From unknown Fri Aug 15 14:17:58 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#14736 <14736@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#14736 <14736@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event Reply-To: bug#14736 <14736@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2025 21:17:58 +0000 retitle 14736 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and = does not send a keyboard event reassign 14736 emacs submitter 14736 Kumaran Santhanam severity 14736 normal tag 14736 moreinfo confirmed thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jun 27 21:25:33 2013 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Jun 2013 01:25:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45902 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNRL-00065z-AZ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:25:31 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:40670) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNNS-0005yL-5G for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:21:30 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNNI-0000Ro-J0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:21:24 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50 autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:40744) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNNI-0000Rk-Gt for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:21:20 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42353) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNND-0005gf-Q5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:21:20 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNN9-00008s-3P for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:21:15 -0400 Received: from na3sys009aog122.obsmtp.com ([74.125.149.147]:48618) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UsNN8-00005h-RN for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:21:11 -0400 Received: from mail.nerur.com ([173.228.91.168]) (using TLSv1) by na3sys009aob122.postini.com ([74.125.148.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKUczlAotvC0ORkU71zlSRKvdU5GH0ojYs@postini.com; Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:21:10 PDT Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:21:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Kumaran Santhanam To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Message-ID: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> In-Reply-To: <177174145.5314.1372381840342.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> Subject: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:25:29 -0400 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -5.0 (-----) On Mac OS X, the "Insert" key on external keyboards is mapped to "Help". Therefore, when the "Insert" key is pressed, the mouse cursor turns into a question mark and the key is not passed to Emacs to process. This is problematic because users may have keybindings from Linux and Windows that make use of the "Insert" key. The VIM project was able to resolve this issue by using the following code in the sendEvent method: // HACK! Intercept 'help' key presses and clear the 'help key flag', else // Cocoa turns the mouse cursor into a question mark and goes into 'context // help mode' (the keyDown: event itself never reaches the text view). By // clearing the 'help key flag' this event will be treated like a normal // key event. if ((NSKeyDown == type || NSKeyUp == type) && (flags & NSHelpKeyMask)) { flags &= ~NSHelpKeyMask; event = [NSEvent keyEventWithType:[event type] location:[event locationInWindow] modifierFlags:flags timestamp:[event timestamp] windowNumber:[event windowNumber] context:[event context] characters:[event characters] charactersIgnoringModifiers:[event charactersIgnoringModifiers] isARepeat:[event isARepeat] keyCode:[event keyCode]]; The full source is here: https://code.google.com/p/macvim/source/browse/trunk/MMApplication.m It would be a great benefit to users if this patch could be included in the upcoming point release. Thanks, Kumaran ----- In GNU Emacs 24.3.1 (x86_64-apple-darwin, NS apple-appkit-1038.36) of 2013-03-12 on bob.porkrind.org Windowing system distributor `Apple', version 10.3.1187 Configured using: `configure '--host=x86_64-apple-darwin' '--build=i686-apple-darwin' '--with-ns' 'build_alias=i686-apple-darwin' 'host_alias=x86_64-apple-darwin' 'CC=gcc -mmacosx-version-min=10.7 -isystem /Users/david/Xcode-10.7_4.5.2/Xcode.app/Contents/Developer/Platforms/MacOSX.platform/Developer/SDKs/MacOSX10.7.sdk/usr/include/ -F/Users/david/Xcode-10.7_4.5.2/Xcode.app/Contents/Developer/Platforms/MacOSX.platform/Developer/SDKs/MacOSX10.7.sdk/System/Library/Frameworks'' From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue May 31 16:41:20 2016 Received: (at 14736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 May 2016 20:41:20 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48750 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1b7qTX-0000Ly-RD for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 31 May 2016 16:41:19 -0400 Received: from mail-wm0-f46.google.com ([74.125.82.46]:38041) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1b7qTV-0000Lm-JH for 14736@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 31 May 2016 16:41:18 -0400 Received: by mail-wm0-f46.google.com with SMTP id a20so734573wma.1 for <14736@debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 31 May 2016 13:41:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=5JQcU2XV39zLugx9FJvGh5oL6U1K5LqTGebzAWnpJMo=; b=ZqlmM3UG2aQZK3/tLGzSNH3HIjsq/avjv2A+rYF+dPYy+/lU5xBF7MzgYphAxx/UFD eT5x6+Khr0wU7SnoMVAOiwhJlsCQjXwFssIU7GjoHPJFZvX2HaigspYFy1guauqVYUZV 3pofURZwHzFwB/yt7JZ4PvkdtQ10PbtGXDJo1EpcZTXif85alRCd4Vzh5zMKva8IUhxY OgCWgGErYoskwl0EiHRPPNydZTezA3rxigmVgy2EtGLn66hIMsKeq5YGIYW/1yLYqN0q z3yDYj3rHVdcNQoGMIsTFoz1pLxJdHRRfEot5aA3JvXf4XfJrHvZthHa8AXcgajBoHTH cjcQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:date :in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=5JQcU2XV39zLugx9FJvGh5oL6U1K5LqTGebzAWnpJMo=; b=Gbpd52PSmpRUBECfB4WC0EAyfbWIsQvmf77lbH/AxFIiA9xMlFkYi8PzQQIBWDXNZa Uw7ufraBunTboO0B+SAExDn8dbEvMowLqn7AAKa46udlxM9idj4gahiCFJmTitXev9Tl L5/MxOI7fsQJfDx45e4aKh5Tcht0ZwKTM5L9e80Dp+Uy7VbQn450JQKPFsMjR+HFZFOX 13JVCz4GxXJvwZKJlKTAEI7RYYSGqN15IAkzaQpqGyLHhoCI6OUor4KFZCUpi6VN6mxk X0iuoc1c7o7NMBDeMxD9Mk63mkjg+CxAlZZU0GpSJUad51uqdFkmQAAqqeiVYog6NKBj O6IA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tLDVrIdUVu5C1IlwknD4VyQxJNOFe0xqCUFiC34ibbuStufs5l1giXQyhncvt9JnQ== X-Received: by 10.28.62.69 with SMTP id l66mr17200719wma.70.1464727271878; Tue, 31 May 2016 13:41:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from breton.holly.idiocy.org (ip6-2001-08b0-03f8-8129-20c5-ff51-aaec-eb15.holly.idiocy.org. [2001:8b0:3f8:8129:20c5:ff51:aaec:eb15]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q189sm5103662wmd.19.2016.05.31.13.41.11 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 31 May 2016 13:41:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan Third To: Kumaran Santhanam Subject: Re: bug#14736: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event References: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 21:41:10 +0100 In-Reply-To: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> (Kumaran Santhanam's message of "Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:21:04 -0700 (PDT)") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.93 (darwin) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14736 Cc: 14736@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Kumaran Santhanam writes: > On Mac OS X, the "Insert" key on external keyboards is mapped to > "Help". Therefore, when the "Insert" key is pressed, the mouse cursor > turns into a question mark and the key is not passed to Emacs to > process. This is problematic because users may have keybindings from > Linux and Windows that make use of the "Insert" key. Confirmed as still present in Emacs 25. Is there some use for the "help" key and question-mark pointer? Interestingly, it looks like on recent Apple keyboards "insert" is replaced with fn instead of help. -- Alan Third From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue May 31 16:42:28 2016 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 May 2016 20:42:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48754 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1b7qUe-0000Ng-4O for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 31 May 2016 16:42:28 -0400 Received: from mail-wm0-f45.google.com ([74.125.82.45]:34397) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1b7qUc-0000NT-7k for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 31 May 2016 16:42:26 -0400 Received: by mail-wm0-f45.google.com with SMTP id z87so24486398wmh.1 for ; Tue, 31 May 2016 13:42:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:date:message-id:to:from:subject; bh=EupWxUCrUImzSzwDkdTH8rarJxtrVNoc3ZGEKiJJ9UU=; b=znXAxx9TxPWzvBsMUhO6s12OviHpdxFD8IBGuXQyLT2P40bH52vneBX0vvvNS0wz7g uIQjPbWtW/ETkc0PSnlm4wNQdVog5O31NYPTV4GhdMImwXl8sBk2DiVz/fSSZoxx1DVr KUzcl1UkecXU/U2ti+kWCEWmxM29GqDA3A2gS0D3eFIThS9gVA/tuAgUvBjdQFv9wY/m TUjuliRksBvPW2APpmvoxEgfqfgczTQmQW98TXe1JaVNHy/lOcp6FpAcyyKpMEgQsa+0 3JIi7Ok7r0tGKNBsLYKwtQ68545x9ZUnY6er2gSzabtd1XTJpn500jh52J3VDZ0Ibb4b BzbA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:date:message-id:to:from:subject; bh=EupWxUCrUImzSzwDkdTH8rarJxtrVNoc3ZGEKiJJ9UU=; b=jMq/a3PQ0qrTtQ0PQDLkr0hAOF7ppneZC9la1UIQ6PwgGktG+yaBIeOQnbiiZIlI1/ Uw0NWcK/VdNVqTIxV4mjGh4VE80TszXzoQOSzuAFNAKLO008zYEDKq8hVk4/Lj6dHZ1/ pnQtM6RjyoXvsajC+dTJ/KHw8w0YUB1YDaVCI5jQVV243O+LtHl9rUS04vsfQS2sA/PF xfJHYpFZ4M20w4cNLqTxFA9JF0dLeT5nLYv7APBTkIG6iJxY7Jjt4zmGW81iZEqT7+Mg XN0ulE10zrTspD9/0TpzLBpibAe4W+zel60PJBiXq6Df+jZFRiiLA4h+FylHp0qKFQDp IrNg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tI/ZUOFTYUQcy2ln3YzDkx+AkqrVl+SUV/pG1ktdmWlBvBNR2MGVso6pkMK2DCOEA== X-Received: by 10.194.72.103 with SMTP id c7mr37105167wjv.65.1464727340712; Tue, 31 May 2016 13:42:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from breton.holly.idiocy.org (ip6-2001-08b0-03f8-8129-20c5-ff51-aaec-eb15.holly.idiocy.org. [2001:8b0:3f8:8129:20c5:ff51:aaec:eb15]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f12sm31172970wme.13.2016.05.31.13.42.20 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 31 May 2016 13:42:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 21:42:19 +0100 Message-Id: To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Alan Third Subject: control message for bug #14736 X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) tags 14736 confirmed From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 15 02:02:28 2021 Received: (at 14736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jul 2021 06:02:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46461 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m3uS4-00044N-1j for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2021 02:02:28 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52784) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m3uS1-0003y8-5w for 14736@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2021 02:02:26 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=wq/f/IB41MgszgvhNhLHI9wMc6dWKmfayD9q2VxfEr0=; b=tiwUqNfDerBtVkG1kJ7AjZBMxd kjZj+w+6FHAXAmsopfWJ1aNarnvTGQa3KxdLvYhQ0wDSEWarVPkiTBaQEnckd0ru8jZmC0DxKaZgP HEbQbZg5WYKFZD0d42hiKuektOkS8Ud8sfY1SsZer241oglhN2uvFNO55tvuMBzO6dG4=; Received: from cm-84.212.220.105.getinternet.no ([84.212.220.105] helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m3uRr-0004Yi-9h; Thu, 15 Jul 2021 08:02:18 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Alan Third Subject: Re: bug#14736: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event References: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> X-Now-Playing: L.u.c.a.'s _Fabric 94: Steffi_: "Echo 1" Date: Thu, 15 Jul 2021 08:02:14 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Alan Third's message of "Tue, 31 May 2016 21:41:10 +0100") Message-ID: <871r80p121.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Alan Third writes: > Kumaran Santhanam writes: > >> On Mac OS X, the "Insert" key on external keyboards is mapped to >> "Help". Therefore, when the "Insert" key is pressed, the mouse cursor [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14736 Cc: Kumaran Santhanam , 14736@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Alan Third writes: > Kumaran Santhanam writes: > >> On Mac OS X, the "Insert" key on external keyboards is mapped to >> "Help". Therefore, when the "Insert" key is pressed, the mouse cursor >> turns into a question mark and the key is not passed to Emacs to >> process. This is problematic because users may have keybindings from >> Linux and Windows that make use of the "Insert" key. > > Confirmed as still present in Emacs 25. > > Is there some use for the "help" key and question-mark pointer? > > Interestingly, it looks like on recent Apple keyboards "insert" is > replaced with fn instead of help. I don't have an external keyboard for my Apple laptop, so I can't test myself. Is this issue still present in newer versions of Emacs/Macos? -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Thu Jul 15 02:02:31 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Jul 2021 06:02:31 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46464 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m3uS7-00047M-Ab for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2021 02:02:31 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52800) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m3uS6-000424-4U for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2021 02:02:30 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=A/bHKTFcy8wvELjcHYduiNz9KzbV9rPBXykXb58Ko7k=; b=O0T2dnL+JC31ALWIhY4ZEuoJwT e1Lgj1y/qW4wNE+pggmC6W86zZoxMhX1YGxOPCRAll1iCeHQg61dvV2LqpQDiO3wG6JgD0E37GEh2 514ti+MU9ESa5yVU9M3OgwbiBKpDhIbjmDxnkoUx0BfU2hZztYRnkDnMFau3n3NEyH8A=; Received: from cm-84.212.220.105.getinternet.no ([84.212.220.105] helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m3uRy-0004Yr-Jm for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 15 Jul 2021 08:02:24 +0200 Date: Thu, 15 Jul 2021 08:02:22 +0200 Message-Id: <87zguonmhd.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #14736 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: tags 14736 + moreinfo quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) tags 14736 + moreinfo quit From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 25 07:36:25 2021 Received: (at 14736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Jul 2021 11:36:25 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47690 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m7cQi-00016N-Ln for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Jul 2021 07:36:24 -0400 Received: from outbound.soverin.net ([116.202.126.228]:44045) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m7cQf-000167-Va for 14736@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 25 Jul 2021 07:36:22 -0400 Received: from smtp.soverin.net (unknown [10.10.3.28]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by outbound.soverin.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 910BC92; Sun, 25 Jul 2021 11:36:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.soverin.net (smtp.soverin.net [159.69.232.142]) by soverin.net DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=idiocy.org; s=soverin; t=1627212974; bh=JgJbuToW3yGZTpIoBMtHcH2ym8Jzv8u4sWUqhmSRUiw=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=eOpyD80m0veU1NAvAsfHnz3pFbVekPxdpPxEloj0N6N5MuwoQ1aWH3+HbdAyyxoD4 sB679zrJ/544pxvnBtOfRWVxOYPD/FrpNaT3oI+6eB/kT1gYtqAbMQPsoFJC85BRhc 8o3neuh///spJLSilmcIzRAl/rQ3r7PVU+JyJWeocMrCQhp6YnnR/oSppdqMQbS5mQ qWgx4zRV9g+WZUNbrYXztpdlHUaFdDWKMOUIEa8EO/FvTOsbyLghT3oi0egl9mFhkQ PXqxclUbP6wYrKUi6LCEx1kHZ9/WUdNDlXISBwAGM1bIBbXU3GlkNEjZXSSteRESpy LG4znZAkPDycQ== Received: from alan by faroe.holly.idiocy.org with local (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1m7cQU-003Q3R-PK; Sun, 25 Jul 2021 12:36:10 +0100 From: Alan Third To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#14736: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event References: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> <871r80p121.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2021 12:36:10 +0100 In-Reply-To: <871r80p121.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Thu, 15 Jul 2021 08:02:14 +0200") Message-ID: <87y29upqvp.fsf@idiocy.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14736 Cc: Kumaran Santhanam , 14736@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Alan Third writes: > >> Kumaran Santhanam writes: >> >>> On Mac OS X, the "Insert" key on external keyboards is mapped to >>> "Help". Therefore, when the "Insert" key is pressed, the mouse cursor >>> turns into a question mark and the key is not passed to Emacs to >>> process. This is problematic because users may have keybindings from >>> Linux and Windows that make use of the "Insert" key. >> >> Confirmed as still present in Emacs 25. >> >> Is there some use for the "help" key and question-mark pointer? >> >> Interestingly, it looks like on recent Apple keyboards "insert" is >> replaced with fn instead of help. > > I don't have an external keyboard for my Apple laptop, so I can't test > myself. Is this issue still present in newer versions of Emacs/Macos? Apparently fn-return should be equivalent. I can't check it right now though. -- Alan Third From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 28 11:43:26 2021 Received: (at 14736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Jul 2021 15:43:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55672 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m8liQ-0006mP-7G for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2021 11:43:26 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:49278) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m8liO-0006m6-Aa for 14736@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2021 11:43:24 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=inCHZwBF15gqxQ/aKwd+9Uf3csWlmOgFQFHBhh23IcA=; b=TeWcXsPFpIHh1o1//zymFEdv3g /gRu1oxszoc35V1twmR49MWoCsIt208qYwqKy0EnHz28t9TJ74Pg+BaSXXpEqI+BoAthU/wN0rgKr 0VFxIRgSj61BmB7+tDFVbsx6U5rW6N37PpCr/pAMqvUn2ZZYPFiVx126DQ5IVlRxuHIs=; Received: from 2.149.45.105.tmi.telenormobil.no ([2.149.45.105] helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m8liD-000165-Oy; Wed, 28 Jul 2021 17:43:16 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Alan Third Subject: Re: bug#14736: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event References: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> <871r80p121.fsf@gnus.org> <87y29upqvp.fsf@idiocy.org> Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2021 17:43:12 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87y29upqvp.fsf@idiocy.org> (Alan Third's message of "Sun, 25 Jul 2021 12:36:10 +0100") Message-ID: <87y29qa1gv.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Alan Third writes: > Apparently fn-return should be equivalent. I can't check it right now > though. And I'm away from home and don't have access to a Mac laptop this week. :-) Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP 0.0 TVD_RCVD_IP Message was received from an IP address -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14736 Cc: Kumaran Santhanam , 14736@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Alan Third writes: > Apparently fn-return should be equivalent. I can't check it right now > though. And I'm away from home and don't have access to a Mac laptop this week. :-) -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Jul 30 14:19:44 2021 Received: (at 14736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Jul 2021 18:19:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60872 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m9X6m-0005S4-BC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Jul 2021 14:19:44 -0400 Received: from outbound.soverin.net ([116.202.126.228]:33789) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m9X6k-0005Rm-5w for 14736@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 30 Jul 2021 14:19:43 -0400 Received: from smtp.soverin.net (unknown [10.10.3.24]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by outbound.soverin.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 77A3B1E2; Fri, 30 Jul 2021 18:19:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.soverin.net (smtp.soverin.net [159.69.232.138]) by soverin.net DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=idiocy.org; s=soverin; t=1627669174; bh=Vtm/jgEMvzQt/Px+1lRkFwRLxP/LnSzRL1ODWFwazAg=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=IXZTBCcXEsFmFODwREP7MCdqrzh52rCbgbJfGOomiV2Kjk5G/5gfI83wNkb8HZeA4 QsTTUx7voo/02zCbXV4/J64nL1RymRGmZvf4eCmnwbG8SbNmWtVUxnHWAnK81XgmVX ytdH925DlJjD009+oCxC2TKvwSxj8wuaTZDxCOGtcbEqVJNGV8QTSKtUgQLLSvYyTA 62WP194dU+R4CB/lfGW4zLDbZa0l/fRXP+N8zK3AbT5Z2L/wzSLZS1oGZx40CTJad5 L3bA42IzEpsi5sp2NV8eWAXhXdOmRrAP1wiSbeSMXaXZ7CEe0hpxDP48dls8j+QkfX Rmpw0BBTnhFVw== Received: from alan by faroe.holly.idiocy.org with local (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1m9X6Y-003bd3-Og; Fri, 30 Jul 2021 19:19:30 +0100 Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 19:19:30 +0100 From: Alan Third To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: Re: bug#14736: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event Message-ID: Mail-Followup-To: Alan Third , Lars Ingebrigtsen , Kumaran Santhanam , 14736@debbugs.gnu.org References: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> <871r80p121.fsf@gnus.org> <87y29upqvp.fsf@idiocy.org> <87y29qa1gv.fsf@gnus.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87y29qa1gv.fsf@gnus.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14736 Cc: Kumaran Santhanam , 14736@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Wed, Jul 28, 2021 at 05:43:12PM +0200, Lars Ingebrigtsen wrote: > Alan Third writes: > > > Apparently fn-return should be equivalent. I can't check it right now > > though. > > And I'm away from home and don't have access to a Mac laptop this week. > :-) I finally tried it on mine and it did exactly nothing. -- Alan Third From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 29 16:23:58 2021 Received: (at 14736) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Aug 2021 20:23:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57519 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mKRLS-0000MP-5R for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 Aug 2021 16:23:58 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:56058) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mKRLP-0000M6-Td for 14736@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 Aug 2021 16:23:56 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=GuITOjRAsWJjTJBhnW01kggr4lMY35lIBN8767E3bsI=; b=Yj3AP61cWSd5JSlm1jbOmT4eAd nSrlPwq1Z0Rf8TEvlP4F8raiNV4PMZppKfTwNN84eWsvLABBy7+CgByI25bxgkdPxnletsfvVIk8W /t6nHEVm5sHJge+uoSg3w9dPVikz7p/FLg2Y2vxlB2Spqlxo+FmIo1bpgpodVoshgWGg=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mKRLE-0003e7-Re; Sun, 29 Aug 2021 22:23:48 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen To: Alan Third Subject: Re: bug#14736: 24.3; "Insert" key results in question mark mouse cursor and does not send a keyboard event References: <1832345773.5319.1372382464778.JavaMail.root@nerur.com> <871r80p121.fsf@gnus.org> <87y29upqvp.fsf@idiocy.org> <87y29qa1gv.fsf@gnus.org> Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2021 22:23:44 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Alan Third's message of "Fri, 30 Jul 2021 19:19:30 +0100") Message-ID: <87o89gc84v.fsf@gnus.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Alan Third writes: > On Wed, Jul 28, 2021 at 05:43:12PM +0200, Lars Ingebrigtsen wrote: >> Alan Third writes: >> >> > Apparently fn-return should be equivalent. I can't check it right now >> > though. [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14736 Cc: Kumaran Santhanam , 14736@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Alan Third writes: > On Wed, Jul 28, 2021 at 05:43:12PM +0200, Lars Ingebrigtsen wrote: >> Alan Third writes: >> >> > Apparently fn-return should be equivalent. I can't check it right now >> > though. >> >> And I'm away from home and don't have access to a Mac laptop this week. >> :-) > > I finally tried it on mine and it did exactly nothing. So... it sounds like the original reported problem is gone, at least? So I'm closing this bug report, but perhaps the Insert key should do something... -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 29 16:24:01 2021 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Aug 2021 20:24:01 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57522 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mKRLV-0000Mi-CW for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 Aug 2021 16:24:01 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:56074) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1mKRLT-0000MB-7h for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 Aug 2021 16:23:59 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Subject:From:To:Message-Id:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=MnwXTth4THnXHWRWl4Cz2xinZvy9cCMCwwzMiRBFaDo=; b=dH7IWg2XT6YcwUS2oVvrjYMldY PS4gmM5/CNw43v9i123wg9gxyUuH9AMn+12MfRGm9Z6sqarSFYtWZjdDOCou9t1dUYtjBUkZxo+is cC79Tu+OGAy+oEpfNGzVWEiRSgNEwOtv/S7fAAcT4c4qFARhvJY05E0j4N1y2xQDokU4=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mKRLL-0003eE-4Q for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 29 Aug 2021 22:23:53 +0200 Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2021 22:23:50 +0200 Message-Id: <87mtp0c84p.fsf@gnus.org> To: control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Subject: control message for bug #14736 X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: close 14736 quit Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) close 14736 quit From unknown Fri Aug 15 14:17:58 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2021 11:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator