From unknown Sat Aug 16 12:44:17 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#17390 <17390@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#17390 <17390@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode Reply-To: bug#17390 <17390@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2025 19:44:17 +0000 retitle 17390 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode reassign 17390 emacs submitter 17390 Johan Bockg=C3=A5rd severity 17390 minor tag 17390 fixed thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 02 14:12:35 2014 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2014 18:12:35 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48676 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwp-00047f-0M for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:12:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:49806) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwm-00047R-0W for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:12:32 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwW-0001yG-K5 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:12:26 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_05,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:57726) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwW-0001yC-HV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:12:16 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:51447) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwO-0007vD-1c for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:12:16 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwD-0001tu-Jo for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:12:07 -0400 Received: from smtprelay-b32.telenor.se ([213.150.131.21]:50720) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WgHwD-0001tZ-CO for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 14:11:57 -0400 Received: from ipb4.telenor.se (ipb4.telenor.se [195.54.127.167]) by smtprelay-b32.telenor.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10A1116606 for ; Fri, 2 May 2014 20:11:55 +0200 (CEST) X-SMTPAUTH-B2: [bocjoh] X-SENDER-IP: [85.229.5.96] X-LISTENER: [smtp.bredband.net] X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Av1yAJbfY1NV5QVgPGdsb2JhbABagwUBAYENDIcttW6IThcDAQEBATg1gwJfNAEEGAEMCohyAZZ5s0QXjm+EIwSvVTs X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.97,973,1389740400"; d="scan'208";a="573902962" Received: from c-6005e555.04-211-6c6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se (HELO muon.localdomain) ([85.229.5.96]) by ipb4.telenor.se with ESMTP; 02 May 2014 20:11:55 +0200 Received: by muon.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 5D7084849D5; Fri, 2 May 2014 20:11:50 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Johan_Bockg=C3=A5rd?= To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode Date: Fri, 02 May 2014 20:11:37 +0200 Message-ID: <87siosqcdi.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.4.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -5.7 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.7 (-----) (info "(elisp) Batch Mode") says: Any Lisp program output that would normally go to the echo area, either using `message', or using `prin1', etc., with `t' as the stream, goes instead to Emacs's standard error descriptor when in batch mode. This is not correct. Text printed with "`prin1', etc., with `t' as the stream" goes to stdout, not stderr. (Unlike `message'.) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 02 19:43:00 2014 Received: (at 17390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 May 2014 23:43:00 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48853 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WgN6a-0008Nz-18 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 19:43:00 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:59094 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WgN6Y-0008Ns-L5 for 17390@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 May 2014 19:42:59 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WgN6X-0002Tn-Fx; Fri, 02 May 2014 19:42:57 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: Johan =?utf-8?Q?Bockg=C3=A5rd?= Subject: Re: bug#17390: 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode References: <87siosqcdi.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spook: Albright Guantanamo Aldergrove Blowfish Albanian Exon X-Ran: i>WynxQyK_ZJ8j9]&D7Z8t1RG-Qi*||GU`)rp+X^o#C+AobB#'?Ma25:\G)LZgTW-aVZfR X-Hue: magenta X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Fri, 02 May 2014 19:42:57 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87siosqcdi.fsf@gnu.org> ("Johan =?utf-8?Q?Bockg=C3=A5rd=22's?= message of "Fri, 02 May 2014 20:11:37 +0200") Message-ID: <6neh0bsq66.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -5.7 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 17390 Cc: 17390@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.7 (-----) Johan Bockg=C3=A5rd wrote: > This is not correct. Text printed with "`prin1', etc., with `t' as the > stream" goes to stdout, not stderr. (Unlike `message'.) To me, it would make more sense for `message' to use stdout too. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 06 07:52:12 2015 Received: (at 17390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Sep 2015 11:52:12 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50526 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZYYUW-0001Q8-3P for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Sep 2015 07:52:12 -0400 Received: from [219.88.242.22] (port=34333 helo=mail.orcon.net.nz) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZYYUT-0001Pi-H4 for 17390@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Sep 2015 07:52:10 -0400 Received: from [10.1.1.5] (202-150-102-33.bng1.avl.orcon.net.nz [202.150.102.33] (may be forged)) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.orcon.net.nz (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-9.4) with ESMTP id t86Bq0Ir020446 for <17390@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 6 Sep 2015 23:52:01 +1200 Message-ID: <55EC28E0.5030900@orcon.net.nz> Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2015 23:52:00 +1200 From: Phil Sainty User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 17390@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#17390: 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Bayes-Prob: 0.0001 (Score 0: No Bayes scoring rules defined, tokens from: outbound) X-Spam-Score: -1.71 () [Hold at 3.00] FREEMAIL_FROM:0.001, RDNS_NONE:1.274, TO_NO_BRKTS_NORDNS:0.001, T_TO_NO_BRKTS_FREEMAIL:0.01, CC(NZ:-3) X-CanIt-Geo: ip=202.150.102.33; country=NZ; latitude=-41; longitude=174.0000; http://maps.google.com/maps?q=-41,174.0000&z=6 X-CanItPRO-Stream: base:outbound X-Canit-Stats-ID: 01PdLQ0F2 - 465793564af6 - 20150906 X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . roaringpenguin . com) X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Johan Bockgård writes: > (info "(elisp) Batch Mode") says: > > Any Lisp program output that would normally go to the echo > area, either using `message', or using `prin1', etc., with > `t' as the stream, goes instead to Emacs's standard error > descriptor when in batch mode. > > This is not correct. Text printed with "`prin1', etc., with `t' as the > stream" goes to stdout, not stderr. (Unlike `message'.) [...] Content analysis details: (4.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (psainty[at]orcon.net.nz) 2.7 RCVD_IN_PSBL RBL: Received via a relay in PSBL [219.88.242.22 listed in psbl.surriel.com] 1.3 RDNS_NONE Delivered to internal network by a host with no rDNS X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 17390 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Johan Bockgård writes: > (info "(elisp) Batch Mode") says: > > Any Lisp program output that would normally go to the echo > area, either using `message', or using `prin1', etc., with > `t' as the stream, goes instead to Emacs's standard error > descriptor when in batch mode. > > This is not correct. Text printed with "`prin1', etc., with `t' as the > stream" goes to stdout, not stderr. (Unlike `message'.) [...] Content analysis details: (4.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 2.7 RCVD_IN_PSBL RBL: Received via a relay in PSBL [219.88.242.22 listed in psbl.surriel.com] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (psainty[at]orcon.net.nz) 1.3 RDNS_NONE Delivered to internal network by a host with no rDNS Johan Bockgård writes: > (info "(elisp) Batch Mode") says: > > Any Lisp program output that would normally go to the echo > area, either using `message', or using `prin1', etc., with > `t' as the stream, goes instead to Emacs's standard error > descriptor when in batch mode. > > This is not correct. Text printed with "`prin1', etc., with `t' as the > stream" goes to stdout, not stderr. (Unlike `message'.) Glenn Morris writes: > To me, it would make more sense for `message' to use stdout too. This bug is still in effect (although it's not clear to me that the documentation should be considered to be what is in error?) It does seems initially intuitive that `message' would go to stdout, but having it go to stderr certainly makes more sense in the context of what the documentation claims -- that output written to the echo area (eq PRINTCHARFUN t) is treated as stderr. At present, `message' seems to be the *only* way of getting output to stderr in batch mode, which isn't ideal, as you don't get the same choice of output formats that you have with all the prin* functions. e.g. The documentation suggests that (princ "foo\n") would write to stdout, and (princ "foo\n" t) would write to stderr, which would seem useful, and much nicer than everything except `message' writing to stdout. However I do note that the functions accepting a PRINTCHARFUN argument tend to say that it will, when `nil', default to the value of `standard-output'; and that latter value (whether in batch mode or not) defaults to `t' -- precisely what is supposed to mean stderr! As such, this seems a bit messy; but given that the bug looks to have been in effect for quite a while now (23.4 behaves the same way), I wonder whether it would be sensible at this point to provide a completely new option for PRINTCHARFUN which explicitly means stderr (or indirectly, via a new `standard-error' variable, seeing as how we have both `standard-input' and `standard-output' vars, but no -error). That way we'd regain(??) the ability to send arbitrary prin* output to stderr in batch mode, without messing with the existing behaviour. Whether or not `message' continued to write to stderr would be a separate question, and I'm not sure what the right answer is, but it would certainly be a backwards-incompatible change. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Oct 31 17:53:21 2015 Received: (at 17390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 Oct 2015 21:53:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47344 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Zse5R-000089-8F for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Oct 2015 17:53:21 -0400 Received: from smtprelay-b21.telenor.se ([195.54.99.212]:60170) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Zse55-00007O-Mq for 17390@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Oct 2015 17:53:19 -0400 Received: from ipb1.telenor.se (ipb1.telenor.se [195.54.127.164]) by smtprelay-b21.telenor.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BA44F0C5 for <17390@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 31 Oct 2015 22:52:58 +0100 (CET) X-SMTPAUTH-B2: [bocjoh] X-SENDER-IP: [85.229.6.149] X-LISTENER: [smtp.bredband.net] X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A2CeAgAgNzVW/5UG5VVeGQEBAg8BAQKDC4FCgl28VgENgVqGEAkCgRs5FAEBAQEBAQGBCoQ2AQEDAVYjBQsLDhMlDwEEGAEMJBOIGwMKDAG+BhiENwEBAQEBBQEBAQEfi3WJQAWWQ6lfHwEBQoQFPTSFfgEBAQ X-IPAS-Result: A2CeAgAgNzVW/5UG5VVeGQEBAg8BAQKDC4FCgl28VgENgVqGEAkCgRs5FAEBAQEBAQGBCoQ2AQEDAVYjBQsLDhMlDwEEGAEMJBOIGwMKDAG+BhiENwEBAQEBBQEBAQEfi3WJQAWWQ6lfHwEBQoQFPTSFfgEBAQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.20,225,1444687200"; d="scan'208";a="408360849" Received: from c-9506e555.04-211-6c6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se (HELO muon.localdomain) ([85.229.6.149]) by ipb1.telenor.se with ESMTP; 31 Oct 2015 22:52:58 +0100 Received: by muon.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id BFAC44841F1; Sat, 31 Oct 2015 22:52:44 +0100 (CET) From: =?utf-8?Q?Johan_Bockg=C3=A5rd?= To: Phil Sainty Subject: Re: bug#17390: 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode References: <87siosqcdi.fsf@gnu.org> <55EC28E0.5030900@orcon.net.nz> Mail-Copies-To: never Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2015 22:52:44 +0100 In-Reply-To: <55EC28E0.5030900@orcon.net.nz> (Phil Sainty's message of "Sun, 06 Sep 2015 23:52:00 +1200") Message-ID: <878u6i9043.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 17390 Cc: 17390@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) Phil Sainty writes: > I wonder whether it would be sensible at this point to provide a > completely new option for PRINTCHARFUN which explicitly means stderr It exists and is called `external-debugging-output'. 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[45.2.119.34]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id l69sm5948028ioi.11.2018.02.10.06.47.22 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Sat, 10 Feb 2018 06:47:22 -0800 (PST) From: Noam Postavsky To: Johan =?utf-8?Q?Bockg=C3=A5rd?= Subject: Re: bug#17390: 24.4.50; Doc bug: Batch Mode References: <87siosqcdi.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2018 09:47:21 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87siosqcdi.fsf@gnu.org> ("Johan \=\?utf-8\?Q\?Bockg\=C3\=A5rd\=22's\?\= message of "Fri, 02 May 2014 20:11:37 +0200") Message-ID: <87po5cc35y.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.0.90 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 17390 Cc: 17390@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) tags 17390 fixed close 17390 25.1 quit Johan Bockg=C3=A5rd writes: > (info "(elisp) Batch Mode") says: > > Any Lisp program output that would normally go to the echo > area, either using `message', or using `prin1', etc., with > `t' as the stream, goes instead to Emacs's standard error > descriptor when in batch mode. > > This is not correct. Text printed with "`prin1', etc., with `t' as the > stream" goes to stdout, not stderr. (Unlike `message'.) This was fixed in 25.1. [1: 565adf2e90]: 2018-02-08 20:32:47 -0500 Clarify that text-quoting-style doesn't affect *Info* (Bug#24519) [...] (Batch Mode): Document how text written to standard streams is encoded. Fix inaccuracy regarding which output streams are used by output functions in batch mode. https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git/commit/?id=3D565adf2e90d67de2= 107343aaf265ec6c3e8fd165 From unknown Sat Aug 16 12:44:17 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2018 11:24:07 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator