floats). The output of this code is unchanged from emacs-18 through emacs-28, however it is now different in emacs-29. Emacs 18-28: "(progn (+ 1 2) (a b\\.c d) (defun hello nil world)) (progn (some elisp code I want to normalize\\. That has strings \"1.0\" and symbols a\\.b))" Emacs 29: "(progn (+ 1 2) (a b.c d) (defun hello nil world)) (progn (some elisp code I want to normalize. That has strings \"1.0\" and symbols a.b))" #+begin_src elisp :tangle /tmp/example.el (defun normalize-elisp-code (body) (let (print-quoted print-length print-level) ; proposed variable would be added here (prin1-to-string (read (concat "(progn\n" body "\n)"))))) (defvar example-body-1 "(+ 1 2) (a b\\.c d) (defun hello () world)") (defvar example-body-2 (prin1-to-string '(some elisp code I want to normalize\. That has strings "1.0" and symbols a\.b))) (message "%s %s" (normalize-elisp-code example-body-1) (normalize-elisp-code example-body-2)) #+end_src The additional step in my use case is the checksum, which cannot be read back in, and changes from 28 -> 29 due to the differences in the output of prin1-to-string seen above. #+begin_src elisp (defun checksum-elisp-code (body) (secure-hash 'sha256 (normalize-elisp-code body))) (message "%s %s" (checksum-elisp-code example-body-1) (checksum-elisp-code example-body-2)) #+end_src From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 05:15:50 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 09:15:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57644 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxPsq-00083o-6S for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 05:15:50 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:56440) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxPsl-00083a-Hd for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 05:15:47 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:47586) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nxPsf-0000PO-Si; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 05:15:37 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=jRIwfGna4w9t/pRlU9KnKTMn1DmX09gWLuLnRB7tQzk=; b=Iw7WV32wKLW/ ob9W2RadvwOGlxRFR9M6oz0hm03B0L65e12qOutihVFEGsEhohGu9xNbTHbuicQadS7jGVp97CbRL pQ/KJGr2jfcb2i95+iegah35SRTlMo3HyXDUT8EumWGPJGXH74jnZc0Swbc6/5uLjIwznb3aoTNH5 w9wsTgis7tZeWGeQQrKLKKvU/iUnCtX1aFzN3igRG0hyNVGbyDgzkaqhydLpAlhkUOsPIWeUgswff r/GrGCxk7rlmwaTtCjtsrJzdOpUajp2yK9r+bQi2vU0QQ5H3Do5KrgJ0lcjS9dDGn5HP//thjuQmM xdt9HnGM2TFQrK0+mrTs9Q==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4506 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nxPsa-0007m4-LS; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 05:15:34 -0400 Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 12:15:26 +0300 Message-Id: <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Tom Gillespie In-Reply-To: (message from Tom Gillespie on Sun, 29 May 2022 14:03:11 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Tom Gillespie > Date: Sun, 29 May 2022 14:03:11 -0700 > Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org > > Hi Eli, > I have included an example below, with some additional context. Best! > Tom OK, thanks (and sorry for the delay in responding). I think I understand the issue now. You say in your OP that there's no way to work around the issue, but I wonder if this is really so. It seems to me that by adding a backslash before '.' and '?', before computing the hash, would be one workaround? > The example below works on emacs-18 (had to remove the number 1.0 > example because emacs 18 does not have support for reading floats). > > The output of this code is unchanged from emacs-18 through emacs-28, > however it is now different in emacs-29. > Emacs 18-28: > "(progn (+ 1 2) (a b\\.c d) (defun hello nil world)) (progn (some > elisp code I want to normalize\\. That has strings \"1.0\" and symbols > a\\.b))" > Emacs 29: > "(progn (+ 1 2) (a b.c d) (defun hello nil world)) (progn (some elisp > code I want to normalize. That has strings \"1.0\" and symbols a.b))" > > #+begin_src elisp :tangle /tmp/example.el > (defun normalize-elisp-code (body) > (let (print-quoted print-length print-level) ; proposed variable > would be added here > (prin1-to-string (read (concat "(progn\n" body "\n)"))))) > > (defvar example-body-1 "(+ 1 2) (a b\\.c d) (defun hello () world)") > (defvar example-body-2 (prin1-to-string '(some elisp code I want to > normalize\. That has strings "1.0" and symbols a\.b))) > (message "%s %s" > (normalize-elisp-code example-body-1) > (normalize-elisp-code example-body-2)) > #+end_src > > The additional step in my use case is the checksum, which cannot be > read back in, and changes from 28 -> 29 due to the differences in the > output of prin1-to-string seen above. > > #+begin_src elisp > (defun checksum-elisp-code (body) > (secure-hash 'sha256 (normalize-elisp-code body))) > > (message "%s %s" > (checksum-elisp-code example-body-1) > (checksum-elisp-code example-body-2)) > #+end_src Frankly, I'm amazed that someone could have such faith into immutability of Emacs Lisp. Why would you assume that the above produces the same literal string across versions, especially given everything that happens lately in Emacs, including changes in the byte-compiler, the introduction of native-compilation, etc. If someone would show me a design that is based on this, I'd tell them they place their bet on a dubious horse, and suggest to find a better design. To me, this is taking some Emacs feature that just happened to be stable, and assuming it will forever be stable. There's no reason and no real basis for such assumptions. Thus, I agree with Lars that it is strange to hear that prin1 is used as something that's supposed to produce a canonical representation of Lisp code; it's definitely isn't its purpose. Anyway, one way forward is to add a new API specifically for that purpose, and then guarantee that the output of that new API will be stable. This will also take care of the issue with the design that relies on prin1. Another way forward is to revert the change. And here I'm asking Lars what are the reasons for the change, except some aesthetics-related considerations, whereby we basically didn't see why the escapes are needed. If the only problems are that we didn't see a good reason for keeping the escapes, perhaps now we do have a good reason? Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 07:35:17 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 11:35:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57733 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxS3p-0006VC-0U for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 07:35:17 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:44984) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxS3n-0006Uv-Ap for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 07:35:15 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=pYK7+Tcuz6LOMTuISxdNGnFdUFb0YTOwrDVKkajX2IY=; b=QJuwyXlNyFJA1AIfjB6vPWF3Ki DOnWa5+V2X/By0mS/cmhuKqnWgz9OM8D87AEf3peH3tlt/fZiOUvxy4eUV5KXjmKGrlk+4gKfoAUD WCCUpwXpHvhzVDHrrzb2wqUIEIbTZE3NEw6jvYE/RzAL2pvxlPgNWzD3itxP4KPIPT5A=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nxS3e-0003CS-AE; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 13:35:08 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAJ1BMVEVlMyKAPhUgOGkX N3U8VUmNUyabaU+2kmrFqowDAwMUKh1WgIP////7CihXAAAAAWJLR0QMgbNRYwAAAAd0SU1FB+YG BAsWC4v0s3YAAAGkSURBVDjLndFNa9swGAdwpTQpyckuK70v/QT1sZcwRLa4F3cgp8cQbGn0Psns XGIfRwmlj3sxxWPY59KN6stVsvNay4ftD8JGPz2PJRl1bKtj17HUOHBWQahj2dtYO2BtVqt0jutp 7KATgq66tu1blo3CrneIP+IzNRw0FSScEvLtO2Ek9MMPtEqoIYniJBZRohPNAxpocdBpLJJpzPl1 LOJEREFA5zUcxWpdEtcFNAmCupeDelwwzvmUCSYEYV9Vr/GY4iGCtCxBRz3V29PmHFCWRQWgoTRB ug/rTv8F7h7orUCaZTNI8QbOV5B11e0MoGxU/PQZn6nCpduAiHsD0M12IS8yX3BP7yF3dwEXqEdp dcoc74GLBllY7XiJP20hxy+/vLBbVaS7gPEo8ynpGwAjRsP++1Y5vpQzxmarK77bAMZSPvviBhpw KaX0qQHUvOxRzwjFiJAGqE6T+5sBMsAEvkyKsgHyFSCZADQB4JGbQBU8LH4YQC1eLm7NAJ/b4HfQ An9dA+hb/dMG48IA1f+BFoAGDFvgQrbC8B8r1h8vDPAGknPX9K4yzwoAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6Y3Jl YXRlADIwMjItMDYtMDRUMTE6MjI6MTErMDA6MDAd/LLDAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOm1vZGlmeQAyMDIy LTA2LTA0VDExOjIyOjExKzAwOjAwbKEKfwAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: Vinicius =?utf-8?Q?Cantu=C3=A1ria's_=5FTucum=C3=A3=5F=3A?= "Vivo Isolado do Mundo" Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 13:35:05 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 12:15:26 +0300") Message-ID: <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > Another way forward is to revert the change. And here I'm asking Lars > what are the reasons for the change, except some aesthetics-related > considerations, whereby we basically didn't see why the [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > Another way forward is to revert the change. And here I'm asking Lars > what are the reasons for the change, except some aesthetics-related > considerations, whereby we basically didn't see why the escapes are > needed. If the only problems are that we didn't see a good reason for > keeping the escapes, perhaps now we do have a good reason? It was mostly an aesthetic change, but sometimes aesthetics are important. People do use dot characters in symbols, but it's confusing to see Emacs display these in a weird way -- so they may be discouraged from doing so when that's a natural thing to do. So I'm not very enthusiastic about reverting the change, especially (as you say): > If someone would show me a design that is based on this, I'd tell them > they place their bet on a dubious horse, and suggest to find a better > design. The reason for reverting it would be to support a use case that we don't support anyway. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 07:53:27 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 11:53:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57779 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSLP-00071D-G3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 07:53:27 -0400 Received: from sonic314-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.189.146]:33507) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSLN-00070z-1p for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 07:53:25 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654343599; bh=Y1YUIXA19CjZlSbxwv+P4y27PSYjJ8txYeJw26kPBSw=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=ma/e1Mn3fVegDQzDowMj2oWRLJbXC7+zJ6Tg7xU8xIlEER/6PCO1GT9v3D4kbNoCKoPMYcqYDPt/sfY4rCIz1WLMQOPb7JOeovE6rq40oejk6Yf9pA2WSz13yl/cOwIEUK1pbqfXIU3QKgqbDxedWY/hBpjDcMLadyEbJ6tYcL2SI+HMhhalLWAD4UK7mWJEHmJw73KxRLSULaR4jqQq1NBGvM0K8EWYfHCPWTdKydrJyvgvDJA9K+q4GIP26wJX1rSRrn7w+jBJn/l4FjrBojrjPh4Z+jdu1creH+TjjqNnawJtQbQhYgL/YIsKRzEad0sNnKzgfPvfyZs+jxMskg== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654343599; bh=pkh7/afaLantkcnuLLthD8oSvbYtLPLxKkrrJl20n/S=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=nemnNAUenwEB9L8inlYEkwSwvM837Z8/B5C7FSwgGW3qCcj5zamZ6biK4vyB3OMhXeqa5ySoQQnZc95zgyPtI4zbPpXvTyK+sIOBCNIxC40JWYUR/BLs0IPNS82L/fJ0lt5pir6GgnBCO0RFjPaBMhkuDQ03PXNC217x3PltgYOwAv9A9R++v8v70qLny65AxTbvvHmPno/pIciw0Hqkp2uGTFgAVfdEoC+341LkRHrSInfp3mEvjspoF1x/KVhUoHzmHA8Arx18po52Y7izlh6vL79tjHRatyozoYDB5HXF88XBLjrK2D1lMUdWmI8BZhKjWLB+CZFVnwFHfDrDUg== X-YMail-OSG: Osj4DE8VM1kAWTtjnAC3JkNAQe9NbO1gbGAlSidKYPOSpgfjH3XKBZ96Wezf0Dq yzR6k51vqRnF0X.54.J_V4OrO4KiHv8rz578tejxoaTcv6FWDGQMQ2J5n80lT3S1Lp_hc2LAC2ik RBe8tR6H5TG1pnqvfvhYzLgsMmW3caCZexYivMyvDAt4t84WWGpqcm1j6xCtBvZUEnV_Gbqey1qE T85zDs3TMj7sPRwTT1rJ43rk5JMmpdAYsGcIv1Sn8QulGCpmMq21CIY_24qvJBlCXmksluWuDa48 rH1rPe4enucm2snCPX5O_f6_oqOutl_H9MhRwZE.MN11SFEK8hcKrzKOX2Tma1Vc5oy_JHZrtljZ 4kV8Jm88POXPF3r_L_WQHWGyrRIqdYL_FfauZuyJDjG2JE82HTjBC2AYx9gfmD86UW9Yu_jgTE_t cuL9_tfnbhrmpPTovgwJNO5BaDlwL8ZC9hrav.EZwNSLzzzmIklq6Vre2UG9..TnR0HWnjnb00IV bWmzoLMhd5jnHVjgmM5Dumlzh1lC7X2tARtbesP13ZIjqyMfBOL1rFS5FPF3JcHyZ4P5wuufcuB1 WXXrztIMDZYu9POSGQwwObBTz48j_8g70qvtMkqwbfN2ybyWxBAsBBhgKl6jcNgS5Y_ELkbfB2cI xUCcFbkqG8.lIONa39DtfJ6QS0CC2SgAmKXOrNoQu4RyKRtZPW2L.JtWSucRowce.lySZ1QIohyp 2AxTWk0Glv.NUf0ZDDShcTBeXKJ7tXWxoA9KV4h2AkkXtskj0PR33TAIb_LPcCmFrHq01TdPyCQg z3IlopY2dj3xl_PklvODzfNymuLpGMS.otENndk4Z3Z6qlvl6n9MPSrsU_toi8CZZMVoCYK1aTya tQ3l5uq2cdz5tEp97K8yb186upCmHdkfSA1owtfFv9LZp86sD3qXC5zYJhVXU8kJkWT1vJ4.qpRw 1ef8xRjuBAT0r1XtmwnBsxk5e._6VxvunBFyGZ.3c1bsPuv8GnB.uOfuNhIhXjAJQM8Gmk3gPDlr 3Z6xIM.uovJMQwFBOJC2wJGeptrwWlsDd9IJbTK5Nlywxa8iybTgaYFR700aCK5ia1a5oaL_d_p8 fisvebstIULQbYOkfky_NuFC4_04JAK64p8qOB_zfne8gmVU6L2xJgl9Kft51ncKLg4YUTkYXVfB UL9uB.O3pp6IzQxnR8qEo7rle.eqjCYnIlSF53V3agBLDk7QMBYFuF_ZSm7uQJqMteZ4YdeV2Nr0 2Dj0dUTzfNiGiAdcDe1gWp9Ztd931F8Q.CI58nX8Y6ubzeCghhSjRc06_.w0CHn18FIRI3RJNtaq R61p016_2fqN3IbMy1ssemMQpzhoyiNfEzVnoRtA2iAEWGPFRsB8fZacXFgEbLlqi8V5bcTXs4fc nwQiNrN7THBoN6X0y0ZvUIsGWYq_2kfBL7mAMjpIDUDmY8iP1Q19ITjZ5MROwYMdz_7AUbioPdqR C7wvIRe9kQ4UjquNbNZLzpHI4c5LkFDtx42qI6JxbvSoWB4yKi_n57xtTEZ5Q6vNV8pzvel8b3oX ZQp8p6Z8.JEdi22byIzX7Wwq.Drfe7OlMkP0q9Q6yCQu20Hiy7tPd8YR_rp5y.jrfCqMa_0P2GYi iayLbStQX6lfvFw1jZoicbq.COKv3beZvOyol3_4_67QvVxLV_lWGoAhZ4276mHzqNuY6XIqF3xi HzDI.jZGXmTqHBIWcHxI6iS3_1SBOERUeRnRnrJdjHGOIgXnrdiqpwH5uTorBsNxV1ipZMraQfrO Aq.1OgTF3bh9OMjw0M4j0aIiWPAuITcaClpj7RFbHjo5EvaXpSI1QCuYgKbcmf8WeJumulvk7jG3 8YeFLEz.JIlykdZIymF5az8msJ6Rt.QeL5xjVSsvVlENjudXj.DvhUqu_0xobtv7N4YwJ_WNzWcx wrNoZ4_gjXXciFsza1VWYf_8ozHxSPRSxn7t_Rsm1Ym0ocXpeI5w4fP5wvoTdzghUq4LoIlzDa0a aJdTBRh4c2fH0nSnjy66hT3AUWFKFxteQhZj_mcbLG0TFuxH4UDz0B7hGwvE3XmQiohSFL8dF5tK DKThfcvYDWxWDVV3ILC5jpen0pQSo0YzhDw2QbxK99Cqp0dqEZK5ctHL58G9Mxwupc_kp2izwYYI UEnmQ4tYvnvh1xqMOR7Q7ZOWDZlqiTxHhTrEFitMI0EZWpga7uIGleUoSLXt2Ba7ejKOGbbbLm_l A9mC4KsQpWGXLelhvkVXUsSArrK_Z6lTANLaEnEi4jYkqgE1roBIC0mNdXHykP6kS X-Sonic-MF: Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic314.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sat, 4 Jun 2022 11:53:19 +0000 Received: by hermes--canary-production-sg3-5f7658c994-7rkj7 (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID b4b73e982b105c326a78e2bd4bb8daaa; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 11:53:15 +0000 (UTC) From: Po Lu To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 19:53:08 +0800 In-Reply-To: <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 13:35:05 +0200") Message-ID: <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.20225 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Content-Length: 498 X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > It was mostly an aesthetic change, but sometimes aesthetics are > important. People do use dot characters in symbols, but it's confusing > to see Emacs display these in a weird way -- so they may be discouraged > from doing so when that's a natural thing to do. FWIW, I don't see how it's natural to use dots in symbols. It certainly feels weird to me. Symbol names should ideally consist of the punctuation characters "-+=*/", letters and digits. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 08:09:20 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 12:09:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57801 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSal-000196-Pw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 08:09:19 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:45438) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSak-00018r-A2 for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 08:09:18 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=FcuFkUxFeVaoI4FGSgIMHX1goaw4+4h/qjQXKoxN6R0=; b=cdjvzfnMqM14uzwnXeD0jODj08 ekfaRapi9Rng+AyAd3RTkAEHCZyLD86SEv4+M6UOsgPEVmhuAAS0dhgzjV/5wYgZzYihPwAPAGpOQ DoclhWs7BfzXDaJfcGIrpudd+so0nJE2dtVVGVYkIdXXuwWWOsj9Lw6zMZF8w5oxEbig=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSab-0003nr-17; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 14:09:11 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Po Lu Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAAXNSR0IArs4c6QAAABhQTFRF /f39p6WkdFy0+doTS0o6NzIIAAAA////FGch4gAAAAFiS0dEBxZhiOsAAAAJcEhZcwAACxIAAAsS AdLdfvwAAAAHdElNRQfmBgQMBRESNh0bAAAAYElEQVQ4y2NgIB0IYgCCEkroQBGXhBJOCUWCEsYY gKCEaygaCIJKhKWhgZRRiVEJvBIpQkpKWCVSXVxcsOvAJUHQcgacEkK4JBiEcEkI4pJgIF2CwQ2X hIoLGnAko+wBALaZH0+PBoXsAAAAWmVYSWZNTQAqAAAACAAFARIAAwAAAAEAAQAAARoABQAAAAEA AABKARsABQAAAAEAAABSASgAAwAAAAEAAgAAAhMAAwAAAAEAAQAAAAAAAAAAAEgAAAABAAAASAAA AAEfUvc0AAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIyLTA2LTA0VDEyOjA1OjE3KzAwOjAweVZJjwAA ACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMi0wNi0wNFQxMjowNToxNyswMDowMAgL8TMAAAAXdEVYdGV4 aWY6WUNiQ3JQb3NpdGlvbmluZwAxrA+AYwAAADh0RVh0aWNjOmNvcHlyaWdodABDb3B5cmlnaHQg KGMpIDE5OTggSGV3bGV0dC1QYWNrYXJkIENvbXBhbnn5V3k3AAAAIXRFWHRpY2M6ZGVzY3JpcHRp b24Ac1JHQiBJRUM2MTk2Ni0yLjFXrdpHAAAAJnRFWHRpY2M6bWFudWZhY3R1cmVyAElFQyBodHRw Oi8vd3d3LmllYy5jaBx/AEwAAAA3dEVYdGljYzptb2RlbABJRUMgNjE5NjYtMi4xIERlZmF1bHQg UkdCIGNvbG91ciBzcGFjZSAtIHNSR0JEU0ipAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Farben's _textstar+_: "FF (Remaster 2022)" Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 14:09:06 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> (Po Lu's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 19:53:08 +0800") Message-ID: <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Po Lu writes: > FWIW, I don't see how it's natural to use dots in symbols. It certainly > feels weird to me. It's mostly natural when dealing with data that arrives from other programming languages that we then have turned into symbols. So you have symbols like `vnd.ms-excel' etc. (We don't use dots in funct [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Po Lu writes: > FWIW, I don't see how it's natural to use dots in symbols. It certainly > feels weird to me. It's mostly natural when dealing with data that arrives from other programming languages that we then have turned into symbols. So you have symbols like `vnd.ms-excel' etc. (We don't use dots in function/variable names.) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 08:18:27 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 12:18:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57833 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSjb-0003Zv-3N for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 08:18:27 -0400 Received: from sonic304-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.191.147]:41074) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxSjX-0003Zg-9P for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 08:18:25 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654345097; bh=axtu5wuEHjTGAN/2wAX1SMIKH3UO8IG9o1i3o0eYnRY=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=XmBaxAQWesOTDrfgb/Hc9gjOQdbV9J7ITnuxqXE2tH/nt2SReT3d+WnwD1FOpquTRhnKkvkuNWpsb3Zu404OLOj1znlozUh/Tl74+Q2DXTB4nPn+UFwjZ45fRBj4aYmB7frOAqI2eCCzIPElLbwnStDSjkDLcfrWDl4r1oDkEIbGz6bem4PzqVv13e+KLZrTq0/REHsnsuyj9UPDR1fDtjJyElPlFY9odbbxabd6vkCv3lc9HJvbrR9YPushhjx+wjA3UNMmfKZMt7pxMYRKIuG8A+N84XQqP2rOjX8l3vtMXNx+puotXm1+xtIMd3Ecb8U6AkkKbBKemRWwbt8p5w== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654345097; bh=31XnkDEdx/9KjjDTSLdgFKIciBdif/leZ2gQFgd2a0t=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=rth1FsQFsgT2LYM/D/wvoA134kjB4wPID8FOk7/wOVV8hjcN8u1aMTZIDNI63LmLBms41XcwGiVOFZPWL240ooNjyfx8yEkItxr6NIsH4oaKheyurs7iYUC9Liy4l0ny3UHvOV99FrMhhs2Zh1eRKXnmiR1XcvdTJ5LHNb61YLXK3APVqShVh43YlsXo1JFFZk0Dp1m3rmD3FJ8NHmGiE2Fc9kr7DztX/ozlyOgCKN1aqlcHYUlyyX2N9nOtYOXIjlMg+ZgiL9yizI+b0VmRBL0IFBbPRM0m5X7J2wvvpToOa7CRsWjAJtmgCQ+1UNiQDGVRGTqGe49gHnMe2BzoyA== X-YMail-OSG: Fq8ddgsVM1mi_QQ_WNbaVfl0GHOGgMEAQsNsxYcVCpcZjk24sEjQYdQwB9aJA3h _DnmU3IUSfJcsMUMBlfc4YcefZ3Dbjse0DLFykT34ZpddirFRlnCv3A8R8gWETgNFoi3nnfBK9Eh TCfb8A4GVvqRRB10rqUci.qTVNEP0bxPulI_JvReQrQcjAbIAQ_P_OF0QtD43em750A2RLWpmkrw I8V20wKuSXfGSAGdbJi0EgqPTzpeKGdnKL580ZlGXIpCs4NmwjTYWAfwtByYwnPxdaRYZuU7qjvS O7YetdH0ndOij9_6S7SUNYTt.Lid_4IyzQQJQKAQxfksKtAqO8grBlp5jtr7oFtrUph6rXqoyzhm cNsP4v7M_IqAdYasXCq_46lLhBYL2ZqsADGus9._IX3OhSuTZYMnOP5lTj72jR7nVxaPLjQEhrok RPhun430M.NBv8gkkHiYL6NFErRUzjCQR3sJpD19qH8w.zVYoZGUD8.zOb1PL1E40Ld2WNfqDWyQ v3tLB9Vweu7JpLYpqGh6NkyvQlTZLXionLMikBYPh1_ZfnPTXlrh7Kh3ZSFCcWrTiY6NZcf5cR__ 5z7nWLN2GC2UI5FdGlFp48gFDhKjp1Xx3cwTCD2MNVEV9gcdDqebHN.wAaYGG.LeGUThpRoqBHj. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID fb05f3d9398cd741a37227f7b029218c; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 12:18:12 +0000 (UTC) From: Po Lu To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 20:18:03 +0800 In-Reply-To: <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 14:09:06 +0200") Message-ID: <87czfo39ms.fsf@yahoo.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.20225 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Content-Length: 693 X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > It's mostly natural when dealing with data that arrives from other > programming languages that we then have turned into symbols. So you > have symbols like `vnd.ms-excel' etc. (We don't use dots in > function/variable names.) But that's not something which happens very often, is it? IOW, this looks like a relatively unimportant asthetic issue that doesn't justify strong opinions in either direction. Even though there's no guarantee that the printed representation of symbols will remain stable, we might as well do Tom the courtesy of reverting that particular change, since it caused him problems with code problem-free since Emacs 18. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 09:14:31 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 13:14:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57886 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTbr-000777-4Y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:14:31 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:46042) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTbp-00076r-2z for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:14:29 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=ztkg8Z5BDi/7R5a/wsWWKiW5TyR3/UaDDMc+Z5Mq75I=; b=l2alOH+aikpPj5YIZtf02MZv/8 2waq0NqAuIIuncAS8rfdWO37UGWRckVMkN9DQpwZCwpTZZ675IFEvJt31FsgvhWw0DaktVD0MNK+b 9f6POUYkNZp9QICBAnA1Nq8mz6vQoNVGVRliIsJ+foTOI1kXcUv9rvalciEMxJDg40gI=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTbf-00053d-Ky; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 15:14:22 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Po Lu Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> <87czfo39ms.fsf@yahoo.com> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEUPDxInHCONbKxO KEOiOy3///9uRwijAAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+YGBAw1FyQTjt0AAAGlSURBVDjLpZNh mqMwCIbh6R4AxAOsZA4gkAO0mvufaUk6M9raf8uPqLx8BAkB+G9DZiY6vpl/QaIDYLEkmA40PoOb aiG4/e1axFMqdFUCfN9wWmCO+A07FF6wHXJkW79fdaGGcNryJ0QXvCP4+gmswG7v4KaZCFivCg+T 2q4AoC5Sd71uPredUK4AYvrKDpVrpy0bslzjYX508OFoNkbxxwfQcvnzAcwje7sWuw3XdH/zCzde 8zznB9tJ5CAzZb8ni7oTUJ8RxhXZgTM55TnDfO/eCBZfOY+TmxsHO0sfD9UOTRaE1vwrYtOwaoxf zVjUpoVBS4R6aEQsnL0Jm8oAHl5105yrnsSTh1rk+Eno0zL+Vlt0VckoiAGiuJqI1j3qpsWLQd84 N8j+lmAte6L82hp0l46lKGW0L2WEgfZUuw8Vieoj/zHzOvQ6m0VUcqMMshyw4iFQIr3ELBRMWRAT S+nXKPhpQsYkcUwj/9j7UOPTO4alL3CSjEf22T4oXi7kGfQrzG/kW5ANfSXS0mysO13AHn2NFwkP V9Sk9lIA15OCjuL+AZFuUILiwA2mAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIyLTA2LTA0VDEyOjUz OjIzKzAwOjAwf9+2egAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMi0wNi0wNFQxMjo1MzoyMyswMDow MA6CDsYAAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: 1CD (2022) - 05 Sea Sapphire's _Illusion_: "(Circle Of Whispers)" Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 15:14:15 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87czfo39ms.fsf@yahoo.com> (Po Lu's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 20:18:03 +0800") Message-ID: <874k107eqg.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Po Lu writes: >> It's mostly natural when dealing with data that arrives from other >> programming languages that we then have turned into symbols. So you >> have symbols like `vnd.ms-excel' etc. (We don't use dots [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Po Lu writes: >> It's mostly natural when dealing with data that arrives from other >> programming languages that we then have turned into symbols. So you >> have symbols like `vnd.ms-excel' etc. (We don't use dots in >> function/variable names.) > > But that's not something which happens very often, is it? I think it might happen more often if the printed representation wasn't as ugly. But we do have a bunch of symbols in-tree that uses dots, too: (mapatoms (lambda (k) (when (string-match "[.]" (symbol-name k)) (insert (format "%s\n" k))))) Lint Directory... iso10646.indian-1 gb2312.1980-0 cns11643.1992-7 cns11643.1992-6 cns11643.1992-5 cns11643.1992-4 cns11643.1992-3 cns11643.1992-2 cns11643.1992-1 Reset Counters for Function... Instrument Package... Lint File... (etc.) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 09:30:54 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 13:30:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57900 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTrh-0007Vr-UH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:30:54 -0400 Received: from sonic313-56.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.185.31]:44251) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTrf-0007Vc-Op for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:30:52 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654349446; bh=rPZRFJb5cnGDvUEDRPCdVBvqI2bMHySEb8OnFiaOHVE=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=lTSVi8rsHVCDaEWg8xnNxkYNX28q20FaWW91mDF6AYJVmhnYRpPdNgELIO2nxieblg7wxA6OUHF5NRaGTK7pPvQgh+VJwUsPOc3XMyDVUwpxsaMWBJYNLP3ca6qdjOlaOQurjAjS9dBOOxhZvbyLBLlJ65lSHgOuPfaTvLINFod/MK9YfRt20Q1v8FWB55p72J8wOBXnd0c7BQwIXv2rrNI76l/SIvTysLtxLFLxbWG1zCtVHoZvePUpkyHgYBaQkg8NEBp3RhVKCQ/lnQ7nRgVrNYilv3UP1/RS4SBrBv8h0q/NTSSWG8kRGj5sQWFu12vc5xoMuL7UtodztMX4og== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654349446; bh=8vqgYskcKy1TIFuFevlZwRu9Y0EKZNdoRcctfJ5fUTX=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=KmMwxCNUbmcVS27kuF3jCCVoE3ditY2iBu843xh0nyzz4F4wZ2M0uzmzdvA29GZD5lkMCQfcc6nNld9+Bpx5aAYAgl6sexVdqtB1FivlWeGo5AuHbrd+R/aglbG4ORTHw4IU/BdTVH2qkZaEOrxd+51c9E2HQaxqbI/tuTZHQQx4WsB15XKi6EhAFzTb1uYt0MbLOTVHHvXAlqxJjNIGH6z8ASu2VndmgITJiWUalIYgwWcKy+2oedfGDSizTHvZdpbTPS5KW3dLqIDV6/2YH6AUGZ8YU20+UUehIcCL4g0UfS7+yWRgpiJ1qR+hp26nMF/c4rvcfjnajVQn16h+eQ== X-YMail-OSG: Vagt32QVM1mdFU2oQYoqXWARGBup_qeDZWKrK4MoJxnQWtq9md45vBmDvaGQydy KiLDJ2RS50yoU9uJnab40lZMpyIDKPLel9rZ8_geRaNIsQkFkrSo1xQNiJG6uh.kdgo3KNnu5TDB 2BszfyZAG.sq32XrtZXUIN2rxhxOCMj0mv9pvx53x_zuolG11c_6wmMxeFD6waQHPfsg.VsNMOv1 Q1A6g6xSD_Z33hhjeQCfDOPtEB.EqLDQ2tTMIZAWQNb_pdec1QfUUu0IIpKWTE4g75_7M4_P3p6V rzXMmkJNkH5K3vfaUFywGp20GifHMcGo7dSTxQo.TLIB1E5awzNwv6xdxb3Kkg_7.HMCQh9k5Gkg ltUkZ9YR3YNfBz3UFxTRrbUgbmISM3xrcAGwc51UXCozBcly.mlPbx199sPx5dm6emKIO_SjB8zn N3QbFdhzDvN1JYkw3vNSzbuNcBI5_R2DqjgS3QRpzDIHHuJCXsag1LlXNrJl.XdFtPAX6zd4tRcc ZKive.rIC7g6U5z.bN86_0E92wRiig7M3AFcOLxE2RTiLnzBWSd35JUFAHHRUtn9RMlI4_sS2d7S FSAdNr9hYjL6qs3mYPesZP5Ucs24eLTsi0rsYiP3gRYpSm8kiyWYz7cmROX9pTc4pd1DEN.oLidg eDZZu.gcChol8rPKnzA.mFVr6ve3g8IpGPNvRUxhoXxK4Bp5i6zj8xveTvHIu9hSffgMQZzxEKBH XCSaSHuvmivqIA2KiD9MlG1VGfM5CZ4O_xwt0t5T3TdtaGO2P.cycQ6HV636F0tOvzH.xOkYsAfi 27ohRnKztrZn3_bPqTGWZ_Y0ItAbg76KpAcBFXJmVRrPYPaqlJURJG_rARniRnXF7vu4f5UE9D3c VCEh3HIKjU6pDrDhebyScyudJsPRI4MiSTWLlN5x4h50rQFg5a4Z4NSDJQ3dsnpX1UjiZI4MKIPO 75ciZluP7iSB9Dkmy1Dn6asKjPRIl.7HE4dbow95zH4jLIssbiHdT4ANfHdD3o4zSG9lcbQBjQap xik3bHPxVd34l3ylOUnVZR96TQfPFv_EtLOStGmqd8LriENJqwjQnmO7pz0x1BT.tlwpJeno0lXT 07qHH6nSHRZQ9YU4kyrfQaQTqSBvOK3VkIiR8Eij8L.Eixm2CiLl5PJBB9L_twV54fhYVEKKA.Z5 _X5RmaAbvX32gE6ST58mGuUI0OlB9hmfniCGO4ZdM6mchwStz3CwrXIE1QCTwA8KzrvfKSyvSpcy vuc5ecHjsfB8FqA4AlveMUlEcWM8EA3w5WhSK0QH394gM_DVSU75r9plapJYocifBTGvLYc9RpXz n4bZ1lEgbkiHq4cb5LgWC5xgH2lmGEnoMkqUdB87UVv5fRcZ_mSZGwcchwDtLgnxbUZwmlt1kVJg uFaDrH0mZZzO__XzWQfXM4ECGDEShqNZwPONOB6.W0t2uFLzuUwcnTsuSVFC2N_WMCqkLZk2wMC6 zgXAtdEuZZFPaCezXjOQwHJ5GTesmpUV_73M7NRsfWQGQDR.bbGV1ykn.pXJdOpjQgMP_Wt2qm8C .r2VPRnnXV25ZDitwRXD955ZznNfVaEWfjAfr55RlfcfurBfzvTr1y3sqNgYZZHdOoRZIcp5Fd1o dlhcTpz0U9l_ebn7RF0gJSfU8pvdeT7dyrJhnSvFdKFQPdV2JCKh1vn0ZPcRJNz5GDrj4hkx3oBi WdZZTTL4kJdf7hyeAsCCSCjBgwyy2CruTWkpN.c6aCsMbfKV0AFjlrFMwqfPaC_F2E7Xn509moDO z0pwxL8oPGxHBy.hf3_VbwKeP_DtI7zJHn_ZO3Le3C30TWEc0dRB9CQ_gUoOy0dtZhddX4YI0rd9 pKBVaMny9e29biRWAC_qs618ZACNm.5zfCFQy7k2itcPvcqDDjfYlLv7g3nfzb75J_4q61ENHS.i amVIdYTn8tyrITZPOhucxmciZvfMs08olwkSdygM8X2cLiLjouBpTjrd_tHK0fHZp6QKgt8Vv_zh HYDJ0tcOIdD_LOwWw8osAqQ5j2cc7BFeZ5_KORISLTuKxjrSfnl5ItKQxL0_zRYXx4..vA8kEjKo 7nG55DjnUQ3tnXZRgstFeOue2P7bdYxz6vbvjVK_b2jTNzuyEyvN4Tf.Q2tSE7GJhX5EHak4rHjs j3etms7XbbOupJTogh_cWb6XoCGVeD.Abp4aHq.xAWE1oSkTXa2UeqXc4.NGTn6E.Nt3NjmN_oxZ h1xmu6bbvONKhCDa4xNEHIRtMW1AaU8jjQRnQy5c4YOooXAEEdN1G7tl8wwhdHqnPMB7L X-Sonic-MF: Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic313.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sat, 4 Jun 2022 13:30:46 +0000 Received: by hermes--canary-production-sg3-5f7658c994-zbd6m (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 2ace7f38ee8c9194ad46ccb6ee037d1b; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 13:30:41 +0000 (UTC) From: Po Lu To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> <87czfo39ms.fsf@yahoo.com> <874k107eqg.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 21:30:35 +0800 In-Reply-To: <874k107eqg.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 15:14:15 +0200") Message-ID: <871qw4369w.fsf@yahoo.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.20225 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Content-Length: 1017 X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > I think it might happen more often if the printed representation wasn't > as ugly. I find it hard to believe: why would changing the print syntax of symbols with dots make it more likely for people to use data types that have type names with those characters? And if you mean in general, then I don't see the point of using dots in keywords and function or variable names. > But we do have a bunch of symbols in-tree that uses dots, too: > > (mapatoms (lambda (k) (when (string-match "[.]" (symbol-name k)) > (insert (format "%s\n" k))))) > Lint Directory... > iso10646.indian-1 > gb2312.1980-0 > cns11643.1992-7 > cns11643.1992-6 > cns11643.1992-5 > cns11643.1992-4 > cns11643.1992-3 > cns11643.1992-2 > cns11643.1992-1 > Reset Counters for Function... > Instrument Package... > Lint File... Most of those are interned from strings (see fc_charset_table in ftfont.c), and not likely to either be printed or to be written by users. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 09:36:05 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 13:36:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57904 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTwj-0007dA-MA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:36:05 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:46304) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTwh-0007cf-LW for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:36:04 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=HTbh73DRhnxI24twR3wQEuOvdRztOAB5jmf3dn659KU=; b=i6PKP5qI40qilkVBmM6CR+JXPg U5BVOpeJFBtQXASHXJ06iJkbO8Tog/HbU07TDkCVb4b89VPItnUI/kVVK0/rr7zNvELR6T/QD39o0 R2Dp/5eI23GBirafTVthfSzQVurNzIVSqAz3yYfQQF70w/joAMiDXpkzywkRU5YidEdE=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nxTwY-0005P5-3y; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 15:35:56 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Po Lu Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> <87czfo39ms.fsf@yahoo.com> <874k107eqg.fsf@gnus.org> <871qw4369w.fsf@yahoo.com> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEUPDxInHCONbKxO KEOiOy3///9uRwijAAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+YGBAw1FyQTjt0AAAGlSURBVDjLpZNh mqMwCIbh6R4AxAOsZA4gkAO0mvufaUk6M9raf8uPqLx8BAkB+G9DZiY6vpl/QaIDYLEkmA40PoOb aiG4/e1axFMqdFUCfN9wWmCO+A07FF6wHXJkW79fdaGGcNryJ0QXvCP4+gmswG7v4KaZCFivCg+T 2q4AoC5Sd71uPredUK4AYvrKDpVrpy0bslzjYX508OFoNkbxxwfQcvnzAcwje7sWuw3XdH/zCzde 8zznB9tJ5CAzZb8ni7oTUJ8RxhXZgTM55TnDfO/eCBZfOY+TmxsHO0sfD9UOTRaE1vwrYtOwaoxf zVjUpoVBS4R6aEQsnL0Jm8oAHl5105yrnsSTh1rk+Eno0zL+Vlt0VckoiAGiuJqI1j3qpsWLQd84 N8j+lmAte6L82hp0l46lKGW0L2WEgfZUuw8Vieoj/zHzOvQ6m0VUcqMMshyw4iFQIr3ELBRMWRAT S+nXKPhpQsYkcUwj/9j7UOPTO4alL3CSjEf22T4oXi7kGfQrzG/kW5ANfSXS0mysO13AHn2NFwkP V9Sk9lIA15OCjuL+AZFuUILiwA2mAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIyLTA2LTA0VDEyOjUz OjIzKzAwOjAwf9+2egAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMi0wNi0wNFQxMjo1MzoyMyswMDow MA6CDsYAAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: 1CD (2022) - 09 Aquabat's _Illusion_: "(Circle Of Whispers)" Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 15:35:53 +0200 In-Reply-To: <871qw4369w.fsf@yahoo.com> (Po Lu's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 21:30:35 +0800") Message-ID: <87v8tg5z5y.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Po Lu writes: > I find it hard to believe: why would changing the print syntax of > symbols with dots make it more likely for people to use data types that > have type names with those characters? Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Po Lu writes: > I find it hard to believe: why would changing the print syntax of > symbols with dots make it more likely for people to use data types that > have type names with those characters? I've certainly been puzzled over the printed representation of these symbols, and I've wondered whether I should use a transliteration scheme (which isn't necessary), so I think it's likely that others have been, too. > Most of those are interned from strings (see fc_charset_table in > ftfont.c), and not likely to either be printed or to be written by > users. Users will inevitably see symbols like this at some point or another. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 04 09:48:15 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2022 13:48:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57928 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxU8V-0007yG-Kk for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:48:15 -0400 Received: from sonic308-56.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.187.31]:39837) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxU8T-0007y2-1A for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:48:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654350487; bh=VlLbHjhWa90CNKenUFQVt0FD1Vl5LgNXxefd0K12EvI=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=gHFja7gNbAR30GDr5bdhaegp/S0YHg0Vi7ABZsCMu7Q20W+aq0RfmqeIUwQeJ4xFNXfQJqw5ph9Pvr/8rWEqErAiHuzhm021fwdNOYoeyh/grQ8FwJQ95YcFDPQOaVoR6R5d7RM7qRRjUB+p8ZFQQ2AZNgpV2Wpv9CMD1LUzI6YyyrofzxEW8bxnUz578kUFnSPl2e+PXT5IxCYY1W1oOByoZ0UVRyErpMG+jeelbjIT5eJmC+vgMfN667Ua8f35P0qI7f+Lm9god7rlXloSz78AJa3HDiB5opBv9V8zsvIvOTF5XzEybn71MCXs+yVwM6AWr2RP7HexBGLmua+n7Q== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1654350487; bh=Btw9Z4XLZF1goxI4trJ1y0ecyL6J+JSphyYEOVB/zqA=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=iz5g+mpdHr/d32hw7D3icuwlmgIQLi2HHqbQTccJiKGaJv3O25cSfFWQAcCY6zWmGz2Af3gICDBgwNbn3c7fon9Om54oCfyi+d0Ix2kSNZCGxV/sL0D6LeP/ICt/d9x4L39BKUFYfk5EvbkDkxRbtOAD7uTsWDS5MeFmtxOWiw5o0EnoMQWm2Rzq679MlB3WZ4dOFAYAO1BZOxr30jgcFYBXBVRo4s+uhdTJ3seatFu9F2McaWA5qeB/2v0UFJy77S5wbOps3BG9BTHKqQlwjAluGmIILJtih0+f8P3xckYmkium5VXCZWwNQrv5oRKouHHHw/U/vcFv7gmZn8Eymg== X-YMail-OSG: 1xY7lUAVM1l9aM2jGac8K0Ly0R86aE9gVeNVktN3.QrGj6PN9uNpkm2W8XyVA7W Y.o3CKotQ1k6O_WTtdB9BfDcZjo6yiD6yompc5LEAtEZzxvYMomcR9R2bkYpMAqtQTOj720I6DjA RsXDXIq82l1HRGd1NDJC.vUSW_G42fVn76x9bR7Zc6lQk0zkNXhToF13F.fmc.paUjGO04rRLirI 8OpWXtCSJCgNLeGXeVBavyeac09FSgFFpQLPvaS8VpqIb.wfPw1CR7CR8KOhoQEm5HmwOJYFO1Np dlwimRR0bMpSQIhs56R6Z1_AM9E8JHK10_MAN1mg9kxPTXwAIRXtvKnT.DqEtD.4yyqa3MadNqlV YReizhSY644lAGBx04xsCuck138MjKgRH7FhE9GDjVcYntxMBZ.hS5hPyEGbqadD7m.VrsNg8gQD yumKid_XFrwcL2RcbA66pKhrfEcQW7uJbT.QeI1Tdbzzns0yWIjhN4c1CdZhhXl7QFSWLaqzD2GL 6d8pCZIl8TM7WKnTX1iHCrFqsY96Cngg7bz5Lyls9.jJI7YNMx9ykzJgKtwqYd2nQ0DShD6vMUGV ozFmPU9S8cIbjupZgMt0u5zE_c4tTe5.8PC9N0R6rfdew0qpOXGmzRbPm2UGOn.yiSkkm2L7FlbI awj5jTOvAHdTh6pTL9ADb455b59Ft0E6JKsJFOUndKFSHARrbhxCc7cz0umCmpByLSREc.xfTwLA QdkAuCwZHmVXF7RuB9A9PEZtaeB3zBJoxcAOC6yEHnx0c12leh0ImXWJtz68Xvi.9B.IA.3ik41P tGkZ_R9mb6uPAu0wECSp1.coCr0EmI.vzYiC_.qwtTd7VDPgTCfCx2pmTKrJJg5wEZt2UmeN8DK1 TU1YRjITGbS6vuY60KjWXcUqCNqr0pHIVmHNut8OdnOkySYWmufK8hZneYWlyq3h959SyP7RvZft PVYqe29AAj6Et0jKwykA.Ab8O.A2z32paQImdY9zkvMV3b8YsHgcVT7Oxsqc7vMi0CzsCa_oNFkV LPwGV79YlPqW0YV067IXAKvHWQ8fc8m2S2ApNu0TeQVxUAWrrjcvuAZvgA7CFkJjwMecNl2lFYh2 YKlywtHZHoD9kGD2UBGFxx6U0t3xoJMxhl8yF3SGG8iyAynXtPdK.VVN0CAUyTNRjvTD03cNHuj5 PQ36T8ZqhY9mbs_aUmiET53VPiWbp6kDodtRnRoYdMsNQ1BSyuizEoTGLBppEK.hPDqZTuwQwjLf 4GyC2f58ne006JYNaG1vcG0mL612odt_jWB8vakAB4dW3gqfwZ0ZuUeMvJsPe0SgDOPD8JGos9qc XPz1HAyUb1rbKO4R9U8pEyktTycgTSDbZ1o6iJmSKPK0ROkPgBqpwnLMhOJoC7qMLn2e9msSkwtI cnTDQ_c84eWCHOmjP.t8JruMSU11xnRrUci.LibjbVIbY7dnFa_xalnycknB.D0DeqrHcb87z59U cZJDgUPtbckfvevsE3wwol_DwvWRwKGqrtYezCcoH.Nz8x2ankGjl1QPiEF2WLSX3NTQAAijirW4 UJiIT.nUeu8e.cY3I.ValgUZumfVp4ZMknK3VC63R.PnjUQGq5Qtq9Ar2Ha.5dXLNmOqC8oP_qeb pCP1jE_ZH0vptid8VXEqB0KJM3diVCKL9yZhE62NkQDmuer2ZSglAz6lhlWAO2ldxdaRu_FMc657 mx5G3MPbyxoJiWPPKnso2TcPUCo5HmMf36x38pXrlpXPgDwQIznG1nxJ05xxydQsduBGRwRotBgY aXG1jZ3haTDdVtONbNFFawLt3ocCNxz0mSbpHQ0nRCxuIF9b0Emx8CJ0oE4H68vgfdGGpGU6HFXg avZosGIJPdUo69YfQEAYz2wUBaoZ1Y17gIV1YELBKPum8fZycpl4tXzgy5KT1SWUX3HrrjRwu1ZU FmMwCJ8naAW7tkDaNnpxZ7ajN8iNOGBNJgQMbwnm8ALJrfO1OM5D60DnJaQJRs7Dy9gFS9PZnmRt 5EXl8lYrVZio_UBu9T2ADLQAWRfyGcQR6D53eCipMxAQxGZMlJx.jmFCyUpeXCXu2D9qDz1HPpH8 hnWDTD.3MP0p7_dXWcsSSybJ1yRGsGcsGMuajDdZqxVrTe8fPvF_EDpQZcWnm_bQtefBTkC8LTaK jtW.2eSl7Gyn_ExlIbHc70av6dIFDGO1rTGzxzYwa9tRZreUZv2guaXgBg22L92OJGux0ZjFtwBx 7_FFEDWmAVMx7TFBuLulLFKDdWA4a.CIvj49H719VjpHt84Y6KmjLllzjHz6ezAB2 X-Sonic-MF: Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic308.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sat, 4 Jun 2022 13:48:07 +0000 Received: by hermes--canary-production-sg3-5f7658c994-r59gj (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 9505297ef9d39679f82c7c50db859eac; Sat, 04 Jun 2022 13:48:02 +0000 (UTC) From: Po Lu To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <878rqcacgm.fsf@gnus.org> <87r1443asb.fsf@yahoo.com> <87k09w8wbh.fsf@gnus.org> <87czfo39ms.fsf@yahoo.com> <874k107eqg.fsf@gnus.org> <871qw4369w.fsf@yahoo.com> <87v8tg5z5y.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sat, 04 Jun 2022 21:47:55 +0800 In-Reply-To: <87v8tg5z5y.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sat, 04 Jun 2022 15:35:53 +0200") Message-ID: <87o7z81qwk.fsf@yahoo.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.20225 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Content-Length: 1210 X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > I've certainly been puzzled over the printed representation of these > symbols, and I've wondered whether I should use a transliteration scheme > (which isn't necessary), so I think it's likely that others have been, > too. Fulfilling a niche is not really a good enough reason to make such a change, especially once it causes actual problems for someone. Most programmers will not see a symbol with a dot inside every day, or even every month (the ones you sent are the first ones I've seen this year.) Programmers probably come across reasons to use them even less, and the amount of those reasons is reduced even further if you rule out unambiguous interfaces such as `intern'. > Users will inevitably see symbols like this at some point or another. Chances are (if it actually happens) those symbols will not be printed, but displayed to the user as the product of something similar to: (message "%s" 'symbol.here) Which does not escape the dot. That aside, why is it escaping a rarely encountered character inside a symbol a "problem" important enough to fix, especially when the fix breaks someone's code badly enough for him to complain about it? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jun 06 19:30:44 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Jun 2022 23:30:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37085 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nyMBI-0001hf-BZ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Jun 2022 19:30:44 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-f181.google.com ([209.85.219.181]:37569) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nyMBC-0001hO-Sg for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Jun 2022 19:30:42 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-f181.google.com with SMTP id v15so389791ybe.4 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 06 Jun 2022 16:30:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=lw9thhmuX44WuQYRKrWRhVAfebcYMYR4gX9q7KNf3X8=; b=lIZWgzSutcPaAdFb5UtVcoTneGSMImCgC2io5ISFzym4feVxcFgnpgmbI0r4X3He3w Ck86arM3xsyg2g4Cu11AJmnS+d+KC4m3ZNnQ7JnlW/F53ahtAkOMnC2wrIZ0V4LzVBJf DT8BkGufgRjcZpgumBY9EYAmBV8cdctJdfYvN4gA6NCwwGELN7o1FuboN/c7QvazM0TS XlWdoBrdFnCOfN2sfjIamiLHffDKwImNt5aU2+3TRRGg+R6qflg40QmdpOvjoB4UM6tq WGpKMHVUXO/0nTrB9h17601beX1J5zGnU7wNL8+2mRUcokk6Yuk49wdKEOHioCOHlmne cfIw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lw9thhmuX44WuQYRKrWRhVAfebcYMYR4gX9q7KNf3X8=; b=qPWDVC+Hf6B/GkZmC7KYVCCj5Sdh6mQqFAIocgaBm0Z56w+874tW4btrXeGhbY2oIB P3bzMJPIYucqF+vPGCYtGPlnzUmO+p/kd5rvxfnqvDTXrIiZAbQpMnH5XrowKQWRk9pU i0aVfVQxi1Pd71TvcwD9UEh0blxuupvW6hT/TaV69FjAN3unTZp/vkSF4fhg78nyh5vP TJBoGGveTavD/E/diviRGufP3Sa0pQsdURe9ach4MatMibXC7mMZ7jFJlvwycd4tnr2E +mYlf/kc1QZhe3/PuLSWasgXwqJkWGGrLBiXjiJsBWyP2NdRewxHCpaLgcD5Kwivs3eZ HGgA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531upgWv+qDR+7CspCHI2lNj5WyeEhD6XScO2nHijg9ozTzZtsfa NKlR8+sreLSVk2cAmub6Wt5D5Lv8DU5z8dn+WpA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyKmBhzRqRHcbQUobxJG+HvbzmAeMlYI+ftAvj3spaDpJNHY4/qOqdjjLq2pCyxfjYt5zpdk6xLfPSBKiNkubg= X-Received: by 2002:a25:d906:0:b0:663:aa8e:b379 with SMTP id q6-20020a25d906000000b00663aa8eb379mr5798300ybg.455.1654558233267; Mon, 06 Jun 2022 16:30:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> In-Reply-To: <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2022 16:30:22 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Hi Eli, Replies in line. Best! Tom > You say in your OP that there's no way to work around the issue, but I > wonder if this is really so. It seems to me that by adding a > backslash before '.' and '?', before computing the hash, would be one > workaround? Unfortunately I don't think there is an easy way to do such a thing from elisp. The primary issue with such a workaround is that while it is safe to do that inside strings and symbols, you have to know the type of the object that is being printed, otherwise floats and characters will be inadvertently converted to symbols. As far as I can tell the only place to make such a change is inside the c implementation of prin1 or some other c function, thus my request for a dynamic variable that would preserve the old behavior by allowing me to reach into the c runtime. > Frankly, I'm amazed that someone could have such faith into > immutability of Emacs Lisp. Why would you assume that the above > produces the same literal string across versions, especially given > everything that happens lately in Emacs, including changes in the > byte-compiler, the introduction of native-compilation, etc. I wouldn't call it faith so much as testing, and perhaps an assumption that there wasn't any reason to change something so fundamental that affected so few people and had been stable for so long. Also, it does not seem such an unfounded assumption because for code the prin1 representation (or at least the pp-buffer representation) must produce valid elisp that can be read, and the reader is extremely stable. In particular the representation also ideally needs to be read by older versions of emacs because some libraries would like to be able to support multiple versions of emacs with a single.el file. As I note below the particular relaxation in the behavior of the reader was made long ago, the change in the prin1 behavior only affects very old versions of emacs, though emacs-18 is installable and usable on gentoo, I have no idea whether anyone actually shares code between emacs-18 and emacs-29, so that is likely a moot point. > If someone would show me a design that is based on this, I'd tell them > they place their bet on a dubious horse, and suggest to find a better > design. To me, this is taking some Emacs feature that just happened > to be stable, and assuming it will forever be stable. There's no > reason and no real basis for such assumptions. As mentioned above, there is a strong basis for such assumptions, which is that prin1 or at least pp-buffer must produce valid elisp code that can be read. Thus the stability of prin1 is intrinsically tied to what the reader will accept. So the change that we are discussing here is due to the fact that there was a change in the reader to relax what it would accept with regard to '.' and '?' in symbols. > > Thus, I agree with Lars that it is strange to hear that prin1 is used > as something that's supposed to produce a canonical representation of > Lisp code; it's definitely isn't its purpose. Am I wrong in my assumption about pp-buffer and read? I mean, yes in principle prin1 could start escaping every single character in every symbol since it will ultimately read in the same way, but that seems somewhat unlikely. > Anyway, one way forward is to add a new API specifically for that > purpose, and then guarantee that the output of that new API will be > stable. This will also take care of the issue with the design that > relies on prin1. This seems like the "right" solution long term. It allows us to skip the aesthetics discussion going on at the moment, and it provides an explicitly stable representation for readable forms, allowing prin1 to be free of any such constraints (complaints?) in the future. It would be possible to use fboundp to check whether the new stable prin1 was present and use that going forward, if it is not found then prin1 itself should be fine through 28. This seems preferable to having an implicit subset of readable objects that are mostly stable in prin1 but can sometimes change to match current reader behavior. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jun 07 12:35:56 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jun 2022 16:35:56 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41280 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nycBH-0006gL-59 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jun 2022 12:35:56 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:46456) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nycBC-0006fw-9H for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jun 2022 12:35:45 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:40676) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nycB6-0001UP-Il; Tue, 07 Jun 2022 12:35:36 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=7WNPCu8I3n36CFW3xscI0nDU34qSzoIom8XxEOWSjT4=; b=Ke39RU7usqLj V50DAV3wVZujYVYsPkTLVSlgZ1YW5ZFYMJ3VKdXUAvwnGT2wcrPrWgr5d5bMLOHUc8juya4ROcUCl o2Liz/ZIDYYDQZeItZd6vF7hWvGRqmvL86fzlgMPoQofWPruvLMwYXpoRq5a5uvkbYDMwIPZX5lSY CLed2CH08t6ED1R1dNubUcdGveQ80wLVrOhy7yd4FgKkKwqsGcc88QncfAZ9NUaeFV90SgOLiFfcv vXo4B0PSTwVYrYSaUvAqPmSoQtifYc6kGi4c6s64MwNhZS51Dl/L1vva1/72Nc3pdnND7kyFXuP8U UTvcgHyVY3MW4cYba4F5oA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4260 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nycAi-0002Ub-VW; Tue, 07 Jun 2022 12:35:31 -0400 Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2022 19:35:05 +0300 Message-Id: <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Tom Gillespie In-Reply-To: (message from Tom Gillespie on Mon, 6 Jun 2022 16:30:22 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Tom Gillespie > Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2022 16:30:22 -0700 > Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org > > > Thus, I agree with Lars that it is strange to hear that prin1 is used > > as something that's supposed to produce a canonical representation of > > Lisp code; it's definitely isn't its purpose. > > Am I wrong in my assumption about pp-buffer and read? Of course you are wrong, since we changed prin1 without affecting read. We could also change both prin1 and read such that what the former produces the latter can consume, as long as the "usual" Lisp code can still be read without any problem. > I mean, yes in principle prin1 could start escaping every single > character in every symbol since it will ultimately read in the same > way, but that seems somewhat unlikely. Unlikely for every character, but we could decide to do that for a few special ones, for example. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 11 07:22:57 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Jul 2022 11:22:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38602 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oArVA-0006DE-VB for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 07:22:57 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50306) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oArV9-0006Cy-BJ for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 07:22:55 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=xI2a17ePJepwW3xpD8Iv0gyICRsZ64vi6qIlQKfDfYI=; b=LRIj3ALPdAPDsCf5ArJ50sH3KJ UC5eTsI7YmD4bq4ynYPDjA+MUts8qViz3Via28TuI0LKwtqmt/5rS0F4jZU7D2JL5yHuIBds/HM3k sU7J+lUPMCgvwKvFPQZdqliKfHY0up1ZL3+/qQNBZBu3QVjTh3tvy8vI7pwlxR7/XZ/4=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oArV0-0002Me-Ke; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 13:22:49 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions In-Reply-To: <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 07 Jun 2022 19:35:05 +0300") References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> X-Now-Playing: Liquid Liquid's _Dig We Must_: "Flextone" Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2022 13:22:45 +0200 Message-ID: <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > Of course you are wrong, since we changed prin1 without affecting > read. We could also change both prin1 and read such that what the > former produces the latter can consume, as long as the "usual" [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Tom Gillespie , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > Of course you are wrong, since we changed prin1 without affecting > read. We could also change both prin1 and read such that what the > former produces the latter can consume, as long as the "usual" Lisp > code can still be read without any problem. This was a month ago, and I think the conclusion here is that we don't want to add an option to tweak this printing behaviour (or guarantee that we won't change printing in general), so I'm closing this bug report. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 11 07:23:01 2022 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Jul 2022 11:23:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38605 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oArVF-0006DY-6K for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 07:23:01 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50322) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oArVD-0006D3-1N for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 07:22:59 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=x+IaDLmnxSAFENrRaS1H1N3yV7ocuQ3SemypU/HAfk8=; b=WHpdcLYxELA8/48FsuQk0fcE61 EdFx7zqy3XlFfXvQ7vnJy5WGgaRZswF1ucL+P6or3QC8B0Gn96oxEKe4GjeY6VLIF0/TiPk8n66/E POLhIl7HtOhvxj917ck/mmwmcLZlGAkK7/d8d0PDewwQdYQq+tum0sY5kOeYf2xqyR4o=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oArV5-0002Mp-FU for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 13:22:53 +0200 Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2022 13:22:51 +0200 Message-Id: <87bktvx59w.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #55645 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: tags 55645 wontfix close 55645 quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) tags 55645 wontfix close 55645 quit From unknown Sun Jun 22 22:45:32 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: Did not alter fixed versions and reopened. Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2022 18:30:02 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # Did not alter fixed versions and reopened. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 11 14:43:56 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Jul 2022 18:43:56 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40996 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oAyNw-0005IU-6u for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 14:43:56 -0400 Received: from mail-qv1-f50.google.com ([209.85.219.50]:45055) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oAyNu-0005IE-2V for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 14:43:54 -0400 Received: by mail-qv1-f50.google.com with SMTP id l15so998580qvo.11 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 11:43:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=PWf/0zhZ/Hs69i5JzARDOBess4lWpcoqhOllSRoeEUY=; b=mRMbwreXu6y5NI5xjxKxmBpXc7EgxDs6QIgOoC/ty+ilznbg3knZH4NEeKCAiOuwIJ MzHEOT00GoRSfxTH63RU02GeJ6aqi+84dmecbu7DZczNrJOMMMgF7SQoFDRVcKnuwn+V JVtp5SNISZ/XCCf3DKTAFmTR7N2P4CwTxPeclw1rPhDpr405p8SvsBNm/XcXRZxPP1Tv Zp8OpQfS0Uvv6dkH/kWkE2LQ1d7yIaUgwIIjTREC5ByJRwGrTnKODMkc5UHxmKHhKYTX ljZgBCD1+kxmZ5ag9Z7B7Hybu8rVGB9QyEh5vvHIYxIFY45h+amDbdBwrKq8Ao0GD1J+ sQpQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=PWf/0zhZ/Hs69i5JzARDOBess4lWpcoqhOllSRoeEUY=; b=bVLh1Y7s4AFSCeIe9JWEpwGUGXaX15Dz44IBPM5NFZwre6fszHwHfQE2LHdFkKAJnj afw6HgystBlHKvHqlmxGry5J7Ac9tDD8v8WwFR495jf3edBtFJ5kNH1PG374XY8nkFZX WJxxEjMCm3EWAfFiP8XsAe7NUqvNr5vigbvCUe4reXpBwnCX/of0m9voY8kT0Ho0XSYN Z10pJIdZmVukvnsmtvcVMOw5lYxKKvRf9w1ihoQCcb1svinY8A3w9/K2twxYYQwTlMkZ wF+vy/iPHOxLq63LD3dhdcbuUqYV4Hs4CssihH9TnflV665kXW0+DRSMGf4S6E/HO3RA CEuQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora+R3dPMZuTxqOKzUwJAl+XaxgR307geeYY1D+CnlburvP+fYxfT 8QmduWR2Z6p6H2PzPS4fs9n+ktKLTFF0H28zpKao43ik X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1uVzPlL1CXNyy66UMT8slPoavqx+4mq/NQenQOKCcBDRg8DzVmZR0446VPOzRuJ1tVOv3jRyARtuzEeBYodaNs= X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:25cb:b0:16b:e975:5a45 with SMTP id jc11-20020a17090325cb00b0016be9755a45mr19846262plb.31.1657565016335; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 11:43:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2022 11:43:23 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > This was a month ago, and I think the conclusion here is that we don't > want to add an option to tweak this printing behaviour (or guarantee > that we won't change printing in general), so I'm closing this bug > report. I still need an actual solution here. Will a new stable print function be implemented in 29 that matches the old behavior? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 11 23:04:38 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Jul 2022 03:04:38 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41363 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oB6CU-0003tI-CI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 23:04:38 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:60630) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oB6CS-0003sr-96 for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 23:04:36 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:33786) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oB6CN-0007Op-0I; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 23:04:31 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=HHZUH6wgfzGmI7T/hmJ15MBtVQKvA7PD/4hQJb4NhRM=; b=fk+GGw/rqB/9 kjvbWfzREUb6Q9MMNloEuPnJYRsDmadwmjaGdZ2C65TSqvoXQR6J3rV4jl06+O34KxkGEWuCdqjI4 T6EZx+Uj5Sc7J6S8biiyZCvCgRNisT4Q8XH1B/20Ih8RF9Tc2Kku2JcWdiHP8B8btpJCip5Km9el1 9JA7MmZ5kVOwiE63ZEWbe9eoUxFM6kFGBLQwix/YsI0YaUhy0n7p8yHNo9dv537Lji0aPVU9tLiYF Js/wcYXQm47sYVkc6hGrCS2H0Jvlkix1vWGaa+fJ3MYtclYMUlTFB4FTxouMnjDTVgimox/AqlSx/ lzITvKmEJJfsiVViqCPh9g==; Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oB6CL-0000Zr-9J; Mon, 11 Jul 2022 23:04:29 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Mon, 11 Jul 2022 13:22:45 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2022 23:04:29 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: tgbugs@gmail.com, eliz@gnu.org, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > This was a month ago, and I think the conclusion here is that we don't > want to add an option to tweak this printing behaviour (or guarantee > that we won't change printing in general), so I'm closing this bug > report. Did we implement something else to make it easier to compare structures including hash tables, for equal contents? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jul 12 08:45:03 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Jul 2022 12:45:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41857 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBFGA-0007Gh-Su for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 08:45:03 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:36712) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBFG9-0007FY-9w for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 08:45:01 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=tAfWM/YmYYzcRHgHMknEdFHlglWS4ZIl7tYzxVIuxXY=; b=V8TLZTcAxLW5w8Iskl9faSCLiu ocD9NcL0UuN+7WEp6GGjWT52UitkT/KS9jXSt22zszRDYsl/IZUQ8T3FweVtnODrZvOx+ixTQ+31g cxS51w5PWVV2nI3wecREs2SXFYGKB4BZYwBXcJSD1uSCJQ5AwnrhQONNZ5kBZ7QaPtBA=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oBFG0-0007S7-Cr; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 14:44:54 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Tom Gillespie Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions In-Reply-To: (Tom Gillespie's message of "Mon, 11 Jul 2022 11:43:23 -0700") References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAJ1BMVEXNsl+1qG2rlVTO xp65kjqRcDSMdEToxl1nTydHNx1nYE8yKhr///8MU+0wAAAAAWJLR0QMgbNRYwAAAAd0SU1FB+YH DAwsAioawnEAAAGdSURBVDjLfdFBb4IwFAfwspF4VbcPILjscxgshjOjptltSyTOE5eFnZdhitcl Cw3HXYxXT4Yvt1dKS1HcPxza93uPYkUIYo3OM56iM3CdkeOOXFcC6nY7LaBbE+DRcH6EBqv/cDky dg3RAHJPnD6wRpiEvTDExBhpAd1gsnzpA3tGorADaQPIjz4NGKSpmvGjTMMdSiFJ0kxkky6kCugE WZYJ4m3YBpip61GQosTGAJ44a2iZgAKAwFX3M1WQDAT4nvq1GtKrkAYRjvzXa+BNGphrSAQs3Abs uTHxhSNPTWADPjIALME24R0mFvhBtF9AuMBQnGHIXF8iDjK89ETNJ5SQJ4TlmhCawZ/uLymD5Pwb EdiKUFZgkkG3KHMBdURbAUOL5zdeRwKT44xtH+m6hfqtENhuV5RKOCLWlnn5E9N9vagayGVbuY0p dJSnqgHOFSzpTpQlFKrMyyxc7/JSAtepeMXCeLPKO1BVonFH4njPyi5ACsoADutLgA/ZH1huQH1g nZNcNiA24uMK7RKqy/wDVX+O6BBvDj35/QOTbX9P8qncFgAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAy Mi0wNy0xMlQxMjo0NDowMiswMDowMLsKXPUAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjItMDctMTJU MTI6NDQ6MDIrMDA6MDDKV+RJAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Hercules & Love Affair's _In Amber_: "Who Will Save Us Now?" Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2022 14:44:51 +0200 Message-ID: <87mtdezeik.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Tom Gillespie writes: > I still need an actual solution here. Will a new stable print function be > implemented in 29 that matches the old behavior? Nope. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Tom Gillespie writes: > I still need an actual solution here. Will a new stable print function be > implemented in 29 that matches the old behavior? Nope. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jul 12 08:45:22 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Jul 2022 12:45:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41862 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBFGU-0007bS-AY for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 08:45:22 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:36730) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBFGS-0007Tu-HG for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 08:45:21 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=8TGSgTiJJpX+rVddy1QaI1roch+841Dr7gNmJWHf/zQ=; b=plM9wiH7GlDh+93gqhYo2uDCbm UoXu1zZF5rkvDlBtk7KskYYOaj8glBYOxJlzeG4YQwHIkJTERW26fvtD/GLnQk12AOHgLxuswDQHB W1FgQrHu6SeUUWGzhT4ngNm+x8tQi6CbAscfFWC2pp7J5UZddHOBXphzQknDCu7keatw=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oBFGJ-0007SN-FN; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 14:45:14 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Richard Stallman Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Mon, 11 Jul 2022 23:04:29 -0400") References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAJ1BMVEXNsl+1qG2rlVTO xp65kjqRcDSMdEToxl1nTydHNx1nYE8yKhr///8MU+0wAAAAAWJLR0QMgbNRYwAAAAd0SU1FB+YH DAwsAioawnEAAAGdSURBVDjLfdFBb4IwFAfwspF4VbcPILjscxgshjOjptltSyTOE5eFnZdhitcl Cw3HXYxXT4Yvt1dKS1HcPxza93uPYkUIYo3OM56iM3CdkeOOXFcC6nY7LaBbE+DRcH6EBqv/cDky dg3RAHJPnD6wRpiEvTDExBhpAd1gsnzpA3tGorADaQPIjz4NGKSpmvGjTMMdSiFJ0kxkky6kCugE WZYJ4m3YBpip61GQosTGAJ44a2iZgAKAwFX3M1WQDAT4nvq1GtKrkAYRjvzXa+BNGphrSAQs3Abs uTHxhSNPTWADPjIALME24R0mFvhBtF9AuMBQnGHIXF8iDjK89ETNJ5SQJ4TlmhCawZ/uLymD5Pwb EdiKUFZgkkG3KHMBdURbAUOL5zdeRwKT44xtH+m6hfqtENhuV5RKOCLWlnn5E9N9vagayGVbuY0p dJSnqgHOFSzpTpQlFKrMyyxc7/JSAtepeMXCeLPKO1BVonFH4njPyi5ACsoADutLgA/ZH1huQH1g nZNcNiA24uMK7RKqy/wDVX+O6BBvDj35/QOTbX9P8qncFgAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAy Mi0wNy0xMlQxMjo0NDowMiswMDowMLsKXPUAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjItMDctMTJU MTI6NDQ6MDIrMDA6MDDKV+RJAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Hercules & Love Affair's _In Amber_: "Who Will Save Us Now?" Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2022 14:45:11 +0200 Message-ID: <87ilo2zei0.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Richard Stallman writes: > Did we implement something else to make it easier to compare > structures including hash tables, for equal contents? Nope. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: tgbugs@gmail.com, eliz@gnu.org, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Richard Stallman writes: > Did we implement something else to make it easier to compare > structures including hash tables, for equal contents? Nope. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jul 12 23:16:33 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 03:16:34 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44087 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBSrQ-0001Jw-Dw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 23:16:33 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:50368) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBSrO-0001De-8y for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 23:16:22 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:45490) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oBSrJ-0004wI-0E; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 23:16:17 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=Yfaj+VX2FY3FXJBqFs9Jj7GGI4+Mn1odCIL069Dfms4=; b=IKz3+epnnp9t ETRozqoOPTMKUKNgitlltJNW2VTuce13tDOBNf7cmKjtQBG5HIsk1SjcxK4bLUt/AfqYx8wNdbgQk JWyqE90Lz6YDGcGsUeMTdLnAaaKc6sQtdnnUHaFYzViBAy5HNYKT1Q/rSBICg6nYooj8+64Z42O+6 MEuFKjkRva1K7ZrGP67z0s7cWeoreFKGOgKYS5VbFWi9zHug8852tcQ9QOjRNxLIRKPJ5DErBadaC LJ0/xEjMRLBIvY79sxgvWbSMGNQRdAPfsj8EffqtJe4bX0uA32auBs/ZTyslcpTMvHWzoSJTuF9RX vcxQQOTRXLT6kErHsgnWEw==; Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oBSrH-0000Ma-Rp; Tue, 12 Jul 2022 23:16:15 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87ilo2zei0.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Tue, 12 Jul 2022 14:45:11 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> <87ilo2zei0.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2022 23:16:15 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: tgbugs@gmail.com, eliz@gnu.org, 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > Did we implement something else to make it easier to compare > > structures including hash tables, for equal contents? > Nope. I hope someone will do that. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 19:26:30 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 23:26:30 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47959 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBlkU-00042G-8F for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 19:26:30 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f49.google.com ([209.85.216.49]:43894) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBlkO-00041v-V9 for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 19:26:28 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f49.google.com with SMTP id o5-20020a17090a3d4500b001ef76490983so583169pjf.2 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 16:26:24 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=PQjJ3T4nNbag1zHqIEUjoC7Sz/+RCEqEX2SnwKnGW2g=; b=NewH+z3pCh7JRGsyKxdB/MQ1MGsgPJDKh4lcqnrxqAsHkNqf5cgDfNa+Zw5YqoY9YS J49AUk/lQXqDyJZhUIyOROR/1biWvuVrCE6Iac3jAP9LWUIZ7AfMaV2JCz9VRQo9lFcK LWHgXTuQgjmC8f4pKCtEFJWdM/JVlefnanzb6jAUZ9EchJkuq7xIJxxZUI8fsT3gsjWw MhfxtVQ6M4aYgzdz7g0DOfeBA/qYrEsr4+zSFRhMbgxF2yv3G7AFqewwWXhUhvYuNuVQ xjL9oHRQvghXXsJPyhZGx25cY76iQUayiIrBK4+NAYpXLLqAO370WRhAgvRl+d848pGO FN/A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=PQjJ3T4nNbag1zHqIEUjoC7Sz/+RCEqEX2SnwKnGW2g=; b=NHDNDI5Rq4mqQvM8vGkpjGaWW9324ZTrPMJ6ab2wGhq+QKCxcCwUfYiGZO2ns0eTJ1 q1W7pZ+/2AmLwagEOSo3FqQWrOVftWseDaPGxLNTvTq14rnQ8OBOXJzpCbKq4MydNajj jLFXC77Q2DRNOwJppWrlwzFLvUwWS0kMbBe9Y0K/GWoJb5SufUtbYr6zTiNKD+0vZiE8 uO/mxbl+attFVIK4+BgHiLdWZgAAWjeG+9WmNum9GWLx8EJuYN0WGWyQED8SqIJDZOXD LKaQKJ6g+gxCjUl/mAWtUvR5Tg+Nb5tcv5zIxgOxRvtbDxfXvbbEmkwPfvv2943AvWDg Fjfg== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora9Wfx2UyPmrOnUHKKV2dW5MwLcEy3T8/sytVwfzImkyMksyQO7c fxY/uWIc4uzbhVwalkYTC4u4F2PN7Vy+hCfiTJaB7GF/ X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1swdUw16VVjTuZxsODAT7yGqkk5FZEKjnq7y9sQK4xGu/UHDRomeG5W1vp78yaWlc6sDgPU7JJaZxlZnUOM6qg= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:f646:b0:168:e2da:8931 with SMTP id m6-20020a170902f64600b00168e2da8931mr5380411plg.84.1657754779067; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 16:26:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> <87mtdezeik.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <87mtdezeik.fsf@gnus.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 16:26:07 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > > I still need an actual solution here. Will a new stable print function be > > implemented in 29 that matches the old behavior? > > Nope. If I were to send a patch with such functionality and stability guarantees would it be considered? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 14 13:22:30 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jul 2022 17:22:30 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38746 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oC2Xm-000213-H1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 13:22:30 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:36684) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oC2Xk-00020o-Jk for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 13:22:29 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=VE2rIXozGc95mKQdFRtBWq5pnqRwpXhnqvj5jKd4rxQ=; b=LqRJ4YCaYR5TDCFT1SxcHtNWM4 Q/JllG0klXxmne+UWYkNqEZaw6Eh+DXqXJCtjCZ5z6EBeCDmXkBZEGOYnu0PbY+XYXudlrHOjK60D iMLwnI5Sfx6bQwsaCvhLxMmwiLmNhk+wwx/TEweXwXqv+HezlGhJ4TaHsM6u/qVOR99Q=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oC2Xb-0004cZ-3V; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 19:22:21 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Tom Gillespie Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions In-Reply-To: (Tom Gillespie's message of "Wed, 13 Jul 2022 16:26:07 -0700") References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> <87mtdezeik.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEWbclq2i2SNcVVN MSasPzb///9/8nd/AAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+YHDhELGl1EEOoAAAGcSURBVDjLdZOL ccMwCEAJ6QBRzwNQ0QES0ABxpP1nKiDLie2ay50lPf4QgAuE5JyZ4tMFUjwj2VmPYL2ZyjjeOlD/ kQNcdUJJ9iZvW+331ZWdIoRK3oi9W0LkKe0AxPM/gCAjWhmCe4DkAVUMRq7cczQQ9SlRpjCyR75b SR6fhQWIwJVZPmKzqDBSNLKXk9FDZ2ZVdSXJutTZi7OrqgCKeIhAi7k9uyqFRhzMguOW1QKFWHQM ZxGgK3qe0XYO0PU0uoh57W4OD2LAIhAT0gAenD0bAB1V9LZjuBcCcj9uNGZp6SO6hZV1eY8WvD3Q AXzOHNiTu5rVADEHXzUDeM1EiwnFPtlsxCtgitkvxUZL0BLybvqeklofrLBYQvbRmDn+YL6M9hjr n1Jafaik1O68Bc+pFn2kNLWdRWtf1UHq0+QAdvytj291gNEtDgtXKXVO2sqrxVw2ruZUq9Zc9lm1 ear6KSuY5smCsA68/P3KPLX28p0ob2ALqgbqbHnJFQ6u2hM50w234CgLGM07NFHlxOLU1U7kDPAJ 8BT+AKy7pC/MFreOAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIyLTA3LTE0VDE3OjExOjI1KzAwOjAw 5UjY9wAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMi0wNy0xNFQxNzoxMToyNSswMDowMJQVYEsAAAAA SUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: Heidi Berry's _Love_: "Great Big Silver Key" Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2022 19:22:18 +0200 Message-ID: <87a69ba9th.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Tom Gillespie writes: > If I were to send a patch with such functionality and stability > guarantees would it be considered? Like I've said before, we (the Emacs maintainers) would not guarantee that Emacs' `prin1' will remain the same. If you want to create a package that does printing in a different way, you're free to do [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Tom Gillespie writes: > If I were to send a patch with such functionality and stability > guarantees would it be considered? Like I've said before, we (the Emacs maintainers) would not guarantee that Emacs' `prin1' will remain the same. If you want to create a package that does printing in a different way, you're free to do so, of course -- we have the `cl-prin1' framework in Emacs already, and you can use that to print things any way you want o. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 14 17:36:29 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jul 2022 21:36:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39031 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oC6VY-0006ob-Oz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 17:36:29 -0400 Received: from mail-pl1-f180.google.com ([209.85.214.180]:37377) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oC6VW-0006oM-4x for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 17:36:27 -0400 Received: by mail-pl1-f180.google.com with SMTP id f11so1562680plr.4 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 14:36:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=swHgWl1xAqt5THC/tP4NzekIHQ3mqDtkrLlUnxOK3Qg=; b=NbsM91V94EAwRXDdA+60tbQ86M4dCkr20OQR3jYp1IseSSVTnkPYK6uwR1RU5Y4xjy t2b8i8fgwKwYpNLvePviSzZyInPhQ6mPp7/W92Rln1pDe/t1Yd41YP4WHBrzrQ6rmoRi lx07Nv7ZJ+X/i/Yi7vzyHTUhxYPESLnkKCBVnNne9xOdFy186Uu10OasYWhpBcGc/kk1 WBnHw8AmH4DDz9deqHBUr0u0rBgHTAhpIo1rrltAjQuOfs+h5VuxTttX10Q9Olt3AeK0 lvUG1QwF6+RbskHtMfewwBmiP/18gmV7dIZJDxmq5BLpnqbn4MrPMwPF4whhtOu28BKc kr+g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=swHgWl1xAqt5THC/tP4NzekIHQ3mqDtkrLlUnxOK3Qg=; b=hChENMQf81HldjTAinEk/MkpICK9zah+rNWlTDBAte2/bHfgnoWmGOGeTK85jdZzgq wlQ5Gx+EgobF+zkdehNXCpaUdyXZiwijqPMyd9M+YSTTP7Azd9DsmWfbgL6W62+6pXUB rtCG6tujXmDdeRA5FUd/3dwHNCoGaadTqprGjb2N0dCgXLdKBEzLCPHH/CVCIUkh3FHZ aduWK77+pwbTgDOFEi2bUYOiBHgibTLsFS6VcBE1gD5Q+r65OUjorhBSeORTpE9UYmxu rIDBcdV3QjtQ8VIL8SAaYPGn4yVCKQYVISjNGqESq3KyJd6yhl6U+/kqBduabziS9wqx UvGA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora/N41DFywEjrn/Eq0wpi+RPgZG5EB710Ajq/0WIa8bBUgWkNRAO gIURCVxndG3jMY0WwjjFY9OaAgNH7+U92514EM8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1vWoCca07VcgWbVuoUw93dLD/9HWFyiX7n6/kdxrrn2LyM7zEYpqkg1dcBNPKfojPYcTqhsFll3FX7AegWqdF4= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:1643:b0:1f0:2094:57db with SMTP id il3-20020a17090b164300b001f0209457dbmr11680546pjb.140.1657834580214; Thu, 14 Jul 2022 14:36:20 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> <87mtdezeik.fsf@gnus.org> <87a69ba9th.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <87a69ba9th.fsf@gnus.org> From: Tom Gillespie Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2022 14:36:08 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > Like I've said before, we (the Emacs maintainers) would not guarantee > that Emacs' `prin1' will remain the same. If you want to create a > package that does printing in a different way, you're free to do so, of > course -- we have the `cl-prin1' framework in Emacs already, and you can > use that to print things any way you want Unfortunately none of these work for my use case because cl-prin1 is not available before emacs 26 and it differs too much from prin1 to be useful without requiring additional code. I have to fit all the code under 3000 chars because it is in an eval local variable and the changes for cl-prin1 are too extensive. I'm not 100% sure how to use cl-prin1 but as far as I can tell defining new cl-print-object methods (e.g. for symbol) is highly invasive and makes changes to the entirety of the user's runtime. Would a patch that leveraged cl-prin1 to create a function that matches the old behavior of prin1 be more viable? Without that my only solution is to restrict symbol names so that they do not include . and ? by raising an error if they are detected, and hoping that prin1 doesn't undergo another change in the future in the readable subset of objects. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 18 14:13:31 2022 Received: (at 55645) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Jul 2022 18:13:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52036 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oDVFK-0004kk-Q2 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 14:13:31 -0400 Received: from mail-pf1-f179.google.com ([209.85.210.179]:46886) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oDVFI-0004kW-Cu for 55645@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 14:13:29 -0400 Received: by mail-pf1-f179.google.com with SMTP id c3so10433303pfb.13 for <55645@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 11:13:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:cc; bh=eVCIbxV9xocfXfcDC3haXJO4zD+2uTwjJ50gFylpWzQ=; b=c1sQnUwGSReZQW2cEnbI4FoYeWeojPqOvP3CAuxIGhFQ+SSKFvxgUxo8xBWe9md2tR lPCkrqygMbv3O1NspxwDlcqQHGwthGTyVekTKLIidBLEdGZ2Ujk6ZXLFcYkFpQOIZWs5 iDxE0mUiA5s9MghWz5AC1PJmib8NwRjOTqKTGDtZWEN5jNLFf7MPwDBYGVPEVgD101La ItC1CTPYn5HT+oXAuLBXQaVl6KkDr9Tk+hWirGp+pGk8EkqHh+SlL+N4GJK6RcV4GYjk Wa3QDn9AIO6I3C/ULBSNp+gWpcjznK77EAOVtW7q35B0BRXE8CiByoUlhnHVlJ9gwQ4b nawA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:cc; bh=eVCIbxV9xocfXfcDC3haXJO4zD+2uTwjJ50gFylpWzQ=; b=idDt+cMbBFXcERZJzF/bvn80ekkoy4ktclVyWFE8W+A/HD32GwHeuPTu0bDHTFilGV 04kpd3BL+wjx7ZaH0cvRZVXlGhWwdAUoWZCiCOgciUcIaF34g5uzhlZV8GdmVV8dASvO bTbwCJENd5jtktiAS1oisPLUfEkORLz4FeXVEzKO8TnsclCJq+auj6tbIjoHr2CcZYvv AHyOOVUiE984meGccXMcvN2YQeWXJQfK1/P7ePpZUQX1sANV5/sE7b900tYDE0nHkyb/ lrMDQQ/JgbU59D5PWJt+qkUdVHcsx4/mZE0K6TD3m2rz+VMGjdW2lQFAducLCpbJuAvR 9jGQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora/ykQLJZT5xkM+sRBzuIvX7oL+zYk9FlvEgv2jD1oo5npctsApM AUInou5S6IgUM/zFMDwzAJ8Wcg+s5pAvRlZv0Sc9TAeu X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1viqudLetgO30vrfZd2+/qgmsODXaCoLkbZ871aPy4Vfm/NAD2sFwcJkLmTr4oOCiEWUvimlzcA5DQD4IbMn7o= X-Received: by 2002:a63:e90f:0:b0:415:9dcf:c641 with SMTP id i15-20020a63e90f000000b004159dcfc641mr25375305pgh.476.1658168002209; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 11:13:22 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87zgj4biw7.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1b9ser.fsf@gnus.org> <874k1a54ap.fsf@gnus.org> <87o7zg1nut.fsf@gnus.org> <83v8tojrr5.fsf@gnu.org> <83czfobxht.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgio5t52.fsf@gnu.org> <87czebx5a2.fsf@gnus.org> <87mtdezeik.fsf@gnus.org> <87a69ba9th.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: From: Tom Gillespie Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2022 11:13:10 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#55645: src/print.c; print_object changes make it impossible to compare elisp code across versions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Ok. I went with the band non-portable symbols solution and it works. Here's to hoping nothing changes for another 30 years! Will close. 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X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 55645 Cc: 55645@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) Ok. I went with the band non-portable symbols solution and it works. Here's to hoping nothing changes for another 30 years! Will close. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 18 14:53:27 2022 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Jul 2022 18:53:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52111 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oDVrz-0007zT-C8 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 14:53:27 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f43.google.com ([209.85.216.43]:52182) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oDVrv-0007zE-GK for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 14:53:25 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f43.google.com with SMTP id o15so12604543pjh.1 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 11:53:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=EkddnTf0ztbeofAW/8QAKX0BLICYrT+s9J/BNshRIKA=; b=jysRRg2l4o8hx0Ou2ElAaTjLzuPj9DBSixnDSASVFTdZQ/SoU/9iG5pr/rZ32OJF1j 45Wlp0+VsaB9DgpCZ6NRjaLXRZw+xnH+TAZnYm6qk/gCUaWUzdp+bFDoTuAK+smZFyAO RAxw/8t0fmhr4YM43CzPfv8HcUoiSsOKN/u6STYMQDEpJEqI6ztHnRPxuYu98fb4Op2d V9789G/VDm4tbGNTxvv1EmlvXRXT3fp38ZaNHVQjFMWtH7nyjV5RhlivoEw640gmrNKi +gPshPptF00UhLjQKbnGYwR+2EgumRWR9rWA949nkzILP7B1ZajArC71tg797KHEh4jU 6UuQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=EkddnTf0ztbeofAW/8QAKX0BLICYrT+s9J/BNshRIKA=; b=vGNNMZ7UW2ytrO/CxlBzawk+3h0o75hj0ffXSkT0oHo2THTF7+Ybg4xcUgmEStcZYN QXrM+sz32/YglXVX3Btn2YhLhOq87wh7zH57owEGPGaak3PHH8K5G65Ws+3gPQ7ElnAs 9ZZy5YpbbjTIlh13Tn7FpX9OHScaFzjMnefZGq+ItETxEMRNTj2EmItAlpWprVX/ETS2 MgefGX78cKqyE9OStDibFezfpwO9oAVgYwuNxZvL++uLGxb3/Kn9vZuRwX+MMI+DyHzE /04lqoeX8h3Aduy/qwcGN3fICA1rLMNfwoIGedTtMG/Cg45JdCxPhpU/SIyKujaPmZhi mo+Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora/Y6MxM336FtmctYA5vAE/OUkNC9FgT1Bi9PyQjDOYrgbb5LRNn YGm90jCTrYEV+qiNze++xteqqeMZDuBLoVoGaS5ppYTs2Ok= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1uOKW2F78vl7slLEJjCdNBeLtQ/g7DVBPlSk0uiNtQOAZd5/i5pnYn1aYeeLaR3JlF4RCiS+VpdskylX/6MDDM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:25cb:b0:16b:e975:5a45 with SMTP id jc11-20020a17090325cb00b0016be9755a45mr29443713plb.31.1658170397307; Mon, 18 Jul 2022 11:53:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Tom Gillespie Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2022 11:53:06 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: close 55645 To: control@debbugs.gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) close 55645 From unknown Sun Jun 22 22:45:32 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. 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