From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 25 15:45:42 2022 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Jan 2022 20:45:43 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50267 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCShC-0007x1-Fr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 15:45:42 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:37708) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCShA-0007wu-NT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 15:45:41 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:51704) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nCSh8-0006nK-K3 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 15:45:39 -0500 Received: from [2a00:1450:4864:20::435] (port=43963 helo=mail-wr1-x435.google.com) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nCSh4-0005Jo-R4 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 15:45:38 -0500 Received: by mail-wr1-x435.google.com with SMTP id v13so22060090wrv.10 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 12:45:34 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=1I96UAtwfDKYocDs8/DhmrWfkzuBmLbv1mgpWi1NL4M=; b=IJ9uZEn2urlQj3kG7Qlc+I2YIq/n6cacX50+0DVdjDa8huoBQdmRtABs/5A4DhQN/6 SfI1JkcTHii79x3b0Wve12kuJD+O2fqVYFMuElWj3n1s7RANVKUt56QrOnoOxusxERsM xfMDcGHQ93IsVO9J8N9lzuKgK6Mx63SPh+SGgahnhEzcTTUvUqnOunR5X+sEAX2+YPl3 BhWI8hClKSHNzNkF3khbmW6HimVT/bQnIEgYSj7d2B2j7FeVGsegWJkDmtfsNokqeB99 XUj28kYnLMXLJLzBtlOoUifB4e+kewWmBUsuFvj/nQBZWjLn4k02vx/alhMF6pqIyUNG C/yQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=1I96UAtwfDKYocDs8/DhmrWfkzuBmLbv1mgpWi1NL4M=; b=2yHTkwpflNkwBJNMn6LyGG5F2XavNnvWoHXCYeWU7Nf85C6rsaZPLFewAF1VxC46yl NqRT1JjuYtzFNn8UyCoFKeOXrwedPqJVE5nDT7Fm1k3kLWmdQiFqIT/bcc94kvAGD5ll M6DMyFzNrGOsjlKjEz0Km45QKoqlnLroylOUflDjFF5XctVpTcTceTn3gYzdn83GzvW9 fOFki6eBAjYlVzLSqZmv8IPZSkBXoHHFgUOtiAMoKadjIZKlqlViY0aJsvwph2Ax0PkT lJ/cJVskk8BJxI8U1cVulJVR/djpmeMSb1qkETVb7Bx0zAHy/DtaoHSxjnk7uFdXcqjT Lirg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533YqzKEivdEd1osqgSlXX+m+6tVYINGOAaL7Lmjt5Ii3+uJdxoN MPcfYMvw8AnN/8cO43yxSYuGyPt99O7T1iF5JS+yp3aDVRQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzHBuU2EwPuXEk9+esWgQJOCkkfxPYB8JwD55uwuui5WamBlsi/5E/q35ddZPh4Ou8MDM/67qGT4InNULVj53U= X-Received: by 2002:adf:d849:: with SMTP id k9mr7478799wrl.380.1643143532974; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 12:45:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Sharlatan Hellseher Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 20:45:22 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: [DISCUSSION] Quality of services in reproducible build environment Guix To: bug-guix@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2a00:1450:4864:20::435 (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::435; envelope-from=sharlatanus@gmail.com; helo=mail-wr1-x435.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -12 X-Spam_score: -1.3 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, PDS_HP_HELO_NORDNS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Hi Guix team! The current QA for the accepted changes in Gujx is far away from trustible. For example, some changes in package update may cause a faileur of the whole chain of packages depending on it. It would be nice to have some soft policy of changes, check list or some procedure to have a "stable" branch which may guarantee all packages build successfully and pass of all enabled tests. I find current [[id:60941898-0ed4-4188-b473-d2dcda158d61][CI/CD]] (https://ci.guix.gnu.org/) is missleading in case of providing some visibility of all successful builds for the current pushed changes (on master branch). I would like to conclude from the CI is which commit broke how many packages. Other open question - if I've sticked to a specific "stable" branch how I may be sure that another ~guix pull~ will not break my packages in case of un-pinned version? Some missing features of CI - Timing - current view has missing a clear representation of build date-ti= me - Overall slats for the current commit to the specific branch - and how many package are become broken after update of package X. - Sort of "blocking on merge" of a commit which causes some issues (do not merge broken packages into stable branch) - Some documentation for all UI features (green dots, red dots, grey dots e= tc. https://ci.guix.gnu.org/eval/54326/dashboard) Some missing practice of packaging: - Some essential message of the reason why tests were disabled and any sort of suggestions on how to make them enabled. Contact upstream if required. - Before sending patch make sure (at least for the localhost architecture) it's built, linted and in case of bumping version - all dependent chain still can be built. Related commits and issues which broke other packages in ~master~ branch: - https://issues.guix.gnu.org/53230 - fix 6445f412b993ec7b52dc4c81e99f49af38b3a967 RawTherapee stopped building with wrong configure key, the previous update to 5.8 was never tested before been merged. #+begin_src sh git checkout master git pull git log -n1 --pretty=3D"%h %s %cd - %cn" #+end_src : 4235c6ee92 gnu: QGIS: Build without QtWebKit. Tue Jan 25 15:10:19 2022 -0500 - Leo Famulari Excess changes which could be prevented with just local attempt to build #+begin_src sh git log --grep=3D"Fix build" --pretty=3D"%h %s %cd - %cn" | wc -l #+end_src : 1025 --=20 =E2=80=A6 =D0=BD=D0=B0=D1=88 =D1=80=D0=B0=D0=B7=D1=83=D0=BC - =D0=BF=D1=80= =D0=B5=D0=B2=D0=BE=D1=81=D1=85=D0=BE=D0=B4=D0=BD=D0=B0=D1=8F =D0=BE=D0=B1= =D1=8A=D1=8F=D1=81=D0=BD=D0=B8=D1=82=D0=B5=D0=BB=D1=8C=D0=BD=D0=B0=D1=8F = =D0=BC=D0=B0=D1=88=D0=B8=D0=BD=D0=B0 =D0=BA=D0=BE=D1=82=D0=BE=D1=80=D0=B0= =D1=8F =D1=81=D0=BF=D0=BE=D1=81=D0=BE=D0=B1=D0=BD=D0=B0 =D0=BD=D0=B0=D0=B9=D1=82=D0=B8 =D1=81=D0=BC=D1=8B=D1=81=D0=BB =D0=BF=D0=BE= =D1=87=D1=82=D0=B8 =D0=B2 =D1=87=D0=B5=D0=BC =D1=83=D0=B3=D0=BE=D0=B4=D0=BD= =D0=BE, =D0=B8=D1=81=D1=82=D0=BE=D0=BB=D0=BA=D0=BE=D0=B2=D0=B0=D1=82=D1=8C = =D0=BB=D1=8E=D0=B1=D0=BE=D0=B9 =D1=84=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=BE=D0=BC=D0=B5=D0=BD, = =D0=BD=D0=BE =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=B2=D0=B5=D1=80=D1=88=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=BD=D0=BE =D0=BD=D0=B5 = =D0=B2 =D1=81=D0=BE=D1=81=D1=82=D0=BE=D1=8F=D0=BD=D0=B8=D0=B8 =D0=BF=D1=80= =D0=B8=D0=BD=D1=8F=D1=82=D1=8C =D0=BC=D1=8B=D1=81=D0=BB=D1=8C =D0=BE =D0=BD= =D0=B5=D0=BF=D1=80=D0=B5=D0=B4=D1=81=D0=BA=D0=B0=D0=B7=D1=83=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0= =BE=D1=81=D1=82=D0=B8. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 25 21:36:27 2022 Received: (at 53533) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Jan 2022 02:36:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50609 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCYAd-0002XC-9V for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:36:27 -0500 Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.28]:43581) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCYAb-0002Ww-7T for 53533@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:36:26 -0500 Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id C34E25C02AC; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:36:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:36:19 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=famulari.name; h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender :subject:subject:to:to; s=mesmtp; bh=jwPcNeAes0lAzFK73kzyH7OzWYa aL3xyRo0dY290n00=; b=FCnMKmXtjKjcgHXQLnkrxDupnCxd74CLIzST/v4+c13 S3fAM1Jn9QS3ILF+YaCYATbE1UhoDDcnr31ETHvkZV8L7Dv3pBr6iQy/lIh4TkqM Xi/ERt2KLPmaVgMds8VLP7gRTN4jhHidasiOPrGs2Xa8J1P1DDxHSceREAK5Y/ME = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:from:from :in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy :x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=jwPcNeAes0lAzFK73 kzyH7OzWYaaL3xyRo0dY290n00=; b=Byk+XOcQB5ium+DBhO02KiEn7VdxGWF8K ZUJl56oSEQ851mRlQzMobFWcQsKfNv1QohDN2oIwiITMv9jQ9qJX5EJppwukTCPE wSSCzHEdj1zlI08TxFkiWVirMLcb73PpzdnyWOR2AkWMkSOIs9qEYISJoRNG6+06 I2Ib/J+4axe7jKmeQMViNjnIcouomkaNddiX6pmiv4HM6EJWFflpxFUUtqLh5TJk Q0DzwuQ/IsVextlnum888dfKR4EVXENNAWnreyF82qE6+bBDHLm0a3W4Vyk2yib3 DX7Rm+H8vRF16lmQgiFO5JVMzoUxwXnr8B1naQ95kBIuTQqLhFHvw== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvvddrfedtgdeglecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvffukfhfgggtuggjsehttdertd dttddvnecuhfhrohhmpefnvghoucfhrghmuhhlrghrihcuoehlvghosehfrghmuhhlrghr ihdrnhgrmhgvqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpedvvddugefffeeitddthfefvdeuhffgke eikeegkeevteeghfeftefggeeuudffieenucffohhmrghinhepghhnuhdrohhrghenucev lhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehlvghosehfrg hmuhhlrghrihdrnhgrmhgv X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:36:19 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:36:17 -0500 From: Leo Famulari To: Sharlatan Hellseher Subject: Re: bug#53533: [DISCUSSION] Quality of services in reproducible build environment Guix Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53533 Cc: 53533@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 08:45:22PM +0000, Sharlatan Hellseher wrote: > Related commits and issues which broke other packages in ~master~ branch: > - https://issues.guix.gnu.org/53230 > - fix 6445f412b993ec7b52dc4c81e99f49af38b3a967 RawTherapee stopped > building with wrong configure key, > the previous update to 5.8 was never tested before been merged. The previous update of the Rawtherapee package happened in February 2020, almost two years ago. It was definitely tested at that time. Since then, some other changes in the distro broke it. > #+begin_src sh > git checkout master > git pull > git log -n1 --pretty="%h %s %cd - %cn" > #+end_src > : 4235c6ee92 gnu: QGIS: Build without QtWebKit. Tue Jan 25 15:10:19 > 2022 -0500 - Leo Famulari > > Excess changes which could be prevented with just local attempt to build > #+begin_src sh > git log --grep="Fix build" --pretty="%h %s %cd - %cn" | wc -l > #+end_src > : 1025 Can you say what this shell snippet means? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 25 21:52:02 2022 Received: (at 53533) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Jan 2022 02:52:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50616 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCYPh-0002wA-MO for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:52:02 -0500 Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.28]:52053) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCYPf-0002vs-Lc for 53533@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:52:00 -0500 Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.internal [10.202.2.45]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9145E5C0214; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:51:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:51:53 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=famulari.name; h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender :subject:subject:to:to; s=mesmtp; bh=WNaJJLgB4ke6uSSOyr9SQMZmioe zOpDCzwaSLhP5+1I=; b=Q3FGl7POQrtYAahCkTJHl/tZYh5i2rEUmmAkLwUOcCQ EyMWLnCyuQvKrkZVQqvbBFWxPbHLfjwA04nHbJNLEEbs7bn+dKFWdv8NbVMSKw3G 542lrw2IZS8Pz4rlAGMizIdGtQ4wQocQJqq5yz14MerN84e539i+45/caQ5jiVQY = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:from:from :in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy :x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=WNaJJLgB4ke6uSSOy r9SQMZmioezOpDCzwaSLhP5+1I=; b=VFlhiZaTY3YxYgIs71RQdFDwN3XdkVp+i St65jjpHJr50ugDTR3VeGfw6vwF/+NzxxZcPzS74mG0LCg+PpJumlVRAE7kmth8M kxFUcdCTVKmMquK8uKAbrrm3eeEZzAgrHwHwq4d/MVHMR+ukZWSaiC0e2DOnCT4g ucJcmh8kqifzwteDhcHXnkM8WRJwbQoZpSwfU5H+dG+CDMYVwfd9/+9XK1ok3IvK CyMx/l1WhAxlHmZ3OwqPmjAgCBJVadYwnKflY3eXXTWDaC1XUOCEC2MprAZDduvM VepM8Ndr+n41iaoCGSQDcvVLwgu+EcnbzXctlde9XteEcABuAhJCw== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvvddrfedtgdehvdcutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvffukfhfgggtuggjsehttdertd dttddvnecuhfhrohhmpefnvghoucfhrghmuhhlrghrihcuoehlvghosehfrghmuhhlrghr ihdrnhgrmhgvqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpedvvddugefffeeitddthfefvdeuhffgke eikeegkeevteeghfeftefggeeuudffieenucffohhmrghinhepghhnuhdrohhrghenucev lhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehlvghosehfrg hmuhhlrghrihdrnhgrmhgv X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:51:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 21:51:51 -0500 From: Leo Famulari To: Sharlatan Hellseher Subject: Re: bug#53533: [DISCUSSION] Quality of services in reproducible build environment Guix Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53533 Cc: 53533@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 08:45:22PM +0000, Sharlatan Hellseher wrote: > The current QA for the accepted changes in Gujx is far away from > trustible. For example, some > changes in package update may cause a faileur of the whole chain of > packages depending on it. It > would be nice to have some soft policy of changes, check list or some > procedure to have a "stable" > branch which may guarantee all packages build successfully and pass of > all enabled tests. People are definitely supposed to check that their changes don't break things before they push them, but it doesn't always happen. It's not easy to make sure that all packages build successfully. I've never seen 100% of packages build successfully since I joined Guix in 2015. It's a nice goal but it requires some work... a lot more work. Everyone is invited to help. Probably, the first step is to remove several hundred packages that don't build; it might even be a couple thousand. > I would like to conclude from the CI is which commit broke how many > packages. Agreed, this is a very important missing feature. Also, we need the capability to compare commits in terms of CI results. Our CI software is called Cuirass: https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/guix/guix-cuirass.git We need more people to help develop Cuirass! > Some missing practice of packaging: > - Some essential message of the reason why tests were disabled and any > sort of suggestions on how to > make them enabled. Contact upstream if required. Everyone is supposed to do this when writing packages. It's a failure of the code review process if that is not happening. > - Before sending patch make sure (at least for the localhost > architecture) it's built, linted and in > case of bumping version - all dependent chain still can be built. This is supposed to be done for patches that go to the master branch. That is, patches that affect <300 packages. Other patches that affect more than 300 packages are batched on development branches such as 'core-updates' [0], and then we need a lot of Guix contributors to help get all the packages building again. Maybe we should remove broken packages more casually, like I suggested above. > Excess changes which could be prevented with just local attempt to build > #+begin_src sh > git log --grep="Fix build" --pretty="%h %s %cd - %cn" | wc -l > #+end_src > : 1025 We have 92225 commits total: ------ $ git log --oneline | wc -l 92225 ------ So, about 1.1% of them are "Fix build" commits. However, not all of these commits were made on the master branch. Many of them are on development branches such as 'core-updates' and 'staging', and so users never experienced the problems that were fixed. That doesn't mean that Guix QA is perfect, but rather that your measurement is inaccurate and misleading. [0] To learn more about development branches like core-updates, see item 8: https://guix.gnu.org/manual/en/html_node/Submitting-Patches.html From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 26 05:18:31 2022 Received: (at 53533) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Jan 2022 10:18:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51012 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCfNn-0008AP-3z for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 05:18:31 -0500 Received: from mail-io1-f49.google.com ([209.85.166.49]:34542) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nCfNl-0008AC-KX for 53533@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 05:18:30 -0500 Received: by mail-io1-f49.google.com with SMTP id i62so11350104ioa.1 for <53533@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 02:18:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=UPxSSeE8C5LBi73/ayWes6ABMVxIxT4umpwGjoiqk/c=; b=o+NMb0Z9maks04qUelv7u4nHGSSNt4r8kzsQY+bEHefHjiEBWDC+XzKYge/C7ZREu7 my7hsfSwDYSmWBvw7bVcj4iI+500i4HNgy7KqMWq2Lj30yDlKMzrbgZ2CEyXX1zJGfoh Uw5/+fQug8GMZuBfjdgQ8LWe224I+mu2omYxk7JUH5GH3x6UXaUUZ2HwlOWEePoLhgdj dVrBpJ85parTYJMLc13X/iZAxHgPyGyC609zseTx2CDJWYPe4IBl6vJ5I9DB68EM92fb N+hY4c9wM2QoG+xoTW7tQsCOLZ7HvIPxQ7N79udzkvrhkP2CEy38/I2GpymW8DyI6rRB AOVQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=UPxSSeE8C5LBi73/ayWes6ABMVxIxT4umpwGjoiqk/c=; b=u083ucrkZZJ/reb/3qZLxpfjDGZWHTWHnOSuxOribRF4yawRhY7g4BYSqVcpvFnGI2 kxvN9Mzwoy2Hqd7O2pUKd7XqmIrjorJ56AEdMCq4zLDnXexY+4Yjw9S4sRYSnTOY0AiB xm0w87et4KIpAWP77hJfV3ScYbDeSrmmWaJTfrlADo8Uo+x7ldgnPb6HOwjFy7qwvDZv gv+lOj/ZDVjDwAPCW7xfUx7dgD7suN4Bb29pM6p6PxG0mo67OEVqZvBFSRgKPyJ+EfLL cNfkspPtyex8ytcj7CTPpS8l8IkzPUjrQZIAxhFyNonY27Ez/1436QlR8KG4UKqYsSIM 7z2A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530P7YVNdw6ijLOxpd1u+nondEfJpEoSjFYir7r+67UbLSD/MwaG 9vt1bM3vCvzUnYozTcGzpZNNSBrH/KkD3WOMM40= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyW7IBASB2u5tcWBKWMjarRh2V6w5knQx9QStA7FkffOR6oqL+tAQl7zuW3a595pYQD1swZrXM3kWleVFnQnDw= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6602:1591:: with SMTP id e17mr13311634iow.171.1643192303535; Wed, 26 Jan 2022 02:18:23 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: zimoun Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2022 11:18:12 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#53533: [DISCUSSION] Quality of services in reproducible build environment Guix To: Leo Famulari Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53533 Cc: 53533@debbugs.gnu.org, Sharlatan Hellseher , Mathieu Othacehe X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Hi, On Wed, 26 Jan 2022 at 03:53, Leo Famulari wrote: > It's not easy to make sure that all packages build successfully. I've > never seen 100% of packages build successfully since I joined Guix in > 2015. It's a nice goal but it requires some work... a lot more work. I think this goal is impossible by design of the current workflow. Do not take me wrong, I am saying that some clean is not necessary. My aim with this email is to point that the annoyance of broken packages comes from our current workflow and our scaling up, yeah! :-) > Everyone is invited to help. Probably, the first step is to remove > several hundred packages that don't build; it might even be a couple > thousand. We agreed to do that in 2019 with a reminder on June, 20th 2020: and nothing happened. Because the issue is the current modelling: master/staging/core-updates. Continuing with that workflow, it is not realistic to purge broken packages. Here, we have to make a choice: a) current workflow with broken packages b) adopt another workflow The pro for a) is that it is already working enough, we have the habits, etc. And the cons of a) are some packages break sometimes. My rough guess is, these days, ~5% of packages are broken per revision. And my guess is that this percentage of broken package stays the same as the number of packages increases; other said, more packages often means more users, so this ~5% means more "visibility" to hit a broken package. For b), the switch comes with a cost and I am not convinced all people are agreeing if this cost would be counter-balanced. More details about such discussion are for instance in this thread: and the archive guix-devel contains many similar discussions. Nothing new. ;-) > > I would like to conclude from the CI is which commit broke how many > > packages. > > Agreed, this is a very important missing feature. Also, we need the > capability to compare commits in terms of CI results. The idea was to have this feature provided by the Data Service. However, AFAIK, many pieces are since then broken between ci.guix.gnu.org and data.guix.gnu.org. For instance, using this: you can detect which commit breaks the package. Well, 2 important notes: 1. All is Scheduled because data.guix.gnu.org is fetching data from the other CI managed by the Build Coordinator, not from the CI managed by Cuirass. 2. The commits listed there are an approximation. Basically, there are based on the mailing list guix-commits and a complete batch pushed as once is considered as a change, and more than often, this batch contains irrelevant change, see details there: > > Some missing practice of packaging: > > - Some essential message of the reason why tests were disabled and any > > sort of suggestions on how to > > make them enabled. Contact upstream if required. > > Everyone is supposed to do this when writing packages. It's a failure of > the code review process if that is not happening. I would not say it is a failure of the code review process. Instead, I would say it is a failure of the current workflow. On one hand, the project cannot complain that not enough people are doing reviewing (see this thread [1]), when on the other hand, potential reviewer would have to build many more than just the change itself, especially when many potential reviewers do not have enough power at hand (see this thread [2]). 1: 2: Note that since I joined the project (around 2018), we are discussing about more automation using patchwork and other similar tools. For instance, Chris started this initiative: which would really help to improve the CI process. However, we, as a project, are not putting enough love in such initiative. Well, the hidden point barely discussed is twofold: necessity of a powerful infrastructure for building more when the resource are somehow splitted and strong integration with current CI. Both require many more resources: manpower and money. That's why, I think the current workflow will make more visible broken packages. > That doesn't mean that Guix QA is perfect, but rather that your > measurement is inaccurate and misleading. Yes, this 1.1% does not make sense. Firstly, counting the commits containing "Fix build" completely underestimates the number of real fixes, because some fixes contains instead "Fix tests", some fixes are update, etc. Secondly, the important number is the number of broken packages at one instant t (revision) and for that, the Git history is useless. Basically, the important number is the ratio between the green vs red bullets [3]. Other said, compare the coverage, say, using "guix weather" for past revisions. I guess, ~5% of packages are broken, on average. 3: My 2 cents. Cheers, simon PS: The discussion usually happens on guix-devel and not in the bug tracker. Other said, since it does not appear to me an actionable bug report, I would like to close it. 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[82.25.93.113]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s16-20020adfea90000000b0033b198efbedsm4102411wrm.15.2024.02.08.10.21.43 for <53533@debbugs.gnu.org> (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 08 Feb 2024 10:21:43 -0800 (PST) From: Sharlatan Hellseher To: 53533@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: [DISCUSSION] Quality of services in reproducible build environment Guix Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2024 18:21:42 +0000 Message-ID: <878r3uvmtl.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53533 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Hi, I think I can close this now as all questions were covered. 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