From unknown Thu Aug 14 21:55:01 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#15542: 24.3.50; doc strings: cl-flet, cl-labels Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2013 21:15:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 15542 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 15542@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.138109405130414 (code B ref -1); Sun, 06 Oct 2013 21:15:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Oct 2013 21:14:11 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58256 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VSveV-0007uU-3U for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:14:11 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:46889) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VSveT-0007uJ-KC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:14:10 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VSveJ-0005zb-3b for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:14:09 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:58059) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VSveJ-0005zU-0z for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:13:59 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:48518) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VSveA-0000aa-FZ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:13:58 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VSve1-0005wi-U1 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:13:50 -0400 Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:36356) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VSve1-0005wd-N2 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 17:13:41 -0400 Received: from ucsinet21.oracle.com (ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.1/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.1) with ESMTP id r96LDdxq018747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sun, 6 Oct 2013 21:13:40 GMT Received: from userz7021.oracle.com (userz7021.oracle.com [156.151.31.85]) by ucsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r96LDc5b007830 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 6 Oct 2013 21:13:39 GMT Received: from abhmt120.oracle.com (abhmt120.oracle.com [141.146.116.72]) by userz7021.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r96LDcbX007827 for ; Sun, 6 Oct 2013 21:13:38 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <12eb23ab-078e-4761-aa3e-b4c03be15253@default> Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2013 14:13:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8 (707110) [OL 12.0.6680.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -4.0 (----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -4.0 (----) The doc strings should _describe the macros_. And that includes specifying each parameter. In GNU Emacs 24.3.50.1 (i686-pc-mingw32) of 2013-09-30 on LEG570 Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 6.1.7601 Configured using: `configure --enable-checking 'CFLAGS=3D-O0 -g3' CPPFLAGS=3D-DGLYPH_DEBUG= =3D1' From unknown Thu Aug 14 21:55:01 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#15542: 24.3.50; doc strings: cl-flet, cl-labels Resent-From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 04:08:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 15542 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Drew Adams Cc: 15542@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 15542-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B15542.13918324458940 (code B ref 15542); Sat, 08 Feb 2014 04:08:01 +0000 Received: (at 15542) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2014 04:07:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55871 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WBzCP-0002K8-6x for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 07 Feb 2014 23:07:25 -0500 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:48428) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WBzCM-0002Jv-Pe for 15542@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 07 Feb 2014 23:07:23 -0500 Received: from [204.14.154.233] (helo=building.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1WBzC8-0004fA-Ct; Sat, 08 Feb 2014 05:07:08 +0100 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen References: <12eb23ab-078e-4761-aa3e-b4c03be15253@default> Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 20:06:00 -0800 In-Reply-To: <12eb23ab-078e-4761-aa3e-b4c03be15253@default> (Drew Adams's message of "Sun, 6 Oct 2013 14:13:37 -0700 (PDT)") Message-ID: <87ob2i6yfr.fsf@building.gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13001 (Ma Gnus v0.10) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-MailScanner-ID: 1WBzC8-0004fA-Ct X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1392437228.8531@ongeZiFYWELPuQagM4ohsQ X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) Drew Adams writes: > The doc strings should _describe the macros_. > And that includes specifying each parameter. I don't really see how saying that "FUNC is a function" and "ARGLIST is an argument list" really would help anybody. Closing. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/ From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 07 23:07:32 2014 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2014 04:07:32 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55874 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WBzCV-0002KQ-Kp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 07 Feb 2014 23:07:31 -0500 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:48437) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WBzCS-0002KI-Qk for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 07 Feb 2014 23:07:29 -0500 Received: from [204.14.154.233] (helo=building.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1WBzCE-0004fJ-Ji for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 08 Feb 2014 05:07:15 +0100 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 20:06:06 -0800 Message-Id: <87mwi26yfl.fsf@building.gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #15542 X-MailScanner-ID: 1WBzCE-0004fJ-Ji X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1392437235.25783@fp4OjuQejradsuGzBFrhVg X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) close 15542 From unknown Thu Aug 14 21:55:01 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#15542: 24.3.50; doc strings: cl-flet, cl-labels Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 03:05:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 15542 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Cc: 15542@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 15542-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B15542.13919150726438 (code B ref 15542); Sun, 09 Feb 2014 03:05:02 +0000 Received: (at 15542) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Feb 2014 03:04:32 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58612 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCKh5-0001fl-BR for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 08 Feb 2014 22:04:31 -0500 Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:23225) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCKh3-0001fd-HW for 15542@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 08 Feb 2014 22:04:30 -0500 Received: from ucsinet21.oracle.com (ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s1934RRB019974 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 9 Feb 2014 03:04:28 GMT Received: from userz7022.oracle.com (userz7022.oracle.com [156.151.31.86]) by ucsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s1934QnG015864 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 9 Feb 2014 03:04:27 GMT Received: from abhmp0011.oracle.com (abhmp0011.oracle.com [141.146.116.17]) by userz7022.oracle.com (8.14.5+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s1934QRZ026515; Sun, 9 Feb 2014 03:04:26 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 19:04:24 -0800 (PST) From: Drew Adams References: <12eb23ab-078e-4761-aa3e-b4c03be15253@default> <87ob2i6yfr.fsf@building.gnus.org> In-Reply-To: <87ob2i6yfr.fsf@building.gnus.org> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8 (707110) [OL 12.0.6680.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93] X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) > > The doc strings should _describe the macros_. > > And that includes specifying each parameter. >=20 > I don't really see how saying that "FUNC is a function" > and "ARGLIST is an argument list" really would help anybody. > Closing. This is ridiculous. There needs to be a description of what these important macros are for or what their parameters are. Contrast this with pages of Common Lisp doc describing every detail about them. No, Emacs should not reproduce the Common Lisp doc. That's not the point. But it should give an overall description that is better than what is there now. And yes, each parameter should be described, including BODY and FORM. ARGLIST is not just "an argument list". It is the argument list for function FUNC (which should be called FUNCTION). Yes, when a parameter is named FUNCTION and its value can be any function there is no need to also say that the value is a function. That much you got right. Other than that (i.e., renaming the parameter to FUNCTION), each of the other parameters needs to be described. And the macros themselves need better descriptions. "Temporary function bindings" is misleading in a couple of ways, for instance. Only one of them is that it is not about _time_ when scoping is lexical. It is better (as was done for cl-flet) to speak of "local" rather than "temporary". The other is the ambiguity of the phrase "function bindings" - that should be clarified to say bindings of function names (symbols) to function definitions. Or even better, just say what is said for cl-flet: "make local function definitions" - no ambiguity about what bindings are meant. And what is this gobbledygook: "scoping is lexical, but capturing them in closures will only work if `lexical-binding' is in use." What does "work" mean here? This is a description that only a mother could love, i.e., it means something only to the person who implemented the macro. Tell us, if it is important, what lexical scoping is, if bindings are not captured in closures that work. And if it is not important then don't say it at all. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 10 02:54:24 2014 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Feb 2014 07:54:24 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33916 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WClh7-0005Aw-T3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 02:54:23 -0500 Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:55987) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WClh5-0005Ak-WF for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 02:54:20 -0500 Received: from [204.14.154.233] (helo=building.gnus.org) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1WClgr-00014r-3J for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 08:54:05 +0100 Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 23:52:52 -0800 Message-Id: <8761on1k17.fsf@building.gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #15542 X-MailScanner-ID: 1WClgr-00014r-3J X-Netfonds-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Netfonds-MailScanner-From: larsi@gnus.org MailScanner-NULL-Check: 1392623646.21381@3E4qguNhynO36AFLasHlSQ X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) close 15542