From unknown Tue Jun 24 03:24:16 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#30994 <30994@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#30994 <30994@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) Reply-To: bug#30994 <30994@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2025 10:24:16 +0000 retitle 30994 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) reassign 30994 emacs submitter 30994 Michael Heerdegen severity 30994 normal thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Mar 29 23:31:53 2018 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Mar 2018 03:31:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59235 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f1kld-0000Zq-IO for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:53 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:55842) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f1klb-0000Zd-Qo for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:52 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1klV-0007nv-Lq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:46 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_20,FREEMAIL_FROM autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:59604) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1klV-0007ng-IZ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:45 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46807) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1klU-0005X9-BQ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:45 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1klP-0007l3-Ee for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:44 -0400 Received: from mout.web.de ([212.227.15.4]:53631) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1klP-0007ki-3J for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 23:31:39 -0400 Received: from drachen.dragon ([88.75.99.135]) by smtp.web.de (mrweb001 [213.165.67.108]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0M8zhl-1epKZY0NFl-00CPum for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 05:31:37 +0200 From: Michael Heerdegen To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 05:31:20 +0200 Message-ID: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-=" X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:halXsesMeUasLp8Jw2u0OKDYqlu0WUfv7RzascNYEtMscqUwfnB LAG45GSdcIif8w+eZ+acIWA9pPrS3BuqP3JwSZHMg2ZBAnb+iHv04a0f4IfLr9/xkQV5TSq Mud5wYqHHTqqThvsa8dZVzPHsEo5DgWxw8tOr1ELXmODnJ2XU2keHCHxAVTILKCmE4bimpb poO8FtoU/M8i2YPqPS8zw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:4DCIv7U2Wok=:eDaTVBHiljEA/Zzr2Y5QBg 9f0rx9eYsKK841YEz6kwZIqn8kxAPoZjLNA/v5G/wv/FLGFn12bedMbzdfvMKoZwLcy1pzv28 YTF1H3p1IyngHNWTw+d9uqC2wHmbhav+qLM6z2qHrvoTzlmdPo4HSHwibPwD5anj7Ktdf6bJf KWyQglDId0vg8E4AXyDuBZQW9M0S+ynCBjKERRrvVkn7qAPzcqLdtBtEv8Kvwg3xSFBD9stFj 1gvZbgIo66u1F3KyG6Qezd28jtM4d641IGXQLn00rVFuS6nOQe6t+vSTUn8ciqHYC5K4vHDaI z5LCh3NtoaUBkooiRzqWGpKmiywRjKmGeNvJevLYPKzyJj33CUHlI/0Y/ptbC1dCdPjCL1UIE zWec/tgms2w6yEs/B1uv0pU8mVr7uU9FQt5mQurHrVEmWucu4EhViD1ZnjQG4HtXaois0+NBF LrQjkwu+1eZm5RL6CApB/zg1KwFcBY2CvMSSkNMMujprmxNKqTi4Jx3sAu4dGySWIuwaTV8Oi ER0kh0KPSOsjoC2/ccTtCjnHtf9gCA1/ZzOeJ/KWotTtAz4KoQGy9Fonu6bcq3e9TwmY/b/Kb CYI2N0yrMPGiHcrjq4DKvtmcIJmsLt4Wm4Fk2GvEGHu3WK3HtJ1lCyIost3YhQQzQuvoR9W2i vXmg/PhRFYNxY4yCyfZH/5EXZB6mijsU8H28sz4eh6eKpBnuo0UR8CTWVlLUTrXYgezEbrCT8 owkh8/G/WBdu+7e+tWdUrOM7J0PYIdEuwYkCFCFnxieT/7j6C8y0y2E/OdToTv98BXRb5P4Re VKq1xsRf3ibE6BRtz9lRVnWw81efXfH7lWDv9nWXd9b/H5jVhg= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -4.1 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -4.1 (----) --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Hello, I start emacs -Q (under openbox in X on Debian if it matters), and I get an Emacs where the cursor doesn't blink. Thankfully only on master but not with an emacs-26 build. The problem is simply that `blink-cursor-mode' is not turned on when starting, but I can successfully enable it. The reason is that at the moment the :init-value expression of `blink-cursor-mode' is evaluated, `window-system' is bound to nil, i.e. when installing the following: --=-=-= Content-Type: text/x-diff Content-Disposition: inline; filename=0001-WIP-test-no-blinking-cursor.patch >From befd2667396125748d6e9e0e15c5fc38f7846082 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Michael Heerdegen Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 04:25:00 +0200 Subject: [PATCH] WIP: test no-blinking-cursor --- lisp/frame.el | 10 ++++++---- 1 file changed, 6 insertions(+), 4 deletions(-) diff --git a/lisp/frame.el b/lisp/frame.el index fbf2f6e773..b07e2800ba 100644 --- a/lisp/frame.el +++ b/lisp/frame.el @@ -2357,10 +2357,12 @@ blink-cursor-mode This command is effective only on graphical frames. On text-only terminals, cursor blinking is controlled by the terminal." - :init-value (not (or noninteractive - no-blinking-cursor - (eq system-type 'ms-dos) - (not (memq window-system '(x w32 ns))))) + :init-value (progn + (message "window-system: %S" window-system) + (not (or noninteractive + no-blinking-cursor + (eq system-type 'ms-dos) + (not (memq window-system '(x w32 ns)))))) :initialize 'custom-initialize-delay :group 'cursor :global t -- 2.16.2 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain I get a *Messages* buffer like | window-system: nil | For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a. After starting up, window-system ==> x as expected. Thanks, Michael. In GNU Emacs 27.0.50 (build 5, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.22.29) of 2018-03-30 built on drachen Repository revision: befd2667396125748d6e9e0e15c5fc38f7846082 Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11906000 System Description: Debian GNU/Linux buster/sid --=-=-=-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Mar 30 01:05:25 2018 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Mar 2018 05:05:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59262 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f1mE8-0002fy-RA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:25 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:40025) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f1mE7-0002fm-MS for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:23 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1mE1-0007Ri-My for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:18 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:59842) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1mDy-0007Mh-Di; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:14 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1f1mDw-0006b0-MD; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:12 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: Michael Heerdegen Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> X-Spook: White Powder ASO Hugo Chavez Chobetsu Abu Sayyaf X-Ran: `v9eU>H?nA|;]zpFme.}>/:+'392z7tvv[LfU(.Rx['`tQ2Dw2-Ik&1M\n>!vpaXwt=KH] X-Hue: black X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:12 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> (Michael Heerdegen's message of "Fri, 30 Mar 2018 05:31:20 +0200") Message-ID: <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) I guess (without testing) that this is due to 2db57579b0 moving custom-reevaluate-setting before the window setup. (I note there's no blinking in emacs started as --daemon in earlier versions of Emacs for similar reasons.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Mar 30 03:58:57 2018 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Mar 2018 07:58:57 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59314 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f1ow5-0000Gl-3F for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 03:58:57 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:38749) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f1ow3-0000GY-Sc for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 03:58:56 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1ovt-0002dX-Vp for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 03:58:50 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:33553) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f1ovt-0002dR-SR; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 03:58:45 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=3861 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1f1ovs-0006hi-U4; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 03:58:45 -0400 Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 10:58:32 +0300 Message-Id: <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Glenn Morris In-reply-to: <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> (message from Glenn Morris on Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:12 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) > From: Glenn Morris > Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 01:05:12 -0400 > Cc: 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > > I guess (without testing) that this is due to 2db57579b0 moving > custom-reevaluate-setting before the window setup. Can we fix that by calling custom-reevaluate-setting one more time after the window setup? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Mar 30 21:05:07 2018 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 Mar 2018 01:05:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60541 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f24x8-0000FD-Pm for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:05:06 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:50823) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f24x5-0000Ee-DW for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:05:04 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f24wt-0002EB-7d for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:04:58 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:37876) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f24wf-00023c-OK; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:04:37 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1f24wb-0006L9-UA; Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:04:35 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spook: AK-47 JUWTF Mahmoud Ahmadinejad Chemical weapon MS13 New X-Ran: {[;&Q%}^a@t"Qq'kM%"PkVuV1NkOC>)e8{u5!Yy[(51c[9>3hG|bS&=IFE0I5c>;{d2c X-Hue: green X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:04:33 -0400 In-Reply-To: <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 30 Mar 2018 10:58:32 +0300") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> I guess (without testing) that this is due to 2db57579b0 moving >> custom-reevaluate-setting before the window setup. > > Can we fix that by calling custom-reevaluate-setting one more time > after the window setup? I don't know. It seems ugly to call it twice, but perhaps it works. I guess that it would clobber "early init" settings made outside the customize mechanism, but I haven't looked at how this new init file is supposed to work. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Mar 31 04:06:22 2018 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 Mar 2018 08:06:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60633 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f2BWn-0007EA-TA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Mar 2018 04:06:22 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:49089) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1f2BWm-0007Do-0j for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Mar 2018 04:06:20 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f2BWd-0002zx-LR for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Mar 2018 04:06:14 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:45149) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1f2BWd-0002zQ-IU; Sat, 31 Mar 2018 04:06:11 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=2741 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1f2BWc-0006rq-Ed; Sat, 31 Mar 2018 04:06:10 -0400 Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2018 11:06:09 +0300 Message-Id: <83d0zk8ya6.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Glenn Morris In-reply-to: (message from Glenn Morris on Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:04:33 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) > From: Glenn Morris > Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2018 21:04:33 -0400 > > Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > >> I guess (without testing) that this is due to 2db57579b0 moving > >> custom-reevaluate-setting before the window setup. > > > > Can we fix that by calling custom-reevaluate-setting one more time > > after the window setup? > > I don't know. It seems ugly to call it twice, but perhaps it works. We already do such things with other features. Sometimes it's necessary. > I guess that it would clobber "early init" settings made outside the > customize mechanism, but I haven't looked at how this new init file is > supposed to work. Another idea is to define a function that would re-evaluate only certain specific defcustoms, then add that function to after-init-hook. But that is more problematic, because maintaining the list of defcustoms which need this is a maintenance burden. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jun 12 11:10:02 2018 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Jun 2018 15:10:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45254 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fSkvq-0002oe-IK for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jun 2018 11:10:02 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:42428) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fSkvo-0002o6-DW for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jun 2018 11:10:00 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fSkvg-00072e-4z for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Jun 2018 11:09:55 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:38291) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fSkvf-00072T-WC; Tue, 12 Jun 2018 11:09:52 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=3915 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1fSkvf-0001A9-Dk; Tue, 12 Jun 2018 11:09:51 -0400 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 18:10:01 +0300 Message-Id: <83k1r4oxbq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: michael_heerdegen@web.de In-reply-to: <83d0zk8ya6.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Sat, 31 Mar 2018 11:06:09 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> <83d0zk8ya6.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.0 (------) See more discussions of this issue in this thread: http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2018-06/msg00349.html I think I fixed the original problem now. I'm leaving the bug open because the secondary issue of clobbering user customizations of variables in the custom-delayed-init-variables list still needs attention, perhaps some reasonable solution could be found. For now, I just added to the docs a warning against moving customizations into the early init file that don't have to be there. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 22 21:24:30 2020 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Aug 2020 01:24:30 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51758 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1k9ekI-0008Ly-1C for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Aug 2020 21:24:30 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-f178.google.com ([209.85.219.178]:41929) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1k9ekG-0008Lm-Gj for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Aug 2020 21:24:29 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-f178.google.com with SMTP id s195so3172737ybc.8 for <30994@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 22 Aug 2020 18:24:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:user-agent :mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=pk3f0MPyZmXR+dBckyIemmnZ0IbYO6hu4xHo+uiYx1I=; b=i+wiXCjjd+JS8jcCDYcYX00La67IlxQFFzkD2mAa3gY0gpmPUGcZkx7KYUSxEoWF2R X8N9arYmbZxRaUPL0xanbtym3mUF+X5cCrxnH4KpHfSuri/EwLX9C063lUlV+PWHV7n8 h3j1bD4rSL3imtCUfslB8l3DB2bZwy1P5YakNd4o6s8aaEn3tVuySzEWv1j8plovSXar 3G/W9IGbWLr3jAdOBvMYk9Oy2AxJEvnpQVqCdfe+XOsFXC1rrjCaIMGYWIA1WdkipTIE s0ZjmM5v/TL54WInQtqrntfdnt8AuIs2vzmuOsFySfsu1oBW57WXNcnZVXWU7/7HrFw1 9+yA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533ugXzFE8hBIcOnft8s1EbYGoBa6Dao/GEW91kaUqFmohtZ6+HK gsVuznD6iP5ukwdRu/sOEhIjg5TS1wBCRTN/p6c= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyDKz/NGArMmJrWY9XlFmhE5D49KMOdbvquQYK22d3WSTDc60+R1UV7AYW5clsXZ0y8Ml6qNSBe3G1A/jcf8/4= X-Received: by 2002:a5b:508:: with SMTP id o8mr13830319ybp.43.1598145863065; Sat, 22 Aug 2020 18:24:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sat, 22 Aug 2020 21:24:22 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <83k1r4oxbq.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 12 Jun 2018 18:10:01 +0300") References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> <83d0zk8ya6.fsf@gnu.org> <83k1r4oxbq.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2020 21:24:22 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Eli Zaretskii writes: > See more discussions of this issue in this thread: > > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2018-06/msg00349.html > > I think I fixed the original problem now. I'm leaving the bug open > because the secondary issue of clobbering user customizations of > variables in the custom-delayed-init-variables list still needs > attention, perhaps some reasonable solution could be found. For now, > I just added to the docs a warning against moving customizations into > the early init file that don't have to be there. (That was 2 years ago.) Has the custom-delayed-init-variables problem discussed here been solved? Best regards, Stefan Kangas From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 23 01:53:26 2020 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Aug 2020 05:53:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51951 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1k9iwY-0000Po-HL for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 01:53:26 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45106) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1k9iwX-0000Pa-0D for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 01:53:25 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:50086) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k9iwR-0003I8-HN; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 01:53:19 -0400 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4729 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1k9iwR-0000T8-1c; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 01:53:19 -0400 Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2020 08:53:13 +0300 Message-Id: <83r1rx9ad2.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Kangas on Sat, 22 Aug 2020 21:24:22 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> <83d0zk8ya6.fsf@gnu.org> <83k1r4oxbq.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Kangas > Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2020 21:24:22 -0400 > Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > See more discussions of this issue in this thread: > > > > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2018-06/msg00349.html > > > > I think I fixed the original problem now. I'm leaving the bug open > > because the secondary issue of clobbering user customizations of > > variables in the custom-delayed-init-variables list still needs > > attention, perhaps some reasonable solution could be found. For now, > > I just added to the docs a warning against moving customizations into > > the early init file that don't have to be there. > > (That was 2 years ago.) > > Has the custom-delayed-init-variables problem discussed here been > solved? I don't think so, but we should probably close this bug anyway, and leave the rest for another day/bug. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 23 07:59:36 2020 Received: (at 30994-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Aug 2020 11:59:36 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52196 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1k9oeu-0003HK-8f for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 07:59:36 -0400 Received: from mail-yb1-f175.google.com ([209.85.219.175]:44742) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1k9oet-0003H7-Gm for 30994-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 07:59:35 -0400 Received: by mail-yb1-f175.google.com with SMTP id i10so3598232ybt.11 for <30994-done@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 04:59:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=T+bF7p/Y0GqcpK1cpzID7UP+iL4Op7QVmK7nouY9bko=; b=OdrGJZLI2+3yitCa0t6kNhzhPbqKOy6UFOkodaeZ3IKvc5DHDwEgXYtc0g7wfuyjBG /a12z4T7UbFEjAedFMg6nHaoaVxEelcWF8P4QGlSUFDkiCS6IZBftVI2ZkYdlc7P9epo S6C3aveV3UKIRNk/0Fah912Kc58VP/b/gnT9GaGhx5LIkrC4noo019rxo03nEoG2U5xq mAG/uK02ljegiRGAe77WwIpfx/24pVlriitUx+fHXAgxfzCCLtvFAi6MYEvFhYJd5Vpg NnOSDdYGcNGeZ/LsY684zHdRsqf8yD9o90rCWtl2Dw2fTFhAm6yWCWIl2hIxhFQ4HHI2 NI7w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533CRrt4WvhZ6qu6u+EJ+KCylxKwIpKiDc6JjlSNDsULcAn1P7Ht uAQyxmqTXN4wYx6V0znxR2gSNg/Z8GOMOHa63Gs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxpngM2m0SkjzEWum5lZul1Z2ab58EHtwCpFTTh/Sq0TKIkBr89Xn6NA9W70zeze+VUoynK8O6svXOhMemni1U= X-Received: by 2002:a25:4ed7:: with SMTP id c206mr1333003ybb.129.1598183970088; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 04:59:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 23 Aug 2020 07:59:29 -0400 From: Stefan Kangas In-Reply-To: <83r1rx9ad2.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87r2o2tf1z.fsf@web.de> <3b370i2lx3.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83k1tuc7vb.fsf@gnu.org> <83d0zk8ya6.fsf@gnu.org> <83k1r4oxbq.fsf@gnu.org> <83r1rx9ad2.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2020 07:59:29 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#30994: 27.0.50; Cursor doesn't blink (X window system) To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994-done Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, 30994-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Eli Zaretskii writes: > I don't think so, but we should probably close this bug anyway, and > leave the rest for another day/bug. Thanks, I'm therefore closing this bug report. From unknown Tue Jun 24 03:24:16 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:24:03 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 14 11:54:09 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2021 16:54:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39000 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l05su-0004U6-Qf for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 11:54:09 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:28582) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l05sq-0004TZ-UM for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 11:54:06 -0500 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 2EEF08081E; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 11:53:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id DED2880722; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 11:53:57 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610643237; bh=TpZfsy0lLxQW/xwwNPSIH/bFneQDWYDYYmvmBRK2YPE=; h=From:To:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=gV4nQoki2lVFSdDACH47qd+qOY2uC3FwEoK7khTVcfewOQGMDA0m2ICV5wkyHwuYn yrRgOxslMU9uwYB1PxYNObqrNXwTH5TEjf9XlZI0LXeCEMkMjSphOy6UgzeOY9B24I icW+ogo1bYaXHDV07yp/XrVI4+dXw3S9uqw5OkASkBaQqQFq/TGUrZWdBK8s/s06Fj tM/Ct3lrUzQbtI/whGMkOYsvokXLZSawN1uCDdEr4m+OC+IgWUrGjYwR41ILxlmTyG ncQH5r9NA/7haGSMp2wkYwc3lqCn4FgHO2s0vAV9MlcAqf1RSuAR5AfydVyOq6gYv0 S5ddjAXusqjFw== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B99A2120489; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 11:53:57 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: control@debbugs.gnu.org (GNU bug tracker automated control server) Subject: Re: Processed: Re: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 11:53:56 -0500 In-Reply-To: (GNU bug tracker automated control server's message of "Thu, 14 Jan 2021 10:42:02 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.079 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) unarchive 30994 forcemerge 45857 30994 thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 14 13:21:06 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2021 18:21:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39143 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l07F4-0000IM-6i for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:21:06 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:8489) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l07Ez-0000HS-Mx; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:21:05 -0500 Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 387FF101AA5; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:20:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id B8A70100250; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:20:54 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610648454; bh=N8kWsFEtlteaNrqYs6dAB581rPt5p26YaG2lB4AfchI=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=Oy5Qhz+F8eWF+qL4r7oxNdVJnZq40fTQB8bQG40qMTkTkPWHDBO/n0P18+rU4/jvl Clpo4YYb+QcaZC83mTJzJ/zVw4jIA43c2hACu1o+CqpTH49hFZjrpBPpWcLR5sJBsZ /2W0YyKHkIHgABAkuT/tmlTkJoAo6YX0qfTpuuaWKKZ3wjO9P3gRvXftufqldU2ryr 8cfmqkrjBBm/kT24ssGPLX7QfdPIoke7FT+zt9z4MtPJkX9jXIDNbXiHdOaTJoUKhu O5pzLoQLJvOYnftJ+lulYmJ5b0WoMmehY2b3xxhdK9q67bsnrCR60FoF+IrqY8FOK/ e0zfBsQvGdj7w== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6943212046B; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:20:54 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Ola x Nilsson Subject: Re: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:20:53 -0500 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Thu, 14 Jan 2021 10:41:07 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.061 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) >> the package-user-dir defcustom gets the custom-initialize-delay >> intializer. At least for me, this overrides any setting of >> package-user-dir that is done in early-init.el. > Oh, I see you're right, and I think this issue is wider than > `package-user-dir` since it affects all the other vars that use > `custom-initialize-delay`. Back in June 2018, Eli wrote: > I can see several ways out of this: > > . Move the call to custom-reevaluate-setting back where it was, and > instead call custom-reevaluate-setting in that earlier place only > for Info-default-directory-list, which was the original reason why > the call was moved; > . Add a call to custom-reevaluate-setting for blink-cursor-mode > where the window-system is already set up; > . Call custom-reevaluate-setting for all the delayed-init variables > twice: once where we do that now, and again where we did that > before the above commit; > . Introduce yet another variable similar to > custom-delayed-init-variables, but separate from it, and put on > it all the delayed-init variables that need the window-system to > be set up, leaving all the rest in custom-delayed-init-variables. We ended up going with the 3rd option, but this is the source of the problem here. I think we should change to option 2 for now and plan on fixing it for good by removing this exception, i.e. by making the default value of `blink-cursor-mode` be t. More concretely, I suggest the patch below, Stefan diff --git a/lisp/startup.el b/lisp/startup.el index 57fd87f20f..8c9ac4e30f 100644 --- a/lisp/startup.el +++ b/lisp/startup.el @@ -1311,12 +1312,13 @@ command-line (startup--setup-quote-display) (setq internal--text-quoting-flag t)) - ;; Re-evaluate again the predefined variables whose initial value - ;; depends on the runtime context, in case some of them depend on - ;; the window-system features. Example: blink-cursor-mode. - (let (current-load-list) ; c-r-s may call defvar, and hence LOADHIST_ATTACH - (mapc 'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) - (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil)) + ;; Some vars's initialization need to be delayed yet further, until + ;; after we setup the real initial frame, because their initial + ;; value depends on the window-system features. + ;; Currently, the only such var is `blink-cursor-mode'. See bug#30994. + ;; FIXME: We should arrange for `blink-cursor-mode's default to be + ;; unconditionally `t' so as to finally eliminate this problem. + (custom-reevaluate-setting 'blink-cursor-mode) (normal-erase-is-backspace-setup-frame) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 14 13:41:01 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2021 18:41:02 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39180 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l07YL-0000mj-CH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:41:01 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:60746) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l07YJ-0000mG-7v; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:41:00 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:56215) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l07YA-00030p-38; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:40:50 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:3023 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l07Y5-0000Bf-Pq; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:40:50 -0500 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:40:45 +0200 Message-Id: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:20:53 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el References: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 13:20:53 -0500 > Cc: 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > > >> the package-user-dir defcustom gets the custom-initialize-delay > >> intializer. At least for me, this overrides any setting of > >> package-user-dir that is done in early-init.el. > > Oh, I see you're right, and I think this issue is wider than > > `package-user-dir` since it affects all the other vars that use > > `custom-initialize-delay`. > > Back in June 2018, Eli wrote: > > I can see several ways out of this: > > > > . Move the call to custom-reevaluate-setting back where it was, and > > instead call custom-reevaluate-setting in that earlier place only > > for Info-default-directory-list, which was the original reason why > > the call was moved; > > . Add a call to custom-reevaluate-setting for blink-cursor-mode > > where the window-system is already set up; > > . Call custom-reevaluate-setting for all the delayed-init variables > > twice: once where we do that now, and again where we did that > > before the above commit; > > . Introduce yet another variable similar to > > custom-delayed-init-variables, but separate from it, and put on > > it all the delayed-init variables that need the window-system to > > be set up, leaving all the rest in custom-delayed-init-variables. > > We ended up going with the 3rd option, but this is the source of the > problem here. I think we should change to option 2 for now and plan on > fixing it for good by removing this exception, i.e. by making > the default value of `blink-cursor-mode` be t. > > More concretely, I suggest the patch below, Is there any place where all these complications are described, so that people (and we ourselves) could have a complete, comprehensive overview of this stuff and the various problems it needs to solve? If not, how about taking this opportunity to describe that? Because otherwise these incidents will keep happening. FWIW, I'm not sure I have a good understand how is this old issue related to the new one. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 14 14:32:26 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2021 19:32:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39312 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l08M5-0004Oz-2q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:26 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:15471) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l08M1-0004Og-VM; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:23 -0500 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 5EB0480880; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 9836780722; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:14 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610652734; bh=5FxppJ3GkCI8vSDSI5Tpegi/4PddWJ2a7O15f1x+o7U=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=NbXL03i8jj0gdrpuQLILF+8slMOp2p3yzFBOWmyBs6dmhy9YnuSqNmzlSsTn+HU1o nsbU3Z8+N0sghCp5vjvphrVUJgPgwfeCWNHXhNor72OPE4khgLcxeM+QPoIN7wUESs a8LtfiDc/DtgZzk0sqk3wcuPDKHhXXRGiy0UPDbR5k5msnwglHYzRbipHoV4xD/VYi iZvqRhdSRENU6bk/xy8020rpn5caDE1o3m/xJgDuSGu0EJ4sU98MvqX8orgcRwvzWE zjg05lDzaXqzo90MLli562x3FQZYiVqVvJ8jFsJNCjCKKWiTEOqst7r6SsLzq0vAUL HJ+3mx8ogPOOQ== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 10B05120352; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:14 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:13 -0500 In-Reply-To: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 14 Jan 2021 20:40:45 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.078 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Is there any place where all these complications are described, so > that people (and we ourselves) could have a complete, comprehensive > overview of this stuff and the various problems it needs to solve? If > not, how about taking this opportunity to describe that? Because > otherwise these incidents will keep happening. Here's the story: We have a few variables which are predefined in the dumped Emacs but whose default value depends on information only available when Emacs is executed, such as the user's $HOME. We handle those using `custom-initialize-delayed`, so when the variable's `defcustom` is procesed the variable isn't initialized yet, and instead initialization happens in `startup.el` by calling `custom-reevaluate-setting` on each one of those delayed variables. In Emacs-26, we did that just before loading the `.emacs` file and everybody was happy. But the `early-init.el` file added to Emacs-27 introduced a difficulty there: - Those vars's values might be needed in `early-init.el` so we should call `custom-reevaluate-setting` before we load `early-init.el`. - The value of `blink-cursor-mode` depends on whether window-system is nil or not, which is only known after loading `early-init.el`, so we should call `custom-reevaluate-setting` after we load `early-init.el`. Currently we solve this by calling `custom-reevaluate-setting` twice for every one of those variables. But it means that we silently override any change made to those variables from `early-init.el`. As noted, the only var whose default value needs to be (re)computed after loading `early-init.el` is `blink-cursor-mode`. In theory there could be more, but I think we should aim to reduce rather than increase those cases. E.g. the current way `blink-cursor-mode` is defined means that if I start `emacs -Q -nw` and later create a GUI frame, that frame won't have a blinking cursor. I think this is a bug (tho I can see that some people may consider it a feature if they (like me) dislike blinking cursors ;-0) Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 14 15:41:36 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2021 20:41:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39411 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l09R2-0006Af-Jp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 15:41:36 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39938) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l09Qz-0006AN-2c; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 15:41:35 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:59164) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l09Qs-0004LD-Vk; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 15:41:26 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:2648 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l09Qs-0000nu-5E; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 15:41:26 -0500 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 22:41:22 +0200 Message-Id: <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:13 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 14:32:13 -0500 > > > Is there any place where all these complications are described, so > > that people (and we ourselves) could have a complete, comprehensive > > overview of this stuff and the various problems it needs to solve? If > > not, how about taking this opportunity to describe that? Because > > otherwise these incidents will keep happening. > > Here's the story: Thanks, I actually meant to have that in the sources in some prominent place. > Currently we solve this by calling `custom-reevaluate-setting` twice for > every one of those variables. But it means that we silently override > any change made to those variables from `early-init.el`. > > As noted, the only var whose default value needs to be (re)computed > after loading `early-init.el` is `blink-cursor-mode`. In theory there > could be more, but I think we should aim to reduce rather than increase > those cases. I think relying on a small number of such variables is not future-proof enough. This case is a living proof: we decided something 2 years ago, but changes we did since then require us now to change that decision, which means we risk bumping into issues which we wanted to avoid back then. That's a general problem with kludgey solutions. I think we need some new infrastructure that would support the two init files that are loaded in different stages of startup. Basically, some variables can only be usefully initialized after some part(s) of startup have happened already. One way of dealing with this is to have the variables record this information (e.g., in a plist of their symbol) that would allow us evaluate each variable only once, at the earliest opportunity where the prerequisites are fulfilled. > E.g. the current way `blink-cursor-mode` is defined means that if I > start `emacs -Q -nw` and later create a GUI frame, that frame won't > have a blinking cursor. I think this is a bug (tho I can see that > some people may consider it a feature if they (like me) dislike > blinking cursors ;-0) I think that's a separate issue. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jan 14 16:02:44 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2021 21:02:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39432 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l09lT-0006hp-4G for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:44 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:15130) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l09lP-0006hX-BW; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:41 -0500 Received: from pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id C6DDB440F73; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id F26DE440F6E; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:31 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610658151; bh=vxr3jwmcEZ88hQNld0L4jPhTSyTfvSAU0v4oVh+te6I=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=n/4gD5cZoD6gLocTuEp5IcTY2vp8xr1IiiHzxG9dBIXp1eudtERRKSFNYv9iAKher GkWqzjz+FcbcK0jtbhxUDUZkJ1TmzK2irstcy2XjhH7yXbNwLTxs1TcVJHH6kllTLG GtWWb3ke6JZKL7felAd86NShOZMqK8CMCreUmgxeoxGaTsTcl9N8k3c9aj7RVLCwqP 1eN1FWSlb5teE3NaXTVc4hx7rI44M/v502HLEup4m+Q54HsedI5CApyoWsp6RMJ6ng PUJYsELnIrppa4Dtk7mc6QOxbBzM7PlIzedjLywf57nxG45lVjDvDwNxkphufvsMtN Z8ZgJ2mqtgmqQ== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AE3B61201CC; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:31 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:30 -0500 In-Reply-To: <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 14 Jan 2021 22:41:22 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.042 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Thanks, I actually meant to have that in the sources in some prominent > place. Ah, OK, I'll do that. >> Currently we solve this by calling `custom-reevaluate-setting` twice for >> every one of those variables. But it means that we silently override >> any change made to those variables from `early-init.el`. >> >> As noted, the only var whose default value needs to be (re)computed >> after loading `early-init.el` is `blink-cursor-mode`. In theory there >> could be more, but I think we should aim to reduce rather than increase >> those cases. > > I think relying on a small number of such variables is not > future-proof enough. This case is a living proof: we decided > something 2 years ago, but changes we did since then require us now to > change that decision, which means we risk bumping into issues which we > wanted to avoid back then. That's a general problem with kludgey > solutions. Indeed. Other than eliminate the `blink-cursor-mode` special case, I can't see how to make it less kludgey. > I think we need some new infrastructure that would support the two > init files that are loaded in different stages of startup. > > Basically, some variables can only be usefully initialized after some > part(s) of startup have happened already. One way of dealing with > this is to have the variables record this information (e.g., in a > plist of their symbol) that would allow us evaluate each variable only > once, at the earliest opportunity where the prerequisites are > fulfilled. In theory I would agree, but: - We don't have any such system to record dependencies, so we'd have to design and implement it. A minimal version would simply duplicate `customize-initialize-delayed` into two different options depending on the stage at which we should initialize it, but that'd still be pretty ad-hoc. - The only need for this complexity is `blink-cursor-mode` and it's only needed because we currently handle `blink-cursor-mode` incorrectly. So, I'd rather fix the bug and avoid the complexity. >> E.g. the current way `blink-cursor-mode` is defined means that if I >> start `emacs -Q -nw` and later create a GUI frame, that frame won't >> have a blinking cursor. I think this is a bug (tho I can see that >> some people may consider it a feature if they (like me) dislike >> blinking cursors ;-0) > I think that's a separate issue. Agreed, which is why the patch I propose keeps this for later. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 15 02:52:24 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jan 2021 07:52:24 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39825 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0JuC-0005gQ-A4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 02:52:24 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:35306) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0JuA-0005gA-Cv; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 02:52:22 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:40713) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l0Ju3-0004iE-2l; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 02:52:16 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:4080 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l0Ju2-0001KG-Is; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 02:52:14 -0500 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 09:52:12 +0200 Message-Id: <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:30 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 16:02:30 -0500 > > > I think relying on a small number of such variables is not > > future-proof enough. This case is a living proof: we decided > > something 2 years ago, but changes we did since then require us now to > > change that decision, which means we risk bumping into issues which we > > wanted to avoid back then. That's a general problem with kludgey > > solutions. > > Indeed. Other than eliminate the `blink-cursor-mode` special case, > I can't see how to make it less kludgey. But that's still the same kludge: we will rely on the fact that there are currently no (i.e. zero, a.k.a. "a small number") of such variables. > > Basically, some variables can only be usefully initialized after some > > part(s) of startup have happened already. One way of dealing with > > this is to have the variables record this information (e.g., in a > > plist of their symbol) that would allow us evaluate each variable only > > once, at the earliest opportunity where the prerequisites are > > fulfilled. > > In theory I would agree, but: > - We don't have any such system to record dependencies, so we'd have to > design and implement it. A minimal version would simply duplicate > `customize-initialize-delayed` into two different options depending on > the stage at which we should initialize it, but that'd still be pretty > ad-hoc. It isn't ad-hoc, because the stages in the startup process and their effects are clearly defined and didn't change much for a long time. > - The only need for this complexity is `blink-cursor-mode` and it's only > needed because we currently handle `blink-cursor-mode` incorrectly. > So, I'd rather fix the bug and avoid the complexity. That'd probably work for another couple of years, and then break again. The early-init file introduction is letting a genie out of the bottle: we don't yet know what it will eventually require, but we already see some serious problems it causes that we need to adapt to. I say we should get ready for the future now. Introducing the infrastructure I mentioned is not a big deal. I don't want to argue further about this, so if you are still unconvinced, so be it. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 15 11:09:10 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jan 2021 16:09:10 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41537 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0Rew-0005YU-EO for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:09:10 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:30533) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0Reu-0005YF-TA; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:09:09 -0500 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 592D780611; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:09:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id BCAC78063C; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:09:01 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610726941; bh=1mHaLqVayr280HxFisojQRB8pnWaGWHHfxjX0QNvfJI=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=jvPtH9oR34pNPDVUPZ8DPUUID/+G23Dt21F1TvcklU8jgZu3S39v0PTcIQfLw5Y/o 5eaCNJ/JVpygYEZewgxSmy7gOp78zp/zUJO3x5paKFWa+BSHIXhmnmmWQnQly8X84G EKrUj37+w/v3V8SFsXafeapu9uQs8stkrS4VMQT2JDGPFkaGKUetjKoA9aAMGL9qG6 2bkkwf0AkAISmP7w8nqyY0AQBPwM7u8PKIu05kTXiOf46u7nFSik86TwSmNlNpahIJ bMebFQ/EfhA5O5B4UXFZt8qaufZPq7RmO5MEUJjup0fbTza7kWnDaOqRrO87yBc76T jAwlPW1is89Hw== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 39D68120376; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:09:01 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:08:52 -0500 In-Reply-To: <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 15 Jan 2021 09:52:12 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.077 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > But that's still the same kludge: we will rely on the fact that there > are currently no (i.e. zero, a.k.a. "a small number") of such > variables. I'm hoping that there's a good reason why the one exception we have suffers from a bug, and for that reason we should resist the temptation to add more such cases. >> > Basically, some variables can only be usefully initialized after some >> > part(s) of startup have happened already. One way of dealing with >> > this is to have the variables record this information (e.g., in a >> > plist of their symbol) that would allow us evaluate each variable only >> > once, at the earliest opportunity where the prerequisites are >> > fulfilled. [...] > I say we should get ready for the future now. Introducing the > infrastructure I mentioned is not a big deal. Hmm... maybe I misunderstood what you meant by that infrastructure, then. Could you outline more concretely what it would look like? Also, would it currently result in a behavior that's different from: - initialize all delayed vars before early-init - re-initialize blink-cursor-mode after early-init ? Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 15 13:26:06 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jan 2021 18:26:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41729 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0TnR-0002dF-0l for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 13:26:06 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:33426) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0TnM-0002cd-C1; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 13:26:03 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:35184) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l0TnF-0007uW-A3; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 13:25:53 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:3673 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l0TnC-0005Np-PB; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 13:25:51 -0500 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 20:25:49 +0200 Message-Id: <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:08:52 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 11:08:52 -0500 > > >> > Basically, some variables can only be usefully initialized after some > >> > part(s) of startup have happened already. One way of dealing with > >> > this is to have the variables record this information (e.g., in a > >> > plist of their symbol) that would allow us evaluate each variable only > >> > once, at the earliest opportunity where the prerequisites are > >> > fulfilled. > [...] > > I say we should get ready for the future now. Introducing the > > infrastructure I mentioned is not a big deal. > > Hmm... maybe I misunderstood what you meant by that infrastructure, then. > Could you outline more concretely what it would look like? In a nutshell: record the startup phase for each variable in a plits of its symbol. > Also, would it currently result in a behavior that's different from: > > - initialize all delayed vars before early-init > - re-initialize blink-cursor-mode after early-init > > ? With my proposal, blink-cursor-mode will not be mentioned by name in any of these places. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 15 17:19:44 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jan 2021 22:19:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41918 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0XRY-0001yB-0W for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:44 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:62678) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0XRV-0001xv-IB; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:42 -0500 Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 0588D102381; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 65204100250; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:34 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610749174; bh=tq85eMmbiAZLcSCVvyh8k94T57wuH2nB6M7RJgm/Ivs=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=LTPVSDlzK8jmQgGE6uTV+GL/q2RNl6SicVraGDBo33Wzy0t+uAEPRzuW0gdPHYXMH alMeIOgKbfnI7i6LIGHsCmtWO3bUkGLlZhR9s3bPyHvUTz/xzUVvg8ZfrUWoe2rumP UyfKDae/ySKNQkhBdBm7ds9H/S1cfNfK38iAYcLiHz6jDNYaRDlufE+WbVUp0zOqqf druGb5GyvC6C3D/rzgATOQHU5sY/uqrcQd91vojBAL/WS6dKbBcTAX8qValMr24nCX h8V0vpEp3IqIXT0eY78Xq9T3adhYflk8h3ihAf7Qnyb1ppFf5WSKRtIP8qBzOmeuLh FwU1kajbn/28g== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2711312046D; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:34 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:33 -0500 In-Reply-To: <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 15 Jan 2021 20:25:49 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.061 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) >> >> > Basically, some variables can only be usefully initialized after some >> >> > part(s) of startup have happened already. One way of dealing with >> >> > this is to have the variables record this information (e.g., in a >> >> > plist of their symbol) that would allow us evaluate each variable only >> >> > once, at the earliest opportunity where the prerequisites are >> >> > fulfilled. >> [...] >> > I say we should get ready for the future now. Introducing the >> > infrastructure I mentioned is not a big deal. >> Hmm... maybe I misunderstood what you meant by that infrastructure, then. >> Could you outline more concretely what it would look like? > In a nutshell: record the startup phase for each variable in a plits > of its symbol. Ah, so instead of just :initialize #'custom-initialize-delay we'd have something like :initialize (custom-initialize-delay 'before-early-init) or :initialize (custom-initialize-delay 'after-early-init) Where `custom-initialize-delay` becomes something like (defun custom-initialize-delay (phase) (lambda (symbol) (push (cons symbol phase) custom-delayed-init-variables))) depending on when we want the initialization to take place? >> Also, would it currently result in a behavior that's different from: >> >> - initialize all delayed vars before early-init >> - re-initialize blink-cursor-mode after early-init >> >> ? > > With my proposal, blink-cursor-mode will not be mentioned by name in > any of these places. Yes, of course, but I'm asking whether the resulting *behavior* you're after is this one. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 15 23:52:41 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jan 2021 04:52:41 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42244 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0dZp-0002yJ-8w for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:41 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:48637) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0dZm-0002y2-Kl; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:40 -0500 Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 1091F10247E; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id F0055102380; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:30 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1610772751; bh=53PmadSLVUsVX+nKWKZQ1GFjtHsAnNroR9c/U57oiKM=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=hX0DLC1Td2cuzOjpEzqeDJzPACSQlNTqyLN5DcwbNjIPWkj2YeswmDOI0fbQ4rlv5 Pw+pW36Mj6/K81KVVs3MC4K48sX8ddxggn3w8L38svBjOxc1nv/cfNsorQ5AaaIMO1 j+Rg/OVaBMVu48knG199Q3NAj6w8ay+J0WKU2qTJkPexT3fFNFC0PEi1J0863jyct8 uLQX+uKeXufnANPiUhQgVDibo1PDc+j9FwlrCAdedmGIJZZMIYZ+vMXKrNAr88KHur +iqXc+c+4efFJMwdpG4QkX6RkQXOVpaNfyKs1u7hTzM8HDfYzehug7fwE1q7ONm3cU MofBmgwLB4H1g== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8F75912051C; Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:30 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:29 -0500 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:33 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.060 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) I looked at the issue of the default value of `blink-cursor-mode` and it's actually easy to make it be t unconditionally, so as to eliminate the need to re-evaluate variables after loading `early-init.el`. Maybe some time in the future this need will re-appear at which point we may want to introduce some fancier system to control which var is initialized when, but I think for now the patch below is a better solution. Stefan 2021-01-15 Stefan Monnier * lisp/startup.el: Fix bug#45857, bug#30994, and bug#45913. (command-line): Don't re-evaluate the `custom-delayed-init-variables` a second time after reading the `early-init.el` file. (x-apply-session-resources): Set `blink-cursor-mode` rather than `no-blinking-cursor`. * lisp/frame.el (blink-cursor-start): Turn `blink-cursor-mode` off if `blink-cursor-mode` was set to nil. (blink-cursor-mode): Default to it being enabled regardless of `window-system`. diff --git a/lisp/frame.el b/lisp/frame.el index e2d7f21a49..06aab269dd 100644 --- a/lisp/frame.el +++ b/lisp/frame.el @@ -2552,13 +2552,15 @@ blink-cursor-start This starts the timer `blink-cursor-timer', which makes the cursor blink if appropriate. It also arranges to cancel that timer when the next command starts, by installing a pre-command hook." - (when (null blink-cursor-timer) + (cond + ((null blink-cursor-mode) (blink-cursor-mode -1)) + ((null blink-cursor-timer) ;; Set up the timer first, so that if this signals an error, ;; blink-cursor-end is not added to pre-command-hook. (setq blink-cursor-blinks-done 1) (blink-cursor--start-timer) (add-hook 'pre-command-hook #'blink-cursor-end) - (internal-show-cursor nil nil))) + (internal-show-cursor nil nil)))) (defun blink-cursor-timer-function () "Timer function of timer `blink-cursor-timer'." @@ -2637,9 +2639,8 @@ blink-cursor-mode terminals, cursor blinking is controlled by the terminal." :init-value (not (or noninteractive no-blinking-cursor - (eq system-type 'ms-dos) - (not (display-blink-cursor-p)))) - :initialize 'custom-initialize-delay + (eq system-type 'ms-dos))) + :initialize #'custom-initialize-delay :group 'cursor :global t (blink-cursor-suspend) diff --git a/lisp/startup.el b/lisp/startup.el index 552802a38d..7011fbf458 100644 --- a/lisp/startup.el +++ b/lisp/startup.el @@ -1172,6 +1172,7 @@ command-line ;; are dependencies between them. (nreverse custom-delayed-init-variables)) (mapc #'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) + (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil) ;; Warn for invalid user name. (when init-file-user @@ -1301,12 +1302,6 @@ command-line (startup--setup-quote-display) (setq internal--text-quoting-flag t)) - ;; Re-evaluate again the predefined variables whose initial value - ;; depends on the runtime context, in case some of them depend on - ;; the window-system features. Example: blink-cursor-mode. - (mapc #'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) - (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil) - (normal-erase-is-backspace-setup-frame) ;; Register default TTY colors for the case the terminal hasn't a @@ -1487,13 +1482,13 @@ x-apply-session-resources opens a graphical frame. This can set the values of `menu-bar-mode', `tool-bar-mode', -`tab-bar-mode', and `no-blinking-cursor', as well as the `cursor' face. +`tab-bar-mode', and `blink-cursor-mode', as well as the `cursor' face. Changed settings will be marked as \"CHANGED outside of Customize\"." (let ((no-vals '("no" "off" "false" "0")) (settings '(("menuBar" "MenuBar" menu-bar-mode nil) ("toolBar" "ToolBar" tool-bar-mode nil) ("scrollBar" "ScrollBar" scroll-bar-mode nil) - ("cursorBlink" "CursorBlink" no-blinking-cursor t)))) + ("cursorBlink" "CursorBlink" blink-cursor-mode nil)))) (dolist (x settings) (if (member (x-get-resource (nth 0 x) (nth 1 x)) no-vals) (set (nth 2 x) (nth 3 x))))) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jan 16 02:08:24 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Jan 2021 07:08:24 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42308 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0fhA-0006IK-8U for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 16 Jan 2021 02:08:24 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:35986) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l0fh5-0006I1-Uf; Sat, 16 Jan 2021 02:08:22 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:50314) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l0fgz-0003f9-Dp; Sat, 16 Jan 2021 02:08:13 -0500 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:2764 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1l0fgy-0005Ui-AU; Sat, 16 Jan 2021 02:08:12 -0500 Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2021 09:08:12 +0200 Message-Id: <83ft319x5v.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stefan Monnier In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:33 -0500) Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45857@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 17:19:33 -0500 > > > In a nutshell: record the startup phase for each variable in a plits > > of its symbol. > > Ah, so instead of just > > :initialize #'custom-initialize-delay > > we'd have something like > > :initialize (custom-initialize-delay 'before-early-init) > or > :initialize (custom-initialize-delay 'after-early-init) > > Where `custom-initialize-delay` becomes something like > > (defun custom-initialize-delay (phase) > (lambda (symbol) > (push (cons symbol phase) custom-delayed-init-variables))) > > depending on when we want the initialization to take place? Yes, something like that. Also 'after-init-file, 'after-term-setup, 'after-window-setup -- per the startup phases we already have. > >> Also, would it currently result in a behavior that's different from: > >> > >> - initialize all delayed vars before early-init > >> - re-initialize blink-cursor-mode after early-init > >> > >> ? > > > > With my proposal, blink-cursor-mode will not be mentioned by name in > > any of these places. > > Yes, of course, but I'm asking whether the resulting *behavior* you're > after is this one. The current result will be the same, yes. But I think it's more future-proof, the only thing that needs to be figured out is the earliest startup phase after which a given variable needs to be initialized. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 19 12:12:09 2021 Received: (at 30994-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Jan 2021 17:12:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51456 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l1uY4-0001Cj-Un for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:12:09 -0500 Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:25215) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l1uY1-0001C7-Qr; Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:12:07 -0500 Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 11A80809A7; Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:12:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 5353D805F4; Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:11:58 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1611076318; bh=DWwzP8btQWt0C8JZSXZYfbeymIF19gh40k5BkTjxvRQ=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=o/SDHF8iQac1yqS895ibLr+JH756Wp0BCMA3UPpCsUfVWWfOAiBDOBTzPVWpk4rIv RkoWdmBnxO5EkMYHHQWZLyDIleHUEcWMSJOLXkVe7WT/bVv4jRG96nmbpqfty8zZku +xjX9fXyterFIsWPTD4ojnrnjJ3GOLuXnRTw+Sv1HBYnrQ29xTBpN/+/Cc1EcXq3Lt YcWHhQU7wFaMGOlz2+IdVfCW1U/yzQjspwl88xBZRlbIGP6cKuZMf+iDScaD58Ghso SPqL/msGOpsY8J8WWqEjRAKXI9Jx02DWbeKVoPQBeGaZIHF4FWqf9z8WVVdXGgE9Y3 1CKj1VvRS3s7g== Received: from alfajor (unknown [45.72.224.181]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0E344120177; Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:11:58 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el Message-ID: References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:11:57 -0500 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Fri, 15 Jan 2021 23:52:29 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-SPAM-INFO: Spam detection results: 0 ALL_TRUSTED -1 Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP AWL -0.071 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain X-SPAM-LEVEL: X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994-done Cc: ola.x.nilsson@axis.com, 45913-done@debbugs.gnu.org, 45857-done@debbugs.gnu.org, 30994-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Maybe some time in the future this need will re-appear at which point we > may want to introduce some fancier system to control which var is > initialized when, but I think for now the patch below is > a better solution. Pushed, Stefan > > Stefan > > > 2021-01-15 Stefan Monnier > > * lisp/startup.el: Fix bug#45857, bug#30994, and bug#45913. > > (command-line): Don't re-evaluate the `custom-delayed-init-variables` > a second time after reading the `early-init.el` file. > (x-apply-session-resources): Set `blink-cursor-mode` rather than > `no-blinking-cursor`. > > * lisp/frame.el (blink-cursor-start): Turn `blink-cursor-mode` off > if `blink-cursor-mode` was set to nil. > (blink-cursor-mode): Default to it being enabled regardless of > `window-system`. > > > diff --git a/lisp/frame.el b/lisp/frame.el > index e2d7f21a49..06aab269dd 100644 > --- a/lisp/frame.el > +++ b/lisp/frame.el > @@ -2552,13 +2552,15 @@ blink-cursor-start > This starts the timer `blink-cursor-timer', which makes the cursor blink > if appropriate. It also arranges to cancel that timer when the next > command starts, by installing a pre-command hook." > - (when (null blink-cursor-timer) > + (cond > + ((null blink-cursor-mode) (blink-cursor-mode -1)) > + ((null blink-cursor-timer) > ;; Set up the timer first, so that if this signals an error, > ;; blink-cursor-end is not added to pre-command-hook. > (setq blink-cursor-blinks-done 1) > (blink-cursor--start-timer) > (add-hook 'pre-command-hook #'blink-cursor-end) > - (internal-show-cursor nil nil))) > + (internal-show-cursor nil nil)))) > > (defun blink-cursor-timer-function () > "Timer function of timer `blink-cursor-timer'." > @@ -2637,9 +2639,8 @@ blink-cursor-mode > terminals, cursor blinking is controlled by the terminal." > :init-value (not (or noninteractive > no-blinking-cursor > - (eq system-type 'ms-dos) > - (not (display-blink-cursor-p)))) > - :initialize 'custom-initialize-delay > + (eq system-type 'ms-dos))) > + :initialize #'custom-initialize-delay > :group 'cursor > :global t > (blink-cursor-suspend) > diff --git a/lisp/startup.el b/lisp/startup.el > index 552802a38d..7011fbf458 100644 > --- a/lisp/startup.el > +++ b/lisp/startup.el > @@ -1172,6 +1172,7 @@ command-line > ;; are dependencies between them. > (nreverse custom-delayed-init-variables)) > (mapc #'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) > + (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil) > > ;; Warn for invalid user name. > (when init-file-user > @@ -1301,12 +1302,6 @@ command-line > (startup--setup-quote-display) > (setq internal--text-quoting-flag t)) > > - ;; Re-evaluate again the predefined variables whose initial value > - ;; depends on the runtime context, in case some of them depend on > - ;; the window-system features. Example: blink-cursor-mode. > - (mapc #'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) > - (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil) > - > (normal-erase-is-backspace-setup-frame) > > ;; Register default TTY colors for the case the terminal hasn't a > @@ -1487,13 +1482,13 @@ x-apply-session-resources > opens a graphical frame. > > This can set the values of `menu-bar-mode', `tool-bar-mode', > -`tab-bar-mode', and `no-blinking-cursor', as well as the `cursor' face. > +`tab-bar-mode', and `blink-cursor-mode', as well as the `cursor' face. > Changed settings will be marked as \"CHANGED outside of Customize\"." > (let ((no-vals '("no" "off" "false" "0")) > (settings '(("menuBar" "MenuBar" menu-bar-mode nil) > ("toolBar" "ToolBar" tool-bar-mode nil) > ("scrollBar" "ScrollBar" scroll-bar-mode nil) > - ("cursorBlink" "CursorBlink" no-blinking-cursor t)))) > + ("cursorBlink" "CursorBlink" blink-cursor-mode nil)))) > (dolist (x settings) > (if (member (x-get-resource (nth 0 x) (nth 1 x)) no-vals) > (set (nth 2 x) (nth 3 x))))) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jan 22 11:08:44 2021 Received: (at 30994) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jan 2021 16:08:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32799 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l2yzM-0006ei-38 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Jan 2021 11:08:44 -0500 Received: from cloud103.planethippo.com ([78.129.138.110]:43646) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1l2yzG-0006eV-Nu for 30994@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 22 Jan 2021 11:08:43 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=russet.org.uk; s=default; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type: MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Date:In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender :Reply-To:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From: Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help: List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=5O1sHvRG2ODrfXjqh6Zei+7ASEeW35bPZdlKHNm2O+8=; b=dledDKtfr1nAHKVDq2KRKmKElK VE7uV27s2gDdBW0Od2x8Y2ZgaZrLZtORC1AajmKdM4VhPmhtP06Mv+ZLb774ghr04LT/5e6mH0nyh +D45wlN/8Spls3efJ8bkPYKHUYq6n3bfw8IPyUVIxGn4JqiZrUBdaiBR/f91l4FOLBJR/ZUEixhx4 HUfIragG2aKvt6fRYWpNS1Wumohplyez2RaYTK4G4idyqYQVV4rdeI1A6zZt1ZnGBn6zF2csqEjfq 5gqNLQZeIgSzmxkAa9MIRxa30Tq3TFnwMART7mVQ/Llh7J5JZxDaQ3RS+PaB9DzF47haiOkUDdmOs QLK9QkNQ==; Received: from cpc142648-benw12-2-0-cust627.16-2.cable.virginm.net ([82.10.74.116]:47918 helo=russet.org.uk) by cloud103.planethippo.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1l2yzD-000150-AA; Fri, 22 Jan 2021 16:08:35 +0000 From: Phillip Lord To: 30994@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#30994: bug#45857: 28.0.50; Not possible to set package-user-dir in early-init.el In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Tue, 19 Jan 2021 12:11:57 -0500") Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 16:08:27 +0000 Message-ID: <87k0s57y4k.fsf@russet.org.uk> References: <83o8hrbbv6.fsf@gnu.org> <83h7njb6a5.fsf@gnu.org> <835z3ybpsj.fsf@gnu.org> <83k0se9hw2.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.1.90 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - cloud103.planethippo.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - debbugs.gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - russet.org.uk X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: cloud103.planethippo.com: authenticated_id: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk X-Authenticated-Sender: cloud103.planethippo.com: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30994 Cc: michael_heerdegen@web.de, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) I am still getting start up package.el oddities. While I can reset package-user-dir in early-init.el now and it is correct when init.el starts up, my package-initialize is raising an error from auctex in my case. Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading =E2=80=98/hom= e/phillord/.emacs.d/init.el=E2=80=99: File is missing: Cannot open load file, No such file or directory, tex-= site package-user-dir looks right package-user-dir is a variable defined in =E2=80=98package.el=E2=80=99. Its value is "~/.emacs.d/elpa/28.0" Original value was "~/.emacs.d/elpa" but load-path is not correct, having been set up for the default location of package-user-dir load-path is a variable defined in =E2=80=98C source code=E2=80=99. Its value is ("/home/phillord/.emacs.d/elpa/auctex-13.0.3" "/home/phillord/.emacs.d/elpa= /cider-1.0.0" "/home/phillord/.emacs.d/elpa/clojure-mode-5.12.0" ..... Phil Stefan Monnier writes: >> Maybe some time in the future this need will re-appear at which point we >> may want to introduce some fancier system to control which var is >> initialized when, but I think for now the patch below is >> a better solution. > > Pushed, > > > Stefan > >> >> Stefan >> >> >> 2021-01-15 Stefan Monnier >> >> * lisp/startup.el: Fix bug#45857, bug#30994, and bug#45913. >> >> (command-line): Don't re-evaluate the `custom-delayed-init-variables` >> a second time after reading the `early-init.el` file. >> (x-apply-session-resources): Set `blink-cursor-mode` rather than >> `no-blinking-cursor`. >> >> * lisp/frame.el (blink-cursor-start): Turn `blink-cursor-mode` off >> if `blink-cursor-mode` was set to nil. >> (blink-cursor-mode): Default to it being enabled regardless of >> `window-system`. >> >> >> diff --git a/lisp/frame.el b/lisp/frame.el >> index e2d7f21a49..06aab269dd 100644 >> --- a/lisp/frame.el >> +++ b/lisp/frame.el >> @@ -2552,13 +2552,15 @@ blink-cursor-start >> This starts the timer `blink-cursor-timer', which makes the cursor blink >> if appropriate. It also arranges to cancel that timer when the next >> command starts, by installing a pre-command hook." >> - (when (null blink-cursor-timer) >> + (cond >> + ((null blink-cursor-mode) (blink-cursor-mode -1)) >> + ((null blink-cursor-timer) >> ;; Set up the timer first, so that if this signals an error, >> ;; blink-cursor-end is not added to pre-command-hook. >> (setq blink-cursor-blinks-done 1) >> (blink-cursor--start-timer) >> (add-hook 'pre-command-hook #'blink-cursor-end) >> - (internal-show-cursor nil nil))) >> + (internal-show-cursor nil nil)))) >>=20=20 >> (defun blink-cursor-timer-function () >> "Timer function of timer `blink-cursor-timer'." >> @@ -2637,9 +2639,8 @@ blink-cursor-mode >> terminals, cursor blinking is controlled by the terminal." >> :init-value (not (or noninteractive >> no-blinking-cursor >> - (eq system-type 'ms-dos) >> - (not (display-blink-cursor-p)))) >> - :initialize 'custom-initialize-delay >> + (eq system-type 'ms-dos))) >> + :initialize #'custom-initialize-delay >> :group 'cursor >> :global t >> (blink-cursor-suspend) >> diff --git a/lisp/startup.el b/lisp/startup.el >> index 552802a38d..7011fbf458 100644 >> --- a/lisp/startup.el >> +++ b/lisp/startup.el >> @@ -1172,6 +1172,7 @@ command-line >> ;; are dependencies between them. >> (nreverse custom-delayed-init-variables)) >> (mapc #'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) >> + (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil) >>=20=20 >> ;; Warn for invalid user name. >> (when init-file-user >> @@ -1301,12 +1302,6 @@ command-line >> (startup--setup-quote-display) >> (setq internal--text-quoting-flag t)) >>=20=20 >> - ;; Re-evaluate again the predefined variables whose initial value >> - ;; depends on the runtime context, in case some of them depend on >> - ;; the window-system features. Example: blink-cursor-mode. >> - (mapc #'custom-reevaluate-setting custom-delayed-init-variables) >> - (setq custom-delayed-init-variables nil) >> - >> (normal-erase-is-backspace-setup-frame) >>=20=20 >> ;; Register default TTY colors for the case the terminal hasn't a >> @@ -1487,13 +1482,13 @@ x-apply-session-resources >> opens a graphical frame. >>=20=20 >> This can set the values of `menu-bar-mode', `tool-bar-mode', >> -`tab-bar-mode', and `no-blinking-cursor', as well as the `cursor' face. >> +`tab-bar-mode', and `blink-cursor-mode', as well as the `cursor' face. >> Changed settings will be marked as \"CHANGED outside of Customize\"." >> (let ((no-vals '("no" "off" "false" "0")) >> (settings '(("menuBar" "MenuBar" menu-bar-mode nil) >> ("toolBar" "ToolBar" tool-bar-mode nil) >> ("scrollBar" "ScrollBar" scroll-bar-mode nil) >> - ("cursorBlink" "CursorBlink" no-blinking-cursor t)))) >> + ("cursorBlink" "CursorBlink" blink-cursor-mode nil)))) >> (dolist (x settings) >> (if (member (x-get-resource (nth 0 x) (nth 1 x)) no-vals) >> (set (nth 2 x) (nth 3 x))))) From unknown Tue Jun 24 03:24:16 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2021 12:24:07 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator