From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Dec 27 20:50:53 2021 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Dec 2021 01:50:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44753 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n21dc-0004oj-Q3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 27 Dec 2021 20:50:53 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:45146) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n21dZ-0004oa-35 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 27 Dec 2021 20:50:51 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:55446) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n21dY-0005zj-S9 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Dec 2021 20:50:48 -0500 Received: from [2a00:1450:4864:20::32e] (port=43962 helo=mail-wm1-x32e.google.com) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n21dX-0001vb-0P for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Dec 2021 20:50:48 -0500 Received: by mail-wm1-x32e.google.com with SMTP id k66-20020a1ca145000000b00345fa984108so3513067wme.2 for ; Mon, 27 Dec 2021 17:50:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=sender:to:subject:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=iyRc3knID5rlAStONMGuIQ7DuJnCUxDPZMt/laWCt/w=; b=MkEkPI/W+5OmXJRNuwKUYK3c9zhteWcWPQnTvbtz2dJIkG8cw5Vu8KQimjlUUAtiDI uIoxm+rubO7vt+Gf0HgZL5X/4NN6tP4fy6QSPGGqmkEIQafK6kA3FwnlC18lXA3+ycUf aOn/PMSa1dNxzAlC/NrG6I0HczluHd4+OqA9AILL+8WLb9VpybFA286BgoaW3uKFL37P Q/CQ1s2U6WrIng1Ix7s7pqKfjmm5ywaWIous711OAFQrb0RlIzy9rQuj32S2dVnR12LS gA6Ixt1kP2LxeDQX6DKH0hFRyhDraLKN7ZV7Xm2iRFF1TmdGNGl4XI1Ib0+EVGDrIfjI gr8A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:to:subject:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=iyRc3knID5rlAStONMGuIQ7DuJnCUxDPZMt/laWCt/w=; b=XWKkVIiAMeOyhpW5FA7TvbHsKyXf63mIcIcXiFOaGQRF5O4dHOcAuQSgjT+unQhX0B 5E+Cpl0zqATX2hLdXWlG9yC7SfGvhOT0/PpKbUdpIFHs9+80wZmgwD8gxm506tFvgTpR npvcrl+Kp2kA5lhqqV9OZx/ZOg7nFXLN1zrab9ITriVLfCQTr8h+nNgOGzK8ZEHejGS5 YcUCJcdVHiYrdTTpDBLzZqApMc+OfOupFc9dvk11kTZkSlOlvjwmc6uTtzzfBppRWvA6 7nxTnuubTXBW6lJnlPPPjbXw/daYUduB31cBYMej/1YpHL0pyeJEbkkGzc8AVpaoz1tk 08Qw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531LYEutiZbPRMLMm53Alpn9UiJWHU4glHfU6V6VoMGmiRq0B6Vd N132aoKQfSIep0C7wzrTwhwlBiIDKik= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwA314DEqa2w97QvreNUl/JZWL9P1x9umKkBlfjO99aW1lXI+mV/1Df/zHxXAcuIMVwI6h5ZQ== X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:1c90:: with SMTP id k16mr15139774wms.40.1640656244981; Mon, 27 Dec 2021 17:50:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.111.255.129] ([185.209.196.135]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id b14sm12974688wri.112.2021.12.27.17.50.44 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 27 Dec 2021 17:50:44 -0800 (PST) To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing From: Dmitry Gutov Message-ID: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2a00:1450:4864:20::32e (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::32e; envelope-from=raaahh@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x32e.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -6 X-Spam_score: -0.7 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (-0.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.248, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.8 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) It says these syntaxes "declare how completion should happen" or one of them "can be used as a general predicate to say whether the command should be present when completing with 'M-x TAB'", but neither have any effect unless the user customizes read-extended-command-predicate. The previous entry (the one about (interactive "p" dired-mode)) doesn't mention the predicate user option either. Should read-extended-command-predicate be set to #'command-completion-default-include-p by default? Otherwise the NEWS entries (at least one of them) should probably mention it. When reading the manual (subsection "Specifying Modes For Commands"), I'm feeling a similar problem. command-completion-default-include-p *is* mentioned, but only somewhere in the middle. The intro gives the impression that "specifying modes" will have an effect by default. The small two paragraphs saying Specifying modes _may_ affect completion in @kbd{M-x} ...when using the ... predicate ... look kind of sneaky. Like, we have just described a way to set up a bunch of meaningful information, and that _may_ affect your Emacs's behavior if (...). That's weird, but I'm not sure how to resolve that best. Apart from changing the default value, that is. Other options may be: * Change the 'M-x' binding to call execute-extended-command-for-buffer instead. The behavior of execute-extended-command won't change, but that probably isn't going to save anybody: the user who set up the binding to call that command explicitly is probably rare. * Have the subsection be actually about the command execute-extended-command-for-buffer. Mention its binding (M-X) and say that (interactive nil dired-mode) affects its behavior. Then mention that by customizing read-extended-command-predicate the user can have 'M-x' behaving like that as well. If they like. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Dec 28 07:46:10 2021 Received: (at 52839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Dec 2021 12:46:10 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45285 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2Brm-0004cQ-EX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 07:46:10 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:55816) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2Brk-0004cE-I3 for 52839@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 07:46:09 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=34910 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2Bre-0002TZ-T2; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 07:46:03 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=Ewtc58sKrYFgz69oL26VGHeMhq+8z9Pf6C4NbIpinvM=; b=RIl9aCmo2rp1 Z11PdaqUchCSh33YXQqReaDDOQ9kCXsHr7eeIdTw5kvxwgZznXU185PE9bfnwG08LWf/oXylVRQBP dFW7bo6UVEu+n1vqmRZP2kOkkNPscu5hPy+tjrsUkslcxQJbo7Rf476TyDSOTc05MkmOgK2At741+ H213fdRtUk+OOwU4FQm0otQCUvTefL6oCEHbF1sg3YE0fRXFBtkcwF8wHSHSQ1oHSofwIlyANPi8u SCw6bUoHAkGlTwUceAs8uXA1CxN64ZBOVRHpxj5QpJdFwGcO0X37UdSp4ZGuSfViKwWoL8aCLtKxo U00nJLen0oETww3a2JkxPg==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=3882 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2Bre-0000NN-NG; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 07:46:03 -0500 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 14:46:02 +0200 Message-Id: <8335mcnbhx.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Dmitry Gutov , Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839 Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Dmitry Gutov > Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200 > > It says these syntaxes "declare how completion should happen" or one of > them "can be used as a general predicate to say whether the command > should be present when completing with 'M-x TAB'", but neither have any > effect unless the user customizes read-extended-command-predicate. > > The previous entry (the one about (interactive "p" dired-mode)) doesn't > mention the predicate user option either. > > Should read-extended-command-predicate be set to > #'command-completion-default-include-p by default? Otherwise the NEWS > entries (at least one of them) should probably mention it. > > When reading the manual (subsection "Specifying Modes For Commands"), > I'm feeling a similar problem. > command-completion-default-include-p *is* mentioned, but only somewhere > in the middle. The intro gives the impression that "specifying modes" > will have an effect by default. > > The small two paragraphs saying > > Specifying modes _may_ affect completion in @kbd{M-x} > > ...when using the ... predicate ... > > look kind of sneaky. Like, we have just described a way to set up a > bunch of meaningful information, and that _may_ affect your Emacs's > behavior if (...). That's weird, but I'm not sure how to resolve that > best. Apart from changing the default value, that is. > > Other options may be: > > * Change the 'M-x' binding to call execute-extended-command-for-buffer > instead. The behavior of execute-extended-command won't change, but > that probably isn't going to save anybody: the user who set up the > binding to call that command explicitly is probably rare. > > * Have the subsection be actually about the command > execute-extended-command-for-buffer. Mention its binding (M-X) and say > that (interactive nil dired-mode) affects its behavior. Then mention > that by customizing read-extended-command-predicate the user can have > 'M-x' behaving like that as well. If they like. Stefan, any comments? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Dec 28 15:27:53 2021 Received: (at 52839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Dec 2021 20:27:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47529 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2J4b-000421-G1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:53 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:12709) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2J4Z-00041m-P9 for 52839@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:52 -0500 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id ED4868063A; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id B29F4801D5; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:42 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1640723262; bh=tDo/gNC5uHawclkLvUQXGujnWFX3MPM9ONV93opHu84=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=St+jjf5pgl7rL2yDNs/B1Bu1ut1BzTFWkT2coVU61+IxKMbvHJ4uP5bcj0GYf2ikH Cvt4YTWFydUK4QlMmw/uAj4zivL8QKYEl11TTPDgWzaNzh5dsBSx9UxZHeO1kXZJ+A 20vY34ZRbRL6BNngNINTgFghCQq2z5lQqNPaUkGxKmjfXJO5x2bVOMUpaDhUKVQNqr SdCuR+7XKM0bCuGNG2SelC3if0LGUy24uQwr71X4a9IHw2xJFiw20FWsTUxOKBzFJU RMfSfjvNpSfA/0SjI4mLgNksGOsGnNWrZk8NktjM2wBuhmWHqsQTa8GznaunOmTVHW NdqUhFatFFH6A== Received: from ceviche (unknown [216.154.30.173]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7B9FC1201C3; Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:42 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Dmitry Gutov Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing Message-ID: References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:38 -0500 In-Reply-To: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> (Dmitry Gutov's message of "Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.083 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839 Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Apart from changing the default value, that is. That seems to be asking a question: what is the reason for the current default value. AFAICT this comes from: commit 927b88571cebb4f64aca360fbfa5d15a1f922ad6 Author: Eli Zaretskii Date: Wed Feb 17 18:53:54 2021 +0200 Disable filtering of commands in M-x completion This makes the default behavior like it was before: M-x completion doesn't filter out any commands. To have commands filtered based on their relevance to the current buffer's modes, customize the option 'read-extended-command-predicate' to call 'command-completion-default-include-p'. * doc/lispref/commands.texi (Interactive Call): * doc/emacs/m-x.texi (M-x): Update the description of 'read-extended-command-predicate' and improve wording. * etc/NEWS: Update the entry about 'read-extended-command-predicate'. * lisp/simple.el (read-extended-command-predicate): Change default value to nil. Update doc string. Add :group. (read-extended-command): Handle nil as meaning to apply no-filtering. But the commit doesn't say why this change was made (other than saying "like it was before"). Was there a specific problem introduced by the filtering, or was it a change based on a judgment call about what the default should be to balance the tradeoffs between bringing new features and surprising the users? Stefan "who doesn't have an opinion on this one" From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Dec 29 09:45:36 2021 Received: (at 52839-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Dec 2021 14:45:36 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48321 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aCt-0004UL-M7 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:45:35 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40260) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aCs-0004U4-CN for 52839-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:45:34 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=41302 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aCn-0004CB-3F; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:45:29 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=duGb83hGsFxPCOcPDmfeYKTcQqwEzAidaVa2Guts+g0=; b=rbTg+OzChWK5 XriPdvCC/xT6hyBJ+Gh50O68VHBlontjSajU8eQpDXt77C+0JPAUidXmprLL5Bd0cxf9b6ArhwV1f YgRi3X0Q/abIZ2aMazLxC0fE19Zq2m4o3Hmto1aUbXcs10+Nny+5CtNLhKwbfPMzGzIy73AO/uHSC G+GVhDYRA7L2o8gQ1Zx5CMKcho8hWKtPeatDOF/UofEPS3tXnF+z6KJmDxGyhsMq9Ma7AEDl0qX8M QY1ryRzkbMFVnS5LAOAYjAixUffvKRrluRckcrzeAFfTVvCcQQtmlexbaljsylD5Df0/swMdHBbPu SYTgRWqkCiSX5+D2h9EBRg==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1319 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aCa-0002Bk-2c; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:45:29 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 16:45:17 +0200 Message-Id: <83r19vjwqq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Dmitry Gutov In-Reply-To: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839-done Cc: 52839-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Dmitry Gutov > Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200 > > It says these syntaxes "declare how completion should happen" or one of > them "can be used as a general predicate to say whether the command > should be present when completing with 'M-x TAB'", but neither have any > effect unless the user customizes read-extended-command-predicate. > > The previous entry (the one about (interactive "p" dired-mode)) doesn't > mention the predicate user option either. > > Should read-extended-command-predicate be set to > #'command-completion-default-include-p by default? Otherwise the NEWS > entries (at least one of them) should probably mention it. Thanks, I added the caveat to these NEWS entries. > When reading the manual (subsection "Specifying Modes For Commands"), > I'm feeling a similar problem. > command-completion-default-include-p *is* mentioned, but only somewhere > in the middle. That's a 75-line node, so "in the middle" is also "close to the beginning". In fact, it mentions it immediately after explaining the issue and saying that Emacs has a mechanism for tagging commands as being specific to modes. I don't see how this could be moved earlier without severely disrupting the text didactically. > The intro gives the impression that "specifying modes" will have an > effect by default. I don't think so, but I now tried to make it even more evident. > * Change the 'M-x' binding to call execute-extended-command-for-buffer > instead. The behavior of execute-extended-command won't change, but > that probably isn't going to save anybody: the user who set up the > binding to call that command explicitly is probably rare. > > * Have the subsection be actually about the command > execute-extended-command-for-buffer. Mention its binding (M-X) and say > that (interactive nil dired-mode) affects its behavior. Then mention > that by customizing read-extended-command-predicate the user can have > 'M-x' behaving like that as well. If they like. I've added the reference to execute-extended-command-for-buffer and its binding. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Dec 29 09:47:15 2021 Received: (at 52839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Dec 2021 14:47:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48328 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aEV-0004Xi-3Q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:47:15 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40566) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aET-0004XV-FJ for 52839@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:47:14 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=41334 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aEL-0006Mq-6J; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:47:06 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=boaMWB3/hIN94CUlhldPNudDRyoq5d8SqbUa6oG92dE=; b=XXqI6UPxcadv HkOYvpn1uuzqKo3yK0ePEgg9K0kdTYveO9bS5EzP72SQh4C8zLlnR0rT4ReIjX7xWSDlikPf3lcro Bv5iEgz+ZUfk9gqgYQD9qCioAJJlkC0mlBBT3BxQYQu/dz6K1mFHqJN+nYoM+vNVZXzp4LPYKrpxp YXROs0NCW38+MZC3UBDTL/mKWBf3Ti1PvEOg96jb+ACbn35H18HpFIF0wSBqEO6MoXgQLflApyo8t D+NFNEvOPux8a9IAc0Fg61NCBWm0w4iauYjzpQ3h1qqbiFrLbtMXndooEoiNINtXyUukPB/oWiKtB f2qYj5gEX3CqYAl7uxayfA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1430 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aEL-0002T6-4w; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:47:05 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 16:47:07 +0200 Message-Id: <83pmpfjwno.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org) Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839 Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org, dgutov@yandex.ru X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 15:27:38 -0500 > From: Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, > the Swiss army knife of text editors" > > But the commit doesn't say why this change was made (other than saying > "like it was before"). Was there a specific problem introduced by the > filtering, or was it a change based on a judgment call about what the > default should be to balance the tradeoffs between bringing new > features and surprising the users? The latter. We then added the "M-X" binding for the new command that always omits inapplicable commands from the completion, so now users can have the cake and eat it, too. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Dec 29 09:51:14 2021 Received: (at 52839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Dec 2021 14:51:14 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48341 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aIM-0004hh-0o for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:51:14 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:42354) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aIK-0004hO-Et for 52839@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 09:51:12 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=WlB1HSd0wD9HW787Z4jozETivh2VLAP81ZaQbS8VZe8=; b=GHLgj6tMsMB5BBpIvXTrpgq57T CpH6eN58efYguoxD6fIjaiQdV21VsqmWJGbhJVDS3ibfwqQnGmcDu75JbkpV6TzXoxrG8o5X64FwI VRY7I5StCLDK4D8UbImifb78no2L+THMzSDvThV96Gb1WUHIZfgTeUug0OWp0RCBc6V4=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aIA-0006tq-Iv; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 15:51:05 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> <83pmpfjwno.fsf@gnu.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAGFBMVEX+/OfJs5vCkmie UT0mERNgJSN0VUb///98IOfRAAAAAWJLR0QHFmGI6wAAAAd0SU1FB+UMHQ4oMnLKkPIAAAG4SURB VDjLbdNRcusgDAVQ+60gOBso0jT/RUNWgFdg6H+dNvtfwrsS4JC0zPSjPkZcyWSantfM01mIJE2v QI43ieUVHJGXUmL6BSKylVLyKyyM93UNMJ/wt6B8g5Pr1b1Cfb6VjAf91LdpnqlBzBMZzAvinP5R BynTzs4WYXFoIID7nXyDRegZ2hYP5FgrSQR8OXdU43aE7fAdluHs/DdEhd09QCuJHo1ZjaB9owz6 Th1queXdkmJSChbKe229Qz5gqUDveI75dvBErkJE/dLB2zQ0kre02wOWgB0sdVJ2ExR2a8x9sOys IB0C4qNUENkl/FiDFTBbjBtw3yR820Ry2+GIhVmuN5E8ABmcie8ijEjSwRsEudxwjGYd4YyD5RYC tzuFtSoE3G+8jlL5gFbqyhpApPwCQiz8KlYMqh5hpRa57hqAL4+0FRgQNNlaS+VhB04IBNi0jw7o WuyGXhNGFR99II4BxXSEOiAg22Vow2alIIgVi33aktdhhy793HYXVr1XuDTUn2N96i1MBqIfTl8s a+r9lQb1KqP05wjcIKcKmiqPkAZYFaj+Kuzf3kfBSBqkJ1jz+h9Ajeeus5t/rAAAACV0RVh0ZGF0 ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAyMS0xMi0yOVQxNDo0MDo1MCswMDowMKavV5oAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5 ADIwMjEtMTItMjlUMTQ6NDA6NTArMDA6MDDX8u8mAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Four Tet's _Pause_: "You Could Ruin My Day" Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 15:51:00 +0100 In-Reply-To: <83pmpfjwno.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 29 Dec 2021 16:47:07 +0200") Message-ID: <87a6gj8nxn.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > The latter. We then added the "M-X" binding for the new command that > always omits inapplicable commands from the completion, so now users > can have the cake and eat it, too. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839 Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Monnier , dgutov@yandex.ru X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > The latter. We then added the "M-X" binding for the new command that > always omits inapplicable commands from the completion, so now users > can have the cake and eat it, too. That's not what `M-X' does, though -- it filters out commands that aren't particularly marked for the current mode, but there's always other commands that will be useful. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Dec 29 10:06:06 2021 Received: (at 52839-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Dec 2021 15:06:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49920 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aWk-0005XP-BI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 10:06:06 -0500 Received: from mail-wr1-f50.google.com ([209.85.221.50]:36841) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2aWi-0005Wt-RP for 52839-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 10:06:05 -0500 Received: by mail-wr1-f50.google.com with SMTP id r17so44995146wrc.3 for <52839-done@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 07:06:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Vc4fprIrLGm3NmEC4y60MGIIE96++WO7jyGC0rTPb78=; b=R9tKQVPaTVnVUmrk2hU+hGwc3r/BFFbXzRCOCuOVRxKFTQFDwGwOFTf/3OJaJy/hIg gAomc67SwUcx9IghAGCWpqmyqFbiM04Qe2Q8WYjScWzOmLYb6FnwbkKz/vcUmkp1n5JQ gEC/jYnu1efkFmtrJGXN2yNUvbBF0AD+E+iYpwo82CLkwrZ+IY6RHhRwCmTpuXQ313nT JfTfRSV/924ullN2YKhHBnZffBVUMYSmbwKapITEeGYJXA/vkomk3IX1bCb+2GWucAsJ rGpTKpHnpPDQn9guR6nAarCb3sksZwEEs3oOTgruz5hQI0KfDnxaviJdtthF4TlvZvOd Vf/Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Vc4fprIrLGm3NmEC4y60MGIIE96++WO7jyGC0rTPb78=; b=lm+G1bdGkoamKR8OfiEv4lrnALxZ08Yz5sTVLo3Waw8A4w3Jm5VKmH91FJtg3uiYcE Ic7Yd8wI+BXNNhmGw5xDxmDb9Awi8EdRAdvk58AoftHGHNbubuUcTTsNjuQJ5MbK79+E qEu7sM+Mu9MVpAe7c34fBi+USH+RTMcriPvhTZ3vFojCh0lFCnLyvFmkppKNLACyIrXs UQi3gSYjFVIAGNIBKEoPn4AOOCrnkKhqIpNu8gcDKdqmgaTkRFW8A7KQNIzc7F1V6Gk7 we0DCYhCDqfFytMUS6cOV5ZkDv4entE1Q7HePqw18VJf4KATS8FB7bAM/+nsb9McFyR1 tlGQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532OT2RhlkyNBwSrHIFSRMPWv32J1bjM42/nsWyzrh8VhftUyEUn wAgvmVHfzav2as91sbl7h7Oi+Ih8MLAM6Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJziVNqDdG81h1L0Bwx2x3YVNXHD1+8F56NU2RXtOyhJthvRDRNebx1UQUxDsmnqv9GatRRomQ== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:5608:: with SMTP id l8mr10423825wrv.587.1640790359025; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 07:05:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.6] ([46.251.119.176]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id l6sm27398948wry.18.2021.12.29.07.05.58 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 29 Dec 2021 07:05:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing To: Eli Zaretskii References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> <83r19vjwqq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Dmitry Gutov Message-ID: <814dcdb4-c3c2-2c5f-cfc5-347e586cf231@yandex.ru> Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 17:04:46 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <83r19vjwqq.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839-done Cc: 52839-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.6 (/) On 29.12.2021 17:45, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Dmitry Gutov >> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2021 03:49:33 +0200 >> >> It says these syntaxes "declare how completion should happen" or one of >> them "can be used as a general predicate to say whether the command >> should be present when completing with 'M-x TAB'", but neither have any >> effect unless the user customizes read-extended-command-predicate. >> >> The previous entry (the one about (interactive "p" dired-mode)) doesn't >> mention the predicate user option either. >> >> Should read-extended-command-predicate be set to >> #'command-completion-default-include-p by default? Otherwise the NEWS >> entries (at least one of them) should probably mention it. > > Thanks, I added the caveat to these NEWS entries. > >> When reading the manual (subsection "Specifying Modes For Commands"), >> I'm feeling a similar problem. >> command-completion-default-include-p *is* mentioned, but only somewhere >> in the middle. > > That's a 75-line node, so "in the middle" is also "close to the > beginning". In fact, it mentions it immediately after explaining the > issue and saying that Emacs has a mechanism for tagging commands as > being specific to modes. I don't see how this could be moved earlier > without severely disrupting the text didactically. > >> The intro gives the impression that "specifying modes" will have an >> effect by default. > > I don't think so, but I now tried to make it even more evident. > >> * Change the 'M-x' binding to call execute-extended-command-for-buffer >> instead. The behavior of execute-extended-command won't change, but >> that probably isn't going to save anybody: the user who set up the >> binding to call that command explicitly is probably rare. >> >> * Have the subsection be actually about the command >> execute-extended-command-for-buffer. Mention its binding (M-X) and say >> that (interactive nil dired-mode) affects its behavior. Then mention >> that by customizing read-extended-command-predicate the user can have >> 'M-x' behaving like that as well. If they like. > > I've added the reference to execute-extended-command-for-buffer and > its binding. Thank you. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Dec 29 11:53:04 2021 Received: (at 52839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Dec 2021 16:53:04 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50147 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cCF-0005Gb-Sx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 11:53:04 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40832) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cCE-0005G6-Lx for 52839@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 11:53:03 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=44664 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cC8-0003Ou-HF; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 11:52:56 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=/kFVFOneVod+0rYueJ6UDIMntVW6ZpXPnXwgG5xcS40=; b=bMcFkF9xlBh1 YzPMihTtS5MsHvg8kGz69DMxiMBImJLlwlg7YwRJR6rdnK29Fyk5FlSKi9afkC3bGmhAkLGcNaHLS 8v+GQtOqtqNlY2tL/oiBqgV41icOKDAofZpqiLcQZYUuFX0foynmeygN00i3fOxUmEktF86VLbQ6D PCb/FU5we8bEywoy6OCN3bU9Z6xez42oGFL5GQHMII0KRkYQB7SI7iEu4041qEiwZYCeJmCZ4V8Qt jCOwPgHqbrfAG0fT3YZ4EXFXl7/L8Z+TAxykwJsPFPNCHvp/pGyCAztX4jh0TY7v7RroIQ392r9KR HE+tGJLNzFxVbKVvHPY8ZQ==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1215 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cC8-0004hs-HA; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 11:52:56 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 18:52:59 +0200 Message-Id: <83k0fnjqtw.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87a6gj8nxn.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Wed, 29 Dec 2021 15:51:00 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> <83pmpfjwno.fsf@gnu.org> <87a6gj8nxn.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839 Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, dgutov@yandex.ru X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: Stefan Monnier , 52839@debbugs.gnu.org, > dgutov@yandex.ru > Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 15:51:00 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > The latter. We then added the "M-X" binding for the new command that > > always omits inapplicable commands from the completion, so now users > > can have the cake and eat it, too. > > That's not what `M-X' does, though -- it filters out commands that > aren't particularly marked for the current mode, but there's always > other commands that will be useful. How is that different from what I said? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Dec 29 11:54:42 2021 Received: (at 52839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Dec 2021 16:54:42 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50151 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cDq-0005JT-8z for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 11:54:42 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:43750) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cDo-0005JG-Hf for 52839@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 11:54:41 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=4dwL+OU6F5FngOB4y/XZ2jb7QxVf8zJw+oc5QBuCY/E=; b=M3OMbZqAcxH6xgxUSE0PbHxMk5 E7zS4FCWjwEHPQ4MtUSPMmSJdtqXQa6Iu6KMMXUyJKHOAO8LuSdk+4DrGKs5w77OTlHrMoNb/ExFS /YETJpzFNX/HQQMAwtN3TK2zQW0rPRqu7qimoiyvA0aqsM1yeVsx1YouV7gnMcqN6ZmY=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1n2cDe-0007ls-4X; Wed, 29 Dec 2021 17:54:32 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#52839: 29.0.50; The '(declare (modes MODE...))' NEWS entry is confusing References: <701c3a8d-d7d4-cdb8-6e10-0212db7bc35e@yandex.ru> <83pmpfjwno.fsf@gnu.org> <87a6gj8nxn.fsf@gnus.org> <83k0fnjqtw.fsf@gnu.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAHlBMVEX0vDD7xDTNni2z jS2Nby5YRSJZUE9lWlKzsrH///8JT23mAAAAAWJLR0QJ8dml7AAAAAd0SU1FB+UMHRA1HTDPT80A AAGmSURBVDjLdZLBUsIwEIZ3g9x3qw/QJs54hSCcGRXuCugdMblzSN/A4bHdBGibUgOTdvbrn393 /gAAIDPHBwHIHzitczm+YFFyZ10/YAKtcQiwsmYQFNrqoaNI5ydFQOmprbSUAeI3YqVnOqtHxeOW CjvTCNQ1AVTb1cSAxSiruor5+4dWtiQU/y4Yr3ZbrbTBXl9QbF53LzMzq6ReZh52vqu0sXpiymxy tdoJUEZQPuDYbpYkYxib1QWMlhKCsaakHNxvUcIxuswHF/MYHowmmNdTVZaqAPsAieLWq58zBwC4 BdFnGBCq9tZ0ARbrKcGtOai1O9weJoLVZ3BH6hOwEJzzvorhZ8A8O1nhWyJnzI+6c15+xzQmNzIg orWT09y0ud7nXfJ/EIFz39gzl20dbdwyc4cRR0lc0plkgh0F4SKRPaUI8HyZpylGd/G/3H66AMYn 8Q/1oeMPy/Qoggu+DsemjqkrTlPWofZV3m48Vab88fW+BddvpGWRhEbSBrfwp18fGvc2hMKdan/g WwU/ff2G/RAQf1cNAX7wrSADvJj+A4rO+x8Ynnbz2HAz3wAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAy MS0xMi0yOVQxNjo1MzoyOSswMDowMHMXytgAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjEtMTItMjlU MTY6NTM6MjkrMDA6MDACSnJkAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Hot Chip's _Coming on Strong_: "Down With Prince" Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2021 17:54:29 +0100 In-Reply-To: <83k0fnjqtw.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 29 Dec 2021 18:52:59 +0200") Message-ID: <87zgoj8i7u.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > The latter. We then added the "M-X" binding for the new command that >> > always omits inapplicable commands from the completion, so now users >> > can have the cake and eat it, too. >> >> That's [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52839 Cc: 52839@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, dgutov@yandex.ru X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > The latter. We then added the "M-X" binding for the new command that >> > always omits inapplicable commands from the completion, so now users >> > can have the cake and eat it, too. >> >> That's not what `M-X' does, though -- it filters out commands that >> aren't particularly marked for the current mode, but there's always >> other commands that will be useful. > > How is that different from what I said? There's many commands that are applicable in any given mode that will not be listed by `M-X'. (I.e., all commands that are generally useful across modes.) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From unknown Thu Jun 19 13:55:54 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2022 12:24:08 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator