From unknown Sat Jun 21 12:34:27 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2019 18:59:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 37334 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 37334@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.15678827194231 (code B ref -1); Sat, 07 Sep 2019 18:59:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2019 18:58:39 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38073 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fuw-00016A-3q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:39 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:37309) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fut-00015y-PF for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:36 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49490) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fus-0006W9-KT for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:35 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fur-00024I-6a for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:34 -0400 Received: from aserp2120.oracle.com ([141.146.126.78]:58758) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fuq-0001zF-V5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:33 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp2120.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp2120.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x87IwRFN050412 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2019 18:58:27 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : subject : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2019-08-05; bh=OCVB5V0QGE3cpYBtUixs+pbaOW5UCsjcRM2OkiuKsks=; b=NsEyZSPrz1eUSBVQflKmmJmqTJjKFfMEUR3QBYXY3HjWJJxqSuzQ+4gaUHgv/qvMBhrz SFqL3p1zLAjRt111bcCF37zQUTZ2juE/igncSUwAMnQ0fli6bVECt4BVlGjHWPsTGOvg P/A6AYEQYalj7PXMD5VVPnieh2ReCxeQxpyC3Fg6OdTzEKewoVt1CC6Riqd6s+DJxDGi C8QwfGsMV52G9YBVzNv1cYPaOpKMVGCdefxhKIhpVQQPx91oQxF/yc8+z4mN2KhpVAMc s33+nL3MA082vIqwc0EnyHrGLL/7R9gi9OP87h2E2gfoHWejhZCAgJbbSKsXTjCFEXdK ag== Received: from aserp3030.oracle.com (aserp3030.oracle.com [141.146.126.71]) by aserp2120.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uvj5rg09k-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 18:58:27 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp3030.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp3030.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x87IwQul092708 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2019 18:58:27 GMT Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by aserp3030.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uv2kxg47k-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 18:58:26 +0000 Received: from abhmp0006.oracle.com (abhmp0006.oracle.com [141.146.116.12]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id x87Iw8Ym013872 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2019 18:58:08 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4873.0 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9373 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=1 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=931 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909070205 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9373 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=1 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=998 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909070205 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 141.146.126.78 X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) This paragraph does not belong in the doc string of `backward-word': The word boundaries are normally determined by the buffer's syntax table and character script (according to 'char-script-table'), but 'find-word-boundary-function-table', such as set up by 'subword-mode', can change that. If a Lisp program needs to move by words determined strictly by the syntax table, it should use 'backward-word-strictly' instead. See Info node '(elisp) Word Motion' for details. At most, it should just say "See Info node '(elisp) Word Motion' for information about word syntax and word boundaries" - or just "See Info node '(elisp) Word Motion'". In GNU Emacs 26.3 (build 1, x86_64-w64-mingw32) of 2019-08-29 Repository revision: 96dd0196c28bc36779584e47fffcca433c9309cd Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 10.0.17763 Configured using: `configure --without-dbus --host=3Dx86_64-w64-mingw32 --without-compress-install 'CFLAGS=3D-O2 -static -g3'' From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 07 15:11:08 2019 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2019 19:11:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38079 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g72-0001W6-1s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:08 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43249) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g6z-0001VR-VV; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:06 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36006) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g6u-0007LF-Cr; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:00 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4251 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g6t-00038P-Oc; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:00 -0400 Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2019 22:11:02 +0300 Message-Id: <83sgp753cp.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Drew Adams In-reply-to: (message from Drew Adams on Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: bug#37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' References: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control Cc: 37334-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) tags 37334 notabug thanks > Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT) > From: Drew Adams > > This paragraph does not belong in the doc string of `backward-word': > > The word boundaries are normally determined by the buffer's > syntax table and character script (according to > 'char-script-table'), but 'find-word-boundary-function-table', > such as set up by 'subword-mode', can change that. If a Lisp > program needs to move by words determined strictly by the syntax > table, it should use 'backward-word-strictly' instead. See Info > node '(elisp) Word Motion' for details. I see no reason to claim this "doesn't belong", as it clearly _is_ relevant to word movement. See also bug#22560 for some additional background. From unknown Sat Jun 21 12:34:27 2025 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.505 (Entity 5.505) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: Drew Adams Subject: bug#37334: closed (Re: bug#37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word') Message-ID: References: <83sgp753cp.fsf@gnu.org> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 37334 X-Gnu-PR-Package: emacs X-Gnu-PR-Keywords: notabug Reply-To: 37334@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2019 19:12:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1567883522-5960-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1567883522-5960-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' which was filed against the emacs package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 37334@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 37334: http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D37334 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1567883522-5960-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 37334-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2019 19:11:08 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38081 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g72-0001WA-EA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:08 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43249) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g6z-0001VR-VV; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:06 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36006) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g6u-0007LF-Cr; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:00 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4251 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1i6g6t-00038P-Oc; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 15:11:00 -0400 Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2019 22:11:02 +0300 Message-Id: <83sgp753cp.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Drew Adams In-reply-to: (message from Drew Adams on Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: bug#37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' References: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 37334-done Cc: 37334-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) tags 37334 notabug thanks > Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT) > From: Drew Adams > > This paragraph does not belong in the doc string of `backward-word': > > The word boundaries are normally determined by the buffer's > syntax table and character script (according to > 'char-script-table'), but 'find-word-boundary-function-table', > such as set up by 'subword-mode', can change that. If a Lisp > program needs to move by words determined strictly by the syntax > table, it should use 'backward-word-strictly' instead. See Info > node '(elisp) Word Motion' for details. I see no reason to claim this "doesn't belong", as it clearly _is_ relevant to word movement. See also bug#22560 for some additional background. ------------=_1567883522-5960-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Sep 2019 18:58:39 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38073 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fuw-00016A-3q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:39 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:37309) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fut-00015y-PF for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:36 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49490) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fus-0006W9-KT for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:35 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fur-00024I-6a for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:34 -0400 Received: from aserp2120.oracle.com ([141.146.126.78]:58758) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1i6fuq-0001zF-V5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 14:58:33 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp2120.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp2120.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x87IwRFN050412 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2019 18:58:27 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : subject : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2019-08-05; bh=OCVB5V0QGE3cpYBtUixs+pbaOW5UCsjcRM2OkiuKsks=; b=NsEyZSPrz1eUSBVQflKmmJmqTJjKFfMEUR3QBYXY3HjWJJxqSuzQ+4gaUHgv/qvMBhrz SFqL3p1zLAjRt111bcCF37zQUTZ2juE/igncSUwAMnQ0fli6bVECt4BVlGjHWPsTGOvg P/A6AYEQYalj7PXMD5VVPnieh2ReCxeQxpyC3Fg6OdTzEKewoVt1CC6Riqd6s+DJxDGi C8QwfGsMV52G9YBVzNv1cYPaOpKMVGCdefxhKIhpVQQPx91oQxF/yc8+z4mN2KhpVAMc s33+nL3MA082vIqwc0EnyHrGLL/7R9gi9OP87h2E2gfoHWejhZCAgJbbSKsXTjCFEXdK ag== Received: from aserp3030.oracle.com (aserp3030.oracle.com [141.146.126.71]) by aserp2120.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uvj5rg09k-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 18:58:27 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (aserp3030.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp3030.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x87IwQul092708 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2019 18:58:27 GMT Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by aserp3030.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uv2kxg47k-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 18:58:26 +0000 Received: from abhmp0006.oracle.com (abhmp0006.oracle.com [141.146.116.12]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id x87Iw8Ym013872 for ; Sat, 7 Sep 2019 18:58:08 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4873.0 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9373 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=1 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=931 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909070205 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9373 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=1 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=998 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909070205 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 141.146.126.78 X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) This paragraph does not belong in the doc string of `backward-word': The word boundaries are normally determined by the buffer's syntax table and character script (according to 'char-script-table'), but 'find-word-boundary-function-table', such as set up by 'subword-mode', can change that. If a Lisp program needs to move by words determined strictly by the syntax table, it should use 'backward-word-strictly' instead. See Info node '(elisp) Word Motion' for details. At most, it should just say "See Info node '(elisp) Word Motion' for information about word syntax and word boundaries" - or just "See Info node '(elisp) Word Motion'". In GNU Emacs 26.3 (build 1, x86_64-w64-mingw32) of 2019-08-29 Repository revision: 96dd0196c28bc36779584e47fffcca433c9309cd Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 10.0.17763 Configured using: `configure --without-dbus --host=3Dx86_64-w64-mingw32 --without-compress-install 'CFLAGS=3D-O2 -static -g3'' ------------=_1567883522-5960-1-- From unknown Sat Jun 21 12:34:27 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2019 00:51:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 37334 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: notabug To: Eli Zaretskii , Drew Adams Cc: 37334-done@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 37334-done@debbugs.gnu.org id=D37334.156790385128599 (code D ref 37334); Sun, 08 Sep 2019 00:51:01 +0000 Received: (at 37334-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Sep 2019 00:50:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38254 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6lPm-0007RD-KV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 20:50:50 -0400 Received: from userp2130.oracle.com ([156.151.31.86]:43232) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6lPk-0007Qu-0y for 37334-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 07 Sep 2019 20:50:49 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (userp2130.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp2130.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x880mvaC123926; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 00:50:40 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : cc : subject : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2019-08-05; bh=5IdASh/RRVNudWReqldF7ixOZ+dN+bLkaJA+hv43b9Q=; b=BP4wzZtqlRRg8DDvygQV1V54gFLOzwsg94kj8U9huQB+70vLpoX3N31lzPxkrnkbtrsh Z+6lWYKhg0pFLIMD4n/bUJ3keG+lSH0ehzV1KTXZcLAdDIATv6lWnCYhIFLLvztrDViH +pSl8ZnNdBmnUq/Xoh385J18/vNAVPQk2zdan25oPHJcG+BY0dX6yEjJL0bIiOzjG5L1 0cNRjzFhchUw6Cdg2daJLe7n7242KSCGa1KE0b41aanvBBOkQ2XFKgJ7e5VyihqzifpY COZhrGgfs8rvHeHFauYbrkHZvUOwUGAIGkXnmlb1a0SzPjyp2EJUCJYL6BMU0Qymw7C6 bg== Received: from userp3030.oracle.com (userp3030.oracle.com [156.151.31.80]) by userp2130.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uvqeb8016-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 08 Sep 2019 00:50:40 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (userp3030.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp3030.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x880mnAV042800; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 00:50:40 GMT Received: from userv0121.oracle.com (userv0121.oracle.com [156.151.31.72]) by userp3030.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uve9beg27-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 08 Sep 2019 00:50:40 +0000 Received: from abhmp0006.oracle.com (abhmp0006.oracle.com [141.146.116.12]) by userv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id x880odcE010601; Sun, 8 Sep 2019 00:50:39 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <50180a6f-d4a9-43d3-beb5-82fbe0fcf345@default> Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2019 17:50:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams References: <> <<83sgp753cp.fsf@gnu.org>> In-Reply-To: <<83sgp753cp.fsf@gnu.org>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4873.0 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9373 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=983 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909080005 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9373 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1011 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1909080006 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > I see no reason to claim this "doesn't belong", as it > clearly _is_ relevant to word movement. Lots of things are "relevant to word movement" in some way. That doesn't mean all such things belong in the doc string of `(for|back)ward-word'. And I see no reason why this particular text belongs there. What's a particular reason? > See also bug#22560 for some additional background. I'm aware of that bug. And since you bring it up here... IMHO, it is wrong to suppose, claim, or proclaim in a blanket way that `(for|back)ward-word' should not be used in Lisp code - that they are now only for interactive use. Doing that is a mistake - it goes overboard. AFAICT, the only reason given in that thread for why Emacs should outlaw/prevent non-interactive use of `(for|back)ward-word' was this "because", from Daniel: > Because lots of packages invoke word movement commands > on the user's behalf, expecting that movement happens > by words. That doesn't address code that invokes these commands commands WITHOUT expecting that the movement necessarily happens by "words". That's exactly the case for thing-at-point code. It doesn't care whether `(for|back)ward-word' _actually_ moves by words, subwords, paragraphs, pages, elephants or thermometers. It relies on those functions for their opposite cursor movement, whatever it in fact might be. I see no reason why it shouldn't use them in its Lisp code. Functions `forward-*' and `backward-*' are used in a general, conventional way by thingatpt.el. The correct behavior of its use of such functions does NOT rely on any particular meaning or behavior of "word". IOW, it is _not_ covered by Daniel's "because". The prohibition of non-interactive use is too strong. All that should be said, IIUC, is that code that uses these functions should not count on them moving across what one might think of as "words" (in spite of their names!). IOW, make clear just what the problem is, rather than raling against all non-interactive use. From unknown Sat Jun 21 12:34:27 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#37334: 26.3; doc string of `backward-word' Resent-From: Noam Postavsky Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2019 12:42:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 37334 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: notabug To: Drew Adams Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 37334@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 37334-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B37334.156794646422249 (code B ref 37334); Sun, 08 Sep 2019 12:42:02 +0000 Received: (at 37334) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Sep 2019 12:41:04 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38510 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6wV6-0005mn-Bt for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 Sep 2019 08:41:04 -0400 Received: from mail-io1-f45.google.com ([209.85.166.45]:41498) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1i6wV5-0005mC-6i for 37334@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 Sep 2019 08:41:03 -0400 Received: by mail-io1-f45.google.com with SMTP id r26so22610711ioh.8 for <37334@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 08 Sep 2019 05:41:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=Xfr9Kgwwh2GQAaQav7SIe955DUq0RDUiWgaQnkXs+LU=; b=Ig1FpQqFqiA3Wk/hZqMVNNNFKHuWCg5i+iVMDsomDN4S6jEaZgt4sgLdZ72XnoarMa FmzqLQBgmtWqlcICjTKDcmAWnFpXyaAIIC0ROxK8DKDKXwTgyN5Um5DytXbxR3Dh5kor 16YYstNcnLSjaXge4qM/BzoPPX+z32hVDv9erW6iG1INCyQL+KPMx2kK8EiisH+bj7c8 wCDCEU/+CjolZV/DTR6FYfIAG9HthMD9885DDXev4sD00e+T37aRIakSqTNLbi8uFpSr YiYJPzyZ75OeJN1/lFe0q9gPuB+s1T0OxdLBnYDCoyDL3Q3SUpifJ1eqcQQjQHzp6hBn XOVw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=Xfr9Kgwwh2GQAaQav7SIe955DUq0RDUiWgaQnkXs+LU=; b=Q1aMSYK4w5XvW1aEnuoXI25mdoEBtws/wplOV9zd/6hH3wiO+rID+1wfx5TeLe/4DC 5nEldKEGQmBpryNcEGZMuzc/XxYvkTK13M0tvIC0Xa1v7P+jUL7h5rR08b/avMitRQG5 Mv34VVaJIcXqdqN06magXcmtBuXCTCStLXeKgbELfvaGcLG4wolrnfUskobOBHiGpu3y wmp/ucuBg4a6Tmz6bC8HTK/cdQoZb0KY4u6Mx2PcTTpMZTjD3fMvBZNLP/tyxeRRXkqu SsYJA+QMxUiS9wcb1075tPBuEKi/boGJSWH/0f3FiNruVCObYSW6u/ZJZ7r/mgg4CcXd AkLw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAURa17eztrG5xHHRjeYKxxWJ6qA1yLo4ntqiBqgzr85Tv5VgtYs 5vZd2T1fXL4ajVJ3EiENbNlf4BAx X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyNuQzQuaeHDa4SKgsVWTd1Xfq8p02A2ow+CN30vTsjj75202p6gHNNM3tWa8URUKEy68a8qw== X-Received: by 2002:a02:3f12:: with SMTP id d18mr6618873jaa.39.1567946457326; Sun, 08 Sep 2019 05:40:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minid (cbl-45-2-119-34.yyz.frontiernetworks.ca. [45.2.119.34]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w6sm8864177iob.29.2019.09.08.05.40.56 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Sun, 08 Sep 2019 05:40:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Noam Postavsky References: > <83sgp753cp.fsf@gnu.org>> <50180a6f-d4a9-43d3-beb5-82fbe0fcf345@default> Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2019 08:40:50 -0400 In-Reply-To: <50180a6f-d4a9-43d3-beb5-82fbe0fcf345@default> (Drew Adams's message of "Sat, 7 Sep 2019 17:50:38 -0700 (PDT)") Message-ID: <8736h7arl9.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.3 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Drew Adams writes: > The prohibition of non-interactive use is too strong. There isn't any prohibition in the current docstring, so I don't understand why you feel the need to subject the bug list to this lecture.