From unknown Fri Jun 20 18:10:05 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#23478 <23478@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#23478 <23478@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry Reply-To: bug#23478 <23478@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2025 01:10:05 +0000 retitle 23478 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry reassign 23478 emacs submitter 23478 Stephen Berman severity 23478 minor tag 23478 patch thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 08 11:45:09 2016 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 May 2016 15:45:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43368 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azQtI-0002lc-Ls for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:45:08 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:49900) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azQtG-0002kr-RT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:45:07 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azQtA-0005pW-7F for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:45:01 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,FREEMAIL_FROM autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:52230) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azQtA-0005pP-45 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:45:00 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:40853) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azQt7-0006RS-Nm for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:44:58 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azQt3-0005ns-EX for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:44:56 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:50426) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azQt3-0005nU-0x for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 11:44:53 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.107.13]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx002) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MAyZg-1apYyz43sa-009xEz for ; Sun, 08 May 2016 17:44:50 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 17:44:49 +0200 Message-ID: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:BYCv2RBdN2Y8htEFOwy+YWlLU9tBomWjO+Fc4uPxMO2/fWyUvFf eq5aixU/IeQX802Bzq+UVyf4u1Lr+vrM8euY1Vrd7TqWmzLO8b6zEDR6bZnvDcddPC1PDEM IMIPdAcTMuG7sCh0Ye+jx7/tG05D9Ei0CBJc4fe2kbGxXI+61IdPtzeNVmBgbwrEsy7vcSG QXTP57BA8TlYdSdtNb4DA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:w/71NvayzRg=:8uWrSXnWeMVcCuO5hmxK56 KB7l7avDjVBiKAaUj0YvN+TorW/yiUjvI9jyGaL8Yr2/uX9GdZhXbTH14rDKfTfv8NQcBAsrP ea18ijPZYG/nfsEYP7gAhqpJyHKPvfU/2xMLwlzLmAGcQLWusYlmN4l2uhAZeVVColBPHpMak GfDEgCfW0SwqFe7kZkDad5HNAALjX91EUcI949yfHeHGvLLisMLnwvxjZPX6kS/XVyjd//qbK GJHTRh9xZ2EPlBjstA5kNTSugN5EAduhQ5bi5pULURpZ8VQ1L6NsS2pVM+aItrkO/Fj9qVoe9 c3ehc507w3qS4oU8DJxt9b1wc3bRO+gjFAAvRkqZB1lDTDqQo8HLxSEUQ+xtn4RdA7WC9VaCa kavwBDaDEcatss6NRI3ezHqX/OQ0rm2uJvKejjqIiJ2dIB5IZODD1HiRA5q/LNmO1K6RJ/m9x 7xRb/dfrnYTK8URvOoXB1+/jfxC2wqGy04AQD4NXGQTkIrc73MT9CEALR2kFJu6A5KHRnWcjn 69ZojkhkBnFCRbyVoRxf1p2V7ciykoYpU6Cu2rW0sfgrEuIH86N43i+X9QuWDJMWO31NKHgo9 Oq/fb8LGBrpKF4wOEgZzC9MKcAyBHWrOEddbQfrd4kSOq6ObUDiRgXN0TGwWDxKI6e8Sb7HVg SD7tNOi9z+LD6l29qRbVC2IgVXVFu59pRC5kb5pu4RPxnoNYcG6OiLGTjJXXqoQZgDR2CkMjr Oe0lmnXe71qHAgSEL+E7mJ+I0StjvrJp8r8tE1OYrqVkcLwSurUrDb8wiN1FZkAbtbw9yy/H/ NnFJLiK X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -4.1 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -4.1 (----) When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end of the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible (unless it's larger than half the window's height). But when you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of the region is above the first visible line of the window, Emacs does not recenter the display, so the entire selected region is not visible. To reproduce: 0. emacs -Q 1. C-h t M-g M-g 42 RET (to open the English Emacs Tutorial and put point on line 42). 2. C-l C-l C-l (to make line 42 the last visible line in the window). 3. Double click with mouse-1 on the `(' before "hold" in line 42. => The display is recentered and the region between `(' on line 42 and `)' on line 43 is selected and highlighted. 4. C-a C-l C-l (to clear the selection highlighting and make line 43 the first visible line in the window). 5. Double click with mouse-1 on the `)' after "key" in line 43. => Line 43 is highlighted but remains the first visible line in the window and the part of the region on line 42 is not visible. This is not a program bug, since Emacs is behaving as intended, but it is a UX asymmetry that I think it would be preferable to eliminate. The patch below does that, but I'm not sure it's the best way to handle this, since I don't know whether calling `recenter' from Lisp may have undesirable side effects that the automatic recentering Emacs redisplay does when point moves out of the visible portion of the window does not have. diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el index fa355ff..c3efefe 100644 --- a/lisp/mouse.el +++ b/lisp/mouse.el @@ -531,7 +531,10 @@ mouse-set-point (interactive "e\np") (mouse-minibuffer-check event) (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) - (mouse-set-region event) + (progn + (mouse-set-region event) + (when (> (window-start) (region-beginning)) + (recenter))) ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) In GNU Emacs 25.0.93.5 (x86_64-suse-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.14.15) of 2016-05-08 built on rosalinde Repository revision: cd27f7396b77086b6c02eff5b2648bfba439d264 Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11601000 System Description: openSUSE 13.2 (Harlequin) (x86_64) Configured using: 'configure --with-xwidgets 'CFLAGS=-Og -g3'' Configured features: XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG IMAGEMAGICK SOUND DBUS GCONF GSETTINGS NOTIFY GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE M17N_FLT LIBOTF XFT ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11 XWIDGETS Important settings: value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=ibus locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 08 12:23:29 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 May 2016 16:23:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43389 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azRUP-0003eL-Ji for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 12:23:29 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:54900) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azRUO-0003e9-Co for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 12:23:28 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azRUF-00046V-5i for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 12:23:23 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:56179) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azRUF-00046R-2i; Sun, 08 May 2016 12:23:19 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1949 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1azRUD-0001PV-62; Sun, 08 May 2016 12:23:17 -0400 Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 19:23:17 +0300 Message-Id: <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Sun, 08 May 2016 17:44:49 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -7.1 (-------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -7.1 (-------) > From: Stephen Berman > Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 17:44:49 +0200 > > When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end of > the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs recenters > the display, making the entire selected region visible (unless it's > larger than half the window's height). But when you select a region by > double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of the region is above > the first visible line of the window, Emacs does not recenter the > display, so the entire selected region is not visible. Isn't this because Emacs always makes sure point is visible, but there's no such requirement about the mark? If I type "C-x C-x" after item 5 in your recipe, the entire region becomes visible, as expected. > This is not a program bug, since Emacs is behaving as intended, but it > is a UX asymmetry that I think it would be preferable to eliminate. The > patch below does that, but I'm not sure it's the best way to handle > this, since I don't know whether calling `recenter' from Lisp may have > undesirable side effects that the automatic recentering Emacs redisplay > does when point moves out of the visible portion of the window does not > have. I don't think calling 'recenter' is TRT. First, the fact that you see the display recentering after item 3 in your recipe is only the default behavior; if you set scroll-conservatively to 101 before repeating your recipe, you will see that Emacs instead scrolls the display just one line, i.e. the minimum amount required to bring point back into view. Users that set scroll-conservatively like that will lynch us if we recenter display in this situation. Bottom line, I don't think we should behave like that by default. I think this could be an optional feature, but it must obey scroll-conservatively (and maybe also other related variables). Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 08 14:31:16 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 May 2016 18:31:16 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43438 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azTU4-0006cL-K0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:31:16 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:63757) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azTU2-0006c7-UM for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:31:15 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.107.13]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Lugbo-1bhR7L0Pxo-00zr6P; Sun, 08 May 2016 20:31:07 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 20:31:04 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 08 May 2016 19:23:17 +0300") Message-ID: <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:BuhGFyw1D4oqjPEkUmSkavDZZjKNPoejD0JvDpizKNsqWq5orH8 awWlLPlhv1U5YG8h6s3cUAPyJKCsEKqD01z1JRNndq4UUUZV42IvdYVSZGBCWIYTdgHjQ2e s7wLaOyhIfKjGMWjhwOVEuqqSOxYpS/i+DOiPl4VIfo1FYv2o2tnQn9kv+AdRBOJJMLAYNA bNeVKK3lQSxHU0nQYQs5Q== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:1HYIM0alZjQ=:yFKbPDXO1w0sDa1sH8tkd0 DRg98/Ih45YR3ec/E3matrZO8W8sWXfj4/rmrre4srxbFjeJ8ztprEuLy2zp4YzJae5QV+xOk hiOaUpJYyyFS7zdMjOJgscgU/c5je/gIf8c2JFUtOoTj9a2b73oOj6gWPJu5AuWrn/FD7e5tR iB/b7wd0ZpxGBoUP4T9Xj17oTrnOwUMLsmBJ2w1S+WVilsrxp8lO7ExO0wzie+pcu2C07V7Jn laE6lcLv2qc6E8omfPvxEGE7nuNLArP177ZLyS2SbQni7ELMv3PdDh/k4w1l045mhmIpsI9o9 RaFbAbq+Kur6x39ZYN+fFIJk/seRdEQQ1YX9j8bGLuqa5TWDUnvmMAzjlMCOXWrwZ0Xr6fc2h /Oo72OgGOhGpxslVi1pNvhhoOzJ5ZYjia6i0aGVdoJp117E9Q4RvM7UCiiegoqhv0Pq07F1Mm 1z37wDDKT8+8PGEU2WUCHrS18VVG/IPPSYKtTQenl4tB2C51q1go9Drgg1lIrZcbKmq9JT7kt jEUTpCJQ+RUKKlDpAkIPwKTz19r/69EVzTOqzGEUXaOhGQq8rZdLdpLJMC5uF9L6QKYNCese8 +yO3nO8i7o+reRRKlkWG+y1L8UwfYVSNLZ/T9QJDDhLBTrpV8XhHhkAHphJq3oaHk8X8hLIjV CkgcaGgk+P5eJSu6iGzAhkvV7JOwGTQajQa9reckS6nvie3iQ39nWlM9LXSLcOeNr5xRyUPbz 93I7b1ED0QGo9DeUlQfWTPceYOZWUc1iFyj3euNk7OGOkgwBhQxCaWylNES8etL/Icyf7RWqg ISL3S7+ X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) On Sun, 08 May 2016 19:23:17 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 17:44:49 +0200 >> >> When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end of >> the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs recenters >> the display, making the entire selected region visible (unless it's >> larger than half the window's height). But when you select a region by >> double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of the region is above >> the first visible line of the window, Emacs does not recenter the >> display, so the entire selected region is not visible. > > Isn't this because Emacs always makes sure point is visible, but > there's no such requirement about the mark? I'm sure it is. > If I type "C-x C-x" after > item 5 in your recipe, the entire region becomes visible, as expected. Yes, and you also see the whole region when you type `S-C-M-b' on `)' in step 5 instead of double clicking on it, because backward-sexp changes point, but double-clicking does not (or rather, it puts point one position after region-end). >> This is not a program bug, since Emacs is behaving as intended, but it >> is a UX asymmetry that I think it would be preferable to eliminate. The >> patch below does that, but I'm not sure it's the best way to handle >> this, since I don't know whether calling `recenter' from Lisp may have >> undesirable side effects that the automatic recentering Emacs redisplay >> does when point moves out of the visible portion of the window does not >> have. > > I don't think calling 'recenter' is TRT. First, the fact that you see > the display recentering after item 3 in your recipe is only the > default behavior; if you set scroll-conservatively to 101 before > repeating your recipe, you will see that Emacs instead scrolls the > display just one line, i.e. the minimum amount required to bring point > back into view. Users that set scroll-conservatively like that will > lynch us if we recenter display in this situation. Good point, I think I had that vaguely in mind when I expressed my doubts about `recenter', but couldn't remember just what needed to be taken account of. I did try an alternative to `recenter', using `goto-char' instead, which changes point and hence induces recentering by redisplay, but it also loses the region highlighting. I tried (with several variants involving redisplay-highlight-region-function and redisplay--update-region-highlight) but failed to figure out how to keep the highlighting, but if that's a better way to handle this, maybe someone more familiar with the region highlighting code will be able to do that. > Bottom line, I don't think we should behave like that by default. I > think this could be an optional feature, but it must obey > scroll-conservatively (and maybe also other related variables). Definitely. Thanks for the feedback. Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 08 14:54:28 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 May 2016 18:54:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43460 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azTqW-000791-GW for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:54:28 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:49849) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azTqV-00078p-EL for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:54:27 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azTqM-0005qa-Sy for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:54:22 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:40759) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azTqM-0005pn-PT; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:54:18 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:3276 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1azTqK-0006FK-Ji; Sun, 08 May 2016 14:54:17 -0400 Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 21:54:17 +0300 Message-Id: <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Sun, 08 May 2016 20:31:04 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -7.1 (-------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -7.1 (-------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 20:31:04 +0200 > > > I don't think calling 'recenter' is TRT. First, the fact that you see > > the display recentering after item 3 in your recipe is only the > > default behavior; if you set scroll-conservatively to 101 before > > repeating your recipe, you will see that Emacs instead scrolls the > > display just one line, i.e. the minimum amount required to bring point > > back into view. Users that set scroll-conservatively like that will > > lynch us if we recenter display in this situation. > > Good point, I think I had that vaguely in mind when I expressed my > doubts about `recenter', but couldn't remember just what needed to be > taken account of. I did try an alternative to `recenter', using > `goto-char' instead, which changes point and hence induces recentering > by redisplay, but it also loses the region highlighting. I tried (with > several variants involving redisplay-highlight-region-function and > redisplay--update-region-highlight) but failed to figure out how to keep > the highlighting, but if that's a better way to handle this, maybe > someone more familiar with the region highlighting code will be able to > do that. > > > Bottom line, I don't think we should behave like that by default. I > > think this could be an optional feature, but it must obey > > scroll-conservatively (and maybe also other related variables). > > Definitely. Thanks for the feedback. How about momentarily exchanging mark and point, then calling sit-for for some small time interval, then exchanging back? Shouldn't this do what you want, or at least come close? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 08 15:41:31 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 May 2016 19:41:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43481 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azUa2-0008Gv-Vk for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:41:31 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:60274) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azUa0-0008Gg-TT for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:41:29 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.107.13]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LvVYZ-1bgd4E2V1v-010gCy; Sun, 08 May 2016 21:41:21 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 21:41:19 +0200 In-Reply-To: <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 08 May 2016 21:54:17 +0300") Message-ID: <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:SXdKb+xLaaaDHJriipv2P5yCCh484JcLBi5TffNue/Q7V9mznXr UZ51J1htDd4AsbCNkraOHQ3THBs3HA+qsmGLhWqp4lm2Q5Fo81RyateUdwpCNVd/YkXdQzT 6BtKH7whXfikLQ94FW2P1nZg/DpRutmCvHFxC7YF9t/qd6X3ZOjcLfH7uiJZ4zDn6zMHIkA osvboouJLIjt0i6lYDqYg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:8syMQJ96+1c=:R/aPCqm5CWCO50qsl2Ohl2 gZgTDJISv6QZpv11hWF5bEoDaoPaU1cJ7PUhI5yjmQxX23MRWwOlLWCV6qzEdyV0gDwcDuB7J Oh83mO09i2B6E6IucpHFVGqRYfeNTYzepIJCuuEqJsuxKB6Tu/5ybwOiMFsyyVARvZJT3IiQ+ Uxl4A/4d1N7ALAeGbBLI+nxrR8k+PIumHxRTs5hdUeHPG70BLwPCOgtZvPxGX0afRdguhtelk hYATYcQnr3nrtHam0NXJYPX5v3hQ28SdR2MzUuk6zwjNUeqAVa9y/x5hQgblXerPPDajiKwBc eLso7QE1JKAN/kcimf3qO50N9z7WWcSdjyyL+HfFillrDlqrKt3VNQMsojn7CPKlXSIAfWIUY 0JeXxCDNJ8838PWHzeGhztRTOGN66pgaF0XzFpI+9o0bIeqdIlg994LC8sct7N0awJgfElEnU MY0MBT+EKFkL+u9vNtNYKH6mJeTJEu3eIJAHoFuXDCEien4/34L1F4/cE9UFt8HWv7kJ5OhCj U57RXW8t0UhAYKHsvZgUmNfVaw91E204xDUy9Pbx4m528n8yLamDgaI8x0BfXppmIDKV83gcn hTWXRx5CqE6c2tFf8uNTRu97N/QsTH7dwOUF41uOFLP5n1PUQPw3wQgGm4eUa+w2XHxylWyHB m55YK/jy4J12NV2THC93ngIY4baoX5+/tzdEDpcKlklVN5z1WK1svIavCieZgyfYuQp3JWZDc 8sdB9tgvRyFpQXSk2MZiw8ITc1b8soKnbQE6MGmXrmpaiwZlRjZ9sXP9rgwgTz275gK0DjBK7 Mo9wp+t X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) On Sun, 08 May 2016 21:54:17 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 20:31:04 +0200 >> >> > I don't think calling 'recenter' is TRT. First, the fact that you see >> > the display recentering after item 3 in your recipe is only the >> > default behavior; if you set scroll-conservatively to 101 before >> > repeating your recipe, you will see that Emacs instead scrolls the >> > display just one line, i.e. the minimum amount required to bring point >> > back into view. Users that set scroll-conservatively like that will >> > lynch us if we recenter display in this situation. >> >> Good point, I think I had that vaguely in mind when I expressed my >> doubts about `recenter', but couldn't remember just what needed to be >> taken account of. I did try an alternative to `recenter', using >> `goto-char' instead, which changes point and hence induces recentering >> by redisplay, but it also loses the region highlighting. I tried (with >> several variants involving redisplay-highlight-region-function and >> redisplay--update-region-highlight) but failed to figure out how to keep >> the highlighting, but if that's a better way to handle this, maybe >> someone more familiar with the region highlighting code will be able to >> do that. >> >> > Bottom line, I don't think we should behave like that by default. I >> > think this could be an optional feature, but it must obey >> > scroll-conservatively (and maybe also other related variables). >> >> Definitely. Thanks for the feedback. > > How about momentarily exchanging mark and point, then calling sit-for > for some small time interval, then exchanging back? Shouldn't this do > what you want, or at least come close? I didn't think of that, but it looks like it does the trick. It also behaves well with scroll-conservatively. Thanks! Do you really think this should be conditioned by a user option? I'd be surprised if some people prefer the existing behavior or there's any code that relies on it. Can you think of any gotchas? Steve Berman diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el index fa355ff..d256393 100644 --- a/lisp/mouse.el +++ b/lisp/mouse.el @@ -531,7 +531,12 @@ mouse-set-point (interactive "e\np") (mouse-minibuffer-check event) (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) - (mouse-set-region event) + (progn + (mouse-set-region event) + (when (> (window-start) (region-beginning)) + (exchange-point-and-mark) + (sit-for 0.01) + (exchange-point-and-mark))) ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun May 08 15:45:23 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 May 2016 19:45:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43494 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azUdm-0008O3-R4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:45:23 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:58935) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1azUdk-0008No-NK for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:45:21 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azUdc-00074z-I5 for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:45:15 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_20,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:41316) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1azUdc-00074Z-7v; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:45:12 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:3482 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1azUda-0004yf-5M; Sun, 08 May 2016 15:45:10 -0400 Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 22:45:10 +0300 Message-Id: <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Sun, 08 May 2016 21:41:19 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -7.1 (-------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -7.1 (-------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 08 May 2016 21:41:19 +0200 > > > How about momentarily exchanging mark and point, then calling sit-for > > for some small time interval, then exchanging back? Shouldn't this do > > what you want, or at least come close? > > I didn't think of that, but it looks like it does the trick. It also > behaves well with scroll-conservatively. Thanks! Glad it did the trick. > Do you really think this should be conditioned by a user option? I do, but let's hear from others. Anyone? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jul 02 19:16:55 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2016 23:16:55 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34936 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJU9f-00088Z-36 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 02 Jul 2016 19:16:55 -0400 Received: from mail-io0-f175.google.com ([209.85.223.175]:34533) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJU9d-00088H-DL; Sat, 02 Jul 2016 19:16:53 -0400 Received: by mail-io0-f175.google.com with SMTP id g13so126634376ioj.1; Sat, 02 Jul 2016 16:16:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=Fe7Rn9GmqMz7LdtyFk7ce4ygY5kdWBdVy6SqGWImivI=; b=Gm8uivSpOTh82hqYU41gpMD7mMX8wxmVr6fm36zwNGgTIe5eYXqHdxAplrBeBYgN7Q dAM/7QHuHzKEk2aBW97+Pi1Jmwlaabd2fiQb7nq1XPvQS7Yj5/p3UHQTDBM5La6faudk XowuLwK3B++gryyaEDg6Pbfyz74dqHFEBTQREO4LTFzeDsQDDywGy79GShAOt1keJqxX O9VT8WfSU78LXkVBs0tkdS1wQOsQjFaUoFPKeX4ArGlhL+C1msXLaBVg/p/KjFMzl4Op s+5gICx8bP72/gX/yg8dtFWddpw5Kw9jpwyCPzp8KGH/FD9aYsEc+km2nJ4hUEBHFAW2 4tmA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:date :in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=Fe7Rn9GmqMz7LdtyFk7ce4ygY5kdWBdVy6SqGWImivI=; b=jP3HBCltBsObDuirQGnrETnOfV3LjuxYehKDHs7OG3tr9gDk/CSLRBkwd8KnBOAfxe xhdtsxYUsEkjvfjd17OGPitHqxh7RkUgMeCG6O71/pEvMSIF2lfdGmr9LdudyRsn2gUm yMv1wDNSV3B9mc03ve/79UDJLoFE9WhelxflSpsqQrenUzlwtZzUCc5vSW71wRLjveZC swNpqYCpBXhaQ5DV7qYfv6Y66uSKA9XJzTpAWTF8vbEkuxTAqfUtX4sBUDnSrx5LdF7n O0Gr8GdaPk4oz6zNsQur4cfcUWqybsB2Sfw0lGdNBn3WqA3KsEaJC4MhzbUQ0S47h+Sy 2HmQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tLGkiNq/ZFZVudEJastc4b9912IoW603cDwV/gsLbQbp3fe8mPsv9Xj/NFPdFXUqg== X-Received: by 10.107.161.11 with SMTP id k11mr3922423ioe.149.1467501407857; Sat, 02 Jul 2016 16:16:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zony (206-188-64-44.cpe.distributel.net. [206.188.64.44]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id f69sm2715230ioj.39.2016.07.02.16.16.46 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 02 Jul 2016 16:16:46 -0700 (PDT) From: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2016 19:16:56 -0400 In-Reply-To: <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 08 May 2016 22:45:10 +0300") Message-ID: <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: Stephen Berman , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) severity 23478 minor tags 23478 patch quit Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Do you really think this should be conditioned by a user option? > > I do, but let's hear from others. Anyone? This behaviour seems much preferable to me, since otherwise it's not clear which text gets selected. I'm not in favour of adding an option, but if there must be one, at least let this new behaviour be the default. Regarding the code, I notice that using (sit-for 0) works as well. A comment to explain what the calls are for would be nice. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 03 10:34:19 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Jul 2016 14:34:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36026 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJiTT-0002nR-5R for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 10:34:19 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:50296) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJiTR-0002nD-KJ for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 10:34:18 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.64.176]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MAQ0o-1b9EtC2Aw6-00BcE4; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 16:33:56 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2016 16:33:55 +0200 In-Reply-To: <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> (npostavs's message of "Sat, 02 Jul 2016 19:16:56 -0400") Message-ID: <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:RSKrUFK3lfCdBcEnSGgk+qOjm3EEPsaJeOvVLv3I4SPH6LHG4jU W154FcOUiIHm+3a7JKva0ivjH4d1r+XSJtAf97sro/ed9BW5rvVoyJIjBHNdUwssPxwen/N Tv+B0/dS7wEVI+qvqyxiKoKE2Eo90p2lhHYSwoOdI/KwLEOZ2SL9C07k1f04LRDv6QaCtPs CALchDBa98DMBYBVmsoLA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:56cTCJD8n+0=:YqL0wFPBaOu4UMGd7LX8LH WKe8EAn7AjDduulAEcdhJaUtPlDFUc7EHnAlZgeFLR2i8wUyvh5icrlWCAISOliB4KXh6mLUQ KZdm0IpgBL/BITxTE85p6cc+EUX7BccdpuJQRxF1p653bHiqDHZVkzewZqEFCUxFRTSlwP2YV hHrmGZjx7mwRDWQsjkwLddilXeyTOSzM3lN2j/FGak+dMnISzYiozYMcGjuC4JqstktPSo5sm IQtPkWcsFOUU8DAfZcAUPEdcs6N4UxFWu2nmbeq+AaCoRkD1L5zbc0QOjRMVFs5ArhNBtmpIJ jLi9BgNp+kxD9Eg2WI2YljCASg1m6+iuHh2kLZ9ThNR+7L3auUAnBADPSjKAo49tTTfIZ4S7K eZHMDQQY6L81VDhNnW2O63bezzeJUmadOkGzaeC062PJCWtX16w3fd5Zf1Vx72MHx37zyBEuu TnE1/52OiLrJITmPDTabycikrrRzK2LIa949Kw4RmrHG+nNFqMkImpDdwxuKnq9/J2uXQZ3iT dnZKihzXiXoa94g0SoBLlC5dZyU8UPhBWsUzqGJqMYcWdwuKxQ3S63jkV5jVT9hUKYqSAIZF1 kpg9F4kG97CKp19CMkmUhnEqBgFvyX4ky9MsbhibgpyoLsFLs0HwHfAESKDkyRw9ESlTcci5d cgvnOXez1mz2fkEPGnMkv6LBOmmXAPgLrYMu5pBQZOQ/pNXKaY/GYFUui/g4sIShXaQQ2X5fP 5u4yyZEIEZZ2/cBezmtdDiZhiCZMF+D9uAo4+UulWwQSZU/z4O9m7g5Zn5FbVKvsZxepbmmUz 6nKV8VL X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Sat, 02 Jul 2016 19:16:56 -0400 npostavs@users.sourceforge.net wrote: > severity 23478 minor > tags 23478 patch > quit > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > >>> From: Stephen Berman >>> Do you really think this should be conditioned by a user option? >> >> I do, but let's hear from others. Anyone? > > This behaviour seems much preferable to me, since otherwise it's not > clear which text gets selected. I'm not in favour of adding an option, > but if there must be one, at least let this new behaviour be the > default. I agree on both points (prefer no option, but if so default to new). > Regarding the code, I notice that using (sit-for 0) works as well. Thanks. Indeed, even a negative number works. But zero does seem the least arbitrary. > A comment to explain what the calls are for would be nice. I'll do that when the final version is settled on. Eli, John, what's the decision on making this behavior customizable (and if yes, what default)? Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 03 11:38:54 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Jul 2016 15:38:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36079 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJjTx-0005vS-Tw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 11:38:54 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:40390) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJjTw-0005vG-AR for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 11:38:52 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bJjTo-0001lT-1m for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 11:38:47 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:36663) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bJjTn-0001lN-UM; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 11:38:43 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:4718 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bJjTm-0000c4-O1; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 11:38:43 -0400 Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2016 18:38:39 +0300 Message-Id: <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Sun, 03 Jul 2016 16:33:55 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2016 16:33:55 +0200 > > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > >>> From: Stephen Berman > >>> Do you really think this should be conditioned by a user option? > >> > >> I do, but let's hear from others. Anyone? > > > > This behaviour seems much preferable to me, since otherwise it's not > > clear which text gets selected. I'm not in favour of adding an option, > > but if there must be one, at least let this new behaviour be the > > default. > > I agree on both points (prefer no option, but if so default to new). > > > Regarding the code, I notice that using (sit-for 0) works as well. > > Thanks. Indeed, even a negative number works. But zero does seem the > least arbitrary. > > > A comment to explain what the calls are for would be nice. > > I'll do that when the final version is settled on. Eli, John, what's > the decision on making this behavior customizable (and if yes, what > default)? I think backward-incompatible behavior should almost always be opt-in, unless we have no choice. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 03 18:25:12 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Jul 2016 22:25:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36298 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJppA-00084K-MF for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 18:25:12 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:59999) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJpp8-000847-Tu for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 18:25:11 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.64.176]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Mcmmn-1b21zB0sYj-00Hxtj; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 00:24:52 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 00:24:51 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 03 Jul 2016 18:38:39 +0300") Message-ID: <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:sqpP7k58XfzmIPnHXnjQhJeUofLTf6syoptFMAczCafGIkgJnRE OYKYlWLlctG8GAS/aFkFUvLJvaCeh1+ngDc1bBRiqzQMxViptwLTm8sdik8oGFf0+9K/h6E 2y9NRKPrG675K8gDO0VID3e0+BzbfjyAt4aOW5301Gg3nC1LXi1MZB49IN1s9JdbrFytjGB jmlB291AGZiBqySoAUCiA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:SugWPyj8LpI=:/tptsqSMn7YeYljMSLn43O 0FXHkxvJhUwGUj8cEH4STgiS9MWhaS6wJ4lLa98/6uBKBAv3n006UJwrFwFxmoxHRuyuy+JD7 XvvODenNtUw27JsuTTblK2bQ/YpMjtzGfnKPBcI8p+Mtx3uH8crYe7+8772xJeZAWpXCOn4Ij EaVsjamHbLZITOgUPw7qNH7Df4MtYWp+MCfEBPNSbjG25dluhlyTJIRKS9jJ4gqC9EwjDJXnQ e7PCyFpU3VK+RKPKQ47i/ORA0ejx89Bg9uD+zLbN8o8jA3urmzOmal40azBUacgLh3k/Si2Wg YDNF8xTAglKMiz20tUzP803TR1A3oJA6r27EHlD5o5mtTFOfayM2nJqdmY8hGizE2slK9x06/ SSZmCM+G/FSzLo2pvMabgg4BqVgL0TAtoSvgrKpspxS50Nm5bY4jz/lY1VwqI2m8hQsAaeqmi 1VmLfo3QeHLfo4pWbH0iv0ZTzv4ZEEBwFFyYExUleWB26wtuoFDAt+8Q/otsr0FwH8rWiMvA0 fWtX9tn6z2GMuA9+BnAXSX0qwFDBLj+WYNXhm8S4GtKZH+4yGOwQAvhLwlv3QYgJaUEPGnV6V 9xhoutpKYOCN5d+vhzngsyeK2tUU4uFcyNUirvtrxMP1Tq4HD3fgnZsir4aLr1zmcfwn3m2po KDjlbg7cuCjcnnCikhMnxJi5aqoh8HgEZxaPft1v6+oiCmCf5pqRdvM7TId9QCriS0W1vqSni XhS/e6Ace1+bP9BY01LrMGlItL4mO/liMzFTYoUat/MlxuTL6onoABOXXo/E/PdN8VJX6NOtr tueO0lD X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Sun, 03 Jul 2016 18:38:39 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2016 16:33:55 +0200 >> >> > Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > >> >>> From: Stephen Berman >> >>> Do you really think this should be conditioned by a user option? >> >> >> >> I do, but let's hear from others. Anyone? >> > >> > This behaviour seems much preferable to me, since otherwise it's not >> > clear which text gets selected. I'm not in favour of adding an option, >> > but if there must be one, at least let this new behaviour be the >> > default. >> >> I agree on both points (prefer no option, but if so default to new). >> >> > Regarding the code, I notice that using (sit-for 0) works as well. >> >> Thanks. Indeed, even a negative number works. But zero does seem the >> least arbitrary. >> >> > A comment to explain what the calls are for would be nice. >> >> I'll do that when the final version is settled on. Eli, John, what's >> the decision on making this behavior customizable (and if yes, what >> default)? > > I think backward-incompatible behavior should almost always be opt-in, > unless we have no choice. Opting in does, however, have the problem of discoverability (a NEWS entry notwithstanding). I think opting in is best in cases where it's likely that some people may prefer (or some code may depend on) the existing behavior, or where the new behavior may bring a disadvantage in some case. But I don't think any of that is likely in this case (indeed, I really think the existing behavior is a misfeature). Your concern about the interaction with scroll-conservatively applied to my initial patch, but you yourself suggested a better alternative that allays this concern. Given that, I ask again, and not rhetorically, do you see a strong downside to having the new behavior be the default? Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 03 22:39:20 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jul 2016 02:39:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36367 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJtn6-00008T-0d for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 22:39:20 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:55954) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJtn5-000086-94 for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 22:39:19 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bJtmw-0004Wq-Vc for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 22:39:14 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:45507) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bJtmw-0004Wg-SY; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 22:39:10 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1308 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bJtmu-0003YY-VS; Sun, 03 Jul 2016 22:39:09 -0400 Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 05:38:51 +0300 Message-Id: <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Mon, 04 Jul 2016 00:24:51 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 00:24:51 +0200 > > > I think backward-incompatible behavior should almost always be opt-in, > > unless we have no choice. > > Opting in does, however, have the problem of discoverability (a NEWS > entry notwithstanding). Since this is age-old behavior that no one complained about until now, we can assume most users won't need it. > I think opting in is best in cases where it's > likely that some people may prefer (or some code may depend on) the > existing behavior, or where the new behavior may bring a disadvantage in > some case. But I don't think any of that is likely in this case > (indeed, I really think the existing behavior is a misfeature). Your > concern about the interaction with scroll-conservatively applied to my > initial patch, but you yourself suggested a better alternative that > allays this concern. Given that, I ask again, and not rhetorically, do > you see a strong downside to having the new behavior be the default? Let's make one step back and describe the exact change in behavior with the last patch, OK? Maybe some of us (e.g., me) don't really understand what is the change. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 04 04:46:09 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jul 2016 08:46:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36547 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJzW5-0006i0-4V for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 04:46:09 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.22]:58195) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bJzW3-0006hW-GK for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 04:46:07 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.65.175]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx101) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Lat5o-1biIlP2mWu-00kPUf; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:45:47 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:45:43 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Mon, 04 Jul 2016 05:38:51 +0300") Message-ID: <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:KLdf/DjFfpFdkPBuZtgXrovCrnpV398HKNfzD3hhE5AC7qX6P51 yD50dLQoxgowNDpY+otEuXp0sdeZ0LGuMzyvK7tJqSMr8BIgf6BeQ+5dSbIZcwxU05J2PDn pR4805qsCn6IAufxA1fL7VcfH3iiNLd2Xh4CrEg+InQiU/AYA5J7YpAARhbbnjhdyl/KsrN RPtcanEfcG8UyYkL7AyGA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:oJiLzvxsa00=:c6x77yVWB9zkw3nLUQsWIP 2vy+Hba3QRkFArABifUgrGnV6j/U4WCV265q3d+GkzVuK1Y/pQofDZul9AJu8zYFA60ooz62T S+Xag9ZaRUObSt/KzemFchQgCkTkyhdYqxbfuydBN0vw3o+gDBem3WCbzYouQcZPmbkItXlkw MAtrkksQUFE/9Xel/0FMjKkX2LFmnU8M5JqjAbJ8pPyeQb7eJPXA/R6NhKOtvh0THb+CY58WR UsKRI7UGZnNzB1uSKzAsD8zAm+nlWPUZix82SQxGYTdv2v+nkHzpalGa+3vCDCmBZeIxVcriQ /SlwoXihJwuwgwAV/Dy0YQo7868nBLub3KJ2udfA9nD2MaPRIm+P0nmheLmNIpAlAGZh8mtfH 5wdmOGdp+OHrATZ8c4Jwnh6owrMlRI2gazV3u22Y25BzOatfvHcplHzjujsQxVxbZMhdi3N6e mKsTg1ipYzIxRHfB9df2BILQRsFgAZ+zgFGjIhV9omjt+romwuiSPaHGuaIMDjs771qK2AdrT rrs8ynMHMbXqWfyxXobRJu2kUuwC/u0UqiUuUuCfZhIb8o9Y+wSTeYG5S8mRIfO73jjX4BMvU ENPhOcMmAvF3imDzKR4MXLV8qmE+B1Kl2p/tdgMEWslWH4hXhhMhc745pdLVO4TVpckvxUzEc 8z5toF2S/f5myplgZ7+9Edf9dmZDDGBlpAEmuakWvAMvJfqFRIGCQM4w8fqgD+I5cnQllDeja ggdfCbEFjuCH1EV7LAiSCHsJ8pMUZz1FPfNYibrr8o9onT8XsqLEfvlUDvHBx5mrIM0kBQC+y Yf8rTYW X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Mon, 04 Jul 2016 05:38:51 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 00:24:51 +0200 >> >> > I think backward-incompatible behavior should almost always be opt-in, >> > unless we have no choice. >> >> Opting in does, however, have the problem of discoverability (a NEWS >> entry notwithstanding). > > Since this is age-old behavior that no one complained about until now, > we can assume most users won't need it. If by "it" you mean the new behavior, then I agree nobody needs it, in the sense that it doesn't provide any functionality you can't get another way (e.g. by selecting a region by means of key combinations by dragging the mouse instead of by double-clicking). Nevertheless, I've always been slightly annoyed when I've encountered the issue, just never enough to try and do anything about it till now. >> I think opting in is best in cases where it's >> likely that some people may prefer (or some code may depend on) the >> existing behavior, or where the new behavior may bring a disadvantage in >> some case. But I don't think any of that is likely in this case >> (indeed, I really think the existing behavior is a misfeature). Your >> concern about the interaction with scroll-conservatively applied to my >> initial patch, but you yourself suggested a better alternative that >> allays this concern. Given that, I ask again, and not rhetorically, do >> you see a strong downside to having the new behavior be the default? > > Let's make one step back and describe the exact change in behavior > with the last patch, OK? Maybe some of us (e.g., me) don't really > understand what is the change. It simply makes selecting a region by double-clicking with the mouse more uniform; as I wrote in my OP, the current behavior is this: When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end of the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible (unless it's larger than half the window's height). But when you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of the region is above the first visible line of the window, Emacs does not recenter the display, so the entire selected region is not visible. With the patch the behavior is now simply this: When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1, Emacs recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible (unless it's larger than half the window's height). To me (and I think Noam agrees), this is the behavior I would expect, while the current behavior is less user-friendly; I can't think of a reason why anyone would dislike the new behavior or prefer the current behavior, but maybe someone can provide a use case. Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 04 10:57:51 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jul 2016 14:57:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37228 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5Jm-0000Oa-P6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:57:50 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:41915) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5Jl-0000ON-BR for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:57:50 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5Jc-0005x8-17 for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:57:44 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:56510) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5Jb-0005x1-Th; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:57:39 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1932 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5Ja-0002D4-0k; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:57:38 -0400 Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 17:57:18 +0300 Message-Id: <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:45:43 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:45:43 +0200 > > > Let's make one step back and describe the exact change in behavior > > with the last patch, OK? Maybe some of us (e.g., me) don't really > > understand what is the change. > > It simply makes selecting a region by double-clicking with the mouse > more uniform; as I wrote in my OP, the current behavior is this: > > When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end > of the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs > recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible > (unless it's larger than half the window's height). But when you > select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of > the region is above the first visible line of the window, Emacs does > not recenter the display, so the entire selected region is not > visible. > > With the patch the behavior is now simply this: > > When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1, Emacs > recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible > (unless it's larger than half the window's height). > > To me (and I think Noam agrees), this is the behavior I would expect, > while the current behavior is less user-friendly; I can't think of a > reason why anyone would dislike the new behavior or prefer the current > behavior, but maybe someone can provide a use case. Thanks, I wanted to be sure I understand the change correctly. This is indeed a change in behavior: the display recentering in the second situation might be undesirable, since some text that was previously visible might become invisible. And what will happen if the region is larger than the window can show? In the first situation, the mouse click actually moves point, so the scrolling that may follow is expected. Not so in the second case. So I still think we should default to the old behavior. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 04 11:30:07 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jul 2016 15:30:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37249 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5p1-00019e-He for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 11:30:07 -0400 Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:28859) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK5oz-00017t-KC for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 11:30:06 -0400 Received: from userv0022.oracle.com (userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id u64FTwm2018542 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 4 Jul 2016 15:29:58 GMT Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by userv0022.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u64FTvIj030535 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 4 Jul 2016 15:29:57 GMT Received: from abhmp0014.oracle.com (abhmp0014.oracle.com [141.146.116.20]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u64FTtUO027636; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 15:29:56 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <3c435aac-aab0-46b6-97a7-4a90badfafea@default> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2016 15:29:54 +0000 (UTC) From: Drew Adams To: Stephen Berman , Eli Zaretskii Subject: RE: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> In-Reply-To: <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6744.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74] X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.6 (---) > If by "it" you mean the new behavior, then I agree nobody needs it, in > the sense that it doesn't provide any functionality you can't get > another way (e.g. by selecting a region by means of key combinations by > dragging the mouse instead of by double-clicking). Nevertheless, I've > always been slightly annoyed when I've encountered the issue, just never > enough to try and do anything about it till now. >=20 > >> I think opting in is best in cases where it's > >> likely that some people may prefer (or some code may depend on) the > >> existing behavior, or where the new behavior may bring a disadvantage = in > >> some case. But I don't think any of that is likely in this case > >> (indeed, I really think the existing behavior is a misfeature). Your > >> concern about the interaction with scroll-conservatively applied to my > >> initial patch, but you yourself suggested a better alternative that > >> allays this concern. Given that, I ask again, and not rhetorically, d= o > >> you see a strong downside to having the new behavior be the default? > > > > Let's make one step back and describe the exact change in behavior > > with the last patch, OK? Maybe some of us (e.g., me) don't really > > understand what is the change. >=20 > It simply makes selecting a region by double-clicking with the mouse > more uniform; as I wrote in my OP, the current behavior is this: >=20 > When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end > of the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs > recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible > (unless it's larger than half the window's height). But when you > select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of > the region is above the first visible line of the window, Emacs does > not recenter the display, so the entire selected region is not > visible. >=20 > With the patch the behavior is now simply this: >=20 > When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1, Emacs > recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible > (unless it's larger than half the window's height). >=20 > To me (and I think Noam agrees), this is the behavior I would expect, > while the current behavior is less user-friendly; I can't think of a > reason why anyone would dislike the new behavior or prefer the current > behavior, but maybe someone can provide a use case. I haven't really been following this thread. Now that I've read the summary description of the problem (I have not tried the fix), here are my two cents, FWIW. 1. I agree with Eli about new features generally being opt-in, not opt-out. Actually, he spoke of "backward-incompatible behavior", and I agree with that "almost always" approach too: "I think backward-incompatible behavior should almost always be opt-in, unless we have no choice." 2. I see plenty of _bug fixes_ that have backward-incompatible behavior, and that are neither opt-in nor "have no choice". No, I'm not going to look for a list of them. But this is definitely my recollection and impression. (And it is usually not a problem - I am not complaining that it is here.) 3. In this particular case, I agree with Stephen. I really don't see why someone would complain about this fix. And if someone does then it should be easy enough to discuss and DTRT at that point. 4. Also in this case, as Eli said, this is not a big deal either way. But I see (so far) no reason for keeping both behaviors and providing a user choice here. If the non-recentering behavior were the case for both directions then I can imagine that someone might argue for a choice (recenter or not). But I don't think that will happen here. In sum, FWIW my vote would be to fix this unconditionally, and not bother with a user option for this. (This should apply only to the case where the entire region _can_ be shown in the window, of course. If it cannot (too big), then there is little reason to recenter.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 04 12:56:29 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jul 2016 16:56:29 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37343 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK7Aa-0005Xx-QE for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 12:56:29 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:57321) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK7AY-0005Xk-N7 for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 12:56:27 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.65.175]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Lymoh-1bPHk101Sh-016AGf; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:06 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:03 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Mon, 04 Jul 2016 17:57:18 +0300") Message-ID: <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:FDWNLcH78dwzYs5Dnyq+yyOyEpIBJ41OE/KyUV88XrjvDYVXVEH 5ROxvgtvtARhdkvdX2H3U+Sz18MQFp+Sf3ReqfV0zc1IpKlfyA22s9OfqLag2NcASfueyVY heRoOsycRGEAwvd7MjCJjHiSFrOHcKDubH5fLA2PSpBbyZBCpk9ftg5la4IlgbmZUahcSHT ATPBTBc5dlr5yKCd92nBg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:ukaG8Qn3I1g=:eD3BWGmSFSr12UrB4t/SNw cO84dZJWNQo7LjF8577NaoB7x06huog3ue82ifhfzIojNpzxDzK+qNagYNxvdSPurLZQ5bYUi XF8i76/rMV7JTEgyWxlb2GWsfTKWIkLWHbnPa2qQnBv74DsFGbPHD43F8zzXLj5H4+HB2nQYK Ngrqdt77Pn0YC9dEcSsghaJiyvGrUqqB58Pot7Q9DJlK2nuXjRMTdKY0j6xB+QjEKaSfvtIZW wtXoVzCj3ydyia13r+AV0Neade6P+FcGngLNvbRfilOCo3l8KjXJTlkqGKAZFaRXGaREsQn+h 7EXUyfK5fEqQioKt7vT1FCNHsMxl4MS3nF9q+DY+cr2uBjV8TQFUYZsrweDkQN04L+OHXuUak Rr/jrMLzpVnfGztdTBVQ9vdD2r2qCZlkHReo8xx1DVjHdEV0dPbJPWImyyjjwR//dNR4zpWWk Z7MMf9TBIKuTRtzazxuSaJKsD0MW2hqbbDVxrO+etCVlGrd+BXwoP3De0NokIzhg8BF+WbfPG kodZMx9RmipA3lvpXNkZfXm1aFrrRxUOhVLHJowo9yL84Lgy3LNwGRaxEBfAQvMdKcwbtYp2w Rrrwu990cBeNHBlRSsW/sO+jLly5QJhkvottTWN2/93Dn2ddFgDzsvM2ArtZlJ5U4+hOcYxjL zOnbTZlAJ80PR8DPXL7vGZcCgaHI9XoRXkEDVPSiZAE/3xr7QuLoGZIkVIseTWJBR0dDes/Dy 0ayLEPFHq5uJNiqlvj2812mJcVeucxOs/N4BoRQ6lmR/DSgDZnsJ6fYCuEjI6C6dCgbPoM5UE qrx1+c+ X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Mon, 04 Jul 2016 17:57:18 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 10:45:43 +0200 >> >> > Let's make one step back and describe the exact change in behavior >> > with the last patch, OK? Maybe some of us (e.g., me) don't really >> > understand what is the change. >> >> It simply makes selecting a region by double-clicking with the mouse >> more uniform; as I wrote in my OP, the current behavior is this: >> >> When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the end >> of the region is below the last visible line of the window, Emacs >> recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible >> (unless it's larger than half the window's height). But when you >> select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1 and the beginning of >> the region is above the first visible line of the window, Emacs does >> not recenter the display, so the entire selected region is not >> visible. >> >> With the patch the behavior is now simply this: >> >> When you select a region by double-clicking with mouse-1, Emacs >> recenters the display, making the entire selected region visible >> (unless it's larger than half the window's height). >> >> To me (and I think Noam agrees), this is the behavior I would expect, >> while the current behavior is less user-friendly; I can't think of a >> reason why anyone would dislike the new behavior or prefer the current >> behavior, but maybe someone can provide a use case. > > Thanks, I wanted to be sure I understand the change correctly. > > This is indeed a change in behavior: the display recentering in the > second situation might be undesirable, since some text that was > previously visible might become invisible. But (more of) the text that is selected by mouse-click becomes visible; surely that's more desirable, don't you think? And again, that makes the second situation more like in the first situation, which also seems desirable. > And what will happen if > the region is larger than the window can show? Part of the region simply won't be displayed in the window, which is nothing new: the same thing that currently happens in the first situation. > In the first situation, the mouse click actually moves point, so the > scrolling that may follow is expected. Not so in the second case. Actually, it's easy to get this in the second situation: just call exchange-point-and-mark once: diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el index 8d72753..39adc42 100644 --- a/lisp/mouse.el +++ b/lisp/mouse.el @@ -548,7 +548,11 @@ mouse-set-point (interactive "e\np") (mouse-minibuffer-check event) (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) - (mouse-set-region event) + (progn + (mouse-set-region event) + (when (> (window-start) (region-beginning)) + (exchange-point-and-mark) + (sit-for 0))) ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) This makes the bevavior even more like the first situation (i.e., the mirror image of it). So I like this solution even better. What do you think? > So I still think we should default to the old behavior. Even with the above adjustment? Although three of the four opinions that have been voiced in this thread have been in favor of just having the new behavior (though that was prior to the above adjustment), I will defer to your decision, or if you wish, ask John to settle it. And to be clear, whatever the decision on a user option and concomitant default, I would rather install the above patch, where point moves, than the version where point does not move. Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 04 14:27:23 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jul 2016 18:27:23 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37387 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK8aY-0000lb-RS for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 14:27:22 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.20]:63889) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bK8aX-0000lN-6X for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 14:27:21 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.65.175]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx101) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LdLw5-1bkdlP1J5d-00iUbt; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 20:27:02 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 20:26:59 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> (Stephen Berman's message of "Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:03 +0200") Message-ID: <877fd16yz0.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:PoQEF4CR2XlJTnfCrJcRZwbTCZQmxnVQnxZrsFwQVQYqKotoSr8 x9rv/jncC2RryaJoXr5uKINlRfn/0gAmdToAAV5yzKV5P/ywI/2lTEOtDRETfj11bYx4xnH oQLxj+Ecupt98D+SXfCsIJB93Ohz06GqDTv3C8c83o7GEKjWsIbOrObOkTMnYmOGMkCVi1n eS+wRymM7AmM2oDFIPUVg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:aU5Drsx4QhA=:SXxnlE8z7k2lZS1YAogC/D YXYwXypVEQdEDggvwip8LUmY7yMCA3zGdiCKc48d8FQZwBPKkC/wj8Lt3tVesR2VpPW0rzkKk 8v8TiLa+KpwYalZZc0HZFKqh+zMgQZZAhPUc8JgxOCrI0QssPSUBOs+5DkALcf3Lqrw967Cq+ BLeaHOs8AVE/3gAnJChmvhfM91TdCexL+OXWG/fZgqz2CPIV4fn0zNLYZ+gXgx9QrsMgPdpw/ ai/xJ4swREplpsuyznZAupphe4vvVJlD+r8rWZz8SqKvOzp5khBVn7kvqUXe31NNqdnLUO7nQ qnCL7+/yG5itfyBP4sG3H/T15o/ENKpFhsnl1Y9y7jkL2ka0cx/u03WCkCzces9/YQV3x9jh7 aoudNxLmuWXa55wlQtuGVONKo73CThdKm4bHRVHg49f3XQfpUxX0Mpn2IJ0/DZ/rzP9fQpzV2 dxrbHhhVhW1P2PKTSWnPfW3/E/osn9CZ9sWkuySjQi2FR1FvNc4d9K3CU0VNtOgAirR0YSPqH BXkAlcOsdc3LwlJ1ZlzTQ27BbBOCLGhKV4k5OjprTy/RCYtRrRzy/OrGO0uQGQo3ru2TsWsB8 8t+pnpqXPNVHGDHaABJNt1bEpioMRKE8TDSRLLPFts7ZlQ0d2rqaKN+KtFkeylaCuw2EFCvDN oRSgXvEjfA6CaLitt1MpAWdeK0xLUXIpRBRsAZsPReP9rAt9/ptyv8CDYwWCf0xoXMwG9ym4e YVBZtVssri5iv0fQfinEIkBQ6dDv2WZkBRVKm/1IrE2E8zlCFDeP+OCHxwukYoUxR6IDQYw56 tQJ7zhS X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:03 +0200 Stephen Berman wrote: > diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el > index 8d72753..39adc42 100644 > --- a/lisp/mouse.el > +++ b/lisp/mouse.el > @@ -548,7 +548,11 @@ mouse-set-point > (interactive "e\np") > (mouse-minibuffer-check event) > (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) > - (mouse-set-region event) > + (progn > + (mouse-set-region event) > + (when (> (window-start) (region-beginning)) > + (exchange-point-and-mark) > + (sit-for 0))) > ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. > ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. > (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) > > This makes the bevavior even more like the first situation (i.e., the > mirror image of it). So I like this solution even better. What do you > think? That patch only mirrors the first situation when the region begins above the window; the following always changes point when clicking at what will be the end point of the region, so this fully mirrors the first situation, and would be the most symmetrical behavior (unless I'm overlooking something): diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el index 8d72753..608a52f 100644 --- a/lisp/mouse.el +++ b/lisp/mouse.el @@ -548,7 +548,11 @@ mouse-set-point (interactive "e\np") (mouse-minibuffer-check event) (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) - (mouse-set-region event) + (progn + (mouse-set-region event) + (when (> (posn-point (event-start event)) (region-beginning)) + (exchange-point-and-mark) + (sit-for 0))) ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 04 21:32:44 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jul 2016 01:32:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37561 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKFEC-0002d4-B7 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 21:32:44 -0400 Received: from mail-io0-f181.google.com ([209.85.223.181]:34584) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKFEA-0002cr-0K for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 21:32:42 -0400 Received: by mail-io0-f181.google.com with SMTP id g13so161806884ioj.1 for <23478@debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:32:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=2WmAufstR//VYs7+bc3xzrTIWqMvHcsdvW/1zV41M6s=; b=UQM+nmufa9Wbhe/CIuqLp2H6Yg2HFkEX5DGOXxJg9BCriNL0F3p7f3hY09KoUDiKuK +ukPqyrR8iVAklYd9vImsZjMuc2zYH0zD1JXhLGmnQa9BocCPxS6h2syWocTw60a1lJ5 QRJvxlMuXGiUC6sel7nj6pbCUq5OB85ZUve+5WXnhYG1pqTs3goMzJqdfGGhYtcqdxOL K9qHIO9GeTzmAJdwxVx8HT/v5r+6tA7TRseUToYr7Nr8uAQ7DbG0Y4bZD1S2F8FHeauY MeQLM2IEOrQ+Z3BdBBp82gJ4AgBPQDlLD9EpnzPdoHQgiR2epywoXZLBgGKRCU5oPRk6 EtjQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:date :in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=2WmAufstR//VYs7+bc3xzrTIWqMvHcsdvW/1zV41M6s=; b=C5KsjQops+tPxq3jqez/7HWPem2toljwIiZouQuSQ4r3pR3lBZNnIWUBEMVrXqVJ5U YZYSaTnT7PYb/7AqJnYYBeE6mXS9h8LthGyYDSgWnMeSvKAiWzXRMvX4VGdWh+8S/k8A VaPQoqq/TxO5iZA4tpgqJM+FRy0Lumu1w1Q1h2xWIrpwGZs/5LrUtNVybIcyeBoUfRCH xpR1bX2hgEwH6MLz1q7AghI8iTPE6U3p6jn4nr0GKm99+GL1W3eoZ6q1SbmMFeOdeGR3 apO86XiUGzTM8QMLHNsYUbHTmvX6QlCv+5UzfrfvmbrP75bmQFCQtchQFLTlVEiWw0cs NjHg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tLiVmrUSsBO/C7C3gfSFNT8ZcI8ywogm26QdESztgvpqQ+xjp1vuSwMqXXD9PjcTg== X-Received: by 10.107.8.26 with SMTP id 26mr10172728ioi.85.1467682356411; Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:32:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zony (206-188-64-44.cpe.distributel.net. [206.188.64.44]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id v129sm1147671itg.10.2016.07.04.18.32.35 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:32:35 -0700 (PDT) From: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net To: Drew Adams Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <3c435aac-aab0-46b6-97a7-4a90badfafea@default> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 21:32:43 -0400 In-Reply-To: <3c435aac-aab0-46b6-97a7-4a90badfafea@default> (Drew Adams's message of "Mon, 4 Jul 2016 15:29:54 +0000 (UTC)") Message-ID: <8737noeuo4.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Stephen Berman , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Drew Adams writes: > > 2. I see plenty of _bug fixes_ that have backward-incompatible > behavior, and that are neither opt-in nor "have no choice". > No, I'm not going to look for a list of them. But this is > definitely my recollection and impression. (And it is usually > not a problem - I am not complaining that it is here.) The line bug fixes and new features can be fuzzy at times. In this case, the current behaviour just feels like a (albeit very minor) bug to me. So it would be nice if users didn't have to opt-in to get non-buggy behaviour. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jul 05 13:24:12 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jul 2016 17:24:12 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38537 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKU4y-0008An-Es for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:24:12 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:49504) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKU4x-0008Ab-NH for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:24:11 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKU4o-0006lY-KN for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:24:06 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:48802) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKU4o-0006kf-Gr; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:24:02 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:3417 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bKU4i-0008Sm-JT; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:24:01 -0400 Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 20:23:23 +0300 Message-Id: <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:03 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:03 +0200 > > > So I still think we should default to the old behavior. > > Even with the above adjustment? Yes. For me, the important part is that the age-old behavior will change. We have no idea how many users will like it and how many won't. In particular, the new behavior that moves point where it previously didn't might annoy people who intend to type after the click. Thus, my preference is to make this an opt-in change. Perhaps with time, if we hear many users asking this to be the default, we will reverse the default value. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 06 12:41:17 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Jul 2016 16:41:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39812 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKpsy-00072t-NC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 12:41:17 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.20]:53786) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKpsw-00072g-SQ for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 12:41:15 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.89.122]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx103) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LiTrM-1bqsJO13Ii-00chQB; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 18:40:54 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2016 18:40:53 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 05 Jul 2016 20:23:23 +0300") Message-ID: <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:9RfZxyApevxVeuQXUMwE0GVdcTvTkNXr0F6LcVfK7HRtuABCI9w yLspLNhDLBjvUV5SX5Ox07kfm5sC9ROVkJRMOrfRHiO6JT7l8fjYKVUZKnRqVp5zuF6dyQ/ dEQRVLZRmThnn3kABBOXqGKkBRIgTRkQqba6ATFeFo504t+JzkZWItb4TlJRGIw/bRW0HC3 WJA0zfMgW4Pv/YePbcIKg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:KlodS1JBlVg=:n185Mvmoq3Kbh7yZ6MGqXN m4MfMGel3iaDN8iOaQkfXazG1JEOvMaPqSy7BV8Z14KVGqB+aqkfwOPIxil9gJpYSWpwO+TaY 45ZSE5S0zbpDdM69AhrnFWampjTyvlHoVLZKrSi3Dw70fovMsOCdX3RKgctys6ZNEZXCI6N/f Wnxfyuymx2hbTSknTYjJmDDM3tMQ6OGXg39kmZv4DMW3BuvpyUJxSjGmHg3w8nBLNe7EcwIoV /3BS5GbV/cA7bLP6Jb4kOvXzDdmluUSqu61DZAFVoaH768N/TYiSlxg1HwZBg3DoH4NXrUhzF TJ68SAoNAim6O9CVxFhu1QZkYTYrGNtHJEP06zQsfsWOQb5CsiyVbErG8uRXRMznQyXcYTR3x 4DJ8N3nsSgWg4ILZiVoPfGkZbqOL8fvrOw6Y0NjvV4z27LtSSWeohnepFE1zlRCEfkdWo3OND c4oz0tKsdZ3Nq721TyNcD/eCLCcjTjVDQaEKCJbjnvSZGFP7NVjR+pK4nbZu7JVzWsEssM6RF ABVT1Cg7h6TxJ2A1o2H+5p8d4qkpPHN+CjS0tY8bpZKIEL2jNeoy4oygYgBH4TCcLRXTLjI9z TkaUYdEZ64ELK808wM0yJGibmRccAqNuIr7zo92WENlhg5nY+CGYG+KOUfarmwyAe1uoYAv0/ xnxy3D8i1IWRqlgm8Ppz1pKu76jb4uZ98bPDDScBU2f8ywt4bp5b0mTeXmdzLvABxDEdP2otl cZl64C/exWZZ/oPmcrGNrn3h4j4cpjVYdtlLlM71Fov4s1aOWrZ/KhE5ncHMoSVks3tXQiZIn EWaJN3U X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Tue, 05 Jul 2016 20:23:23 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:56:03 +0200 >> >> > So I still think we should default to the old behavior. >> >> Even with the above adjustment? > > Yes. For me, the important part is that the age-old behavior will > change. We have no idea how many users will like it and how many > won't. In particular, the new behavior that moves point where it > previously didn't might annoy people who intend to type after the > click. Thus, my preference is to make this an opt-in change. Perhaps > with time, if we hear many users asking this to be the default, we > will reverse the default value. I want to be clear about exactly what the new behavior should be. Since the patch referred to by "the above adjustment" was faulty and I followed it with an improvement, I assume "the new behavior that moves point" refers to the latter patch. So the user option would specify the behavior when selecting a region which extends backward from point, providing a choice between (i) the current behavior (as default), which leaves point at the position of the click and does not scroll backward if the region extends above window-start; and (ii) the new behavior, which moves point to region-beginning, scrolling if the region extends above window-start (the new behavior is thus the mirror image of the current behavior when selecting a region which extends forward from point). Here is a patch implementing this: diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el index 8d72753..2f9ff6b 100644 --- a/lisp/mouse.el +++ b/lisp/mouse.el @@ -540,15 +540,31 @@ mouse-drag-vertical-line (interactive "e") (mouse-drag-line start-event 'vertical)) +(defcustom mouse-select-region-backward nil + "Effect of selecting a region extending backward from double click. + +Nil means keep point at the position clicked (region end) and +don't scroll backward when the region extends above the top of +the window; non-nil means move point to region beginning, +scrolling when the region extends above the top of the window." + :version "26.1" + :type '(choice (const :tag "Keep point and don't scroll backward" nil) + (const :tag "Move point and scroll if needed" t))) + (defun mouse-set-point (event &optional promote-to-region) "Move point to the position clicked on with the mouse. This should be bound to a mouse click event type. -If PROMOTE-TO-REGION is non-nil and event is a multiple-click, -select the corresponding element around point." +If PROMOTE-TO-REGION is non-nil and event is a multiple-click, select +the corresponding element around point, with the resulting position of +point determined by `mouse-select-region-backward'." (interactive "e\np") (mouse-minibuffer-check event) (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) - (mouse-set-region event) + (progn + (mouse-set-region event) + (when mouse-select-region-backward + (when (> (posn-point (event-start event)) (region-beginning)) + (exchange-point-and-mark)))) ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) But note that, prior to the patch in my previous post, what was under discussion as the new behavior was different: namely, scrolling if the region extends above window-start but leaving point at the position of the click. This is a sort of compromise between the current behavior and that in (ii), and it could be a third choice for the user option. Here is a patch for this alternative: diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el index 8d72753..19b4804 100644 --- a/lisp/mouse.el +++ b/lisp/mouse.el @@ -540,15 +540,37 @@ mouse-drag-vertical-line (interactive "e") (mouse-drag-line start-event 'vertical)) +(defcustom mouse-select-region-backward nil + "Effect of selecting a region extending backward from double click. + +Nil means keep point at the position clicked (region end) and +don't scroll backward when the region extends above the top of +the window; `keep' means keep point at region end but scroll when +the region extends above the top of the window; `move' means move +point to region beginning, scrolling when the region extends +above the top of the window." + :version "26.1" + :type '(choice (const :tag "Keep point and don't scroll backward" nil) + (const :tag "Keep point and scroll if needed" keep) + (const :tag "Move point and scroll if needed" move))) + (defun mouse-set-point (event &optional promote-to-region) "Move point to the position clicked on with the mouse. This should be bound to a mouse click event type. -If PROMOTE-TO-REGION is non-nil and event is a multiple-click, -select the corresponding element around point." +If PROMOTE-TO-REGION is non-nil and event is a multiple-click, select +the corresponding element around point, with the resulting position of +point determined by `mouse-select-region-backward'." (interactive "e\np") (mouse-minibuffer-check event) (if (and promote-to-region (> (event-click-count event) 1)) - (mouse-set-region event) + (progn + (mouse-set-region event) + (when mouse-select-region-backward + (when (> (posn-point (event-start event)) (region-beginning)) + (exchange-point-and-mark))) + (when (eq mouse-select-region-backward 'keep) + (sit-for 0) + (exchange-point-and-mark))) ;; Use event-end in case called from mouse-drag-region. ;; If EVENT is a click, event-end and event-start give same value. (posn-set-point (event-end event)))) A problem with the `keep' choice is that, when the region is too big for the window, there is a somewhat jarring flicker due to exchanging point and mark twice and redisplayin in between, and perhaps even worse, when scroll-conservatively is 0, the region shown in the window can be smaller than the text shown before selecting, due to recentering. But for smaller regions, the `keep' choice could be a useful option. Do you have a preference between these two alternatives? (Perhaps Noam and Drew wish to chime in here, since they in effect commented only on the `keep' choice, not the `move' choice.) Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 06 14:45:13 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Jul 2016 18:45:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39895 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKrov-0001Yr-1D for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 14:45:13 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:45581) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKrot-0001Yd-2l for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 14:45:11 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKroi-0008IA-SI for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 14:45:05 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:38822) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKroi-0008I3-P1; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 14:45:00 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:4735 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bKrog-0002rh-Sc; Wed, 06 Jul 2016 14:44:59 -0400 Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2016 21:44:44 +0300 Message-Id: <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Wed, 06 Jul 2016 18:40:53 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2016 18:40:53 +0200 > > I want to be clear about exactly what the new behavior should be. Since > the patch referred to by "the above adjustment" was faulty and I > followed it with an improvement, I assume "the new behavior that moves > point" refers to the latter patch. Yes. > So the user option would specify the behavior when selecting a > region which extends backward from point, providing a choice between > (i) the current behavior (as default), which leaves point at the > position of the click and does not scroll backward if the region > extends above window-start; and (ii) the new behavior, which moves > point to region-beginning, scrolling if the region extends above > window-start (the new behavior is thus the mirror image of the > current behavior when selecting a region which extends forward from > point). Yes, that's what I had in mind. > Here is a patch implementing this: > > diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el > index 8d72753..2f9ff6b 100644 > --- a/lisp/mouse.el > +++ b/lisp/mouse.el > @@ -540,15 +540,31 @@ mouse-drag-vertical-line > (interactive "e") > (mouse-drag-line start-event 'vertical)) > > +(defcustom mouse-select-region-backward nil I'd name it mouse-select-region-scroll-backward. > But note that, prior to the patch in my previous post, what was under > discussion as the new behavior was different: namely, scrolling if the > region extends above window-start but leaving point at the position of > the click. This is a sort of compromise between the current behavior > and that in (ii), and it could be a third choice for the user option. I have no opinion about this. Please do what you feel is better. This will also need a NEWS entry, and also please see if the description of mouse-set-point in the Emacs manual needs an update. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 08:08:56 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 12:08:56 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40304 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bL86x-0002Zu-SC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 08:08:56 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:53620) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bL86w-0002Zg-2Y for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 08:08:54 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.112.189]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx002) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0M7Hao-1bWl6t1NMk-00x0PJ; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:08:33 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:08:32 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 06 Jul 2016 21:44:44 +0300") Message-ID: <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:wbK/J16GarebAZKhxi66d3RGl6bV291wRJoHXzF9Z2oMuCACdXl Z1yxRjmhVbphMG61s2Kvvc/ZAwgpu95g6DwuNErbQS8SYlDsxmlIJQWgB6tIkO+LP7HvYAZ BzJ4iDoyOmjI7600QAw4U9bec+UK33hVi5HE3jY60qsAn5yco+ilvSNk6fhj5u4NlXPiEiM YNrdTeSTP6wj+ni5k0qsw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:dkox32ODBQA=:3BBBoTTzEWQnauPBzkMhl7 5pOL0/evTiLd/xJ7KBx6fGTDl38PodHur0cUaIYOnjfQdhh8j/BgZswgqDh4X1qwePv+ds1Dz deat+YPuhV5e1Wcb3AegkJ7TYA8otHzMNDhqn/zO7lCcvXM3esvmWGl+n0tSuBujlyuFaP4LW d1Ut7wp9m1dDdJFvzcrVQXFyMD3ZDE+AkHee3gX/7OGfP7U1A8XZJwN0gF+0T+ejvh5Elmpnq 1ZOpPN+AMvgrAkuYI9/LUVMmaYsvJ3+A7kNxf0UohzyTGWj6EHKzsaXPoPYMXp1Fs4f64Fg4M +h0ovQIfuzHWrnRL3UnZ85SPfalEVOGZGpsnPyWTdEspdZiQJlQkkyOlunmIgizbCTx9mji/X /V2uJZDPIIU4QILWjpXaFjQbk3QvXrYN0Frq7FfLZh5md9kONBxoQ5veMkMSaFz/lf+7x/BTi SG7aA9Uu5Mr/+EvJKkR74cPh9SvcsiD+wct+5JjixWFnzPriyKkAgQ+MITeaOT0kEwQjcm0wO RZnJNIu784fojXAfN1wCEJ8OTYYABl+kSjOBaNp2pfyusPQtHwEvC0dAuC4B9SuNjbVwwsFKA B1WPMYkEvwwy1600+colqEWWfNUs0jHLCW61pTCLBkRSxGI6204SE7yWy63u4PooIkiojR7+n mlUSVsUlMduNMFVeQSfn4vlKkLSSvcfws6zZ46NCUmZi8vTRvuKzoHdHg1WHAr3W2hC/vFwom fYZ80omujksi4EXW0Hj7h+5kNU64EFFz+uqAr+99763TqwKLKqZUxWAUBjlx6qnlZ2CDoD5BS uR0JFiw X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Wed, 06 Jul 2016 21:44:44 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman > >> So the user option would specify the behavior when selecting a >> region which extends backward from point, providing a choice between >> (i) the current behavior (as default), which leaves point at the >> position of the click and does not scroll backward if the region >> extends above window-start; and (ii) the new behavior, which moves >> point to region-beginning, scrolling if the region extends above >> window-start (the new behavior is thus the mirror image of the >> current behavior when selecting a region which extends forward from >> point). > > Yes, that's what I had in mind. > >> Here is a patch implementing this: >> >> diff --git a/lisp/mouse.el b/lisp/mouse.el >> index 8d72753..2f9ff6b 100644 >> --- a/lisp/mouse.el >> +++ b/lisp/mouse.el >> @@ -540,15 +540,31 @@ mouse-drag-vertical-line >> (interactive "e") >> (mouse-drag-line start-event 'vertical)) >> >> +(defcustom mouse-select-region-backward nil > > I'd name it mouse-select-region-scroll-backward. Using "scroll" in the name suggests that the main purpose of this variable is to control scrolling backward, but it only controls the final position of point, and scrolling is a by-product of that which only happens if necessary. Given that, do you still prefer to have "scroll" in the name? >> But note that, prior to the patch in my previous post, what was under >> discussion as the new behavior was different: namely, scrolling if the >> region extends above window-start but leaving point at the position of >> the click. This is a sort of compromise between the current behavior >> and that in (ii), and it could be a third choice for the user option. > > I have no opinion about this. Please do what you feel is better. If nobody objects I'll go with the binary rather than the ternary option, because of the display issues with the latter that I noted, and the former is also simpler both in implementation and conceptually. > This will also need a NEWS entry, and also please see if the > description of mouse-set-point in the Emacs manual needs an update. In that node ("Mouse Commands") there is no mention of the current behavior of double clicking mouse-1, but there is a partial description in the node "Word and Line Mouse". There is also a cross-reference in "Mouse Commands" to "Word and Line Mouse" in connection with mouse-3. I think a cross-reference in connection with mouse-1 is also appropriate, and a description of the new user option should go in the latter node. What do you think of the following? diff --git a/doc/emacs/frames.texi b/doc/emacs/frames.texi index 7e60062..231989f 100644 --- a/doc/emacs/frames.texi +++ b/doc/emacs/frames.texi @@ -97,7 +97,8 @@ Mouse Commands invoked by clicking with the left mouse button, @kbd{mouse-1}, in the text area of a window. This moves point to the position where you clicked. If that window was not the selected window, it becomes the -selected window. +selected window. You can also activate a region by double-clicking +mouse-1 (@pxref{Word and Line Mouse}). @vindex x-mouse-click-focus-ignore-position Normally, if the frame you clicked in was not the selected frame, it @@ -215,7 +216,7 @@ Word and Line Mouse @table @kbd @item Double-mouse-1 -Select the text around the word which you click on. +Select the text around the word or character which you click on. Double-clicking on a character with symbol syntax (such as underscore, in C mode) selects the symbol surrounding that character. @@ -226,6 +227,17 @@ Word and Line Mouse constant (Emacs uses heuristics to figure out whether that character is the beginning or the end of it). +Double-clicking on the beginning of a parenthetical grouping or +beginning string-delimiter moves point to the end of the region, +scrolling the buffer display forward if necessary to show the new +location of point. Double-clicking on the end of a parenthetical +grouping or string-delimiter keeps point at the end of the region by +default, so the beginning of the region will not be visible if it is +above the top of the window; setting the user option +@code{mouse-select-region-scroll-backward} to non-nil changes this to +make point move to the beginning of the region, scrolling the display +backward if necessary. + @item Double-Drag-mouse-1 Select the text you drag across, in the form of whole words. One somewhat embarassing aspect of describing this option is that is makes the default asymmetrical behavior painfully obvious without providing a rationale for it (and I don't know of any). I suppose we could add "for historical reasons" after "by default".... Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 11:30:20 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 15:30:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41356 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLBFs-0007pC-AE for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 11:30:20 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:44525) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLBFq-0007p0-5N for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 11:30:18 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLBFg-0000jp-UF for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 11:30:12 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:56340) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLBFg-0000je-RA; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 11:30:08 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1854 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bLBFd-00010c-Uw; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 11:30:07 -0400 Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:29:54 +0300 Message-Id: <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:08:32 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:08:32 +0200 > > >> +(defcustom mouse-select-region-backward nil > > > > I'd name it mouse-select-region-scroll-backward. > > Using "scroll" in the name suggests that the main purpose of this > variable is to control scrolling backward, but it only controls the > final position of point, and scrolling is a by-product of that which > only happens if necessary. Given that, do you still prefer to have > "scroll" in the name? I'm not great at naming symbols, so I don't insist. However, the original name seemed slightly misleading: it could be interpreted as if the selection will be made backward, which is incorrect. And since I know that the "select-region" belongs to "mouse", I'm left wondering what is "backward" about. Do you see my problem with the name? If so, perhaps you can suggest a better one. > One somewhat embarassing aspect of describing this option is that is > makes the default asymmetrical behavior painfully obvious without > providing a rationale for it (and I don't know of any). I suppose we > could add "for historical reasons" after "by default".... I don't think it's needed: since point doesn't move, no scrolling should be expected. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 12:23:05 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 16:23:05 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41401 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLC4v-0000ei-0q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:23:05 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:51766) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLC4t-0000ds-3q for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:23:03 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.112.189]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MHHdb-1b7lwW3GOx-00E45p; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:22:43 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:22:42 +0200 In-Reply-To: <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:29:54 +0300") Message-ID: <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:nn3d39nIUuXwurHqFah3plXehNL+Nue48AXFb0XL289DizA78FV zJ0iB5fxA/oZf3QZqgiDmbjJIoVw1CEPuAvJzmdQQgNg8kOYdY10Zd9Slz2ObL/aPPOqxAD 6YZSLrD2efk4BitElckYji7oocurm/7jfCLGHcjmNEJSMXySp/GTHBOOfh6jEpHKrj6IAe7 Hjilq+ezfBNS+wCHPL5dw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:uKaO+TUPLiE=:JBT8Pf3nMbFghtwq47lqHH irth4PdjTQlMQi9yiJe2lxi5qKTcDIHHr6Iul27t0t/ggB2cuaPDeDM1HdF6ubDZ6IdzTin+9 9HRiyJjWUCmSjc6h7gP3J1on1xfyZg1XI996/hU9rKEAvgTosBQCYkA/fqoAikQxzq1vYWWBd PfqEArHfNuyFWcKPHHHuQpm+6uj0B4RMsB455d2/eSKIyMRk9rQQ7y5drwPO2TyccSVNgqTCl dSGooFxrkNtcLF8BfUGRhuFgIhIDTlAiNGPLFtGhE32lb4uJkqAu2TZ1B6bGZf/P3SjXOJZUv JvVSu6zF3B6NhKwlP7KUKfCaT2M9ZGpomMxqdwI09yM1MF9ySNzcxY7uLxt0sDZ4z2cHDxaeE 1XXH0/VNquv7mVEM34FNk90nbYNNOi1J+2/NBgQOys+51El34JQkt2Z9HnujdXkB/YxqoHweq ZijRXWQ6bUQ2YB8jiuszBq2OMisL2X6cLuShJt5Ea2cMDYX0YROKmsqtal85q1Qm/HIcCMJtZ 98dlKrHpxDDwxDCDdVjWUdpM44zzG+g1KeJG7XElCWDBT1fD9f5F0Zi7uUYd9jyDN6oDf5yNl /En865otWD4B6+3G1CWaIfgHufA+uodkbW9rylpIwIgXmrbcc47/OSpcVFg96lKFJIHOvFvve iedjKtauS30S8xkdt4pmTPHAgbhAcGf+G4incRcH9eNyS6oc/fajjhcwFEJkH1tHgQ7tMyrzF rVVyM28C2hFr6bNWMJvzs/eG8mL1B67xBzqMh1+iVstLxqRP4a8OftICH1eWNCInvRMyp3W/M metPPkb X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:29:54 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:08:32 +0200 >> >> >> +(defcustom mouse-select-region-backward nil >> > >> > I'd name it mouse-select-region-scroll-backward. >> >> Using "scroll" in the name suggests that the main purpose of this >> variable is to control scrolling backward, but it only controls the >> final position of point, and scrolling is a by-product of that which >> only happens if necessary. Given that, do you still prefer to have >> "scroll" in the name? > > I'm not great at naming symbols, so I don't insist. However, the > original name seemed slightly misleading: it could be interpreted as > if the selection will be made backward, which is incorrect. And since > I know that the "select-region" belongs to "mouse", I'm left wondering > what is "backward" about. What do you understand by "selection backward"? My intention was to indicate that this variable controls selecting the region when you double-click at region-end; in this it is indeed selection backward from point, though I admit that the phrasing is not elegant. > Do you see my problem with the name? If so, perhaps you can suggest a > better one. I don't yet see your problem, because I don't know how you interpreted "selection backward". I did struggle a bit with the name, though, and am not thrilled with it. But if no one comes up with a better name and you find this one unsuitable, I can certainly live with mouse-select-region-scroll-backward. >> One somewhat embarassing aspect of describing this option is that is >> makes the default asymmetrical behavior painfully obvious without >> providing a rationale for it (and I don't know of any). I suppose we >> could add "for historical reasons" after "by default".... > > I don't think it's needed: since point doesn't move, no scrolling > should be expected. What's not needed: the phrase "for historical reasons", a rationale for the asymmetrical behavior, or any description of the user option? In other words, are you saying the doc changes in the patch are acceptable? Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 12:48:37 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 16:48:37 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41434 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCTc-0002sl-Ou for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:48:36 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:40925) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCTb-0002sY-0V for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:48:35 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCTS-0003QP-Jr for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:48:29 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:57855) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCTS-0003Q8-Gi; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:48:26 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1981 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCTQ-0008Tb-Kg; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:48:25 -0400 Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 19:48:12 +0300 Message-Id: <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:22:42 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:22:42 +0200 > > What do you understand by "selection backward"? mouse-select-region-backward can be interpreted as "mouse selects region backward". > My intention was to indicate that this variable controls selecting > the region when you double-click at region-end But "region-end" doesn't appear in the name. How about mouse-select-region-at-region-end ? > >> One somewhat embarassing aspect of describing this option is that is > >> makes the default asymmetrical behavior painfully obvious without > >> providing a rationale for it (and I don't know of any). I suppose we > >> could add "for historical reasons" after "by default".... > > > > I don't think it's needed: since point doesn't move, no scrolling > > should be expected. > > What's not needed: the phrase "for historical reasons", a rationale for > the asymmetrical behavior, or any description of the user option? In > other words, are you saying the doc changes in the patch are acceptable? The rationale is not needed, IMO. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 13:02:47 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 17:02:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41450 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLChK-0003Ek-Ou for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:02:46 -0400 Received: from mail-oi0-f44.google.com ([209.85.218.44]:33002) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLChI-0003EY-Ja for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:02:44 -0400 Received: by mail-oi0-f44.google.com with SMTP id u201so31534066oie.0 for <23478@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 10:02:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=Wi0xLFdhOv0DjKa56LQgMXQ0MBDIQwRVUAoCf8hu5tw=; b=LaXSNpCo6T+XcnrKSBkE/aUyNphfNR+Y/Gl7WP5HQIqGyrH2OShXhfJX9QDR+6a3Sk XSp755gmxpPNvaky1tPGiXP/8llPBBLzV4F7oKrmIOhWTIB6BovRAlDXMaR5srLcPHvh m0+Pe5z0XAPxJTwF87zp4z05+xIkFhcUgKwaYFzxJq8SJACSTv+/rgx0lax4TDd0Lt9z qpiaRUiP348P6NHArHX/m+2EBvAlWZz/bDzv+OGFnwCxsXK30FRHqLIWRe6Ns7iUJRLl RiS8YHF/QoR8GpmwssfzpJ6haRWr9G3HiAauXOc6f/TYkY6D90/5++MQRDzO36/e714m lx2g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Wi0xLFdhOv0DjKa56LQgMXQ0MBDIQwRVUAoCf8hu5tw=; b=Kya3nZp3pHQp+qGhkFaraqEqw0wgN/OPX3jaDtVK+bywNviWBSyw60vvqAdD+uPM/5 GUgrjdGE6lLCwWxQIlDqJu/aw9pCLCEKw6GvV6p//nSWoC/EsPFoeIP8L+snXk0uKbD0 aA3G+3rYKO0/uD9WVnq/TOxqmWPsaAN1Nl3nAJOfseaiRIGIjeIMqO7Nh5dMuYQ2L/Fq zvzD1jHFfr4trv6HmSp5K9J1vUD1zgqRL4P6qaDErdstxD0QtUtmDnvovQKeLsS3P0GF OahiatZuEJoHwkc9Qm1WbiSAKx5vgnNSTEbdzJciWLCR+yUjlBYKhZvtWc90+BQThDIg E/yw== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tI0mtq7wzB1vbhY1IgTOLMdD9syRtiDfIk9LQ3QZcHYBXAa9+G/gzB/3cBPdXKGo8k4JlgfYlpVpaQm3w== X-Received: by 10.202.85.9 with SMTP id j9mr705367oib.202.1467910959042; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 10:02:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.157.4.197 with HTTP; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 10:02:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> From: Noam Postavsky Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400 X-Google-Sender-Auth: vLj_BcCHZOqNFjlgiri_dpMsN2k Message-ID: Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry To: Eli Zaretskii Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: Stephen Berman , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 12:48 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:22:42 +0200 >> >> What do you understand by "selection backward"? > > mouse-select-region-backward can be interpreted as "mouse selects > region backward". > >> My intention was to indicate that this variable controls selecting >> the region when you double-click at region-end > > But "region-end" doesn't appear in the name. > > How about mouse-select-region-at-region-end ? IMO, it would be a bit confusing if mouse-select-region-at-region-end = t implies point gets moved to the beginning. How about mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning. I also suggest removing mention of scrolling from docstring, I don't think we need to re-explain how moving point interacts with scrolling here. (defcustom mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning nil "Effect of selecting a region extending backward from double click. Nil means keep point at the position clicked (region end); non-nil means move point to region beginning." :version "26.1" :type '(choice (const :tag "Don't move point" nil) (const :tag "Move point to beginning of region" t))) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 13:05:05 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 17:05:05 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41454 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCjZ-0003IF-Gr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:05:05 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:64626) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCjY-0003Hi-7C for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:05:04 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.112.189]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx001) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0M0h9K-1bYsUd0BF0-00uodh; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 19:04:45 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 19:04:43 +0200 In-Reply-To: <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 07 Jul 2016 19:48:12 +0300") Message-ID: <87zipt5qhg.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:wXBx4nJ4PSwxtjm7S2AIaIN7AZG7M6zYppGzyBVhat4LXCHOKUS iGHuzGDS8/dS5C2JQJH5zbHDFmIZZa8zTnpVHHPRCKDh3OCd85pBYuSQ/153lQElZBhjaDp GZpH6rRmWZMYtVh4OMskoeOOhLTStXlxlVs08W5sB8PlhqwNfSNEygEBjT0Po2r+G4l7tgW 4+5wUTCliWUihjw/mceig== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:gKUCDJer4/8=:KvVqeJ+vE77w4rYo8aq4DG JdUaFUJiZr6kpEwM9K+BnNfD2g/q98j3ydpQVmlZvuiaF91qB37gtyzbgqqxSl4C447YUl6dX y40J0aYU2fOBfTwuNq3kzVfWc/oJlGs8qaTZ09nQzmxOac5RqHXfDFBYkv3+XvECWUzQ9izkp Q5rC8FoJImM2UADalvaT2jsyj12HaWg384La9lUu+JxJI1h5ba7Hv12XceLBC26oVG7Q2BAh4 SDio0m7ZtYU0pH902e10/1D+z5LMcvOfepEdeOihkYbciyiVZDb/xqj4rQEXyoLlWGBEOzHa6 Kn2zvF1aEjAhlTc1lxkii3GZ/MBlLXgeMAOdVenit/H8/dmrQx4n04ijUkOI1nCZ/brBDAZi7 II1Ozrhk8CtFNspBXnAq7p5YGIgOoj+f84uRokNK2id8/19skrYMEAvY2orUDS9LojVc87aTn j0XyVOkyZb47kM4jZkZRmhjX6qu7s5bI/4HAmWwvvZIeoC13yJbBGIlqHf7EQH409i47W2WjL rirgcMyJZbpx/+OJGSb1wRHgXK+AO+dYGM89sMi14hIzipQsY/NgASFHxdKQ/xKBiH2CzNj51 3IISAkLlV036tTMk/QUspYPZBE1h6/CenjWotVsVYRQr2ry6hr/UPJTH5wrDhIDAjjL+LIqVP f1Y2NsyS4KRDkml+7T4BJN/OS8IyA2nomMMYZjcAtruxIJwNcFFleNGy+rG/SvOEn7fpc8M6v WoKuoZ5LRGNTZVISMPP973VRsePAGOkxOWDGQF9Wz5fcZuKXwmDJUHJ346M2Io0mK0NXXoNOs 7nSikef X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Thu, 07 Jul 2016 19:48:12 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Stephen Berman >> Cc: npostavs@users.sourceforge.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 18:22:42 +0200 >> >> What do you understand by "selection backward"? > > mouse-select-region-backward can be interpreted as "mouse selects > region backward". I still don't get it, but I'll drop it. >> My intention was to indicate that this variable controls selecting >> the region when you double-click at region-end > > But "region-end" doesn't appear in the name. > > How about mouse-select-region-at-region-end ? This sounds a bit convoluted and also not so clear to me; how about referring to the action instead of the result: mouse-double-click-at-region-end ? >> >> One somewhat embarassing aspect of describing this option is that is >> >> makes the default asymmetrical behavior painfully obvious without >> >> providing a rationale for it (and I don't know of any). I suppose we >> >> could add "for historical reasons" after "by default".... >> > >> > I don't think it's needed: since point doesn't move, no scrolling >> > should be expected. >> >> What's not needed: the phrase "for historical reasons", a rationale for >> the asymmetrical behavior, or any description of the user option? In >> other words, are you saying the doc changes in the patch are acceptable? > > The rationale is not needed, IMO. Ok. Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 13:16:53 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 17:16:53 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41471 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCuz-0003b9-9K for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:16:53 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:49728) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCuu-0003at-Vd for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:16:51 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCul-0002gx-Sk for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:16:43 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_40,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:58316) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCul-0002gn-Pa; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:16:39 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:2008 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bLCuj-0007GG-Qs; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 13:16:38 -0400 Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:16:26 +0300 Message-Id: <83oa69jrmd.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Noam Postavsky In-reply-to: (message from Noam Postavsky on Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg9cecy2.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: stephen.berman@gmx.net, 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Noam Postavsky > Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400 > Cc: Stephen Berman , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > > How about mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning. Fine with me. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 07 14:26:28 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jul 2016 18:26:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41503 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLE0K-0005Dm-LP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:26:28 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:61489) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLE0J-0005Da-2U for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 14:26:27 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.112.189]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Le5XQ-1bdn191fCu-00psTq; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:26:07 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Noam Postavsky Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <87wpn4wgev.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:26:06 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Noam Postavsky's message of "Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400") Message-ID: <87vb0h5mpt.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:vRW2Nalq5wSbX+zWWBAn0p+KpPj/SP8t5uVwSJqjaDKsRSwURv0 pQQj4eJh4hs2qIPV2YgPeHHuEv9VO2ebHt9ZemZngdvRVSjAbMtwGOhTw/EHOnM0hydu9Xi 6Y0qJTkGNiAWCVBY3C3f4smbHMZkqQhscNZsZCSDvAdptirhdJ43Thg9Gwrl1ZIyVDFu0Ua +wYulvbLRP98Xn1UOC9Pw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:azVKOatubaw=:c4L/4VyM4u2Imdu17q9ukY Y2M5D4TybEY4wwN3q4ctbnFjPPWT+sCqxuoIfAZQQ4FpbEG215tRKvX/npqa5lcIrvNSqo5sx 5CywywX2grEODWV9jWasEV6YaHzaPBetLKgFxniqS6IZPMhBwrrAooLc1qrj8/Z/MNk9xgtR+ nwDUnuKi1rbbfCHj82Hf/8QndHJPuXINsyx84wX1qX5SnF3gtRrw7FLpqO3c+2fiRTrtDdh8X kPOs0p9+FMSA1mKpRHIoPeEqdgwJ+Y2wvlCsWjSM9Fbqx5/yRcMhaxq0qLQbnywOskR+rH9ne WVAxhf6viNx8pVpL0fm7mbGrlIEgBBlHlS1BFaMkquAGpadDGIXxmN2W2IVFCq2Y2x1DL/O+4 4oMYz6mXf8GWN5VQ8n7MqmFuTo60WRqUTAQE1j0XQsAR3hahgoetxyenD0TdaDsG9jARwejoB qt0N5y/G635Cvlh0OukaoGce4OQkLas1sadMweh9jUl6G6VUO1wrFsGNEs1npaMTJZrux2VNk zDgQVU9585X2YAuNcxdwPqinBLwbP63QeY32d9fUX2T5kTmLO2sVMNiD5OsCQUBgCuRvWaHVz 9RVL99jcYKgEPUVsHLMLUoNgH39kgbKlKBnoUFpYW7O65S2Rt8g1yDEbMZAGMoAAhm3rKmBRT O2M4Epgz5VPwvMIBZ64Ag/84qZR7+sgp5wDVM97rByr2p3O704UhfmYECwPtBUoqbRm+wZ+QB eO8Btgh5tktvAypTJxveQBePAvfvMO+u02qanr96yKYunvGRcOdaQac/jmFY8Iy4GtlLDB8FU gheORA+ X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:16:26 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> From: Noam Postavsky >> Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400 >> Cc: Stephen Berman , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >> >> How about mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning. > > Fine with me. > Me too. On Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400 Noam Postavsky wrote: > I also suggest removing mention > of scrolling from docstring, I don't think we need to re-explain how > moving point interacts with scrolling here. > > (defcustom mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning nil > "Effect of selecting a region extending backward from double click. > > Nil means keep point at the position clicked (region end); > non-nil means move point to region beginning." > :version "26.1" > :type '(choice (const :tag "Don't move point" nil) > (const :tag "Move point to beginning of region" t))) > This is also more appropriate, thanks. I'll push the changes to master as soon as I get a chance (hopefully tomorrow). Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jul 08 05:58:31 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Jul 2016 09:58:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41745 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSYI-0001w2-P9 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 05:58:30 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:61227) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSYE-0001vn-Rl for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 05:58:29 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.89.198]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MBWTO-1bAywi4Bba-00AVHT; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:58:07 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Noam Postavsky Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> <87vb0h5mpt.fsf@gmx.net> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:58:05 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87vb0h5mpt.fsf@gmx.net> (Stephen Berman's message of "Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:26:06 +0200") Message-ID: <87twg0bgeq.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:JslhhuWeXfbWaOdQYFEn7fxEWKwmT2nO/1yPz0hHTp//7d7w4QZ DMjHajhahko6abRqmb3kyF1dEWjvhMhJSpPLciIzuA50Rdb72m6f034q+94wg5cFWP3ViRh oFG6u5Y6WO7tWGkpB0oMj+wFOr8/aPRIZEeer7txV2EN2+zJB2PxXzKMNG0lPxlB/M9CAFo Lvr6K7aMV0+8IrqHSFI3g== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:lZlozITOtIA=:0EXol/1L8o62BTX874fJ5g 1Yy2fdc+Ti50c/k/BLRpyjCvJdutzbuuPkfsdNXYBIMYLCtiFhWOZhF3hGrY8ngmAyFDorwfI brd6vBaY+FrXJXWTmzQ3J0qtyoFlJqFu9Zc/xP5lXrD3J21cpxY9RDZyIaQNxeZpcklbp+T2d 8AGAhQpgdlHPDPtkBPBPaYlJr0jP/bK8rpxv6DWwWjTLph65ud7M5kpTLyYLRa0VAxGn2EHzP NhbciNQR3SvD6D2/alxM5egwz9tc1OvbNwecZXexTBjzrfZoyK3mCkPXjyLUfowWDhrnee7UY XPiM9jx5yK+avuqhCoDo+HdkMysnZMzqAYImtlvaI6MuLNJjzl3QW4R9eHTZvbJlAHplhBQ7T WnT5z1eWvlb2R3igQt8nKD1KXTqPvbq89MPvvbmW//BIYD5OP8eRDTORx2AFp+DPDnHh0gpBQ oFx4pQPK+NoSUL5V5NtCHP6J4NrWrY2+kuOD9rnZ2811Icmn+KHAP27uW8Fn46xKvBekJARjm ajrFfbGK0eOH2daqCQDCOiA13dfrgtyRM0U17ranM9p/fo3NBMur94ksY5r+1k1aTIommBi/R OVAjYJ0oQPsqcwXwd4rBU8t8/dPd4nVuFP9gxwBTOMPiy/McREC0i9YhdcByzqpyWw6U45v11 uXcXra0EyhYaFdGniyQAoMAtlBnlTg/WVT32QH1p4IuUjAyjq9zU1uUYJ0wsHu0452t2kZzB0 N34sUMPqPgTtTISVRRR1p2xD9/qND0KccxC+GE/UOTru/y6Hywb8VTLaF/Zd4a96CjcEhO26v x8YRxSi X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:26:06 +0200 Stephen Berman wrote: > On Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:16:26 +0300 Eli Zaretskii wrote: > >>> From: Noam Postavsky >>> Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400 >>> Cc: Stephen Berman , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org >>> >>> How about mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning. >> >> Fine with me. >> > > Me too. > > On Thu, 7 Jul 2016 13:02:38 -0400 Noam Postavsky > wrote: > >> I also suggest removing mention >> of scrolling from docstring, I don't think we need to re-explain how >> moving point interacts with scrolling here. >> >> (defcustom mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning nil >> "Effect of selecting a region extending backward from double click. >> >> Nil means keep point at the position clicked (region end); >> non-nil means move point to region beginning." >> :version "26.1" >> :type '(choice (const :tag "Don't move point" nil) >> (const :tag "Move point to beginning of region" t))) >> > > This is also more appropriate, thanks. > > I'll push the changes to master as soon as I get a chance (hopefully > tomorrow). First, two questions, to hopefully avoid further changes after pushing: i. Currently no defcustom in master has `:version "26.1"' but several have `:version "25.2"', so should the latter be used here too? ii. Is the following NEWS entry ok, both in content and location? diff --git a/etc/NEWS b/etc/NEWS index b3a044d..286933f 100644 --- a/etc/NEWS +++ b/etc/NEWS @@ -56,6 +56,13 @@ affected by this, as SGI stopped supporting IRIX in December 2013. * Changes in Emacs 25.2 ++++ +** The new user option 'mouse-select-region-move-to-beginning' +controls the position of point when double-clicking mouse-1 on the end +of a parenthetical grouping or string-delimiter: the default value nil +keeps point at the end of the region, setting it to non-nil moves +point to the beginning of the region. + --- ** 'find-library-name' will now fall back on looking at 'load-history' to try to locate libraries that have been loaded with an explicit path Steve Berman From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jul 08 06:14:45 2016 Received: (at 23478) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Jul 2016 10:14:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41774 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSo1-0002Ku-Mg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 06:14:45 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:37786) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSo0-0002Kj-GX for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 06:14:44 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSns-0002A3-9f for 23478@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 06:14:39 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:43458) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSns-00029z-6h; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 06:14:36 -0400 Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:3175 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1bLSnr-0001OE-Ci; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 06:14:35 -0400 Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 13:14:25 +0300 Message-Id: <83r3b4ighq.fsf@gnu.org> From: Eli Zaretskii To: Stephen Berman In-reply-to: <87twg0bgeq.fsf@gmx.net> (message from Stephen Berman on Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:58:05 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> <87vb0h5mpt.fsf@gmx.net> <87twg0bgeq.fsf@gmx.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478 Cc: 23478@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -6.3 (------) > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:58:05 +0200 > > i. Currently no defcustom in master has `:version "26.1"' but several > have `:version "25.2"', so should the latter be used here too? Yes, please. I think we will produce 25.2 from master (after branching it or some other Git op). > ii. Is the following NEWS entry ok, both in content and location? Yes, it's okay. Don't worry about the current location, entries get relocated before a release anyway. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jul 08 11:39:15 2016 Received: (at 23478-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Jul 2016 15:39:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42820 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLXs2-0004nV-V4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:39:15 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:63966) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bLXs1-0004nI-7D for 23478-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:39:13 -0400 Received: from rosalinde ([89.245.89.198]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MDQI1-1b4okq3fi9-00Gp4h; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 17:38:53 +0200 From: Stephen Berman To: Noam Postavsky Subject: Re: bug#23478: 25.0.93; Mouse region selection asymmetry References: <878tzky2oe.fsf@gmx.net> <8360uoe5ye.fsf@gnu.org> <87shxswd5s.fsf@gmx.net> <834ma8e3ll.fsf@gnu.org> <871t3bhbpz.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <87poqun63w.fsf@gmx.net> <83furqratc.fsf@gnu.org> <87h9c6mkb0.fsf@gmx.net> <83vb0mp1ok.fsf@gnu.org> <87wpl17pvs.fsf@gmx.net> <83eg79pi29.fsf@gnu.org> <87bn2d736k.fsf@gmx.net> <83furongms.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3b6btyi.fsf@gmx.net> <83poqqli77.fsf@gnu.org> <878txd7irj.fsf@gmx.net> <8360shlb4d.fsf@gnu.org> <874m8176zx.fsf@gmx.net> <83wpkxjsxf.fsf@gnu.org> <87vb0h5mpt.fsf@gmx.net> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 17:38:50 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87vb0h5mpt.fsf@gmx.net> (Stephen Berman's message of "Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:26:06 +0200") Message-ID: <87furkm96d.fsf@gmx.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:qPkCnNKWaoJ+D7poHXYqSe8uKOhWShqwrBJQEYSVM77lvk18eBX V0GXq4rT8GoVjc+L8GjIHjSmrUpvBUJY0juOn1DrqoGDTXhY7tNys8eFBYaTEyPqr0sT1nK bD/vtcaOpXwiDzYumOOdNSqIxZ4P8u1Z8cPyYSTzKWTEyMy8YfKOr9L/LrthO9pNixbxKz8 fIqhD9z9scvFnL9WCG7Gg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:SEvhTdamA1k=:ce9cv2rNRasqw+/6ebyWc0 2PnvY9j2jSi3kX2M56B73pad7SOVnsDpeILyUHWg3GD8G2YefaoNIx+Z9DXtkuKOtCEB4Lh2u Ztbg21Veplq4HBJkcEnLoMnwm/MZZ1qSY6fGzRKdks1/js0Lq3TgL0yb9a3u6hGvjZWRFBJlw G4uAwhSL6mcV2AC2Boeai/wFKZxiJggHzWGHsK7IRD8S4otNbka3FB92hfaEt6cxf6A/Gex4i 2JCjFfdscKfKJnLxHKK6k37TVxPqLkwum8k7B3HdSzaqHUcRUP6Z1psXSfYsif6zjgmkxzcr3 O9OY+S7PYhCQXVSa4vViFAeatfSV3AAJbFoC3ZFvOvrWj+k97rZWVptyCOL0sCXv8sUnllzGa 7GQesjjRVggmAVwQCA9bODfDFv7m4by7FWKpO//5gwuqDxVCpFt3kBddWiEUZftqqzRN106fO wgrnPV5BbGBDtBPd7z4JDJW8Ns1/LNBMZ8fZcGJfV6Zixa3MdawvQZKqXDenfwqaUJFndF8ha DjgzeIPwinyRdVJajXe550MP9l4EmDSc9xgWz+flPL0tU9yr1baIspFCrEdtI3bRU2RkP8rTI uGUCS8y6kqmjUOjXTW/VcLah7J/awQ70x2svf1X0BPu6DFH1N5ueHmup+ep/iVyF0X0ZSTVvg KDQeeEFz8EpZiYzX9er6H81QZhrqhQKA56Bdh/tRQj/prM5uyTdorJRTf14FrljL/VF8x1fOU DlBZN8xLpMu2mQlCs+biJr1r1i3/bOaLEA65EO1ij9izYaU4hzZ6ZVzKqiDhaV2itpyYHC5ec FMc4n+K X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 23478-done Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 23478-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) On Thu, 07 Jul 2016 20:26:06 +0200 Stephen Berman wrote: > I'll push the changes to master as soon as I get a chance (hopefully > tomorrow). Done as commit d0c0b71 and closing this bug. Steve Berman From unknown Fri Jun 20 18:10:05 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2016 11:24:05 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator