From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: "Drew Adams" , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:40:06 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: report 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B.124508370929647 (code B ref -1); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:40:06 +0000 Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 15 Jun 2009 16:35:09 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.0 required=4.0 tests=AWL autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org (fencepost.gnu.org [140.186.70.10]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5FGZ4jQ029523 for ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:35:05 -0700 Received: from mx10.gnu.org ([199.232.76.166]:32875) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1MGF9D-0001d9-BI for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:35:03 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MGF9C-00054m-8C for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:35:03 -0400 Received: from acsinet11.oracle.com ([141.146.126.233]:49564) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MGF9B-00054K-Rk for emacs-pretest-bug@gnu.org; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:35:02 -0400 Received: from rgminet15.oracle.com (rcsinet15.oracle.com [148.87.113.117]) by acsinet11.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5FGZs4C029596 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:35:56 GMT Received: from abhmt001.oracle.com (abhmt001.oracle.com [141.146.116.10]) by rgminet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5FGZ1uq025422 for ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:35:01 GMT Received: from dradamslap1 (/130.35.178.194) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:34:53 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" To: Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:34:55 -0700 Message-ID: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Thread-Index: Acnt1zbUcsi0+oRZR++gvGRYKnMI/w== X-Source-IP: abhmt001.oracle.com [141.146.116.10] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A09020A.4A367830.0030:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) At least on MS Windows, when you scroll down, you keep scrolling past the end of the buffer, without (noticeable) limit. I cannot believe that anyone would consider this a "feature". It is in fact a regression wrt Emacs 22 (21, 20,...). From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:40:10 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12450872707797 (code B ref 3576); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:40:10 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 15 Jun 2009 17:34:30 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 required=4.0 tests=FOURLA,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mtaout3.012.net.il (mtaout3.012.net.il [84.95.2.7]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5FHYP1W007780 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:34:26 -0700 Received: from conversion-daemon.i_mtaout3.012.net.il by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) id <0KLA00D00JA4X100@i_mtaout3.012.net.il> for 3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:34:18 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.124.179.132]) by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) with ESMTPA id <0KLA00AS5JH5WOE1@i_mtaout3.012.net.il>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:34:18 +0300 (IDT) Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:34:18 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii In-reply-to: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Drew Adams , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Message-id: <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> > From: "Drew Adams" > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:34:55 -0700 > Cc: > > At least on MS Windows, when you scroll down, you keep scrolling past > the end of the buffer, without (noticeable) limit. Scroll how? Please give a complete recipe, starting with "emacs -Q". FWIW, I cannot reproduce this on MS-Windows using the latest pretest. From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: "Drew Adams" , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:50:07 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12450878909637 (code B ref 3576); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:50:07 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 15 Jun 2009 17:44:50 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=4.0 tests=AWL,FOURLA,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from rgminet12.oracle.com (rcsinet12.oracle.com [148.87.113.124]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5FHik5x009624 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:44:47 -0700 Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by rgminet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5FHiMCf011772 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:44:24 GMT Received: from abhmt005.oracle.com (abhmt005.oracle.com [141.146.116.14]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5FHjqoJ031541; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:45:52 GMT Received: from dradamslap1 (/130.35.178.194) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:44:35 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Eli Zaretskii'" , <3576@debbugs.gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:44:40 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Thread-Index: Acnt34fi7hiPHYO/TqOR5kgpmxqCvAAAFP0Q X-Source-IP: abhmt005.oracle.com [141.146.116.14] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A010205.4A368883.028B:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 > > At least on MS Windows, when you scroll down, you keep > > scrolling past the end of the buffer, without (noticeable) limit. > > Scroll how? Please give a complete recipe, starting with "emacs -Q". > FWIW, I cannot reproduce this on MS-Windows using the latest pretest. Sorry, I meant scroll by dragging (downward) the scroll-bar handle with the mouse (e.g. mouse-1). But I see now that scrolling does *not* continue forever. It does continue past eob, sometimes as much as a whole blank screen, but it stops at some point. Point does not move past eob, of course; it is just the window that scrolls. emacs -Q grab vertical scroll bar with mouse-1 and drag down Buffers with different contents have different amounts of blank overshoot scroll (i.e. past eob). It seems that the max overshoot is a full blank screen. It also seems that larger buffers have more overshoot. So to see this with a full blank window of overshoot, try scrolling a large buffer. From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 18:45:05 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.124509117219365 (code B ref 3576); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 18:45:05 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 15 Jun 2009 18:39:32 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.0 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mtaout3.012.net.il (mtaout4.012.net.il [84.95.2.10]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5FIdRWs019359 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 11:39:28 -0700 Received: from conversion-daemon.i_mtaout3.012.net.il by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) id <0KLA00500M7XVE00@i_mtaout3.012.net.il> for 3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:39:21 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.124.179.132]) by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) with ESMTPA id <0KLA00K9TMHH2EG1@i_mtaout3.012.net.il>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:39:18 +0300 (IDT) Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:39:19 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii In-reply-to: X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Drew Adams Cc: 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Message-id: <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> > From: "Drew Adams" > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:44:40 -0700 > > emacs -Q > grab vertical scroll bar with mouse-1 and drag down > > Buffers with different contents have different amounts of blank overshoot scroll > (i.e. past eob). It seems that the max overshoot is a full blank screen. It also > seems that larger buffers have more overshoot. So to see this with a full blank > window of overshoot, try scrolling a large buffer. Still cannot reproduce this. The worst case I see is that the very last line of the buffer ends up on the top visible line of the window. If that's what you see, it's normal, and Emacs 22.x and 21.x behave exactly the same. If that's not what you see, can you pick up some of the files in the Emacs distribution, and describe what you see scrolling each one of them? Please define and describe the ``overshoot'' more precisely. From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: "Drew Adams" , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:10:05 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12450963041796 (code B ref 3576); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:10:05 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 15 Jun 2009 20:05:04 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from rgminet12.oracle.com (rcsinet12.oracle.com [148.87.113.124]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5FK4xo4001637 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:05:00 -0700 Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by rgminet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5FK4bt1016849 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:04:38 GMT Received: from abhmt002.oracle.com (abhmt002.oracle.com [141.146.116.11]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5FK6671025794; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:06:06 GMT Received: from dradamslap1 (/130.35.178.194) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:04:49 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Eli Zaretskii'" Cc: <3576@debbugs.gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:04:59 -0700 Message-ID: <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Thread-Index: Acnt6VLa7UHEAyvDSKaQRKDfDTPw7QAADdlQ X-Source-IP: abhmt002.oracle.com [141.146.116.11] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A010206.4A36A962.014C:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 > Still cannot reproduce this. The worst case I see is that the very > last line of the buffer ends up on the top visible line of the window. > > If that's what you see, it's normal, and Emacs 22.x and 21.x behave > exactly the same. No, that's not what I see. The last line can be scrolled completely off of the screen, so all that can be seen is blank space. And yes, I do see the same thing in Emacs 22.3. But *not* in Emacs 21.3 or Emacs 20.7 (-q for all three). Even if what you say were the case, no, that's wouldn't be normal. > If that's not what you see, can you pick up some of the files in the > Emacs distribution, and describe what you see scrolling each one of > them? Please define and describe the ``overshoot'' more precisely. emacs -Q C-x C-f /path/to/allout.el C-x 1 Scroll down using mouse on scroll-bar slider. You can scroll so that no text is visible, all text is above the (single) window. Same thing even if there are other windows above or below. Same with any other large file. Try it with a small file, autoarg.el. The overshoot possible is only about 6 lines in that case. The larger the file, the larger the overshoot, with a full blank window maximum (last line just off the window). Clear enough? Do you see something different from this? From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 03:10:05 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12451214287275 (code B ref 3576); Tue, 16 Jun 2009 03:10:05 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 16 Jun 2009 03:03:48 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.0 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mtaout6.012.net.il (mtaout6.012.net.il [84.95.2.16]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5G33h3Y007269 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:03:44 -0700 Received: from conversion-daemon.i-mtaout6.012.net.il by i-mtaout6.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0KLB00I009THEZ00@i-mtaout6.012.net.il> for 3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 06:03:36 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.124.179.132]) by i-mtaout6.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0KLB00E0E9TZU6B0@i-mtaout6.012.net.il>; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 06:03:36 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 06:03:37 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii In-reply-to: <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Drew Adams Cc: 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Message-id: <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> > From: "Drew Adams" > Cc: <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com> > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:04:59 -0700 > > emacs -Q > C-x C-f /path/to/allout.el > C-x 1 > Scroll down using mouse on scroll-bar slider. You can scroll so that no text is > visible, all text is above the (single) window. Same thing even if there are > other windows above or below. Yep. Emacs 21.4 stops on the last text line, Emacs 22.3 and 23.0.94 stop on EOB. From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: "Drew Adams" , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 03:15:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12451218419378 (code B ref 3576); Tue, 16 Jun 2009 03:15:04 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 16 Jun 2009 03:10:41 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from rgminet11.oracle.com (rcsinet11.oracle.com [148.87.113.123]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5G3AbPa009234 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:10:39 -0700 Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by rgminet11.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5G3BV9I028917 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jun 2009 03:11:33 GMT Received: from abhmt004.oracle.com (abhmt004.oracle.com [141.146.116.13]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5G3BjBG006548; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 03:11:45 GMT Received: from dradamslap1 (/24.5.177.54) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:10:28 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Eli Zaretskii'" Cc: <3576@debbugs.gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:10:27 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-reply-to: <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> Thread-Index: AcnuLxIFAvCzUM1ST1mjOLTJvTtXtQAABeDw X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: abhmt004.oracle.com [141.146.116.13] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090206.4A370D24.01F7:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 > > emacs -Q > > C-x C-f /path/to/allout.el > > C-x 1 > > Scroll down using mouse on scroll-bar slider. You can > > scroll so that no text is visible, all text is above the > > (single) window. Same thing even if there are > > other windows above or below. > > Yep. Emacs 21.4 stops on the last text line, Emacs 22.3 and 23.0.94 > stop on EOB. What do you mean by "stop on EOB"? If end of the buffer is the newline immediately following the last line of non-newline chars, then how can showing up to a screenful of blank vertical space be considered "stopping at EOB"? Do you mean that it decides that the final newline has as a right to be scrolled to the top of the screen? Is that what "stopping at eob" means? If this is just an unfortunate result of the way things happen to be currently implemented, that's one thing. But I find it hard to believe that this would have been a design goal - that someone would start out intentionally to produce this behavior. What's the advantage or use case? I've never seen this behavior in any other app (though I'm sure you'll come up with some other app that has the same behavior). ;-) From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:30:05 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12451767268892 (code B ref 3576); Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:30:05 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 16 Jun 2009 18:25:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.0 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from mtaout3.012.net.il (mtaout3.012.net.il [84.95.2.7]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5GIPI9e008742 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 11:25:20 -0700 Received: from conversion-daemon.i_mtaout3.012.net.il by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) id <0KLC00D00G3ZNB00@i_mtaout3.012.net.il> for 3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:25:12 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.124.179.132]) by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) with ESMTPA id <0KLC003N8GHZE5M0@i_mtaout3.012.net.il>; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:25:12 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:25:13 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii In-reply-to: X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Drew Adams Cc: 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Message-id: <83k53cavee.fsf@gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> > From: "Drew Adams" > Cc: <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com> > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:10:27 -0700 > > > Yep. Emacs 21.4 stops on the last text line, Emacs 22.3 and 23.0.94 > > stop on EOB. > > What do you mean by "stop on EOB"? If end of the buffer is the newline > immediately following the last line of non-newline chars, then how can showing > up to a screenful of blank vertical space be considered "stopping at EOB"? EOB == (point-max) Emacs 21.4 stops when the last line of the buffer is at the topmost line of the window. Emacs 22 and 23 put EOB on the topmost line of the window. > Do you mean that it decides that the final newline has as a right to be scrolled > to the top of the screen? Is that what "stopping at eob" means? > > If this is just an unfortunate result of the way things happen to be currently > implemented, that's one thing. But I find it hard to believe that this would > have been a design goal - that someone would start out intentionally to produce > this behavior. What's the advantage or use case? > > I've never seen this behavior in any other app (though I'm sure you'll come up > with some other app that has the same behavior). ;-) I was just stating the fact, not embracing it. Now, can you please stop shouting at me? My only sin is that I confirmed your report. From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: "Drew Adams" , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 00:40:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.124519890412177 (code B ref 3576); Wed, 17 Jun 2009 00:40:04 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 17 Jun 2009 00:35:04 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from acsinet12.oracle.com (acsinet12.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5H0Ywpf012119 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 17:34:59 -0700 Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by acsinet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5H0YoCu019410 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jun 2009 00:34:51 GMT Received: from abhmt002.oracle.com (abhmt002.oracle.com [141.146.116.11]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n5H0a6tF014857; Wed, 17 Jun 2009 00:36:07 GMT Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.80.217) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Tue, 16 Jun 2009 17:34:48 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" To: "'Eli Zaretskii'" Cc: <3576@debbugs.gnu.org> References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> <83k53cavee.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 17:34:56 -0700 Message-ID: <8BA1212D193F486090CFAC50E0C100E3@us.oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-reply-to: <83k53cavee.fsf@gnu.org> Thread-Index: Acnur9SVn0hMx6aNRZ24mYncycNHjwAMqo2A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: abhmt002.oracle.com [141.146.116.11] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090209.4A383A29.0094:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 > > > Yep. Emacs 21.4 stops on the last text line, Emacs 22.3 > > > and 23.0.94 stop on EOB. > > > > What do you mean by "stop on EOB"? If end of the buffer is > > the newline immediately following the last line of non-newline > > chars, then how can showing up to a screenful of blank vertical > > space be considered "stopping at EOB"? > > EOB == (point-max) > > Emacs 21.4 stops when the last line of the buffer is at the topmost > line of the window. Emacs 22 and 23 put EOB on the topmost line of > the window. Emacs 22/23 does not put the last non-whitespace line at the top of the window. It apparently puts (point-max) at the top, which in most cases (e.g. Lisp libraries) is a line with only a newline character. Why should they put the last line (whitespace or not) at the _top_ of the window, instead of the bottom of the window? Why would someone want to see an extra screen of blank space, with the final newline at the top of the window? That just doesn't seem very user friendly. Do you know of a use case for that, which might justify that as the standard behavior? If not, I propose that this be fixed by returning to the Emacs 20/21 behavior. > > Do you mean that it decides that the final newline has as a > > right to be scrolled to the top of the screen? Is that what > > "stopping at eob" means? > > > > If this is just an unfortunate result of the way things > > happen to be currently implemented, that's one thing. > > But I find it hard to believe that this would have been a > > design goal - that someone would start out intentionally to > > produce this behavior. What's the advantage or use case? > > > > I've never seen this behavior in any other app (though I'm > > sure you'll come up with some other app that has the same > > behavior). ;-) > > I was just stating the fact, not embracing it. > > Now, can you please stop shouting at me? My only sin is that I > confirmed your report. No one has shouted at you. Don't be so defensive. This is not about you, at all. It's merely a bug report. Thank you for confirming it. From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Reply-To: Stefan Monnier , 3576@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-From: Stefan Monnier Resent-To: bug-submit-list@lists.donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 00:45:05 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Received: via spool by 3576-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3576.12460630865258 (code B ref 3576); Sat, 27 Jun 2009 00:45:05 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 27 Jun 2009 00:38:06 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 (2008-06-10) on rzlab.ucr.edu X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 required=4.0 tests=AWL,HAS_BUG_NUMBER, MURPHY_DRUGS_REL8 autolearn=ham version=3.2.5-bugs.debian.org_2005_01_02 Received: from smtp-04.vtx.ch (smtp-04.vtx.ch [212.147.0.65]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n5R0c2ZT005248 for <3576@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Fri, 26 Jun 2009 17:38:03 -0700 Received: from alfajor.home (dyn.83-228-218-202.dsl.vtx.ch [83.228.218.202]) by smtp-04.vtx.ch (VTX Services SA) with ESMTP id 297E929ADC4; Sat, 27 Jun 2009 02:38:01 +0200 (CEST) Received: by alfajor.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 16B6E64341; Sat, 27 Jun 2009 02:38:01 +0200 (CEST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Drew Adams Cc: 3576@debbugs.gnu.org, "'Eli Zaretskii'" Message-ID: References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> <83k53cavee.fsf@gnu.org> <8BA1212D193F486090CFAC50E0C100E3@us.oracle.com> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 02:38:00 +0200 In-Reply-To: <8BA1212D193F486090CFAC50E0C100E3@us.oracle.com> (Drew Adams's message of "Tue, 16 Jun 2009 17:34:56 -0700") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.94 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Why should they put the last line (whitespace or not) at the _top_ of the > window, instead of the bottom of the window? That's the wrong question. The right question could be something like: - Why should Emacs (or any other application ofr that matter) prevent you from displaying the last line anywhere else than the bottom of the window, what would be gained from it? - Why does Emacs only let you display the first line of the buffer at the top of the window? [well, actually, if you play enough with overlays and before-strings you could move the first line further down, but that's cheating] - Why hasn't anybody written a patch (after all these years of acrymony) so that Emacs can mimick the brain-dead dogmatic behavior of most other GUI apps's drag scroll? > Do you know of a use case for that, Of course: move the last line so it sits right next to some other line in some other window. I often do such things to compare two windows line-by-line (it doesn't always involve the last line of one of the two buffers, but sometimes does). > which might justify that as the standard behavior? The real justification is that it's difficult to implement and the benefits are dubious. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Sep 17 02:12:50 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Sep 2011 06:12:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R4o8v-0003cl-Gd for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 02:12:50 -0400 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R4o8u-0003cf-1a for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 02:12:48 -0400 Received: from cm-84.215.51.58.getinternet.no ([84.215.51.58] helo=stories.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1R4o4A-0002Y9-98 for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 08:07:54 +0200 Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 08:04:35 +0200 Message-Id: To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #3576 X-MailScanner-ID: 1R4o4A-0002Y9-98 X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1316844474.38145@+oM0QCGlDymSkO1kZ6FP/Q X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) close 3576 From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Resent-From: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 06:20:14 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Stefan Monnier Cc: 3576@debbugs.gnu.org, 'Eli Zaretskii' , Drew Adams Received: via spool by 3576-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B3576.131624041317863 (code B ref 3576); Sat, 17 Sep 2011 06:20:14 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Sep 2011 06:20:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R4oG4-0004e0-9X for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 02:20:12 -0400 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R4oFd-0004bi-F3 for 3576@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 02:19:50 -0400 Received: from cm-84.215.51.58.getinternet.no ([84.215.51.58] helo=stories.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1R4oAr-0002kc-Pm; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 08:14:49 +0200 From: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Sat, 27 Jun 2009 02:38:00 +0200") Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 08:04:32 +0200 Message-ID: References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com> <83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org> <83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org> <6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com> <83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org> <83k53cavee.fsf@gnu.org> <8BA1212D193F486090CFAC50E0C100E3@us.oracle.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-Now-Playing: Ikonika's _Contact, Love, Want, Have_: "Look (Final Boss Stage)" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-MailScanner-ID: 1R4oAr-0002kc-Pm X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1316844890.09074@OK2gpwHAUkAcf1SMop9n7A X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.7 (--) Stefan Monnier writes: > That's the wrong question. The right question could be something like: > > - Why should Emacs (or any other application ofr that matter) prevent > you from displaying the last line anywhere else than the bottom of the > window, what would be gained from it? So this doesn't seem like a bug, so I'm closing the report. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/ From unknown Mon Aug 18 11:10:23 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#3576: 23.0.94; scroll bar scrolls past eob - keeps scrolling Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 14:07:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 3576 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: "'Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen'" , "'Stefan Monnier'" Cc: 3576@debbugs.gnu.org, 'Eli Zaretskii' Received: via spool by 3576-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B3576.131626837931873 (code B ref 3576); Sat, 17 Sep 2011 14:07:01 +0000 Received: (at 3576) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Sep 2011 14:06:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R4vX7-0008I1-MA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 10:06:18 -0400 Received: from rcsinet15.oracle.com ([148.87.113.117]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R4vX4-0008Hs-9O for 3576@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 10:06:15 -0400 Received: from acsinet22.oracle.com (acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238]) by rcsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id p8HE1LjN000640 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 17 Sep 2011 14:01:22 GMT Received: from acsmt358.oracle.com (acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158]) by acsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id p8HE1JjA014687 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 17 Sep 2011 14:01:20 GMT Received: from abhmt103.oracle.com (abhmt103.oracle.com [141.146.116.55]) by acsmt358.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id p8HE1EHC004869; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 09:01:14 -0500 Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.54.49) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Sat, 17 Sep 2011 07:01:13 -0700 From: "Drew Adams" References: <929A2B1B4DED49D28DDCAD61181807D0@us.oracle.com><83prd5bdut.fsf@gnu.org><83ocspbaug.fsf@gnu.org><6D79C4AC04B54A39ADC5C3E57C1CC150@us.oracle.com><83my88c22e.fsf@gnu.org><83k53cavee.fsf@gnu.org><8BA1212D193F486090CFAC50E0C100E3@us.oracle.com> Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 07:01:15 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-reply-to: Thread-Index: Acx1ASTR1mzLuf9yQnavzFXniuvOrwAQLcdw X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6109 X-Source-IP: acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090207.4E74A833.0091:SCFMA922111,ss=1,re=-4.000,fgs=0 X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.2 (------) > So this doesn't seem like a bug, so I'm closing the report. Stefan's "real justification" was that the right behavior is "difficult to implement". That does not mean that this is not a bug. Besides, it cannot be that difficult, since this is a _regression_ from the fixed behavior in Emacs 18, 19, 20, and 21. Please close it as "won't fix", if that's the decision, but not as "not a bug".