From unknown Sun Aug 10 08:58:42 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#50444: Remove support for the curses library Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: eggert@cs.ucla.edu, bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2021 00:29:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 50444 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 50444@debbugs.gnu.org Cc: paul eggert X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-Xcc: paul eggert Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.163097452714081 (code B ref -1); Tue, 07 Sep 2021 00:29:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2021 00:28:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54776 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNOyl-0003f3-3E for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 20:28:47 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:45452) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNOyj-0003ew-S6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 20:28:46 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59362) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mNOyj-0001Sh-In for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 20:28:45 -0400 Received: from mail-pg1-f173.google.com ([209.85.215.173]:37645) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mNOyi-0007Xz-4D for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 20:28:45 -0400 Received: by mail-pg1-f173.google.com with SMTP id 17so8209539pgp.4 for ; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 17:28:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=koHVoxEF3DB8ndDUEwR3daocEq6nzGvPZ3EKHpLWZQM=; b=LtmZIkXf6exxeae/gYtie5uat4MwogueGtx2fSMKR9eUzZ52Mokg2FB8d7r+xp5Tax KzXcNFKuX/4xM2o+Pgg8tH+0s02PdvG0GfTjV+Pr/B5Tu9L/Mrn1zUme5LfyHYO3gu7y nMXoaGasjGB5oMH0cD6LlXdTy32AEqwtMNsR92XplYEu+0vJ/dau9zfuumQQkTLNmNr3 /TSDFWjTpOzz6SC7kEeTXbZcbyWDg8YFvbEmGVenl72i0dyICDcRGq02/VTV0jrwIuMc ywTPmnmE3f6jpDkWU2G3twVnc2S7G1PQAzyKXxMMQCOUeVHk0iXWGyEpi7XX9+CFyTde 4LKg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533RksM6un27fHbMB0M+nvmy16QUAwsXL3bpu770HdqAds0Iek4c GXwW51Q5uWrUwKhB8H1EXgVuhia0y28m/vcFpzUwf1dbLhU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzUNCh+OQSMC0twB1XtfOYtMc+bokMI0zeQqy5OZIvoEGG9cIntFcrC2mo+0NnBTe5G8cm6lwPOskLjBIHGcNU= X-Received: by 2002:a62:7594:0:b0:416:310f:d083 with SMTP id q142-20020a627594000000b00416310fd083mr2343892pfc.33.1630974522426; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 17:28:42 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Kangas Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 02:28:31 +0200 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=209.85.215.173; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-f173.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -13 X-Spam_score: -1.4 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.8 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.8 (-) Severity: wishlist X-Debbugs-CC: Paul Eggert Building with curses is, according to Paul Eggert: "Completely broken" in the sense it won't link and Emacs won't build, yes. (It will link in master, due to a patch I installed recently.) And yes, the original curses library has been obsolete for at least two decades. See the discussion here: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2021-01/msg00416.html The conclusion from that thread AFAIU is that support for curses should be removed. (We should keep ncurses though.) From unknown Sun Aug 10 08:58:42 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#50444: Remove support for the curses library Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2021 06:04:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 50444 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Kangas Cc: eggert@cs.ucla.edu, 50444@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 50444-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B50444.163099462115926 (code B ref 50444); Tue, 07 Sep 2021 06:04:01 +0000 Received: (at 50444) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2021 06:03:41 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55264 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUCq-00048n-RO for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:03:41 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33908) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUCp-00048b-Co for 50444@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:03:39 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:38352) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUCj-0005Jt-Kh; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:03:33 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:3202 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUCj-0003bH-75; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:03:33 -0400 Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2021 09:03:41 +0300 Message-Id: <83zgsoq5vm.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Tue, 7 Sep 2021 02:28:31 +0200) References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 02:28:31 +0200 > Cc: paul eggert > > Building with curses is, according to Paul Eggert: > > "Completely broken" in the sense it won't link and Emacs won't build, > yes. (It will link in master, due to a patch I installed recently.) > > And yes, the original curses library has been obsolete for at least two > decades. > > See the discussion here: > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2021-01/msg00416.html > > The conclusion from that thread AFAIU is that support for curses > should be removed. (We should keep ncurses though.) Doesn't that mean we will be removing support for AIX (and any other systems that cannot use ncurses due to the same problem)? Are we willing to drop support for those platforms because of curses? AFAIU, the original problem was fixed, and there's no longer a link error when using curses. In any case, if we are planning to drop support for curses, we need to obsolete it first, i.e. add a configure-time warning for that. From unknown Sun Aug 10 08:58:42 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#50444: Remove support for the curses library Resent-From: Paul Eggert Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2021 06:42:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 50444 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: Stefan Kangas , 50444@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 50444-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B50444.163099690819631 (code B ref 50444); Tue, 07 Sep 2021 06:42:02 +0000 Received: (at 50444) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2021 06:41:48 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55306 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUnj-00056Z-W7 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:41:48 -0400 Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:46002) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUni-00056N-UQ for 50444@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:41:47 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1210160129; Mon, 6 Sep 2021 23:41:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id WOevMlY95PwK; Mon, 6 Sep 2021 23:41:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 544D116012A; Mon, 6 Sep 2021 23:41:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id 5HKKPRiXv6u4; Mon, 6 Sep 2021 23:41:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.9] (cpe-172-91-119-151.socal.res.rr.com [172.91.119.151]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2E3C7160129; Mon, 6 Sep 2021 23:41:40 -0700 (PDT) References: <83zgsoq5vm.fsf@gnu.org> From: Paul Eggert Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: <683ee57b-9768-1561-f926-16605e77b483@cs.ucla.edu> Date: Mon, 6 Sep 2021 23:41:39 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <83zgsoq5vm.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.4 (---) On 9/6/21 11:03 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > Doesn't that mean we will be removing support for AIX (and any other > systems that cannot use ncurses due to the same problem)? Yes it does mean that, at least, on AIX systems without any of the other=20 terminal libraries installed. > the original problem was fixed, and there's no longer a link error > when using curses. That's right. So I guess we should keep curses support, for the odd user=20 still running Emacs on AIX. Sorry about any confusion on the topic. From unknown Sun Aug 10 08:58:42 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#50444: Remove support for the curses library Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2021 06:45:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 50444 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Paul Eggert Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 50444@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 50444-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B50444.163099708719927 (code B ref 50444); Tue, 07 Sep 2021 06:45:02 +0000 Received: (at 50444) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2021 06:44:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55315 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUqd-0005BK-KQ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:44:47 -0400 Received: from mail-pf1-f172.google.com ([209.85.210.172]:36792) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNUqb-0005B7-Ul for 50444@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 02:44:46 -0400 Received: by mail-pf1-f172.google.com with SMTP id m26so7381025pff.3 for <50444@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 23:44:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lZPuGzDGYVJ9JyCIshTycUiREDqNo6evb7LkwTFMGuY=; b=S+VM24x8wzb4oD8FyANEgUXks1jt+domTB/TOFNEQ34CiE7JMr3Veljle/7spnmCiT 8+r8/5DaOGj1olnT9mK03gOnkLw3D0aZBA+vKh1dO8HTcQhZvtg4Z0lFeC+dRTzFC2zM PyO3GACsWDNESDV/r/auOj8kXKzhwR0/ydH98rnLpq+AcVoQMwKbExDg54YnGbOZl/2e dpxkPhOLKoI11ElTNNGwTUac+SVa+wlDOAzyLD+jvp17y6edQxVXGYQhOy/jPiH40LvJ nsKxDgMCKoKmHohGqlX/rnoxReRSQ1hnJOp3JCiI8BdEDwirgLXGqPImlJQV79ds/3F3 L5kA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532/cHnImcJZwWLf7xLSFGWvX1WH8YmUsfrukypMmeaSwfpT8sng JNBfQxcmnil7l46Dcyg4u+xbmmTJs8C5MAoZJ6c= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx4IXgPh5OUI2oM9wecS0E0EGAM6CpPRrEgiSJ/AOLV30SwFDM3++kAS9T2J7ZjgPd+sHGbEQrTVtzzv5ryXXQ= X-Received: by 2002:a63:7d5d:: with SMTP id m29mr5519622pgn.114.1630997080141; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 23:44:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <83zgsoq5vm.fsf@gnu.org> <683ee57b-9768-1561-f926-16605e77b483@cs.ucla.edu> In-Reply-To: <683ee57b-9768-1561-f926-16605e77b483@cs.ucla.edu> From: Stefan Kangas Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 08:44:29 +0200 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) tags 50444 notabug close 50444 thanks Paul Eggert writes: > That's right. So I guess we should keep curses support, for the odd user > still running Emacs on AIX. Sorry about any confusion on the topic. OK, thanks for clearing that up. From unknown Sun Aug 10 08:58:42 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#50444: Remove support for the curses library Resent-From: Richard Stallman Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 08 Sep 2021 03:30:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 50444 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: notabug To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: eggert@cs.ucla.edu, stefan@marxist.se, 50444@debbugs.gnu.org Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Received: via spool by 50444-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B50444.163107174719542 (code B ref 50444); Wed, 08 Sep 2021 03:30:02 +0000 Received: (at 50444) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Sep 2021 03:29:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58150 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNoGo-000557-PA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 23:29:07 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:37948) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNoGe-00054T-8T for 50444@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 23:29:06 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:48944) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mNoGV-0006c1-2w; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 23:28:50 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mNoGS-0001gG-BF; Tue, 07 Sep 2021 23:28:44 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman In-Reply-To: <83zgsoq5vm.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Tue, 07 Sep 2021 09:03:41 +0300) References: <83zgsoq5vm.fsf@gnu.org> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2021 23:28:44 -0400 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] If curses support is actually needed for some systems which people still run Emacs on, and it does work on those systems, there is no need to delete it. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)