From unknown Thu Sep 11 11:26:46 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#50760 <50760@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#50760 <50760@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 26.3; Add `symbol' to the Emacs manul glossary Reply-To: bug#50760 <50760@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2025 18:26:46 +0000 retitle 50760 26.3; Add `symbol' to the Emacs manul glossary reassign 50760 emacs submitter 50760 Drew Adams severity 50760 wishlist thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Sep 23 10:58:06 2021 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Sep 2021 14:58:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55377 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTQAn-0007u6-Qz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 10:58:06 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:50548) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTQAm-0007ty-Cp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; 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Thu, 23 Sep 2021 14:41:21 +0000 Received: from SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::c0bc:7c3a:292f:8a82]) by SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::c0bc:7c3a:292f:8a82%9]) with mapi id 15.20.4523.018; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 14:41:21 +0000 From: Drew Adams To: "bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org" Subject: 26.3; Add `symbol' to the Emacs manul glossary Thread-Topic: 26.3; Add `symbol' to the Emacs manul glossary Thread-Index: AdewiQQ1s09Lp0pcRBubss8/EbjthQ== Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2021 14:41:20 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: gnu.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;gnu.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=oracle.com; x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 4f6d639d-4b23-4bc3-6782-08d97ea035b8 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: BYAPR10MB3671: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:7691; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 4f6d639d-4b23-4bc3-6782-08d97ea035b8 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 23 Sep 2021 14:41:20.9536 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: waTzN54takknWgaXZ9ILShaq7x84CVvDDX8MUBG9rk/W5JU7g+m4/B1Oj1IE/Qd7lAgQha8WS2wBHU0vTkaEmA== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BYAPR10MB3671 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6300 definitions=10115 signatures=668682 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 adultscore=0 suspectscore=0 bulkscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=939 spamscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2109200000 definitions=main-2109230092 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: 3zYr49PpkeGjw55OINu7kIgGJsHbGO_D X-Proofpoint-GUID: 3zYr49PpkeGjw55OINu7kIgGJsHbGO_D Received-SPF: pass client-ip=205.220.165.32; envelope-from=drew.adams@oracle.com; helo=mx0a-00069f02.pphosted.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) "Symbol" is used in many places in the Emacs manual, but it's not defined in the Glossary. Please consider adding its definition there. The notion of an Emacs symbol is not obvious from the name. (emacs) `Symbol Completion' is one node that talks about "symbol names", without actually saying what's meant. It's probably clear enough, from context, but a more definite definition in the Glossary would help. In GNU Emacs 26.3 (build 1, x86_64-w64-mingw32) of 2019-08-29 Repository revision: 96dd0196c28bc36779584e47fffcca433c9309cd Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 10.0.19042 Configured using: `configure --without-dbus --host=3Dx86_64-w64-mingw32 --without-compress-install 'CFLAGS=3D-O2 -static -g3'' From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Sep 23 17:34:28 2021 Received: (at 50760) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Sep 2021 21:34:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56069 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTWMN-00071k-QT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 17:34:27 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:48136) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTWML-00071R-SG for 50760@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 17:34:26 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=f9PAEnXQhpV9qPN5MtYARcLx3+XNC2atCSdxHQk3+vo=; b=VRH0Fmfz3QBiRjCxj7rQZ/r5AP E2VkfyVN+yv7vf/JxwmVbK2vY7tviChd+bnMgA7sSjA1OccLs22vaT0lLOrZTxONlMl1AVnrLbKdt f6PJAcYTpdD1d+WzFYIrdfpzoMqVnvOTjz2qHvlJWJtZRTyU7OfVtchPhZimjrOhGXnQ=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mTWMB-00079i-3i; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 23:34:18 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Drew Adams Subject: Re: bug#50760: 26.3; Add `symbol' to the Emacs manul glossary References: X-Now-Playing: Magnus Granberg & Skogen's _Let Pass My Weary Guiltless Ghost_: "Let Pass My Weary Guiltless Ghost" Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2021 23:34:14 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Drew Adams's message of "Thu, 23 Sep 2021 14:41:20 +0000") Message-ID: <87r1dfvuw9.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Drew Adams writes: > "Symbol" is used in many places in the Emacs manual, but it's not > defined in the Glossary. Please consider adding its definition there. > > The notion of an Emacs symbol is not obvious from the na [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 50760 Cc: 50760@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Drew Adams writes: > "Symbol" is used in many places in the Emacs manual, but it's not > defined in the Glossary. Please consider adding its definition there. > > The notion of an Emacs symbol is not obvious from the name. > > (emacs) `Symbol Completion' is one node that talks about "symbol names", > without actually saying what's meant. It's probably clear enough, from > context, but a more definite definition in the Glossary would help. Makes sense. I've now added an entry in the glossary in Emacs 28 (that points to the "Symbol Type" node in the lispref manual.) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Sep 23 17:34:31 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Sep 2021 21:34:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56072 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTWMR-000720-1D for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 17:34:31 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:48150) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTWMP-00071Z-4y for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 17:34:29 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=dpxLBDXf0FUrFMC0VOHggRDE16LGoJRrcsw8FVo/5Eo=; b=nxUAviWz8LMkfTFyCrv28I212z nEecsIlBXfX0RlkPY6lziv74basChBHEyYsnIq/+CAEcE/n/oF4+QLqI+ZsvC6FhxpA8sx2jptax3 w47DdlQqwP5/InxVevQrjwgvQTKjlOdC12xALcjUbh1aiJW6Nf8GnOmLo5RWTjbWeAj0=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mTWMH-00079r-1u for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 23 Sep 2021 23:34:23 +0200 Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2021 23:34:20 +0200 Message-Id: <87pmszvuw3.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #50760 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 5cbca88a-9399-407c-7c40-08d97edf7895 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 23 Sep 2021 22:14:11.4688 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: M7H88U6VANtJavUO/RWB1N/SSM9xxbRG+VGGmPmtf2pQV7rg4r6OvC5u0m1/rG+llx/0UuuwIEgvlIJdSYJhCQ== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BY5PR10MB3955 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6300 definitions=10116 signatures=668682 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 malwarescore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=997 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 phishscore=0 spamscore=0 suspectscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2109230000 definitions=main-2109230129 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: 7BiL41Isfdi0uWav-wJ--A8HgAD4zQPv X-Proofpoint-GUID: 7BiL41Isfdi0uWav-wJ--A8HgAD4zQPv X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 50760 Cc: "50760@debbugs.gnu.org" <50760@debbugs.gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > > "Symbol" is used in many places in the Emacs manual, but it's not > > defined in the Glossary. Please consider adding its definition > there. > > > > The notion of an Emacs symbol is not obvious from the name. > > > > (emacs) `Symbol Completion' is one node that talks about "symbol > names", > > without actually saying what's meant. It's probably clear enough, > from > > context, but a more definite definition in the Glossary would help. >=20 > Makes sense. I've now added an entry in the glossary in Emacs 28 (that > points to the "Symbol Type" node in the lispref manual.) Thanks, but I don't think that's sufficient. There are (at least) two important meanings of "symbol" in Emacs: 1. The usual Lisp meaning, which is meaningful only in Lisp. 2. The Elisp meaning of characters with symbol-constituent syntax. And per= haps names composed of such chars, possibly combined with chars with other = syntax, e.g., typically word-constituent. For example, in programming languages (not only Elisp), we have commands su= ch as `forward-symbol'. They move over or otherwise manipulate names compo= sed of symbol-constituent chars and sometimes other kinds of chars. Emacs users deserve to know about these quite different meanings, I think. = Each such meaning is important to using Emacs. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Sep 24 02:12:25 2021 Received: (at 50760) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Sep 2021 06:12:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56504 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTeRd-0000KQ-7C for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 24 Sep 2021 02:12:25 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39256) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mTeRb-0000K8-Ri for 50760@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 24 Sep 2021 02:12:24 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:44550) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mTeRV-0004Y2-8Z; Fri, 24 Sep 2021 02:12:17 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:1523 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mTeRU-00013U-Rj; Fri, 24 Sep 2021 02:12:17 -0400 Date: Fri, 24 Sep 2021 09:12:12 +0300 Message-Id: <83lf3mtscj.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Drew Adams In-Reply-To: (message from Drew Adams on Thu, 23 Sep 2021 22:14:11 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#50760: [External] : Re: bug#50760: 26.3; Add `symbol' to the Emacs manul glossary References: <87r1dfvuw9.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 50760 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 50760@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Drew Adams > Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2021 22:14:11 +0000 > Cc: "50760@debbugs.gnu.org" <50760@debbugs.gnu.org> > > There are (at least) two important meanings of "symbol" in Emacs: > > 1. The usual Lisp meaning, which is meaningful only in Lisp. > > 2. The Elisp meaning of characters with symbol-constituent syntax. And perhaps names composed of such chars, possibly combined with chars with other syntax, e.g., typically word-constituent. > > For example, in programming languages (not only Elisp), we have commands such as `forward-symbol'. They move over or otherwise manipulate names composed of symbol-constituent chars and sometimes other kinds of chars. > > Emacs users deserve to know about these quite different meanings, I think. Each such meaning is important to using Emacs. The meaning of "symbol" for searching is explained in "Symbol Search". 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: d7478d1c-2a45-4d60-3725-08d97f8c9269 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 24 Sep 2021 18:53:17.7387 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: C/xMVVT3dQoyheS/KPBn6sO4m5M90qxl6Asd6X/NkhnKHED8Gws4FdnMwyyGqHxze+CvMz9J2v36LPLxnbrD/g== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: SJ0PR10MB5663 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6300 definitions=10117 signatures=668682 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxlogscore=779 malwarescore=0 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2109230001 definitions=main-2109240116 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: zSgrB7uiCEpR5tBP9LP7DfzjfDwxauEM X-Proofpoint-GUID: zSgrB7uiCEpR5tBP9LP7DfzjfDwxauEM X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 50760 Cc: "larsi@gnus.org" , "50760@debbugs.gnu.org" <50760@debbugs.gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > > There are (at least) two important meanings of "symbol" in Emacs: > > > > 1. The usual Lisp meaning, which is meaningful only in Lisp. > > > > 2. The Elisp meaning of characters with symbol-constituent syntax. > And perhaps names composed of such chars, possibly combined with chars > with other syntax, e.g., typically word-constituent. > > > > For example, in programming languages (not only Elisp), we have > commands such as `forward-symbol'. They move over or otherwise > manipulate names composed of symbol-constituent chars and sometimes > other kinds of chars. > > > > Emacs users deserve to know about these quite different meanings, I > think. Each such meaning is important to using Emacs. >=20 > The meaning of "symbol" for searching is explained in "Symbol Search". Great. Add that meaning to the glossary entry, please. (And it's also movement commands, not just search.) A user seeing the doc string for `C-h S' (`info-lookup-symbol') can well wonder what "symbol" means. My observation comes from someone having questioned possibly using the word "symbol" in a help menu item (for `info-lookup-symbol'). The term isn't obvious, especially for new users. From unknown Thu Sep 11 11:26:46 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sat, 23 Oct 2021 11:24:07 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator