From unknown Sat Aug 09 13:00:10 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#5040 <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#5040 <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem Reply-To: bug#5040 <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2025 20:00:10 +0000 retitle 5040 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem reassign 5040 emacs,w32 submitter 5040 "Drew Adams" severity 5040 normal thanks From drew.adams@oracle.com Wed Nov 25 13:11:05 2009 Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 21:11:05 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.2 required=4.0 tests=AWL,FOURLA autolearn=no version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPLB3b1000918 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:11:05 -0800 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NDP8h-0006Xh-IK for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:11:03 -0500 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NDP8d-0006SX-PT for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:11:03 -0500 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=47815 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NDP8d-0006SL-Jt for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:10:59 -0500 Received: from acsinet11.oracle.com ([141.146.126.233]:23865) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NDP8d-0007vd-8c for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:10:59 -0500 Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by acsinet11.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPLBuxm003730 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 21:11:57 GMT Received: from acsmt358.oracle.com (acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPKJM81026675 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 21:10:52 GMT Received: from abhmt009.oracle.com by acsmt354.oracle.com with ESMTP id 616078891259183443; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:10:43 -0800 Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.80.204) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:10:43 -0800 From: "Drew Adams" To: Subject: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:10:53 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcpuE8WW4wm/QYCLQdKfhQOdqKAK2Q== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090206.4B0D9D5D.00FE:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) emacs -Q M-: (w32-register-hot-key [M-tab]) Visit a buffer in emacs-lisp-mode. Type `forward-', then hit `M-TAB'. The Windows TAB dialog comes up (dunno what you call it - a seqence of icons; you TAB to cycle among their apps) when you hold down the keys and then disappears when you release them. It should not not come up at all; instead, `lisp-complete-symbol' should be executed. However, from then on it works as it should. It is only the first time you press `M-TAB' that Windows doesn't pass the chord to Emacs. emacs -Q M-: (w32-register-hot-key [M-tab]) Visit a buffer in emacs-lisp-mode. `C-h k M-TAB'. Same as above: the Windows TAB dialog comes up and then disappears when you release the keys. And from then on it works OK. In sum, after evalling (w32-register-hot-key [M-tab]) the first `M-TAB' should be seen by Emacs, but it is not. Only subsequent `M-TAB's are seen by Emacs. This worked perfectly in Emacs 20 and 21. It is broken starting with Emacs 22. In GNU Emacs 23.1.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600) of 2009-07-29 on SOFT-MJASON Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 5.1.2600 configured using `configure --with-gcc (4.4)' Important settings: value of $LC_ALL: nil value of $LC_COLLATE: nil value of $LC_CTYPE: nil value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil value of $LC_MONETARY: nil value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil value of $LC_TIME: nil value of $LANG: ENU value of $XMODIFIERS: nil locale-coding-system: cp1252 default-enable-multibyte-characters: t Major mode: Emacs-Lisp Minor modes in effect: tooltip-mode: t tool-bar-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t menu-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t global-auto-composition-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t Recent input: M-: C-y C-h k C-g C-g C-x 1 C-h k C-g C-g Recent messages: For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a. 265 (#o411, #x109) Type C-x 1 to delete the help window. Quit Type C-x 1 to delete the help window, C-M-v to scroll help. Quit Quit From lennart.borgman@gmail.com Wed Nov 25 13:49:17 2009 Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 21:49:18 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=unavailable version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPLnGRG004086 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:49:17 -0800 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NDPjg-00036T-3v for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:49:16 -0500 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NDPjb-00031P-MB for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:49:15 -0500 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=35738 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NDPjb-00031M-Gp for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:49:11 -0500 Received: from mail-yx0-f175.google.com ([209.85.210.175]:32929) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NDPjb-0004WE-90 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:49:11 -0500 Received: by yxe5 with SMTP id 5so171712yxe.24 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:49:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=zcuRfWPCf5EPLW5CGKQu++0S1OQJrk8MiKTzWe70s0A=; b=AcWMn9NjUog3rXMOwvVNUCVEq1zHdq+/HzPmpV0xsSznT2aNe22Gp0djWOWV9SM0o+ VV2yBtz/lRwL2dBsfd+UBfr+dozUClUj5Ks0cIFviXE1xevumftf7TtpDTOe8VLwhLQj Pa8Fp8IpQZBhrlkyHurwXDf+NaKbsnhc7pN0k= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; b=MPzMw/dwy+qXOKs93cZt1zS+CrM4FJn+e4xHT5cP6RDR3rEfWKc9Emr5ZeFKAOnuo2 Ka5oHJ4Uw91yAwOgPtMKuS7WJ7qoRr8rXsrqUybaZY/onOrGby082xhd0DmC9BRAZ8Uk 5WklQfRMnvtWz7JMTur1lQRxrz3ss1Zau3rzM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.101.61.20 with SMTP id o20mr6071260ank.166.1259185750634; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:49:10 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Lennart Borgman Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:48:49 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Drew Adams , 5040@debbugs.gnu.org Cc: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:10 PM, Drew Adams wrote: > emacs -Q > M-: (w32-register-hot-key [M-tab]) > > Visit a buffer in emacs-lisp-mode. > Type `forward-', then hit `M-TAB'. > > The Windows TAB dialog comes up (dunno what you call it - a seqence of > icons; you TAB to cycle among their apps) when you hold down the keys > and then disappears when you release them. It should not not come up > at all; instead, `lisp-complete-symbol' should be executed. > > However, from then on it works as it should. It is only the first time > you press `M-TAB' that Windows doesn't pass the chord to Emacs. This is AFAICS not a bug. M-TAB (and some other keys) can not be registered as hot keys according to MS documentation. From drew.adams@oracle.com Wed Nov 25 13:53:23 2009 Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 21:53:23 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.8 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=unavailable version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPLrLjd004570 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:53:22 -0800 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NDPnd-0005dl-8R for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:53:21 -0500 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NDPnY-0005bG-Kb for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:53:20 -0500 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=33349 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NDPnY-0005bA-Fe for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:53:16 -0500 Received: from rcsinet11.oracle.com ([148.87.113.123]:27659 helo=rgminet11.oracle.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NDPnY-0004p2-6T for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:53:16 -0500 Received: from rgminet15.oracle.com (rcsinet15.oracle.com [148.87.113.117]) by rgminet11.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPLrA8g010611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 25 Nov 2009 21:53:11 GMT Received: from acsmt358.oracle.com (acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158]) by rgminet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPLr4Hc026382; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 21:53:04 GMT Received: from abhmt002.oracle.com by acsmt356.oracle.com with ESMTP id 615446191259185963; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:52:43 -0800 Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.80.204) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:52:42 -0800 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Lennart Borgman'" , <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> Cc: References: Subject: RE: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:52:52 -0800 Message-ID: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcpuGSIrE/zikm0bTZuU8DkHMe6B7gAACFEQ In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090208.4B0DA740.007E:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) > On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:10 PM, Drew Adams > wrote: > > emacs -Q > > M-: (w32-register-hot-key [M-tab]) > > > > Visit a buffer in emacs-lisp-mode. > > Type `forward-', then hit `M-TAB'. > > > > The Windows TAB dialog comes up (dunno what you call it - a > > seqence of icons; you TAB to cycle among their apps) when > > you hold down the keys and then disappears when you release > > them. It should not not come up at all; instead, > > `lisp-complete-symbol' should be executed. > > > > However, from then on it works as it should. It is only the > > first time you press `M-TAB' that Windows doesn't pass the > > chord to Emacs. > > This is AFAICS not a bug. M-TAB (and some other keys) can not be > registered as hot keys according to MS documentation. As I said: 1. It works perfectly after the first time you hit `M-TAB'. 2. It works perfectly in Emacs 20 and 21, even the first time. So AFAICS what you say is simply not true, at least for me (Windows XP SP3). From lennart.borgman@gmail.com Wed Nov 25 13:55:31 2009 Received: (at 5040) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 21:55:31 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.4 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mail-gx0-f226.google.com (mail-gx0-f226.google.com [209.85.217.226]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPLtTO1004885 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:55:30 -0800 Received: by gxk26 with SMTP id 26so143817gxk.1 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:55:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=X6xRQG3G6vs/bZWv8x7WB2cEf7JJS/q0AU3I1ZVBNsc=; b=CA/jj29eMQzzYy9tpqM0oU0Bvv69JNxI1aWIdewyXg7Mdats0N7VinY10ZGUMnz354 mio4FdYZVUuXpe6iM54dkm79X+SzLSOahEv4/14aJ1dcj8w+z3EppKskSkwnqtVuuE5C nsJykUnvf/z7eOXGbD4yb0oZm79hXVjXZXqvo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; b=EakNNqQg941DeXxb9aHSc3X+xl7wpsXc+ypMehlmyXXh19S4hLYy2p8LiaBizqatyL NI6huf3hd7rH/wWUZqNhP1ZDbq/sOhogscFQXpb37tRi3hTr794wkd742ng9Axy4Enr9 ut9y9CeS/EMHvSZh1jmW5XAXrf1HQfkLYMkTQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.101.178.5 with SMTP id f5mr6005812anp.104.1259186124075; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:55:24 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> From: Lennart Borgman Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:55:04 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Drew Adams Cc: 5040 <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > As I said: > > 1. It works perfectly after the first time you hit `M-TAB'. > > 2. It works perfectly in Emacs 20 and 21, even the first time. > > So AFAICS what you say is simply not true, at least for me (Windows XP SP3). Why does it matter that it worked for you before? From drew.adams@oracle.com Wed Nov 25 14:01:48 2009 Received: (at 5040) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 22:01:48 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.8 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from acsinet12.oracle.com (acsinet12.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPM1kvA005365 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:01:48 -0800 Received: from rgminet15.oracle.com (rcsinet15.oracle.com [148.87.113.117]) by acsinet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPM1aJD005281 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:01:38 GMT Received: from acsmt358.oracle.com (acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158]) by rgminet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPLr4ka026384; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:01:41 GMT Received: from abhmt008.oracle.com by acsmt355.oracle.com with ESMTP id 614970791259186495; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:01:35 -0800 Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.80.204) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:01:35 -0800 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Lennart Borgman'" Cc: "'5040'" <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> Subject: RE: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:01:46 -0800 Message-ID: <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcpuGgGw5YY9vVFiT/iGswEfc7R0LAAAG6CA In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090206.4B0DA941.0105:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 > > As I said: > > 1. It works perfectly after the first time you hit `M-TAB'. > > 2. It works perfectly in Emacs 20 and 21, even the first time. > > > > So AFAICS what you say is simply not true, at least for me > > (Windows XP SP3). > > Why does it matter that it worked for you before? Huh? Who said anything about "before"? It works for me NOW. And probably for others too. It works in Emacs 20 and 21 always, including the first time I hit `M-TAB'. It works in Emacs 22 and 23 also, EXCEPT for the first time I hit `M-TAB'. This is a regression starting in Emacs 22. We know it is possible for it to work starting with the first `M-TAB', because it does (still) work in older Emacs versions (now, not "before'). From lennart.borgman@gmail.com Wed Nov 25 14:04:51 2009 Received: (at 5040) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 22:04:51 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.4 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mail-gx0-f226.google.com (mail-gx0-f226.google.com [209.85.217.226]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPM4nQS005401 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:04:51 -0800 Received: by gxk26 with SMTP id 26so150309gxk.1 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:04:44 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=W/UMmBQ98e89dRyOX7m93WDl+L3RjFLVsFVyYB2vkYY=; b=L9MnxkTk4rGtJo+c8ff4lqDCHA9AL3MqVSpmztHIQWMJQ8KqhfJDYg814xAzxiSI5n svVVDeXHS8mk9wDdd+KrxqDy0inXz7+5msdoE788Xuc+TFkoNIJOUPvaCdu0sNerwiah xp2Bc6RTctrBnWj+Y9eyPsvdSL2B7Kn7sgaXs= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=q/wLZywGygLhwwMvtfHtitxiv+uSFsoDqAr5m/Kd4x8man14EMbFKwLtNUHHtcHKYi X4FTL6LC8ETQe+HVdm5F2c5etHKx6jCPUBB2cVJFArAxeJ6Y6G+LKC4EHudskpKVd/Dr j15YKK+lWK87JCDeehrBohl/K6QzTYhYNagCU= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.101.4.22 with SMTP id g22mr6096708ani.40.1259186684174; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:04:44 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> From: Lennart Borgman Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 23:04:24 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Drew Adams Cc: 5040 <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:01 PM, Drew Adams wrote: >> > As I said: >> > 1. It works perfectly after the first time you hit `M-TAB'. >> > 2. It works perfectly in Emacs 20 and 21, even the first time. >> > >> > So AFAICS what you say is simply not true, at least for me >> > (Windows XP SP3). >> >> Why does it matter that it worked for you before? > > Huh? Who said anything about "before"? > > It works for me NOW. And probably for others too. > It works in Emacs 20 and 21 always, > =C2=A0 including the first time I hit `M-TAB'. > It works in Emacs 22 and 23 also, > =C2=A0 EXCEPT for the first time I hit `M-TAB'. > > This is a regression starting in Emacs 22. We know it is possible for it = to work > starting with the first `M-TAB', because it does (still) work in older Em= acs > versions (now, not "before'). No, it is not guaranteed to work. If you want to be sure that it works you need something like the low level keyboard path I have suggested before. From drew.adams@oracle.com Wed Nov 25 14:18:05 2009 Received: (at 5040) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 22:18:05 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.7 required=4.0 tests=AWL,FOURLA,HAS_BUG_NUMBER, MURPHY_DRUGS_REL8 autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from rgminet12.oracle.com (rcsinet12.oracle.com [148.87.113.124]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPMI3R3007383 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:18:05 -0800 Received: from rgminet15.oracle.com (rcsinet15.oracle.com [148.87.113.117]) by rgminet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPMHpkU004554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:17:52 GMT Received: from acsmt357.oracle.com (acsmt357.oracle.com [141.146.40.157]) by rgminet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id nAPLggJG031996; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:17:59 GMT Received: from abhmt002.oracle.com by acsmt356.oracle.com with ESMTP id 617229661259187473; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:17:53 -0800 Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.80.204) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:17:53 -0800 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Lennart Borgman'" Cc: "'5040'" <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> Subject: RE: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:18:03 -0800 Message-ID: <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcpuG02v7BScbxz7Su6TzO8S/7CwFgAAD0nA In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt357.oracle.com [141.146.40.157] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090202.4B0DAD12.00FB:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 > >> > As I said: > >> > 1. It works perfectly after the first time you hit `M-TAB'. > >> > 2. It works perfectly in Emacs 20 and 21, even the first time. > >> > > >> > So AFAICS what you say is simply not true, at least for me > >> > (Windows XP SP3). > >> > >> Why does it matter that it worked for you before? > > > > Huh? Who said anything about "before"? > > > > It works for me NOW. And probably for others too. > > It works in Emacs 20 and 21 always, > > =A0 including the first time I hit `M-TAB'. > > It works in Emacs 22 and 23 also, > > =A0 EXCEPT for the first time I hit `M-TAB'. > > > > This is a regression starting in Emacs 22. We know it is=20 > > possible for it to work starting with the first `M-TAB', > > because it does (still) work in older Emacs versions (now, > > not "before'). >=20 > > No, it is not guaranteed to work. If you want to be sure that it = works > > you need something like the low level keyboard path I have suggested > > before. Lennart, we don't seem to be communicating. "No", what? Did I say anything about guarantees? I said it works FOR ME (Windows XP SP3), and I suspect for at least some = others also. (Have you tried it (with emacs -Q)? Does it work for you? You = might be surprised that it does.) What is THIS bug report about? There is a minor regression starting with = Emacs 22. THAT'S ALL. Please don't turn this into a discussion/rant about the Windows/Emacs = patching you "have suggested before". All I'm asking for is that this particular = bug be fixed - to make Emacs do again what it did in Emacs 21. Nothing more. Let's not let the perfect become the enemy of the good. If you want to = file another bug about guarantees, low-level patches, and other things, feel = free. I have no objection to perfection ;-). But while waiting, let's see if = this can be fixed to at least let Emacs do what it did before. From lennart.borgman@gmail.com Wed Nov 25 14:24:43 2009 Received: (at 5040) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 25 Nov 2009 22:24:44 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=4.0 tests=AWL,FOURLA,HAS_BUG_NUMBER, MURPHY_DRUGS_REL8 autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mail-yw0-f196.google.com (mail-yw0-f196.google.com [209.85.211.196]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id nAPMOg9B007834 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:24:43 -0800 Received: by ywh34 with SMTP id 34so164620ywh.1 for <5040@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:24:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=VZkoT/rD4/AAMaOgxDeGJJi+Zegzg3JkWYRT/cDOgAU=; b=xmEcyLbpKwZ18KmowIXCNvgUJzO8UIjs+STcNiJPBmPNXgzsRveb1sM0j/fYlOlJgp OVZnQoBJvd5vF/uOfb2h9qlRoQ0lz0LU4AlOpcQGN3lf2IsL6/D82zTLjUwnSlk70lvx nzE76It7+koA8fQOCDbPLr2GXQB0xD0HC8+jY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=D1nbIzjAmgINRWYCnpMvZX7+mIqrNIgsp0+7kbCQ+zihfvvt506CWwB4CjouX8sRxs wGXRwSSDWsUQWo6Z8R10t33C1zE/QgprZjSO+tpsprUY3wZpcPjApeUabKKuOcOzJ+8Y d8bHfEkl1rv9K1RFgUFJMWMSDyGW6cSX3fI8A= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.101.144.30 with SMTP id w30mr16772ann.52.1259187877107; Wed, 25 Nov 2009 14:24:37 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> From: Lennart Borgman Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 23:24:17 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Drew Adams Cc: 5040 <5040@debbugs.gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:18 PM, Drew Adams wrote: > > Lennart, we don't seem to be communicating. > "No", what? =C2=A0Did I say anything about guarantees? > > I said it works FOR ME (Windows XP SP3), and I suspect for at least some = others > also. (Have you tried it (with emacs -Q)? Does it work for you? You might= be > surprised that it does.) > > What is THIS bug report about? There is a minor regression starting with = Emacs > 22. THAT'S ALL. I am trying to say that this is not guaranteed to work. Some key combinations are strictly not allowed by w32 to be used by applications. And I think I misremembered. I am not sure if it can work with a low level keyboard hook either. There is not very much that we can do to guarantee that it works. If it works it works a bit by chance. Next patch from MS may stop it from working. But you are right, if it works for you with the old versions of Emacs there might be a way to fool w32 here. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 27 19:13:46 2010 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Jan 2010 00:13:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NaI14-0003WI-8V for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 19:13:46 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NaI12-0003WB-1C for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 19:13:44 -0500 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NaI0y-0002kj-9B; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 19:13:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19296.54964.237486.393967@fencepost.gnu.org> Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 19:13:40 -0500 From: Glenn Morris To: control Subject: control X-Attribution: GM X-Mailer: VM (www.wonderworks.com/vm), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs) X-Hue: magenta X-Ran: jqeI@9]N2j9L=T5y{46XM$yis^=8-t%A[c3H.k}5+~~"#Nf)E5)8*?XxH+0T%:q./m!M*2 X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Spam-Score: -4.9 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.9 (----) tags 5032 moreinfo reassign 5032 emacs,w32 reassign 5040 emacs,w32 severity 5042 wishlist reassign 5074 emacs,w32 severity 5105 minor tags 5173 patch severity 5183 minor severity 5184 minor submitter 5195 monnier@iro.umontreal.ca unarchive 5227 unmerge 5227 tags 5251 patch severity 5290 wishlist reassign 5299 emacs,w32 tags 5326 patch reopen 5336 severity 5336 serious retitle 5336 DOC file is arch dependent reassign 5349 emacs,ns severity 5433 wishlist close 5456 reassign 5464 emacs,w32 reassign 5465 emacs,w32 reassign 5480 emacs,gnus reassign 5482 emacs,w32 reassign 5484 emacs,etags tags 5484 patch From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jul 01 22:04:51 2011 Received: (at 5040-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2011 02:04:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QcpZj-00024u-Ai for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 01 Jul 2011 22:04:51 -0400 Received: from mail-pv0-f178.google.com ([74.125.83.178]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QcpZi-00024j-75 for 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Fri, 01 Jul 2011 22:04:50 -0400 Received: by pvg7 with SMTP id 7so3920456pvg.37 for <5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Fri, 01 Jul 2011 19:04:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=/VZy610nmQi/XVZm+Xr5sTq1INnMqr45x57UBxivE8Y=; b=YpVe7FGQULFPdEb8aPZHnA6gMCSyR9C10zpFNns2KR886omAHiACD8NY7l7m+53Iuz tzNHNCS8pjqnKG2o1EDp8mg/26duj15cvigK2B6Ofdtwfvw88Jfp2DuaMY3FQqW2dJSy gbbMv2L1cmRCVej3WTDtQexUb+qjA4ojzd5Bo= Received: by 10.143.12.16 with SMTP id p16mr1683701wfi.50.1309572284236; Fri, 01 Jul 2011 19:04:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.50.7 with HTTP; Fri, 1 Jul 2011 19:04:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> From: Juanma Barranquero Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2011 04:04:03 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Lennart Borgman , 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 5040-done Cc: Drew Adams X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) On one hand, Drew is right that if it works with 21.X and 22.X, it should work with 23.X+. On the other hand, Lennart's right that Alt-Tab is reserved and, to make it work reliably it would be necessary to write a low level keyboard hook. On the third hand, alt-tab role in Vista and Windows 7 is enhanced and it does not make much sense to try to bypass it and go against the system (not that it does not make any sense, just not worth the effort IMHO). So I'm closing this one. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Juanma From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 02 10:16:57 2011 Received: (at 5040-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2011 14:16:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd10D-0000W8-5u for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 10:16:57 -0400 Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com ([141.146.126.227]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd10A-0000Vo-A0 for 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 10:16:55 -0400 Received: from acsinet21.oracle.com (acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id p62EGktQ029165 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 2 Jul 2011 14:16:48 GMT Received: from acsmt356.oracle.com (acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156]) by acsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id p62EGkVQ007580 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 2 Jul 2011 14:16:46 GMT Received: from abhmt113.oracle.com (abhmt113.oracle.com [141.146.116.65]) by acsmt356.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id p62EGeVF006238; Sat, 2 Jul 2011 09:16:40 -0500 Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.63.244) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 07:16:40 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Juanma Barranquero'" , "'Lennart Borgman'" , <5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com> References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> Subject: RE: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2011 07:16:31 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: Thread-Index: Acw4XG6Q3Ocqk+7lQZ+WkIsEOkX1dAAY7jXQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6109 X-Source-IP: acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090203.4E0F2850.0085:SCFMA922111,ss=1,re=-4.000,fgs=0 X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 5040-done X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) > On one hand, Drew is right that if it works with 21.X and 22.X, it > should work with 23.X+. Correction: it works with 20 and 21, not with 22 or 23 (or 24). And it works in all versions after just the first M-TAB. It is only the first M-TAB in Emacs 22+ where it does not work. Why not at least look into why this might be? Emacs apparently *knows* how to make this work - it works forever after the first M-TAB, and in Emacs 20 and 21 it works even for the first M-TAB. It's not like this is something Emacs doesn't know how to do correctly - it's that a bug was introduced to break it. > On the other hand, Lennart's right that Alt-Tab is reserved and, to > make it work reliably it would be necessary to write a low level > keyboard hook. > > On the third hand, alt-tab role in Vista and Windows 7 is enhanced and > it does not make much sense to try to bypass it and go against the > system (not that it does not make any sense, just not worth the effort > IMHO). So I'm closing this one. I don't know anything about Vista or Windows 7, so I can't speak to that. That MS Windows "reserves" something is not in itself (i.e., alone) a reason that Emacs should respect that "reservation". There is nothing new about MS Windows using M-TAB, and nothing new about Emacs using M-TAB. And to use it in Emacs, Windows users must explicitly do (w32-register-hot-key [M-tab]). That's a user choice, not Emacs's choice or Windows's choice. The bug remains. And AFAICT no one has even looked at it (why does it happen? what change introduced the bug?). There has only been argument over whether Windows officially permits Emacs to do something it has always done. There is nothing in this bug thread apart from the bug report recipe and frothing about how Emacs shouldn't disrespect Windows's "reservation". Why the zeal to "close" bugs that remain bugs? This bug has never even been investigated. If there is insufficient manpower to look into this bug, then leave it open. Or if Emacs Dev is certain that it should not fix it (why?), then change it to `wontfix'. It is a bug nonetheless - and a regression no less. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 02 10:38:26 2011 Received: (at 5040-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2011 14:38:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd1L0-0001yv-5t for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 10:38:26 -0400 Received: from mail-ew0-f50.google.com ([209.85.215.50]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd1Kw-0001yb-CQ for 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 10:38:23 -0400 Received: by ewy10 with SMTP id 10so1596051ewy.37 for <5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 07:38:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=sBW9nhWtrvbAqPJh2jENgxTypUMam/ohhCVoJX77F/o=; b=hd9ZBLw3nlt60YqT+19ZVoi/CmgONDu55sWkDYF6xYyLggjaa7wcI5PpJPdtDSc+Vh MZuliHkIGvXtzdKKKSZ5hxLNdxSyHkY2BfGdVE13gIyiqZ4AbiZBCgxqG7VQIs8ZzbqP FthBMmvjtX7DfZ2qScyVlDvQKCxzWT4tytQO8= Received: by 10.213.20.200 with SMTP id g8mr1329124ebb.140.1309617496116; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 07:38:16 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.7.84 with HTTP; Sat, 2 Jul 2011 07:37:56 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> From: Lennart Borgman Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2011 16:37:56 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Drew Adams Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 5040-done Cc: Juanma Barranquero , 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: 0.4 (/) On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 16:16, Drew Adams wrote: > > That MS Windows "reserves" something is not in itself (i.e., alone) a rea= son > that Emacs should respect that "reservation". =C2=A0There is nothing new = about MS > Windows using M-TAB, and nothing new about Emacs using M-TAB. > > And to use it in Emacs, Windows users must explicitly do (w32-register-ho= t-key > [M-tab]). =C2=A0That's a user choice, not Emacs's choice or Windows's cho= ice. MS has warned not to use this combination and some other. It might be possible to sometimes get around this technically but that is not guaranteed. As I think I have told in a bug report I have seen more problems in this area in Windows 7 than before. In addition to this I have seen some very strange things in this area in Windows 7 (64-bit) when running 32-bit Emacs. However I suspect that might be problems with gcc compiler. (And the lack of control of status after system calls on w32 in Emacs. Something that makes it hard to catch problems of the type I have seen now. At the moment I have not time to look at it. Sadly I do not have time to argue about adding these checks either, but I would be glad if they were added.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 02 13:24:36 2011 Received: (at 5040-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2011 17:24:36 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd3vo-0004dN-1r for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 13:24:36 -0400 Received: from mail-pv0-f178.google.com ([74.125.83.178]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd3vm-0004d3-I5 for 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 13:24:35 -0400 Received: by pvg7 with SMTP id 7so4429509pvg.37 for <5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 10:24:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jaHuIPn52IwBJiM10V6F4fP2XIi7s/b/ALccmwPytHc=; b=TWM2kud04ma026iLXjuyOlCwd8j4W2TYcjbVaqEt6TYK8d0QT3vAgrHEzEXSIpVfFc q72+Ek5099Xm1a625Ug4KuKNb/PCdhznkyZHv+MmXSPjr4JQSM5C3zxci8zcfxYMUVZS 0v+1wVg2EH0hjdeg7R3nHi3SvAehurRB0rfzg= Received: by 10.143.66.15 with SMTP id t15mr1913027wfk.278.1309627468243; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 10:24:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.50.7 with HTTP; Sat, 2 Jul 2011 10:23:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <9231AB1910AA47F2B285F07F0FBBAFAC@us.oracle.com> <7D46B07AB79C4B97ACC6A10827E4C259@us.oracle.com> <0FA4391554F74C69AED4E1DE61F5ABAA@us.oracle.com> From: Juanma Barranquero Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2011 19:23:47 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#5040: 23.1; w32-register-hot-key problem To: Drew Adams Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.6 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 5040-done Cc: 5040-done@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com, Lennart Borgman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: 0.6 (/) On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 16:16, Drew Adams wrote: > Correction: it works with 20 and 21, not with 22 or 23 (or 24). Yes, sorry. > Why not at least look into why this > might be? > > Emacs apparently *knows* how to make this work - it works forever after t= he > first M-TAB, and in Emacs 20 and 21 it works even for the first M-TAB. = =C2=A0It's not > like this is something Emacs doesn't know how to do correctly - it's that= a bug > was introduced to break it. Or perhaps it worked right before just by happenstance. Perhaps we were passing uninitialized data to some API, and the moment we fixed it it stopped working. On Windows 7, I cannot make it work *at all*, not the first time, not afterwards, not ever. > That MS Windows "reserves" something is not in itself (i.e., alone) a rea= son > that Emacs should respect that "reservation". =C2=A0There is nothing new = about MS > Windows using M-TAB, and nothing new about Emacs using M-TAB. > > And to use it in Emacs, Windows users must explicitly do (w32-register-ho= t-key > [M-tab]). =C2=A0That's a user choice, not Emacs's choice or Windows's cho= ice. > > The bug remains. =C2=A0And AFAICT no one has even looked at it (why does = it happen? > what change introduced the bug?). =C2=A0There has only been argument over= whether > Windows officially permits Emacs to do something it has always done. =C2= =A0There is > nothing in this bug thread apart from the bug report recipe and frothing = about > how Emacs shouldn't disrespect Windows's "reservation". > Why the zeal to "close" bugs that remain bugs? =C2=A0This bug has never e= ven been > investigated. =C2=A0If there is insufficient manpower to look into this b= ug, then > leave it open. There are very few maintainers of Emacs for Windows. No one of us has shown any inclination to fix it or give it too much weight, and even if you believe that Emacs is not bound to obey Microsoft, it is certainly easier to go with the flow that against it, and the flow is for that kind of keystrokes to be more strongly reserved for Windows functions, not less. It *was* a regression, on 2007-06-02 when 22.1 was released. Now, four years later, it seems like something which is not worth investing any effort in fixing it (specially because, as I've said, I think it wouldn't easily work at all on newer Windows). Of course that's my take, and that's why I closed the bug. If you feel strongly, don't hesitate to reopen it and change it to a Wontfix, because I suspect no one is going to go the trouble to fix it anyway (though I could be wrong). =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Juanma From unknown Sat Aug 09 13:00:10 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2011 11:24:05 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator