From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Nov 08 22:18:52 2019 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Nov 2019 03:18:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48038 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTHH2-00066v-9v for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 22:18:52 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:42674) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTHGz-00066m-UF for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 22:18:50 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38935) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iTHGy-0000sZ-UX for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 22:18:49 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iTHGx-0000Qt-OA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 22:18:48 -0500 Received: from relayout01.e.movistar.es ([86.109.101.201]:57637 helo=relayout01-redir.e.movistar.es) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iTHGx-0000Kq-HP for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 22:18:47 -0500 Received: from sky (233.red-79-151-7.dynamicip.rima-tde.net [79.151.7.233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: 981711563@telefonica.net) by relayout01.e.movistar.es (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4792R65mTFzfZv0 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2019 04:18:42 +0100 (CET) From: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar_Fuentes?= To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:18:41 +0100 Message-ID: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-CTCH-Score: 0.000 X-CTCH-ScoreCust: 0.000 X-TnetOut-Country: IP: 79.151.7.233 | Country: ES X-TnetOut-Information: AntiSPAM and AntiVIRUS on relayout01 X-TnetOut-MsgID: 4792R65mTFzfZv0.AF0ED X-TnetOut-SpamCheck: no es spam, Unknown X-TnetOut-From: ofv@wanadoo.es X-TnetOut-Watermark: 1573874323.06155@+FTS3ytd9UWhbypGrZ/oDA X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 86.109.101.201 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Currently de docstrings of those variables do not mention that they are not invoked for the initial frame. Adding that detail is trivial, except that when the initial frame belongs to a daemon they are invoked. I'm not sure how to word that information. In GNU Emacs 27.0.50 (build 3, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit) of 2019-11-09 built on sky Repository revision: f8284f1e408b38e6a3c0e2a1d5a465fefac6800a Repository branch: master Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12004000 System Description: Debian GNU/Linux bullseye/sid From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 09 04:01:47 2019 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Nov 2019 09:01:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48147 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTMct-0006bZ-1F for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:01:47 -0500 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.21]:57831) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTMcq-0006bI-5S for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:01:45 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1573290093; bh=uBzSUOvBTEc3dNIFq4dDZjR6LEpza7OtY0WuqtiwQJA=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=L1pzSnkSQxl2FEEZkdYau4lnKhWTLz4vW3KIqXqrmY9lmrK+fzUcfqhEZ86yrfXVE ve0WeqWbYKWdXYFgb03W4dF36+RmkphKX5Z3P1hU348pcJIYGJFGE4ZAKpj7nliRe5 mfNv/jmPVzlYAxcSyah2eEffwsIT4OunhpmvckF8= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.1.102] ([46.125.249.42]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1Mv31c-1hcUzF1b96-00qygw; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 10:01:33 +0100 Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame To: =?UTF-8?Q?=c3=93scar_Fuentes?= , 38143@debbugs.gnu.org References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> From: martin rudalics Message-ID: Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2019 10:01:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: de-AT Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:14YJDx03pSAuanbUezEgN3XofNIsMvmPoe/jJehypqNBaontg0B rr691vQHE7YzFhyP5NwJv7lqwZgJ/BjlFvAriQXasYy9aHJqK/8S8pPbgcvO6bUgnC9Br+p lNgOvQT07bW/2B0EaoYtFLDYfTA32lXgCH3LeWHA/5NRrt12JAgbwU6mIwu+W1k36bSqn4p 7vHp9e0o0PwYsfjmD/Jcw== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:0SDfOwgbim0=:8z4Ko/MqeF/Bu7ZVBbbJ49 BYhdZCNeNVA8BLq60g4Vt41fJFQH0/lcU+SM4o4Z2xAr3pRXgUMHOJi5oYjEsbgfPfnI4NcTo CTCJfwvknMEaj0PjhfPxiWAKubC9zSNq5OV9Ml3hwB0dCqJHl20AC/QE9L79uhINh+eu8CMxQ gkGwFasLSZoraOJ+gxIFoL4X8MGIT2Ug10uYnZLemtv31fSEem4+wyRikG1jIK+QDEs0vdD53 klEeZMZ1eHuFwuNDElRap0VMC8lVZVQAZYyeRtpgtu5Hxw3cVueWqLZyn+YqeqM9+SKXlLEUm UEmtfxK84sxvZFOPYk9dt8wRh9eT53RB9uIeO8l6EwiNq/pqtmmO42jSeywpsM8rIQ3yza6hS NupJ2n3d8wV45CWEeyd8ISFbvgPhJZ6aECW2XA6wF+8zApW6lstyUBwW4G+m13nPF5rVQXKpl dyifFAKn8luNoADem2Kt8qvrAqjxlDssnmgdCKAitIDsJoHwOv3/utTBAAgd6S+iZ4S+n4xK7 LGUDkRGXEKg9owvp9ZWJA9MQbu92mpZPnX8kJNY5ItrZCWuRwDTRev7Tq4wOS/OFyVbfL0wvC y0mmKcgpaMtd9TN+jOupPo06pHLZSAZ8apbzX7KeGgBO3Iimr48RjjO1trZTJHpiPJqBB4rbh I2QY9v8xuadUD5BYJdWJl2AgbjBMNZ5bV6CWRU9LDZWFxT+XjIiwJFWgAtLdEfr324noHR2DT ElZl+xjBTICMRVh/h6LkzR/pgu120UiZ0XAqwy1pLgsQ1YSHJGGKxX+GySAdDhAHJnNmq0fuv fSMTqq0wd/sC/kEB4fzVEQ8JWRS72wLMqihR0phM9x4si8djrliK+erGWiuv52+JSKClTzN+m Klh3oX8VecUHmrdCuvGot4DBMWHu5YFAqpq9nFG/d3egngVqigIYCJzPZ6/Klo6GXGt6ifVxP f5zpE6oeNACcbOtW+7W5eYCEXawutUXq+8iA8P1QcUO3ptUEvqH5uf532s9ON8SRXevg+pEX8 cffdFv8GIUOVihj3hjfxXRocrtGaXGKWDg+wn97puR7hYqld+iOXkKGUWW/o2pMOBEPYdhE3r h3piRS7gFKM7bh92BgNYxlywyV86rTS7/d8koYV9xPOXL+fe5jJL5Jyy8CxL2nVtJT3gP57Je 8K+Z17dAplNQgLAd/bPODnbdWcC972XMUyE/4x3mX7qxuye0etrq0zu5JR7r4MJr5K9FaVhyd n8km+yUR4IPcz78qR9B+JuiaIxlJTIdsdH6HXlA== X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > Currently de docstrings of those variables do not mention that they are > not invoked for the initial frame. Adding that detail is trivial, except > that when the initial frame belongs to a daemon they are invoked. > > I'm not sure how to word that information. The reason is that the initial frame is not made by 'make-frame'. The Elisp manual says Note that any functions added to these hooks by your initial file are usually not run for the initial frame, since Emacs reads the initial file only after creating that frame. However, if the initial frame is specified to use a separate minibuffer frame (*note Minibuffers and Frames::), the functions will be run for both, the minibuffer-less and the minibuffer frame. This explanation is slightly misleading: Since the initial frame is not created by 'make-frame', Emacs would not run these hooks even if it did read the initial file earlier. Hints for improving the documentation are welcome. martin From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 09 04:27:45 2019 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Nov 2019 09:27:45 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48206 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTN20-0007IP-UR for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:27:45 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:34048) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTN1y-0007IC-SL for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:27:43 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:37167) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iTN1t-0005bT-E6; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:27:37 -0500 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4167 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1iTN1s-0008Ai-Gy; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 04:27:37 -0500 Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2019 11:27:29 +0200 Message-Id: <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: martin rudalics In-reply-to: (message from martin rudalics on Sat, 9 Nov 2019 10:01:34 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: martin rudalics > Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2019 10:01:34 +0100 > > Note that any functions added to these hooks by your initial file are > usually not run for the initial frame, since Emacs reads the initial > file only after creating that frame. However, if the initial frame is > specified to use a separate minibuffer frame (*note Minibuffers and > Frames::), the functions will be run for both, the minibuffer-less and > the minibuffer frame. > > This explanation is slightly misleading: Since the initial frame is > not created by 'make-frame', Emacs would not run these hooks even if > it did read the initial file earlier. But without an init file, where would the hooks come from? And anyway, the issue is probably only meaningful for users who define these hooks in init files. So I think the only missing piece in the above is to mention the daemon case. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Nov 09 12:21:54 2019 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Nov 2019 17:21:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50222 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTUQp-0006wM-VV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 12:21:54 -0500 Received: from relayout04-redir.e.movistar.es ([86.109.101.204]:46111) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTUQn-0006w8-Ug for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 12:21:50 -0500 Received: from sky (233.red-79-151-7.dynamicip.rima-tde.net [79.151.7.233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: 981711563@telefonica.net) by relayout04.e.movistar.es (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 479P7m6KJ7z11M5; Sat, 9 Nov 2019 18:21:40 +0100 (CET) From: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar_Fuentes?= To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2019 18:21:40 +0100 In-Reply-To: <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 09 Nov 2019 11:27:29 +0200") Message-ID: <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-CTCH-Score: 0.000 X-CTCH-ScoreCust: 0.000 X-TnetOut-Country: IP: 79.151.7.233 | Country: ES X-TnetOut-Information: AntiSPAM and AntiVIRUS on relayout04 X-TnetOut-MsgID: 479P7m6KJ7z11M5.A6911 X-TnetOut-SpamCheck: no es spam, Unknown X-TnetOut-From: ofv@wanadoo.es X-TnetOut-Watermark: 1573924903.29088@sCNuny0g9t3A6EFF7s06Hg X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: martin rudalics , 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> Note that any functions added to these hooks by your initial file are >> usually not run for the initial frame, since Emacs reads the initial >> file only after creating that frame. However, if the initial frame is >> specified to use a separate minibuffer frame (*note Minibuffers and >> Frames::), the functions will be run for both, the minibuffer-less and >> the minibuffer frame. >> >> This explanation is slightly misleading: Since the initial frame is >> not created by 'make-frame', Emacs would not run these hooks even if >> it did read the initial file earlier. > > But without an init file, where would the hooks come from? > > And anyway, the issue is probably only meaningful for users who define > these hooks in init files. So I think the only missing piece in the > above is to mention the daemon case. Please note that Martin is referring to the manual, not to the docstrings. Although mentioning the daemon case on the manual would be nice too. IMO the missing information on the docstrings is: 1. The hooks are not run for the initial frame because it is not created with `make-frame'. 2. Except when Emacs runs as daemon, in that case make-frame is always used and therefore the hooks are executed. The added text would be something like this: When Emacs is not executed as a daemon, `make-frame` is not used for creating the initial frame, therefore the hooks are not invoked on that case. Or this: `make-frame` is not used for the frame that is automatically created before the init file is processed, therefore the hooks are not invoked for that frame. Please note that when Emacs is executed as a daemon there is no such frame. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Nov 10 04:46:01 2019 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Nov 2019 09:46:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50609 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTjnF-00005T-Eh for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 04:46:01 -0500 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.21]:60147) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iTjnD-00004y-Pq for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 04:46:00 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1573379149; bh=T9dOOAls4IEJ2qop7yP/1sQNDzskrb2y458i1VvX/JQ=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=UmZnjnoYRfaQaGarIbHq33v3T22rZubmfMXKxyViufQsS3k3RxThVsucw5+yHgAkr Lwm6Yvl4nYu9/2v0Kf2UZZ6aZka22tqgLbmAUWYnH3Tnwcpf/yCI6ZwQs4S8Ht9v4U Mt3XN649B0eJxprI8tz28BOxow9oPiQuKURMM5fI= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.1.102] ([46.125.249.100]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx104 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1M8hZJ-1iXqWr3bu5-004mNI; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:45:49 +0100 Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame To: Eli Zaretskii References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> From: martin rudalics Message-ID: <95e91f77-c045-d3c3-e7e2-3de6cbe9d734@gmx.at> Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:45:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: de-AT Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:KWlt/CkaUbtvW9vq8DyWutztxDh9jws7v0nsTBY5cdR7Z+BM1tI Nwf+zoRNAMzmgonX7XlHLmFLRC79IbS1A4Oax9IJCr7idA9EC95Kcw2zzftdFvdU6rdZ4uo 3eWye9HB11QjSlSX5pEUo3BgDjPffWXCupVQKOz3zhKxo0XYajEhqoBnh3JkHIrmn8CFlbD Bhk0KEyJvQF5TIBwSeEBw== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:Tbrzq+Oam8E=:wAOsfDfCI0KldjXGR7yxF1 EW+VwI/Yb6ZvZEwwblCk97f9pYDJsavMKaQEZXhI5YcX3gGBYrY532h7xpczgUopitdG2oG30 q9aFp3DVLukBprUiAlPCwnrwWXCcPvYI1dF+JyDWF3H33WNNulR0HlUeFJEoY+ZLfEqp7pxvZ YGd9l00L1JZ3pCZ3oIlN8gtLsFXOnWUHujSdUz/iv2pNAGkAKf463GNDNPaNyzVgwyHJzVq9g Pu+07jDPHgjCJx/lsd+892FZ0BpXkRdocp97ymYh1vt03Kq6OKy1ky/3mSF6u0W2zOYoOFKB5 FpOQFIjN6g5f3RHIuzPLvBbtCjs5vW3Hcokx6tIJrcJY5MDdPFXMDQXTGCSTIlRWynuS+GTN0 y9223zVvThpHrhBhPlk3WJx7/hSLOMk4MS5UnJfbfWN+3yG0es2DLyYVI0qVe8JbYweHVxcvt 1B7mccAW5pjoCXp2lpYTpIAwhzb4/hsvem+WsCrqtzBH8Z2mcQGHIKf29+TuwDzn04p4q/+V5 VNcujZfgD9rlhYHo4pNlk5q1i/YPvdQAwz+QG28Y0fXvv91WJ8h2cmaxI6I79WatrChbapKP4 YxitsghDB6b7aLwxA+BF7bBP00b6Ivfgy785zJmjlnZBlH8UU9yEhIaXY7wj5zxq7Bu8ziDJr Y8hc1eXsHMP4uUHZVPVssjoxxuuDr9KOcj/x04J+ULO+tWkmIx8j1gcaQdKi1IjDimMs09Kxb gAkY+pQvMNGAzXBgZrHlRLfUbt2aAQW0YKoZx2Xa8GSg5I9nircRSa/8H6aKMniK8mLxCfU4f M2e9QrDLs52nnFLMaOg8Rhbea7p8A/OQl6qCiOy/KwhT6yvX8WY3cKEKfdah/iGDMOF43aCnU QR72HFou7n2wworxmFnRfjKqIyameNC7GRkJTSHZ5G0Nny5prl06NXvzZgv2QjrNxFFqEh9A6 Jd04yRuogFczdq6+bgu2hJ70ISjHGjla+z4UXjpzQeVRuxVld49kdjwLGUCNv41klNpUu8CNf Tp1zWooSAB4FAx+o8DMWHLOzqL2gZ+SLJFuUdY//0epK/EUo6dLRlUv/jMi4jCeUQTDCEiO6e cr238XnNKN+utMc9K+OnRJaVPxFpMeHLWJC3grlUZbah24B6WGOI9C16wAg5XN75DphGsbsRQ qey8n6YlDuJoNekebROVacvgJnOngJoSL93RSNuok880sOVEpz+iH7/hnq7AnZyelqg/Ca7y+ t+SUuOsLoLZvxSZ+NRWfXfTysqVmaoxsVRJ1C2PiEHLO7yGETajqhAk1yai4= X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > But without an init file, where would the hooks come from? From an early-init file. IIUC that file is read before the initial frame is created. martin From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Nov 14 04:47:15 2019 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Nov 2019 09:47:16 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60950 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iVBia-0007vA-Pz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 04:47:15 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:56777) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iVBiY-0007ux-Lz for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 04:47:11 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:47219) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iVBiS-0004zx-Qx; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 04:47:04 -0500 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4413 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1iVBiR-0001DN-LT; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 04:47:04 -0500 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2019 11:46:47 +0200 Message-Id: <83tv767ptk.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: martin rudalics In-reply-to: <95e91f77-c045-d3c3-e7e2-3de6cbe9d734@gmx.at> (message from martin rudalics on Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:45:50 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <95e91f77-c045-d3c3-e7e2-3de6cbe9d734@gmx.at> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org > From: martin rudalics > Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:45:50 +0100 > > > But without an init file, where would the hooks come from? > > From an early-init file. IIUC that file is read before the initial > frame is created. I'm not sure I understand how this scenario affects the issue at hand in any significant manner. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Nov 14 04:59:20 2019 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Nov 2019 09:59:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60973 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iVBuK-0008EA-1o for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 04:59:20 -0500 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.21]:56729) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1iVBuI-0008Dm-9X for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 04:59:18 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1573725549; bh=eqFF16ziWrLxsPvlXaMAytzepSex1KpemwlBG2Hq+C0=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=I1WDyASaziSkwyn8gC0gFt6faqZEAM9y/kYfLuqr+VqOvP0gev2XHeLFPK8W6for1 2vwIeVYgZ6g+8TrIuf9DvhrKvDXn5ATvNmf342+kTzxL3/lo7Y4Vj8LwpqKuevBv0B a05Uu0lKpq6HxXLQgq7JoMi6t6eb6NQwztmOVCi4= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.1.102] ([46.125.249.17]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MoO6C-1i77cT2i8e-00opAo; Thu, 14 Nov 2019 10:59:09 +0100 Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame To: Eli Zaretskii References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <95e91f77-c045-d3c3-e7e2-3de6cbe9d734@gmx.at> <83tv767ptk.fsf@gnu.org> From: martin rudalics Message-ID: <2b07e963-d740-c430-e932-d96dac7c033d@gmx.at> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2019 10:59:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <83tv767ptk.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: de-AT Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:2EkUEhLlkXfNkiA4isqux+AD81yypIJNGDtc5Xc4z+bLkgJm1RF HBvNEfaQGKHqVLxomo+k0ZKp9mvJJzeZOrkKz2AEEWZD40cjkNMrwsxUN+DLDs52569jdVh VVjyDcXVYk+tS/CBxxUU14MNrHOcNvt7tBpKMh26AWKU4hQnsfohgqYVSbgqzzme11s29l2 DXJWsf4KtpeX7bv3WZVIQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:nU8sdH36IR8=:JcCuvU1A9t4GOtAyifYAML Yoa35iGTQyyp/7BOcMTX1w7aVoK0AXcJmBVPdjz/5DKU6aDh7XYGsdvIhNhfh5B2yy7Wx9s4Z IDSm/Y+pCpxhvapUxEJrXgE0bjKKJJVM05xWQQ8WSwD/kgoLm7lh8hFUKeEksI/hEwoX4TaIj m8jCGeUFEamnar1uQQ0WkGxeVn6rrAeDpYaoHTM1S3KSip7tROMP5g+WTS9rCIwf3j8486e4w qGEQ1EenuA/hmBpLOU7zJCcSRyGiDvRhHdAM4g19ZKr6Mf/tI6BQRyqCTHfQze0M7tD+cIEWy 9Lt6l/oBchjYOP3LNZCCrxub4oTFEOn9zc0qZNUzuuxcrDOCnVB+pU2H06cwTKRva0GXi6Do/ tx4j31GoV8OphlQS3MgRur2G+3n+KNfiM5qJ9Zy00LnqPkyxFvSvzk5ZQwk8YSnhYEnykclS4 wEEkGKPHSaO4W6lqusXGABzRb6k7iSceBm/VNG9S4TlMcHaiIjXH5k4I8m5ln+fsXshwfF44H Oi2+bdVHm81WhWDm+xAw/WcgBytEXKYTNslcMbd+Vg6kjsRr2tp7dC6J1dVSj5tzKycFX184/ mz6rhwJ3CExOOkiC1D0GLpznavz41ounI4a3teE6OLbMeOrllrD5ZeIh83Vv28QlMJhi9CoUc tg0UkNmRCA9oc9kgJfLOpg9PPKPS+7s2NTlpLJo6B3ctjkP3xirnUTwLEf+TVhWJzLEY6kO4V OauAZDC6FHTGUUItiVFd4Dx9zivsL9LbJIs78EJbuPKI0vnyVJG5TFafTPohGtCgRs3IGz+VN KiGECxBY0WEVXAqO9niAPv7dAwrIbr9XcfD2b5jzylahLIvKb4LhI1GJ9/GkJxD85zIvfACnw vBv7Yxz75yuThP742Mtx0gt4/pJlZGUbdhveOJkw5VaVNY9FXJEqf8rH/1cNNJp5D+yku1JlL 9fNY8ynlbl93moPasHi/MaDU6vkj4Y8R5mazpVPk8Yt6axQhw9JP2/6YEnWDvr0lw5bPIwyQK FH6I1faiZ8Hls8HxnNDLJzftW9HVdjRkPHmxg0O8jJVCExm8kVAosTxmVqgzYuROrBC+xRdty tRD9Lz7ig0iani0yoySvzRrO72jmvxPoCIdWq6oI77XD8J+/79Pg8DX/5b5g/FVKqePGynF+W 64J6sUFdDDSJHvWRfTx2SkrBrUy2ijNtbZzPdr6tgneZdsJk4t3tGLKi/904hpNJINNllS2d0 GLeeBq8tG9KBGkPlHEJoDMNdm9IA34im1O4kOsDCOjVWHmxFH4VrcnV0KYiY= X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > I'm not sure I understand how this scenario affects the issue at hand > in any significant manner. It doesn't. It's a related issue I noticed when reading the manual. martin From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 04 22:13:23 2021 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2021 03:13:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55933 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mthxr-00039J-AI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 22:13:23 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:45180) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mthxp-000393-Kq for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 22:13:22 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID :In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=CAhbWsFZfScBy8MdI+V84gSh91m0J0q8pp4JrlOB0Ts=; b=aplWp/txiUrFTiI2eMvWIAOL9/ gU1XUYu+XIKNEKkHw/irQAw5sLWkXraqPQ/8e8nKbeUDQlbKyYOa28XSfVEPAYwW0aSDBmOpQpur3 /qtQVN+msbXkUvD7PDSdS0RHAKHkpZFlEi8mOqYgm5pT0+Ea6az/B1nWqX2KNpVGMTYA=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mthxf-0003aD-Ux; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:13:14 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar?= Fuentes Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> X-Now-Playing: Pink Floyd's _Animals_: "Sheep" Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:13:11 +0100 In-Reply-To: <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> (=?utf-8?Q?=22=C3=93scar?= Fuentes"'s message of "Sat, 09 Nov 2019 18:21:40 +0100") Message-ID: <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Óscar Fuentes writes: > 1. The hooks are not run for the initial frame because it is not created > with `make-frame'. > > 2. Except when Emacs runs as daemon, in that case make-frame is always > used and therefore the hook [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: martin rudalics , Eli Zaretskii , 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) =C3=93scar Fuentes writes: > 1. The hooks are not run for the initial frame because it is not created > with `make-frame'. > > 2. Except when Emacs runs as daemon, in that case make-frame is always > used and therefore the hooks are executed. > > The added text would be something like this: > > When Emacs is not executed as a daemon, `make-frame` is not used for > creating the initial frame, therefore the hooks are not invoked on > that case. > > Or this: > > `make-frame` is not used for the frame that is automatically created > before the init file is processed, therefore the hooks are not invoked > for that frame. Please note that when Emacs is executed as a daemon > there is no such frame. I've now added something like this to Emacs 29. --=20 (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 04 22:13:27 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2021 03:13:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55936 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mthxv-00039c-Hp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 22:13:27 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:45198) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mthxu-00039B-5m for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 22:13:26 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=19qd8swLQXEmloM7MRJiG2Xh6Ieo7f6F5SMev7YBizk=; b=WrV231EimiZfzvU1eHlgKt5y9V 0PIEWB6VgnYezpNcpdQJkMm2F9WXPG/OYNhDgLpU+qZvPcVL4g+byv3Rk/YhMwhWQD6G22hwv89m/ 1yJEmTxrVBBlCYJAwFk95pMdecgjr+JQ8QUzMdsPqlkElTNdDeWxMlEogZN0LaQirrpg=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mthxm-0003aM-6R for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:13:20 +0100 Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:13:17 +0100 Message-Id: <87czmbu4ky.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #38143 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: close 38143 29.1 quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) close 38143 29.1 quit From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 05 04:47:16 2021 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2021 09:47:16 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56369 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mto72-00045d-Cm for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:47:16 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:42748) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mto70-00045M-OW for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:47:15 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=35568 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mto6u-0008Kp-Iq; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:47:08 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=yjEpGeZNemtiBm+4AXEZuZP5C9t4Yjit4uapqzS9Utw=; b=jwyS5ym0v9+RGPVUHsiH J9Bth3zR7UyRDKtjPfweoA1qapH7n0QTshPdiKlinx/3lwJA/HbM/C+HFNnwiaKLYqVtYcCjeySzy 0BcP4JmaBTjALX4OA2cqf1XBkCo0mMBa+g4DNaAid63BUPIWwyE/Rc4DCNwbR5zjWNXn4lH37uxej rZa8Ir0FD4vIB8Rlv3O0QD/AjH0Z2S9J4bGONywVzcdD9miRz8xVFbQANIx4rrkCwv/qv9/BjPjOS BzBT2wOUgMR1vewTEBE+xZeoPlL5b+i5S0ZJ5h5uflbTZy2iZZwNqmwJczP2o/m0PFbMHcXTAlRA5 TmSNDR1qIPgxkA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4508 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mto6t-0007Rl-VB; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:47:08 -0500 Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 11:47:00 +0200 Message-Id: <83bl1v4c4r.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:13:11 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, rudalics@gmx.at, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , martin rudalics , > 38143@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 04:13:11 +0100 > > Óscar Fuentes writes: > > > 1. The hooks are not run for the initial frame because it is not created > > with `make-frame'. > > > > 2. Except when Emacs runs as daemon, in that case make-frame is always > > used and therefore the hooks are executed. > > > > The added text would be something like this: > > > > When Emacs is not executed as a daemon, `make-frame` is not used for > > creating the initial frame, therefore the hooks are not invoked on > > that case. > > > > Or this: > > > > `make-frame` is not used for the frame that is automatically created > > before the init file is processed, therefore the hooks are not invoked > > for that frame. Please note that when Emacs is executed as a daemon > > there is no such frame. > > I've now added something like this to Emacs 29. Bother: (defvar before-make-frame-hook nil - "Functions to run before `make-frame' creates a new frame.") + "Functions to run before `make-frame' creates a new frame. +Note that these functions are usually not run for the initial +frame, except when the initial frame is created from an Emacs +daemon.") (defvar after-make-frame-functions nil "Functions to run after `make-frame' created a new frame. The functions are run with one argument, the newly created -frame.") +frame. + +Note that these functions are usually not run for the initial +frame, except when the initial frame is created from an Emacs +daemon.") The new text is incorrect -- assuming that by "initial frame" the doc strings mean what we usually mean by that: the first frame displayed by a GUI Emacs session (see "Frame Parameters" in the user manual, and cf. initial-frame-alist). You can put a breakpoint on Frun_hooks and on Frun_hook_with_args, run Emacs, and see that both of these hooks _are_ called during startup. And the reason is simple: we do create that "initial frame" via make-frame, see frame-initialize. Perhaps the bug report was using "initial frame" in another sense: to allude to the frame we create in temacs, which is a terminal frame, normally deleted when a GUI session starts, except in a daemon, which keeps it. But in that case, these changes will confuse the heck out of the users who will read them and try to figure out how to use this information. We should in that case explain in the doc strings which "initial frame" we allude to here. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 05 15:17:21 2021 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2021 20:17:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59606 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mtxwm-00088J-TM for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 15:17:21 -0500 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:55676) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mtxwl-00082p-NZ for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 15:17:20 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=dlHBPVGvREQyyQdh3qr1ItNlVySJYF/mHr+0LlfR2ic=; b=tJtyjb8yknM0sOAmjEcEHiDmGs Wx11ezUkTFuhBXQ6TSAW5E7ppqLrALKJoKIPYmq+IBw3+rjL5PCxUjvaIfm/yM+RD2K2YO8I+M2qR WwYZ8FJHLLUuKr6Q1BULufjmfWOxtWa36AEdN3D+SXHUXJw6JnfcfFhEkR5EtnB2/w6c=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mtxwU-0002aY-BF; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 21:17:08 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> <83bl1v4c4r.fsf@gnu.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwAgMAAAAqbBEUAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAADFBMVEUmIiSMfHPIwr// ///XfD68AAAAAWJLR0QDEQxM8gAAAAd0SU1FB+UMBRMvJqYCnRsAAAGPSURBVCjPRdFBa6NAFAfw l1KH6MmCKepJignqp3BDG8KeTFGpPZlFhySfws0hbHMyIUrrKQYDOp9ynTG2c5of/5nHezwAmKtW rRZRAvTMeasWSJTeMPkUiBG2VxuGCq5/IONVC+2GPzXamD0u9cxSpG/4E0Vm1Rjw72GPBuE9/53c rfcvHYwW9X72g8/dlkE2LtHg33HbJxF8XLZ2h6MOX8sDg2QetQHR06RDrklYP9+w0yVs9MjNNX4L HQrRzK0m/tAZNL3YuKsvo0f8Vy7YqKCFTQVyrnRYBCkMXwUG0ePPwD/NJJYEoxOgyW7eYVECsrbP FOPGPwBSpvcUavayhJHnMSjXaZk8ZSZHwV1f63B5eJ9S3JF0gJ6VIqdAxAX/hEhD0S7KsU6P5I2h iVMhfSQVQ3A9ocQnZwreKzMhCQhbKsrLbPbL6yD4ZbEYeBv2R30PC4dbWyxRg2UWcat2DtpbIHoV RDHD2JViByrMno1BenAWFWYFrnD/YCN3lFFkYEsguCKbxwUYiYpjc/Afhu+BQQa9QocAAAAldEVY dGRhdGU6Y3JlYXRlADIwMjEtMTItMDVUMTk6NDc6MzgrMDA6MDCFwShyAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOm1v ZGlmeQAyMDIxLTEyLTA1VDE5OjQ3OjM4KzAwOjAw9JyQzgAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: Peter Gabriel's _Peter Gabriel 2_: "Perspective" Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 21:17:01 +0100 In-Reply-To: <83bl1v4c4r.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 05 Dec 2021 11:47:00 +0200") Message-ID: <87fsr6q01u.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > The new text is incorrect -- assuming that by "initial frame" the doc > strings mean what we usually mean by that: the first frame displayed > by a GUI Emacs session (see "Frame Parameters" in the u [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, rudalics@gmx.at, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > The new text is incorrect -- assuming that by "initial frame" the doc > strings mean what we usually mean by that: the first frame displayed > by a GUI Emacs session (see "Frame Parameters" in the user manual, and > cf. initial-frame-alist). OK; reverted. Has this changed since the bug was reported? > Perhaps the bug report was using "initial frame" in another sense: to > allude to the frame we create in temacs, which is a terminal frame, > normally deleted when a GUI session starts, except in a daemon, which > keeps it. But in that case, these changes will confuse the heck out > of the users who will read them and try to figure out how to use this > information. We should in that case explain in the doc strings which > "initial frame" we allude to here. I think we need some input from the bug reported about what they meant by "initial frame" here. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 05 15:21:29 2021 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2021 20:21:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59636 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mty0n-00008L-72 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 15:21:29 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:60322) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mty0k-000087-JV for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 15:21:27 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=49148 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mty0e-0007Wc-MX; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 15:21:20 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=yxAw6ZuUFJnX0ycMnLVYvcaoP5Sx3wwEqsCfw3BWw8Q=; b=QNBADOgKqB2y ECyjrICeSHBi7Oiy0JyVzBc8UQM74ky4saXR4KZFEIYdeuNN0jKkP8NXI6h1AUqcHM+7xcDjb05o0 sfQOstrhdZJI6hKSSLsXM1vPcF3/v4LPQR1x0klzNnLiWcaSFJhpJBLkQOxQ7vU5NNgKo0MUC6YQW joXnxFsm4EVouarnaeinDHjP6LgHgtezvOqL0NM8nOSE55BAY0MM63/gtNcMRp3E4hl/+7+33OfFW A8Mtm/8herjaH1bgECWXn7uq4zcG45JrA9ELl/YiBZgqKfKZzkMORP4zbi1NiKDhhNwRlWH21Q4lw F3P2XeGwClgUd7m85t+Lyg==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4292 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mty0e-00082T-EM; Sun, 05 Dec 2021 15:21:20 -0500 Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 22:21:16 +0200 Message-Id: <83bl1u3irn.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87fsr6q01u.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sun, 05 Dec 2021 21:17:01 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> <83bl1v4c4r.fsf@gnu.org> <87fsr6q01u.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, rudalics@gmx.at, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: ofv@wanadoo.es, rudalics@gmx.at, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2021 21:17:01 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > The new text is incorrect -- assuming that by "initial frame" the doc > > strings mean what we usually mean by that: the first frame displayed > > by a GUI Emacs session (see "Frame Parameters" in the user manual, and > > cf. initial-frame-alist). > > OK; reverted. Has this changed since the bug was reported? The only relevant change I know of is that we now have early-init file, which means users can set up these hooks there, and have them run when the initial frame is created. > > Perhaps the bug report was using "initial frame" in another sense: to > > allude to the frame we create in temacs, which is a terminal frame, > > normally deleted when a GUI session starts, except in a daemon, which > > keeps it. But in that case, these changes will confuse the heck out > > of the users who will read them and try to figure out how to use this > > information. We should in that case explain in the doc strings which > > "initial frame" we allude to here. > > I think we need some input from the bug reported about what they meant > by "initial frame" here. Indeed. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Dec 06 18:23:01 2021 Received: (at 38143) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Dec 2021 23:23:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35658 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1muNK0-0006Hj-PA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Dec 2021 18:23:01 -0500 Received: from relayout02-redir.e.movistar.es ([86.109.101.202]:53401) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1muNJy-0006HT-HK for 38143@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Dec 2021 18:22:59 -0500 Received: from sky (234.red-88-17-68.dynamicip.rima-tde.net [88.17.68.234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: 981711563@telefonica.net) by relayout02.e.movistar.es (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4J7KGg0wZDzddtH; Tue, 7 Dec 2021 00:22:50 +0100 (CET) From: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=93scar_Fuentes?= To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> <83bl1v4c4r.fsf@gnu.org> <87fsr6q01u.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Tue, 07 Dec 2021 00:22:50 +0100 In-Reply-To: <87fsr6q01u.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sun, 05 Dec 2021 21:17:01 +0100") Message-ID: <871r2pb9o5.fsf@telefonica.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-TnetOut-Country: IP: 88.17.68.234 | Country: ES X-TnetOut-Information: AntiSPAM and AntiVIRUS on relayout02 X-TnetOut-MsgID: 4J7KGg0wZDzddtH.A9789 X-TnetOut-SpamCheck: no es spam, clean X-TnetOut-From: ofv@wanadoo.es X-TnetOut-Watermark: 1639437771.84321@qGF5IR+kTNUtpb8ohlIp2A X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143 Cc: rudalics@gmx.at, Eli Zaretskii , 38143@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Eli Zaretskii writes: > >> The new text is incorrect -- assuming that by "initial frame" the doc >> strings mean what we usually mean by that: the first frame displayed >> by a GUI Emacs session (see "Frame Parameters" in the user manual, and >> cf. initial-frame-alist). > > OK; reverted. Has this changed since the bug was reported? > >> Perhaps the bug report was using "initial frame" in another sense: to >> allude to the frame we create in temacs, which is a terminal frame, >> normally deleted when a GUI session starts, except in a daemon, which >> keeps it. But in that case, these changes will confuse the heck out >> of the users who will read them and try to figure out how to use this >> information. We should in that case explain in the doc strings which >> "initial frame" we allude to here. > > I think we need some input from the bug reported about what they meant > by "initial frame" here. I just tested with master and, indeed, the hook is executed. However, to be effective for all invocations of make-frame the user must add the function early enough (which means `early-init.el`.) When emacs.el is processed it is too late as the initial frame (the frame created by simply invoking emacs without parameters) already exists. Maybe we could expand the docstrings of the hooks and/or make-frame to note that you need early-init.el if you want your hooks executed when the initial frame is created. Otherwise, this bug can remain closed. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Dec 07 12:58:41 2021 Received: (at 38143-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Dec 2021 17:58:41 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38557 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1muejg-0006eF-Rq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Dec 2021 12:58:41 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:54506) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1muejf-0006e0-2p for 38143-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Dec 2021 12:58:40 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=51592 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1muejZ-0005I8-59; Tue, 07 Dec 2021 12:58:33 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=yaPlasYkqJ09oyWejGYhXCVI5nn1TvlnvE/n/xftIWM=; b=C9i+K16el4D4I0CjI48Q uZo+XHRpGrmyKLy6uqdVgrj3SDFSXLtopsAV2MEqfBFTiZlA+4NYWzI44N4UgYv7oX7tf1qSbgGnJ m+xTiuKwAGJAMGoummobT3TBxj2yiP+LZ6nj1DImKOmha7kI8GpvXJ68169U0aNZqxdCvN+asJVZ5 lb8PMrfSOmsMJe9lnyrzMyCM/2Ncg72GIQlQoPH5iLHPrgzKg8eM8bPAjdTBt4VEYPqDW6fbmMaQJ 6hg6ij1Xqu55YTpyrqLbAjnj/1BcRiz7q8eoFb5lOZopTNGkRMqapxLAxOP6O1PTrJ/D4ahvlwpgE 7+0Hr+m+oND1Sw==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=2300 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1muejY-0008Gz-QW; Tue, 07 Dec 2021 12:58:33 -0500 Date: Tue, 07 Dec 2021 19:58:33 +0200 Message-Id: <83r1aoxpo6.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=D3scar?= Fuentes In-Reply-To: <871r2pb9o5.fsf@telefonica.net> (message from =?iso-8859-1?Q?=D3scar?= Fuentes on Tue, 07 Dec 2021 00:22:50 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#38143: 27.0.50; Say that before-make-frame-hook & after-make-frame-functions are not invoked for the initial frame References: <87mud5ivou.fsf@telefonica.net> <83a7959z7i.fsf@gnu.org> <87imnthsnv.fsf@telefonica.net> <87ee6ru4l4.fsf@gnus.org> <83bl1v4c4r.fsf@gnu.org> <87fsr6q01u.fsf@gnus.org> <871r2pb9o5.fsf@telefonica.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 38143-done Cc: rudalics@gmx.at, larsi@gnus.org, 38143-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Óscar Fuentes > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , rudalics@gmx.at, 38143@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 07 Dec 2021 00:22:50 +0100 > > > I think we need some input from the bug reported about what they meant > > by "initial frame" here. > > I just tested with master and, indeed, the hook is executed. However, to > be effective for all invocations of make-frame the user must add the > function early enough (which means `early-init.el`.) When emacs.el is > processed it is too late as the initial frame (the frame created by > simply invoking emacs without parameters) already exists. > > Maybe we could expand the docstrings of the hooks and/or make-frame to > note that you need early-init.el if you want your hooks executed when > the initial frame is created. > > Otherwise, this bug can remain closed. Done and done. Thanks. From unknown Fri Jun 13 10:35:48 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2022 12:24:06 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator