From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:25:40 2025 X-Loop: don@donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#493: describe-variable vs. not necessarily soul origins Reply-To: jidanni@jidanni.org, 493@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: jidanni@jidanni.org Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:15:06 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: don@donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: report 493 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B.121458273532679 (code B ref -1); Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:15:06 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2007-08-08) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.7 required=4.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.2.3-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 27 Jun 2008 16:05:35 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id m5RG5TUT032412 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:05:31 -0700 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KCGS1-0004Yo-DU for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:29 -0400 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KCGRz-0004Y6-QK for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:29 -0400 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=37564 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KCGRz-0004Y1-Lh for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:27 -0400 Received: from lax-green-bigip-5.dreamhost.com ([208.113.200.5]:55782 helo=blingymail-a3.g.dreamhost.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KCGRz-0000Fp-FA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:27 -0400 Received: from jidanni1.jidanni.org (122-127-39-207.dynamic.hinet.net [122.127.39.207]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by blingymail-a3.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9FB414D65D for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:05:25 -0700 (PDT) To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org From: jidanni@jidanni.org Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2008 00:03:01 +0800 Message-ID: <873amyhnm2.fsf@jidanni.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) describe-variable shows e.g., kill-emacs-hook is a variable defined in `C source code'. Its value is (w3m-arrived-shutdown (lambda nil (sleep-for 5)) #[nil "\300\301!\207" [server-mode -1] 2]) The problems are: Saying kill-emacs-hook is a variable defined in `C source code'. Its value is is misleading, as it looks like you are saying "this is the definition as found in the C source code" when in fact it has been modified since. So maybe say Its CURRENT value is Or if you keep track of whether it has been modified or not, than say two different things accordingly. P.S., saying #[nil "\300\301!\207" [server-mode -1] 2]) presents the user with unexplained octal gobbledygook. And maybe even add a list of all the files that altered the variable, so one can track down just what put that byte-compiled stuff there (that one doesn't see with emacs -Q). From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:25:40 2025 X-Loop: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: bug#493: describe-variable misleading origin References: <873amyhnm2.fsf@jidanni.org> In-Reply-To: <873amyhnm2.fsf@jidanni.org> Resent-From: jidanni@jidanni.org Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 03 Feb 2010 18:55:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 493 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: wontfix To: 493@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 493-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B493.12652232444484 (code B ref 493); Wed, 03 Feb 2010 18:55:01 +0000 Received: (at 493) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Feb 2010 18:54:04 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NckMV-0001AH-TW for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 03 Feb 2010 13:54:04 -0500 Received: from caiajhbdcagg.dreamhost.com ([208.97.132.66] helo=homiemail-a7.g.dreamhost.com) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NckMT-00019s-VV for 493@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 03 Feb 2010 13:54:02 -0500 Received: from jidanni.org (218-163-0-198.dynamic.hinet.net [218.163.0.198]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by homiemail-a7.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A415A25C06F for <493@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 3 Feb 2010 10:53:54 -0800 (PST) From: jidanni@jidanni.org Date: Thu, 04 Feb 2010 02:53:52 +0800 Message-ID: <87hbpyf8vz.fsf@jidanni.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -3.1 (---) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.1 (---) (describe-variable (quote message-mode-hook)) gives message-mode-hook is a variable defined in `message.el'. Its value is (#[nil "\300\301\302\"\207" [local-set-key "^Ci" ispell-message] 3]) This variable is potentially risky when used as a file local variable. Documentation: Hook run in message mode buffers. You can customize this variable. It looks to the user like that byte code is coming from message.el. Actually it is coming from http://jidanni.org/comp/configuration/.emacs (.emacs.elc), loaded before message.el. So maybe that origin should be mentioned too. You must admit "is a variable defined in `message.el'" is wrong. It is defined in .emacs.elc. In message.el there is merely a empty defcustom. emacs-version "23.1.92.1" From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:25:40 2025 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.428 (Entity 5.428) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: jidanni@jidanni.org Subject: bug#493: closed (Re: bug#493: describe-variable misleading origin) Message-ID: References: <873amyhnm2.fsf@jidanni.org> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 493 X-Gnu-PR-Package: emacs X-Gnu-PR-Keywords: wontfix Reply-To: 493@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2012 01:06:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1329872762-13772-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1329872762-13772-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #493: describe-variable to keep track of where vars were set; not just wher= e they were defined which was filed against the emacs package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 493@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 493: http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D493 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1329872762-13772-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 493-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Feb 2012 01:06:00 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49506 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1S00ed-0003Zr-Bq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:05:59 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:54450 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1S00eb-0003Zl-8E for 493-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:05:57 -0500 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1S00cL-0001Sj-CW; Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:03:37 -0500 From: Glenn Morris To: 493-done@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#493: describe-variable misleading origin References: <873amyhnm2.fsf@jidanni.org> <87hbpyf8vz.fsf@jidanni.org> X-Spook: rail gun embassy industrial intelligence USCODE M-14 X-Ran: \;5NOK&yi@B4(f1_2jEKLD94M(2]cOSa*-dENb'jKD/vGfV`t1Ej>[Ex;O@=laL$/{hH5L X-Hue: yellow X-Attribution: GM Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:03:37 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87hbpyf8vz.fsf@jidanni.org> (jidanni@jidanni.org's message of "Thu, 04 Feb 2010 02:53:52 +0800") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -4.2 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 493-done X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.2 (----) I see no prospect of something like this being implemented. Closed as wontfix. ------------=_1329872762-13772-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >From jidanni@jidanni.org Fri Jun 27 09:05:35 2008 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2007-08-08) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.7 required=4.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.2.3-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 27 Jun 2008 16:05:35 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id m5RG5TUT032412 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:05:31 -0700 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KCGS1-0004Yo-DU for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:29 -0400 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KCGRz-0004Y6-QK for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:29 -0400 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=37564 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KCGRz-0004Y1-Lh for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:27 -0400 Received: from lax-green-bigip-5.dreamhost.com ([208.113.200.5]:55782 helo=blingymail-a3.g.dreamhost.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KCGRz-0000Fp-FA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:05:27 -0400 Received: from jidanni1.jidanni.org (122-127-39-207.dynamic.hinet.net [122.127.39.207]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by blingymail-a3.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9FB414D65D for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:05:25 -0700 (PDT) To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: describe-variable vs. not necessarily soul origins From: jidanni@jidanni.org Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2008 00:03:01 +0800 Message-ID: <873amyhnm2.fsf@jidanni.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) describe-variable shows e.g., kill-emacs-hook is a variable defined in `C source code'. Its value is (w3m-arrived-shutdown (lambda nil (sleep-for 5)) #[nil "\300\301!\207" [server-mode -1] 2]) The problems are: Saying kill-emacs-hook is a variable defined in `C source code'. Its value is is misleading, as it looks like you are saying "this is the definition as found in the C source code" when in fact it has been modified since. So maybe say Its CURRENT value is Or if you keep track of whether it has been modified or not, than say two different things accordingly. P.S., saying #[nil "\300\301!\207" [server-mode -1] 2]) presents the user with unexplained octal gobbledygook. And maybe even add a list of all the files that altered the variable, so one can track down just what put that byte-compiled stuff there (that one doesn't see with emacs -Q). ------------=_1329872762-13772-1--