From unknown Fri Jun 20 07:13:13 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#48543 <48543@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#48543 <48543@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default Reply-To: bug#48543 <48543@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2025 14:13:13 +0000 retitle 48543 Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default reassign 48543 emacs submitter 48543 Cl=C3=A9ment Pit-Claudel severity 48543 wishlist thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu May 20 13:25:26 2021 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 May 2021 17:25:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35154 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ljmQI-0002DO-H6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 20 May 2021 13:25:26 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:36114) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ljmQH-0002DH-FS for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 20 May 2021 13:25:25 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46994) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ljmQH-0005D2-93 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 20 May 2021 13:25:25 -0400 Received: from mail-qt1-x82c.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::82c]:35420) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ljmQE-00071i-Dc for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 20 May 2021 13:25:25 -0400 Received: by mail-qt1-x82c.google.com with SMTP id k19so13372481qta.2 for ; Thu, 20 May 2021 10:25:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=tKS+9lBWXllntgMbm4l0FieXXv+S0dsDdYjnYSZRIjo=; b=ulHiFYm3UeRqCFu3JKSq3rDy7mUmsMVzRlKy55Z61DuFS9gdiJSmn5ufCzqmGED+jB thYVehwLpcckmaxTLib/EbnTkS+LHgR6SZ4JmdVsFWNBSNJR9+/TbnHJLOIwRrkuZXk+ 33Uf53vREhctgF8OQptot6bcZ0cI8Lg7uuO6h28vIfGG+P1exXinLSJ87RSnYcI76JV8 kOB8+9ZZhmPcJFYVfFL6KwXXFuJNkjF6ROK9YAWGzUy0dTq/8yomUCF0kZ/lOioYfo5W G708OFNEqoJEFFV3DELOQzcFc8TaGKJsrqJH6rWUL/8eYYaAuZYVuBSTf942CumPheIW oqRA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=tKS+9lBWXllntgMbm4l0FieXXv+S0dsDdYjnYSZRIjo=; b=ZXdBR7mk/Ax4vOOQH74gqT3JLL6Tmoi/XqRKFobMDt+ww+7nVSHxPBlGK0LXGkf7+G 8bYHHR9HdujjexW0qXo9kD2QU1E+z4DJgHxxwEHbWLYmLt/Kp0bfQk/LIrxvzGby+Lw3 0S7nvQj0Sm3O4jJK6Z+s9eOFuiya39Gvo0aiDJzNqzK62lZ4S6upPdSNo7UNKW0n+KJl 2ExbA9c1Y0qdH49hH1Yg20fFK+cRQRH7rrsIQqFNmvTD8Iz15HVsPTiM7Xn78eZeRak8 fa2w5gl+AU/e/AUjWLHfCnZdyVxuQ58yKbFhOwRd0qADcnl5/Y6ftQmZQ0FKj07PoNoj 3snA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533VMxmcyhWU7EkUsNEKTN3VD7oG7C6WV+FBPqj6rLTbH4/NktO5 ANCbJOqFSLl8RPvfiRwohOKwXAEpNmU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJztma9Da2GU744pst3bn0YCi7oDVZ9ePLuCBZotL9AVn/sVZnSuy14oBvCHBxrT1sLXJoNqhA== X-Received: by 2002:aed:30e6:: with SMTP id 93mr6319160qtf.41.1621531519536; Thu, 20 May 2021 10:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.11] (c-24-61-240-80.hsd1.ma.comcast.net. [24.61.240.80]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id s20sm2554456qke.2.2021.05.20.10.25.19 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 May 2021 10:25:19 -0700 (PDT) From: =?UTF-8?Q?Cl=c3=a9ment_Pit-Claudel?= To: bug-gnu-emacs Subject: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default Message-ID: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2021 13:25:18 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::82c; envelope-from=cpitclaudel@gmail.com; helo=mail-qt1-x82c.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Hi all, By default the eln cache is stored in .emacs.d/eln-cache. Would it make sense to store it in $XDG_CACHE_HOME/emacs/eln by default on platforms that obey the XDG spec? I came across this because my backup scripts already exclude $XDG_CACHE_HOME, but didn't exclude .emacs.d/eln-cache, so I found myself backing up hundreds of megabytes of ELN files. In a related Reddit discussion, https://www.reddit.com/r/emacs/comments/mltaie/gccemacs_how_to_permanently_change_where_elncache , Steve Purcell wrote: > Now that emacs honours xdg settings for finding its own config, might it make sense for the eln cache to move to the xdg cache directory? And Eli Zaretskii responded: > I don't think so, personally: the XDG spec says the XDG cache directory should hold "user-specific non-essential (cached) data files". The *.eln files don't fit that description: the user would like the files to persist. > > That said, feel free to submit a feature-request bug report about this, and let's see what others think about this. FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 08:09:07 2022 Received: (at 48543) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 12:09:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44828 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbAx-0007CA-18 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:09:07 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50944) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbAv-0007BS-Rj for 48543@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:09:06 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID :Date:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=Hf4oo6NEWjEPpKNHqDJBy+ZN30lp6hTz83UoIiHBQ0U=; b=k/IXh4E9sf4Xgcr/D/KuNV/Ijw SilvPDtd0sY2heImPQy8YY6Yz/zRm5ujJaukZwv8rhgVZ2IcctX5lE+CI5Mrz19EroC1638GIpDsK /+DQawZT8qOod2f1JZBjtZ8FGfaedBsPh6MFCvZShwX7WtQ4q+40XyINEo/Sxd3/mgw8=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbAm-0005nG-Qy; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:08:59 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: =?utf-8?Q?Cl=C3=A9ment?= Pit-Claudel Subject: Re: bug#48543: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default In-Reply-To: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> (=?utf-8?Q?=22Cl=C3=A9ment?= Pit-Claudel"'s message of "Thu, 20 May 2021 13:25:18 -0400") References: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> X-Now-Playing: Pink Industry's _Is This The End?_: "Is This The End" Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:08:56 +0200 Message-ID: <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Clément Pit-Claudel writes: > By default the eln cache is stored in .emacs.d/eln-cache. Would it > make sense to store it in $XDG_CACHE_HOME/emacs/eln by default on > platforms that obey the XDG spec? Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 48543 Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, Andrea Corallo X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Cl=C3=A9ment Pit-Claudel writes: > By default the eln cache is stored in .emacs.d/eln-cache. Would it > make sense to store it in $XDG_CACHE_HOME/emacs/eln by default on > platforms that obey the XDG spec? I think that makes sense. Perhaps Andrea has some comments; added to the CCs. > And Eli Zaretskii responded: > >> I don't think so, personally: the XDG spec says the XDG cache >> directory should hold "user-specific non-essential (cached) data >> files". The *.eln files don't fit that description: the user would >> like the files to persist. >> >> That said, feel free to submit a feature-request bug report about >> this, and let's see what others think about this. > > FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that > chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS > bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). Since the .eln files are cached data, it seems like the right place to put them. Of course the user would like all (non-stale) cached data to persist. --=20 (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 08:43:19 2022 Received: (at 48543) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 12:43:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44909 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbi3-0001rD-4a for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:43:19 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:53308) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbhq-0001q2-KP for 48543@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:43:18 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:51860) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbhl-0004m7-1B; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:43:01 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=RZiOoHbINj4cNRWSPQ96kEfyoAVkr35vB9tuaebXqEc=; b=HEvZxzc8/Fsy KV41/ZoYOfWJQjI2o+E5vc80BoGXfBK6gNFSPhP/mWwsVQQOgPxvdAtI1SlPCUWwletDuf/X7QJ60 aCK3UB7zFJPyEPRTpFQvTCVR4LA1r34sgFMvyvIrLXPuPnTDlAY0WEprIl8dJ92yNPKekNyM3+VI2 Hq9HVr1SsZgOAar/T7hS28oRtG/DuVoas70hQf5aav/VR9JY0l3s7GLEsHTswWpJRJXhks06WzP0n X69lncGXptKsGuNZFdEarAYGcdwS2qi9pA0nkQ4jFWNhxOiUtWlWjejR39jpUC8my681MT0M+IS8T Egj+hgosT6jNR9spzDx/Rw==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1540 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbhj-0002Nh-HO; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:42:59 -0400 Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 15:42:52 +0300 Message-Id: <834jzlw5df.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:08:56 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#48543: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default References: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 48543 Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, cpitclaudel@gmail.com, akrl@sdf.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, Andrea Corallo > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:08:56 +0200 > > >> I don't think so, personally: the XDG spec says the XDG cache > >> directory should hold "user-specific non-essential (cached) data > >> files". The *.eln files don't fit that description: the user would > >> like the files to persist. > >> > >> That said, feel free to submit a feature-request bug report about > >> this, and let's see what others think about this. > > > > FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that > > chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS > > bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). > > Since the .eln files are cached data, it seems like the right place to > put them. Of course the user would like all (non-stale) cached data to > persist. So we prefer to hear more complaints about Emacs being slow to start because the eln-cache was purged? Don't forget that the XDG directories can disappear without a warning. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 08:46:01 2022 Received: (at 48543) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 12:46:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44930 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbkf-0002wD-8c for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:46:01 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:51434) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbke-0002pk-6A for 48543@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:46:00 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=GcVB4H8EmwaLivIMnC/HV13vtm3mYd6HxXarUdz4KVs=; b=OSU0ICwa1cu3FmVdL4/2p4iY1/ 7MesZZs0LrHifzVJQ9blgRAldZgCLeuwwf9yeZHP32x5oKrlFFVn70G3As1xNEMXRdPOwY8015mOs yR3UGBbOJuqRRSo1EXKrzdKfxP2mx2R+ehdauLLkp8RUY7Y2wXopf5m/vBKy3eGnNxkE=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oBbkU-00067N-PF; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:45:53 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#48543: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default In-Reply-To: <834jzlw5df.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 13 Jul 2022 15:42:52 +0300") References: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> <834jzlw5df.fsf@gnu.org> X-Now-Playing: Black Midi's _The Black Midi Anthology Vol. 1: Tales of Suspense and Revenge_: "Out of Season by Ernest Hemingway" Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:45:49 +0200 Message-ID: <878roxp4ea.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that >> > chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS >> > bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). >> >> Since [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 48543 Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, cpitclaudel@gmail.com, akrl@sdf.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that >> > chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS >> > bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). >> >> Since the .eln files are cached data, it seems like the right place to >> put them. Of course the user would like all (non-stale) cached data to >> persist. > > So we prefer to hear more complaints about Emacs being slow to start > because the eln-cache was purged? Don't forget that the XDG > directories can disappear without a warning. This doesn't seem to worry the Chromium etc people, so I don't think it should worry us. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 09:09:26 2022 Received: (at 48543) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 13:09:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45013 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBc7K-0006yW-JA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 09:09:26 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f68.google.com ([209.85.216.68]:45706) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBc7J-0006yJ-1e for 48543@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 09:09:25 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f68.google.com with SMTP id q5-20020a17090a304500b001efcc885cc4so3525040pjl.4 for <48543@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 06:09:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=1cqmHVow1aSIqF6B/NVq1BS4DBEZMSqx+FSau5W2GMA=; b=jKCOnC8yXBm5A3kBtScSgyb4fpGld0LSKn/+RaXFCMxwn80o255W2zbV6v3vcwDF14 wpTVH9Y+JxS5OMvHHCYmkh2SUHw41w59Lm3xATb4zU5EYSlxsvlglx8GP39PEN2B+TEY XdVoCsgypKGqxDdv0WYljRsduMuepM2kOpfz37VFdbBBhYrjK1R7O8OQdFv1AGK6rZH+ bs6o5ZsVN2hkJV67PhmVjyVzsyvK9NxsxZXgeETVGYu1OZHtJv/VylJMSsHZM7wzaPk1 UYQvVYtFbF/LbZBlDfREucrZQaOnEMFC1PHzp8/Im+PYJyo+l5xfANxYrpWISP08fvPP 81ng== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=1cqmHVow1aSIqF6B/NVq1BS4DBEZMSqx+FSau5W2GMA=; b=WDKT5qOFlGFIrcb5+wbIa/oQSFyDNj/eS1ERnfur1bC6/fsiHd7RPYK1dRDyQa1Vnh aCu1WZaiUIuPk8Cyy63FozPLYH39l+B8Hfuh49KNHVxOHEbmgRYh3e3asvLZJzYv+vhG fNWz9Q+mQHrnK6PxsJTrsPu46fmqPqFShs3CFki/LG7CHV9/Ttpgq9xhvMZk+X84wyIy R5zaH4TAQE0R09gpkjoY9xND4BChp2sQdIA/1oHYwWEyHkpwu128GDl6K7yHheFA1lPS eWdFwtmUFkIoK4EmzELVzwOCCTDMmcLgFeKixMLgkBqNbnF5T1nVrVw5Ahbx9j/DGRpv 4SKA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora/L2amJWD5CRJIo01Pw6Uxc0/GN5odHbOYr0B58wztiGqy/2R+R pRWksFYsXrDux4viPUgl3GU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1ua+JoidQbAiVZKtB0KqJEFNvbOo7y0KEP1eO1NKDiEIcennfnU+Cw6M912wwAQG4uIWTD4UA== X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:fb8d:b0:1ef:8d22:35e with SMTP id cp13-20020a17090afb8d00b001ef8d22035emr9788001pjb.229.1657717759583; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 06:09:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([49.204.129.90]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id i5-20020a1709026ac500b0015f2b3bc97asm8790911plt.13.2022.07.13.06.09.18 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 13 Jul 2022 06:09:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Visuwesh To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#48543: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default In-Reply-To: <878roxp4ea.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:45:49 +0200") References: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> <834jzlw5df.fsf@gnu.org> <878roxp4ea.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 18:39:16 +0530 Message-ID: <87y1wxgnwj.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 48543 Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , cpitclaudel@gmail.com, akrl@sdf.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) [=E0=AE=AA=E0=AF=81=E0=AE=A4=E0=AE=A9=E0=AF=8D =E0=AE=9C=E0=AF=82=E0=AE=B2= =E0=AF=88 13, 2022] Lars Ingebrigtsen wrote: > Eli Zaretskii writes: > >>> > FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that >>> > chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS >>> > bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). >>>=20 >>> Since the .eln files are cached data, it seems like the right place to >>> put them. Of course the user would like all (non-stale) cached data to >>> persist. >> >> So we prefer to hear more complaints about Emacs being slow to start >> because the eln-cache was purged? Don't forget that the XDG >> directories can disappear without a warning. > > This doesn't seem to worry the Chromium etc people, so I don't think it > should worry us.=20=20 Why not use XDG_DATA_HOME in that case? It doesn't get cleared I think. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 09:40:54 2022 Received: (at 48543) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 13:40:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45129 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBcbl-0007qC-T4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 09:40:54 -0400 Received: from mx.sdf.org ([205.166.94.24]:62495) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBcbk-0007q1-9y for 48543@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 09:40:52 -0400 Received: from ma.sdf.org (ma.sdf.org [205.166.94.33]) by mx.sdf.org (8.15.2/8.14.5) with ESMTPS id 26DDeoGf025434 (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256 bits) verified NO); Wed, 13 Jul 2022 13:40:51 GMT From: Andrea Corallo To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#48543: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default References: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> <834jzlw5df.fsf@gnu.org> <878roxp4ea.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 13:40:51 +0000 In-Reply-To: <878roxp4ea.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Wed, 13 Jul 2022 14:45:49 +0200") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 48543 Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , cpitclaudel@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Eli Zaretskii writes: > >>> > FWIW, I had a quick look through my .cache folder, and it seems that >>> > chromium and Firefox both put compiled code in that folder (JS >>> > bytecode and compiled Webassembly files). >>> >>> Since the .eln files are cached data, it seems like the right place to >>> put them. Of course the user would like all (non-stale) cached data to >>> persist. >> >> So we prefer to hear more complaints about Emacs being slow to start >> because the eln-cache was purged? Don't forget that the XDG >> directories can disappear without a warning. > > This doesn't seem to worry the Chromium etc people, so I don't think it > should worry us. Hi Lars, thanks for adding me in Cc. Browser speed is tipically dominated by the internet/web server bandwidth and it's therfore very variable. Users will hardly notice if a page loads slower because the cache was removed and complain, this is indeed not the case for Emacs as program. Also given the XDG spec definition I'm not sure this move would be the right thing. Best Regards Andrea From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 13 10:02:00 2022 Received: (at 48543) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2022 14:02:00 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47382 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBcwC-0000Zq-Dk for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 10:02:00 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f53.google.com ([209.85.216.53]:43896) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oBcw9-0000Zb-Az for 48543@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 10:01:59 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f53.google.com with SMTP id o5-20020a17090a3d4500b001ef76490983so3788255pjf.2 for <48543@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 07:01:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=p0uCjGDVQtoBFvPGCjQe3/4uvfhlx2wVOm7g3QSXE94=; b=hW2GkK155iQ0Hk7qWy8ZVXpcaxAzHqF2R8RHsMmv4pcA8Md4nL7L3mwA6ibsyGKSaB RAcZHG1A0MMGV3+jOpLMD4K2nHt2nLYEDJvK/sh5Gkj/WqrEyZVopMLjKwDaGteApWnD lW5Fj8hlI92GspEQFcBqAx3nqycNGGlKetPNbmxXKLeUKbniZOssGY9aSTu9FVribyIY 2GqhDG6UppJbti6Z6zCqkAA6YqYud3sZqzT5jAAZlPdJqIahcGq/7HUTOJUeBYt5fepy oPpdSv4Akx9K6+LMGzaYJ/3HZ9qOGUe6htyWHMYxrgvcyjCyEXhrB/bpVpfzHyamLPNn ry4g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=p0uCjGDVQtoBFvPGCjQe3/4uvfhlx2wVOm7g3QSXE94=; b=NXVBHppef9dkm7uMIYLoYUrKFAwSpdGM4H4BB0jCdQbnW7xCQxuRKiER4Ckw1coaeM 7vJPTZGTQ9zmZKndHBc2oE12MiQHxUY4XTFuS0+o1JX4La+0+fc0yu7j8wt70mhAl8Ab FgvcRP3MbFh7EujL128brZ0m/cYiDYN3Jvubr7iMcETfgK6lpJGI35JKnIgVkkQbDmK3 T0rUQJX2Z+8S27+DUnySJrO+lTZzW0OSiHJIy6z+ZaLZ8hURT3LvAYHtXL121mIz/6lg IlueqFqJWBlDdukJHaUPlwATf12CrGk9ff/hqajr3HODBmva0LLxP30cnv1H75dC9LpI gQdw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora8FNGyy79V9U87MzT5ZRFrEVyuvHlXHgCv4mUsjC5MQ8YWv7MQ7 iOdxsiY67FZuAQnxOK04pg+ShG0rgNk6pjiV5kQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1uqOdeeKgnb1jVXh6oI/KijgErlvPk3D/rvucEzcanZyl6eBL95QIYOgWK0OSQPIlLsS+52ZOuATa4t80/yszw= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:7c0d:b0:16b:7dd2:626c with SMTP id x13-20020a1709027c0d00b0016b7dd2626cmr3243404pll.152.1657720911486; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 07:01:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 07:01:50 -0700 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <87y1wxgnwj.fsf@gmail.com> References: <80f227b7-ee3e-3c5f-9fec-8aca8b315951@gmail.com> <875yk1qko7.fsf@gnus.org> <834jzlw5df.fsf@gnu.org> <878roxp4ea.fsf@gnus.org> <87y1wxgnwj.fsf@gmail.com> X-Hashcash: 1:20:220713:48543@debbugs.gnu.org::XvjTBhF8tJV45YlF:0000000000000000000000000000000000000000Cgqr MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 07:01:50 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#48543: Feature request: put ELN cache in $XDG_CACHE_HOME by default To: Visuwesh , Lars Ingebrigtsen Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 48543 Cc: 48543@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , cpitclaudel@gmail.com, akrl@sdf.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Visuwesh writes: > Why not use XDG_DATA_HOME in that case? I realize that the XDG Base Directory Specification could be more clear on these details, but I believe that a study of the current practices as well as previous discussions on e.g. the XDG mailing list, in Debian, Arch and so on, would lead to the conclusion that this would be wrong. It is generally understood that XDG_DATA_HOME is roughly analogus to /usr/share and XDG_CACHE_HOME is roughly analogous to /var/cache -- one is volatile, the other one is not. For starters, please compare the contents of ~/.local/share with ~/.cache on your machine to see what other software puts where. Next, to understand how these issues are often approached, I invite you to study references such as: https://wiki.debian.org/XDGBaseDirectorySpecification https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/XDG_Base_Directory https://wiki.gnome.org/action/show/Initiatives/GnomeGoals/XDGConfigFolders https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=259356 There are more to find obviously, but that should be plenty to get the discussion started. > It doesn't get cleared I think. AFAIK, $XDG_CACHE_HOME also doesn't "get cleared" arbitrarily. There has to be some action on behalf of the user for that to happen.