From unknown Tue Jun 17 20:18:17 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#52400 <52400@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#52400 <52400@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el Reply-To: bug#52400 <52400@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2025 03:18:17 +0000 retitle 52400 [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify= .el reassign 52400 emacs submitter 52400 Stefan Kangas severity 52400 wishlist tag 52400 patch thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Dec 09 21:07:34 2021 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 02:07:34 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45140 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvVJu-0007ii-I4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 09 Dec 2021 21:07:34 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:35512) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvVJs-0007ib-Rx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 09 Dec 2021 21:07:33 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:36526) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvVJs-0003md-LO for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Dec 2021 21:07:32 -0500 Received: from mail-pg1-f180.google.com ([209.85.215.180]:39451) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvVJm-00053j-L0 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Dec 2021 21:07:30 -0500 Received: by mail-pg1-f180.google.com with SMTP id r5so6769207pgi.6 for ; Thu, 09 Dec 2021 18:07:26 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=rombmvHahgASzZOIZX3MAZeII1f3k+pscaRxfeh0r0A=; b=3rbZ/BnACfD4nqqoWuHXZHmHajnQfweOPUd0q31yF9yP6Xwl9NqLoWekvuC2zk3ZG1 kOJEehqEH/zTQShMr7HiJFQRITjfafPZLArgexQ8fia7a6duJglSHSzndhWUkDpw1POJ ic889y8FmgtfOZ4GzTvrF9JfU3a/QxY/TtTZRisUWOTRjNndyEai2MECU+loIaXTHs7p R/i0mKknTZ8AocIW7XKvALAzGCCnh+U7CoJiQsGkngU0jcaopN+qtliDA5uHnBJVikvS evhVfdCT2qN2X/8FIRi28+LDrezCESOvHg2JJoNTbeDpLcUU153/XiPi/Aq0ZKAxEk1C kJ6Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533KgwNlsC+iCCDFvog7HFudVCOK0JW/Wnn/ceo7Yime6AfHYMMW K7y90Iv/m84nUYW/D482SPqpDT/j57zYgePOdYBSF82U X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw/y6h8w0/sejdFV68zko27835D5CBnHIIiemQFUHfhynJKgnM+feupNvT8eNDZD5un8uUnGl6u16jz7DK7Kcs= X-Received: by 2002:a63:cd:: with SMTP id 196mr2100229pga.591.1639102045127; Thu, 09 Dec 2021 18:07:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Thu, 9 Dec 2021 18:07:24 -0800 From: Stefan Kangas MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2021 18:07:24 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="00000000000026ed5305d2c12f60" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=209.85.215.180; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-f180.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -13 X-Spam_score: -1.4 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.248, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.8 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.8 (-) --00000000000026ed5305d2c12f60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Severity: wishlist Is there any need for generating a separate file htmlfontify-loaddefs.el file given that it only contains three definitions? Or should we just get rid of it as in the attached? --00000000000026ed5305d2c12f60 Content-Type: text/x-diff; charset="US-ASCII"; name="0001-Don-t-generate-separate-autoload-file-for-htmlfontif.patch" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="0001-Don-t-generate-separate-autoload-file-for-htmlfontif.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Attachment-Id: facd197b40735eb9_0.1 RnJvbSBkNzQzNmIyOGEyYTkzMjRkZWZmYWNkN2ZlMmRiNWE5YjlhZTYyOGE1IE1vbiBTZXAgMTcg MDA6MDA6MDAgMjAwMQpGcm9tOiBTdGVmYW4gS2FuZ2FzIDxzdGVmYW5AbWFyeGlzdC5zZT4KRGF0 ZTogRnJpLCAxMCBEZWMgMjAyMSAwMjo0NzozNSArMDEwMApTdWJqZWN0OiBbUEFUQ0hdIERvbid0 IGdlbmVyYXRlIHNlcGFyYXRlIGF1dG9sb2FkIGZpbGUgZm9yIGh0bWxmb250aWZ5CgoqIGxpc3Av aGZ5LWNtYXAuZWw6IFVwZGF0ZSBmaWxlIGxvY2FsIHRvIG5vIGxvbmdlciBwdXQgaHRtbGZvbnRp ZnkKYXV0b2xvYWRzIGluIGh0bWxmb250aWZ5LWxvYWRkZWZzLmVsLgoqIGxpc3AvaHRtbGZvbnRp ZnkuZWwgKGh0bWxmb250aWZ5LWxvYWRkZWZzKTogRG9uJ3QgcmVxdWlyZS4KKiB0ZXN0L2xpc3Av aHRtbGZvbnRpZnktdGVzdHMuZWwgKGh0bWxmb250aWZ5LWF1dG9sb2FkKTogRGVsZXRlCnRlc3Qu Ci0tLQogbGlzcC9oZnktY21hcC5lbCAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIHwgNCAtLS0tCiBsaXNwL2h0bWxm b250aWZ5LmVsICAgICAgICAgICAgfCAyIC0tCiB0ZXN0L2xpc3AvaHRtbGZvbnRpZnktdGVzdHMu ZWwgfCA5IC0tLS0tLS0tLQogMyBmaWxlcyBjaGFuZ2VkLCAxNSBkZWxldGlvbnMoLSkKCmRpZmYg LS1naXQgYS9saXNwL2hmeS1jbWFwLmVsIGIvbGlzcC9oZnktY21hcC5lbAppbmRleCBiN2RlNjVm NWI3Li5iZDRlYWZjNWQyIDEwMDY0NAotLS0gYS9saXNwL2hmeS1jbWFwLmVsCisrKyBiL2xpc3Av aGZ5LWNtYXAuZWwKQEAgLTg1OSw4ICs4NTksNCBAQCBoZnktZmFsbGJhY2stY29sb3ItdmFsdWVz CiAKIChwcm92aWRlICdoZnktY21hcCkKIAotOzsgTG9jYWwgVmFyaWFibGVzOgotOzsgZ2VuZXJh dGVkLWF1dG9sb2FkLWZpbGU6ICJodG1sZm9udGlmeS1sb2FkZGVmcy5lbCIKLTs7IEVuZDoKLQog Ozs7IGhmeS1jbWFwLmVsIGVuZHMgaGVyZQpkaWZmIC0tZ2l0IGEvbGlzcC9odG1sZm9udGlmeS5l bCBiL2xpc3AvaHRtbGZvbnRpZnkuZWwKaW5kZXggOGRjNGNjZTMyMy4uM2I3MmU1ZTZiMSAxMDA2 NDQKLS0tIGEvbGlzcC9odG1sZm9udGlmeS5lbAorKysgYi9saXNwL2h0bWxmb250aWZ5LmVsCkBA IC04MSw4ICs4MSw2IEBACiAoZXZhbC13aGVuLWNvbXBpbGUgKHJlcXVpcmUgJ2NsLWxpYikpCiAo cmVxdWlyZSAnY3VzLWVkaXQpCiAKLShyZXF1aXJlICdodG1sZm9udGlmeS1sb2FkZGVmcykKLQog KGRlZmNvbnN0IGh0bWxmb250aWZ5LXZlcnNpb24gMC4yMSkKIAogKGRlZmNvbnN0IGhmeS1tZXRh LXRhZ3MKZGlmZiAtLWdpdCBhL3Rlc3QvbGlzcC9odG1sZm9udGlmeS10ZXN0cy5lbCBiL3Rlc3Qv bGlzcC9odG1sZm9udGlmeS10ZXN0cy5lbAppbmRleCAxNTc5ODMxOWExLi42OThjNmI0OThlIDEw MDY0NAotLS0gYS90ZXN0L2xpc3AvaHRtbGZvbnRpZnktdGVzdHMuZWwKKysrIGIvdGVzdC9saXNw L2h0bWxmb250aWZ5LXRlc3RzLmVsCkBAIC0yMSwxNSArMjEsNiBAQAogKHJlcXVpcmUgJ2VydCkK IChyZXF1aXJlICdodG1sZm9udGlmeSkKIAotKGVydC1kZWZ0ZXN0IGh0bWxmb250aWZ5LWF1dG9s b2FkICgpCi0gICJUZXN0cyB0byBzZWUgd2hldGhlciByZWZ0ZXgtYXVjIGhhcyBiZWVuIGF1dG9s b2FkZWQiCi0gIChzaG91bGQKLSAgIChmYm91bmRwICdodG1sZm9udGlmeS1sb2FkLXJnYi1maWxl KSkKLSAgKHNob3VsZAotICAgKGF1dG9sb2FkcAotICAgIChzeW1ib2wtZnVuY3Rpb24KLSAgICAg J2h0bWxmb250aWZ5LWxvYWQtcmdiLWZpbGUpKSkpCi0KIChlcnQtZGVmdGVzdCBodG1sZm9udGlm eS1idWcyNTQ2OCAoKQogICAiVGVzdHMgdGhhdCBodG1sZm9udGlmeSBjYW4gYmUgbG9hZGVkIGV2 ZW4gaWYgbm8gc2hlbGwgaXMKIGF2YWlsYWJsZSAoQnVnIzI1NDY4KS4iCi0tIAoyLjMwLjIKCg== --00000000000026ed5305d2c12f60-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 10 03:43:15 2021 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 08:43:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45491 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvbUo-0005ql-SR for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 03:43:15 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43634) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvbUm-0005qX-TS for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 03:43:13 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=45472 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvbUg-00038f-9C; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 03:43:07 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=GNP9KjIl8Q3iB18hH/48jEQKl4Vvem0kroLZVL65X8Q=; b=h9YfLyBxUKvy djPTbm7D8tYsuyd633nzq4Xvt5m9lWuPuXNc15iwFady7/VTipL4p4rNrm+202wMp8DcLyOtqanz4 u+mt/Sxuao6sVxHlLcehVdplvwG/UN7DbqD2QNu8S8FSWLNZfwQ8sTDn/GzegaLwXf5cpYJfXzBul QGxk1KDmPlAUozQCrfOzqsrVgX4TY/p09Z+ouRfYcw0dmhnEud9iDt5X8jMXEetnOsrCGm6XTgTlA Na389FU2ndPHj+TIR0vEGIXPNKumnT7bZVl7nkc/Bs01roRTXN7Y23XxSf1Pho/a9dIfENpbv3LMg z5CZIOz/zsS37MBW+zN1cg==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=3111 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvbUf-0007X0-ST; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 03:43:06 -0500 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 10:42:52 +0200 Message-Id: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Thu, 9 Dec 2021 18:07:24 -0800) Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2021 18:07:24 -0800 > > Is there any need for generating a separate file htmlfontify-loaddefs.el > file given that it only contains three definitions? Or should we just > get rid of it as in the attached? I wouldn't touch these issues with a 3-mile pole. They are fragile, and once they work, having an extra file with 3 definitions is a price I take every day. It just isn't worth the effort to awaken these sleeping dogs. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 10 08:33:02 2021 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 13:33:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45907 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvg1G-0005fk-CV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 08:33:02 -0500 Received: from mail-pl1-f173.google.com ([209.85.214.173]:38848) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvg1B-0005fJ-Dv for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 08:33:01 -0500 Received: by mail-pl1-f173.google.com with SMTP id o14so6289182plg.5 for <52400@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 05:32:57 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=u/EdXLsLryvL6N1KMd/kQm9B9ZFiV4vsj6RBwRn68m0=; b=DJqbNuUevqNm/6kCflp9jzgEQuf77caikJprLWxY8CQmsG0opZ0u6q9DlRca4IpTJa UD1EpQ0/LTbnXupw0999VbIJJ77yzlU6EnOY8ZjHiDcKUWplreCHcmklc4C2KQZKoT3H GDM9N5wnXvdjzSb0hC8swUwL+dic+go2vgpZ+LtwSgBX48l9uwe7Nr4sEP8vELuIdJJ3 nAZ2wKQ8GOVi2UlVG9TcDq44ZuBWJweCd1p2wPwnPzM2gnKiYoLMLsIWaX6FmOzspcON E/k7wI8Nsf8xkAQceAwNLnpnB5Os5befrE0nd9uQb1QG1KOABLUnmMlOvSGTDb6mOCnE WLPQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533+YdEsNPCiMb4GKSKBceprYxIoc+/N2g+f6hmKjavll6nSiJqB +uBuAv5KI+6pH+YWmOfrc7qtWkjzDjTjYPkvCzs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxw17ZWZyPiQBOGti+jqUvsTDvGnV6xA0DeUtHjHptqH3WvR6dP69d3KRlIjw0bYKDlmPHMkkADAv2tLGBJWbM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:be10:: with SMTP id a16mr23708726pjs.133.1639143171609; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 05:32:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 13:32:51 +0000 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 13:32:51 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Eli Zaretskii writes: > I wouldn't touch these issues with a 3-mile pole. They are fragile, > and once they work, having an extra file with 3 definitions is a price > I take every day. It just isn't worth the effort to awaken these > sleeping dogs. What are the risks in a case like this? It seems to me that they are low, in the sense that if we run into any problems we can just revert it and live happily ever after. What am I missing? The main benefit for me is just a general reduction of complexity, but admittedly it is small. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 10 08:37:44 2021 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 13:37:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45938 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvg5o-0005pA-D1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 08:37:44 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33500) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvg5m-0005os-9B for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 08:37:42 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=48262 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvg5h-0006Y3-0m; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 08:37:37 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=u/EbCpoCe5Eu69bHNesHFRdecj54w0psD+Mfk+z4eRM=; b=FJP5OqF8goCV k98OL/t8eyRhRcvxp1oqQ4AbHPf7BoHOWBwqdNnyTAMQP/+FzWKq9BYFiOLcY8hOSL408mhVk7Eb+ vgv4DHFFvae5WYvtOnxVriXqkaPQfCRySkrMSCyRTvGC7dhapgLWPsnZS+Of4XozraSJxxnu9SUkI 4zqynbbI9zKDl+PrSt35JvHaNSCJUp+KQ1xwq1hAZdTd/IXYTd38TnlcuFWR0Ry2A5jRERPkU/mCB eCVpCkG0ff8BsQbVYUP/wwufPZfHNfzLMdI3nr1fA1Xho1CJheKLSf/cYYONlTSX29kipC6a4QDg4 cF19U61BSy7N9mmcbw5GnA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1268 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvg5c-0001y6-Tw; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 08:37:36 -0500 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 15:37:19 +0200 Message-Id: <83mtl8shrk.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Fri, 10 Dec 2021 13:32:51 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el References: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 13:32:51 +0000 > Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > I wouldn't touch these issues with a 3-mile pole. They are fragile, > > and once they work, having an extra file with 3 definitions is a price > > I take every day. It just isn't worth the effort to awaken these > > sleeping dogs. > > What are the risks in a case like this? That the build breaks. Two possible variants of breakage: . the autoloads aren't updated when they should be . the rule for updating the autoloads is executedevery time you say "make", even if there was no change anywhere in Emacs > It seems to me that they are low, in the sense that if we run into > any problems we can just revert it and live happily ever after. I say why take the risks, however low, if the problem is not serious enough? > The main benefit for me is just a general reduction of complexity, but > admittedly it is small. Exactly. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 10 10:22:22 2021 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 15:22:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47739 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvhj3-0002y3-Sv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 10:22:22 -0500 Received: from mail-pl1-f178.google.com ([209.85.214.178]:34556) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvhj0-0002xi-87 for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 10:22:20 -0500 Received: by mail-pl1-f178.google.com with SMTP id y8so6508748plg.1 for <52400@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 07:22:18 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:user-agent :mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=o1wbITE7tqFnIStlArhQcoi5PdYA2OueMtwBzdq+/FI=; b=kJELVe6LQJR+3wbHpeMFYbrV5EPYbUrJb4RH8FTS013F3Ro0Dhq5q6165UuwuFRgyp MoCvmbiDRkZOOBbAu9EZ5YivUWL2b9+EFCtFzqa/Gpksz9uL3+MOE2RTHevDjsWStoJg VaXrSBx9fdbGyZP06gq8eREiAcCFZmRv9FWhrSQGYNsqkZ/hn23Em6DRLgJxrchU/oJl lbDXUlt8aSIwZVs28PxGlf4ISyNh1k6+SwwU3BcSBqv1zWoOLCIkB2/EIM335YGm7tmt kxtrLrMMKdYuzE/ULxrMJCn6ulZQ0PaZ0eNZCmHEdzmQO3fTEeM3kuypJ+ClehokzhgO Ktuw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5325rOuHBTwfcTDG6r8MMp/2+VaXztV3lGEOsLypHUItCgWncp0v RxhOa7K8vXPFQcwNn5Eo2s37dVgpXKC6AKrUblw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx/RsEg7Ir//5wdCao6Z8ntEHUB4scvQD3vgKNtPR8+ZVnZ4mJBGQzwHftaFhSVHWFh4V8S7q673lkS3v/2NlM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:4414:: with SMTP id s20mr24871604pjg.132.1639149732620; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 07:22:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 15:22:12 +0000 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <83mtl8shrk.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 10 Dec 2021 15:37:19 +0200") References: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtl8shrk.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 15:22:12 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Eli Zaretskii writes: > That the build breaks. Two possible variants of breakage: > > . the autoloads aren't updated when they should be > . the rule for updating the autoloads is executedevery time you say > "make", even if there was no change anywhere in Emacs FWIW, I didn't see any of those issues in my testing. > I say why take the risks, however low, if the problem is not serious > enough? Cruft inevitably adds to cognitive load. A lot of it adds more, little adds little. We have a lot of it, IMO, so every little bit helps. The problem is that if it exists, you will sometimes happen to look at it and think "hmm, why is this file here". I think this is the second (or third?) time I stumble upon this particular file. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 10 11:47:06 2021 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 16:47:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47802 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvj34-0005Lg-8s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:47:06 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:34388) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvj32-0005Kx-1R for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:47:04 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=34544 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvj2w-0002lK-JE; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:46:58 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=U320AwfouhqhvH5IhyZyOS0rFknIbNkPezSOZyIrEXU=; b=lsA4hGfDpnWD I/Q3RevF7vzRhHQMepXbF7ZknayJFtsIZTVXUy1bU+qeBNVGVmjyShgLHmA72AgrqGCgxv1Wycgt0 I4zZjeZBq1XU02VzGMZzJp+sozki+mQB9OJrkPYVRYOKTgm+5iDbI2lwqnO6d9KSpey/LKW7zTPmi uvI4pOjHnAkkrGcetDDd/6VhSxhcCFOCnwnOCSz42SJjRz38vPPFAQsTa1So8fsaQmydaOcZRzkjs fXUc+sNE5XTMr9pX/5mIUPgWnq/PoueDb0BfH+YtWXGoPb9xkfxI+69Fb8BCMsvTG1ZcpNJ2SpOYb 6uVuxBRnMNRTvWrexhYSmg==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1076 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mvj2w-0008DT-CC; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:46:58 -0500 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 18:46:45 +0200 Message-Id: <83fsr0s8zu.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Fri, 10 Dec 2021 15:22:12 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el References: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtl8shrk.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 15:22:12 +0000 > Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org > > > I say why take the risks, however low, if the problem is not serious > > enough? > > Cruft inevitably adds to cognitive load. But it isn't cruft. You tend to declare something "cruft" too easily. > We have a lot of it, IMO, so every little bit helps. No, we don't. Please don't consider cruft anything that you think is not right; there's more than one way to skin a fish. People who worked on Emacs before us weren't exactly incompetent, you know. > The problem is that if it exists, you will sometimes happen to look at > it and think "hmm, why is this file here". I think this is the second > (or third?) time I stumble upon this particular file. Just get used to it being there, I say. It doesn't do any harm, although you seem to think it does. We have enough real problems to deal with. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 10 14:45:44 2021 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2021 19:45:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47940 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvlpv-0001lr-TG for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 14:45:44 -0500 Received: from mail-pg1-f182.google.com ([209.85.215.182]:35566) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mvlpt-0001ld-BR for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 14:45:42 -0500 Received: by mail-pg1-f182.google.com with SMTP id j11so8919709pgs.2 for <52400@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:45:41 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:user-agent :mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/C1aIZ7Z1IK2kjgqn8ZHWrdw0Ow2mOW7joVqxHevphY=; b=za4TB52tiX9LIDvqTaA9qIB552jsFqxTy74ojzmTpRfR/VZcJAdNtPh+Nh2iGzIsLw JlR9jRSdsjbT+uUmkJnQqGWgjBG6sdrM6JiAB9ShXsuhT/c7bW9xIByWXYvo3KP44nZ+ Kh/jPfKV/lwSB8HlFQwYsEIBEPzz1s2ju2H3ipK/oCu0l4gts2a1EeRTkTR4LNkqMw3U YBYSqyGf7i4buWzrISlYp0rTGPDMcJ0iJ5c1JNCvug2FiTMHJA2e5bXV6k2Tc2hj9PIC ggt+UvKMkXBH8dhg23MUrNuyGRdP3DtlhRZRq35UsRGmyUZ3jpgfDNZrY1nY6NF1v8AW OXiA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531AmWODK/z2L5R460yuopTvKsBKF9xjOFjzH9sbAPUxjrFyFwhA izRvj8v+Ft7Fu/uNZ2bsh7VfzsTOM1bGVBMqOMbls3wl X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwLIFfT7OQPU9vP67A+GpF2sIQw2dFHIbV4/5MglImzy7A1b/LJXKd+8n8256Vk2qX/XyLYBGBjumiSjAzg04E= X-Received: by 2002:a62:1a03:0:b0:494:64b5:3e01 with SMTP id a3-20020a621a03000000b0049464b53e01mr19902488pfa.35.1639165535484; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:45:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 10 Dec 2021 19:45:35 +0000 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <83fsr0s8zu.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 10 Dec 2021 18:46:45 +0200") References: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtl8shrk.fsf@gnu.org> <83fsr0s8zu.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2021 19:45:35 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Eli Zaretskii writes: > But it isn't cruft. You tend to declare something "cruft" too easily. This file is the result of an old optimization (some autoloads) that were subsequently cleaned up. (The non-optimized version would have been to just require hfy-cmap.el.) However, the clean-up didn't go far enough, and thus we ended up with a file that I think can be accurately described as cruft. > No, we don't. Please don't consider cruft anything that you think is > not right; there's more than one way to skin a fish. People who > worked on Emacs before us weren't exactly incompetent, you know. I don't think saying that some things have outgrown their usefulness or could be done better reflects negatively on previous authors. > Just get used to it being there, I say. It doesn't do any harm, > although you seem to think it does. The "harm" here is exactly having to get used to it. IOW, you may argue that this is a very minor cleanup, but on the other hand the cost of doing nothing is also non-zero. Hackers will have to look at this for another couple of decades, or until someone else thinks to install a patch like the one I wrote. However, since you seem to feel strongly about it, I won't insist. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jun 05 12:24:21 2022 Received: (at 52400) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jun 2022 16:24:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33344 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxt37-0001MZ-7e for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Jun 2022 12:24:21 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:58510) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxt32-0001M9-5q for 52400@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Jun 2022 12:24:20 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=2SpBbQMkHjU8swSkYBRaySPM/xk4pzIIzJ6+ffj6XMU=; b=nPN6cQ3AkyhYx6rjk+1vwO4SDB 7wE+O9gWZly1M9rtaqX9XAazcovRYcTsjezuqXeWyGVAZIYFlBe02kdUL6Kgj4Cq3DAO/XfpYx+8t 7Rq1ByXhslhZmEuWGYIfpypWVviWsOMlIyOnb6CgW8IHQzihQm5CYVe1eAqlfHJeRV8A=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nxt2s-0003Ii-Tn; Sun, 05 Jun 2022 18:24:09 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Stefan Kangas Subject: Re: bug#52400: [PATCH] Don't generate separate autoload file for htmlfontify.el References: <83y24ssveb.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtl8shrk.fsf@gnu.org> <83fsr0s8zu.fsf@gnu.org> X-Now-Playing: Exek's _Check it Out!!_: "Punishment" Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2022 18:24:05 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Fri, 10 Dec 2021 19:45:35 +0000") Message-ID: <8735gj13kq.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Stefan Kangas writes: > This file is the result of an old optimization (some autoloads) that > were subsequently cleaned up. (The non-optimized version would have > been to just require hfy-cmap.el.) However, the clean-up [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 52400 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 52400@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Stefan Kangas writes: > This file is the result of an old optimization (some autoloads) that > were subsequently cleaned up. (The non-optimized version would have > been to just require hfy-cmap.el.) However, the clean-up didn't go far > enough, and thus we ended up with a file that I think can be accurately > described as cruft. I think that's the correct analysis here, so I've pushed Stefan's patch to Emacs 29. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jun 05 12:24:23 2022 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jun 2022 16:24:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33346 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxt39-0001Mi-Ds for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Jun 2022 12:24:23 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:58526) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nxt36-0001MJ-QL for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Jun 2022 12:24:21 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=EyKBPG4KylB4rQEHvJUNBaoWdDULkexbgQAyCTeQZ7Q=; b=PyqN4nnjNSqP016jlNZXBFTS4E bqZq9gQ6WmEF8gzyYo/Ywqc3plfYXH+tKB2zIXEkDpGErTx73cK4NzW0GM9aZfbzjUmCv+KqEt2BZ Xjg42wDsnx5ZNaySToIWiPkBbz3sKyoNLUTC853GdH192LUMNusG7lxnGy18mX6etMFc=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nxt2y-0003Ip-Tu for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Jun 2022 18:24:14 +0200 Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2022 18:24:12 +0200 Message-Id: <871qw313kj.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #52400 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. 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Content preview: close 52400 29.1 quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) close 52400 29.1 quit From unknown Tue Jun 17 20:18:17 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2022 11:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator