From unknown Sat Aug 16 16:07:51 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#30204 <30204@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#30204 <30204@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec Reply-To: bug#30204 <30204@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2025 23:07:51 +0000 retitle 30204 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility = spec reassign 30204 emacs submitter 30204 Philipp Stephani severity 30204 minor tag 30204 moreinfo thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 22 04:51:53 2018 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jan 2018 09:51:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37700 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1edYld-0004Cl-HG for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:53 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:45198) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1edYlb-0004CX-Q2 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:52 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edYlV-0007uG-CX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT,FREEMAIL_FROM,T_DKIM_INVALID autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:60490) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edYlV-0007uA-8S for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:45 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36169) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edYlT-0004Ox-RI for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:45 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edYlN-0007sB-Hk for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:43 -0500 Received: from mail-wr0-x22c.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c0c::22c]:38689) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edYlN-0007rh-Az for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 04:51:37 -0500 Received: by mail-wr0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id x1so7896939wrb.5 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 01:51:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=0FFNrkmA9jE1yOYiND/+Af6659yr+eQB6OyULewz8mY=; b=mjElobXG4VHpuXqmIVoNAZkowmjwk9IE1XJVhehCtKamB9v2aqS4Ippl1wq1RsOsgJ RcqgwNuErU9v5KaCLma4ISFF+xSN5m1ejOxTLD1A0rJPQF1WRxZou4aGnD2tBP3kZc1g s0o3LpwjgIZyKosMoRRhw3RZlHG1zn+a7Oc8aX5rn92oc8pfA+dsSRnTIB2LxSLaUSYJ RTMVejKz8AFr57Z23jW3iwiroaSykMCc+KMfPdOp4oM4Rk+n/gbSJqwIGezF7sMZf4FT PDewZSyfyFaySnUFKVP8J16FGo1CVH+nAV7tCOhkbc0wZ4mQTaGCUX6bJUt5+qEbo6du Zi1w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=0FFNrkmA9jE1yOYiND/+Af6659yr+eQB6OyULewz8mY=; b=BofF8eT95ALvRE6QYeTb/j8fNH9Lr0LvKrfOzQGsdiIpcuDCamKTh7zObS2bW+pQhq ubAPSpEPkWR7KKUJgAb1TKSiLBZ0xoJizqZhqS+AR6VhCY7gZqkOBIyLrgNANKGTdBgY q52BWoq5qlu0dLDt6yFs1sdnODsoMIhztYeY/E1XnifocZGqeaEDrZABYz+QZu8BjYTI VhhPHc/a7Vaed94R7CsrGu/3v1FCXDoOH2b1kXevnrca2FddJ85h3FuMzQ2KLL4XUbNx 8KLf1pKyuFaWXTysrymQQnH3Zf9XZc7zon8c90X84R+55Yc+HAgXM1hAlvoLvaPkWpIl c3mg== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxyteBSYBhPJYDpek9ZgpGL5wWe8NL7j3op7t6+GNcUMhEUG/F/Sg9 Kiy45Lb+iplnrxBwzB6lUM/LMWKt X-Google-Smtp-Source: AH8x22756uxrRo++Kc3QxX+szklF1JsljnqdnD8661mhRe5UScyFFfVgifw0wa6rQCTPq7HnT9ZV9w== X-Received: by 10.223.164.22 with SMTP id d22mr5790363wra.186.1516614695492; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 01:51:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from a.muc.corp.google.com ([2a00:79e0:15:4:bfda:710c:4a38:a674]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f48sm10448181wra.72.2018.01.22.01.51.33 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Mon, 22 Jan 2018 01:51:34 -0800 (PST) From: Philipp Stephani To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -3.8 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.8 (---) C-x b *foo* RET M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize "foo" 'invis= ible 'foo))) Now "foo" is visible, as it should be. M-x fundamental-mode =3D> "foo" becomes invisible, because `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec' to t. This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility properties such as markdown-mode. Probably `kill-all-local-variables' shouldn't blindly reset `buffer-invisibility-spec', or maybe it should remove conditional invisibility properties. In GNU Emacs 27.0.50 (build 3, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.22.24) of 2018-01-22 built on localhost Repository revision: d0fd9809d7574c67a181225fcc1c59afdbb1295c Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11903000 System Description: Debian GNU/Linux Recent messages: For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a. Configured using: 'configure --without-threads --enable-gcc-warnings=3Dwarn-only --enable-gtk-deprecation-warnings --without-pop --with-mailutils --enable-checking --enable-check-lisp-object-type --with-modules 'CFLAGS=3D-O0 -ggdb3'' Configured features: XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG SOUND DBUS GSETTINGS NOTIFY GNUTLS FREETYPE XFT ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11 MODULES JSON Important settings: value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: Lisp Interaction Minor modes in effect: tooltip-mode: t global-eldoc-mode: t eldoc-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t tool-bar-mode: t menu-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t Load-path shadows: None found. Features: (shadow sort mail-extr emacsbug message rmc puny seq byte-opt gv bytecomp byte-compile cconv cl-loaddefs cl-lib dired dired-loaddefs format-spec rfc822 mml easymenu mml-sec password-cache epa derived epg epg-config gnus-util rmail rmail-loaddefs mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader sendmail rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr mail-utils elec-pair time-date mule-util tooltip eldoc electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment text-mode elisp-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page menu-bar rfn-eshadow isearch timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax facemenu font-core term/tty-colors frame cl-generic cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite charscript charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev obarray minibuffer cl-preloaded nadvice loaddefs button faces cus-face macroexp files text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote dbusbind inotify dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty make-network-process emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 95246 8855) (symbols 48 20322 1) (miscs 40 41 121) (strings 32 28332 1986) (string-bytes 1 756483) (vectors 16 14131) (vector-slots 8 499256 13014) (floats 8 49 68) (intervals 56 225 0) (buffers 992 12)) --=20 Google Germany GmbH Erika-Mann-Stra=C3=9Fe 33 80636 M=C3=BCnchen Registergericht und -nummer: Hamburg, HRB 86891 Sitz der Gesellschaft: Hamburg Gesch=C3=A4ftsf=C3=BChrer: Paul Manicle, Halimah DeLaine Prado If you received this communication by mistake, please don=E2=80=99t forward= it to anyone else (it may contain confidential or privileged information), please erase all copies of it, including all attachments, and please let the sender know it went to the wrong person. 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From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 22 10:57:03 2018 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jan 2018 15:57:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38317 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1edeSz-0008Lq-Rp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:57:03 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:48911) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1edeSx-0008LT-UI for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:57:00 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edeSp-0007vq-HH for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:56:54 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:38309) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1edeSp-0007vi-Df; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:56:51 -0500 Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=3289 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1edeSo-0007iG-Or; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:56:51 -0500 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 17:56:38 +0200 Message-Id: <83h8rdrio9.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Philipp Stephani In-reply-to: (message from Philipp Stephani on Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) > From: Philipp Stephani > Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100 > > C-x b *foo* RET > M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize "foo" 'invisible 'foo))) > > Now "foo" is visible, as it should be. > > M-x fundamental-mode => "foo" becomes invisible, because > `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec' to t. > This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility > properties such as markdown-mode. > Probably `kill-all-local-variables' shouldn't blindly reset > `buffer-invisibility-spec', or maybe it should remove conditional > invisibility properties. Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local variable in the cases where that is TRT? (In general, clearing buffer-invisibility-spec on major mode change sounds appropriate to me.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 22 15:42:20 2018 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jan 2018 20:42:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38566 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ediv5-00075b-Mn for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 15:42:19 -0500 Received: from mail-lf0-f46.google.com ([209.85.215.46]:42738) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ediv3-00075O-Hj for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 15:42:17 -0500 Received: by mail-lf0-f46.google.com with SMTP id q17so12273703lfa.9 for <30204@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 12:42:17 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=CnjXeGRkbVhxT7mc2nqkobOnmM5jnGL0w3/6dLVvgSw=; b=exYdLf3GsaRjqNM9X8IwwIgkkgyAE2xZ3cw+V/wXd4qe0oybxpEQ/ZrVWumAf2lVDr 9dhfVvDglBUwQefAyV2E/q4AHzCMV5XmjxK8XRbQRaSNNeQ82nr10LL1aDyIl5Iuw3jl 9krJAapPH7O9rjax7OOCU4HSn7FXqkBsA4gi5y011LgXwgzTWmox+Im8mRW8zvHkerJe QNcgMX10ZkJnVhd+nlMxuHxCWFt9VDFaZTiPIAPu7IHBtRiNKJ3SSZCk7Su5uHTAbr5o xPxeXP5dqbFJVcKe1mUlZsbDVrC/egUpbNe19hGCKhUrHpDeFan1Wt3UwRB5/gOjgrhf n9nA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=CnjXeGRkbVhxT7mc2nqkobOnmM5jnGL0w3/6dLVvgSw=; b=I1fx525hJnEVSWXuOKTFIWbaRPkjXVvH+yxfMM1/C9FMbLMD4urhO9hDINEEmEoUCm rVJ1CBtpi8LlGxTtqo/PIgwGJRqraWjcUCu5ZNnqqCkVL3I3hxniBgsEN4e/gBjCytmE gpnq9JvDc1aje/3MLOyEPGc3OzmYuop1MsHktoS+jnzvUZ4Coper+gGheS1ZGLkFFPnb vWSeS+SnDO04SenD55kQNORYcnJW82OhLx0D6efaPO/qZ4dJ47sVgoEzFkqLFi7asNee HP2UQO3oNcYWjE+MgGKLRPhDudtTfXyZi4i5LgcO5n0Zb5O5eXwJL71+v4QGuGelHdNs lZVg== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxyteZ7t3NUMAgUwKyS6lYFUDdev1v0eFlubqqsyGZvwB3KEYSywWL AxIA33felYbiAPA32a2GzQk5gZDCDweHhOWoBdw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AH8x226LtYzD4t95LhWpiXwIcZZiYyST+xRltttqD4065B9gUmQPLCSGFyo+BRNU8HXWESMjASSUAeYaAKvuokh0d5Q= X-Received: by 10.25.93.83 with SMTP id p19mr45170lfj.113.1516653731270; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 12:42:11 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <83h8rdrio9.fsf@gnu.org> In-Reply-To: <83h8rdrio9.fsf@gnu.org> From: Philipp Stephani Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 20:42:00 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045e49fae657a20563637604" X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) --f403045e49fae657a20563637604 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Eli Zaretskii schrieb am Mo., 22. Jan. 2018 um 16:57 Uhr: > > From: Philipp Stephani > > Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100 > > > > C-x b *foo* RET > > M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize "foo" > 'invisible 'foo))) > > > > Now "foo" is visible, as it should be. > > > > M-x fundamental-mode => "foo" becomes invisible, because > > `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec' to t. > > This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility > > properties such as markdown-mode. > > Probably `kill-all-local-variables' shouldn't blindly reset > > `buffer-invisibility-spec', or maybe it should remove conditional > > invisibility properties. > > Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local > variable in the cases where that is TRT? > > Hmm, yes, that sounds like a good idea. Let me try that. --f403045e49fae657a20563637604 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Eli Za= retskii <eliz@gnu.org> schrieb am= Mo., 22. Jan. 2018 um 16:57=C2=A0Uhr:
> From: Philipp Stephani <p.stephani2@gmail.com>
> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100
>
> C-x b *foo* RET
> M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize &qu= ot;foo" 'invisible 'foo)))
>
> Now "foo" is visible, as it should be.
>
> M-x fundamental-mode =3D> "foo" becomes invisible, becaus= e
> `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec'= ; to t.
> This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility
> properties such as markdown-mode.
> Probably `kill-all-local-variables' shouldn't blindly reset > `buffer-invisibility-spec', or maybe it should remove conditional<= br> > invisibility properties.

Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local
variable in the cases where that is TRT?


Hmm, yes, that sounds like a good idea= . Let me try that.=C2=A0
--f403045e49fae657a20563637604-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 22 15:47:43 2018 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jan 2018 20:47:43 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38570 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1edj0J-0007E9-ED for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 15:47:43 -0500 Received: from mail-lf0-f51.google.com ([209.85.215.51]:35183) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1edj0H-0007Dx-Tk for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 15:47:42 -0500 Received: by mail-lf0-f51.google.com with SMTP id a204so12300159lfa.2 for <30204@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 12:47:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4Ol0D5NPQq03m7OdCyOvJkhtZvnXgmrB0kUzgd2iaio=; b=kEWL6jesH5z3qvP7/VXKcV3rw9pE+J/EXwhinMaoPhfEtbAwZyIPYS3iUgrPLeE2AJ U4sYZH1uMcNLb/j3Zkx9/yIeQKxj2fHINMR1KmzeAoSmIZL5aHNqkWqRy5qHeL7VYaDm brT8kvYOSPrnYgLJfNLWrseh0xSp2lvMCl+dAHXkKvpSeU6PCZ3NJtCJiadSv1p+TwjZ Us1VwxDJh1caVLnvt0NfQw+ytY6kDvaZJhb0FYWDugnTfWza5NKY+pKv90+sLtYslM4D el4Acsq5qunPJEojnsHkcTlo/hHM4PE+6hsDT8kuefdakGtnohn7ekBRqmejWVC7UVVH LMfA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4Ol0D5NPQq03m7OdCyOvJkhtZvnXgmrB0kUzgd2iaio=; b=fqliiHpryPL3VS6DDPgr8nFAR71xRS0ztWFC84MN5UteJeZZ5I8HWYbZlGc8+jzxWT oY8xyn8wB9nL/X/hu6EnwBSuq1+JjWmAk7PhrxEQZd8Hom/tqrrJXNOhFnJiwSw9cJax yq27MhFwBGw+vOofJsCeB/Lqpfs7RCcmJV/jrilYxuR8HuEAAo1H1bNTyEUa+0uKEn16 A3ylvvVGX+TdUt6GMrnDB+IS+jBoMh3kVHx9Dfp2cPpYLQ2Ht8yfl4VBDR1T8lWeDvsJ 6fcNVqh8Ias0XOGkEZ5bjOfrqG/7K1lL25pw2aHZ0tFm1RFWAsKgQ8CaUckTgRRezNfG ubQQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxytdVPI+W+r33UYBxctqQLlBs2HA5i7fRq1gCxM4ekY7z26Z7biwm NZo2yRtKmv7iHlXvuy8vYAaD6fpscRKt6oXyqVs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AH8x225G5gcNU4O1SxL0Qr1T3w6s9t3v8sSVEkOOS7P/LBEUDogUcygJ6XZSENOYjg1FGepp83fZwtUHBJPiSz0qAgQ= X-Received: by 10.25.22.2 with SMTP id m2mr70154lfi.21.1516654055852; Mon, 22 Jan 2018 12:47:35 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <83h8rdrio9.fsf@gnu.org> In-Reply-To: From: Philipp Stephani Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 20:47:25 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a114082e03f10e40563638a16" X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) --001a114082e03f10e40563638a16 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Philipp Stephani schrieb am Mo., 22. Jan. 2018 um 21:42 Uhr: > Eli Zaretskii schrieb am Mo., 22. Jan. 2018 um 16:57 Uhr: > >> > From: Philipp Stephani >> > Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100 >> > >> > C-x b *foo* RET >> > M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize "foo" >> 'invisible 'foo))) >> > >> > Now "foo" is visible, as it should be. >> > >> > M-x fundamental-mode => "foo" becomes invisible, because >> > `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec' to t. >> > This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility >> > properties such as markdown-mode. >> > Probably `kill-all-local-variables' shouldn't blindly reset >> > `buffer-invisibility-spec', or maybe it should remove conditional >> > invisibility properties. >> >> Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local >> variable in the cases where that is TRT? >> >> > Hmm, yes, that sounds like a good idea. Let me try that. > I don't think this works: The permanent-local property is a global symbol property, but I'd need it to be per-buffer. --001a114082e03f10e40563638a16 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Philip= p Stephani <p.stephani2@gmail.c= om> schrieb am Mo., 22. Jan. 2018 um 21:42=C2=A0Uhr:
Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> schrieb am Mo., 22. Jan. 2018 um 16:57=C2=A0Uhr:
> From: Philipp Stephani <p.stephani2@gmail.co= m>
> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100
>
> C-x b *foo* RET
> M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize &qu= ot;foo" 'invisible 'foo)))
>
> Now "foo" is visible, as it should be.
>
> M-x fundamental-mode =3D> "foo" becomes invisible, becaus= e
> `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec'= ; to t.
> This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility
> properties such as markdown-mode.
> Probably `kill-all-local-variables' shouldn't blindly reset > `buffer-invisibility-spec', or maybe it should remove conditional<= br> > invisibility properties.

Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local
variable in the cases where that is TRT?


Hmm, yes, that sounds like a good idea. Let me try that.= =C2=A0

I don't think = this works: The permanent-local property is a global symbol property, but I= 'd need it to be per-buffer.=C2=A0
--001a114082e03f10e40563638a16-- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Aug 13 08:50:23 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Aug 2021 12:50:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40798 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mEWdj-0002Zz-1T for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 08:50:23 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:51214) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mEWdf-0002Za-C2 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 08:50:22 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=zUfMjEl66LYYr/Il5h+kfqopjWhIADuMu4BkOaNLQnE=; b=ooJS/HeLPDcfeozVWAh/cjh8kj WJKIRXaE50YI/OSQoG3g3zEfW798OPki2ZhETDY5lU86MYAXfaZ/If2EH7QZByJEN8g6NG88FIm3u 22gyEzJshvhyT0sKxjLV9kSlWMS+PV7XLyXJBwend06qVZnD67HhFQaivA3ojs9KcZ2g=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mEWdU-0003zu-MB; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 14:50:12 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Philipp Stephani Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2021 14:50:08 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Philipp Stephani's message of "Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:51:32 +0100") Message-ID: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Philipp Stephani writes: > C-x b *foo* RET > M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize "foo" 'invisible 'foo))) > > Now "foo" is visible, as it should be. > > M-x fundamental-mode => "foo" becomes invisib [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Philipp Stephani writes: > C-x b *foo* RET > M-: (progn (add-to-invisibility-spec 'bar) (insert (propertize "foo" 'invisible 'foo))) > > Now "foo" is visible, as it should be. > > M-x fundamental-mode => "foo" becomes invisible, because > `kill-all-local-variables' has reset `buffer-invisibility-spec' to t. > This can be confusing for modes that use conditional invisibility > properties such as markdown-mode. I'm not quite sure I understand the problem here -- if you have a buffer in markdown-mode (that's set these properties), why would you change to fundamental-mode? And I think this is correct behaviour -- if you've switched to fundamental-mode, then you don't want these remnants from markdown-mode to survive, I think? > Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local > variable in the cases where that is TRT? > > Hmm, yes, that sounds like a good idea. Let me try that. > > I don't think this works: The permanent-local property is a global symbol > property, but I'd need it to be per-buffer. Yes, I don't think we have any mechanism that says "this buffer-local value should survive if you change major mode, but only this one". And I think that's probably a good idea, because it sounds like a confusing interface. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Aug 13 08:50:36 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Aug 2021 12:50:36 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40800 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mEWdk-0002a7-96 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 08:50:36 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:51228) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mEWdi-0002Ze-EV for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 08:50:22 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=3EtofRTnCdvpDGUOwAt38FsFlqsWMIZ7G8GstvuNkbQ=; b=oIF+ewH9N1pHztAzaoNvdb/cig E0l93itF4r4dTDex8JqludAvi1AMbAVvJU63AtWkNDwVDDSRL44kMCH56fVgvYP56lpgOTSkLOopc rxMnuPfubq0+Q6Vmefgt+hDgXqe0bvU7ciZeXfpn4fEE1B1F6X+Ldo+4wVuhP7BUDcOQ=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mEWda-000402-IC for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 14:50:16 +0200 Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2021 14:50:14 +0200 Message-Id: <87k0kpcxvd.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #30204 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. 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Why not? Changing the major mode of a buffer is a supported operation. = For example, maybe I decide mid-way while writing a Markdown document = that I'd rather want a plain text file without special syntax. >=20 > And I think this is correct behaviour -- if you've switched to > fundamental-mode, then you don't want these remnants from = markdown-mode > to survive, I think? Yes, but they do survive, i.e. once markdown-mode has made some text = conditionally-visible (which it does for URLs etc.), I'd expect it to = become unconditionally-visible instead of unconditionally-invisible when = changing the major mode. >=20 >> Why can't you make buffer-invisibility-spec be a permanent-local >> variable in the cases where that is TRT? >>=20 >> Hmm, yes, that sounds like a good idea. Let me try that.=20 >>=20 >> I don't think this works: The permanent-local property is a global = symbol >> property, but I'd need it to be per-buffer.=20 >=20 > Yes, I don't think we have any mechanism that says "this buffer-local > value should survive if you change major mode, but only this one". = And > I think that's probably a good idea, because it sounds like a = confusing > interface. >=20 >=20 Yes, and probably it's difficult to define a reasonably generic API for = this. Maybe we should aim for a more specific solution: For example, Emacs = could make all conditionally-visible text unconditionally-visible when = changing major modes? Or have a way for major modes to declare which = invisibility specifiers are mode-specific and should be undone when = leaving the mode? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 04:53:17 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 08:53:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49164 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMnts-0002Ko-Qh for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 04:53:17 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:49526) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMntq-0002KU-W5 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 04:53:16 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=ss3Axpz71O8XmTZs/g91xzpJ90AfwkNWljtFmgeeYB0=; b=mI5IjCWLGrLqy7FEvVe13eCHsl h+gkWWMAZMAHuRsMOwIvy7UstESJaZ+u+H9TzS4SV6cwhA/KDKIgaj8QJ6JZa2zIRAQ7FtfRB2UNk 6oJ9+3o7tNyxM4FhegaLQk/UM1nh7KtysVhY0GgFsksQAX7ZeAr3vsuNypGYZOK2vdG0=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mMnth-0003fw-Oe; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:53:08 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Philipp Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:53:05 +0200 In-Reply-To: <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> (Philipp's message of "Sat, 4 Sep 2021 20:35:11 +0200") Message-ID: <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Philipp writes: >> And I think this is correct behaviour -- if you've switched to >> fundamental-mode, then you don't want these remnants from markdown-mode >> to survive, I think? > > Yes, but they do survive, i.e. [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Philipp writes: >> And I think this is correct behaviour -- if you've switched to >> fundamental-mode, then you don't want these remnants from markdown-mode >> to survive, I think? > > Yes, but they do survive, i.e. once markdown-mode has made some text > conditionally-visible (which it does for URLs etc.), I'd expect it to > become unconditionally-visible instead of unconditionally-invisible > when changing the major mode. That's true. Hm... Should major modes remove `invisible' text properties (where the value isn't t)? No, that wouldn't be right, either. Uhm. OK, if `buffer-invisibility-spec' isn't t, `kill-all-local-variables' could remove the `invisible' text property from all text that has a non-t value? That sounds like it would potentially be expensive, but a non-nil invisibility spec is quite unusual (and switching major modes, in general, is unusual (well, switching from anything but fundamental-mode is unusual)). I dunno. Anybody have an opinion here? -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 05:34:23 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 09:34:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49225 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMoXe-0003Pj-W9 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:34:23 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:52032) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMoXc-0003PT-Ak for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:34:21 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:58866) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMoXX-0004Mu-0u; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:34:15 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:1209 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMoXW-0000gm-DC; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:34:14 -0400 Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:34:16 +0300 Message-Id: <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:53:05 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:53:05 +0200 > Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org > > > Yes, but they do survive, i.e. once markdown-mode has made some text > > conditionally-visible (which it does for URLs etc.), I'd expect it to > > become unconditionally-visible instead of unconditionally-invisible > > when changing the major mode. > > That's true. Hm... Should major modes remove `invisible' text > properties (where the value isn't t)? No, that wouldn't be right, > either. > > Uhm. OK, if `buffer-invisibility-spec' isn't t, > `kill-all-local-variables' could remove the `invisible' text property > from all text that has a non-t value? > > That sounds like it would potentially be expensive, but a non-nil > invisibility spec is quite unusual (and switching major modes, in > general, is unusual (well, switching from anything but fundamental-mode > is unusual)). > > I dunno. Anybody have an opinion here? I think this is a corner use case, and if there's no easy way of doing something better with it, we shouldn't do anything. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 05:43:37 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 09:43:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49252 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMogb-0003eg-57 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:43:37 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50036) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMoga-0003eT-9w for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:43:36 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=a/0hus8t0C9SyaFItq+I0ufFP3TPuz8GbWfMQoI6bbg=; b=ByUf9uMcZpJSWxOfW5sAkb2EfP 7Ff9k03SS+cseczh3Sj6tA2eEpert5WZ/XPcqkvPOPaIf/5oZJ1ndt1+NX9/95SuoJ7NPZy9RRgWl pWitTOZ4pqeVgV2Gv3UKddpxIFbPoc9lCGPdN/9AEUORrPpkpRz7CLYPEDrxS1DLUEXQ=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mMogQ-00042c-WA; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 11:43:29 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 11:43:26 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:34:16 +0300") Message-ID: <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > I think this is a corner use case, and if there's no easy way of doing > something better with it, we shouldn't do anything. Perhaps we should have a mode that even more fundamental than fundamental-mode, that does a real cleanup of the buffer (removes all text properties, overlays, etc), and just document that there are so [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > I think this is a corner use case, and if there's no easy way of doing > something better with it, we shouldn't do anything. Perhaps we should have a mode that even more fundamental than fundamental-mode, that does a real cleanup of the buffer (removes all text properties, overlays, etc), and just document that there are some artefacts that may remain otherwise when changing modes? We could call it... fundamentalist-mode. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 05:50:50 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 09:50:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49266 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMona-00060P-8s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:50:50 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:54462) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMonY-00060C-Ld for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:50:49 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:59132) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMonT-0001a6-3u; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:50:43 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:2388 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMonS-00006z-NC; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 05:50:43 -0400 Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:50:47 +0300 Message-Id: <83sfyjtkp4.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sun, 05 Sep 2021 11:43:26 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 11:43:26 +0200 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > I think this is a corner use case, and if there's no easy way of doing > > something better with it, we shouldn't do anything. > > Perhaps we should have a mode that even more fundamental than > fundamental-mode, that does a real cleanup of the buffer (removes all > text properties, overlays, etc), and just document that there are some > artefacts that may remain otherwise when changing modes? > > We could call it... fundamentalist-mode. We could. But my understanding of the original report is that it isn't limited to Fundamental mode, it expects a switch to _any_ mode to do the same. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 06:12:29 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 10:12:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49319 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMp8X-0006cL-B4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:12:29 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50308) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMp8V-0006c3-G3 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:12:28 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=BmZEoi7HQIA01F74gQZOPCFwRcOToKcwvHqVx+QcSV8=; b=B1Xlfty0udVGBbDtPZXFPu8CcL FIQZ46EfwVa5TplmYYfDSggdat4nevgZuyweIvst2GxFgDbTCAC3PMrfzMJsKwr6NmXpW6WVyyp5t NNcPMh4jVcV1o0n0rqIfFSTsxh1sijI1Oqv/oS98TJ9MnmWE660wQXA9omzNIteAf/MA=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mMp8M-0004Fv-VF; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:12:21 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <83sfyjtkp4.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:12:18 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83sfyjtkp4.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:50:47 +0300") Message-ID: <87h7ezmiv1.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > We could. But my understanding of the original report is that it > isn't limited to Fundamental mode, it expects a switch to _any_ mode > to do the same. Yes, so this wouldn't fix this, per se. We'd just document that changing modes doesn't clear everything out (in some obscure corner cases), and then provide this new mode for those corner cases. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > We could. But my understanding of the original report is that it > isn't limited to Fundamental mode, it expects a switch to _any_ mode > to do the same. Yes, so this wouldn't fix this, per se. We'd just document that changing modes doesn't clear everything out (in some obscure corner cases), and then provide this new mode for those corner cases. Actually, that's a function that's I've wanted before -- I sometimes find myself in a buffer with lots of... stuff, and then resorting to saving, killing the buffer and then loading the contents to be sure that I'm rid of all local variables/overlays/text properties/etc. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 06:32:13 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 10:32:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49354 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpRd-0002p6-9K for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:32:13 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:60086) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpRa-0002in-BH for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:32:11 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:60074) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpRT-0002rf-A1; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:32:04 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:4986 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpRQ-000729-1c; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:32:02 -0400 Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 13:32:01 +0300 Message-Id: <83o897tise.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87h7ezmiv1.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:12:18 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <83sfyjtkp4.fsf@gnu.org> <87h7ezmiv1.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:12:18 +0200 > > Actually, that's a function that's I've wanted before -- I sometimes > find myself in a buffer with lots of... stuff, and then resorting to > saving, killing the buffer and then loading the contents to be sure that > I'm rid of all local variables/overlays/text properties/etc. Doesn't font-lock-fontify-block (which used to be "M-o M-o") do what you want? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 05 06:44:52 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Sep 2021 10:44:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49377 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpds-0003Uo-NH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:44:52 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:50544) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpdr-0003Ub-D8 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 06:44:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=CY4Xqu9wBIJAOFbmNBlB1Frb6n43LMgbczDeCyFn2Dg=; b=T2D7bii91hPAOa8gMg2i4hRX/k 4i7cajotEjSPpkfR8iH0QfkIxiX8DVTifb3/ndl+T44LfuN/iLH45IcXvWlwPuYMOk1W3lk6VLlZJ GDdTRC7R1oOEUGX1dIU6jNZt4tbKShyruwOb2bU+DTnT9Yi81hG5yBXgpP/LafWmNIOY=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mMpdh-0004RL-VZ; Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:44:44 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <83sfyjtkp4.fsf@gnu.org> <87h7ezmiv1.fsf@gnus.org> <83o897tise.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 05 Sep 2021 12:44:39 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83o897tise.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 05 Sep 2021 13:32:01 +0300") Message-ID: <8735qjmhd4.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii writes: > Doesn't font-lock-fontify-block (which used to be "M-o M-o") do what > you want? Nope -- that doesn't get rid of all the shenanigans that may be going on in the buffer (display properties, overlays, etc). Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: > Doesn't font-lock-fontify-block (which used to be "M-o M-o") do what > you want? Nope -- that doesn't get rid of all the shenanigans that may be going on in the buffer (display properties, overlays, etc). -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Sep 06 06:19:18 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Sep 2021 10:19:18 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52017 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNBig-0008M3-2v for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 06:19:18 -0400 Received: from kamnitnik.top ([209.250.245.214]:60490 helo=mail.kamnitnik.top) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mNBie-0008Lu-7S for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 06 Sep 2021 06:19:16 -0400 Received: from localhost (unknown [IPv6:2a00:ee2:e04:9300:225:d3ff:fef9:f08a]) by mail.kamnitnik.top (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8B880BBB71; Mon, 6 Sep 2021 10:19:14 +0000 (UTC) From: To: Lars Ingebrigtsen , Philipp Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec In-Reply-To: <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Mon, 06 Sep 2021 12:22:17 +0200 Message-ID: <87zgsqknqe.fsf@miha-pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Philipp writes: > >>> And I think this is correct behaviour -- if you've switched to >>> fundamental-mode, then you don't want these remnants from markdown-mode >>> to survive, I think? >> >> Yes, but they do survive, i.e. once markdown-mode has made some text >> conditionally-visible (which it does for URLs etc.), I'd expect it to >> become unconditionally-visible instead of unconditionally-invisible >> when changing the major mode. > > That's true. Hm... Should major modes remove `invisible' text > properties (where the value isn't t)? No, that wouldn't be right, > either. > > Uhm. OK, if `buffer-invisibility-spec' isn't t, > `kill-all-local-variables' could remove the `invisible' text property > from all text that has a non-t value? > > That sounds like it would potentially be expensive, but a non-nil > invisibility spec is quite unusual (and switching major modes, in > general, is unusual (well, switching from anything but fundamental-mode > is unusual)). > > I dunno. Anybody have an opinion here? markdown-mode should simply add `invisible' to font-lock-extra-managed-props. Font-lock will then automatically remove this property as well from the buffer in change-major-mode-hook. > > -- > (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) > bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Oct 06 06:56:03 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Oct 2021 10:56:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42699 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mY4ah-0005nR-5X for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 06:56:03 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52458) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mY4ad-0005mq-0P for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 06:56:02 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=LwI9++dOcUAnDYMY+TieLGscFfmgqhlhR8hvirPUPYY=; b=e2zerthJ7uygUA7lkLUBkLYZ3a j05CzICAht6UevxwKx6T+OVLDVjrYCa6WUpshs4ZxTh6JxjEf+Hn1eksxRnxp6Q672G6KUUiWMaNI fzdBBtrYthd7nimgOt59Tew+OGOfs5K8MlvANbErHcMsBasB1u0mib9hTwDz3/d2x9e0=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mY4aT-0001E8-MQ; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 12:55:52 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> X-Now-Playing: Sylvan Esso's _WITH_: "Dreamy Bruises" Date: Wed, 06 Oct 2021 12:55:44 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sun, 05 Sep 2021 11:43:26 +0200") Message-ID: <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Perhaps we should have a mode that even more fundamental than > fundamental-mode, that does a real cleanup of the buffer (removes all > text properties, overlays, etc), and just document that there [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Perhaps we should have a mode that even more fundamental than > fundamental-mode, that does a real cleanup of the buffer (removes all > text properties, overlays, etc), and just document that there are some > artefacts that may remain otherwise when changing modes? > > We could call it... fundamentalist-mode. I've now added this to Emacs 29 under the name `clean-mode'. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Oct 06 06:56:06 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Oct 2021 10:56:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42702 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mY4ak-0005nh-DP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 06:56:06 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52478) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mY4aj-0005mz-3b for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 06:56:05 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=xKY34wEAiogNnmFJdQve24FMxbeMT73NUC4BEaIc/EU=; b=jmbqFrHqC9X3uhEj3LxADGGZeE bxcKdLnCdz3mU+kHSsvvYSpwCVI+aZupCMMY3wqKZmXd2NX0NsTLCTUUb2My/m3i0f6zZemB/HkhS UoWl03aCixdCpK4s6RFcV4DnCfuZXw/kLaMH0k0sGFZSHmkj9ZP16ry+JjDmetsabLB0=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mY4ab-0001EI-DK for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Oct 2021 12:55:59 +0200 Date: Wed, 06 Oct 2021 12:55:55 +0200 Message-Id: <87mtnm5sn8.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #30204 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: close 30204 29.1 quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) close 30204 29.1 quit From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 07 18:21:30 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Oct 2021 22:21:30 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48654 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mYbla-0001Sh-5d for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:21:30 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:55712) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mYblX-0001SS-13 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:21:28 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:50694) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYblR-0002Mr-Kp; Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:21:21 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYblR-00076L-DP; Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:21:21 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Wed, 06 Oct 2021 12:55:44 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:21:21 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, eliz@gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > Perhaps we should have a mode that even more fundamental than > > fundamental-mode, that does a real cleanup of the buffer (removes all > > text properties, overlays, etc), and just document that there are some > > artefacts that may remain otherwise when changing modes? > > > > We could call it... fundamentalist-mode. > I've now added this to Emacs 29 under the name `clean-mode'. I see the usefulness of a command to remove such things from the buffer, but I don't think it fits the Emacs concept of "mode". It changes the contents of the buffer. I suggest renaming it to something like `clean-buffer'. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Oct 07 18:26:09 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Oct 2021 22:26:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48658 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mYbq4-0001Zm-Oz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:26:08 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:41756) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mYbq2-0001ZH-Mo for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:26:07 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=4feLLr89Bur8UenTq2msmP2AiLh3GtalAfsODMYcJJI=; b=t242KuytF4LRwP3nLJAI5Bbgye p0uW+d/eKlON3r2eoodhABdRgQD7M4mtkf7DkVN8GuC5LdMweC6sR7IC4A5M2vMbzoCBNquYBGoVi 4ME5M3pPIvb0sDI2BDWh3hDeHSaTNGmbP3oi7aVV5tO8MyRY3YIDsg7jtQoKmr9i1vfY=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mYbpu-0003j9-3n; Fri, 08 Oct 2021 00:26:00 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Richard Stallman Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwAgMAAAAqbBEUAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAACVBMVEViUE6NeXD///+N ib42AAAAAWJLR0QCZgt8ZAAAAAd0SU1FB+UKBxYZGbr63pMAAAEpSURBVCjPRVJRjgUhCINE/p1E 74PJm39M5P5X2Rbf7prJxNpSEBSxI3/L8mRYE1FpAFgTp6qvuMj20mjyP4P/DkYg5XET3di3QuYK tWlTUoxRrgsQ40uCWwJb4QPaz1WeoMOhm+7o5XaTFkGLl+neomQe5tdbm72wkPNfKG5xZbrobj1u dXWErF+mA1gxKocALi7TZZTYIQBQVgLQvgYWvETolSVETy6EgUpk/eTeDBMzbzlzMSzm6m2+iTq2 jObe5tkAw83E+0QILtDROWkj5gOmN6a2weTIDWcdyp54rwtmlXVaqAmcNTgF1Kp7FeAAHbn3Beyt +fwFs2mB26bH9iJjNVXbqTjHg2DnPSVqGLVGGdzR4x1wPuM2slcHOj+8rbULaPhM9OIHGBsthXAq V+gAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6Y3JlYXRlADIwMjEtMTAtMDdUMjI6MjU6MjUrMDA6MDCsQOq4AAAAJXRF WHRkYXRlOm1vZGlmeQAyMDIxLTEwLTA3VDIyOjI1OjI1KzAwOjAw3R1SBAAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: Sussan Deyhim & Richard Horowitz's _Desert Equations: Azax Attra_: "Ishtar" Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2021 00:25:57 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Thu, 07 Oct 2021 18:21:21 -0400") Message-ID: <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Richard Stallman writes: > I see the usefulness of a command to remove such things from the > buffer, but I don't think it fits the Emacs concept of "mode". It > changes the contents of the buffer. > > I suggest renaming it t [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, eliz@gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Richard Stallman writes: > I see the usefulness of a command to remove such things from the > buffer, but I don't think it fits the Emacs concept of "mode". It > changes the contents of the buffer. > > I suggest renaming it to something like `clean-buffer'. It's a mode -- it continues to remove text properties from text you yank into it. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Oct 08 17:56:17 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Oct 2021 21:56:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52025 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mYxqj-0004s6-Jq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Oct 2021 17:56:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45480) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mYxqi-0004ru-J3 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Oct 2021 17:56:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:59826) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYxqd-0002SW-3c; Fri, 08 Oct 2021 17:56:11 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mYxqc-00071b-Po; Fri, 08 Oct 2021 17:56:10 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Fri, 08 Oct 2021 00:25:57 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2021 17:56:10 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, eliz@gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > I suggest renaming it to something like `clean-buffer'. > It's a mode -- it continues to remove text properties from text you yank > into it. Thanks for explaining. "Clean" is not a very clear name for this, because the idea that having no text properties is "cleaner" is a matter of taste. Some might not make the connection between the word "cleam" and what this does. Thus, people will have more difficulty remembering the name from the meaning and vice versa. I suggest renaming it to "no-properties-mode". -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 09 06:56:03 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Oct 2021 10:56:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52340 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZA1L-0005MO-CL for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 06:56:03 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-f45.google.com ([209.85.221.45]:41723) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZA1K-0005Ls-Ca for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 06:56:02 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-f45.google.com with SMTP id t2so37646329wrb.8 for <30204@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 03:56:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version; bh=Ay+m1+Z4zHa2ZihjrYAZlnE+Yrup6ugTTkx+Ku/99lg=; b=lCYbt45Y2gIVmSqMYZt56zAl2UZ1SOdtaknLXs3W7S4x4WcXLPW8Nfl115n2Gi6amx OtnD1N5mKkF483fDfZNykueJW0VFwYgALpIQU94jwYD536Sp7gzWuLVmmZ+r7Y3peFwR sT9tvVdVmWNt+sc8oUrHklVf9GqSyOLJpyG5UeZ+FjfVlFt/fqQmLPTh149YAJ/LXvRc frkWqEHDGmJ3OBWqG+BJFaSQ7iwLrC7JS+s5r4LtTqG1eYBcalkjeBHMCHYggiloIsuq MgKFpvP4Ibp4iTykf5d+KNBIKYOIhkWBJsrXCGe/C9g+uXEmdWxHdcaAZH4FZNLitF/H SkAA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version; bh=Ay+m1+Z4zHa2ZihjrYAZlnE+Yrup6ugTTkx+Ku/99lg=; b=xaxIdWphaE2PWxidMCtQdHC5DPt2o4tzYSBJo6MPGyuT/Nnq6cB98c46Lkjo90iHCL E/l+dGh6qJHbAR1ARkdkeZu/rxuuGoMQbpze+0glaJ4keIT3pWfmcMZ5t39fn0HDxy+e ZcR6m1HAFVpJHCagdoNwHFoJjH/FDPDsAHSOoBmtdRcIL7+iZa4KEycOCIYR97Qk93KW fYRwHfRirIckzRGAurO5IwOgH9dWH2b00giGH7pGNVSxw8RznvDUZJ9XM5Q57H2KUBg4 2yYxnO/Sj2KFv4IJg9VGDOxiHhjxm+HxS3XbdF3a1DhlBXF3lVhQv6XsiF4/SX+c9Wy9 AvzA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532gVbXEQpTxUsuko6EB0JVCzFlwo1bp4rqF0Caaw89yU7KwiORY v6dGTbisxnPSCDzv/7yxU1+QPcQGKEg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw5untg/MUcW0ssLZMLT63ramEZdG/HYBnIgn2q3m3QqO85AwzBT/skyNeDrZ/+WeCRRdlFWQ== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:f302:: with SMTP id q2mr9042182wmq.56.1633776956125; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 03:55:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rltb ([82.66.8.55]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id k17sm14013978wmj.0.2021.10.09.03.55.55 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 09 Oct 2021 03:55:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Pluim To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2021 12:55:54 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Fri, 08 Oct 2021 00:25:57 +0200") Message-ID: <87bl3yv551.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) >>>>> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 00:25:57 +0200, Lars Ingebrigtsen said: Lars> Richard Stallman writes: >> I see the usefulness of a command to remove such things from the >> buffer, but I don't think it fits the Emacs concept of "mode". It >> changes the contents of the buffer. >> >> I suggest renaming it to something like `clean-buffer'. Lars> It's a mode -- it continues to remove text properties from text you yank Lars> into it. I see you did that with 'after-change-functions'. Would a 'pre-yank-hook' be a useful addition to Emacs? I often yank output from badly behaved programs, and having a buffer-local hook to replace non-breaking-spaces and the like before insertion would be useful. Robert -- From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 09 07:11:15 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Oct 2021 11:11:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52357 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAG3-0007tw-5y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:11:15 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:60638) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAFz-0007th-OZ for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:11:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=o69XhtWo9FCCceU3VcYj8XMS1Yte1r6eJqHVXKAt+T0=; b=DKzg35Zdfgu5c4ubQEppVz2KOF 8FNx3WlTDTTG06YBDUTJRUsWDVyhm1WiPKshU53X13EUCrHT9GUWiayNxEZa38IWLqZMpbDYMV/NF E8bsdwW3cR8e/0SwG7+5+elrnSYjCx8cLXQ9lPc+D88ao3RqUJxtVDsmVS0zjyHbh+FU=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAFq-0004ll-Ri; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:11:05 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Robert Pluim Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <87bl3yv551.fsf@gmail.com> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAG1BMVEWqopWFcHi9wr3f 39H8/fFpmac8RFcWFBr///8FzRywAAAAAWJLR0QIht6VegAAAAd0SU1FB+UKCQsJGQQZi9IAAAGA SURBVDjLtZNBc4IwEIXVTusVDqZXB6neCz9AgannMhN6xRlZrnTaZv9+34ZoFOmt7kEhH+8lb5NM JveoMAin+L2H9SwZKQEPxUhNphcgSZMkT5LUAjiNK3ora9uPQCIaB6ZhGAY9yLTWsQf4GwNPLbMB 2CpCNQKWFsyZWwbY4QPmH6+Yc6AEbPkGUGuCPFRsxJQodeBN3uqMjSKr4dgDFkCH9gIg+V5euhwr 4oECttxlRApKAalPbhOQc/o6J3+N5jKuHPEtKYqNwbByms8TQEc3WPAz88IIOBZ+udSDrrqy2mPU EEvqNUnY9AzQDNjDZ0GDHCzzmqqP4ZKvisw6sWkqsk1sj1YBYFvKBpuHyfH07azQPiIDRRlFHwqi E8jhhO9INy8QtYaPp+Q7Y1tFGG40+T23O8U4BZhD96fEA9tDQbq8AuJ1qMSrjAZWOFBUlRVfnqsi 6+q6ltkfEf8SFKs0jtf6fRGt3UmMlsOLk12t6rb+BPZyRstZNKx/vf6/STfx+bOzeE8AAAAldEVY dGRhdGU6Y3JlYXRlADIwMjEtMTAtMDlUMTE6MDk6MjUrMDA6MDAPOQxJAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOm1v ZGlmeQAyMDIxLTEwLTA5VDExOjA5OjI1KzAwOjAwfmS09QAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: Thomas Dolby's _The Flat Earth_: "Hyperactive!" Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:10:57 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87bl3yv551.fsf@gmail.com> (Robert Pluim's message of "Sat, 09 Oct 2021 12:55:54 +0200") Message-ID: <87lf32pi66.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Robert Pluim writes: > I see you did that with 'after-change-functions'. Would a > 'pre-yank-hook' be a useful addition to Emacs? I often yank output > from badly behaved programs, and having a buffer-local hook to replac [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Robert Pluim writes: > I see you did that with 'after-change-functions'. Would a > 'pre-yank-hook' be a useful addition to Emacs? I often yank output > from badly behaved programs, and having a buffer-local hook to replace > non-breaking-spaces and the like before insertion would be useful. There's `filter-buffer-substring' to do it from the other side... But I see now that I could just have set `yank-excluded-properties' to t in this mode to get the same effect as the `after-change-functions'. I'll adjust. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 09 07:15:37 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Oct 2021 11:15:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52366 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAKG-00009d-Mh for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:15:37 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-f51.google.com ([209.85.221.51]:34554) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAKE-0008Tl-Ju for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:15:34 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-f51.google.com with SMTP id y3so4680257wrl.1 for <30204@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 04:15:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=YkCexXdZwN8NTcHrG567ag6yNN517SwMTY08gblfvFA=; b=NqijjcPUiqqkEdqIkLTJS3qiW/+4nJWg9jforVi9UnDddVHv95tFBJoi5lZdROYVBs hYC9yfG86oyvJjyg1TTxNG4UShOphkazxyOx6bctP87ybkFmB00gaJzbW/oXmxpx3zdF rOyOmZc2z32LTqHKd1GbOtn0uUPs0pxf46icvcn0NQNJ3hgYhOz2RY/b6b9Wz05JayuP z/7nNNE8koNdsZ0aI6CVCbbYT5JyeYOIuAMoat7EHR5+a5dhUM2h26RqTAuld8oJb/dn Uy0L5zbN12vJlO1MrKs4Ds+4TKKpIQflkO4ptLcKhVnddiJtR1DMpuc2auFwMlYnX0Uh DdLA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=YkCexXdZwN8NTcHrG567ag6yNN517SwMTY08gblfvFA=; b=W5QXfMWI+wAx4ErGwxGTZXLqf+/jqvYL2+Tdhex03CFvPFFVBIihCX/ploZdZaaqSI cHll+GjmCTcRJgR0ByQdrzDD8xqurIXBLtZgv29oAtdp/3hEmysov2f6GzodH75J456/ UYev/E/l6C2rgxmikH3PlBBpNkAsnV+ejx2hhF+zCiBQkatmALP5K2cVp1NV5XCXPMc/ ArdJzinN/EiG55OX9z3qx3XctERAvEhJTNukmV0MTrqGATc4y/svCNiApsHIfiedqppO dVJlYp5FrzwkGzf3IeANKWdNyUbcsSbaEja1DmqwA9ZVDbM8v3Ju9FVepVVWuPFBJcA9 UydA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530Lg18eJiYqs583P4p/OvgQ1sCq3ziltN6siW2vTj32N3XcIiJr RCRtIom1n0RpLy/atdP+9/NZ0CzZltA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJy7FhTIrKG7t598D+sukueitvysSJW4Ql5cy0CxPGSQiFZIVUJ/IoIsfNh0p+BiMEnSXFmmRQ== X-Received: by 2002:adf:97cd:: with SMTP id t13mr10534231wrb.312.1633778128475; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 04:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rltb ([82.66.8.55]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z133sm15704078wmc.45.2021.10.09.04.15.27 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 09 Oct 2021 04:15:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Pluim To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <87bl3yv551.fsf@gmail.com> <87lf32pi66.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:15:26 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87lf32pi66.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:10:57 +0200") Message-ID: <877demv48h.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) >>>>> On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:10:57 +0200, Lars Ingebrigtsen said: Lars> Robert Pluim writes: >> I see you did that with 'after-change-functions'. Would a >> 'pre-yank-hook' be a useful addition to Emacs? I often yank output >> from badly behaved programs, and having a buffer-local hook to repla= ce >> non-breaking-spaces and the like before insertion would be useful. Lars> There's `filter-buffer-substring' to do it from the other side...= But I Lars> see now that I could just have set `yank-excluded-properties' to = t in Lars> this mode to get the same effect as the `after-change-functions'.= I'll Lars> adjust. Doesn=CA=BCt `filter-buffer-substring' only work if I=CA=BCm yanking from o= ne buffer to another? What if I=CA=BCm yanking the X selection? Robert --=20 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 09 07:20:44 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Oct 2021 11:20:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52387 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAPE-0001ua-H2 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:20:44 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:60744) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAPC-0001uO-Km for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:20:43 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=bcpjlCC7ulHAtJ4mczc0c8CVttciLkrcjRzHc5s+W7s=; b=S548nQmUB97KguhAw6s5+7Eq0E XSX6f8AYyN07fi8hCV/U5vAiwecczvC5hZS2HSrmvFG6F1un++e/t62GccjQxxFoozDGrGeA0hbjG 5w2MnUNbrdlH2uhgWXk74p7pK3R4ACFHUepUVsGPlrZAR22HrorphqFwKngPFqY/wUvs=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAP4-0004qB-J8; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:20:36 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Richard Stallman Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEUkHxswKiQVEhFf VFCilpD///85qtkRAAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+UKCQsPE7KWxUoAAAGxSURBVDjLrVTb kdwwDJN4DZDmFUBrG7BPbiBj919TAMqPZC/5yEw0s7uWAYIgZG8pY+n5KVae1bB+2UorLcC4KXH/ JtG+rRO/too77aHpfVmqQqH+CZgofSL6AFYFgAgRCTjHBTaK2mEGe4VbLb6agiCwgSaYoBo0sbd1 tflDRav516RBJc4H3jRbVRE3X0ZPcKwWE8gqc8Bk7EEux0+cI8SEmIp3c3Alhl0pIVUYBN1qkyuS TFAig+c07QbGPRBUAqpy1z4hCfghqJasjtl7347jsMIpJMVgEgWf1vcESkqlE+Aa/rETWKjCaNgE DSXcflBqIR85Rz4VzM6nedsHkI6v5yQ8bD82ADlJsLnUBF57R8lSOEieTHaL6r7D1rawwQCCcUT4 sXcgCxsPgK7p6lgvoPFDefoI/7R9R3MdbAAYgnG6bWmXbNzJ009/Xo5+bH0ZrccweeEtU1xOt6wY BG/mqMEcbRyVBBSDk68zSvRUyBjTHaRm+LUbKHwME3idFRLPi8bmNr1WHNR0S11A3zYA69c7cD0M 78D52kp5l/q2/ieQr27Jr9//Nuwv69+Bnw57ZtnpcaJwAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIx LTEwLTA5VDExOjE1OjE5KzAwOjAwnaRekAAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMS0xMC0wOVQx MToxNToxOSswMDowMOz55iwAAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: Throwing Muses's _Chains Changed_: "Snail Head" Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:20:34 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Fri, 08 Oct 2021 17:56:10 -0400") Message-ID: <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Richard Stallman writes: > "Clean" is not a very clear name for this, because the idea that > having no text properties is "cleaner" is a matter of taste. Some > might not make the connection between the word "cleam" and what [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, eliz@gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Richard Stallman writes: > "Clean" is not a very clear name for this, because the idea that > having no text properties is "cleaner" is a matter of taste. Some > might not make the connection between the word "cleam" and what this > does. Thus, people will have more difficulty remembering the name > from the meaning and vice versa. > > I suggest renaming it to "no-properties-mode". I think `no-properties-mode' sounds pretty awkward, but I don't really have much of an opinion here, one way or the other. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 09 07:28:24 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Oct 2021 11:28:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52400 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAWe-00026U-PH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:28:24 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:60814) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAWc-00026H-DC for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 07:28:23 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID :In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=w1EoLLsnBVjHgEwBNEV3U/e8yRlWXApuQh4sue37ocI=; b=g87A/Llx48dl2lZjlwZ5uoE5u/ qPXTHdTvirCVdprCO+DKP/MOSLHjZy8F6g8rD6bopg+uUVNoBw2fMtQzTT+C8nHYQiiMyqSe1q7LV hqFmVYdGDzzT9VdVpK3Qe5po2AXOt+Jg5qW5zwJD2RLiTIfQ+658mmAVVpn58T3W4lSI=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mZAWU-0004rm-7q; Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:28:16 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Robert Pluim Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <87bl3yv551.fsf@gmail.com> <87lf32pi66.fsf@gnus.org> <877demv48h.fsf@gmail.com> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEUkHxswKiQVEhFf VFCilpD///85qtkRAAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+UKCQsPE7KWxUoAAAGxSURBVDjLrVTb kdwwDJN4DZDmFUBrG7BPbiBj919TAMqPZC/5yEw0s7uWAYIgZG8pY+n5KVae1bB+2UorLcC4KXH/ JtG+rRO/too77aHpfVmqQqH+CZgofSL6AFYFgAgRCTjHBTaK2mEGe4VbLb6agiCwgSaYoBo0sbd1 tflDRav516RBJc4H3jRbVRE3X0ZPcKwWE8gqc8Bk7EEux0+cI8SEmIp3c3Alhl0pIVUYBN1qkyuS TFAig+c07QbGPRBUAqpy1z4hCfghqJasjtl7347jsMIpJMVgEgWf1vcESkqlE+Aa/rETWKjCaNgE DSXcflBqIR85Rz4VzM6nedsHkI6v5yQ8bD82ADlJsLnUBF57R8lSOEieTHaL6r7D1rawwQCCcUT4 sXcgCxsPgK7p6lgvoPFDefoI/7R9R3MdbAAYgnG6bWmXbNzJ009/Xo5+bH0ZrccweeEtU1xOt6wY BG/mqMEcbRyVBBSDk68zSvRUyBjTHaRm+LUbKHwME3idFRLPi8bmNr1WHNR0S11A3zYA69c7cD0M 78D52kp5l/q2/ieQr27Jr9//Nuwv69+Bnw57ZtnpcaJwAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOmNyZWF0ZQAyMDIx LTEwLTA5VDExOjE1OjE5KzAwOjAwnaRekAAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTptb2RpZnkAMjAyMS0xMC0wOVQx MToxNToxOSswMDowMOz55iwAAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Now-Playing: Throwing Muses's _Chains Changed_: "Cry Baby Cry" Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:28:13 +0200 In-Reply-To: <877demv48h.fsf@gmail.com> (Robert Pluim's message of "Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:15:26 +0200") Message-ID: <87r1cuo2sy.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Robert Pluim writes: > Doesnʼt `filter-buffer-substring' only work if Iʼm yanking from one > buffer to another? What if Iʼm yanking the X selection? Then you have... er... interprogram-paste-function and friends. :-/ Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Robert Pluim writes: > Doesn=CA=BCt `filter-buffer-substring' only work if I=CA=BCm yanking from= one > buffer to another? What if I=CA=BCm yanking the X selection? Then you have... er... interprogram-paste-function and friends. :-/ Hm... perhaps there is no transform function that handles all yanks? I thought I remembered that we'd added that, but apparently not... --=20 (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Oct 10 13:33:16 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Oct 2021 17:33:16 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55772 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZchH-0001p6-T1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 13:33:16 -0400 Received: from relay3-d.mail.gandi.net ([217.70.183.195]:51041) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZchF-0001oX-PQ for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 13:33:14 -0400 Received: (Authenticated sender: juri@linkov.net) by relay3-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7CF3960009; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 17:33:05 +0000 (UTC) From: Juri Linkov To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec Organization: LINKOV.NET References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:50:22 +0300 Message-ID: <87ily5f3yh.fsf@mail.linkov.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) >> "Clean" is not a very clear name for this, because the idea that >> having no text properties is "cleaner" is a matter of taste. Some >> might not make the connection between the word "cleam" and what this >> does. Thus, people will have more difficulty remembering the name >> from the meaning and vice versa. >> >> I suggest renaming it to "no-properties-mode". > > I think `no-properties-mode' sounds pretty awkward, but I don't really > have much of an opinion here, one way or the other. Since it strips all text properties, then maybe 'stripped-mode'. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Oct 10 14:08:20 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Oct 2021 18:08:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55834 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZdFE-0004vu-Lp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 14:08:20 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:51594) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZdFC-0004vg-7B for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 14:08:18 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:57894) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mZdF6-0004cx-6u; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 14:08:12 -0400 Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=3490 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mZdEw-0005O9-4f; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 14:08:04 -0400 Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2021 21:07:50 +0300 Message-Id: <83pmscrbwp.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Juri Linkov In-Reply-To: <87ily5f3yh.fsf@mail.linkov.net> (message from Juri Linkov on Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:50:22 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87ily5f3yh.fsf@mail.linkov.net> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, larsi@gnus.org, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, rms@gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Juri Linkov > Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:50:22 +0300 > Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, > Richard Stallman > > >> "Clean" is not a very clear name for this, because the idea that > >> having no text properties is "cleaner" is a matter of taste. Some > >> might not make the connection between the word "cleam" and what this > >> does. Thus, people will have more difficulty remembering the name > >> from the meaning and vice versa. > >> > >> I suggest renaming it to "no-properties-mode". > > > > I think `no-properties-mode' sounds pretty awkward, but I don't really > > have much of an opinion here, one way or the other. > > Since it strips all text properties, then maybe 'stripped-mode'. I suggest stripped-naked-mode. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Oct 10 19:26:20 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Oct 2021 23:26:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56038 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZiCw-0004bp-9O for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:26:20 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:36828) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZiCm-0004bU-Hd for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:26:18 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:35482) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mZiCh-00031b-94; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:26:03 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mZiCg-0002ZQ-Ji; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:26:02 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sat, 09 Oct 2021 13:20:34 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:26:02 -0400 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > I think `no-properties-mode' sounds pretty awkward, but I don't really > have much of an opinion here, one way or the other. How about Vow of Poverty mode or just Poverty mode? (Poverty is having no properties.) M-x poverty-mode and M-x vow-of-poverty-mode can complete from only 2 or 3 characters. Likewise M-x no-properties-mode. M-x clean-mode requires 7 characters for completion. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Oct 10 23:01:58 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 03:01:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56197 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZlZe-0003lh-9M for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 23:01:58 -0400 Received: from smtp-4.orcon.net.nz ([60.234.4.59]:38687) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZlZY-0003lV-PD for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 10 Oct 2021 23:01:56 -0400 Received: from [10.253.37.70] (port=56805 helo=webmail.orcon.net.nz) by smtp-4.orcon.net.nz with esmtpa (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mZlZN-0004Yc-Lz; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 16:01:41 +1300 Received: from ip-203-94-48-127.kinect.net.nz ([203.94.48.127]) via [10.253.37.253] by webmail.orcon.net.nz with HTTP (HTTP/1.1 POST); Mon, 11 Oct 2021 16:01:41 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 16:01:41 +1300 From: Phil Sainty To: rms@gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec In-Reply-To: References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> Message-ID: <9ebff1f439f9177de78047c3eb62de14@webmail.orcon.net.nz> X-Sender: psainty@orcon.net.nz User-Agent: Orcon Webmail X-GeoIP: -- X-Spam_score: -2.9 X-Spam_score_int: -28 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, Lars Ingebrigtsen , p.stephani2@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On 2021-10-11 12:26, Richard Stallman wrote: > How about Vow of Poverty mode or just Poverty mode? > (Poverty is having no properties.) Neat, albeit unlikely to help anyone to find it. I suspect it might be considered to be in poor taste though (it needn't be interpreted as such, but I think it has potential to be). I agree that "clean" has no particular association with a lack of text properties, and I think Juri's suggestion: > Since it strips all text properties, then maybe 'stripped-mode'. is little different to "clean" -- anything can be stripped of anything, so there's no obvious reason why "text properties" should come to mind. > can complete from only 2 or 3 characters. Is it very important to optimise for this, in this particular case? I think that "no-properties" is sufficiently well-established terminology that incorporating that into the mode name would at least make it very easy to discover. Index entries that match ‘no-properties’: * buffer-substring-no-properties [Index]: Buffer Contents. (line 38) * field-string-no-properties [Index]: Fields. (line 61) * insert-buffer-substring-no-properties [Index]: Insertion. (line 94) * match-string-no-properties [Index]: Simple Match Data. (line 53) * minibuffer-contents-no-properties [Index]: Minibuffer Contents. (line 27) * substring-no-properties [Index]: Creating Strings. (line 101) (thing-at-point THING &optional NO-PROPERTIES) (buffer-substring-with-bidi-context START END &optional NO-PROPERTIES) (line-substring-with-bidi-context START END &optional NO-PROPERTIES) If someone is looking for related concepts, it's likely where they would start. A bit awkward/boring maybe, but probably still a good option. -Phil From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 04:19:15 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 08:19:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56392 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZqWg-0005ak-Vw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 04:19:15 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52552) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZqWe-0005aX-QL for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 04:19:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=Zm9Q22BsceiiVjWDjyOMWf6/5YmQ4G7h9Nq3/r8gEwE=; b=Eyc28TBZ0gyoRzj/vgHeZUXcb/ UjrcjQ/BtB7ap7FCFL8eEMOeWiGp5jx0YPU74wYjf8fC/8Kyd8fh06J4ggtgUdykcnvHN1OT1XXcQ 1ybJDCjrsBRaLRMlJrDVoxeY3ddms1st9/snkh5dd3Wb2OdqK3/qXNoLjYRYqE4PhfrA=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mZqWW-0000nh-Tn; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 10:19:07 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Richard Stallman Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAElBMVEXw6dX7+Omqp52D gntFR0T///9bmYzmAAAAAWJLR0QF+G/pxwAAAAd0SU1FB+UKCwc2FIFl7LwAAAGgSURBVDjLjZSB ccMgDEUF7gCQLkAFA7igCYz2n6lfgJO0ie+qy3GxniV9JCVE1+bitPkUYgzx2Q0LcJOd5H6DYW6A 8ArgThxfImYdju4FeAPJxTcRjubxt8bUFy9APEEgnzxXzsw5t1YnuHFrTZf1xvg+7xEA9I7GS3GC RMwpa+utIlXyolYdAKodnhrXzChGeUVEitHLoQflVmtj3vpDFfuu+k25tkpc9A5cqKLSkadoohOg BtMQ9eUCNHDW2atgvbMr6B4o9wewGtJFVSq5LBXp8PYC8OKTaNOe/ASz1+bWTq6oVv4YqdbYivay mzbUKiew8XPpOdHZyngCdKtte7qZ6CYGVg1PHjemDT6Tt0Bw50rKI5XJRQkewK9ZPQCn4S/mPpjl rOHHqGs2v3Rv3XUjQoZ8tVPkSOjV3MSb3HMfH6Wmra0L3u7+vH/K7n1b81gAQ08QULFYSs8RVsVj JzqANQnKij4brt5nr7CJtWE5MrYK68bYldXd91t94Q9X4E+qsPr8AmIIAX8Bb8BTqPtXjV8hV/4l Y/643bnLRD/tfnRPPiimNAAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAyMS0xMC0xMVQwNzo1NDoyMCsw MDowMBD3brsAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjEtMTAtMTFUMDc6NTQ6MjArMDA6MDBhqtYH AAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: David Byrne's _Music for The Knee Plays_: "Admiral Perry" Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 10:19:04 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Sun, 10 Oct 2021 19:26:02 -0400") Message-ID: <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Richard Stallman writes: > M-x poverty-mode and M-x vow-of-poverty-mode > can complete from only 2 or 3 characters. > Likewise M-x no-properties-mode. It also removed overlays and local variables, so it's not all about text properties... Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Richard Stallman writes: > M-x poverty-mode and M-x vow-of-poverty-mode > can complete from only 2 or 3 characters. > Likewise M-x no-properties-mode. It also removed overlays and local variables, so it's not all about text properties... -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 05:14:19 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 09:14:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56577 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZrNz-0002yl-5P for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 05:14:19 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-f43.google.com ([209.85.221.43]:33538) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZrNv-0002yO-Ao for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 05:14:17 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-f43.google.com with SMTP id m22so54006379wrb.0 for <30204@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 02:14:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=z7nzD6P/jyGkzzFR9idmyo8gIzCGQkfj8Knl8ljmZc4=; b=nS9ZWP8PcUW4eUicsoy7HCk3cTrBBgYcuniq/mDCEBHv3zmEVGyIEI9XCF7+IFsncC GKbHmu40LPucJHyQUY5rP8ZCDf9Nfmpugx53nDHn6WpEDaqXlsLvYbblFGGRaiszqDIN E11GgJ83I8lLmqskOmyjF38f17DBanMKTx5iqeTm4Hy0L3SRxP2F15AxwLug2aUjY4ld k6GFbWLLVdXVEBJQm389f2Ha7/RjqDdihhXWJLM6fCTrtwb3qQWkWZ5rRSbJqCx5qFTX LTJWsYNuzATCFgzWFcdqHMsxQf3GNWYQLmO8fPLO7srM4DSnLkkffVe1ttlMmkPIRRBf GoHQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=z7nzD6P/jyGkzzFR9idmyo8gIzCGQkfj8Knl8ljmZc4=; b=5H7HBUuTE72H3QyuE7h2g5nnXgrOBxfgK2cj/v2F90Q2rScM4JlvvKLxv+yOuw5jMA WOWrXDWK5y1wYeK9+0XX6fZsbxcAqCdfVQyklaj4Mu93/tentw01h4rQ/Rje8g173EM8 NIAKgigcZ6bJhPmtnW+sfaPJsfdtaM+3mHhtoDVaJCGJzS8dJd6joSibO2kiKkY5TY4L nyCu+l5NVn0r7+ULBq90WjnKAViimbtVdFkgDsUlVPML2iuxgyK6wenhzJ7vhzuVFyVv 13UrC4lqrhSe42iKvA1t8TpR6/aEg0G8CB/QI3Xp+EdEs/LOrD155JbyHxxEvGPZ+weN hp9g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532tTdeUQ94hgeTYOCbiUQDqJEIST3YbEfytbYk8Yopctki5e9kL 4G0g4bsnEi7Bhwi/y4Y5GQiB+VdtRJc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyfFltfa3WbHIFU5zxL+3XSDE8fdBKa1xcdnR61BiJJnC/pRqmckPyBKZQKnrWZ8YKkjUab+Q== X-Received: by 2002:adf:f8c2:: with SMTP id f2mr23796844wrq.234.1633943649000; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 02:14:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amdahl30 ([2a01:e0a:253:fe0:2ef0:5dff:fed2:7b49]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w5sm7146820wrq.86.2021.10.11.02.14.07 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Mon, 11 Oct 2021 02:14:08 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin_Le_Gouguec?= To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 11:14:07 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Mon, 11 Oct 2021 10:19:04 +0200") Message-ID: <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Richard Stallman writes: > >> M-x poverty-mode and M-x vow-of-poverty-mode >> can complete from only 2 or 3 characters. >> Likewise M-x no-properties-mode. > > It also removed overlays and local variables, so it's not all about text > properties... Maybe the name should emphasize the _lack_ of any features whatsoever, rather than the _removal_ of features? E.g. void-mode, null-mode, nil-mode, empty-mode, bare-mode, plain-mode? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 06:06:03 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 10:06:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56669 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZsC2-0000Dx-OA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 06:06:02 -0400 Received: from mail-wr1-f52.google.com ([209.85.221.52]:36411) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZsC1-0000DT-34 for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 06:06:01 -0400 Received: by mail-wr1-f52.google.com with SMTP id o20so54254408wro.3 for <30204@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 03:06:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=qyhbGcGrAHfLHSkp7LG5RM0yyqB+TItppX4TTR64qGw=; b=bbb/Wr9qYsG9Tqt3yFEZ0NIdaW5WotSixdOz86dQFRk2X+PVl1asK1Xnh/rvoH7nv+ kTsYuhFg8Jjf+10MdfuWQuMpaPcm8Yd6VL9S7zkQG52wCqlQLSDBE7ZnMgHmfAuMVm6Y 2gN7Ib+JU2xS/CdqmoOHN1P4MAZwaWcvyhMhwVeQia5u1pJKP0KBsl7YcEituLmvmY2n N9Ay1pDfvaO2dBd1CogFCERRD08WXAruIL6K1KqGZxLihnco2yGoLWw0L847Iz/o0txI d3q8nqwSWl4EZeORThqsPD4YeOn8nI7TH0KSgAl4Kyp8F2T96cusIbyH0bzSjWnHkCHF zRMQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=qyhbGcGrAHfLHSkp7LG5RM0yyqB+TItppX4TTR64qGw=; b=iZTK1jBQPcM48JcZLYuN4nh8bgs98qvPeFfOUoB8zc6w7BU4+lwhHhH17ixWaUXnxx brUIPey5k4LrHPZj8D7ykDsOov6OTTzJB4LVGW87PMbtdr+Q7/9y1gM4uW8+Y15kxkud MpZ1cy0EzrW1mVFLa3LiwA+K4ESxA+xXimvyrK3FjX/GvXL5I0HsaqlqHCJxwrn9KzDU lzlB5303E1uYs+PleW3Blxwk0qqLJVLuiL8uQDm/m4bYiwaMHPZnG3xWqR1HhWP8EICJ tFfYSDwc2j8I7KuF8SXLe/RBLV5Xgn0lRLVGSK0gjOXnjwUglejJPHa2uvOICdcLlM3n 4kOg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530NV3Si50M4pK+D+3pcmroh5MUL5YQWQiB0uNUlqUt5dmy6qx4q YtGnFfXA8LitQo/21g0UmJo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzEDHma/3XYmVmjzYLJ0qdG05AdopVF+TH8oQQ60K3w5EwzJqX7NvmaQPIwnZ9MmGwCS2oTlg== X-Received: by 2002:adf:dc0d:: with SMTP id t13mr23242223wri.158.1633946754982; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 03:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rltb ([82.66.8.55]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l20sm5359996wmq.42.2021.10.11.03.05.54 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Mon, 11 Oct 2021 03:05:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Pluim To: =?utf-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 12:05:53 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> (=?utf-8?Q?=22K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec"'s message of "Mon, 11 Oct 2021 11:14:07 +0200") Message-ID: <87ily3ub9a.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, Lars Ingebrigtsen , 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) >>>>> On Mon, 11 Oct 2021 11:14:07 +0200, K=C3=A9vin Le Gouguec said: K=C3=A9vin> Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: >> Richard Stallman writes: >>=20 >>> M-x poverty-mode and M-x vow-of-poverty-mode >>> can complete from only 2 or 3 characters. >>> Likewise M-x no-properties-mode. >>=20 >> It also removed overlays and local variables, so it's not all about = text >> properties... K=C3=A9vin> Maybe the name should emphasize the _lack_ of any features = whatsoever, K=C3=A9vin> rather than the _removal_ of features? E.g. void-mode, nul= l-mode, K=C3=A9vin> nil-mode, empty-mode, bare-mode, plain-mode? ascetic-mode, austere-mode, thomas-=C3=A0-becket-mode? Robert --=20 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 06:53:06 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 10:53:06 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56698 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZsva-0001Ui-K8 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 06:53:06 -0400 Received: from smtp-3.orcon.net.nz ([60.234.4.44]:38519) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mZsvY-0001UY-4T for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 06:53:05 -0400 Received: from [10.253.37.70] (port=5168 helo=webmail.orcon.net.nz) by smtp-3.orcon.net.nz with esmtpa (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mZsvV-0005id-JB; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 23:53:01 +1300 Received: from ip-203-94-48-127.kinect.net.nz ([203.94.48.127]) via [10.253.37.253] by webmail.orcon.net.nz with HTTP (HTTP/1.1 POST); Mon, 11 Oct 2021 23:53:01 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 23:53:01 +1300 From: Phil Sainty To: =?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin_Le_Gouguec?= Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec In-Reply-To: <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <51d75408d86e8c6bb05861bb725552ea@webmail.orcon.net.nz> X-Sender: psainty@orcon.net.nz User-Agent: Orcon Webmail X-GeoIP: -- X-Spam_score: -2.9 X-Spam_score_int: -28 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, Lars Ingebrigtsen , 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On 2021-10-11 22:14, Kévin Le Gouguec wrote: > Maybe the name should emphasize the _lack_ of any features whatsoever, > rather than the _removal_ of features? E.g. void-mode, null-mode, > nil-mode, empty-mode, bare-mode, plain-mode? foundation-mode? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 17:12:47 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 21:12:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32824 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2bH-0006tG-6X for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:12:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39168) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2bF-0006t1-Da for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:12:45 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:39552) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2b9-00086b-TB; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:12:39 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2b8-0005Y1-6m; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:12:38 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <83pmscrbwp.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Sun, 10 Oct 2021 21:07:50 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87ily5f3yh.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <83pmscrbwp.fsf@gnu.org> Message-Id: Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:12:38 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, larsi@gnus.org, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, juri@linkov.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > Since it strips all text properties, then maybe 'stripped-mode'. > I suggest stripped-naked-mode. I think that `stripped-mode' might be a good name. But since it is not about nudity, adding he word "naked" would only cause confusion. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 17:14:19 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 21:14:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32828 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2cl-0006vr-IO for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:14:19 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39596) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2cg-0006vb-CN for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:14:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:39656) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2cb-0002n2-3J; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:14:09 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2cZ-0005sI-Il; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:14:08 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Robert Pluim In-Reply-To: <87ily3ub9a.fsf@gmail.com> (message from Robert Pluim on Mon, 11 Oct 2021 12:05:53 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> <87ily3ub9a.fsf@gmail.com> Message-Id: Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:14:07 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, larsi@gnus.org, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, kevin.legouguec@gmail.com X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > ascetic-mode, austere-mode, thomas-à-becket-mode? Of those, I think "austere" mode is more correct -- but still, not immediately clear like no-properties-mode. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 11 17:16:00 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Oct 2021 21:16:00 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32832 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2eN-0006yn-UX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:16:00 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39908) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2eI-0006yR-5p for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:15:59 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:39712) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2eC-0003f3-Ux; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:15:48 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ma2eC-00065S-L4; Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:15:48 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Mon, 11 Oct 2021 10:19:04 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:15:48 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > It also removed overlays and local variables, so it's not all about text > properties... Changing major mode always eliminates local variables, so there is no need to regard that as a feature of this particular mode. Also, normally overlays are created by modes, so removing them may also be due to changing the mode, not a feature of this particular mode. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Oct 12 08:04:50 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Oct 2021 12:04:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33761 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1maGWY-0004nD-1m for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 08:04:50 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:37430) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1maGWW-0004my-HE for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 08:04:48 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=AIA1kdCOdHeMc8C6lGWDcAUn5P+SVRBvGd5q+L25iKw=; b=T+MluaoYg9/DgjnBNNAvkCgP7X j9tvu8SNMTP+FqatkP0bt65dRX0pJbtTQRdsiufRHuOVxZITrNyb2RBqtCnJqBlVIYagcn50aw3T5 v2t81bHr0Rep1TPB26VJK7Bn3xfoezgBT+mDeE2lm7e3K/rDPlS0HKcyXAp0WpTP06eQ=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1maGWO-0004kV-69; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 14:04:42 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Richard Stallman Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> X-Now-Playing: The Soft Pink Truth's _Am I Free To Go?_: "Respect the Earth (Crude SS cover)" Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2021 14:04:39 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Mon, 11 Oct 2021 17:15:48 -0400") Message-ID: <87lf2ye9ew.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Richard Stallman writes: > Changing major mode always eliminates local variables, so there is no need > to regard that as a feature of this particular mode. It also blanks out the permanent local variables, so it's unusual that way. Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Richard Stallman writes: > Changing major mode always eliminates local variables, so there is no need > to regard that as a feature of this particular mode. It also blanks out the permanent local variables, so it's unusual that way. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Oct 12 18:43:51 2021 Received: (at 30204) by debbugs.gnu.org; 12 Oct 2021 22:43:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55468 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1maQUw-0003YH-PA for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 18:43:51 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:36220) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1maQUm-0003Xs-8n for 30204@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 18:43:49 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:34628) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1maQUg-0007Zo-V7; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 18:43:34 -0400 Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1maQUg-0001a9-Ce; Tue, 12 Oct 2021 18:43:34 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman To: Lars Ingebrigtsen In-Reply-To: <87lf2ye9ew.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Tue, 12 Oct 2021 14:04:39 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#30204: 27.0.50; Changing major mode resets non-default invisibility spec References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf2ye9ew.fsf@gnus.org> Message-Id: Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2021 18:43:34 -0400 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 30204 Cc: p.stephani2@gmail.com, 30204@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > It also blanks out the permanent local variables, so it's unusual that way. That is indeed pretty strong medicine. Perhaps vanilla-mode ? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Oct 13 17:38:17 2021 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Oct 2021 21:38:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33781 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1malx2-0002Dv-UQ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2021 17:38:17 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:40878) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1malx0-0002Dl-3P for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2021 17:38:15 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45350) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1malwz-0005qB-Sg for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2021 17:38:13 -0400 Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]:55657) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1malwu-0001FE-8o for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2021 17:38:13 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1C932240104 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 2021 23:38:03 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1634161084; bh=quOaf4FYfhTVl3mmfjNVP7go+PQPDxLCcDjPkIPq3gc=; h=Date:From:To:CC:Subject:From; b=IT5tLQKy469AxT0Gs9rftW2hzADP5X3A9NpitHox0i2qoVCxit3dOhJFOBJPd2u+P Am2XyNkLGf5EGgKm3qtmict5bYdob9b5V2ihGivpEyhGuAWtn404JYghViDMwbQLp0 6XDD2+XHEEV4vEE8NEjB0QveGeeOSXATt2yD1q6n31L13Eb2QwknJiSAAaayQBHBRG BsD5XqCEptsSF5f/Ev0CBg7SPcuglyUsZX2gg5ni2sw95wwYSMO8XdSzPezomaomJD Yc4prsJLIAZ9LIgVLI7rqR0k/b8bcj9h62N1JJeMq7VF2S4GjeYq2m9V7KPkQa1fMC aK54rBKML+94A== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4HV5Vf5Cc1z6tmB; Wed, 13 Oct 2021 23:38:02 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2021 21:38:02 +0000 From: Tomas Nordin To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?K=E9vin_Le_Gouguec?= , Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: =?US-ASCII?Q?Re=3A_bug=2330204=3A_27=2E0=2E50=3B_Changing_major_m?= =?US-ASCII?Q?ode_resets_non-default_invisibility_spec?= In-Reply-To: <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lf55cxvj.fsf@gnus.org> <97574057-8212-4812-93CF-0C2EC7EA8B39@gmail.com> <87ilzfo13i.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnnvtlgn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgsrmk75.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8825snj.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf34qxoq.fsf@gnus.org> <871r4uphq5.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf30j7nr.fsf@gnus.org> <87tuhnudnk.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <750052F3-E906-450C-B654-1929DA5E42DE@posteo.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=tomasn@posteo.net; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -24 X-Spam_score: -2.5 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.5 / 5.0 requ) DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_TEMPERROR=0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit Cc: 30204@debbugs.gnu.org, p.stephani2@gmail.com, Richard Stallman X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) "K=C3=A9vin Le Gouguec" skrev: (11 oktober= 2021 11:14:07 CEST) >Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > >> Richard Stallman writes: >> >>> M-x poverty-mode and M-x vow-of-poverty-mode >>> can complete from only 2 or 3 characters=2E >>> Likewise M-x no-properties-mode=2E >> >> It also removed overlays and local variables, so it's not all about tex= t >> properties=2E=2E=2E > >Maybe the name should emphasize the _lack_ of any features whatsoever, >rather than the _removal_ of features? E=2Eg=2E void-mode, null-mode, >nil-mode, empty-mode, bare-mode, plain-mode? > > minimalistic-mode From unknown Sat Aug 16 16:07:51 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2021 12:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator