From unknown Fri Aug 15 15:32:47 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#20720 <20720@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#20720 <20720@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' Reply-To: bug#20720 <20720@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2025 22:32:47 +0000 retitle 20720 Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' reassign 20720 guix submitter 20720 Alex Kost severity 20720 normal thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jun 02 10:59:05 2015 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jun 2015 14:59:05 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37721 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Yznej-0001gZ-1n for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:59:05 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:54150) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Yzneh-0001g6-5e for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:59:03 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Yzneb-0007M4-6a for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:58:57 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_20,FREEMAIL_FROM, T_DKIM_INVALID autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:46592) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Yzneb-0007M0-4h for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:58:57 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:39351) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YzneX-0005X4-ES for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:58:57 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YzneU-0007HC-4w for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:58:53 -0400 Received: from mail-lb0-x22a.google.com ([2a00:1450:4010:c04::22a]:33719) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YzneT-0007GV-U4 for bug-guix@gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 10:58:50 -0400 Received: by lbcue7 with SMTP id ue7so106256660lbc.0 for ; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 07:58:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:user-agent:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=+ipS0jETMYoY2UIjhAaIatqe40BXT6y+kVCOTXa46kw=; b=kNXCpF2O3H08AYKPs604o0CqDlHpPBImhmHWgeMuJtDS5oAlHnNAcENwlSXCPf8mEm zz7vd+P2agce4ZlQjidar8RC1PKYJT7lYqbzraqSTrn9N//ydjT4+mCHXK7uu/AiYuaj 2cSLXAAGb9+0fVTTdF1PfMx4mXyYElvo2Ph4c35zLEEbntN2idgfr6ZpWfPutOuvTR1R Sooq9U90/e2EbebMYBEF3O3rLJOMxok6IpDesjwdEIU0a4uvEF5yOKuKGFV9Dxvg59CY yyqJJFK3WwbhtuJ31lsWzll020iSeQpF5LrxdlmOwaL9xCsP6fw2ItRpNTkhyfY8OU11 f8xA== X-Received: by 10.152.21.97 with SMTP id u1mr26308740lae.71.1433257128193; Tue, 02 Jun 2015 07:58:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leviafan ([217.107.192.152]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ef5sm2687044lac.30.2015.06.02.07.58.46 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 02 Jun 2015 07:58:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Kost To: bug-guix@gnu.org Subject: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2015 17:58:46 +0300 Message-ID: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -4.0 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -4.0 (----) Hello, this is not a bug report, but a feature request. I see some inconsistency in specifying text / text files in an operating-system declaration: - =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issue=E2=80=99 want plain strings; - =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98mingetty-service=E2=80=99 (#:mo= td argument) want a 'text-file' monadic procedure; - some other services (=E2=80=98syslog-service=E2=80=99, =E2=80=98lirc-serv= ice=E2=80=99, ...) want file names (of the configuration files). As for me, I prefer the latter variant. But I think the best would be to add support for any of the above possibilities for all services or operating-system fields. --=20 Alex From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jun 03 05:52:47 2015 Received: (at 20720) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Jun 2015 09:52:47 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38261 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z05Lq-0002ho-OH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 03 Jun 2015 05:52:47 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:34464 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z05Lo-0002hg-Be for 20720@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 03 Jun 2015 05:52:44 -0400 Received: from reverse-83.fdn.fr ([80.67.176.83]:41695 helo=pluto) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z05Ln-0005zI-Gh; Wed, 03 Jun 2015 05:52:43 -0400 From: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) To: Alex Kost Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 15 Prairial an 223 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x3D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2015 11:52:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> (Alex Kost's message of "Tue, 02 Jun 2015 17:58:46 +0300") Message-ID: <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720 Cc: 20720@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) Alex Kost skribis: > I see some inconsistency in specifying text / text files in an > operating-system declaration: Yeah, I agree it is somewhat annoying that there=E2=80=99s no single way to handle this. But... > - =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issue=E2=80=99 want plain string= s; > > - =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98mingetty-service=E2=80=99 (#:= motd argument) want a > 'text-file' monadic procedure; > > - some other services (=E2=80=98syslog-service=E2=80=99, =E2=80=98lirc-se= rvice=E2=80=99, ...) want file > names (of the configuration files). In reality they take a =E2=80=9Cfile=E2=80=9D, not a file name. A file is = an object that within a gexp expands to a file name. So it can be a =E2=80=98local-f= ile=E2=80=99 object, a derivation, etc. > As for me, I prefer the latter variant. But I think the best would be > to add support for any of the above possibilities for all services or > operating-system fields. An important criterion is whether the file needs to contain references to store items or not. For =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issue=E2= =80=99, that=E2=80=99s normally not the case, and these are usually small files or computable files, so I think it=E2=80=99s fine to use strings here (more convenient than files.) Using monadic values as for =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and #:motd is not = nice. These should be changed to use either a string or a file. The best would be to always use a file-like object. I=E2=80=99ve just added =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80=99 for that reason. Now I would change #:motd and =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 to take a file-like object rather than a monad= ic value. WDYT? This brings up the question of how far we should go on the declarative side: Similar to =E2=80=98local-file=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80= =99, should we add more declarative types, say for =E2=80=98gexp->derivation=E2=80=99? My current inclination would be to not add anything beyond =E2=80=98local-f= ile=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80=99: These two are useful in OS configurations= , so that=E2=80=99s fine, but for more elaborate things people should just use the procedural interface. Thoughts? Thanks, Ludo=E2=80=99. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jun 04 10:44:06 2015 Received: (at 20720) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jun 2015 14:44:07 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40659 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0WNK-00006n-9W for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 04 Jun 2015 10:44:06 -0400 Received: from mail-la0-f53.google.com ([209.85.215.53]:36080) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0WNI-00006D-Rs for 20720@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 04 Jun 2015 10:44:05 -0400 Received: by laei3 with SMTP id i3so33474340lae.3 for <20720@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 04 Jun 2015 07:43:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=KRfJRyxvjARU+Re8jYI86axlNow5CgKQ4GtHUF/AH+c=; b=AyiAMrAlioGUV8vllsoqlyF9UX8o6la9YgXtE3ATtFOoC7D2ozT11AysYVxz8VtRa6 qdmlWIcWeUtITQLeuTAzw6YTM1uBpq8IeMIWEq5DUF1DAZAnifbazxySyvC9ImbZROSu CVUmwDhtYf7h+UM6DwjLW/zOeW/cHGMqMku59vSrC5yfarl9YxbFomQH3QlBad+1Smuk VgOrCyGUfRMrUfpO+cQRiTJPeoHwBJplyaf9XDH8n4RQFqc4uTk63Eg/zPQ01rejWhmz seuvqcqlIU+gNUCcxbM4GwnXEZ8hBTxxwhaLHqCF/1GyK9QFSUr+JLCMl97F6vU/r3Cv Z79A== X-Received: by 10.152.3.33 with SMTP id 1mr37976213laz.109.1433429038802; Thu, 04 Jun 2015 07:43:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leviafan ([217.107.192.140]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id jl4sm790557lbc.14.2015.06.04.07.43.56 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 04 Jun 2015 07:43:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Kost To: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Thu, 04 Jun 2015 17:43:55 +0300 In-Reply-To: <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> ("Ludovic \=\?utf-8\?Q\?Court\=C3\=A8s\=22'\?\= \=\?utf-8\?Q\?s\?\= message of "Wed, 03 Jun 2015 11:52:41 +0200") Message-ID: <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720 Cc: 20720@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-03 12:52 +0300) wrote: > Alex Kost skribis: > >> I see some inconsistency in specifying text / text files in an >> operating-system declaration: > > Yeah, I agree it is somewhat annoying that there=E2=80=99s no single way = to > handle this. But... > >> - =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issue=E2=80=99 want plain strin= gs; >> >> - =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98mingetty-service=E2=80=99 (#= :motd argument) want a >> 'text-file' monadic procedure; >> >> - some other services (=E2=80=98syslog-service=E2=80=99, =E2=80=98lirc-s= ervice=E2=80=99, ...) want file >> names (of the configuration files). > > In reality they take a =E2=80=9Cfile=E2=80=9D, not a file name. A file i= s an object > that within a gexp expands to a file name. So it can be a =E2=80=98local= -file=E2=80=99 > object, a derivation, etc. Ah, thanks! I didn't realize that =E2=80=98local-file=E2=80=99 or a deriva= tion may be used there. >> As for me, I prefer the latter variant. But I think the best would >> be to add support for any of the above possibilities for all services >> or operating-system fields. > > An important criterion is whether the file needs to contain references > to store items or not. For =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issue= =E2=80=99, that=E2=80=99s normally not > the case, and these are usually small files or computable files, so I > think it=E2=80=99s fine to use strings here (more convenient than files.) Well, I don't agree about =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99. It may be a really bi= g file. Mine is not so big, but it is 40 lines long (including some useful comments), so I have to use some additional guile code to convert the contents of the file into string. > Using monadic values as for =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and #:motd is no= t nice. These > should be changed to use either a string or a file. > > The best would be to always use a file-like object. I=E2=80=99ve just ad= ded > =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80=99 for that reason. Now I would change #:motd = and > =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 to take a file-like object rather than a mon= adic value. > > WDYT? I beg a pardon, but if I inderstand it correctly (probably not), I don't see a difference from the user point of view. Previously it was: (hosts-file (text-file "hosts" "...")) and now it would be: (hosts-file (plain-file "hosts" "...")) > This brings up the question of how far we should go on the declarative > side: Similar to =E2=80=98local-file=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98plain-file=E2= =80=99, should we add more > declarative types, say for =E2=80=98gexp->derivation=E2=80=99? > > My current inclination would be to not add anything beyond =E2=80=98local= -file=E2=80=99 > and =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80=99: These two are useful in OS configuratio= ns, so that=E2=80=99s > fine, but for more elaborate things people should just use the > procedural interface. Thoughts? I think I'm not competent as I have a vague understanding of all this stuff and of user's needs (except mine =E2=98=BA). What I would like to ha= ve, is a possibility to specify my configuration files for various services and operating-system fields. I don't want to write text configs in my os-config.scm file (as it happens now with =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99). I'm very happy with the current behaviour of =E2=80=98syslog-service=E2=80= =99, =E2=80=98lirc-service=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98console-keymap-service=E2=80=99= where I just specify file names, e.g.: (syslog-service #:config-file "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf") and I like this =E2=86=91 way of specifying configurations very much! That= 's what I would like to see in =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98hosts-fi= le=E2=80=99 fields. --=20 Thanks, Alex From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jun 05 08:30:45 2015 Received: (at 20720) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jun 2015 12:30:45 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41223 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0qln-0001uK-Mq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 08:30:44 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:53135 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0qli-0001u8-R3 for 20720@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 08:30:41 -0400 Received: from pluto.bordeaux.inria.fr ([193.50.110.57]:33255 helo=pluto) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0qlh-0002CS-Kv; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 08:30:37 -0400 From: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) To: Alex Kost Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 17 Prairial an 223 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x3D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu Date: Fri, 05 Jun 2015 14:30:35 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> (Alex Kost's message of "Thu, 04 Jun 2015 17:43:55 +0300") Message-ID: <874mmmjq1g.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720 Cc: 20720@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) Alex Kost skribis: > Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-03 12:52 +0300) wrote: [...] >> An important criterion is whether the file needs to contain references >> to store items or not. For =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issue= =E2=80=99, that=E2=80=99s normally not >> the case, and these are usually small files or computable files, so I >> think it=E2=80=99s fine to use strings here (more convenient than files.) > > Well, I don't agree about =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99. It may be a really = big file. Mine > is not so big, but it is 40 lines long (including some useful comments), > so I have to use some additional guile code to convert the contents of > the file into string. Ah, good point. So let=E2=80=99s turn =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 into a fil= e-like object. >> Using monadic values as for =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and #:motd is n= ot nice. These >> should be changed to use either a string or a file. >> >> The best would be to always use a file-like object. I=E2=80=99ve just a= dded >> =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80=99 for that reason. Now I would change #:motd= and >> =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 to take a file-like object rather than a mo= nadic value. >> >> WDYT? > > I beg a pardon, but if I inderstand it correctly (probably not), I don't > see a difference from the user point of view. Previously it was: > > (hosts-file (text-file "hosts" "...")) > > and now it would be: > > (hosts-file (plain-file "hosts" "...")) Right. But it could also be: (hosts-file (local-file "/home/foo/my-hosts-file.txt")) This form is pleasant when the file can be long or when it has special syntax and you=E2=80=99d rather use the editor=E2=80=99s syntax highlightin= g. > I think I'm not competent as I have a vague understanding of all this > stuff and of user's needs (except mine =E2=98=BA). What I would like to = have, > is a possibility to specify my configuration files for various services > and operating-system fields. I don't want to write text configs in my > os-config.scm file (as it happens now with =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99). OK. So that=E2=80=99s definitely in favor of using file-like objects pretty much everywhere. > I'm very happy with the current behaviour of =E2=80=98syslog-service=E2= =80=99, > =E2=80=98lirc-service=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98console-keymap-service=E2=80= =99 where I just specify file > names, e.g.: > > (syslog-service #:config-file "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf") > > and I like this =E2=86=91 way of specifying configurations very much! Th= at's > what I would like to see in =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98hosts-= file=E2=80=99 fields. OK. Note that this form (directly using a local file name) works somewhat by chance and should not be used because it defeats reproducibility. That is, your OS configuration actually depends on that file in /home, which may be modified or deleted anytime, thereby changing the syslogd behavior in unpredicable ways. The right thing to do is: (syslog-service #:config-file (local-file "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf")) This means that the config file is automatically added to the store and made part of the closure of the OS config. Now if "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf" is removed/modified, the OS behavior remains unchanged. I=E2=80=99ll prepare a patch for that and report back. Thank you! Ludo=E2=80=99. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jun 05 09:28:03 2015 Received: (at 20720) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jun 2015 13:28:04 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41254 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0rfG-0003F7-Ru for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 09:28:03 -0400 Received: from mail-la0-f48.google.com ([209.85.215.48]:34827) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0rfC-0003Ek-Rf for 20720@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 09:27:59 -0400 Received: by labko7 with SMTP id ko7so54296763lab.2 for <20720@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 06:27:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=SanbrckgEOrwX4HrvUu8/MJdSu3AlKXJ+YF7RXCSp1c=; b=RsPdYpjaI+1/qTWRs6pi61NQusV/UhxQUxx2vv/yosEqoFUvZ1vvPQOFgDmEvVJ1/m zP94E05M29Ve2c90ZcWlpI2o29mcFZB8VGHhB6SzTShs9yxPtw0PMdQ0uyQ7GDEwnHox iS6BIcDxnmeitcrmvqNcHU17Lghlk/34C6zudzKvfc7NPff0xHOU2+08JhGLk663Jvuy HMW5iH/ulC1No/vIv40H+r6gTAz7j04wDfk/ZtQK9hRL+w7csDmdz7ezptXOOa5BR32K UZpK4wXSDE74GWmUkzQfYzRE6cy62xrGBwXu6YxKGNRJMybHSZuqubVch8QLPvNxZWgR Y2KQ== X-Received: by 10.152.44.132 with SMTP id e4mr3490103lam.34.1433510872941; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 06:27:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leviafan ([217.107.192.175]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id jr1sm1776473lbc.43.2015.06.05.06.27.43 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 05 Jun 2015 06:27:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Kost To: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> <874mmmjq1g.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Fri, 05 Jun 2015 16:27:39 +0300 In-Reply-To: <874mmmjq1g.fsf@gnu.org> ("Ludovic \=\?utf-8\?Q\?Court\=C3\=A8s\=22'\?\= \=\?utf-8\?Q\?s\?\= message of "Fri, 05 Jun 2015 14:30:35 +0200") Message-ID: <87oaku8eus.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720 Cc: 20720@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-05 15:30 +0300) wrote: > Alex Kost skribis: > >> Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-03 12:52 +0300) wrote: > > [...] > >>> An important criterion is whether the file needs to contain references >>> to store items or not. For =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98issu= e=E2=80=99, that=E2=80=99s normally not >>> the case, and these are usually small files or computable files, so I >>> think it=E2=80=99s fine to use strings here (more convenient than files= .) >> >> Well, I don't agree about =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99. It may be a really= big file. Mine >> is not so big, but it is 40 lines long (including some useful comments), >> so I have to use some additional guile code to convert the contents of >> the file into string. > > Ah, good point. So let=E2=80=99s turn =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 into a f= ile-like object. Thanks! >>> Using monadic values as for =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and #:motd is = not nice. These >>> should be changed to use either a string or a file. >>> >>> The best would be to always use a file-like object. I=E2=80=99ve just = added >>> =E2=80=98plain-file=E2=80=99 for that reason. Now I would change #:mot= d and >>> =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 to take a file-like object rather than a m= onadic value. >>> >>> WDYT? >> >> I beg a pardon, but if I inderstand it correctly (probably not), I don't >> see a difference from the user point of view. Previously it was: >> >> (hosts-file (text-file "hosts" "...")) >> >> and now it would be: >> >> (hosts-file (plain-file "hosts" "...")) > > Right. But it could also be: > > (hosts-file (local-file "/home/foo/my-hosts-file.txt")) > > This form is pleasant when the file can be long or when it has special > syntax and you=E2=80=99d rather use the editor=E2=80=99s syntax highlight= ing. Ah, This is great! Thank you. >> I think I'm not competent as I have a vague understanding of all this >> stuff and of user's needs (except mine =E2=98=BA). What I would like to= have, >> is a possibility to specify my configuration files for various services >> and operating-system fields. I don't want to write text configs in my >> os-config.scm file (as it happens now with =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99). > > OK. So that=E2=80=99s definitely in favor of using file-like objects pre= tty > much everywhere. Yes :-) >> I'm very happy with the current behaviour of =E2=80=98syslog-service=E2= =80=99, >> =E2=80=98lirc-service=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98console-keymap-service=E2=80= =99 where I just specify file >> names, e.g.: >> >> (syslog-service #:config-file "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf") >> >> and I like this =E2=86=91 way of specifying configurations very much! T= hat's >> what I would like to see in =E2=80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 and =E2=80=98hosts= -file=E2=80=99 fields. > > OK. Note that this form (directly using a local file name) works > somewhat by chance and should not be used because it defeats > reproducibility. That is, your OS configuration actually depends on > that file in /home, which may be modified or deleted anytime, thereby > changing the syslogd behavior in unpredicable ways. Yes, that's exactly what I want! I realize the benefits of the reproducibility but often I just want my system to depend on /home/... files that can be modified anytime. > The right thing to do is: > > (syslog-service #:config-file > (local-file "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf")) > > This means that the config file is automatically added to the store and > made part of the closure of the OS config. Now if > "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf" is removed/modified, the OS behavior > remains unchanged. And that's exactly what I don't want! I don't want my config files to be put into the store. Because I have to reconfigure the system to see the changes. With my current unpredicable way, I can change my syslog.conf and the next time I boot into the same system, I will face the changes I made. I realize that it sounds like a strange whim and is not what is supposed to be done, but, well, I just like it :-) > I=E2=80=99ll prepare a patch for that and report back. Thank you, in spite of all I said earlier, I really like =E2=80=98local-fil= e=E2=80=99! --=20 Alex From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jun 05 16:47:33 2015 Received: (at 20720) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jun 2015 20:47:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42228 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0yWa-0006s1-A1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 16:47:32 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:41640 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0yWX-0006rs-WB for 20720@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 16:47:30 -0400 Received: from reverse-83.fdn.fr ([80.67.176.83]:37902 helo=pluto) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1Z0yWW-0003gt-Ry; Fri, 05 Jun 2015 16:47:29 -0400 From: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) To: Alex Kost Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> <874mmmjq1g.fsf@gnu.org> <87oaku8eus.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Jun 2015 22:47:25 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87oaku8eus.fsf@gmail.com> (Alex Kost's message of "Fri, 05 Jun 2015 16:27:39 +0300") Message-ID: <87fv65992a.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720 Cc: 20720@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) Alex Kost skribis: > Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-05 15:30 +0300) wrote: [...] >> The right thing to do is: >> >> (syslog-service #:config-file >> (local-file "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf")) >> >> This means that the config file is automatically added to the store and >> made part of the closure of the OS config. Now if >> "/home/me/my-favourite-syslog.conf" is removed/modified, the OS behavior >> remains unchanged. > > And that's exactly what I don't want! I don't want my config files to > be put into the store. Because I have to reconfigure the system to see > the changes. With my current unpredicable way, I can change my > syslog.conf and the next time I boot into the same system, I will face > the changes I made. > > I realize that it sounds like a strange whim and is not what is supposed > to be done, but, well, I just like it :-) Fair enough. :-) Well, that will keep working, because we can=E2=80=99t really enforce config files in the store. Now, of course the solution will be for =E2=80=98guix system reconfigure=E2= =80=99 to restart services that can be restarted. The goal is not to force people to reboot for changes to take effect. :-) That =E2=80=9Cjust=E2=80=9D has = to be done. >> I=E2=80=99ll prepare a patch for that and report back. > > Thank you, in spite of all I said earlier, I really like =E2=80=98local-f= ile=E2=80=99! Commits 24e02c2 and 8476583 change =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and =E2=80= =98sudoers=E2=80=99 as discussed. Are there others left or can we close the bug? Thanks! Ludo=E2=80=99. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jun 06 13:39:03 2015 Received: (at 20720) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Jun 2015 17:39:03 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43423 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1I3i-0003T5-9q for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 06 Jun 2015 13:39:02 -0400 Received: from mail-la0-f47.google.com ([209.85.215.47]:34726) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1I3g-0003Sb-DK for 20720@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 06 Jun 2015 13:39:01 -0400 Received: by laew7 with SMTP id w7so72327818lae.1 for <20720@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 06 Jun 2015 10:38:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=is7hPJxhPbjH4zvoHFdLjvcNvg0+KvIFRVVnc3DOMdU=; b=bCWTstsiRXiWIqWJK5aFpF2xaJ0JT2T0dvx+gavjXC1o6QzqGg2SyZYtxTcfaj+0vK ZZnkjKFjQ7btsijyBqGCgzMFPfRbELQ52d0kIqKnHf7tSl+R/M9OIAPC9slzgwDrxT1r U9Nb3IsLOtT963AjIy9vpMWeE025QF+fqcf3lg+dChDSbM3kTnc2znjGVVv0xT1pPY3l UHYEW2iQJ2O4hfCI+7H28kuvbf1ZXMd93OxkRF+wq3FLM8sdEUiqCMUeHzGRS1ljz7OI yqNGSbP/jEgJoj1ZREnmSiFASkBCXuW6QEHQ1Jz3lo+eTqIhlhvSZj6wTM/5cmxRuYXQ fTRg== X-Received: by 10.153.11.163 with SMTP id ej3mr8545310lad.105.1433612334566; Sat, 06 Jun 2015 10:38:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leviafan ([217.107.192.168]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id a7sm2700995lbc.36.2015.06.06.10.38.52 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 06 Jun 2015 10:38:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Kost To: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> <874mmmjq1g.fsf@gnu.org> <87oaku8eus.fsf@gmail.com> <87fv65992a.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2015 20:38:53 +0300 In-Reply-To: <87fv65992a.fsf@gnu.org> ("Ludovic \=\?utf-8\?Q\?Court\=C3\=A8s\=22'\?\= \=\?utf-8\?Q\?s\?\= message of "Fri, 05 Jun 2015 22:47:25 +0200") Message-ID: <87vbf0zqhe.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720 Cc: 20720@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-05 23:47 +0300) wrote: > Alex Kost skribis: > >> Ludovic Court=C3=A8s (2015-06-05 15:30 +0300) wrote: > > [...] > > Now, of course the solution will be for =E2=80=98guix system reconfigure= =E2=80=99 to > restart services that can be restarted. The goal is not to force people > to reboot for changes to take effect. :-) That =E2=80=9Cjust=E2=80=9D ha= s to be done. Yeah, that will be a great feature some day :-) >>> I=E2=80=99ll prepare a patch for that and report back. >> >> Thank you, in spite of all I said earlier, I really like =E2=80=98local-= file=E2=80=99! > > Commits 24e02c2 and 8476583 change =E2=80=98hosts-file=E2=80=99 and =E2= =80=98sudoers=E2=80=99 as > discussed. Are there others left or can we close the bug? My needs are completely satisfied now, thank you very much! The bug can be closed I think. --=20 Alex From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jun 07 11:16:48 2015 Received: (at 20720-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Jun 2015 15:16:48 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44181 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1cJb-0003eM-Gu for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:16:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:56080) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1cJZ-0003e9-8U for 20720-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:16:45 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1cJP-0007IR-Vj for 20720-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:16:39 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:36320) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1cJP-0007IN-TH; Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:16:35 -0400 Received: from reverse-83.fdn.fr ([80.67.176.83]:38998 helo=pluto) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1Z1cJP-0000bH-3z; Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:16:35 -0400 From: ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?=) To: Alex Kost Subject: Re: bug#20720: Inconsistency in text fields for 'operating-system' References: <87egludumx.fsf@gmail.com> <87r3ptw23a.fsf@gnu.org> <87y4jzwn2s.fsf@gmail.com> <874mmmjq1g.fsf@gnu.org> <87oaku8eus.fsf@gmail.com> <87fv65992a.fsf@gnu.org> <87vbf0zqhe.fsf@gmail.com> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 19 Prairial an 223 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x3D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu Date: Sun, 07 Jun 2015 17:16:33 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87vbf0zqhe.fsf@gmail.com> (Alex Kost's message of "Sat, 06 Jun 2015 20:38:53 +0300") Message-ID: <87616z35wu.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 20720-done Cc: 20720-done@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) Alex Kost skribis: > My needs are completely satisfied now, thank you very much! The bug can > be closed I think. Great, thanks! Ludo'. From unknown Fri Aug 15 15:32:47 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2015 11:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator