From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service Resent-From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2019 10:18:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 36659 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-guix@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.156318583829171 (code B ref -1); Mon, 15 Jul 2019 10:18:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jul 2019 10:17:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46470 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2o-0007aB-HI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:18 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:40933) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2m-0007Ys-NI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33684) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2l-00052Z-O2 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:16 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2k-0003sB-Hg for bug-guix@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:15 -0400 Received: from pelzflorian.de ([5.45.111.108]:34344 helo=mail.pelzflorian.de) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2j-0003rM-VG for bug-guix@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:14 -0400 Received: from pelzflorian.localdomain (unknown [5.45.111.108]) by mail.pelzflorian.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4A910360035 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 12:17:12 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=pelzflorian.de; s=mail; t=1563185832; bh=alanagfnDaz4Gtwm/rVab7GY50zg9M3pNeK6FXoWn0M=; h=Date:From:To:Subject; b=zduj1CM00HhhB3Syb2l8Z/sxDeFU34e2bsOUXStfouf7jbLMkZCBsBWbRUEPAurE5 +UbpdwIr2P3/bbf8sJcErT9lrZhwrDPum4D57KBXpGZBkGvz0qXTeTpwxo0a2JtHX7 H+wDycII7UEu3j7xst5Mw+3OYlVXZoDlPTf/Ruik= Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2019 12:17:11 +0200 From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" Message-ID: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: NeoMutt/20180716 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 5.45.111.108 X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) Some users (want to) forget about regularly upgrading Guix System. There should be an unattended upgrades service. Some requirements come to mind for its configuration: 1) Some users may want their unattended upgrades service to take care just of reconfiguring from a recent checkout and some may want it to take care of updating users=E2=80=99 ~/.config/guix/current and ~/guix-pr= ofile profiles. 2) Maybe there should be libnotify integration for unattended upgrades if the user uses a desktop environment. 3) Updates may fail if there is no internet connection. Some users may *not* want upgrades on metered internet connections. Some users may *not* want upgrades over untrusted connections. This report is a followup to Ludo=E2=80=99s proposal at to add such a service and add it to %desktop-services, making it the default setting. Such a change in defaults could be a bad surprise for some users and should not go unnoticed, I think. Regards, Florian From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service Resent-From: Matthew Brooks Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 07:30:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 36659 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-guix@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.156326217416104 (code B ref -1); Tue, 16 Jul 2019 07:30:01 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2019 07:29:34 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49574 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnHu2-0004Bf-Dm for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 03:29:34 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:56141) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnHtz-0004BV-KT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 03:29:32 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46526) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnHty-0000JJ-L4 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 03:29:31 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW, URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hnHtw-0003db-VZ for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 03:29:30 -0400 Received: from mx2.mailbox.org ([80.241.60.215]:41420) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hnHtw-0003a0-AZ for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 03:29:28 -0400 Received: from smtp2.mailbox.org (smtp2.mailbox.org [80.241.60.241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx2.mailbox.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 26834A10D3 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:29:23 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=mailbox.org; h= content-transfer-encoding:content-type:content-type:mime-version :references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:subject:from:from :date:date:received; s=mail20150812; t=1563262150; bh=mTfVwMZyZT MquKpfR8Y69wqiccst2zn3kCm7kKwSt4I=; b=QqR2zlr6/OyqGgIYqNPH0Mac9s dnzx17guYQx4OGN04YNVsL35TCjAM5zpC7H4NP5GaYFsOqGwLbx5WXixgEsC6+1F 4fCa5FZm8Py7LJhjGfHiTSnReBLkr2SdEYOG4C3ikY/Ljh9/0JwHgC+De+XTwJ+b esp3VOXwIgQxLD3b4Tv+wNVCNVXFWsmUN3YQnryoZ6LHgOCo9ZXb8RmR0RffLhki ns+4coLPovLmV4x2XDiPV4Ba4y6P7tlPbdb7+E/aQgTh+TF+LKJT6Dv6RkV3a6lt BJ4UhHxpKTJf32anql7Zty6MDbq5i9FWmfwYSWJ3YlWEwI3ZJyh3D3QN9cXA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mailbox.org; s=mail20150812; t=1563262163; h=from:from:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=mTfVwMZyZTMquKpfR8Y69wqiccst2zn3kCm7kKwSt4I=; b=Y3qRXNB/x/bljXDV/AKaHbMmA/bDG9zilAgohoo1AfDD1HcgZ/inpKOeyJJzkqq+Tsjnnk 4ypwBvKtzVoHAg23bz74N/0bEg64umNQppq63fpo6wdZuQWwEZA7RXipmM84Shj/Dd+jwn Tbsjo/hNNPjkcKQfYECAzXUMpfx0EPa+u4aWhTIFLB2U9wSo0CBoB97ndhCwRm1pYESsGr Ca4JYI+XKzRWzBN8XRio7jBDkrW3fCCXpiIPUZSKa/7PKY56DLRvW0UtTtmQ4hXoMCn/Hv 1RBb45c+NZjis/ifuMYix2a02ino48UJE+ghaqgV/QU9I7yVG0XqNV9nkIYf3w== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at heinlein-support.de Received: from smtp2.mailbox.org ([80.241.60.241]) by spamfilter02.heinlein-hosting.de (spamfilter02.heinlein-hosting.de [80.241.56.116]) (amavisd-new, port 10030) with ESMTP id PjXdeGcxXAP4 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:29:10 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 02:29:07 -0500 From: Matthew Brooks Message-ID: <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> In-Reply-To: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> References: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 80.241.60.215 X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) If an automatic updater is included by default (which I think would be a rather bad idea), it absolutely needs to be very easy for a user to disable. GuixSD gives users a hell of a lot more control over the system and software and such than most other operating systems do, and that's a great strength. Leaving all those decisions in the hands of an automatic updating algorithm seems like a great way to discourage users from actually using the full power of the system and instead treat guix as just another generic distribution that decides things for the users instead of letting them decide for themselves. Especially since guix already lets the user know if it's older than about a week or so, which is probably plenty for anything other than the most demanding of security needs. Further, an automatic upgrade service wouldn't really add anything useful, since cron jobs and scripts can already be used to automate upgrading if one so desires. Additionally, anyone who is able to install the system to begin with would easily be able to set up such a cron job if they wish, since creating the system config file takes more work than making a small bash script with the few commands needed to update everything. From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service Resent-From: Ricardo Wurmus Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 12:48:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 36659 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Matthew Brooks Cc: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 36659-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B36659.156328122929609 (code B ref 36659); Tue, 16 Jul 2019 12:48:02 +0000 Received: (at 36659) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2019 12:47:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49685 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnMrN-0007hV-60 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 08:47:09 -0400 Received: from sender-of-o51.zoho.com ([135.84.80.216]:21214) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnMrE-0007gx-7C for 36659@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 08:47:07 -0400 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1563281214; cv=none; d=zoho.com; s=zohoarc; b=XyVsfpIGKfPiQbQVTSXQUdhL4L7gF6oZn6dRktFJnLi+n7mIQM7X0dn3KVVhCuMKlc3tb7QDhyPKtgKWzWYlfl1UrUBRchdnSzY3AFP7McRunM9Z7PAenSRUWmshXCUXDMH9uEX0fUjA86zQ+B0hxtt2YrcGHsLj6z8Xma255zE= ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=zoho.com; s=zohoarc; t=1563281214; h=Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Cc:Date:From:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Message-ID:References:Subject:To:ARC-Authentication-Results; bh=jIC/dkkdlwljEXvHpFXzI9HuBltsh9M60IcC0xGk9J4=; b=huizi1JTh492uuUly95fHRJIVHQdsF5XGaR80qKem6gLPygdDsdIozziQV1Z3++fphkskhNFlwo8yes/FV1TavnHzX1RFs2dMqaM+gIyNSqAh4al91WdbjryjFXgXYlIQoTfyg6RS072QoDGPpK6UiNSP/i/Yo/9SwYI8xYokV4= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.zoho.com; dkim=pass header.i=elephly.net; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=rekado@elephly.net; dmarc=pass header.from= header.from= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; t=1563281214; s=zoho; d=elephly.net; i=rekado@elephly.net; h=References:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-reply-to:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; l=814; bh=jIC/dkkdlwljEXvHpFXzI9HuBltsh9M60IcC0xGk9J4=; b=Ug9Pe6sy/JUBBox76FnsDXsjCy+5ONjBJ8iHTSHAt/xE4Fj6VhAMdg3AKnwBD1Py 1Cp5uYFzYQB4ipaibmD50H8heAxzychRvEUsobvXvFn4sOrKl4rwFuva5N6HQNgZAc5 ZkvJBQ/gI2I5qPI2Vy2nuv4MZ3EkWAuZ2tb7+s40= Received: from localhost (141.80.247.250 [141.80.247.250]) by mx.zohomail.com with SMTPS id 1563281214258459.76636564002524; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 05:46:54 -0700 (PDT) References: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> User-agent: mu4e 1.2.0; emacs 26.2 From: Ricardo Wurmus In-reply-to: <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> X-URL: https://elephly.net X-PGP-Key: https://elephly.net/rekado.pubkey X-PGP-Fingerprint: BCA6 89B6 3655 3801 C3C6 2150 197A 5888 235F ACAC Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 14:46:50 +0200 Message-ID: <87sgr6gn9h.fsf@elephly.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-ZohoMailClient: External X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Hi Matthew, > If an automatic updater is included by default (which I think would be > a rather bad idea), it absolutely needs to be very easy for a user to > disable. Of course. It would be as simple as removing a service from the list of default system services in the operating system configuration. > Further, an automatic upgrade service wouldn't really add anything > useful, since cron jobs and scripts can already be used to automate > upgrading if one so desires. I disagree. We provide a whole lot of services that aren=E2=80=99t strictly necessary in order to satisfy what we think are reasonable user expectations. An upgrade service that=E2=80=99s easily removed or configur= ed seems nicer to me than having to muck about with cron jobs and scripts by myself. -- Ricardo From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service Resent-From: Arne Babenhauserheide Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:24:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 36659 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org Cc: matthewfbrooks@mailbox.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-guix@gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-Cc: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org, Matthew Brooks Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.1563283437630 (code B ref -1); Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:24:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2019 13:23:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49727 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnNQz-0000A5-0R for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:23:57 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:59904) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnNQw-00009v-A1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:23:54 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50758) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnNQv-0004nQ-DV for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:23:54 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hnNQu-0001Kw-A7 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:23:53 -0400 Received: from mout.web.de ([212.227.17.12]:56687) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hnNQt-0001Jj-R1 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 09:23:52 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=web.de; s=dbaedf251592; t=1563283421; bh=/8o4BXJ61l3Yh0Vv75Ht/zqFkmWIn7lGpx5014ie8o4=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:References:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-reply-to:Date; b=iazgftGbGb+8MW/Gg55Uj5R1ugK7T9Zq7bIejHOIELfCIMUPWSKylRHtUsczQzV43 Pz4i6ti3Y0jA7CeuxCY2kcymOVzD/GnrRb1ynNsRELFMA3yuQ41usaiUlRKCAvh6zt /EQpdojBDB7WCNokUefLtVp6DgE9CBWe6TSdvNtE= X-UI-Sender-Class: c548c8c5-30a9-4db5-a2e7-cb6cb037b8f9 Received: from fluss ([84.149.83.171]) by smtp.web.de (mrweb103 [213.165.67.124]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LfRvZ-1iFbVd3pvt-00p4sQ; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 15:23:41 +0200 References: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> <87sgr6gn9h.fsf@elephly.net> User-agent: mu4e 1.2.0; emacs 26.2 From: Arne Babenhauserheide In-reply-to: <87sgr6gn9h.fsf@elephly.net> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 15:23:35 +0200 Message-ID: <87wogiglk8.fsf@web.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:9rdQRaKR+/WxmeJSSNDKMUNwN6+9dFBtOsqWLra++YHz2ojQtih EaGLaVSJ7kMyohOIb5n22G8Ga4bzSvyCBI+2e23fWcqAIbkMmGCKv0tPNF1R4yzFD/ecRDz 6ayzjUul/kTKj00Mkef16rQoSP8CqQiaAh059MZHiOguEvN4GzN/RxBCUXemaTgO66af8ru 6kDWyevVoaUnA/9b3ji1Q== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:oxQ36vkgoaA=:zww8T4/N3+6+IgpuUnj76L Fhbyrke3DlkDFArYMfWBMZququzPhbfpBjB/S9tc5VNpbC0/crDKTi6gtk4SdoSN5ab1ZwF8a Jqh8Yy2aq/BxBkzNz75ByMAcsHCUdvraNiSLTV80MLk36/uzw48qwJPw5Ir+Xbbf2TcpKpQIz fBBzOHvBosubNIS/tWrdZ2vDgU0hoWt6+mOx02TLi9EvFMWR0hFydoH2NIDnfXntOSu6DcMAY tHS+yBPw4YRqnrQB2/H58lYkVh+jGl7EHOZoG7KPDbnCw9uyr3pNPNQ8nkNO11PIQFMNt5vbN rPBrOhw+yBJJRzTeSvf2gLzsytB2Pi7+1M2URVFqswMI42rwGd183/QUdhCWRwAHUAICOb02C f/jQbvaIOHHCORRX+TJnUuAySVxjaBxy9uaMBmuaAjIJxL8vdXjd+OS4BHyA/qruDI82DeTX2 VsQimDMKuaq8AlCHLboPKd6Iq8iuCQFkEVrbpZ4uZG/nhv9kQ+IWMTOwzwA5ZI1J+OUivwRdh V13aMO1OtvSPLQ+RFnMiw0ipJq38VyOMr7OVM7PTfPg5Nmypy32DNU3+qq7Aju7aOihDWMzbJ jRSdvYFq4rlLXcdoV1KfSWA7S2ZD6Xf5qJb2cmlWzDeKyVALZYqitOuPNkKcDX6pQ56cULI8X ko6g= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 212.227.17.12 X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ricardo Wurmus writes: >> Further, an automatic upgrade service wouldn't really add anything >> useful, since cron jobs and scripts can already be used to automate >> upgrading if one so desires. > > I disagree. We provide a whole lot of services that aren=E2=80=99t stric= tly > necessary in order to satisfy what we think are reasonable user > expectations. An upgrade service that=E2=80=99s easily removed or config= ured > seems nicer to me than having to muck about with cron jobs and scripts > by myself. I would most of all like to see a CVE-checking service that tells me about security updates. Sometimes I=E2=80=99ll ignore updates for a few wee= ks because I have a setup that absolutely must keep working, because I could not even afford half an hour of brokenness, but I must still do security updates, and I would like Guix to tell me about those. Also it would be interesting to have an auto-update service that only updates /run/current-system That way users would only have to worry about their personal installations, but not about the underlying base-system. I think there are many users who would be most happy if they never had to sudo. Best wishes, Arne =2D-=20 Unpolitisch sein hei=C3=9Ft politisch sein ohne es zu merken --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEE801qEjXQSQPNItXAE++NRSQDw+sFAl0tz9kACgkQE++NRSQD w+tldBAAvCFKbMb3qXAtYmPDerOJCbA4U6kxQCfzNcK5rSv5W0/t77P4rRH6Yxmu IU6fPzlczkHhx0hjUcU6g91tZM+GIWInUtiUh1L7IFsiCbW82XySNHTBmEG4vO58 2bs/QbB6Sr8PQfXOQPVAeoNd2iFHY2WGd2Qh1wduzDRbxcK99MzeCmvfPg9eOKct +vo9IpfHswfypSXrRo6ZTj7xGqLNknS5JZikONuObrX/aWJ+pd0r6e+sn9a79E5E 7QAQ+1XX5PEbE9JWdJhhuuPz5lJtqbr20v3mNNggxVMgefN7s6omVo+5u9dVF6Bp ahZYlnHBv16erqjaVpZEbTbK+DSW2o9vieRTsi2gakIEQHZaKiEJ0wAa3Y6o2gXM C0FgEs6z91Wj5yMJd9rlu0CZjVYyFcZZcwPPS9vnm4SjVl//oIR+07warQ4xKDBB 4roBh/lKVyCjbiZA4m/9oIUDvfbNQDCQb9o5XTWUY0gvymmoWsl2c0uUUjcGGpxy 0nqOP5JjA5UwFl/kNN1HtZZAI3zf73J0CV+xgPCaYHyO6uH18NedrfguLdXLegmO tAqewablsPsgKxSt0xk/23T2EvdapEAb2NYP2GzzjSkWsUgvfcKIV9WBQpEjlWoj NoDpptpIOtH6JJEmeAut8k47qV+ydp6SF0m+Quf9HbKAL3XDjG2IswQBAQgAHRYh BN0ovebZh1yrzkqLHdzPDbMLwQVIBQJdLc/ZAAoJENzPDbMLwQVIbSAD/2lC0uF3 unhvMrRlQaxpfS2+ltqUJCOqxfJXs6K93yEr3DE4L6SFN5nrEUa+CIfTrSBMRH1T AKRBvRVm2tTqI5mnNQkK0D4s+mbFJ3dkuKLRBfKPG/P8joXzz+QWWukMd0mTe2XT IxXrXYh+JZKKtryXasqx5ztHy7ZjaN244syp =332J -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service Resent-From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 14:05:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 36659 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Matthew Brooks , Arne Babenhauserheide , Ricardo Wurmus Cc: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 36659-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B36659.15632858576163 (code B ref 36659); Tue, 16 Jul 2019 14:05:02 +0000 Received: (at 36659) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jul 2019 14:04:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50916 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnO41-0001bK-4W for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 10:04:17 -0400 Received: from pelzflorian.de ([5.45.111.108]:42092 helo=mail.pelzflorian.de) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hnO3y-0001b9-9r for 36659@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 10:04:15 -0400 Received: from pelzflorian.localdomain (unknown [5.45.111.108]) by mail.pelzflorian.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EC11D3600FA; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:04:12 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=pelzflorian.de; s=mail; t=1563285853; bh=ovAZLuv9H53yUUcPosCi/sZW5BxGyRA/FwzcNDcIjK4=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To; b=LXBA/Z84xx3Ql1Cq9ygtyVXPq+4YKpRmkx7dff6ARw7YyZiRUsO+kFNmA5JxrezdX iUBiYXNzvdYHiZpIgRWHWnQ8F8MAMUfAucrvXBzOxHuTf/Ofg1SpBdWPecuy5fKFxK xCgfCNtpN/+T9NSE5hIUca8r/HO4hUH/6gbbGCQY= Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 16:04:12 +0200 From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" Message-ID: <20190716140412.b24vfd5jfr6vgydg@pelzflorian.localdomain> References: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> User-Agent: NeoMutt/20180716 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) This is just my opinions/ideas: On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 02:29:07AM -0500, Matthew Brooks wrote: > If an automatic updater is included by default (which I think would > be a rather bad idea), it absolutely needs to be very easy for a > user to disable. Guix System should target non-power users too. It is already much easier to install packages and services than in Debian, especially if no sudo were ever needed as Arne wrote in his reply. Perhaps if the unattended upgrades service were not included in %desktop-services but selectable in the Guix System graphical installer and selected by default, users would feel more in control and existing users would not be surprised. If unattended-upgrades-service-type checked with NetworkManager for metered connections *and* if substitutes are available *and* the power user can configure a blacklist/whitelist of trusted connections, the only downside I see is less internet bandwidth during upgrades and slightly more battery drain, but security is more important and the more responsible default. Maybe make it configurable if upgrades should be performed when on battery. Maybe users could stop an upgrade via libnotify notification? On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 03:23:35PM +0200, Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: > I would most of all like to see a CVE-checking service that tells me > about security updates. Sometimes I’ll ignore updates for a few weeks > because I have a setup that absolutely must keep working, because I > could not even afford half an hour of brokenness, but I must still do > security updates, and I would like Guix to tell me about those. > A CVE notification service would be right for %desktop-services, I think. Regards, Florian From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service Resent-From: Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-guix@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2019 16:36:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 36659 X-GNU-PR-Package: guix X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Arne Babenhauserheide Cc: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 36659-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B36659.15639861588805 (code B ref 36659); Wed, 24 Jul 2019 16:36:01 +0000 Received: (at 36659) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Jul 2019 16:35:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37923 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hqKFC-0002Hx-5s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 12:35:58 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:53217) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hqKF9-0002Hk-VQ for 36659@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 12:35:56 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:54475) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hqKF4-0005QN-Ko; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 12:35:50 -0400 Received: from [2a01:e0a:1d:7270:af76:b9b:ca24:c465] (port=50312 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1hqKF3-0001s1-LW; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 12:35:50 -0400 From: Ludovic =?UTF-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= References: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> <20190716022907.534539fc@mailbox.org> <87sgr6gn9h.fsf@elephly.net> <87wogiglk8.fsf@web.de> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 6 Thermidor an 227 de la =?UTF-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2019 18:35:47 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87wogiglk8.fsf@web.de> (Arne Babenhauserheide's message of "Tue, 16 Jul 2019 15:23:35 +0200") Message-ID: <87r26fwfto.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Hi, Arne Babenhauserheide skribis: > Also it would be interesting to have an auto-update service that only > updates /run/current-system Yes, that=E2=80=99s what we=E2=80=99re talking about here, or at least what= I had in mind. :-) Ludo=E2=80=99. From unknown Tue Jun 17 22:30:03 2025 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.505 (Entity 5.505) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" Subject: bug#36659: closed (There should be an unattended upgrades service) Message-ID: References: <87lfeiyf03.fsf@nckx> <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 36659 X-Gnu-PR-Package: guix Reply-To: 36659@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2020 16:41:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1606754462-546-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1606754462-546-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #36659: There should be an unattended upgrades service which was filed against the guix package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 36659@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 36659: http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D36659 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1606754462-546-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 36659-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Nov 2020 16:40:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56466 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kjmEO-00008H-Kk for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 30 Nov 2020 11:40:52 -0500 Received: from tobias.gr ([80.241.217.52]:41468) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kjmEJ-000083-PZ for 36659-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 30 Nov 2020 11:40:51 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tobias.gr; s=2018; bh=U6d0xbBv/EtRUBsOjLZcEax1NIKAQPGrVoOaKpK89os=; h=date:subject:to: from; b=AjVBWpfnuslweLZpotPnOzoFgYgsTWY8w2hQPEQoXjPGOwF2NIcXXVayYJKl4q ibOQxmkISHabu5S6n2boJvMv8Do8q94Y+a1M4g8IcZQLKZoh9bqaiBmYrBgpE0R3z85jTz 9Xnd1j8vlIYlSNHdZQrWTiH9Piu6VSTgdMgF4I5lxWpq6i/9s3xRzimTQ5WOYGO1Q5/dto Pxw3NTrti2ZaR6sdQtuUgFVH2QfSguZi/tmycueG/RL+HSI3iNWHUkxHHhK9p2wFBPXkVL +lxsCT3arW2bhNoseW2meiooPKU/1S+fOaOcZZ9pP4IWdQR3NKdxE2Lu3Ex3M7mjXfrjpA == Received: by submission.tobias.gr (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id b86f5286 (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-ECDSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO) for <36659-done@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 30 Nov 2020 16:40:58 +0000 (UTC) BIMI-Selector: v=BIMI1; s=default; From: Tobias Geerinckx-Rice To: 36659-done@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: There should be an unattended upgrades service Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2020 17:40:44 +0100 Message-ID: <87lfeiyf03.fsf@nckx> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 36659-done X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed One was added by Ludo' in commit 79501f26ab6d82c0256ff786a5dfb0000b52ccd3. The unrelated (CVE) or enhancement (NM integration) suggestions upthread are separate topics. Closing! Kind regards, T G-R --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iIMEARYKACsWIQT12iAyS4c9C3o4dnINsP+IT1VteQUCX8UgjA0cbWVAdG9iaWFz LmdyAAoJEA2w/4hPVW15sdYA/3dpgWK1j3mZydoF8aU1YzwAfVIIAUrCLJQsP3c9 XPUoAQCAL6kRCIK7XL7uVwahuq9T/Zxxp3m0LIpTFC3aIeaFAg== =TVIB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- ------------=_1606754462-546-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jul 2019 10:17:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46470 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2o-0007aB-HI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:18 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:40933) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2m-0007Ys-NI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33684) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2l-00052Z-O2 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:16 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2k-0003sB-Hg for bug-guix@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:15 -0400 Received: from pelzflorian.de ([5.45.111.108]:34344 helo=mail.pelzflorian.de) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hmy2j-0003rM-VG for bug-guix@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 06:17:14 -0400 Received: from pelzflorian.localdomain (unknown [5.45.111.108]) by mail.pelzflorian.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4A910360035 for ; Mon, 15 Jul 2019 12:17:12 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=pelzflorian.de; s=mail; t=1563185832; bh=alanagfnDaz4Gtwm/rVab7GY50zg9M3pNeK6FXoWn0M=; h=Date:From:To:Subject; b=zduj1CM00HhhB3Syb2l8Z/sxDeFU34e2bsOUXStfouf7jbLMkZCBsBWbRUEPAurE5 +UbpdwIr2P3/bbf8sJcErT9lrZhwrDPum4D57KBXpGZBkGvz0qXTeTpwxo0a2JtHX7 H+wDycII7UEu3j7xst5Mw+3OYlVXZoDlPTf/Ruik= Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2019 12:17:11 +0200 From: "pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)" To: bug-guix@gnu.org Subject: There should be an unattended upgrades service Message-ID: <20190715101711.gejdpqkyaq2yri3p@pelzflorian.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: NeoMutt/20180716 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 5.45.111.108 X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) Some users (want to) forget about regularly upgrading Guix System. There should be an unattended upgrades service. Some requirements come to mind for its configuration: 1) Some users may want their unattended upgrades service to take care just of reconfiguring from a recent checkout and some may want it to take care of updating users=E2=80=99 ~/.config/guix/current and ~/guix-pr= ofile profiles. 2) Maybe there should be libnotify integration for unattended upgrades if the user uses a desktop environment. 3) Updates may fail if there is no internet connection. Some users may *not* want upgrades on metered internet connections. Some users may *not* want upgrades over untrusted connections. This report is a followup to Ludo=E2=80=99s proposal at to add such a service and add it to %desktop-services, making it the default setting. Such a change in defaults could be a bad surprise for some users and should not go unnoticed, I think. Regards, Florian ------------=_1606754462-546-1--