From unknown Sat Aug 16 16:07:05 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#53907: font-ibm-plex has a nonfree dependency Resent-From: Greg Farough Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 21:40:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 53907 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 53907@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-guix@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.164444279421607 (code B ref -1); Wed, 09 Feb 2022 21:40:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Feb 2022 21:39:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52993 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nHugs-0005cQ-2P for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:39:54 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:36342) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nHugq-0005cJ-CC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:39:52 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33742) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nHugq-0006wd-5c for bug-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:39:52 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=39696 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nHugp-00041s-SA for bug-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:39:51 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:Date:Subject:To:From:in-reply-to: references; bh=H/RAUBTanxkaAuvNDpf/1VY2qW1qSleUOVqBna72XFk=; b=T5P30puXqdkbL5 3jTRHFXX2PxBRwAGwp91/GhSu3LX1pQ8Kh0ZRN98gx21YqeefETPAxCfB1seqAKglsTjxHm+oNV8D 5hoFIjjGp717AfvyrV6LNC8mBz+9vHUvETIhxwiYn08aW7GAsgVXjWTWfnqb36Lqb8Tu+CY1NAs2B Fc9NVASYanlzCtOgXow5dF1QiNhEepYulrc5VplSNlg39TpJzyjRAq4kq8hiZOiemeiyut17aaNPv iAxL+unT6lFSHN6Q7HaX3EbJE8ATxiZkkDNLU/dCW4h+jAmCu/TeZ7syE+cH+KEq2nxPZrj8/atWf HLQEUj5BpMHJ6hQGFq4g==; Received: from ool-ae2ce474.dyn.optonline.net ([174.44.228.116]:57852 helo=willow) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nHugp-0005Y0-LG for bug-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:39:51 -0500 From: Greg Farough Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:39:40 -0500 Message-ID: <87zgmzvhwj.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Guix developers: As far as I can tell, the IBM Plex family of fonts requires the nonfree program FontLab Studio to build. From=20Plex's GitHub[1] page: > To build binary font files from .vfb sources you need FontLab Studio > 5. A Python script called IBM Plex export FDK files.py is necessary > to export the proper files from FontLab. To run this script you=E2=80=99ll > need the RoboFab library. Also, you=E2=80=99ll need to have the Adobe Font > Development Kit for OpenType (AFDKO) installed. This seems to be a problem for the FSDG[2]'s requirement that a distro be "self-hosting:" > In particular, a free system distribution should be self-hosting. > This means that you must be able to develop and build the system > with tools that the system provides you. As a result, a free system > distribution cannot include free software that can only be built by > using nonfree software. This is one of the reasons Debian[3] has moved the font to the "contrib" section of its repos. > IBM releases Plex as "open source", but unfortunately the freedom > status of the font is less than ideal, as it requires non-free > software to be built from source (see README.md, Requirements section, > and [0]). The problematic step is the hinting, which is done with > FontLab Studio, which is proprietary software. There is currently no > Free Software program that is able to work with the high-level hinting > command language used by FontLab Studio. So, I think this font should probably be removed from Guix. (Disclaimer: I'm an FSF employee, but consider this a personal bug report sent from a personal address.) Thanks for your work. =2Dg [1]: https://github.com/IBM/plex [2]: https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines.html [3]: https://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs//contrib/f/fonts-ibm= -plex/fonts-ibm-plex_5.1.3-1_copyright =2D-=20 "We carry a new world here, in our hearts. That world is growing in this minute." --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJCBAEBCAAsFiEEfMx+zT146zhPbALIlmlRYXoUnHMFAmIENJwOHGdyZWdmQGdu dS5vcmcACgkQlmlRYXoUnHO1ng//YWNnHf0D7Wl056ePMfy62pt5HNosZBy0zsx2 z+HVQChKFUB7tcws+9N8peF+PwvB5dAfRVK88nuooNH4irgLbF7z2Q+qeO8fYdQA kOM5gQMCWdEC+SwYfok/ommSxugui/UYlGB+7xsWyymtuCq1qSCnty4PRm2/vVP3 g/rhwP7sDUKe2exQMhcHuE7EgcftLl+cjETEwXtVuggof/4I2svzLPX8XNsjnWzv zfR0uMkmh1o0vzcVYU0MUBpYhXwdlCAyGlg2V+FXk1jdn9qSVxCeBb0VUi5IkdF3 mPpxuxqShgRCOpRvNlKxPoIblASn6M0QsetkLXd7HM5T4I7NDKsprAudq7tFjYVW nr6YbFniOq6ZWfvPVpKFeYSaciFnWMjmQH/nIXkXUG7Td+gyNIlSTxia0+tsNxmR QguuxJ9m+XDgPClpj34TitpQnaiwy8JC4UufxqvDjdPMQff6sq7KB4p4MfJEBy63 HXG7wCqLBmFjBQ5p2NZTyQUYA1aN8LX3NLP5xHvCzIThhfasA5jjJ1dRXfbK3/9C hskp5eALIyB42c8LYrxEAavThkEY9vpDFHMvzSIZiugsMBzD15ff5U57Yp8YrT6q 1l7y+/7bqn8glH49ZQARrJE9wfYG+bRmOeWow7zVYsw+U2iOH5XzDFBpIxh3S6TV EYIe0v8= =3F0J -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From unknown Sat Aug 16 16:07:05 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#53907: font-ibm-plex has a nonfree dependency Resent-From: Philip McGrath Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 04:10:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 53907 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: gregf@gnu.org, 53907@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: Greg Farough , bug-guix@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.164446615830351 (code B ref -1); Thu, 10 Feb 2022 04:10:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Feb 2022 04:09:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53239 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nI0li-0007tS-7h for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 23:09:18 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:52188) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nI0lg-0007tL-4c for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 23:09:17 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:55242) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nI0lf-0007zC-Vb for bug-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 23:09:15 -0500 Received: from [2607:f8b0:4864:20::833] (port=41707 helo=mail-qt1-x833.google.com) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nI0lY-0005Gl-TO for bug-guix@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 23:09:15 -0500 Received: by mail-qt1-x833.google.com with SMTP id y8so3925947qtn.8 for ; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 20:09:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=philipmcgrath.com; s=google; h=message-id:date:mime-version:user-agent:subject:content-language:to :references:from:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=fKcrkkYARNBpWycOQfkY/QRhLS8SrNgLKHyVEugmJV4=; b=VDgV87EdRvNQn0HGRjFrTNDkGSQvwm5+xSjfmPfq7rJaDp9saIEtqggErvGh2l9la4 lI/maVu2ybDXj/D2LFcxlWwOldwO3MlMbjoAYwjI9G3TtKGfEpoIAHLjWJl7PdATKSdo 4uJe5Jxi5wcYnhhNgtqB/TPfVX/9Y9DVw0h96rZduib6rjPGjrLbExiAITDlUMOsQ005 8aAg/YJvHlMIK+Rv+BUkl2jW3G+19sZAKl1LimHUzHgw6ajx+GhBC/KkUQJ58Vsi0+N8 uI8oKU/N06wv3njYGYrNvds0JD3I+Unf//UrzqefOXMBNyWonZFKtxylVJXAEdKYozEu PH7g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:date:mime-version:user-agent:subject :content-language:to:references:from:in-reply-to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=fKcrkkYARNBpWycOQfkY/QRhLS8SrNgLKHyVEugmJV4=; b=GIkNRUkpJP6tMhx/6EluuBEf/9DVO3pLJZ5xa9pTPESdR0wr2dgcZdmHstd+vEFw6w ZRNzoXq6chzbt4lAk/5Em4BEg9u8O7kZz6m4M7oU1WI1+3h7SkdtM2p7jpbADL5LwrLU Yk3Hdf1oUoZpsVcywBwOcAnAwqddHo00m6Oz7+P6B/AyqpjlJxMRdutpjMdRI/Q4t9x6 psAh9D9Wc8kfYrkbv7uGstTpjktqJnMFrroUss8QeeoQZA3VUztzWwTVr+aK5v9GSu8o 8OOIDpuJYzeS3rv/wK3ck6BNGRVsKp0+ZpHc+21zlEmARghH5tdkIj8rgVJ1A0GIQnJ/ ajTQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530NwbEBPxgPhRq/SuYf/U8NOULAfKBIZDxp/coubzFjbU4lsLmX U40oiZXjEk8z+IihJb+0K7gqrFGNrniC/gQP00g= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxipUWNHpEbcBjwA7LyoSh5SINUFyql8VDfq/UIGnq/jcPLLG81mRqoxNsQCV+CTtch9OvfEg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:622a:1448:: with SMTP id v8mr3566301qtx.412.1644466147306; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 20:09:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.45.36] (c-73-125-98-51.hsd1.fl.comcast.net. [73.125.98.51]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 18sm9268282qka.126.2022.02.09.20.09.06 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 09 Feb 2022 20:09:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2022 23:09:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.5.0 Content-Language: en-US References: <87zgmzvhwj.fsf@gnu.org> From: Philip McGrath In-Reply-To: <87zgmzvhwj.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2607:f8b0:4864:20::833 (failed) Received-SPF: neutral client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::833; envelope-from=philip@philipmcgrath.com; helo=mail-qt1-x833.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -4 X-Spam_score: -0.5 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (-0.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, PDS_HP_HELO_NORDNS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) Hi, On 2/9/22 16:39, Greg Farough wrote: > Hi, Guix developers: > > As far as I can tell, the IBM Plex family of fonts requires the > nonfree program FontLab Studio to build. ... > This is one of the reasons Debian[3] has moved the font to the "contrib" > section of its repos. > >> IBM releases Plex as "open source", but unfortunately the freedom >> status of the font is less than ideal, as it requires non-free >> software to be built from source (see README.md, Requirements section, >> and [0]). The problematic step is the hinting, which is done with >> FontLab Studio, which is proprietary software. There is currently no >> Free Software program that is able to work with the high-level hinting >> command language used by FontLab Studio. > I *think* this may no longer be true---with the caveat that I know just enough about font development to know how little I really know. According to a 2019 GitHub comment[1] by Paul van der Laan (one of the IBM PLEX designers): > The IBM Plex instances started their life as interpolated files in RoboFont which were checked and refined manually for rounding errors in outlines and metrics. Settings in the font info might have been tailored for specific instances as well. Afterwards they were converted to TrueType outlines, and together with the PostScript versions they were hinted in FontLab 5. > > If you are interested to work with the instances then I strongly recommend to take the FontLab files because these are of a much higher fidelity than plain interpolated instances. > > With a utility such as vfb2ufo these files can be converted to UFO files. Although you will probably loose most, if not all all, hinting data when doing so. Apparently that final caveat is not true. In another GitHub issue[2][3] (about the proprietary FontLab 5 reaching end-of-life), Jens Kutilek wrote: > I have my own Python implementation of a FontLab-style TTH compiler which can take an UFO (from vfb2ufo so it contains the FL TT hinting code) and compile the TT instructions. I would be open to release it if there are no objections from the FontLab guys. ... > The alignment zone deltas are stored in the UFO generated by vfb2ufo, so they can be accessed there by any script working with the UFO. Searching further, I found a comment [4] on the discussion of TrueType instructions in the UFO spec saying he was working to enhance the free program ufo2ft "so FontLab hinting code from UFOs generated by vfb2ufo will compile into TTFs and stay 100% rendering-compatible with fonts generated directly from FontLab 5." This support hasn't been merged into upstream ufo2ft yet---more specifically, it was merged last fall but then reverted [5] due to (in my cursorily-formed opinion) relatively minor issues like better unit tests, but a revised pull request [6] was opened just 27 days ago. In any case, apparently the code exists. It has even used IBM Plex as an example.[7] I haven't actually tried to use it, though! -Philip [1]: https://github.com/IBM/plex/issues/228#issuecomment-460160085 [2]: https://github.com/IBM/plex/issues/206#issuecomment-458465851 [3]: https://github.com/IBM/plex/issues/206#issuecomment-458510847 [4]: https://github.com/unified-font-object/ufo-spec/issues/93 [5]: https://github.com/googlefonts/ufo2ft/pull/335#pullrequestreview-761840943 [6]: https://github.com/googlefonts/ufo2ft/pull/577 [7]: https://github.com/unified-font-object/ufo-spec/issues/93#issuecomment-496552530