GNU bug report logs - #23137
25.1.50; Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 22:16:45 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

Hi all,

I sometimes switch between two WMs, namely i3 and GNOME3.  I've noticed
that under GNOME3, the font rendering in Emacs seems to be, in my
opinion, nicer than in i3.  The difference is that under GNOME3 Emacs
uses subpixel rendering and not in i3.

I've tried several configs to get subpixel rendering working in Emacs
under i3: fontconfig and ~/.Xresources (attached).  Unfortunately, Emacs
doesn't conform and still doesn't use subpixel rendering even though
most other applications (gnome-terminal, rhythmbox, firefox, etc...)
do.

I tried running i3 under gnome-session as described at [1] and strangely
this fixes the issue!  Why would running Emacs under gnome-session fix
this?

[1]: http://blog.hugochinchilla.net/2013/03/using-gnome-3-with-i3-window-manager/

In GNU Emacs 25.1.50.1 (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.18.9)
 of 2016-03-24 built on spline
Repository revision: 39577d07124ee16895b9c6aab7e2c6e7d41cc715
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11802000
Configured using:
 'configure --prefix=/usr/local'

Configured features:
XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG SOUND GPM DBUS GSETTINGS NOTIFY ACL GNUTLS
LIBXML2 FREETYPE XFT ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11

Important settings:
  value of $LANG: en_GB.UTF8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: Group

Minor modes in effect:
  gnus-topic-mode: t
  gnus-undo-mode: t
  diff-auto-refine-mode: t
  erc-list-mode: t
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Recent messages:
Opening connection to mx0.mattleach.net via tls...
Opening connection to mx0.mattleach.net...done
Opening nnimap server on Home...done
6 new newsgroups have arrived
Checking new news...
Reading active file via nndraft...done
Checking new news...done
Gnus-Topic mode enabled in current buffer
Mark set
Making completion list...

Load-path shadows:
/home/matthew/.emacs.d/elpa/emms-20160304.920/tq hides /usr/local/share/emacs/25.1.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/tq

Features:
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hashtable-print-readable backquote dbusbind inotify dynamic-setting
system-font-setting font-render-setting move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x
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Memory information:
((conses 16 296882 26791)
 (symbols 48 49352 1)
 (miscs 40 161 521)
 (strings 32 89793 13003)
 (string-bytes 1 2712243)
 (vectors 16 40953)
 (vector-slots 8 761847 8414)
 (floats 8 544 465)
 (intervals 56 1825 949)
 (buffers 976 29)
 (heap 1024 71285 1843))

-- 
Matt

[.Xresources (application/octet-stream, attachment)]

Message #8 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 05:32:10 +0300

> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 22:16:45 +0100
> 
> I sometimes switch between two WMs, namely i3 and GNOME3.  I've noticed
> that under GNOME3, the font rendering in Emacs seems to be, in my
> opinion, nicer than in i3.  The difference is that under GNOME3 Emacs
> uses subpixel rendering and not in i3.

What is "subpixel rendering"?

Message #11 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 08:05:20 +0100

Hi Eli,

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
>> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 22:16:45 +0100
>> 
>> I sometimes switch between two WMs, namely i3 and GNOME3.  I've noticed
>> that under GNOME3, the font rendering in Emacs seems to be, in my
>> opinion, nicer than in i3.  The difference is that under GNOME3 Emacs
>> uses subpixel rendering and not in i3.
>
> What is "subpixel rendering"?

[1] gives an overview of what it is and the 'rgba' values in [2] show
how to configure it.  I think MS use the term ClearType on their Windows
platform.

Thanks,
-- 
Matt

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subpixel_rendering
[2]: http://linux.die.net/man/5/fonts-conf

Message #14 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 18:28:54 +0300

> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
> Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 08:05:20 +0100
> 
> >> I sometimes switch between two WMs, namely i3 and GNOME3.  I've noticed
> >> that under GNOME3, the font rendering in Emacs seems to be, in my
> >> opinion, nicer than in i3.  The difference is that under GNOME3 Emacs
> >> uses subpixel rendering and not in i3.
> >
> > What is "subpixel rendering"?
> 
> [1] gives an overview of what it is and the 'rgba' values in [2] show
> how to configure it.  I think MS use the term ClearType on their Windows
> platform.

Then why do you think it's an Emacs problem?

Are the binaries used on both machines from the same build?  If not,
please show the value of system-configuration-features from both
builds.

Thanks.

Message #17 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 22:13:14 +0100

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
>> Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 08:05:20 +0100
>> 
>> >> I sometimes switch between two WMs, namely i3 and GNOME3.  I've noticed
>> >> that under GNOME3, the font rendering in Emacs seems to be, in my
>> >> opinion, nicer than in i3.  The difference is that under GNOME3 Emacs
>> >> uses subpixel rendering and not in i3.
>> >
>> > What is "subpixel rendering"?
>> 
>> [1] gives an overview of what it is and the 'rgba' values in [2] show
>> how to configure it.  I think MS use the term ClearType on their Windows
>> platform.
>
> Then why do you think it's an Emacs problem?

I think it's an Emacs problem, because it is not behaving as configured,
even though other GTK applications do.

> Are the binaries used on both machines from the same build?  

Indeed, it is the same binary on the same machine, I just switch desktop
environments.  If I switch from i3 (an X11 WM) to GNOME3, Emacs uses
subpixel rendering, whereas other packages use it under both scenarios.

> If not, please show the value of system-configuration-features from
> both builds.

The value of this on my machine is:

"XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG SOUND GPM DBUS GSETTINGS NOTIFY ACL GNUTLS
LIBXML2 FREETYPE XFT ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11"

Thanks,
-- 
Matt

Message #20 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2016 05:46:14 +0300

> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
> Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 22:13:14 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
> 
> >> > What is "subpixel rendering"?
> >> 
> >> [1] gives an overview of what it is and the 'rgba' values in [2] show
> >> how to configure it.  I think MS use the term ClearType on their Windows
> >> platform.
> >
> > Then why do you think it's an Emacs problem?
> 
> I think it's an Emacs problem, because it is not behaving as configured,
> even though other GTK applications do.

What configuration options were supposed to tell Emacs to use subpixel
rendering?

Message #23 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 08:34:47 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

Hi Eli,

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
>> Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2016 22:13:14 +0100
>> 
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
>> 
>> >> > What is "subpixel rendering"?
>> >> 
>> >> [1] gives an overview of what it is and the 'rgba' values in [2] show
>> >> how to configure it.  I think MS use the term ClearType on their Windows
>> >> platform.
>> >
>> > Then why do you think it's an Emacs problem?
>> 
>> I think it's an Emacs problem, because it is not behaving as configured,
>> even though other GTK applications do.
>
> What configuration options were supposed to tell Emacs to use subpixel
> rendering?

There are two: ~/.Xresources (attached).  On some systems there is
/etc/fonts/conf.avail/10-sub-pixel-*.conf and you can symlink one of
those to /etc/fonts/conf.d (I have attached the one I use).  The 'rgba'
value in both configs controls subpixel rendering.

Thanks,
-- 
Matt

[.Xresources (application/octet-stream, attachment)]

[10-sub-pixel-rgb.conf (application/octet-stream, attachment)]

Message #26 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Wolfgang Jenkner <wjenkner <at> inode.at>
To: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>, 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 18:10:58 +0200

On Thu, Mar 31 2016, Matthew Leach wrote:

> On some systems there is
> /etc/fonts/conf.avail/10-sub-pixel-*.conf and you can symlink one of
> those to /etc/fonts/conf.d (I have attached the one I use). 

What about one of 11-lcdfilter-*.conf?

Message #29 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
To: Wolfgang Jenkner <wjenkner <at> inode.at>
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>, 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 17:41:54 +0100

Wolfgang Jenkner <wjenkner <at> inode.at> writes:

> On Thu, Mar 31 2016, Matthew Leach wrote:
>
>> On some systems there is
>> /etc/fonts/conf.avail/10-sub-pixel-*.conf and you can symlink one of
>> those to /etc/fonts/conf.d (I have attached the one I use). 
>
> What about one of 11-lcdfilter-*.conf?

Yes, I forgot about that one, sorry.  I have 11-lcdfilter-default.conf
active on my system.

Thanks,
-- 
Matt

Message #32 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50;
 Subpixel rendering is broken when not running under gnome-session
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 19:43:08 +0300

> From: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
> Cc: 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 08:34:47 +0100
> 
> > What configuration options were supposed to tell Emacs to use subpixel
> > rendering?
> 
> There are two: ~/.Xresources (attached).  On some systems there is
> /etc/fonts/conf.avail/10-sub-pixel-*.conf and you can symlink one of
> those to /etc/fonts/conf.d (I have attached the one I use).  The 'rgba'
> value in both configs controls subpixel rendering.

These are configuration files for software that is external to Emacs,
so I still think the problem might be in the configuration of those
other packages (fontconfig etc.), as I don't think Emacs reads these
files directly.  That's assuming you did make sure that the resources
were read by X.

And I'm really out of my depth here, so if double-checking the setup
of fontconfig and stuff doesn't help, I'm afraid you will have to look
for someone who really knows about this and could help you debug this.
Sorry.

Message #35 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>, 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50; Subpixel rendering is broken when not
 running under gnome-session
Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2022 07:53:26 +0100

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

> And I'm really out of my depth here, so if double-checking the setup
> of fontconfig and stuff doesn't help, I'm afraid you will have to look
> for someone who really knows about this and could help you debug this.
> Sorry.

(I'm going through old bug reports that unfortunately weren't resolved
at the time.)

Skimming this bug report, I think the conclusion here was that this was
not an Emacs issue, but an OS issue, so I'm closing this bug report.  If
I misunderstood, please respond to the debbugs address and we'll reopen.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #40 received at 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Po Lu <luangruo <at> yahoo.com>
To: Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net>
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>, 23137 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#23137: 25.1.50; Subpixel rendering is broken when not
 running under gnome-session
Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2022 15:24:39 +0800

Matthew Leach <matthew <at> mattleach.net> writes:

> There are two: ~/.Xresources (attached).  On some systems there is
> /etc/fonts/conf.avail/10-sub-pixel-*.conf and you can symlink one of
> those to /etc/fonts/conf.d (I have attached the one I use).  The
> 'rgba' value in both configs controls subpixel rendering.

Firstly, do you still see this problem with Cairo rendering?  Secondly,
please show the output of `xrdb -query'.

Thanks.

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