From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:25:44 2025 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Subject: bug#14172: [gmane.emacs.devel] Re: read-from-minibuffer vs completing-read -- Cueing Users: Resent-From: Jambunathan K Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2013 04:43:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: report 14172 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: To: 14172@debbugs.gnu.org X-Debbugs-Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Received: via spool by submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B.136556897812411 (code B ref -1); Wed, 10 Apr 2013 04:43:02 +0000 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Apr 2013 04:42:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42854 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1UPms6-0003E8-E4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:42:58 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:42165) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1UPms3-0003Dy-HT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:42:56 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoS-00041P-Su for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:13 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_XBL, T_DKIM_INVALID, USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]:47813) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoS-00041K-Pv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:12 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:53527) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoR-0008VT-MH for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:12 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoQ-00040y-Bb for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:11 -0400 Received: from mail-da0-x236.google.com ([2607:f8b0:400e:c00::236]:61742) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoQ-00040V-4u for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:10 -0400 Received: by mail-da0-f54.google.com with SMTP id p1so35189dad.27 for ; Tue, 09 Apr 2013 21:39:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:from:to:subject:date:message-id:user-agent:mime-version :content-type; bh=0LnyBa7ipvkVqtwwLJtywisbW72ia2e+pB7MhiWYEG0=; b=lwod8XeQirvXjJZEHJi6KmOWnYHJXnph/qFQ1AMeW46gZKhIM/Jl61vnRrlrUb16ok yOF7f5FbJJNDkP5/Wvm/vLeluG1uUNtXOF9yHlZH9fsN0MlVhikopHtqOISIUINp+Hti IDzkzGFX75BmWgwzASeeqxZX2Y1LJs5YThlCTDYpFEVugrpF4vo8r7yyB30pXxggW2hi jihN7PR6Ej3fiRqMQLVCyzCvpzXaWBfbjpoIjvLuj+LZ0wZk0dr7QreXJi6qirHatJnS mGkRaSMrmrx9mvQktrqRBfFDxYXD4wz01kWY5YjirCik86Bt4UB244fP/Pti8Rje7QOr jHtw== X-Received: by 10.68.131.10 with SMTP id oi10mr595484pbb.147.1365568748883; Tue, 09 Apr 2013 21:39:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from debian-6.05 ([115.242.208.26]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id kd7sm4815191pbb.34.2013.04.09.21.39.06 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 09 Apr 2013 21:39:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jambunathan K Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2013 10:08:57 +0530 Message-ID: <87ppy39ezi.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.17 X-Spam-Score: -4.2 (----) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.1 (------) Copy of http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/157498 Jambunathan K writes: > "T. V. Raman" writes: > >> As a long-time emacs user, I always see if there are completions >> available in the minibuffer -- so the worst that happens is that >> I get disappointed if I am answering a read-from-minibuffer >> prompt -- thinking of this, I realized that there is a good >> chance that new-comers to Emacs do a lot worse in the other >> direction, i.e. never realize that completions are available. >> Should we be cueing this somehow in the prompt -- (are we >> already cueing the user visually?) >> vs a completing-read prompt > > I have been using icomplete-mode for a while. Bzr trunk has an enhanced > version. > > My only complain is that the icomplete-mode starts showing completions > only after you enter the first character. If the first character is > wrong, then you get a more useless "No match" or some such thing. > > There is a buglet in the queue, only that it is not filed. I am essentially saying this: Enhance icomplete-mode so that it shows completion even without any user input. The visual cue is right there hiding behind the curtains. Try installing this quick change, do M-x and wait for the visual cue to reveal itself to you. === modified file 'lisp/icomplete.el' --- lisp/icomplete.el 2013-02-15 19:19:29 +0000 +++ lisp/icomplete.el 2013-03-03 20:18:15 +0000 @@ -267,11 +267,11 @@ and `minibuffer-setup-hook'." (save-excursion (goto-char (point-max)) ; Insert the match-status information: - (if (and (> (point-max) (minibuffer-prompt-end)) - buffer-undo-list ; Wait for some user input. + (if (and ;; (> (point-max) (minibuffer-prompt-end)) + ;; buffer-undo-list ; Wait for some user input. (or ;; Don't bother with delay after certain number of chars: - (> (- (point) (field-beginning)) icomplete-max-delay-chars) + ;; (> (- (point) (field-beginning)) icomplete-max-delay-chars) ;; Don't delay if the completions are known. completion-all-sorted-completions ;; Don't delay if alternatives number is small enough: -- From unknown Fri Aug 15 21:25:44 2025 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.503 (Entity 5.503) X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org From: help-debbugs@gnu.org (GNU bug Tracking System) To: Jambunathan K Subject: bug#14172: closed (Re: bug#14172: [gmane.emacs.devel] Re: read-from-minibuffer vs completing-read -- Cueing Users:) Message-ID: References: <87habep98r.fsf@gmail.com> <87ppy39ezi.fsf@gmail.com> X-Gnu-PR-Message: they-closed 14172 X-Gnu-PR-Package: emacs Reply-To: 14172@debbugs.gnu.org Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 04:42:02 +0000 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------=_1384490522-4790-1" This is a multi-part message in MIME format... ------------=_1384490522-4790-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Your bug report #14172: [gmane.emacs.devel] Re: read-from-minibuffer vs completing-read -- = Cueing Users: which was filed against the emacs package, has been closed. The explanation is attached below, along with your original report. If you require more details, please reply to 14172@debbugs.gnu.org. --=20 14172: http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D14172 GNU Bug Tracking System Contact help-debbugs@gnu.org with problems ------------=_1384490522-4790-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at 14172-done) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Nov 2013 04:41:46 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53326 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VhBE2-0001En-6y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 23:41:46 -0500 Received: from mail-pb0-f43.google.com ([209.85.160.43]:46004) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VhBE0-0001EQ-K9 for 14172-done@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 23:41:44 -0500 Received: by mail-pb0-f43.google.com with SMTP id rq2so924536pbb.16 for <14172-done@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 20:41:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent :mime-version:content-type; bh=34RliMuq46GYZpNAJ9q5wgb5qGmLaLD6QroaM995F1Y=; b=jqh1J5NfJvwMuslrrCM+XVRLTe2g9VDrY8DZeC0+DbRreY/pNq6uPUjoxFCci0EG8H f+d1AHYIMkU4XDVOkj0D4yVSrfqgkAtvTpQ021xevcV3lmgwBrNnzPQiFuUsN1gyJ2Ze OIiNZUJiiSLe1mf5/N4NIQIpeM89JlYxKhuRVREH/5sXly6jLGmKIonnz+GtRxCi3yEo eu/5j2DqAY2AJ/wp/mF+ZNr2CyrlNgEvyEzuY69SLu3PQ3GOY9dWf6itGA1p0Ozyp7tq p5KT+KCBjYfzmRbqMbxduAe5A+BGSc+oNbD9JfEiteOp6AdyOXUYyGkvOtsV+Qo/dgcT P8lA== X-Received: by 10.68.164.165 with SMTP id yr5mr4984753pbb.146.1384490498896; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 20:41:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from debian-6.05 ([115.241.27.214]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id iu7sm1409700pbc.45.2013.11.14.20.41.36 for <14172-done@debbugs.gnu.org> (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 14 Nov 2013 20:41:38 -0800 (PST) From: Jambunathan K To: 14172-done@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#14172: [gmane.emacs.devel] Re: read-from-minibuffer vs completing-read -- Cueing Users: References: <87ppy39ezi.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 10:11:24 +0530 In-Reply-To: <87ppy39ezi.fsf@gmail.com> (Jambunathan K.'s message of "Wed, 10 Apr 2013 10:08:57 +0530") Message-ID: <87habep98r.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 14172-done X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) OP here. Closing it. ------------=_1384490522-4790-1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Apr 2013 04:42:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42854 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1UPms6-0003E8-E4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:42:58 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:42165) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1UPms3-0003Dy-HT for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:42:56 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoS-00041P-Su for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:13 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_XBL, T_DKIM_INVALID, USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]:47813) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoS-00041K-Pv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:12 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:53527) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoR-0008VT-MH for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:12 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoQ-00040y-Bb for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:11 -0400 Received: from mail-da0-x236.google.com ([2607:f8b0:400e:c00::236]:61742) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UPmoQ-00040V-4u for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Apr 2013 00:39:10 -0400 Received: by mail-da0-f54.google.com with SMTP id p1so35189dad.27 for ; Tue, 09 Apr 2013 21:39:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:from:to:subject:date:message-id:user-agent:mime-version :content-type; bh=0LnyBa7ipvkVqtwwLJtywisbW72ia2e+pB7MhiWYEG0=; b=lwod8XeQirvXjJZEHJi6KmOWnYHJXnph/qFQ1AMeW46gZKhIM/Jl61vnRrlrUb16ok yOF7f5FbJJNDkP5/Wvm/vLeluG1uUNtXOF9yHlZH9fsN0MlVhikopHtqOISIUINp+Hti IDzkzGFX75BmWgwzASeeqxZX2Y1LJs5YThlCTDYpFEVugrpF4vo8r7yyB30pXxggW2hi jihN7PR6Ej3fiRqMQLVCyzCvpzXaWBfbjpoIjvLuj+LZ0wZk0dr7QreXJi6qirHatJnS mGkRaSMrmrx9mvQktrqRBfFDxYXD4wz01kWY5YjirCik86Bt4UB244fP/Pti8Rje7QOr jHtw== X-Received: by 10.68.131.10 with SMTP id oi10mr595484pbb.147.1365568748883; Tue, 09 Apr 2013 21:39:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from debian-6.05 ([115.242.208.26]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id kd7sm4815191pbb.34.2013.04.09.21.39.06 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 09 Apr 2013 21:39:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jambunathan K To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: [gmane.emacs.devel] Re: read-from-minibuffer vs completing-read -- Cueing Users: Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2013 10:08:57 +0530 Message-ID: <87ppy39ezi.fsf@gmail.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.17 X-Spam-Score: -4.2 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.1 (------) Copy of http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/157498 Jambunathan K writes: > "T. V. Raman" writes: > >> As a long-time emacs user, I always see if there are completions >> available in the minibuffer -- so the worst that happens is that >> I get disappointed if I am answering a read-from-minibuffer >> prompt -- thinking of this, I realized that there is a good >> chance that new-comers to Emacs do a lot worse in the other >> direction, i.e. never realize that completions are available. >> Should we be cueing this somehow in the prompt -- (are we >> already cueing the user visually?) >> vs a completing-read prompt > > I have been using icomplete-mode for a while. Bzr trunk has an enhanced > version. > > My only complain is that the icomplete-mode starts showing completions > only after you enter the first character. If the first character is > wrong, then you get a more useless "No match" or some such thing. > > There is a buglet in the queue, only that it is not filed. I am essentially saying this: Enhance icomplete-mode so that it shows completion even without any user input. The visual cue is right there hiding behind the curtains. Try installing this quick change, do M-x and wait for the visual cue to reveal itself to you. === modified file 'lisp/icomplete.el' --- lisp/icomplete.el 2013-02-15 19:19:29 +0000 +++ lisp/icomplete.el 2013-03-03 20:18:15 +0000 @@ -267,11 +267,11 @@ and `minibuffer-setup-hook'." (save-excursion (goto-char (point-max)) ; Insert the match-status information: - (if (and (> (point-max) (minibuffer-prompt-end)) - buffer-undo-list ; Wait for some user input. + (if (and ;; (> (point-max) (minibuffer-prompt-end)) + ;; buffer-undo-list ; Wait for some user input. (or ;; Don't bother with delay after certain number of chars: - (> (- (point) (field-beginning)) icomplete-max-delay-chars) + ;; (> (- (point) (field-beginning)) icomplete-max-delay-chars) ;; Don't delay if the completions are known. completion-all-sorted-completions ;; Don't delay if alternatives number is small enough: -- ------------=_1384490522-4790-1--