From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 01:50:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.161940175730724 (code B ref -1); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 01:50:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Apr 2021 01:49:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44086 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1laqNB-0007zU-9E for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 21:49:17 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:43888) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1laqN9-0007zL-EV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 21:49:15 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52300) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1laqN8-0000ua-Nh for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 21:49:14 -0400 Received: from mail-pl1-f182.google.com ([209.85.214.182]:39779) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1laqN7-00007M-2u for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 21:49:14 -0400 Received: by mail-pl1-f182.google.com with SMTP id u7so26258819plr.6 for ; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:49:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=bdDH+uKWSgG7g+Rbn6E64DeAK6rwQANAyAX15mjvUpc=; b=KVaEtxEFlqy4OQeubNBnxjCD2Q5QdyCOLr/aCBPe0UhLbqXNUvvzSQjQzIGafQxGMv zuE7/io1OiBkmTtagi4c/5a0x28GfMVlmCcA1BJiKmpeeFivh1YVMCK4beMnTHOCKU32 qiwO4Wl1+4thMdeSDmE31dEpA9i49QCOd8YHVIS4NrvHgZVovetzoBv34Hoc95Mg5Tcq dkBdVs6HTw5MwYJOig7PP6G2i9MJIAeFSus54GzjxBi1dDA+/f1IiyBdvwLtU/Di5zLw npRpH4xWdGD+8wqaYbW3RHdAB9RxSYbuE2qBYqo3+8G1VWF54U8nZppLfQmDH8YvCrPt QsyA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532vPgrMYYL/2NCGhRDmO1PabjS/zLhxzPgDtI6HwkHq1jmL5hPN SRbJ72kovPbFhy4P7uZ8udakIFDoySOv5qmkqGdDQOaX X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJztmzK6ofGQ5rqZ6XfgBS/4cp4pTtGcbgy/MeNsFHXXPVb++m/9TVmkzw7gfuADJvML+vHME2ABaFK+4FvW2r0= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:7788:b029:e9:11:5334 with SMTP id o8-20020a1709027788b02900e900115334mr15894185pll.70.1619401751664; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:49:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 20:49:11 -0500 From: Stefan Kangas MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2021 20:49:11 -0500 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=209.85.214.182; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-pl1-f182.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -13 X-Spam_score: -1.4 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.8 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.8 (-) Severity: wishlist On this page: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/download.html We have better instructions for non-free systems than for free ones. They include the exact commands you would need to run to install Emacs. I suggest we add instructions for free operating systems as well. I don't think this would mean a lot of work, as the commands rarely change. We could decide to only include instructions for the top 5 most popular distributions, scientifically decided by searching online for "most popular gnu linux distributions" or something: - Debian/Ubuntu - Fedora/RedHat - Arch Linux - OpenSUSE - GNU Guix And we could document in a comment to that file that our policy is to be very restrictive with adding more (to avoid zealous fan of random small distribution to ask it to be added). Note that just the first entry in that list would probably already cover a significant proportion of our GNU/Linux users. From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Richard Stallman Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 04:43:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Kangas Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161941214814096 (code B ref 48023); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 04:43:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Apr 2021 04:42:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44156 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lat4l-0003fI-Te for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 00:42:28 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:37358) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lat4k-0003f2-7z for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 00:42:26 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:48365) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lat4f-0001ni-0r; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 00:42:21 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lat4a-0007sO-1g; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 00:42:16 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Sun, 25 Apr 2021 20:49:11 -0500) References: Message-Id: Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 00:42:16 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > I suggest we add instructions for free operating systems as well. In principle, I agree. And if we handle only five distros of GNU/Linux, it won't be too much work. But there is a wrinkle to deal with. > - Debian/Ubuntu > - Fedora/RedHat > - Arch Linux > - OpenSUSE > - GNU Guix Of all those, the only one that is a free distro is GNU Guix. The others are nonfree distros that we don't want to promote. We could describe Trisquel, and say that the nonfree distros Debian and Ubuntu are similar. We could describe Parabola and Hyperbola, and say that Arch GNU/Linux is similar. Are there free distros (see https://gnu.org/distros/) that are lile Fedora and OpenSUSE? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 11:56:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Kangas Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.1619438108771 (code B ref 48023); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 11:56:01 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Apr 2021 11:55:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44798 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lazpU-0000CN-Ex for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 07:55:08 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33158) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lazpR-0000Bn-Nx for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 07:55:07 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:53937) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lazpM-0002aM-8e; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 07:55:00 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:3027 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lazpL-00020K-PZ; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 07:55:00 -0400 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 14:54:44 +0300 Message-Id: <83pmyhjm63.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Sun, 25 Apr 2021 20:49:11 -0500) References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2021 20:49:11 -0500 > > I suggest we add instructions for free operating systems as well. I don't object, assuming that the added text will not need significant maintenance, like changes with each version, tracking too frequent changes in the installation tools and procedures of these distros, etc. IOW, if it is possible to write the text in a generic way that will be sufficiently future-proof. From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Dmitry Gutov Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 19:02:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: rms@gnu.org, Stefan Kangas Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161946371820520 (code B ref 48023); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 19:02:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Apr 2021 19:01:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47174 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lb6UY-0005Ku-6x for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 15:01:58 -0400 Received: from mail-wm1-f52.google.com ([209.85.128.52]:50910) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lb6UV-0005Ke-5z for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 15:01:57 -0400 Received: by mail-wm1-f52.google.com with SMTP id n84so3313366wma.0 for <48023@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=m9JTFOio9eO9yIY/49j8/Zo3H3azXnYvgd+MSXbDEV8=; b=aZmnkBMTAgZP4i76xoVfxLjfsnEWgoaUtsRotHVgkaUrSbWNeB+2ORa4WvTopEN9MI Fnk1ZaJSQ08PGq6O61nwIfe+4C8y7pF5phxyK9PU3dq83/Y48tOI38ZsFZZeZsGfWkg1 90NYXsLmPnoEbTDO8tFYW2ho6Htf989wXCWceuounbyPPDNIuAKMa+yzd2XS3pypJTdY CzJVjKZOfz+Ygc3/v6mP+x4VJ1qasbk9HNWeErNZDTKtwzJ6cAf3VFT4eBP3gzEMZYuW Zfhza4WWUXDRebEYhRGOUsKDV0NH/IFPTYnDbp/vzkNKo0BBVJCbalruwjE9UDn/bFsF 421g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=m9JTFOio9eO9yIY/49j8/Zo3H3azXnYvgd+MSXbDEV8=; b=UwUZb7/n9KHzcyAEN7w5SWNGXAJooPJKYSHmzW7RygDZiebG6GBrt/6WzOdh7dsNVT yQPh+aJg9IlLiKpr6EbYGcNR0h6kfwWg14JUvBAQkOsdaBF/QOJDAeZO6NlLftdEsctb mD78M8rSLF4GKTUEEqmvNZQXHiHsBxjlly3KduxFp4A5PXv133AAf4ETPLexhiuFUoN3 WB7l7Mb+h5lc2byDEGKYFfVC/mRWSfZD/oWFtWA6R4GICloteoE/oGCeztIAQPIYbsUF pkNOp2fFBv4w2s/p6Ri6OwjlJ1YRMnEGr2AP3MzwlOgeunUBnwR+zU6YbhvuqhArswCS gjrA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530wlu6eFSRRondqvAVhe6tkvAlDPhfL5YJA/x5cw/aLbQxcv8cq IXV0cl08Uuk685aKB11UzqY4rzRjlpE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJysw1m/8ds4+UR3HdX1RvrMnhZSpMWBC/0uvjnnjYlZydgY3GB017Rl9gLbzO1t7yhHaQUQ+Q== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:9a83:: with SMTP id c125mr478616wme.62.1619463709318; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.0.6] ([46.251.119.176]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id v20sm1936669wmj.15.2021.04.26.12.01.47 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:48 -0700 (PDT) References: From: Dmitry Gutov Message-ID: Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 22:01:46 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.7.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) On 26.04.2021 07:42, Richard Stallman wrote: > Of all those, the only one that is a free distro is GNU Guix. > The others are nonfree distros that we don't want to promote. Are they even remotely as "nonfree" as Windows or MacOS, which have dedicated installation instructions on that web page? Are you sure that free software movement is well served by painting Debian, Arch and Fedora in the same light, using the same turn of phrase? From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 20:11:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Kangas Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161946782919191 (code B ref 48023); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 20:11:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Apr 2021 20:10:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47278 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lb7Yo-0004zR-SH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 16:10:29 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:49290) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lb7Yk-0004z8-3z for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 16:10:25 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=YhFlo3r7Zik84mAJL51VDfaouhi4M2Z57xniUUq1mOs=; b=NKJtBFm4UQGs0GtNTNfU6kvr2d aTenpIAEZS6IUewOd2iu8dqzQaDN1g/FAgI2jQdL81m1u4dk1GCdYcQOlvMvjj9JroYu08uwlQuk+ U/J2hADleasP3DVzwi0tLZpmWIQMW0VSkLW9mXo29joPmTLOXDgUOyCn3ZEfnD7p8uFc=; Received: from cm-84.212.220.105.getinternet.no ([84.212.220.105] helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lb7Ya-0002Iu-4e; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 22:10:16 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen References: Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwAgMAAAAqbBEUAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAACVBMVEWJcVjRxrH///8j ErQWAAAAAWJLR0QCZgt8ZAAAAAd0SU1FB+UEGhQEBDhXOxsAAAEuSURBVCjPjVFBigQxCFSI9wzE /9gwuRvQ/39lqjILy95Wmu6uRMuyFPl3hGSuJTLE48RpRHaJ37/Dp8Tw++6uDsdN6Yk+vsxSnAnn dFqn6Lfa23OKP/vVN1KYxmCCiKVVS4sV2F6h2mjdD/sEDqdrH0OfUMEbYgBWKkX1WKDzsq7HtjTl oHUpuH/AZdJF6rRs7zy8mWjq+05UIqBEQRlJtXG8u3ZMKKg9MXoxB9pEFlIGPmJrB8YoC6UHXzD1 uYBW1bT8BcsDHGtfF1PsDYevBzu0Cb6WhFGO8nwmQFxgw2gZtoOLp11sE1CYcRsogWMYk4JhrwW3 5DIqscnIIwqj+j3g2wk0JHeIwoqp7MlCqsCRN4ZT1unr3GVpBGzA3FSgkDqHbRoqk8tDW9r2Jz4s gWkbci4nhwAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAyMS0wNC0yNlQyMDowNDowNCswMDowMGm7tjcA AAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjEtMDQtMjZUMjA6MDQ6MDQrMDA6MDAY5g6LAAAAAElFTkSu QmCC X-Now-Playing: Tom Tom Club's _Tom Tom Club_: "Booming and Zooming" Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 22:10:11 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Sun, 25 Apr 2021 20:49:11 -0500") Message-ID: <87a6pkajto.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Stefan Kangas writes: > I suggest we add instructions for free operating systems as well. I think that's a good idea. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Stefan Kangas writes: > I suggest we add instructions for free operating systems as well. I think that's a good idea. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 22:31:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: rms@gnu.org Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161947625432255 (code B ref 48023); Mon, 26 Apr 2021 22:31:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Apr 2021 22:30:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47446 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lb9kk-0008OB-3h for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 18:30:54 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f48.google.com ([209.85.216.48]:40881) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lb9ki-0008Ny-B1 for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 18:30:53 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f48.google.com with SMTP id g1-20020a17090adac1b0290150d07f9402so6017206pjx.5 for <48023@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 15:30:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Y2l6DRPcbLHBGpNPMl/PVtYRSOFmb7DXF01dywt4Vw4=; b=YrLFWn+DsgGuhUPqtePAks1thWiRJtyznUDKOyCtbP5EdbO772zKjF5OJV6Eio+ViG Dcr0S054p0zCq1C3J9Zetf6tjmZ0qpTA02oGhf9noXby9MDI9sQfet2Xd1TU1q/N/djN XA1gDcCyQdnZ+qAxCEBCh6ZUGEXmVzYNoHeqiit3EBgBTV0XrsBF9XTKVZrL3F3VSI4K n27LHY0xWCzSoCYzEV+eXtOAEP7YV2eSEGenLok5qCmnLOYjA2no4ok56GKIKXWsGRxj ST5L1oacW8oULLycgCI88KWTx5XTImz1W27rSB9+BCQsk/n667vWAx38978criUTHz7h YwAw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532qklCC1KAF1CnVL4G04dW+S+HFaP9N3E0ZKNMmgckI278SG+Ky /QfAh8DOWyVFzvpPULsRJhTXgBfrwEFJxFu0denkl0bk X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyruQ8v7lOKGtYsBdDIBVddWWiSnm8iYDsGfBhUsFS9wS/fmBxozcA1AISZacHa/6p/hhynvHgKhAgNp+PKS9w= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:19ca:: with SMTP id nm10mr24153001pjb.175.1619476246474; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 15:30:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 17:30:46 -0500 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 17:30:46 -0500 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Richard Stallman writes: > But there is a wrinkle to deal with. > > > - Debian/Ubuntu > > - Fedora/RedHat > > - Arch Linux > > - OpenSUSE > > - GNU Guix > > Of all those, the only one that is a free distro is GNU Guix. > The others are nonfree distros that we don't want to promote. I don't understand this given that we are fine with mentioning Windows and macOS. > We could describe Trisquel, and say that the nonfree distros Debian > and Ubuntu are similar. > > We could describe Parabola and Hyperbola, and say that Arch GNU/Linux > is similar. > > Are there free distros (see https://gnu.org/distros/) that are > lile Fedora and OpenSUSE? Is the below acceptable? In comparison to the old page, it actively discourages using distributions that GNU and/or FSF thinks are "non-free". IOW, if I agreed with your position, I think I would be more happy with it. But of course you would know better than me. (The old page simply dodged the issue, which seems less than ideal.) --- download.html.~1.23.~ 2021-04-26 03:34:59.821526101 +0200 +++ download.html 2021-04-26 23:14:32.913860136 +0200 @@ -66,6 +66,74 @@ way to install Emacs unless you always want to use the latest release.

+

Some GNU/Linux distributions recommend nonfree + software. We cannot recommend their use, see + + Why We Don't Endorse Other Systems.

+ + + + + +

Debian and derivatives

+ +

+ We do not recommend using this GNU/Linux distribution and some of + its derivatives (including Ubuntu and Linux Mint), as they + + include nonfree components and firmware. + + We recommend using the Debian-based and fully free + Trisquel GNU/Linux + instead. +

+ + 
sudo apt-get install emacs
+ + +

Arch

+ +

+ We do not recommend using this GNU/Linux distribution, as it + + includes nonfree components and firmware. + + We recommend using the Arch-based and fully free + Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre or + Parabola GNU/Linux-libre + instead. +

+ + 
sudo pacman -S emacs
+ + +

Fedora and Redhat

+ +

We do not recommend using these GNU/Linux distributions, as they + + include nonfree components and firmware.

+ + 
sudo dnf install emacs
+ + +

OpenSUSE

+ +

We do not recommend using this GNU/Linux distribution, as it + + includes nonfree components and firmware.

+ + 
sudo zypper install emacs
+ + +

GNU Guix

+ + 
guix package -i emacs
+ + +

Building from source

+

You can download GNU Emacs releases from a nearby GNU mirror; or if automatic redirection does not work see the list of From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Richard Stallman Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 03:51:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Kangas Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161949544113918 (code B ref 48023); Tue, 27 Apr 2021 03:51:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Apr 2021 03:50:41 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47693 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbEkD-0003cQ-1N for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:41 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40326) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbEkA-0003cD-MU for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:39 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:43244) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lbEk5-0003h5-FA; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:33 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lbEk3-0006ei-7w; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:31 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Mon, 26 Apr 2021 17:30:46 -0500) References: Message-Id: Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:31 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > Of all those, the only one that is a free distro is GNU Guix. > > The others are nonfree distros that we don't want to promote. > I don't understand this Promoting the free distros of GNU/Linux, in contrast to the others, is an important goal. There is more than one way to achieve this goal, but we need to pay attention to it when we decide what to do. given that we are fine with mentioning Windows > and macOS. These two issues are partially similar, and partially different. I can't be sure what you're thinking, but it looks like you've assumed that the similarity determines the decision. I speculate that your conceptual model is that we order all the systems from best to worst, draw some line in that ordering, and everything above that line is ok to promote. That is not what we do; it wouldn't give the best results. The node References in the GNU Coding Standards explains how we look at issues like this. Mentioning Windows and MacOS can't do harm because everyone who would read our pages already knows about them. Talking about Arch might actually call readers' attention to its existence. I don't think you intended that diff as a serious suggestion, but looking at it I see a serious conclusion to be learned from it. Namely, _it isn't useful to mention the names of distros_ for which 'apt' is the command to use. it isn't useful to mention the names of distros for which 'pacman' is the command to use. And so on. There are too many distro names, and mentioning them is best avoided. It is more practical to list _only the commands_ that might be the way to install Emacs. Something like this: Here are some of the commands that various GNU/Linux distros use to install a package named 'emacs'. 

guix package -i emacs
sudo apt-get install emacs
sudo pacman -S emacs
sudo dnf install emacs
sudo zypper install emacs
On some systems, the package name must include the Emacs version number, such as 'emacs-27.1', instead of 'emacs'. However, there is more complexity than this. For instance, on Trisquel you might need to do 'apt-get update' first. Maybe on Debian too. Also, what about using 'apt' instead? All in all, it may be better to say "see the package installation instructions for your distro" rather than duplicating that information from various distros here. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 13:34:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: rms@gnu.org Cc: stefan@marxist.se, 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161953038823983 (code B ref 48023); Tue, 27 Apr 2021 13:34:01 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Apr 2021 13:33:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48312 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbNpl-0006ED-Nc for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:33:08 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:46506) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbNph-0006Dy-PF for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:32:59 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:50213) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lbNpb-0004At-L0; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:32:52 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:2214 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lbNpR-0000qu-7T; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:32:41 -0400 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 16:32:27 +0300 Message-Id: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: (message from Richard Stallman on Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:31 -0400) References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Richard Stallman > Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:31 -0400 > Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org > > Here are some of the commands that various GNU/Linux distros > use to install a package named 'emacs'. > > 
guix package -i emacs
> > 
sudo apt-get install emacs
> > 
sudo pacman -S emacs
> > 
sudo dnf install emacs
> > 
sudo zypper install emacs
> > On some systems, the package name must include the Emacs > version number, such as 'emacs-27.1', instead of 'emacs'. This LGTM, thanks. Stefan, do you like it? > All in all, it may be better to say "see the package installation > instructions for your distro" rather than duplicating that information > from various distros here. If indeed we cannot says something like the above without confusing people, maybe this latter way is the best we can do. But I'd prefer to use the former, if we can reliably say something like that. From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 13:53:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii , rms@gnu.org Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161953152626076 (code B ref 48023); Tue, 27 Apr 2021 13:53:01 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Apr 2021 13:52:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48347 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbO8E-0006mV-HE for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:52:06 -0400 Received: from mail-pl1-f171.google.com ([209.85.214.171]:44914) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbO8C-0006ly-ER for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:52:05 -0400 Received: by mail-pl1-f171.google.com with SMTP id y1so15245434plg.11 for <48023@debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 06:52:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=pntnt49GW/KMH0VyykcFCPk6kepHk73OwU1CZSwquB0=; b=R01S4aDJEf6sua7r+IVshQbiqcpNnCNlfZIGZWypEJvwQcb63E7VDrYp/k62UoMfr/ NCgqTic8SrsiyIyv1nrimh7VaYshHAbyxKmjP7ALfMpY4baNVQPlcs4ixajgYcaEZoWp 1ZOgQAssvhki8mn7mCSv8e/Hli5GIfh3tKmiaeqtoEkOyvzuCnhp4Qr9nbBjgRVs1fgw c79vAHWVfYg1ZPPdx1U8QZUEa45mgaEbEtdTqg349SzlogoZqtbJeNp20xFn52Z+MHuY bD4k9UQfM0QL4SKOvOxnmQKXaVhpVqTDTcanEkjVNXSlclCJBw9AJ6qG6o6C5Ewc4DzK 8h3g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5306SxlnWaz24a0jI8QSjkMDO1Do4oVjrJCAclBaQhb4AkLpEw88 be3t9oEX25JbA2feYHeQUG8WBi/cYRw2xbFIXfU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwy2YZZJXKrEFuKvoGtzGgWonJGSRUPMxnkRC/NwllOvN1RfltkRRpS0qmkz1DLSbgKaEctVM2ZTt1c0odjLRY= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:19ca:: with SMTP id nm10mr27721795pjb.175.1619531518509; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 06:51:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 08:51:57 -0500 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 08:51:57 -0500 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Richard Stallman >> Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:50:31 -0400 >> Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org >> >> Here are some of the commands that various GNU/Linux distros >> use to install a package named 'emacs'. >> >> 
guix package -i emacs
>> >> 
sudo apt-get install emacs
>> >> 
sudo pacman -S emacs
>> >> 
sudo dnf install emacs
>> >> 
sudo zypper install emacs
>> >> On some systems, the package name must include the Emacs >> version number, such as 'emacs-27.1', instead of 'emacs'. > > This LGTM, thanks. > > Stefan, do you like it? Yes, it works for me. How about extending it slightly, along these lines? If your GNU/Linux distribution includes a graphical package manager, this is often the easiest way to install Emacs. Please refer to the documentation for your distribution for full instructions on how to install a package. You might prefer installing from the command-line. Here are some of the commands that various GNU/Linux distributions use to install a package named 'emacs'. [commands here] >> All in all, it may be better to say "see the package installation >> instructions for your distro" rather than duplicating that information >> from various distros here. > > If indeed we cannot says something like the above without confusing > people, maybe this latter way is the best we can do. But I'd prefer > to use the former, if we can reliably say something like that. I tend to agree with Eli. From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Richard Stallman Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:38:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Eli Zaretskii Cc: stefan@marxist.se, 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.16195810222621 (code B ref 48023); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:38:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Apr 2021 03:37:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51433 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb0Y-0000gB-GX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:37:02 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45076) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb0W-0000fe-8Q for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:37:01 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36923) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb0Q-0003eI-Ol; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:36:54 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb0O-0001qB-Fw; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:36:53 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman In-Reply-To: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Tue, 27 Apr 2021 16:32:27 +0300) References: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:36:52 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > Here are some of the commands that various GNU/Linux distros > > use to install a package named 'emacs'. > > > > 
guix package -i emacs
> > > > All in all, it may be better to say "see the package installation > > instructions for your distro" rather than duplicating that information > > from various distros here. I think the two fit together. We can list those commands, that work for lots of distros, and say "otherwise, see distro instructions" as a fallback. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Richard Stallman Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:40:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Kangas Cc: eliz@gnu.org, 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.16195811662857 (code B ref 48023); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:40:01 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Apr 2021 03:39:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51437 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb2r-0000k1-Tj for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:39:26 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45512) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb2q-0000jl-3q for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:39:25 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36971) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb2k-0005Xo-R3; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:39:18 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1lbb2j-00027d-OF; Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:39:17 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Tue, 27 Apr 2021 08:51:57 -0500) References: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 23:39:17 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > Yes, it works for me. How about extending it slightly, along these > lines? > If your GNU/Linux distribution includes a graphical package manager, > this is often the easiest way to install Emacs. Please refer to the > documentation for your distribution for full instructions on how to > install a package. > You might prefer installing from the command-line. Here are some of > the commands that various GNU/Linux distributions use to install a > package named 'emacs'. > [commands here] LGTM. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:09:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: rms@gnu.org Cc: eliz@gnu.org, 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161960450818697 (code B ref 48023); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:09:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Apr 2021 10:08:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51784 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbh7M-0004rP-3T for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 06:08:28 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f51.google.com ([209.85.216.51]:45616) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbh7J-0004r5-Ox for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 06:08:27 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f51.google.com with SMTP id gc22-20020a17090b3116b02901558435aec1so5134507pjb.4 for <48023@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:08:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=YJJtYP2vqTHYHOrCfVVz6i5XOC9PVJrlZqVE95e47+Y=; b=s/WtHUdvQafUdT0FK1lEyT3GDXKozvIvLe+VjLon2lHhdD8ToJ/uhVT9Cs5sr9qVSl PVQPocaWN860ZRSJHDkvzYFlaDp5eLw1DDWX3zPMVU1DeFGEVVyAF3oyMDSKESU4yFe4 94dR14Xcn5t/lhvfv6UY6cP1vGi9DjeaffwBzgGCAqADg21yr76UdmM+hrt8I8VY7Hx7 B4bqUz3Yo/HfHxXABwBH6gecWXKLAF8L2aquzlAJb2t4fM5iLnHZlSnAHabaFr9+yVxg x1naAcCrrwp3/eLCHDrUBStYiixMjzzBM4EG5zqzF8Xz2fyNhnCaawxrKfPVrLM5N0Ne MS8A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532TIQFui0amVk6ju5Vw3XutrSeSanXT0XikJiXa6FCcs8IPvYBI 2nO0kjG+TR8pQ9Vh+e9nnoLTKMQADZSpqQ6ehxY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwuygkH8OwbHuR8a5B2JkqeKhZw5ET/TXGhuwGwTYRSP73w6BvwjELGXX6mstdMtpAixO3FfLDRTQ8pelW4MlU= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:e788:b029:eb:2c5b:bce8 with SMTP id cp8-20020a170902e788b02900eb2c5bbce8mr29383763plb.41.1619604499810; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:08:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:08:19 -0700 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: References: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:08:19 -0700 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) tags 48023 + fixed close 48023 thanks Richard Stallman writes: > > If your GNU/Linux distribution includes a graphical package manager, > > this is often the easiest way to install Emacs. Please refer to the > > documentation for your distribution for full instructions on how to > > install a package. > > > You might prefer installing from the command-line. Here are some of > > the commands that various GNU/Linux distributions use to install a > > package named 'emacs'. > > > [commands here] > > LGTM. Thanks, I've installed the below change. --- download.html.~1.23.~ 2021-04-28 11:47:24.726860127 +0200 +++ download.html 2021-04-28 11:52:37.696388947 +0200 @@ -46,7 +46,7 @@ @@ -59,13 +59,6 @@ FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, MacOS, MS Windows and Solaris.

-

GNU/Linux

- -

Most GNU/Linux distributions provide GNU - Emacs in their repositories, which is the recommended - way to install Emacs unless you always want to use the - latest release.

-

You can download GNU Emacs releases from a nearby GNU mirror; or if automatic redirection does not work see the list of @@ -73,11 +66,45 @@ the main GNU ftp server.

-

GNU Emacs source code and development is hosted on savannah.gnu.org.

+

GNU/Linux

+ +

Most GNU/Linux distributions provide GNU + Emacs in their repositories, which is the recommended + way to install Emacs unless you always want to use the + latest release.

+ +

If your GNU/Linux distribution includes a graphical package manager, + this is often the easiest way to install Emacs. Please refer to the + documentation for your distribution for full instructions on how to + install a package. +

+ +

You might prefer installing from the command-line. Here + are some of the commands that various GNU/Linux + distributions use to install a package named 'emacs'. +

+ + + + 
guix package -i emacs
+ + 
sudo apt-get install emacs
+ + 
sudo pacman -S emacs
+ + 
sudo dnf install emacs
+ + 
sudo zypper install emacs
+ +

On some systems, the package name must include the Emacs + version number, such as 'emacs-27.1', instead of 'emacs'. +

+

BSDs

The BSDs provide GNU Emacs in their repositories, which is the recommended From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Dmitry Gutov Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:42:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: fixed To: Stefan Kangas , rms@gnu.org Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161960650030591 (code B ref 48023); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:42:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Apr 2021 10:41:40 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51813 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbhdT-0007xL-WC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 06:41:40 -0400 Received: from mail-wm1-f52.google.com ([209.85.128.52]:55814) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbhdR-0007x6-29 for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 06:41:38 -0400 Received: by mail-wm1-f52.google.com with SMTP id n127so21685030wmb.5 for <48023@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:41:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=rAyERzA+CkqLu4KX1fIsB0bc5hp+4rUdts4L+m1VISM=; b=HfVs6gMLtc6FqrePcKAarPjw9WqNp9OEucPeY8zT7BgqGr9sltOCf5kP5lW98DV6vz CJX1tfzB2j1Q7ks/fDzYVss95qJUgqmnmOTfj98BHqsUNjJXN6HsZaemrzzEOlhvqIqn 5vi7c2H9bW/elLoo6a1cX4LmvKCKoH3WA/sKyP1SUPIdUat+27Zsoq8zOWnpjHGt5hwx td7Uq/CEMInlup1b3tQYV8n/q+GcZCjkARGCEZ3gEDEQqwrT6M4q/kk0gGmJWpaEJYBe LFaQzHbOho5LpdE5D0Nft+FZQm6F3Vm77rbt6l79/DZ9izQEHuFtRhTN7MyTf+y9QEmY s8aQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=rAyERzA+CkqLu4KX1fIsB0bc5hp+4rUdts4L+m1VISM=; b=OojC8UjGz1OSWR5HdIPj0dWBeCqTa4js0dpyro5herVXgfZyeohFGb3j836mKXSQS5 07KgK8r+Q2YEltpEe7/r5yhkq9Q0k16IXwoD7nDsVrGss+cpOUTNkP3FENE9X9K6XCDa xaiVajKwKWH48oRDjlPIhfAn1Mb2ZpFlR2D2u3Mlz6gmICSoSvsh8k8BMFzf/DuYk6mk N7GxE1GUX3Wt229A32e1DaFy/qWlwUeKzotrF0V214Hp43FRcoG4f/pg1/JJVKgRKnLN hUIx9kiXiTjXbWu8eJytBT3wJ+SnZW6L+fenXKjNYMj9J69LRD6IVJXDL5OCHMf5O94H yZWw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531noBjiM4cY7oDqdEargwmv0PAKURIedZ0+B4y3CN1nljp38+Z3 0mxKn+eXJ8OMKV03gTG2hOJml/nduSY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyK0j6fOLT0C57jsMs9t06ARboSzicNGNy6sJi5Mv4ynf/F0aPvgdn478aRvdqmyXLt9NBvSA== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:c911:: with SMTP id f17mr30902860wmb.45.1619606491057; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:41:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.0.6] ([46.251.119.176]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id t10sm2937107wmf.16.2021.04.28.03.41.29 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 03:41:30 -0700 (PDT) References: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> From: Dmitry Gutov Message-ID: Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 13:41:28 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.7.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) On 28.04.2021 13:08, Stefan Kangas wrote: > +

On some systems, the package name must include the Emacs > + version number, such as 'emacs-27.1', instead > of 'emacs'. > +

You might want to replace these single quotes with .... Looking good otherwise. From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:19:37 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#48023: download.html has better instructions for non-free systems Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 13:15:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48023 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: fixed To: Dmitry Gutov , rms@gnu.org Cc: 48023@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 48023-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48023.161961566528907 (code B ref 48023); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 13:15:02 +0000 Received: (at 48023) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Apr 2021 13:14:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52045 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbk1J-0007WB-3j for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 09:14:25 -0400 Received: from mail-pj1-f53.google.com ([209.85.216.53]:38676) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lbk1H-0007Vz-KM for 48023@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 09:14:23 -0400 Received: by mail-pj1-f53.google.com with SMTP id f11-20020a17090a638bb02901524d3a3d48so9012112pjj.3 for <48023@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 06:14:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=6AoVHssIk3jks8cA2qZu8BWxwZ2I9Xprr1dpIq6zu3w=; b=D9vvTPS2+yU7/1axRlZg0kVf7+LCOAS07NhIpy1lKtNYp3rEIQvIX6SRCREexollGS rhf5tNNELFoizPBvldMcFX620CzSlbuV+Ubwz0cG7Rh1SKDreYXAscQW6XRtBUub6zcB iC1LmqsbYwbfQ7A+XqCH7PPw+oZ9c8/2B2Yz1P73MIMc2gVBleeEEryn/ts40tUAFbm7 qqpPP+wzHsDxlIYr7ybkLW666laWNDnwxiOhOoO9udGq8UwDPFzuqlan8l+XjLsv/Mq8 r3yGvXL4NfJnf2CoeKciilalYr9FJiz6oRIE9XasdkPuUbza7Won1/i805XmQrJ8o3Qq mlRQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532ydgFg5ck/dRaqJO11sN3tgmmi0gnIXxOHKGZGLbRX4bcB9NLy 2np/Uc9YqaRa4vLXZXzuC2mPvSwjw5nCASUgbWk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxDe/S/lNeXtOGlOgOBaFKubhKyXTVXCNumgEp7au97EjMpGLVx4Rj9nL8SRG5UvAaRURwXNjrxw5Ti+TttWkE= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:e788:b029:eb:2c5b:bce8 with SMTP id cp8-20020a170902e788b02900eb2c5bbce8mr30115344plb.41.1619615657911; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 06:14:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 08:14:17 -0500 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: References: <83im47j1jo.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 08:14:17 -0500 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Dmitry Gutov writes: > On 28.04.2021 13:08, Stefan Kangas wrote: >> +

On some systems, the package name must include the Emacs >> + version number, such as 'emacs-27.1', instead >> of 'emacs'. >> +

> > You might want to replace these single quotes with .... Well spotted, fixed. > Looking good otherwise. Thanks for checking.