From unknown Fri Aug 15 03:38:37 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#46084 <46084@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#46084 <46084@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front Reply-To: bug#46084 <46084@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2025 10:38:37 +0000 retitle 46084 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front reassign 46084 emacs submitter 46084 Drew Adams severity 46084 wishlist thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jan 24 13:56:15 2021 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Jan 2021 18:56:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37265 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l3kYZ-0001qL-Dg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 24 Jan 2021 13:56:15 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:44166) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l3kYX-0001qD-9y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; 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envelope-from=drew.adams@oracle.com; helo=userp2130.oracle.com X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Somewhere up front in the Elisp manual, please consider providing a link to the eintr manual. One possible place is in node (elisp) `Introduction'. Let people who arrive at the Elisp manual know that there is an intro to Elisp. In GNU Emacs 26.3 (build 1, x86_64-w64-mingw32) of 2019-08-29 Repository revision: 96dd0196c28bc36779584e47fffcca433c9309cd Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 10.0.18362 Configured using: `configure --without-dbus --host=3Dx86_64-w64-mingw32 --without-compress-install 'CFLAGS=3D-O2 -static -g3'' From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 26 21:49:26 2021 Received: (at 46084) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Jan 2021 02:49:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43175 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l4ata-00078Y-2R for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:49:26 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:35126) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l4atY-00078H-Bv for 46084@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:49:24 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=3zQHL4vLAZWQt+g2Dydr7IOw181BZQCDCiaWPgUn1bI=; b=jSQJyxJ18RAfKCZRjp+BZEZZXB SOcW47cHkdcFU/9eCydp6yASwxpGgucxHcEJ4HR7p+ICu2JIUNLqbqJdzfSn8MtrOWqRIcs48X+4U RuGQx8dRl4ZLla+yKPOkGFJvuo59x+bTezGd9Rn6QZKsapoZih2hDIxK9EFnN80KB8yE=; Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1l4atQ-0008EZ-1y; Wed, 27 Jan 2021 03:49:18 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Drew Adams Subject: Re: bug#46084: 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front References: X-Now-Playing: Ludus's _To The Outside Of Everything: A Story of UK Post Punk 1977-1981 (3)_: "Lullaby Cheat" Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 03:49:14 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Drew Adams's message of "Sun, 24 Jan 2021 18:55:56 +0000") Message-ID: <87o8hbdrh1.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Drew Adams writes: > Somewhere up front in the Elisp manual, please consider providing a link > to the eintr manual. One possible place is in node (elisp) > `Introduction'. > > Let people who arrive at the Elisp manual [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: 46084@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Drew Adams writes: > Somewhere up front in the Elisp manual, please consider providing a link > to the eintr manual. One possible place is in node (elisp) > `Introduction'. > > Let people who arrive at the Elisp manual know that there is an intro to > Elisp. The eintr manual is for people who aren't programmers. The lispref manual is a reference manual (for programmers). So adding a link like that doesn't seem to make much sense. Closing. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 26 21:49:33 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Jan 2021 02:49:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43178 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l4ath-00078v-BS for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:49:33 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:35140) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l4atg-00078g-Je for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:49:32 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=rw9KxaXpNQDQx4tSdHIqy0HouMBxC39wNt1M9qqyVQ8=; b=pEF0990fgTE/rUMVNp0DMSBjYg K1HcjyIt2lrpAwu7PzJ8RyRGD5dmgJLwA5ZK2Q1okeuXsBdzbAF+QaMoURcjWsrrvzmctmjc3n148 JxFz++tn5ck9jBs+f6oHW2FqgIxS7SQvU6iysyRZ6S8e01xDwZA+EYmHtCkBPdlR6fVc=; Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1l4atZ-0008Eg-2L for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 27 Jan 2021 03:49:27 +0100 Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 03:49:24 +0100 Message-Id: <87mtwvdrgr.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #46084 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: f6def323-a984-46da-09c5-08d8c26f785c X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 27 Jan 2021 02:58:48.8266 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: ARBq6dWGyoSWSk7/7ZAHZ+boBbVOxLf3qszRL+ggqmteEmHdJUJHnL6p77hw996Q0cU0hf/VhDUFW+CeiM9vzQ== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: SN6PR10MB2784 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6200 definitions=9876 signatures=668683 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 adultscore=0 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 mlxlogscore=783 bulkscore=0 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2101270015 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6200 definitions=9876 signatures=668683 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 malwarescore=0 adultscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 clxscore=1011 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 impostorscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2101270015 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: "46084@debbugs.gnu.org" <46084@debbugs.gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > The eintr manual is for people who aren't programmers. The lispref > manual is a reference manual (for programmers). So adding a link like > that doesn't seem to make much sense. Closing. That makes NO sense to me. Everyone who uses Lisp is still learning it. Anyone who tries to learn Elisp can benefit from the Eintr help. Anyone who uses the Eintr guidance can also benefit from referring to the E= lisp manual for specific info about this or that thing that they're learnin= g or they're interested in. Many, many people will arrive directly at the Elisp manual - by googling, b= eing referred from a website or mailing list, etc. The Elisp manual is MUC= H wider known and referred to by people. An Elisp learner (and others) can _easily_ arrive at the Elisp manual, and = not have the faintest idea that they might be able to benefit from the Eint= r book. Why on earth would we want to not help a reader of either manual know about= the existence of the other? Why do you think that reference books should not refer to user guides? Or = vice versa? I can assure you that serious doc systems have tons of cross-r= eferences between reference material and guide material. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 28 01:32:06 2021 Received: (at 46084) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Jan 2021 06:32:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46859 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l50qc-0002I0-6M for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:32:06 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:46596) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l50qY-0002B1-K0 for 46084@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:32:04 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36943) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l50qS-0001bB-QQ; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:31:56 -0500 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l50qQ-0003ZI-KP; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:31:54 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Drew Adams In-Reply-To: (message from Drew Adams on Wed, 27 Jan 2021 02:58:48 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#46084: [External] : Re: bug#46084: 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front References: <87o8hbdrh1.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:31:54 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 46084@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] I agree, let's make the link. It costs almost nothing on any dimension, and you're right that it will help some people. -- Dr Richard Stallman Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 28 09:14:33 2021 Received: (at 46084) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Jan 2021 14:14:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47634 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l5849-00085K-Cz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 09:14:33 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:46930) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l5844-000854-Q0 for 46084@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 09:14:32 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:42484) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l583y-0005qC-Hc; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 09:14:22 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:2442 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l583j-00084o-5m; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 09:14:07 -0500 Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 16:14:21 +0200 Message-Id: <834kj1ywqq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: rms@gnu.org In-Reply-To: (message from Richard Stallman on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:31:54 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#46084: [External] : Re: bug#46084: 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front References: <87o8hbdrh1.fsf@gnus.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 46084@debbugs.gnu.org, drew.adams@oracle.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Richard Stallman > Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 01:31:54 -0500 > Cc: larsi@gnus.org, 46084@debbugs.gnu.org > > I agree, let's make the link. It costs almost nothing on any > dimension, and you're right that it will help some people. Did anyone look in the ELisp manual before writing about this issue? Because there is already a link. The ELisp manual says in its first chapter, "Introduction": This manual attempts to be a full description of Emacs Lisp. For a beginner’s introduction to Emacs Lisp, see ‘An Introduction to Emacs Lisp Programming’, by Bob Chassell, also published by the Free Software Foundation. This manual presumes considerable familiarity with the use of Emacs for editing; see ‘The GNU Emacs Manual’ for this basic information. What else is missing? 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28 Jan 2021 15:28:38 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49414 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l59Dp-0001yj-LU for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:28:37 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45000) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l59Dn-0001yU-AR for 46084@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:28:36 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:44208) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l59Dg-0007RV-Vf; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:28:28 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:3005 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l59DV-0006WO-C4; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:28:18 -0500 Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 17:28:31 +0200 Message-Id: <831re5ytb4.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Drew Adams In-Reply-To: (message from Drew Adams on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:16:09 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#46084: [External] : Re: bug#46084: 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front References: <87o8hbdrh1.fsf@gnus.org> <834kj1ywqq.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: larsi@gnus.org, rms@gnu.org, 46084@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Drew Adams > CC: "larsi@gnus.org" , > "46084@debbugs.gnu.org" > <46084@debbugs.gnu.org> > Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:16:09 +0000 > > > Because there is already a link. > > Not that I see. At least not in Emacs 26.3 > (or 27.1, or the latest 28 MS Windows > snapshot I have). Maybe your Info manuals are (severely) outdated. This text is there as far back as Emacs 23. > > What else is missing? > > A link (as the enhancement request says). Not just > a textual mention of the manual's title, but an Info > link. > ___ > > And while we're at it, please consider adding a link > (a link) to the Emacs manual, as well. > > Textual references are great. Linked textual refs > are even better. > ___ > > BTW, "This manual" can be misunderstood in the last > sentence you quoted. We presumably want it to mean, > like the first "This manual" of the paragraph, the > Elisp manual. But immediately following mention of > Eintr, it becomes a bit ambiguous. Better to make > explicit which manual is meant. Nothing is ever good enough, sigh. 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SFP:1101; x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata: =?us-ascii?Q?BK4LhmoPywUN+jejkKwKM1VUqmgT1GVLI1c/1gGUDJVQX7n6loUUOdzCQ8MI?= =?us-ascii?Q?h8XkoD6SSaVq3iEK47sHSGKuO29sUvNnm+Oopmjdjxa2C8BTr6d3y4weD19v?= =?us-ascii?Q?PGQgtGwbgbSl3xurvypSAwriawDDY8Ycb4TtXm1F9sd0ZMWf9LV91ebFLhu6?= =?us-ascii?Q?jVrBdBj+akNUQdvtcGNh2llfnAzE+4fRVxuNYwjbLszNpS8AoLem3aAiKJxb?= =?us-ascii?Q?/1n4fHCiIUzFfOmQJbf+jlN9yIisq/uUDDnfBs4zwjkjF31gvX90pDyAHMB1?= =?us-ascii?Q?Tm7D0z48NrdW+Yma2S/wKfUEA9X7JmTtVzmvjglcUZnAx0Q7wP5Oodf5Ptgg?= =?us-ascii?Q?K9Xe2UDZPjkEizhFq3vz5FsVjdbb9nmQoI3J62cDjBjZ9rSFMlAvmRa3hw3y?= =?us-ascii?Q?+agLeKq1/qBhqEz00svYw1N09qBd5VOygRUHypfZ9ZJsBDCJeWJWjMSvlguI?= =?us-ascii?Q?UlcXq7u7oRfs0uS2neSyMb107iwlspcF5nOxZyVwIL0zkwMtSaznSgl2S3lM?= =?us-ascii?Q?OF99o7mVIQVWzBCa3s9E2nUrRTSrEHsFBPe0Dq3+WF42r7oBix8hpgTxugjr?= =?us-ascii?Q?hc9IfV2vLmVlUZ9o/nnRtcx2mNJBl8Ubvi3Z7TlOtUDJi9bExzbAchibkK6k?= =?us-ascii?Q?yi++jeLNcDYjrYyDhbftVY9Lbzx5kwZwcSDrBXipVLBxDNUpQyIPD67mqc9u?= =?us-ascii?Q?n+0IOwwDx8T7jyMBqT5gxpJc6XlFOGHl0r4yAuyd/1XUL59UBvkOYwGBKvUi?= =?us-ascii?Q?nEEoJAVxGHIeMOySyJJOP0NXYEqIW/RK2ErwMlBQNMd8aglkmfBAEfcStMaQ?= =?us-ascii?Q?N0tefAbbO8lMhenwLldE5sGpxlNeXjVTJ9RbnVf3aAe/5Z//cQi/3PC+17vG?= =?us-ascii?Q?wRCfXP+UAvP3oVzsOWYCpJzGPyjoLa2s7nMBJhvP/laTuqT2/aIDtAMolg1Z?= =?us-ascii?Q?Im8L9Np2oP4wZfBtHaVCo+GAkx/IIXPZf5kgi6heTR3TVLaxg/WGv4TIE3QD?= =?us-ascii?Q?A3xYt1Jf+lnh2uh3rB4IAzuG91a/bPrcrzMC9VopURjVMalM8MxA77pQ8MHm?= =?us-ascii?Q?zYW0/AoK?= x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 83b3b209-6a56-442d-0034-08d8c3a3d9c3 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 28 Jan 2021 15:46:17.2311 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: Q8qlg3zCeiq8WN477OxrV9eUmcG73vs8R8W3hSuwwQhh1H0hgsIVKzIEEbHRz/fyP0T1NmvAMtt9jCv5qAh9ig== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: SA2PR10MB4412 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6200 definitions=9878 signatures=668683 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 adultscore=0 mlxscore=0 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2101280080 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6200 definitions=9878 signatures=668683 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 spamscore=0 phishscore=0 adultscore=0 impostorscore=0 malwarescore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 bulkscore=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxlogscore=999 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2101280080 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: "larsi@gnus.org" , "rms@gnu.org" , "46084@debbugs.gnu.org" <46084@debbugs.gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > > > Because there is already a link. > > > > Not that I see. At least not in Emacs 26.3 > > (or 27.1, or the latest 28 MS Windows > > snapshot I have). > > Maybe your Info manuals are (severely) outdated. > This text is there as far back as Emacs 23. I confirmed that the text is there. And I reiterated that the enhancement request is about a missing link, not missing text. > Nothing is ever good enough, sigh. Please don't take it personally. There's always room for improvement, yes. I'm a writer, and every writer knows that it's very easy to write something that can be misunderstood, and that nearly everything is ripe for a possible rewrite. That added suggestion about "This manual" is a nit - not important. It's not what this enhancement request is about. I wrote "BTW," and separated that minor suggestion from the other text. The enhancement request is just to add a link to the Eintr manual from the Elisp manual, preferably up front somewhere, e.g. in the Introduction. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 29 01:35:59 2021 Received: (at 46084) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Jan 2021 06:35:59 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50948 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l5NNv-0003jL-9w for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 29 Jan 2021 01:35:59 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:57956) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l5NNs-0003j4-HS for 46084@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 29 Jan 2021 01:35:58 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:33035) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l5NNn-0002Oc-6U; Fri, 29 Jan 2021 01:35:51 -0500 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l5NNl-0006Jw-MG; Fri, 29 Jan 2021 01:35:49 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Drew Adams In-Reply-To: (message from Drew Adams on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:46:17 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#46084: [External] : Re: bug#46084: 26.3; Elisp manual: provide a link to (eintro) up front References: <87o8hbdrh1.fsf@gnus.org> <834kj1ywqq.fsf@gnu.org> <831re5ytb4.fsf@gnu.org> Message-Id: Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 01:35:49 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 46084 Cc: eliz@gnu.org, larsi@gnus.org, 46084@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > Nothing is ever good enough, sigh. > Please don't take it personally. There's > always room for improvement, yes. I like that way of looking at it. We have all overlooked opportunities to make Emacs better. When people suggest one that we overlooked, that gives us a chance to make up for the omission. It's GNU Project policy to thank people for bug reports. That's not meant to be perfunctory. Without bug reports we would not know what er need to do. So please think about appreciation for them. -- Dr Richard Stallman Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From unknown Fri Aug 15 03:38:37 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 12:24:16 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator