From unknown Sat Aug 09 12:59:57 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#43617 <43617@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#43617 <43617@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap Reply-To: bug#43617 <43617@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2025 19:59:57 +0000 retitle 43617 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over g= lobal keymap reassign 43617 emacs submitter 43617 dalanicolai@gmail.com severity 43617 normal tag 43617 notabug thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Sep 25 14:10:58 2020 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Sep 2020 18:10:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45288 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kLsBM-0005kl-Pg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 14:10:58 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:46072) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kLsBJ-0005kX-As for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 14:10:55 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45520) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kLsBJ-0003qM-63 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 14:10:53 -0400 Received: from mail-ed1-x534.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::534]:37619) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kLsBD-0004Db-Qr for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 14:10:52 -0400 Received: by mail-ed1-x534.google.com with SMTP id n22so3420034edt.4 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 11:10:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=message-id:subject:from:to:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=lSfTXFi9v+RFwDzwQzYi7LUJj2bVsW5GW2ha9cYkFt0=; b=IKPWzEvS1JYNpegC0o3IPvaA2grsNideQDRJ+fEfURpiOrl2/CkUKyMqazp31h67ZR Gkq2u9KsGQ8m3ep6gYAHBfnqSLXfhcoCyVDBw1DTMapllkVSnLktfqt58Fa/Rlv23C1z 271l5oKhxO7TS1phNx+yAp3/D1I423CAEanXm3s3XPSpkCZPneAZ+DTJFwIUjVwgKE1N jX/G/hsFt22hca3eGQkvT6S/LW6ixAZ9KIyyB4uKIFOTzZrvqNjLp+rO7MXVX6689zZH kgDzpVz83gDXpFBD4yn27PeJFLG04T0VCyBQzJCyC3vNDzgKzUygGwiYka1GWSIRZx3r 5sRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:subject:from:to:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=lSfTXFi9v+RFwDzwQzYi7LUJj2bVsW5GW2ha9cYkFt0=; b=AIXot9BBIMbO1SsV9R8Gg7VNtkGJITHnWN69Aj246zwXHMInN5SGY9ZlqeixHw3jcK zM5y+FELHdzecf8w0skId71JOZezFv/TblpRVdTcDgEQbEVRvQo8sm4SExZvrmHhAFQf PcOk0/28ePBfpZiydZ1R294N2eX9zR2xaUX07YziDMMOAqxjVRtRLDsC9+xT1rY5/WhD 00lhMRDzGjnRlJL7PHSnQ8d03q4tdgYsqf5BtOxZzLyRYkaRTNPcvtDNxWeX8BrCiXbj 46mmEPHW5hJscKWN4oPHXqYk82d6Jxz4p05sOwTLhLumJpuc1VF/5NAjTzuyduBHxJKh hWpw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532lRbunlfU2L3F6lFF/LdMhrMc+fjGk18Cw5+ML+T1wSK1kfWc8 3XfqHxotk2okwS3mX4gQSH+A6ApzxtF/Ng== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw++SZUlda8p1SxSEIADJLWdjHINVZEeTndMMnhGWB4iE25NBsn8nleI0x0VsULzXusZW7f9w== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:1711:: with SMTP id y17mr2708138edu.345.1601057441977; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 11:10:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from daniel-fedora (77-170-248-137.fixed.kpn.net. [77.170.248.137]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r9sm2327423eji.111.2020.09.25.11.10.41 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 25 Sep 2020 11:10:41 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> Subject: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap From: dalanicolai@gmail.com To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 20:10:40 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" User-Agent: Evolution 3.36.5 (3.36.5-1.fc32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::534; envelope-from=dalanicolai@gmail.com; helo=mail-ed1-x534.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Start emacs with the -Q flag, use the following code to create keybindings with define-minor-mode: (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchronized buffers" nil " Continuous" '(((kbd "j") . (lambda () (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) ((kbd "C-n") . (lambda () (interactive)(print "pushed C-n")))) (print "toggled minor mode")) Now activate the just defined pdf-continuous-scroll-mode. The "C-n" keybinding does not work correctly while the "j" keybinding does (i.e. prints "pushed j"). Section 22.7 of the elisp manual ( https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/elisp/Active-Keymaps.html ) states that minor mode keymaps should get highest precedence behind overlay keymaps. Therefore this seems to be a bug. The workaround that was posted in an answer on my question on stackexchange ( https://emacs.stackexchange.com/questions/60835/why-my-minor-mode-bindings-do-not-get-precedence-over-global-major-mode-bindings?noredirect=1#comment95704_60835 ) to create a keymap first with (make-sparse-keymap) and then use that keymap in define-minor-mode works fine. In GNU Emacs 27.1 (build 1, x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.21, cairo version 1.16.0) of 2020-08-20 built on buildvm-x86-24.iad2.fedoraproject.org Windowing system distributor 'Fedora Project', version 11.0.12008000 System Description: Fedora 32 (Workstation Edition) Recent messages: Loading ‘mma’: unescaped character literals `?(', `?)' detected, `?\(', `?\)' expected! Loading /home/dalanicolai/Sync/emacs/private/local/zotero-find/zotero- find.el (source)... Created zotero link. Loading /home/dalanicolai/Sync/emacs/private/local/zotero-find/zotero- find.el (source)...done Loading /home/dalanicolai/.my_emacs.d/init.el (source)...done For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a. Package cl is deprecated Preparing tutorial ... Save your position in the tutorial? (y or n) y Making completion list... Configured using: 'configure --build=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu --host=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu --program-prefix= --disable-dependency-tracking --prefix=/usr --exec-prefix=/usr --bindir=/usr/bin --sbindir=/usr/sbin --sysconfdir=/etc --datadir=/usr/share --includedir=/usr/include --libdir=/usr/lib64 --libexecdir=/usr/libexec --localstatedir=/var --sharedstatedir=/var/lib --mandir=/usr/share/man --infodir=/usr/share/info --with-dbus --with-gif --with-jpeg --with- png --with-rsvg --with-tiff --with-xft --with-xpm --with-x-toolkit=gtk3 --with-gpm=no --with-xwidgets --with-modules --with-harfbuzz --with-cairo --with-json build_alias=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu host_alias=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu 'CFLAGS=-DMAIL_USE_LOCKF -O2 -g -pipe -Wall -Werror=format-security -Wp,-D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 -Wp,-D_GLIBCXX_ASSERTIONS -fexceptions -fstack-protector-strong -grecord-gcc-switches -specs=/usr/lib/rpm/redhat/redhat-hardened-cc1 -specs=/usr/lib/rpm/redhat/redhat-annobin-cc1 -m64 -mtune=generic -fasynchronous-unwind-tables -fstack-clash-protection -fcf-protection' LDFLAGS=-Wl,-z,relro PKG_CONFIG_PATH=:/usr/lib64/pkgconfig:/usr/share/pkgconfig' Configured features: XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG CAIRO SOUND DBUS GSETTINGS GLIB NOTIFY INOTIFY ACL LIBSELINUX GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE HARFBUZZ M17N_FLT LIBOTF ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11 XDBE XIM MODULES THREADS XWIDGETS LIBSYSTEMD JSON PDUMPER GMP Important settings: value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=ibus locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: Fundamental Minor modes in effect: shell-dirtrack-mode: t pdf-occur-global-minor-mode: t tooltip-mode: t global-eldoc-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t tool-bar-mode: t menu-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t buffer-read-only: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t Load-path shadows: 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Features: (shadow sort mail-extr emacsbug message rmc rfc822 mml mml-sec epa derived epg epg-config gnus-util rmail rmail-loaddefs mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader sendmail rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr tutorial help-mode .emacs zotero-find sql view thingatpt org-yt ob-mathematica mma cl ob-shell shell ob-jupyter jupyter-org-extensions jupyter-org-client jupyter-repl jupyter-kernel-manager jupyter-channel jupyter-widget-client websocket bindat simple-httpd jupyter-client jupyter-comm-layer jupyter-messages hmac-def jupyter-mime shr puny svg dom jupyter-kernelspec jupyter-env jupyter-base eieio-base ob-python org-re-reveal ox-odt rng-loc rng-uri rng-parse rng-match rng-dt rng- util rng-pttrn nxml-parse nxml-ns nxml-enc xmltok nxml-util ox-latex ox-icalendar ox-html table ox-ascii ox-publish ox org-element avl-tree generator vc-git diff-mode pdf-sync pdf-annot pdf-outline pdf-links org org-macro org-footnote org-pcomplete 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base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget hashtable-print- readable backquote threads dbusbind inotify dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting xwidget-internal cairo move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty make-network-process emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 366315 21854) (symbols 48 29815 1) (strings 32 127188 4283) (string-bytes 1 3965823) (vectors 16 44121) (vector-slots 8 546653 26336) (floats 8 365 93) (intervals 56 423 0) (buffers 1000 18)) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 26 10:05:09 2020 Received: (at 43617) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2020 14:05:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47481 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAp3-0007Bf-2e for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 10:05:09 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52380) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAp0-0007B8-PB for 43617@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 10:05:07 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=UVNJEQw1KyRlodTvQczqS0bvlF+5ZBJa4T1/Jjjclqk=; b=nBEI9uZU7VOF+lqmRKPgSn6ZUM bX26X4nmC31K6YHB7tK8UUJ9T0YmZsh0VrcU631om47RSL6eNk64h/0ND9hPttFmStBiTR/m/nti8 2Dw2hSlt6Jpq8DUDMWgVOGtJAZG31Ek1eSL3HuCVzhJBSoDOMUOfL08uHmJ2lt/Fej1E=; Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAos-00081I-0c; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:05:00 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: dalanicolai@gmail.com Subject: Re: bug#43617: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap References: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> X-Now-Playing: Laura Jean's _Laura Jean_: "First Love Song " Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:56 +0200 In-Reply-To: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> (dalanicolai@gmail.com's message of "Fri, 25 Sep 2020 20:10:40 +0200") Message-ID: <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: dalanicolai@gmail.com writes: > Start emacs with the -Q flag, use the following code to create > keybindings with define-minor-mode: > > (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode > "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchroni [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 43617 Cc: 43617@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) dalanicolai@gmail.com writes: > Start emacs with the -Q flag, use the following code to create > keybindings with define-minor-mode: > > (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode > "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchronized buffers" > nil > " Continuous" > '(((kbd "j") . (lambda () (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) > ((kbd "C-n") . (lambda () (interactive)(print "pushed C-n")))) > (print "toggled minor mode")) > > Now activate the just defined pdf-continuous-scroll-mode. > The "C-n" keybinding does not work correctly while the "j" > keybinding does (i.e. prints "pushed j"). Hm. It seems like there's a difference between \C-n and (kbd "C-n") here for some reason. With this definition: (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode-3 "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchronized buffers" nil " Continuous" '(((kbd "j") . (lambda () (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) ("\C-n" . (lambda () (interactive)(print "pushed C-n")))) (print "toggled minor mode")) we get the keymap: (keymap (14 lambda nil (interactive) (print "pushed C-n")) (106 lambda nil (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) With `kbd', we get the following keymap, which surely has to be wrong: (keymap (67 keymap (45 keymap (110 lambda nil (interactive) (print "pushed C-n")))) (106 lambda nil (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 26 10:09:50 2020 Received: (at 43617) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2020 14:09:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47489 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAtZ-0007J9-VO for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 10:09:50 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52478) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAtX-0007It-Uk for 43617@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 10:09:48 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=axq2ry3gA9MaYHN02ecx0M4pn0/KDaoji4cMjCc0T9c=; b=hX+ERqWjdcdA9Q7X7gL0TRf38O 4ZFdT8M3UlI0kkfSBSUcE26LUNfWJDlnF/QklbPdtcMj0CnMWjy3aNSDkpGsYGV4+ku+BJDCBRkPU xLIKHkbJ7AdRtWZEu2UJrpvb7Jzfx4cXBthkPeeosUa4yBfbVvchF1gNkw1X7WkMZo/8=; Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAtP-00083g-NK; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:09:42 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: dalanicolai@gmail.com Subject: Re: bug#43617: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap References: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> X-Now-Playing: Laura Jean's _Laura Jean_: "Sister, All I Have Are My Arms" Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:09:38 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:56 +0200") Message-ID: <878scwljdp.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Ah, it just works for "j" by accident -- define-minor-mode does not evaluate anything in the keymap form. So there's no bug here in define-minor-mode, but the here is wrong. It should be: (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode-5 "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchronized buffers" nil " Continuous" `((,(kbd "j") . (lambda () (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) (,(kbd "C-n") [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 43617 Cc: 43617@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Ah, it just works for "j" by accident -- define-minor-mode does not evaluate anything in the keymap form. So there's no bug here in define-minor-mode, but the here is wrong. It should be: (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode-5 "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchronized buffers" nil " Continuous" `((,(kbd "j") . (lambda () (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) (,(kbd "C-n") . (lambda () (interactive)(print "pushed C-n")))) (print "toggled minor mode")) So I'm closing this bug report. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 26 10:09:57 2020 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2020 14:09:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47492 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAth-0007JT-8l for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 10:09:57 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52492) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAtg-0007JH-Cy for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 10:09:56 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=nE1SjeZDIhsatznThhwgMgQ4O+zDzFLTVKA4T6cp4oM=; b=DDh4r3ymFfObP2lq57g+5kCaym JzqiJ+BuO4SO8WQmQxw2cygbmPvMSzVI5Kxfz70xmMjMch78PFyoF4mPnh8DPBhUYQb2pLKYdP5aS rFQm4GWrgKlbK3OPBOHy13LaoW0Mzysnee4UMOGpn29m2C2h2hxeGSmgaJmek11gUg3E=; Received: from cm-84.212.202.86.getinternet.no ([84.212.202.86] helo=xo) by quimby with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kMAtY-00083r-Ni for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:09:50 +0200 Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:09:47 +0200 Message-Id: <877dsgljdg.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #43617 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: tags 43617 notabug close 43617 quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) tags 43617 notabug close 43617 quit From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 26 11:25:50 2020 Received: (at 43617) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2020 15:25:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47577 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMC58-00075X-Lo for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 11:25:50 -0400 Received: from userp2120.oracle.com ([156.151.31.85]:57542) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMC55-00075I-Oe for 43617@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 11:25:49 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (userp2120.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp2120.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 08QFPgCd148088; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 15:25:42 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : cc : subject : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2020-01-29; bh=vWQ1UJQvt2NHDTKv5EP/oVTKhjHl/bvN8NN21c6tihg=; b=WL68un4aXLBZ9ka8Eixsmgt8I+yB+zBPTb2zhju4tDt+GptOsTqYkzXYepnmX+H9miXt CEzTAOv8VvYJCaFzJ9yCshDTzXpsm/RSLa5htuZQvdlf7OfNEi9+DRJqLgOfZ7HTHQ+2 daTsCAKeZTxKFWxMx9iHngL6ssgmcL9xcECW7WwRriQR37xQ48A/HhfbNzGwPpvaeLfb RpQXvJughnFGFJaodo1TrCe4yINf7pGfPa4+bIncR4WYFLXX5RSesLVE7KR91mbiz59v j4g4zEH27WAiFqP7bEDre/1fwqNjj/3qDRrE2okh0rzeKwjaeI/uK1bPJzNq3k+i5awQ BA== Received: from aserp3020.oracle.com (aserp3020.oracle.com [141.146.126.70]) by userp2120.oracle.com with ESMTP id 33sx9mrqa9-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Sep 2020 15:25:41 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp3020.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp3020.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 08QFKEvI039025; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 15:25:41 GMT Received: from userv0122.oracle.com (userv0122.oracle.com [156.151.31.75]) by aserp3020.oracle.com with ESMTP id 33sweyger3-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Sep 2020 15:25:41 +0000 Received: from abhmp0006.oracle.com (abhmp0006.oracle.com [141.146.116.12]) by userv0122.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id 08QFPc8Q026625; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 15:25:39 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <59b95abb-1c57-4a94-b6e0-7f4bdeef72ee@default> Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 08:25:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams To: Lars Ingebrigtsen , dalanicolai@gmail.com Subject: RE: bug#43617: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap References: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> <878scwljdp.fsf@gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <878scwljdp.fsf@gnus.org> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.5056.0 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9756 signatures=668680 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 mlxscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=984 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2006250000 definitions=main-2009260140 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9756 signatures=668680 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 mlxlogscore=999 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 mlxscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 adultscore=0 clxscore=1011 spamscore=0 impostorscore=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 priorityscore=1501 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2006250000 definitions=main-2009260140 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 43617 Cc: 43617@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Ah, it just works for "j" by accident -- define-minor-mode does not > evaluate anything in the keymap form. It should. According to its doc string. > So there's no bug here in define-minor-mode, but the > here is wrong. It should be: >=20 > (define-minor-mode pdf-continuous-scroll-mode-5 > "Emulate continuous scroll with two synchronized buffers" > nil > " Continuous" > `((,(kbd "j") . (lambda () (interactive) (print "pushed j"))) > (,(kbd "C-n") . (lambda () (interactive)(print "pushed C-n")))) > (print "toggled minor mode")) >=20 > So I'm closing this bug report. I don't agree that there's no bug (IIUC). I think there's either a doc bug (if you think the current behavior is what we want - I don't) or a behavior bug (if you think the doc's described behavior is what we want - I do). The doc string says that KEYMAP can be: an expression that returns either a keymap or a list of (KEY . BINDING) pairs where KEY and BINDING are suitable for `define-key' The cons ((kbd "C-n") . 'foo) is exactly such a (KEY . BINDING) pair - both KEY and BINDING are suitable arguments for `define-key'. Yes, it's true that the _result of evaluating_ (kbd ...) is ALSO an acceptable arg for `define-key'. But `define-key' doesn't _require_ its KEY arg to be, say, a string or vector. `define-key' evaluates its arg. And a list (kbd ...) is an acceptable arg for `define-key'. You can write (define-key map (kbd "C-n") 'foo) Or you can write (define-key map " " 'foo) where that string with char ?\n (Control-J) is the result of evaluating the sexp (kbd "C-n"). Or you can write (define-key map "\n" 'foo) `define-minor-mode' should accept any expression that `define-key' accepts for KEY. In the case of `C-n' that means (kbd "C-n"), "\n", and " ". From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 26 11:32:57 2020 Received: (at 43617) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2020 15:32:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47587 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMCC0-0007H4-MD for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 11:32:56 -0400 Received: from mail-out.m-online.net ([212.18.0.9]:60124) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMCBx-0007Gu-DG for 43617@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 11:32:55 -0400 Received: from frontend01.mail.m-online.net (unknown [192.168.8.182]) by mail-out.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BzCTb6hFzz1qv9b; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 17:32:51 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (dynscan1.mnet-online.de [192.168.6.70]) by mail.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BzCTb4wpGz1qs0N; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 17:32:51 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mnet-online.de Received: from mail.mnet-online.de ([192.168.8.182]) by localhost (dynscan1.mail.m-online.net [192.168.6.70]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Pft3oGC0EO12; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 17:32:50 +0200 (CEST) X-Auth-Info: /pl63U+PH2HI1YOhKNPfRfi5nezh4QaSB98doc5Yw/xv+3vUL74XLDW3wnWVEPXU Received: from igel.home (ppp-46-244-165-104.dynamic.mnet-online.de [46.244.165.104]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.mnet-online.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 17:32:50 +0200 (CEST) Received: by igel.home (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 58A732C279B; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 17:32:50 +0200 (CEST) From: Andreas Schwab To: Drew Adams Subject: Re: bug#43617: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap References: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> <878scwljdp.fsf@gnus.org> <59b95abb-1c57-4a94-b6e0-7f4bdeef72ee@default> X-Yow: With this weapon I can expose fictional characters and bring about sweeping reforms!! Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 17:32:50 +0200 In-Reply-To: <59b95abb-1c57-4a94-b6e0-7f4bdeef72ee@default> (Drew Adams's message of "Sat, 26 Sep 2020 08:25:37 -0700 (PDT)") Message-ID: <87h7rk1rkt.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.1 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 43617 Cc: 43617@debbugs.gnu.org, Lars Ingebrigtsen , dalanicolai@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) On Sep 26 2020, Drew Adams wrote: > The cons ((kbd "C-n") . 'foo) is exactly such a > (KEY . BINDING) pair - both KEY and BINDING are > suitable arguments for `define-key'. Is it? ELISP> (define-key global-map '(kbd "C-n") ''foo) *** Eval error *** Wrong type argument: arrayp, (kbd "C-n") Andreas. -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 26 12:05:01 2020 Received: (at 43617) by debbugs.gnu.org; 26 Sep 2020 16:05:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47634 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMCh3-00082j-43 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 12:05:01 -0400 Received: from aserp2120.oracle.com ([141.146.126.78]:53986) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMCgy-00082R-Ay for 43617@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 12:04:59 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp2120.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp2120.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 08QG03OF095674; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:50 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : cc : subject : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2020-01-29; bh=N/v0egq5EjeJ91r3bKnQdv+2r7G9I6jBL5Z4LNL9Kdw=; b=WA0JKlvrEpJTVBCxsIY1oPOTKrnzCplqBy9KGcikCKce7/l4X+8JqotO6LwviMqPgi3h KRtLFRPz/5JwNiofQtChT7cNxRPgp515SHFbYeljrQGF9HCchh3C8Wry/oflvd0wtWCA mngLpCTrcqBycV6o9/fLL+KJ7jUaw/eF8QWqnuWJHp2JsHzbX93XlxgWZ6nLSIQd2Cfz YYhYbCI5Rx372VmoOx4Em3/yvY5heCxY99j/eUJRpJaO8iA4pkHzbpz/lBDYv8m73HOh eklNagHFpxdwFHWOJT/kZ4cZBP7yjwhDDSdyMB4yGNUHoOpRbKAIWZHWsYZ+mBdJuV61 nQ== Received: from aserp3030.oracle.com (aserp3030.oracle.com [141.146.126.71]) by aserp2120.oracle.com with ESMTP id 33swkkgu4y-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:50 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp3030.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp3030.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 08QG4e8j026787; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:50 GMT Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by aserp3030.oracle.com with ESMTP id 33sup8k2at-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:50 +0000 Received: from abhmp0006.oracle.com (abhmp0006.oracle.com [141.146.116.12]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id 08QG4mmw030164; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 16:04:48 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 09:04:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams To: Andreas Schwab Subject: RE: bug#43617: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap References: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> <878scwljdp.fsf@gnus.org> <59b95abb-1c57-4a94-b6e0-7f4bdeef72ee@default> <87h7rk1rkt.fsf@igel.home> In-Reply-To: <87h7rk1rkt.fsf@igel.home> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.5056.0 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9756 signatures=668680 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 mlxscore=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxlogscore=948 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2006250000 definitions=main-2009260147 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9756 signatures=668680 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 malwarescore=0 mlxscore=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxlogscore=968 clxscore=1015 priorityscore=1501 impostorscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2006250000 definitions=main-2009260146 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 43617 Cc: 43617@debbugs.gnu.org, Lars Ingebrigtsen , dalanicolai@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > > The cons ((kbd "C-n") . 'foo) is exactly such a > > (KEY . BINDING) pair - both KEY and BINDING are > > suitable arguments for `define-key'. >=20 > Is it? >=20 > ELISP> (define-key global-map '(kbd "C-n") ''foo) > *** Eval error *** Wrong type argument: arrayp, (kbd "C-n") I get your point. I guess maybe there are two ways to read the doc string. The most _useful_ behavior for users, IMO, is for `define-minor-mode' to allow expressions in arg KEYMAP (when it's such a list) that correspond to what a user writes in `(define-key ...)'. Is that particular list form of KEYMAP intended mostly for programmatically supplying such a list, or for users to write such a list? If the former, why is it needed/helpful at all, since code can just as easily create a keymap arg. If the latter, it gives users an easy way to write key bindings directly for `define-minor-mode'. I hadn't even paid attention to the existence of such a form for the KEYMAP arg. But it looks like it could be handy for users to write - IF the sexp to write is simple and straightforward. If users instead need to use backquote syntax or jump through other hoops to write such a KEYMAP sexp, then what's the point - what's the use case? Maybe there _is_ a programmatic use case. If so, what is it? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 27 07:01:13 2020 Received: (at 43617) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Sep 2020 11:01:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48464 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMUQb-0008Jt-7Y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 07:01:13 -0400 Received: from mail-vk1-f176.google.com ([209.85.221.176]:33198) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kMUQV-0008Jc-So for 43617@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 07:01:11 -0400 Received: by mail-vk1-f176.google.com with SMTP id q13so874307vkd.0 for <43617@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 04:01:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=WPpozd4Nf1WFumL96rmo7BxoZRYKCxs3hZIKWTWfFqA=; b=El8nyGgZSVIT/jU0kUb+MkQG77VShDb6IFHYOKConUP0w5MVNZvGYpcOuoItDDuY5A kEfG99ZmEB5aFxWURUFcbG59vO0rgBdrzb+IDNA/pBjzekB3/FfT0Y6Xic17iVjRq+li Iwh9M1yGwLYlUI3hHIIqZMJIHHNwxUYeSFPBADsN2lK6qUngMZxo16MACETk+sIsSd3R 9RAjiB55R87uU83a+hzUZ76j04FZCZEKxfDevsvNJEhroj4X3xqTEu3ghqFHkRWnSzJG x2HkhPXhaNhdpHBXFTXFXKtajWqRWYjM2LLPwjcLI4DhmP+ND+U6B0c5cP20PqGrWQg1 YwBw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=WPpozd4Nf1WFumL96rmo7BxoZRYKCxs3hZIKWTWfFqA=; b=YdgDTYmPVAvxty/gRxY509CtK8XFhBUoR7pvSsKeTo46Gd7qNJP2kRe3LubkUnHpDi 9pB2/MZIfwh7mGCw91MX6SKZPCQE5O1SwLeLYKaKqKNKwzQW1g/226w1DDaspwpsnu1N DqOZvObyCveTRNoNfg8xFF0vmitah8NC8V50j14new9m7p19ImbWc5kmtoHXN5Kh+nYj gOzgE2AFp4gFcRmss/WjD0SDFIJjZRElTQ9hCE40oZhfCE6GXWpgnq94dirnY5FrCxum lIaQjYm3uMdBTtkGEaUwARVpAozZX0YPXeq+rWmAPa5WrTudWJR/zx0KFmxAaeQSHi59 uJKg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530e9JBxG3wZ8VI9oI6nWlMwt9hU+ff759YtJfYWCZSCCg2jZaaS wCOq2b3xE5X6Vmi+C+TSTxGCcREH9cp6EHKwm2c= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxjltGY33bLdxva52Hl/brp2FpHktLbewlPmQJx0x2i1/OPROFlwJSKf/sAT57gh4o4sXrSyK7Rp3hdI+4D54Y= X-Received: by 2002:ac5:cd88:: with SMTP id i8mr3002512vka.4.1601204462147; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 04:01:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <53faa17bc88194ba2a67440eb1ddd139ea1188c3.camel@gmail.com> <87eemoljlj.fsf@gnus.org> <878scwljdp.fsf@gnus.org> <59b95abb-1c57-4a94-b6e0-7f4bdeef72ee@default> <87h7rk1rkt.fsf@igel.home> In-Reply-To: From: dalanicolai Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2020 13:00:51 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#43617: 27.1; Define-minor-mode keybindings not get precedence over global keymap To: Drew Adams Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002de05e05b04977c3" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 43617 Cc: 43617@debbugs.gnu.org, Lars Ingebrigtsen , Andreas Schwab X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --0000000000002de05e05b04977c3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Well it seems quite obvious now that I simply overlooked the fact that quoting a list results in its elements not getting evaluated. I would argue that, although there might be no real bug in the doc, the doc still somehow helped me to overlook this fact. I think backquoting is not very much a hassle, but it would be nice to get reminded about it for when using the (kbd ...) construct. Of course if the (kbd "j") would not have worked I would have been less confused and maybe had found the mistake myself, but because that one did work it appeared to me to be a bug. Anyway, I think a simple change/addition in the docstring and/or the examples in section 23.3.3 of the elisp manual could help make things clearer. On Sat, 26 Sep 2020 at 18:05, Drew Adams wrote: > > > The cons ((kbd "C-n") . 'foo) is exactly such a > > > (KEY . BINDING) pair - both KEY and BINDING are > > > suitable arguments for `define-key'. > > > > Is it? > > > > ELISP> (define-key global-map '(kbd "C-n") ''foo) > > *** Eval error *** Wrong type argument: arrayp, (kbd "C-n") > > I get your point. I guess maybe there are two ways > to read the doc string. > > The most _useful_ behavior for users, IMO, is for > `define-minor-mode' to allow expressions in arg > KEYMAP (when it's such a list) that correspond to > what a user writes in `(define-key ...)'. > > Is that particular list form of KEYMAP intended > mostly for programmatically supplying such a list, > or for users to write such a list? > > If the former, why is it needed/helpful at all, > since code can just as easily create a keymap arg. > If the latter, it gives users an easy way to write > key bindings directly for `define-minor-mode'. > > I hadn't even paid attention to the existence of > such a form for the KEYMAP arg. But it looks like > it could be handy for users to write - IF the sexp > to write is simple and straightforward. > > If users instead need to use backquote syntax or > jump through other hoops to write such a KEYMAP > sexp, then what's the point - what's the use case? > > Maybe there _is_ a programmatic use case. If so, > what is it? > --0000000000002de05e05b04977c3 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well it seems quite obvious now that I simply overlooked t= he fact that quoting a list results in its elements not getting evaluated. = I would argue that, although there might be no real bug in the doc, the doc= still somehow helped me to overlook this fact. I think backquoting is not = very much a hassle, but it would be nice to get reminded about it for when = using the (kbd ...) construct. Of course if the (kbd "j") would n= ot have worked I would have been less confused and maybe had found the mist= ake myself, but because that one did work it appeared to me to be a bug. An= yway, I think a simple change/addition in the docstring and/or the examples= in section 23.3.3 of the elisp manual could help make things clearer.
<= /div>
O= n Sat, 26 Sep 2020 at 18:05, Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote:
> > The cons ((kbd "C-n") = . 'foo) is exactly such a
> > (KEY . BINDING) pair - both KEY and BINDING are
> > suitable arguments for `define-key'.
>
> Is it?
>
> ELISP> (define-key global-map '(kbd "C-n") ''= foo)
> *** Eval error ***=C2=A0 Wrong type argument: arrayp, (kbd "C-n&q= uot;)

I get your point.=C2=A0 I guess maybe there are two ways
to read the doc string.

The most _useful_ behavior for users, IMO, is for
`define-minor-mode' to allow expressions in arg
KEYMAP (when it's such a list) that correspond to
what a user writes in `(define-key ...)'.

Is that particular list form of KEYMAP intended
mostly for programmatically supplying such a list,
or for users to write such a list?

If the former, why is it needed/helpful at all,
since code can just as easily create a keymap arg.
If the latter, it gives users an easy way to write
key bindings directly for `define-minor-mode'.

I hadn't even paid attention to the existence of
such a form for the KEYMAP arg.=C2=A0 But it looks like
it could be handy for users to write - IF the sexp
to write is simple and straightforward.

If users instead need to use backquote syntax or
jump through other hoops to write such a KEYMAP
sexp, then what's the point - what's the use case?

Maybe there _is_ a programmatic use case.=C2=A0 If so,
what is it?
--0000000000002de05e05b04977c3-- From unknown Sat Aug 09 12:59:57 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sun, 25 Oct 2020 11:24:05 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator