From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: era Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: era+emacsbugs@iki.fi, bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013 08:15:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Cc: era+emacsbugs@iki.fi X-Debbugs-Original-To: submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-Xcc: era+emacsbugs@iki.fi Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.13724936454067 (code B ref -1); Sat, 29 Jun 2013 08:15:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Jun 2013 08:14:05 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47793 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1UsqIG-00013W-IX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:05 -0400 Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.25]:52140) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1UsqID-00012x-Ln for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:02 -0400 Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.mail.srv.osa [10.202.2.45]) by gateway1.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20A9520485 for ; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from web5.nyi.mail.srv.osa ([10.202.2.215]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:01 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=message-id:from:to:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:subject:date; s=smtpout; bh=9rLeCSeWCbJI+WPk2dqJbqgaoKs=; b=edXkibKIiwjSjdcvwOTO9Rt7mMJE Csj3IKiQRq2Gg2goHdymbqHDUpM0RfB2lwTqh+cgfivOFcFwLu77R+U+0M0Ud53j UfcAZAZYqhSbxA9ZDQgL1yx2OMMe0kkenXTBbIeLSV7pruDTD+MJXBmNSVDxe5uM aWSRM+k263HQ240= Received: by web5.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix, from userid 99) id EEBC3F41474; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Sasl-Enc: wew2ROjmwPX3+XVEkaBeiKKBfiNeHw+h511PV8hvMHnL 1372493640 From: era MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-5ae8e04c Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:14:00 +0300 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Package: emacs Version: 24.3 Severity: minor Tags: patch X-Debbugs-Cc: era+emacsbugs@iki.fi As a long-time user of Emacs, but a total newcomer to SES, I had been hoping the barrier to entry for new users would have been a little lower. I was basically unable to do anything useful at all until I had browsed the better parts of the manual (which as such is good, but again, not very geared towards new users) way into the "advanced" chapter. I have collected some notes in http://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/81105/ but at this point, my proposal for a quick and unintrusive fix would amount to the following; 1. Create an (autoloading) alias "spreadsheet-mode" so that ses-mode is easier to discover (included below). 2. Expand the ses-mode documentation string. My proposal follows in-line, but please accept this as (a draft for) a patch against lisp/ses.el starting at line 1888 of the current trunk version. ;;;###autoload (defalias 'spreadsheet-mode 'ses-mode) ;;;###autoload (defun ses-mode () "Major mode for Simple Emacs Spreadsheet. When you invoke SES in a new buffer, it is divided into cells which you can enter data into. You can navigate the cells with the arrow keys and add more cells with the tab key. The contents of these cells can be numbers, text, or Lisp expressions. (To enter text, enclose it in double quotes.) In an expression, you can use cell coordinates to refer to the contents of another cell. For example, you can sum a range of cells with `(+ A1 A2 A3)'. There are specialized functions like `ses+' (addition for ranges with empty cells), `ses-average' for performing calculations on cells, and `ses-range' and `ses-select' for extracting ranges of cells. Each cell also has a print function which controls how it is displayed. Each SES buffer is divided into a print area and a data area. Normally, you should simply use SES to look at and manipulate the print area, and let SES manage the data area outside the visible region. See \"ses-example.ses\" (in `data-directory') for an example spreadsheeet and the Info documentation `(emacs) Ses.' Notice the separate keymaps for cell editing mode and print mode specifications, below. Key definitions: \\{ses-mode-map} These key definitions are active only in the print area (the visible part): \\{ses-mode-print-map} These are active only in the minibuffer, when entering or editing a formula: \\{ses-mode-edit-map}" -- If this were a real .signature, it would suck less. Well, maybe not. From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: Glenn Morris Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2013 15:55:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: era Cc: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.137278044921920 (code B ref 14748); Tue, 02 Jul 2013 15:55:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2013 15:54:09 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52667 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Uu2u8-0005hR-OV for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jul 2013 11:54:09 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:55218 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Uu2u5-0005hH-Fl for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 02 Jul 2013 11:54:06 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Uu2u4-0007f2-GL; Tue, 02 Jul 2013 11:54:04 -0400 From: Glenn Morris References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Spook: underground LABLINK counter terrorism Peking espionage X-Ran: 'trY9bF%D.4ys0xW*';&|:$n-dUt8lf2plv`[98('dL'_t86?7t-q0NN%2m5,s3M-h[R;W X-Hue: blue X-Attribution: GM Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2013 11:54:04 -0400 In-Reply-To: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> (era's message of "Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:14:00 +0300") Message-ID: <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) era wrote: > 2. Expand the ses-mode documentation string. Thank you. Would you be willing to complete an FSF copyright assignment so that we can apply this patch to Emacs? From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: era eriksson Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2013 12:21:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Cc: Glenn Morris Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.138140764214725 (code B ref 14748); Thu, 10 Oct 2013 12:21:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Oct 2013 12:20:42 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39965 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VUFEP-0003pQ-4N for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 08:20:41 -0400 Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.25]:59195) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VUFEL-0003pC-49 for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 08:20:37 -0400 Received: from compute2.internal (compute2.nyi.mail.srv.osa [10.202.2.42]) by gateway1.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8972220CCA; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 08:20:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from web5 ([10.202.2.215]) by compute2.internal (MEProxy); Thu, 10 Oct 2013 08:20:36 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=message-id:from:to:cc:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:subject:date:in-reply-to :references; s=smtpout; bh=qHE0mDrAlrvjQMvy+PRpQHC4/FU=; b=ps74B CxetuSYGEXX0k+uYZlz6SDP/nMRBY4pVwaytkFbzvaHEF25TsxXj7oszycXKSxrE hrLcWObgGb7cozZziCLKW/vIwq6xIMCn013DVTih9ucKjovxb+UR52UdY7FWjVIo VH0syveKqjkw+7DlntLZZFyovOTb+HPtmFD5TU= Received: by web5.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix, from userid 99) id 5F711D0170E; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 08:20:36 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Sasl-Enc: lmDHxE51FwEEgioQb8FUVZrR0/IuxdqeLGdxQi4CBeDs 1381407636 From: era eriksson MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-ce174988 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2013 15:20:36 +0300 In-Reply-To: <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) On Tue, Jul 2, 2013, at 18:54, Glenn Morris wrote: > era wrote: > > 2. Expand the ses-mode documentation string. > Thank you. Would you be willing to complete an FSF copyright assignment > so that we can apply this patch to Emacs? For the record, I finally got the final remaining paperwork from my employer's solicitor yesterday. Depending on how reliable paper mail is in your country (I hope the USPS is not affected by the furlough?) you should have it in a couple of weeks. /* era */ -- If this were a real .signature, it would suck less. Well, maybe not. From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: Stefan Monnier Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2013 14:27:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: era eriksson Cc: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.138141519227737 (code B ref 14748); Thu, 10 Oct 2013 14:27:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Oct 2013 14:26:32 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40866 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VUHCC-0007DH-1m for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 10:26:32 -0400 Received: from chene.dit.umontreal.ca ([132.204.246.20]:47016) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VUHC9-0007D6-96 for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 10:26:29 -0400 Received: from faina.iro.umontreal.ca (lechon.iro.umontreal.ca [132.204.27.242]) by chene.dit.umontreal.ca (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id r9AEQS0N020105; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 10:26:28 -0400 Received: by faina.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 6343AB4149; Thu, 10 Oct 2013 10:26:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Stefan Monnier Message-ID: References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2013 10:26:28 -0400 In-Reply-To: <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> (era eriksson's message of "Thu, 10 Oct 2013 15:20:36 +0300") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-NAI-Spam-Flag: NO X-NAI-Spam-Threshold: 5 X-NAI-Spam-Score: 0 X-NAI-Spam-Rules: 1 Rules triggered RV4727=0 X-NAI-Spam-Version: 2.3.0.9362 : core <4727> : inlines <138> : streams <1053492> : uri <1561331> X-Spam-Score: -1.5 (-) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.5 (-) >> > 2. Expand the ses-mode documentation string. >> Thank you. Would you be willing to complete an FSF copyright assignment >> so that we can apply this patch to Emacs? > For the record, I finally got the final remaining paperwork from my > employer's solicitor yesterday. Depending on how reliable paper mail is > in your country (I hope the USPS is not affected by the furlough?) you > should have it in a couple of weeks. Great, thank you, Stefan From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: era eriksson Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2013 14:59:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.138184913031184 (code B ref 14748); Tue, 15 Oct 2013 14:59:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Oct 2013 14:58:50 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51331 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VW65B-00086t-OQ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 10:58:50 -0400 Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.25]:47250) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VW659-00086k-2z for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 10:58:47 -0400 Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.mail.srv.osa [10.202.2.46]) by gateway1.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36B8722E09 for <14748@debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 10:58:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from web5 ([10.202.2.215]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 15 Oct 2013 10:58:46 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=message-id:from:to:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:in-reply-to:references :subject:date; s=smtpout; bh=5YPLJ3UEoEnsxNXNV8dU770p2v0=; b=syk yTznwbj269H5zmpAcil9c+IrPqm9mzNqu9hdxDJmh4cx19U+s5sN7p6Kgfj++JGR Wusw+Dku+szQTGx6c0Zx+svWMHhCKYI9PBwx/5u260UppPa7bUeSdX9TWOGk/WPK alYuHeAA+Gw8AVYl0xl5CywNJFv2YrCDP6FZ6xGU= Received: by web5.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix, from userid 99) id 1248AA6747A; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 10:58:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1381849126.16125.34261709.5F401543@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Sasl-Enc: qxUX6TON2W5Lx1j/XPeTIAAaaxDYyT6v8wvVrTG9KNyZ 1381849126 From: era eriksson MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-ce174988 In-Reply-To: References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2013 17:58:46 +0300 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) > > 2. Expand the ses-mode documentation string. > Thank you. Would you be willing to complete an FSF copyright assignment > so that we can apply this patch to Emacs? With the paperwork out of the way on my side, I have uploaded a slightly revised patch to GitHub [0]. [0]: https://github.com/tripleee/emacs There are two branches with fixes: bug14748 [1] contains the slightly revised patch from before, and bug14748bis [2] contains a slightly more intrusive -- and, regrettably, for the time being, untested -- patch for the Info documentation. Should I file a separate bug for the latter, or are you prepared to pull them both in one go? /* era */ [1]: https://github.com/tripleee/emacs/tree/bug14748 [2]: https://github.com/tripleee/emacs/tree/bug14748bis -- If this were a real .signature, it would suck less. Well, maybe not. From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: Glenn Morris Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2013 15:38:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: era eriksson Cc: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.13818514712627 (code B ref 14748); Tue, 15 Oct 2013 15:38:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Oct 2013 15:37:51 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51430 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VW6gw-0000gI-H2 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 11:37:51 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:38045 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VW6gu-0000g4-HF for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 11:37:49 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VW6gt-0008Eo-BB; Tue, 15 Oct 2013 11:37:47 -0400 From: Glenn Morris References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1381849126.16125.34261709.5F401543@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Spook: world domination dictionary Clinton CIDA threat AMEMB Lon X-Ran: YB4z&`|S+C)AOTgil@cbWgNBj"DImm)vctS1{_3$gqF!:iE8wPeVY-9j4-xmzU9Jz\\DK# X-Hue: blue X-Attribution: GM Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2013 11:37:47 -0400 In-Reply-To: <1381849126.16125.34261709.5F401543@webmail.messagingengine.com> (era eriksson's message of "Tue, 15 Oct 2013 17:58:46 +0300") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -5.5 (-----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.5 (-----) era eriksson wrote: > With the paperwork out of the way on my side, It still needs to be received and acknowledged by the FSF. IIRC they inform you when this happens - let us know when you hear. > There are two branches with fixes: bug14748 [1] contains the slightly > revised patch from before, and bug14748bis [2] contains a slightly more > intrusive -- and, regrettably, for the time being, untested -- patch for > the Info documentation. > > Should I file a separate bug for the latter, or are you prepared to pull > them both in one go? Please do test it, and when you are finished send both patches here. Thanks. From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: Glenn Morris Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 07:17:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: era eriksson Cc: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.138259898711132 (code B ref 14748); Thu, 24 Oct 2013 07:17:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Oct 2013 07:16:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40055 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VZF9e-0002tT-96 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 03:16:26 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:46025 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VZF9b-0002tL-On for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 03:16:24 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VZF9a-0006Wq-Mx; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 03:16:22 -0400 From: Glenn Morris References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1381849126.16125.34261709.5F401543@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Spook: Ansar al-Islam Leitrim SWAT Bosnia Leuken-Baden satellite X-Ran: {d)I: (Glenn Morris's message of "Tue, 15 Oct 2013 11:37:47 -0400") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -5.4 (-----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.4 (-----) Looks to me like your assignment is complete. Could you send the latest versions of the patch(es)? From unknown Fri Aug 15 18:48:51 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Resent-From: era eriksson Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2013 18:34:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14748 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch To: Glenn Morris Received: via spool by 14748-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14748.138488601431998 (code B ref 14748); Tue, 19 Nov 2013 18:34:02 +0000 Received: (at 14748) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Nov 2013 18:33:34 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33544 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Viq7B-0008Jx-85 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 19 Nov 2013 13:33:34 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:45422 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Viq78-0008Jn-KS for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 19 Nov 2013 13:33:31 -0500 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Viq78-0000DP-6u for 14748@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 19 Nov 2013 13:33:30 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <21131.44794.48998.654470@gnu.org> Resent-Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2013 13:33:30 -0500 Resent-From: Glenn Morris Resent-To: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW, T_DKIM_INVALID autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=message-id:from:to:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:in-reply-to:references :subject:date; s=smtpout; bh=f/1TV+YAr3VEot3AZWuF2Eb1ETw=; b=I+J 8uK99V5530DtyuvL1T94MUt0aGd03Bk7kkzMxD8hFR8T02s6W39yWlYNckbJ3GVa FdlfhqNl3lDJSNLW7PEdm6M+IbGrt3bfQaJCh+lFeTsGpJHIbiTGjJWShAMYoTJY TS/Rb7225Q/ySM9H4X6wSWaLwkN4W3/ymdVoHS7Y= Message-Id: <1384863432.30733.49344249.1DA5A62A@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Sasl-Enc: CIQ1oD0D3EWHMWRqX9JmqaYwSE7MhhIgzWw9oLCNeTBj 1384863432 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_----------=_1384863432307330"; charset="utf-8" In-Reply-To: References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1381849126.16125.34261709.5F401543@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 66.111.4.27 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2013 14:17:12 +0200 From: era eriksson X-Bogosity: no, spamicity=0.003057, v1.2.1 X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-d4893488 X-Spam-Score: -5.5 (-----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.5 (-----) This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --_----------=_1384863432307330 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain On Thu, Oct 24, 2013, at 9:16, Glenn Morris wrote: > Looks to me like your assignment is complete. > Could you send the latest versions of the patch(es)? Here goes, sorry for the delay. I split this into two patches in case you want to review the second in some more detail. The changes in the second patch are to parts I am less familiar with. -- If this were a real .signature, it would suck less. 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(Entity 5.503) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: era Subject: bug#14748: closed (Re: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting) Message-ID: References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 14748 X-Gnu-PR-Package: emacs X-Gnu-PR-Keywords: patch Reply-To: 14748@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2013 08:59:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1384937942-30863-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1384937942-30863-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting which was filed against the emacs package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 14748@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 14748: http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D14748 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1384937942-30863-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 14748-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Nov 2013 08:58:21 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34090 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Vj3c4-00080p-Hz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 03:58:20 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:60371 ident=Debian-exim) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Vj3c2-00080i-Eb for 14748-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 03:58:18 -0500 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Vj3c1-0007DU-Vu; Wed, 20 Nov 2013 03:58:18 -0500 From: Glenn Morris To: 14748-done@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#14748: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting References: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> <83obalgdpf.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <1381407636.11913.32354541.7E5913AD@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1381849126.16125.34261709.5F401543@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1384863432.30733.49344249.1DA5A62A@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Spook: Hamas Al-Qaeda Crypto AG NSA Agfa Soviet csystems X-Ran: $i^Rw?p&H)EMm.nvA:(kOw@@s5E]1&=lLQ:a*t;_oDE5Y}[q^S/Z{aaG6 X-Hue: blue X-Attribution: GM Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2013 03:58:17 -0500 In-Reply-To: <1384863432.30733.49344249.1DA5A62A@webmail.messagingengine.com> (era eriksson's message of "Tue, 19 Nov 2013 14:17:12 +0200") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -5.5 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14748-done X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.5 (-----) Version: 24.4 Thanks. Applied w. tweaks (e.g. the texinfo did not even compile, which was disappointing.) (Also; please send things to the bug address rather than just to me.) ------------=_1384937942-30863-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Jun 2013 08:14:05 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47793 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1UsqIG-00013W-IX for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:05 -0400 Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.25]:52140) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1UsqID-00012x-Ln for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:02 -0400 Received: from compute5.internal (compute5.nyi.mail.srv.osa [10.202.2.45]) by gateway1.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20A9520485 for ; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from web5.nyi.mail.srv.osa ([10.202.2.215]) by compute5.internal (MEProxy); Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:01 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=message-id:from:to:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:subject:date; s=smtpout; bh=9rLeCSeWCbJI+WPk2dqJbqgaoKs=; b=edXkibKIiwjSjdcvwOTO9Rt7mMJE Csj3IKiQRq2Gg2goHdymbqHDUpM0RfB2lwTqh+cgfivOFcFwLu77R+U+0M0Ud53j UfcAZAZYqhSbxA9ZDQgL1yx2OMMe0kkenXTBbIeLSV7pruDTD+MJXBmNSVDxe5uM aWSRM+k263HQ240= Received: by web5.nyi.mail.srv.osa (Postfix, from userid 99) id EEBC3F41474; Sat, 29 Jun 2013 04:14:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <1372493640.29981.140661249844461.6A0FF980@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Sasl-Enc: wew2ROjmwPX3+XVEkaBeiKKBfiNeHw+h511PV8hvMHnL 1372493640 From: era To: submit@debbugs.gnu.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-5ae8e04c Subject: emacs: ses.el: ses is not self-documenting Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013 11:14:00 +0300 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) Package: emacs Version: 24.3 Severity: minor Tags: patch X-Debbugs-Cc: era+emacsbugs@iki.fi As a long-time user of Emacs, but a total newcomer to SES, I had been hoping the barrier to entry for new users would have been a little lower. I was basically unable to do anything useful at all until I had browsed the better parts of the manual (which as such is good, but again, not very geared towards new users) way into the "advanced" chapter. I have collected some notes in http://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/81105/ but at this point, my proposal for a quick and unintrusive fix would amount to the following; 1. Create an (autoloading) alias "spreadsheet-mode" so that ses-mode is easier to discover (included below). 2. Expand the ses-mode documentation string. My proposal follows in-line, but please accept this as (a draft for) a patch against lisp/ses.el starting at line 1888 of the current trunk version. ;;;###autoload (defalias 'spreadsheet-mode 'ses-mode) ;;;###autoload (defun ses-mode () "Major mode for Simple Emacs Spreadsheet. When you invoke SES in a new buffer, it is divided into cells which you can enter data into. You can navigate the cells with the arrow keys and add more cells with the tab key. The contents of these cells can be numbers, text, or Lisp expressions. (To enter text, enclose it in double quotes.) In an expression, you can use cell coordinates to refer to the contents of another cell. For example, you can sum a range of cells with `(+ A1 A2 A3)'. There are specialized functions like `ses+' (addition for ranges with empty cells), `ses-average' for performing calculations on cells, and `ses-range' and `ses-select' for extracting ranges of cells. Each cell also has a print function which controls how it is displayed. Each SES buffer is divided into a print area and a data area. Normally, you should simply use SES to look at and manipulate the print area, and let SES manage the data area outside the visible region. See \"ses-example.ses\" (in `data-directory') for an example spreadsheeet and the Info documentation `(emacs) Ses.' Notice the separate keymaps for cell editing mode and print mode specifications, below. Key definitions: \\{ses-mode-map} These key definitions are active only in the print area (the visible part): \\{ses-mode-print-map} These are active only in the minibuffer, when entering or editing a formula: \\{ses-mode-edit-map}" -- If this were a real .signature, it would suck less. Well, maybe not. ------------=_1384937942-30863-1--