From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 09:54:06 2020 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 13:54:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51638 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsaj-0005Pi-Mr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 09:54:05 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:35126) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsaV-0005P4-6U for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 09:53:51 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53520) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsaU-0002r2-Nn for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 09:53:50 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,SPF_PASS autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsaT-0002gx-PX for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 09:53:50 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-f169.google.com ([209.85.219.169]:42587) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsaT-0002cY-4T for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 09:53:49 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-f169.google.com with SMTP id i16so6501771ybq.9 for ; Sat, 02 May 2020 06:53:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=efv7ceh9qwtCP/BvQeoUbtvIW6woRDQv30rgXuLRtps=; b=cpLTza8LVxboldnQonIpXOERBxw7nRZ9Gjcgo3oTB/UGXDCQ2dno+wKCZH3bW2NTJt 2CK8EOvg+6FzEkdVeT89vG/VY203zmkG+Z1L1UuWXAgxFEOa8HgLIFrHyvF9lteXlXfK ZAl9/U5nZ2TXayT8WE4lHDTgoJvGyyNcK5+6krFtyx4dERtvRx6jTJIfViQZxg7itJmo 6wr/oyFXMHoL8aSVPYtb4rOmnoU+puY7t+QQzcovFi5vOe+WVUJusiMzv665OGUjxKb7 PccGc3PZuWjuddwnayoUt9YiKRVRshasJp63wzDFepVgNefS+K6RaCIr5qdBZKz182Z3 WDQw== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuZpws3M5ib39piR+yylU7aWxi9IaflwD/HXYq+T0bSqKNMQxL5f iGvQ8ASnEc/8akfkhCjYxrWyiSbgy5+CyXtbWpVX1I/E X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypJiOPe53qsSpLEm8j8NQqsYKG1ad87w1AzbIWeLCbW3pbgZoFrjKvtbCa2BynZvQ/CuoiLFUIJRATTKUFbaHWQ= X-Received: by 2002:a25:2:: with SMTP id 2mr14598835yba.466.1588427628008; Sat, 02 May 2020 06:53:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Kangas Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 15:53:37 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="00000000000084f11005a4aaa020" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=209.85.219.169; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-yb1-f169.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/05/02 09:53:48 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 209.85.219.169 X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Severity: wishlist Any objections to or comments on the attached patch? Thanks. Best regards, Stefan Kangas Content analysis details: (1.2 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.2 HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS From and EnvelopeFrom 2nd level mail domains are different 0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (stefankangas[at]gmail.com) 1.0 SPF_SOFTFAIL SPF: sender does not match SPF record (softfail) -2.3 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED RBL: Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/, medium trust [209.51.188.17 listed in list.dnswl.org] -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2 RBL: Average reputation (+2) [209.51.188.17 listed in wl.mailspike.net] 0.2 FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN 2nd level domains in From and EnvelopeFrom freemail headers are different 2.0 SPOOFED_FREEMAIL No description available. X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.8 (-) --00000000000084f11005a4aaa020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Severity: wishlist Any objections to or comments on the attached patch? Thanks. Best regards, Stefan Kangas --00000000000084f11005a4aaa020 Content-Type: text/x-patch; charset="US-ASCII"; name="0001-Improve-doc-strings-of-makunbound-and-fmakunbound.patch" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="0001-Improve-doc-strings-of-makunbound-and-fmakunbound.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-ID: X-Attachment-Id: f_k9pose3b0 RnJvbSBmMWNhYjEwNjFmMDJjYjg4YzllNjNhNjc5MzVlOTcwMWNlZTM3ODFkIE1vbiBTZXAgMTcg MDA6MDA6MDAgMjAwMQpGcm9tOiBTdGVmYW4gS2FuZ2FzIDxzdGVmYW5rYW5nYXNAZ21haWwuY29t PgpEYXRlOiBTYXQsIDIgTWF5IDIwMjAgMTU6NTE6MzEgKzAyMDAKU3ViamVjdDogW1BBVENIXSBJ bXByb3ZlIGRvYyBzdHJpbmdzIG9mIG1ha3VuYm91bmQgYW5kIGZtYWt1bmJvdW5kCgoqIHNyYy9k YXRhLmMgKEZtYWt1bmJvdW5kLCBGZm1ha3VuYm91bmQpOiBJbXByb3ZlIGRvYyBzdHJpbmdzLgot LS0KIHNyYy9kYXRhLmMgfCAxNCArKysrKysrKysrKy0tLQogMSBmaWxlIGNoYW5nZWQsIDExIGlu c2VydGlvbnMoKyksIDMgZGVsZXRpb25zKC0pCgpkaWZmIC0tZ2l0IGEvc3JjL2RhdGEuYyBiL3Ny Yy9kYXRhLmMKaW5kZXggYmNlMmU1M2NmYi4uZTdiOWU3NGEzMCAxMDA2NDQKLS0tIGEvc3JjL2Rh dGEuYworKysgYi9zcmMvZGF0YS5jCkBAIC02OTUsOCArNjk1LDEyIEBAIERFRlVOICgiZmJvdW5k cCIsIEZmYm91bmRwLCBTZmJvdW5kcCwgMSwgMSwgMCwKIH0KIAogREVGVU4gKCJtYWt1bmJvdW5k IiwgRm1ha3VuYm91bmQsIFNtYWt1bmJvdW5kLCAxLCAxLCAwLAotICAgICAgIGRvYzogLyogTWFr ZSBTWU1CT0wncyB2YWx1ZSBiZSB2b2lkLgotUmV0dXJuIFNZTUJPTC4gICovKQorICAgICAgIGRv YzogLyogTWFrZSB2YXJpYWJsZSBTWU1CT0wncyB2YWx1ZSBiZSB2b2lkLgorUmV0dXJuIFNZTUJP TC4KKworRm9yIG1vcmUgaW5mb3JtYXRpb24sIHNlZSBJbmZvIG5vZGUgYChlbGlzcCkgVm9pZCBW YXJpYWJsZXMnLgorCitUaGUgY29ycmVzcG9uZGluZyBvcGVyYXRpb24gZm9yIGZ1bmN0aW9ucyBp cyBgZm1ha3VuYm91bmQnLiAgKi8pCiAgIChyZWdpc3RlciBMaXNwX09iamVjdCBzeW1ib2wpCiB7 CiAgIENIRUNLX1NZTUJPTCAoc3ltYm9sKTsKQEAgLTcwOCw3ICs3MTIsMTEgQEAgREVGVU4gKCJt YWt1bmJvdW5kIiwgRm1ha3VuYm91bmQsIFNtYWt1bmJvdW5kLCAxLCAxLCAwLAogCiBERUZVTiAo ImZtYWt1bmJvdW5kIiwgRmZtYWt1bmJvdW5kLCBTZm1ha3VuYm91bmQsIDEsIDEsIDAsCiAgICAg ICAgZG9jOiAvKiBNYWtlIFNZTUJPTCdzIGZ1bmN0aW9uIGRlZmluaXRpb24gYmUgbmlsLgotUmV0 dXJuIFNZTUJPTC4gICovKQorUmV0dXJuIFNZTUJPTC4KKworRm9yIG1vcmUgaW5mb3JtYXRpb24s IHNlZSBJbmZvIG5vZGUgYChlbGlzcCkgRnVuY3Rpb24gQ2VsbHMnLgorCitUaGUgY29ycmVzcG9u ZGluZyBvcGVyYXRpb24gZm9yIHZhcmlhYmxlcyBpcyBgbWFrdW5ib3VuZCcuICAqLykKICAgKHJl Z2lzdGVyIExpc3BfT2JqZWN0IHN5bWJvbCkKIHsKICAgQ0hFQ0tfU1lNQk9MIChzeW1ib2wpOwot LSAKMi4yNi4yCgo= --00000000000084f11005a4aaa020-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 10:03:33 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 14:03:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53542 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsjt-00069i-FM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:03:33 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:52842) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsjs-00069X-GQ for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:03:32 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:57962) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsjn-00026F-45; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:03:27 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=3367 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsjk-0001yx-IL; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:03:25 -0400 Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 17:03:16 +0300 Message-Id: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Sat, 2 May 2020 15:53:37 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 15:53:37 +0200 > > DEFUN ("makunbound", Fmakunbound, Smakunbound, 1, 1, 0, > - doc: /* Make SYMBOL's value be void. > -Return SYMBOL. */) > + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. > +Return SYMBOL. > + > +For more information, see Info node `(elisp) Void Variables'. > + > +The corresponding operation for functions is `fmakunbound'. */) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ The "corresponding" part isn't accurate, is it? Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 10:17:14 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 14:17:14 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53559 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsx8-0008K7-36 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:17:14 -0400 Received: from ted.gofardesign.uk ([67.225.143.91]:39502) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsx6-0008F4-Mj for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:17:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=marxist.se; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=66eLMspgmbJbV52N7IU7+Dl5z7VLG1p/lW2ekVKa5Jg=; b=CizW8lxDs3GYx+RPD8r/pS4iIe 0sQK4KRzudLKonnzSNHAIJENWGri6DTb/f6NOjxdQwCySlG2vleXEcfwFCY63izaRVBYZ3ma+h0vc Y8Zv1JZqVCzx32tvtJTg3+X5UheKJ71f7OSWbrz7J95rJN8G+bzEKGNmcnBbHwHXqMqCu0DuDhE0g 3YEsUy2ZU96Dwe7ozJhxZGX5lLCid39uS07HohmhScJYLszpGtJGu1L6cYC0V4vmDRKVbxWx8+EuF uLW7Dm5o/SOWzZ+xN7Ryxvq+wqiZbd+xabUJwM69/Hx5zofiE9kp/MQTEx+Ea00sCZkzMaUuqK/Ow h/azKiYA==; Received: from h-4-70-69.a785.priv.bahnhof.se ([155.4.70.69]:45712 helo=localhost) by ted.gofardesign.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1jUsx1-001Aff-2w; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:17:07 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' In-Reply-To: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 02 May 2020 17:03:16 +0300") References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 16:17:04 +0200 Message-ID: <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ted.gofardesign.uk X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - marxist.se X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: ted.gofardesign.uk: authenticated_id: stefan@marxist.se X-Authenticated-Sender: ted.gofardesign.uk: stefan@marxist.se X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Stefan Kangas >> Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 15:53:37 +0200 >> >> DEFUN ("makunbound", Fmakunbound, Smakunbound, 1, 1, 0, >> - doc: /* Make SYMBOL's value be void. >> -Return SYMBOL. */) >> + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. >> +Return SYMBOL. >> + >> +For more information, see Info node `(elisp) Void Variables'. >> + >> +The corresponding operation for functions is `fmakunbound'. */) > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > The "corresponding" part isn't accurate, is it? Sorry, I thought it was. But my understanding of this is probably much too naive. Would we avoid the inaccuracy by deleting the word "corresponding"? Thank you for reviewing. Best regards, Stefan Kangas From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 10:22:59 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 14:22:59 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53592 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUt2g-0000Hx-V1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:22:59 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:59728) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUt2c-0000Hi-2r for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:22:57 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:58474) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUt2W-0003PK-3P; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:22:48 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4574 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jUt2V-00068v-A3; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:22:47 -0400 Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 17:22:39 +0300 Message-Id: <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> (message from Stefan Kangas on Sat, 02 May 2020 16:17:04 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 16:17:04 +0200 > > >> +The corresponding operation for functions is `fmakunbound'. */) > > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > The "corresponding" part isn't accurate, is it? > > Sorry, I thought it was. But my understanding of this is probably > much too naive. > > Would we avoid the inaccuracy by deleting the word "corresponding"? I'd just say "See also `fmakunbound'". And the same in the fmakunbound doc string. Btw, why the link to the manual? Does the manual say something important that the doc strings don't? If it does, perhaps we should make the laconic doc string slightly more elaborate? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 10:55:14 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 14:55:14 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53664 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUtXu-0003Ds-Hb for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:55:14 -0400 Received: from mail-out.m-online.net ([212.18.0.9]:55010) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUtXs-0003Dj-M1 for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 10:55:13 -0400 Received: from frontend01.mail.m-online.net (unknown [192.168.8.182]) by mail-out.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49Dsbz1vJVz1qs04; Sat, 2 May 2020 16:55:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (dynscan1.mnet-online.de [192.168.6.70]) by mail.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49Dsbz0RD9z1qqkR; Sat, 2 May 2020 16:55:11 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mnet-online.de Received: from mail.mnet-online.de ([192.168.8.182]) by localhost (dynscan1.mail.m-online.net [192.168.6.70]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vV8Hwe4xAa6N; Sat, 2 May 2020 16:55:10 +0200 (CEST) X-Auth-Info: La1ztcZ1GKR3jTyvUFtXUmvqSqJCYKbwpKNCtb2SHiX4XKbcEv//QDYoUllxImKt Received: from igel.home (ppp-46-244-183-134.dynamic.mnet-online.de [46.244.183.134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.mnet-online.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Sat, 2 May 2020 16:55:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: by igel.home (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 39ACE2C0E5A; Sat, 2 May 2020 16:55:09 +0200 (CEST) From: Andreas Schwab To: Stefan Kangas Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: X-Yow: Look into my eyes and try to forget that you have a Macy's charge card! Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 16:55:09 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Sat, 2 May 2020 15:53:37 +0200") Message-ID: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) On Mai 02 2020, Stefan Kangas wrote: > + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. What's a variable symbol? Is that the same as a varying symbol? Andreas. -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 11:00:13 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 15:00:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53680 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUtcj-0003NV-Jw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:00:13 -0400 Received: from ted.gofardesign.uk ([67.225.143.91]:45654) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUtch-0003MI-Ru for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:00:12 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=marxist.se; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=sn/5N/zIShuCjD+rVSmUlGLDy/6CmywLtxQ6pGxOWdE=; b=F4Ml9nGKBmfPuZwUN2XL3IBgVN 8aT/mdbjhZiRf7kRCn1hUqh7/S7thbW+dyXFYI3Xrn1L3kOb6gGP3e4RgqcFA55eBFEylAOcBSi9M Ci+ogJApN3NcO1LKg99030Y8SYtIs3IuMa5iKQRdanBJ+edpjfKy7D9FjGN3diafQ3s4WGqWfq0kX 0bWPEA4Qq1OZnHyeVPshmL54drRBGGjuXE7C0L5KtWcWREZRUuaOaTkj2f4Zxkqr6t7ZuCEBwlY6D fQtkD4TXiK4a8MdixqOm13Z0KbiazQMY/YnXI0eqNM7f56pRUgw6j+rSmGbktS22mrgJuybCeHmlm N//zJUZg==; Received: from h-4-70-69.a785.priv.bahnhof.se ([155.4.70.69]:47802 helo=localhost) by ted.gofardesign.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1jUtca-001IsQ-TJ; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:00:05 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas To: Andreas Schwab Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' In-Reply-To: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> (Andreas Schwab's message of "Sat, 02 May 2020 16:55:09 +0200") References: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 17:00:02 +0200 Message-ID: <87lfma4c25.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ted.gofardesign.uk X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - marxist.se X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: ted.gofardesign.uk: authenticated_id: stefan@marxist.se X-Authenticated-Sender: ted.gofardesign.uk: stefan@marxist.se X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Andreas Schwab writes: > On Mai 02 2020, Stefan Kangas wrote: > >> + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. > > What's a variable symbol? Is that the same as a varying symbol? The sentence is a bit unwieldy to get right, if you also want to include the word "variable". Is this clearer? "Make the value of the variable named SYMBOL be void." Best regards, Stefan Kangas From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 11:41:35 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 15:41:36 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53719 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUuGl-0004Lw-N1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:41:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:57624) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUuGk-0004Lk-H3 for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:41:34 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:60262) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jUuGe-0007Up-Q1; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:41:28 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=1383 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jUuGZ-0003DQ-4R; Sat, 02 May 2020 11:41:28 -0400 Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 18:41:15 +0300 Message-Id: <83d07ms5t0.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <87lfma4c25.fsf@stefankangas.se> (message from Stefan Kangas on Sat, 02 May 2020 17:00:02 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> <87lfma4c25.fsf@stefankangas.se> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org, schwab@linux-m68k.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 17:00:02 +0200 > Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org > > Andreas Schwab writes: > > > On Mai 02 2020, Stefan Kangas wrote: > > > >> + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. > > > > What's a variable symbol? Is that the same as a varying symbol? > > The sentence is a bit unwieldy to get right, if you also want to > include the word "variable". Is this clearer? > > "Make the value of the variable named SYMBOL be void." I think the ELisp manual gets it right: Empty out the value cell of SYMBOL, making it void as a variable. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 16:22:40 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 20:22:40 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54003 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUyel-0003P2-T5 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 16:22:40 -0400 Received: from userp2130.oracle.com ([156.151.31.86]:42802) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUyei-0003Op-Sr for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 16:22:38 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (userp2130.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp2130.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 042KJhiG106139; Sat, 2 May 2020 20:22:31 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : cc : subject : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2020-01-29; bh=E6zXm/1wVydaby2o4Xk4OzuA7BAB+CoK+V6n799mGUU=; b=GArZRZUigvDB4kYD7nUm00Ao6uMJanuGCoIR5fg0UHV7YxRc1GHOEdspNPv1S2R9szhw 3A6IOpfnBXf9oAgvqdoKyGUSlmrwvplso5BOFPDHoTET2CKPQUlhasgn1kiYY8JGwVbF xXltpsf0T+RC7joRu0MZl1yxp9nJJwTPaAb5Mq3OuxiI56oKCWN1HdVYpxkfpmKuFprQ yL6bM+8fefN8BAU4a4XpmQeY6r37TQWcWK2rwFijMa3d+Nwm/1HRDcdAyVWbcN9imUj6 edxIL45L5BirUGUSTA5OvxetypfKWYyQWYgU/WcevFJcuWmQawSo26H1aLZ3s8gldwtj bQ== Received: from userp3030.oracle.com (userp3030.oracle.com [156.151.31.80]) by userp2130.oracle.com with ESMTP id 30s09qsu0k-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 02 May 2020 20:22:30 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (userp3030.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp3030.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 042KHWY1187493; Sat, 2 May 2020 20:22:30 GMT Received: from aserv0122.oracle.com (aserv0122.oracle.com [141.146.126.236]) by userp3030.oracle.com with ESMTP id 30rwysp6bv-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 02 May 2020 20:22:30 +0000 Received: from abhmp0014.oracle.com (abhmp0014.oracle.com [141.146.116.20]) by aserv0122.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id 042KMTJA001744; Sat, 2 May 2020 20:22:29 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <94e71619-9d25-4155-b7da-1e51b4852f08@default> Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 13:22:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams To: Andreas Schwab , Stefan Kangas Subject: RE: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> In-Reply-To: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4993.0 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9609 signatures=668687 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 mlxlogscore=706 bulkscore=0 phishscore=0 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2003020000 definitions=main-2005020178 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9609 signatures=668687 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 bulkscore=0 mlxscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 clxscore=1011 suspectscore=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=755 phishscore=0 impostorscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2003020000 definitions=main-2005020178 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > > + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. >=20 > What's a variable symbol? Is that the same as a varying symbol? Make SYMBOL's value as a variable be void. or Make SYMBOL's `symbol-value' be void. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 16:26:08 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 20:26:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54008 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUyi7-0003Uh-Ek for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 16:26:07 -0400 Received: from ted.gofardesign.uk ([67.225.143.91]:32908) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUyi5-0003UC-Fh for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 16:26:05 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=marxist.se; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=uKy38kPxde/gLWn26FSxkWNqXPGRJ+jhfMA1e5cjc98=; b=QVcnXH8K22V5KKrebIIXedmso+ xbUvecjAELpW2MguABf0V28tHpYHQSkb3TrQMNBfttbIZx3GDaf2XLDbsmit8SnipIgZ63oU5DzkQ 9+N3zoG89JBur3GKlWofVBGVTTdxIdAWbOwmi3MMmnadcavlZayk/qmER/n0Iy80p/7pko3VbaIee eeASVrbXsycG0/N9xjluUZ3O8plPlrFZ18onUMKGBe/PWtsHGhDgND91+3tXdUsVf+gsl9hZjOpmH 6EQpF8VXO1stvADSwq9twy+Jlm4dinkikFlgM55KMCJScXpnGvog64NJRyTqYorH5Gx3EQCLhHwi9 qnjAIMRQ==; Received: from h-4-70-69.a785.priv.bahnhof.se ([155.4.70.69]:51234 helo=localhost) by ted.gofardesign.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1jUyhz-000O9H-HY; Sat, 02 May 2020 16:25:59 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' In-Reply-To: <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 02 May 2020 17:22:39 +0300") References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 22:25:57 +0200 Message-ID: <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-=" X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ted.gofardesign.uk X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - marxist.se X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: ted.gofardesign.uk: authenticated_id: stefan@marxist.se X-Authenticated-Sender: ted.gofardesign.uk: stefan@marxist.se X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Eli Zaretskii writes: > I'd just say "See also `fmakunbound'". And the same in the > fmakunbound doc string. > > Btw, why the link to the manual? Does the manual say something > important that the doc strings don't? If it does, perhaps we should > make the laconic doc string slightly more elaborate? Thanks. Based on your feedback, this is what I came up with. WDYT? --=-=-= Content-Type: text/x-diff Content-Disposition: inline; filename=0001-Improve-doc-strings-of-makunbound-and-fmakunbound.patch >From bdd0f8bc5dbcb74fb7f61b786c9fd0e2c2468d80 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Stefan Kangas Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 15:51:31 +0200 Subject: [PATCH] Improve doc strings of makunbound and fmakunbound * src/data.c (Fmakunbound, Ffmakunbound): Improve doc strings. (Bug#41026) --- src/data.c | 20 ++++++++++++++++---- 1 file changed, 16 insertions(+), 4 deletions(-) diff --git a/src/data.c b/src/data.c index bce2e53cfb..1db0a983b4 100644 --- a/src/data.c +++ b/src/data.c @@ -695,8 +695,14 @@ DEFUN ("fboundp", Ffboundp, Sfboundp, 1, 1, 0, } DEFUN ("makunbound", Fmakunbound, Smakunbound, 1, 1, 0, - doc: /* Make SYMBOL's value be void. -Return SYMBOL. */) + doc: /* Empty out the value cell of SYMBOL, making it void as a variable. +Return SYMBOL. + +If a variable is void, trying to evaluate the variable signals a +`void-variable' error, instead of returning a value. For more +details, see Info node `(elisp) Void Variables'. + +See also `fmakunbound'. */) (register Lisp_Object symbol) { CHECK_SYMBOL (symbol); @@ -707,8 +713,14 @@ DEFUN ("makunbound", Fmakunbound, Smakunbound, 1, 1, 0, } DEFUN ("fmakunbound", Ffmakunbound, Sfmakunbound, 1, 1, 0, - doc: /* Make SYMBOL's function definition be nil. -Return SYMBOL. */) + doc: /* Make SYMBOL's function definition be void. +Return SYMBOL. + +If a function definition is void, trying to call a function by that +name will cause a `void-function' error. For more details, see Info +node `(elisp) Function Cells'. + +See also `makunbound'. */) (register Lisp_Object symbol) { CHECK_SYMBOL (symbol); -- 2.26.2 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable BTW, according to (elisp) Function Cells: Note that void is not the same as =E2=80=98nil=E2=80=99 or the symbol = =E2=80=98void=E2=80=99. The symbols =E2=80=98nil=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98void=E2=80=99 are Lisp objects= , and can be stored into a function cell just as any other object can be (and they can be valid functions if you define them in turn with =E2=80=98defun=E2=80=99). A vo= id function cell contains no object whatsoever. So I suppose that means that the old `fmakunbound' docstring was incorrect in saying: "Make SYMBOL's function definition be nil."? Best regards, Stefan Kangas --=-=-=-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 17:12:19 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 21:12:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54044 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUzQp-0006nI-I3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 17:12:19 -0400 Received: from mail-out.m-online.net ([212.18.0.9]:51221) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUzQo-0006nA-8T for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 17:12:18 -0400 Received: from frontend01.mail.m-online.net (unknown [192.168.8.182]) by mail-out.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49F1z506bmz1qrfP; Sat, 2 May 2020 23:12:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (dynscan1.mnet-online.de [192.168.6.70]) by mail.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49F1z45cykz1qrhc; Sat, 2 May 2020 23:12:16 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mnet-online.de Received: from mail.mnet-online.de ([192.168.8.182]) by localhost (dynscan1.mail.m-online.net [192.168.6.70]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WL15xZH5W13O; Sat, 2 May 2020 23:12:16 +0200 (CEST) X-Auth-Info: UsITcXQwAgOfCMimpTZVzCRecV7aEgh8Z0ippRZwS7mEaTVfH8YwiO6V0KBaM5A3 Received: from igel.home (ppp-46-244-183-134.dynamic.mnet-online.de [46.244.183.134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.mnet-online.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Sat, 2 May 2020 23:12:15 +0200 (CEST) Received: by igel.home (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 6C0EB2C0E5A; Sat, 2 May 2020 23:12:15 +0200 (CEST) From: Andreas Schwab To: Stefan Kangas Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> X-Yow: OMNIVERSAL AWARENESS?? Oh, YEH!! First you need 4 GALLONS of JELL-O and a BIG WRENCH!!... I think you drop th'WRENCH in the JELL-O as if it was a FLAVOR, or an INGREDIENT... ...or...I...um... WHERE'S the WASHING MACHINES? Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 23:12:15 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> (Stefan Kangas's message of "Sat, 02 May 2020 22:25:57 +0200") Message-ID: <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) Why do these unimportant functions that almost nobody needs require such elaborate doc strings? Andreas. -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 17:31:19 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2020 21:31:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54058 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUzj3-0007MU-3c for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 17:31:19 -0400 Received: from ted.gofardesign.uk ([67.225.143.91]:41444) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jUziy-0007Lx-UI for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 17:31:07 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=marxist.se; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=LBuu2qYwt1GAVfh8mlXXG1gFZNugYPijK57sx93x7EI=; b=QY2GnlvNWt6vtP0bobuyfMfEAv IQId6ZJw8jlat8o3JnlPa1xoB0JIrqtY8miuIhpzCNOJyOlKXU57UVLhFlv5x5VGjiOM3iAGRVYix kHQlIsYRgQ15wXrQg+EWtyaDEFjv7cBpHkdk4tHZrj8n2VZXitWmY5d6km/jFAYc5thVym7KN75M1 qnOIhhA1RkIog5SmaPVYZI5tnA6hltbEQV1PdPm+5ZSBPnMrgPtwt4kNaqsLCu2MNUjVYWSscvHoj abjed2fo6OX8ZgB1ifY/fADaLAd1Ys7H28UElrHPrTPiEmHO7Jd6Yiro/BxnYnawsnr3mGZKoPCiC iGxmxZYg==; Received: from h-4-70-69.a785.priv.bahnhof.se ([155.4.70.69]:49214 helo=localhost) by ted.gofardesign.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1jUzir-000a2n-FP; Sat, 02 May 2020 17:30:57 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas To: Andreas Schwab Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' In-Reply-To: <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> (Andreas Schwab's message of "Sat, 02 May 2020 23:12:15 +0200") References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 23:30:55 +0200 Message-ID: <87zhaq2fe8.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ted.gofardesign.uk X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - marxist.se X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: ted.gofardesign.uk: authenticated_id: stefan@marxist.se X-Authenticated-Sender: ted.gofardesign.uk: stefan@marxist.se X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Andreas Schwab writes: > Why do these unimportant functions that almost nobody needs require such > elaborate doc strings? I don't think I follow. What is your objection? Best regards, Stefan Kangas From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat May 02 23:43:37 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 May 2020 03:43:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54434 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jV5XV-0006NP-Cj for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 23:43:37 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:34358) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jV5XT-0006ND-Jq for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 May 2020 23:43:35 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:44732) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jV5XO-0006YD-7b; Sat, 02 May 2020 23:43:30 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jV5XM-0001jC-CN; Sat, 02 May 2020 23:43:28 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Andreas Schwab In-Reply-To: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> (message from Andreas Schwab on Sat, 02 May 2020 16:55:09 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <87d07ms7xu.fsf@igel.home> Message-Id: Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 23:43:28 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org, stefan@marxist.se X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > + doc: /* Make variable SYMBOL's value be void. > What's a variable symbol? That is a grammatical misparsing. That sentence does not talk about a "variable symbol". It talks about a variable, and SYMBOL stands for that variable. It is like "the buffer BUF". Would it be clearer to say "Make the variable VAR's value be void" and call the argument 'var'? -- Dr Richard Stallman Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 03 10:21:34 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 May 2020 14:21:34 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57533 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFUr-0001zV-VT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:21:34 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33778) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFUl-0001zC-2U for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:21:32 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:53466) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFUf-0001gE-Po; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:21:21 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4369 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jVFUd-0000VA-3v; Sun, 03 May 2020 10:21:20 -0400 Date: Sun, 03 May 2020 17:21:14 +0300 Message-Id: <83368hqeud.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> (message from Stefan Kangas on Sat, 02 May 2020 22:25:57 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 02 May 2020 22:25:57 +0200 > > Thanks. Based on your feedback, this is what I came up with. WDYT? LGTM, thanks. > BTW, according to (elisp) Function Cells: > > Note that void is not the same as ‘nil’ or the symbol ‘void’. The > symbols ‘nil’ and ‘void’ are Lisp objects, and can be stored into a > function cell just as any other object can be (and they can be valid > functions if you define them in turn with ‘defun’). A void function > cell contains no object whatsoever. > > So I suppose that means that the old `fmakunbound' docstring was > incorrect in saying: "Make SYMBOL's function definition be nil."? I think it just said what it did in a confusing way. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 03 16:08:08 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 May 2020 20:08:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58077 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVKuG-0006h2-Mi for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 16:08:08 -0400 Received: from ted.gofardesign.uk ([67.225.143.91]:38514) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVKuF-0006gc-7B; Sun, 03 May 2020 16:08:07 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=marxist.se; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=tQFBkIGxxt0M300FnisdeCp97sI0cW0D/m6tOdP8qd8=; b=CuwCk6g3kptDJyaRAlVISO/Y/K iOB5c4w4n/saJQwjihfLNvEkqbKHqLoqKiDEEMgl+2F3VRbpX4X4rcjN6+tdsCCfCmcDBgZyISRZW sYL+7xGay6lpEIMGK4355tVlpcUcrv4qLHJ1yzZ1jPSMat1+NBp7KE9JUnAUXc+5Rp1aqdZRPw1Yb y/oF8xyELCxsQ+g1J2keHPd8M6tNU19wZhAR+6a6qrqPrG7yert1z6bk6s14RaHfp9/G11VQBBa3d S9kTfsIAmTxwZEs0bXinxpQxxpVxA6/n+d0mVp6uLGKMPLXDz6HTAxPSC7J89Rb1I0P2hTO+gJ1sy 1NlOud6w==; Received: from h-4-70-69.a785.priv.bahnhof.se ([155.4.70.69]:59312 helo=localhost) by ted.gofardesign.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1jVKu9-000ib2-Ch; Sun, 03 May 2020 16:08:01 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' In-Reply-To: <83368hqeud.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 03 May 2020 17:21:14 +0300") References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83368hqeud.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Sun, 03 May 2020 22:07:58 +0200 Message-ID: <87pnbk234x.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ted.gofardesign.uk X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - marxist.se X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: ted.gofardesign.uk: authenticated_id: stefan@marxist.se X-Authenticated-Sender: ted.gofardesign.uk: stefan@marxist.se X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) close 41026 27.1 thanks Eli Zaretskii writes: > LGTM, thanks. Thanks, pushed to emacs-27 as commit f9fa726ced. Best regards, Stefan Kangas From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 03 23:06:50 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 May 2020 03:06:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58714 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVRRR-0002Lz-SP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 23:06:50 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:59492) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVRRQ-0002Lm-2p for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 23:06:48 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:43947) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVRRK-00034g-PB; Sun, 03 May 2020 23:06:42 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jVRRH-0008Qf-1k; Sun, 03 May 2020 23:06:39 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Andreas Schwab In-Reply-To: <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> (message from Andreas Schwab on Sat, 02 May 2020 23:12:15 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> Message-Id: Date: Sun, 03 May 2020 23:06:39 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org, stefan@marxist.se X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > Why do these unimportant functions that almost nobody needs require such > elaborate doc strings? So that those people who may want to use them, even if they are few, can be sure of how to use them. The cost of writing full and clear doc strings is some work, but once that work is done, it costs nothing to have them in the source files. -- Dr Richard Stallman Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 04 03:31:27 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 May 2020 07:31:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58888 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVVZX-0000Yt-D8 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 03:31:27 -0400 Received: from mail-out.m-online.net ([212.18.0.10]:50184) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVVZV-0000Yj-Ln for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 03:31:26 -0400 Received: from frontend01.mail.m-online.net (unknown [192.168.8.182]) by mail-out.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49Fvg005H8z1sCwL; Mon, 4 May 2020 09:31:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (dynscan1.mnet-online.de [192.168.6.70]) by mail.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49Fvfz46X2z1r5Qh; Mon, 4 May 2020 09:31:23 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mnet-online.de Received: from mail.mnet-online.de ([192.168.8.182]) by localhost (dynscan1.mail.m-online.net [192.168.6.70]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oVN80gQ42W1Q; Mon, 4 May 2020 09:31:22 +0200 (CEST) X-Auth-Info: iFcgWxbAvaS5B9K8haVUZkBmKs0n2korK/WodtnWTEm4aahJ0GfP7dFdE2c6euft Received: from igel.home (ppp-46-244-166-96.dynamic.mnet-online.de [46.244.166.96]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.mnet-online.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Mon, 4 May 2020 09:31:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: by igel.home (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 455D32C0B3F; Mon, 4 May 2020 09:31:22 +0200 (CEST) From: Andreas Schwab To: Richard Stallman Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> X-Yow: So this is what it feels like to be potato salad Date: Mon, 04 May 2020 09:31:22 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Sun, 03 May 2020 23:06:39 -0400") Message-ID: <87y2q840mt.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org, stefan@marxist.se X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.5 (-) On Mai 03 2020, Richard Stallman wrote: > So that those people who may want to use them, even if they are few, > can be sure of how to use them. They are even documented in the manual. What makes them so special? Andreas. -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 04 08:52:48 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 May 2020 12:52:49 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59251 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVaaW-0004VW-LC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 08:52:48 -0400 Received: from ted.gofardesign.uk ([67.225.143.91]:55532) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVaaV-0004VI-Aj for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 08:52:47 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=marxist.se; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=bTipK5cHiCNvPQ/9qvN57YYIBX+rvSylHlKaLuwaYCc=; b=atJnwlDL90xF2JIELivRvOO2qR lyrUJruH1c4R2XQ4G1dsvfc0bDG4TBYwH+IRUe+cDKALwD8J0JE32hSlM7l4aoPdOFfBMKS88r4lo R8RCqnNM5yTksjAXvh7UKRZn4W/4SFmB6p7sdc1Shebx7TWHT/P/IHamJyODimbCirrscc9SPDxup 6Km56wI7sTMe7bUhYQ2nQIM1ChLEBAmndgttMuIpPbNfADO3VvA+5fhoP0c6e8L3vAUBYeH6iM2ri ezdDC8d8/0Oo0ERtWUzFiVLlg9wulEn2ZhTdNfycu6YTZ2IE1zaf2lAsXvq+XXI/qQXDnbX2r/Kik p60RtlyQ==; Received: from h-4-70-69.a785.priv.bahnhof.se ([155.4.70.69]:56560 helo=localhost) by ted.gofardesign.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1jVaaN-001pqq-BE; Mon, 04 May 2020 08:52:39 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas To: Andreas Schwab Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' In-Reply-To: <87y2q840mt.fsf@igel.home> (Andreas Schwab's message of "Mon, 04 May 2020 09:31:22 +0200") References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> <87y2q840mt.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Date: Mon, 04 May 2020 14:52:37 +0200 Message-ID: <87h7wvyi96.fsf@stefankangas.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - ted.gofardesign.uk X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - marxist.se X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: ted.gofardesign.uk: authenticated_id: stefan@marxist.se X-Authenticated-Sender: ted.gofardesign.uk: stefan@marxist.se X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Andreas Schwab writes: > On Mai 03 2020, Richard Stallman wrote: > >> So that those people who may want to use them, even if they are few, >> can be sure of how to use them. > > They are even documented in the manual. What makes them so special? They are occasionally useful. I'm not sure that makes them special. But again, I'm not sure what you are saying. Are you proposing to remove them from the ELisp manual? Best regards, Stefan Kangas From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon May 04 09:05:31 2020 Received: (at 41026) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 May 2020 13:05:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59267 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVamp-0004pa-MU for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 09:05:31 -0400 Received: from mail-out.m-online.net ([212.18.0.10]:34413) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jVamn-0004pP-4d for 41026@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 May 2020 09:05:30 -0400 Received: from frontend01.mail.m-online.net (unknown [192.168.8.182]) by mail-out.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49G34R4DL1z1sB1L; Mon, 4 May 2020 15:05:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (dynscan1.mnet-online.de [192.168.6.70]) by mail.m-online.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49G34R1JF0z1r5Qk; Mon, 4 May 2020 15:05:27 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mnet-online.de Received: from mail.mnet-online.de ([192.168.8.182]) by localhost (dynscan1.mail.m-online.net [192.168.6.70]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AfN0pBKS6awu; Mon, 4 May 2020 15:05:26 +0200 (CEST) X-Auth-Info: aGMKpUyBzNKQbNTiup63f4wwNNs/cBTNZ3ZGbtTA35kpJlslWKmuW/fXbK/nkBrl Received: from igel.home (ppp-46-244-166-96.dynamic.mnet-online.de [46.244.166.96]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.mnet-online.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Mon, 4 May 2020 15:05:26 +0200 (CEST) Received: by igel.home (Postfix, from userid 1000) id CEED22C0B3F; Mon, 4 May 2020 15:05:25 +0200 (CEST) From: Andreas Schwab To: Stefan Kangas Subject: Re: bug#41026: Improve documentation of `makunbound' and `fmakunbound' References: <83sggisacb.fsf@gnu.org> <87pnbm4e1r.fsf@stefankangas.se> <83o8r6s9g0.fsf@gnu.org> <87a72q3wyy.fsf@stefankangas.se> <878siarqhc.fsf@igel.home> <87y2q840mt.fsf@igel.home> <87h7wvyi96.fsf@stefankangas.se> X-Yow: ..I'll make you an ASHTRAY!! Date: Mon, 04 May 2020 15:05:25 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87h7wvyi96.fsf@stefankangas.se> (Stefan Kangas's message of "Mon, 04 May 2020 14:52:37 +0200") Message-ID: <87pnbj4zqi.fsf@igel.home> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 41026 Cc: 41026@debbugs.gnu.org, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) On Mai 04 2020, Stefan Kangas wrote: > They are occasionally useful. I'm not sure that makes them special. There are many functions that are occasionally useful. Why do these two need special care? Andreas. -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." From unknown Wed Sep 10 20:08:05 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2020 11:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator