GNU bug report logs - #23698
24.5; broken character name

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: ynyaaa <at> gmail.com
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2016 22:06:23 +0900

Just after starting emacs -Q, this form returns correct value.

(get-char-code-property #xE01 'name)
=>"THAI CHARACTER KO KAI"

Then display THAI characters by typing this.
  M-x list-charset-chars RET thai-iso8859-11 RET

After THAI characters are displayed, the form returns wrong value.

(get-char-code-property #xE01 'name)
=>"LETTER KO KAI"

For other THAI characters, get-char-code-property returns wrong names.

UCS  correct name                    wrong name
E01  THAI CHARACTER KO KAI           LETTER KO KAI
E02  THAI CHARACTER KHO KHAI         LETTER KHO KHAI
E03  THAI CHARACTER KHO KHUAT        LETTER KHO KHUAT
E04  THAI CHARACTER KHO KHWAI        LETTER KHO KHWAI
E05  THAI CHARACTER KHO KHON         LETTER KHO KHON
E06  THAI CHARACTER KHO RAKHANG      LETTER KHO RAKHANG
E07  THAI CHARACTER NGO NGU          LETTER NGO NGU
E08  THAI CHARACTER CHO CHAN         LETTER CHO CHAN
E09  THAI CHARACTER CHO CHING        LETTER CHO CHING
E0A  THAI CHARACTER CHO CHANG        LETTER CHO CHANG
E0B  THAI CHARACTER SO SO            LETTER SO SO
E0C  THAI CHARACTER CHO CHOE         LETTER CHO CHOE
E0D  THAI CHARACTER YO YING          LETTER YO YING
E0E  THAI CHARACTER DO CHADA         LETTER DO CHADA
E0F  THAI CHARACTER TO PATAK         LETTER TO PATAK
E10  THAI CHARACTER THO THAN         LETTER THO THAN
E11  THAI CHARACTER THO NANGMONTHO   LETTER THO NANGMONTHO
E12  THAI CHARACTER THO PHUTHAO      LETTER THO PHUTHAO
E13  THAI CHARACTER NO NEN           LETTER NO NEN
E14  THAI CHARACTER DO DEK           LETTER DO DEK
E15  THAI CHARACTER TO TAO           LETTER TO TAO
E16  THAI CHARACTER THO THUNG        LETTER THO THUNG
E17  THAI CHARACTER THO THAHAN       LETTER THO THAHAN
E18  THAI CHARACTER THO THONG        LETTER THO THONG
E19  THAI CHARACTER NO NU            LETTER NO NU
E1A  THAI CHARACTER BO BAIMAI        LETTER BO BAIMAI
E1B  THAI CHARACTER PO PLA           LETTER PO PLA
E1C  THAI CHARACTER PHO PHUNG        LETTER PHO PHUNG
E1D  THAI CHARACTER FO FA            LETTER FO FA
E1E  THAI CHARACTER PHO PHAN         LETTER PHO PHAN
E1F  THAI CHARACTER FO FAN           LETTER FO FAN
E20  THAI CHARACTER PHO SAMPHAO      LETTER PHO SAMPHAO
E21  THAI CHARACTER MO MA            LETTER MO MA
E22  THAI CHARACTER YO YAK           LETTER YO YAK
E23  THAI CHARACTER RO RUA           LETTER RO RUA
E24  THAI CHARACTER RU               LETTER RU (Pali vowel letter)
E25  THAI CHARACTER LO LING          LETTER LO LING
E26  THAI CHARACTER LU               LETTER LU (Pali vowel letter)
E27  THAI CHARACTER WO WAEN          LETTER WO WAEN
E28  THAI CHARACTER SO SALA          LETTER SO SALA
E29  THAI CHARACTER SO RUSI          LETTER SO RUSI
E2A  THAI CHARACTER SO SUA           LETTER SO SUA
E2B  THAI CHARACTER HO HIP           LETTER HO HIP
E2C  THAI CHARACTER LO CHULA         LETTER LO CHULA
E2D  THAI CHARACTER O ANG            LETTER O ANG
E2E  THAI CHARACTER HO NOKHUK        LETTER HO NOK HUK
E2F  THAI CHARACTER PAIYANNOI        PAI YAN NOI (abbreviation)
E30  THAI CHARACTER SARA A           VOWEL SIGN SARA A
E31  THAI CHARACTER MAI HAN-AKAT     VOWEL SIGN MAI HAN-AKAT N/S-T
E32  THAI CHARACTER SARA AA          VOWEL SIGN SARA AA
E33  THAI CHARACTER SARA AM          VOWEL SIGN SARA AM
E34  THAI CHARACTER SARA I           VOWEL SIGN SARA I N/S-T
E35  THAI CHARACTER SARA II          VOWEL SIGN SARA II N/S-T
E36  THAI CHARACTER SARA UE          VOWEL SIGN SARA UE N/S-T
E37  THAI CHARACTER SARA UEE         VOWEL SIGN SARA UEE N/S-T
E38  THAI CHARACTER SARA U           VOWEL SIGN SARA U N/S-B
E39  THAI CHARACTER SARA UU          VOWEL SIGN SARA UU N/S-B
E3A  THAI CHARACTER PHINTHU          VOWEL SIGN PHINTHU N/S-B (Pali virama)
E3F  THAI CURRENCY SYMBOL BAHT       BAHT SIGN (currency symbol)
E40  THAI CHARACTER SARA E           VOWEL SIGN SARA E
E41  THAI CHARACTER SARA AE          VOWEL SIGN SARA AE
E42  THAI CHARACTER SARA O           VOWEL SIGN SARA O
E43  THAI CHARACTER SARA AI MAIMUAN  VOWEL SIGN SARA MAI MUAN
E44  THAI CHARACTER SARA AI MAIMALAI VOWEL SIGN SARA MAI MALAI
E45  THAI CHARACTER LAKKHANGYAO      LAK KHANG YAO
E46  THAI CHARACTER MAIYAMOK         MAI YAMOK (repetition)
E47  THAI CHARACTER MAITAIKHU        VOWEL SIGN MAI TAI KHU N/S-T
E48  THAI CHARACTER MAI EK           TONE MAI EK N/S-T
E49  THAI CHARACTER MAI THO          TONE MAI THO N/S-T
E4A  THAI CHARACTER MAI TRI          TONE MAI TRI N/S-T
E4B  THAI CHARACTER MAI CHATTAWA     TONE MAI CHATTAWA N/S-T
E4C  THAI CHARACTER THANTHAKHAT      THANTHAKHAT N/S-T (cancellation mark)
E4D  THAI CHARACTER NIKHAHIT         NIKKHAHIT N/S-T (final nasal)
E4E  THAI CHARACTER YAMAKKAN         YAMAKKAN N/S-T
E4F  THAI CHARACTER FONGMAN          FONRMAN
E50  THAI DIGIT ZERO                 DIGIT ZERO
E51  THAI DIGIT ONE                  DIGIT ONE
E52  THAI DIGIT TWO                  DIGIT TWO
E53  THAI DIGIT THREE                DIGIT THREE
E54  THAI DIGIT FOUR                 DIGIT FOUR
E55  THAI DIGIT FIVE                 DIGIT FIVE
E56  THAI DIGIT SIX                  DIGIT SIX
E57  THAI DIGIT SEVEN                DIGIT SEVEN
E58  THAI DIGIT EIGHT                DIGIT EIGHT
E59  THAI DIGIT NINE                 DIGIT NINE
E5A  THAI CHARACTER ANGKHANKHU       ANGKHANKHU (ellipsis)
E5B  THAI CHARACTER KHOMUT           KHOMUT (beginning of religious texts)




In GNU Emacs 24.5.1 (i686-pc-mingw32)
 of 2015-04-11 on LEG570
Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 6.0.6002
Configured using:
 `configure --prefix=/c/usr --host=i686-pc-mingw32'

Important settings:
  value of $LANG: JPN
  locale-coding-system: cp932

Major mode: Lisp Interaction

Minor modes in effect:
  tooltip-mode: t
  electric-indent-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  tool-bar-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Recent messages:

Load-path shadows:
None found.

Features:
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mail-prsvr mail-utils thai-util thai-word mule-util info mule-diag
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font-lock syntax facemenu font-core frame cham georgian utf-8-lang
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hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process w32notify w32
multi-tty emacs)

Memory information:
((conses 8 164471 6457)
 (symbols 32 27891 0)
 (miscs 32 55 271)
 (strings 16 24013 5282)
 (string-bytes 1 514589)
 (vectors 8 11535)
 (vector-slots 4 515427 5354)
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 (intervals 28 317 19)
 (buffers 508 16))

Message #8 received at 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: ynyaaa <at> gmail.com, Kenichi Handa <handa <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23698: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2016 18:44:56 +0300

> From: ynyaaa <at> gmail.com
> Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2016 22:06:23 +0900
> 
> 
> Just after starting emacs -Q, this form returns correct value.
> 
> (get-char-code-property #xE01 'name)
> =>"THAI CHARACTER KO KAI"
> 
> Then display THAI characters by typing this.
>   M-x list-charset-chars RET thai-iso8859-11 RET
> 
> After THAI characters are displayed, the form returns wrong value.
> 
> (get-char-code-property #xE01 'name)
> =>"LETTER KO KAI"

Displaying the list of Thai characters loads thai-util.el, which
deliberately overwrites the names derived from the Unicode Character
Database with its own variants.  I'm CC'ing Handa-san, who added that
code back in 2008, in the hope that he could tell why are we doing
that, and whether this is still needed nowadays.

Thanks.

Message #11 received at 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Kenichi Handa <handa <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, ynyaaa <at> gmail.com
Subject: Re: bug#23698: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2016 19:44:01 +0300

> Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2016 18:44:56 +0300
> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
> Cc: 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Displaying the list of Thai characters loads thai-util.el, which
> deliberately overwrites the names derived from the Unicode Character
> Database with its own variants.  I'm CC'ing Handa-san, who added that
> code back in 2008, in the hope that he could tell why are we doing
> that, and whether this is still needed nowadays.

Actually, this code is much older: we have it since 1997, i.e. before
we started using the UCD for these purposes.  So I think we can either
remove it or use a property that doesn't clash with the Unicode
standard properties.

Btw, the same problem exists with Lao (see lao-util.el).

Message #16 received at 23698-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Paul Eggert <eggert <at> cs.ucla.edu>
To: ynyaaa <at> gmail.com
Cc: Kenichi Handa <handa <at> gnu.org>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>,
 23698-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2016 10:49:12 -0700

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

> we have it since 1997, i.e. before
> we started using the UCD for these purposes.  So I think we can either
> remove it or use a property that doesn't clash with the Unicode
> standard properties.
It appears to be unnecessary these days, so I removed it in the attached 
patch to master and am marking the bug as done. If I'm wrong and we need 
it we can use a different property as you suggest.

[0001-Use-standard-Unicode-names-for-Thai-Lao.txt (text/plain, attachment)]

Message #19 received at 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Paul Eggert <eggert <at> cs.ucla.edu>
Cc: 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, ynyaaa <at> gmail.com, handa <at> gnu.org
Subject: Re: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2016 22:00:31 +0300

> Cc: 23698-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>,
>  Kenichi Handa <handa <at> gnu.org>
> From: Paul Eggert <eggert <at> cs.ucla.edu>
> Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2016 10:49:12 -0700
> 
> > we have it since 1997, i.e. before
> > we started using the UCD for these purposes.  So I think we can either
> > remove it or use a property that doesn't clash with the Unicode
> > standard properties.
> It appears to be unnecessary these days, so I removed it in the attached 
> patch to master and am marking the bug as done. If I'm wrong and we need 
> it we can use a different property as you suggest.

I'd still like to hear Handa-san's opinions on this.

Message #22 received at 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: handa <handa <at> gnu.org>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, ynyaaa <at> gmail.com
Subject: Re: bug#23698: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2016 23:32:21 +0900

In article <83y46jtzbb.fsf <at> gnu.org>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

> Displaying the list of Thai characters loads thai-util.el, which
> deliberately overwrites the names derived from the Unicode Character
> Database with its own variants.  I'm CC'ing Handa-san, who added that
> code back in 2008, in the hope that he could tell why are we doing
> that, and whether this is still needed nowadays.

Long ago, I discussed with Thai/Lao people about how to support their
languages in Mule.  At that time, as I can't speak those languages, we
refer each character by name in the discussion.  And, for debugging the
support code, name property was very useful.  That's the reason for
those properties.   Now, I think we can get rid them.

---
K. Handa
handa <at> gnu.org

Message #25 received at 23698-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: handa <handa <at> gnu.org>
Cc: ynyaaa <at> gmail.com, 23698-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23698: 24.5; broken character name
Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2016 17:37:31 +0300

> From: handa <handa <at> gnu.org>
> Cc: ynyaaa <at> gmail.com, 23698 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2016 23:32:21 +0900
> 
> In article <83y46jtzbb.fsf <at> gnu.org>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
> 
> > Displaying the list of Thai characters loads thai-util.el, which
> > deliberately overwrites the names derived from the Unicode Character
> > Database with its own variants.  I'm CC'ing Handa-san, who added that
> > code back in 2008, in the hope that he could tell why are we doing
> > that, and whether this is still needed nowadays.
> 
> Long ago, I discussed with Thai/Lao people about how to support their
> languages in Mule.  At that time, as I can't speak those languages, we
> refer each character by name in the discussion.  And, for debugging the
> support code, name property was very useful.  That's the reason for
> those properties.   Now, I think we can get rid them.

OK, thanks.  So I guess Paul's change did TRT, and we can close this
bug report.

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