From unknown Fri Jun 20 07:14:25 2025 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.509 (Entity 5.509) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: bug#12760 <12760@debbugs.gnu.org> To: bug#12760 <12760@debbugs.gnu.org> Subject: Status: letf doc is not very helpful Reply-To: bug#12760 <12760@debbugs.gnu.org> Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2025 14:14:25 +0000 retitle 12760 letf doc is not very helpful reassign 12760 emacs submitter 12760 Glenn Morris severity 12760 minor thanks From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 29 03:55:17 2012 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Oct 2012 07:55:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37326 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TSkBp-0007U8-2K for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 03:55:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:42690) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TSkBn-0007U1-Kh for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 03:55:15 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TSk9S-0008IR-KX; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 03:52:50 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: submit@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: letf doc is not very helpful X-Spook: colonel STARLAN cybercash Medco warfare Hugo Chavez X-Ran: yA3,yk#~Gij>>#5czL0r| X-Hue: magenta X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 03:52:50 -0400 Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) Package: emacs Version: 24.2.50 Severity: minor emacs -Q -l cl C-h f letf -> Like `cl-letf', but with some extra backward compatibility. This is so vague as to not be useful. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 29 09:55:22 2012 Received: (at 12760) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Oct 2012 13:55:22 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37730 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TSpoH-0003GP-Mr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:55:22 -0400 Received: from ironport2-out.teksavvy.com ([206.248.154.182]:51069) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TSpoF-0003GD-0M for 12760@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:55:19 -0400 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Av0EAG6Zu0/O+LET/2dsb2JhbABEtBGBCIIWAQUnLyMQCw4mEhQYDSSIIboJkEQDozOBWIMF X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.75,637,1330923600"; d="scan'208";a="203064135" Received: from 206-248-177-19.dsl.teksavvy.com (HELO ceviche.home) ([206.248.177.19]) by ironport2-out.teksavvy.com with ESMTP/TLS/ADH-AES256-SHA; 29 Oct 2012 09:52:52 -0400 Received: by ceviche.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 1FE20661F0; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:52:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Stefan Monnier To: Glenn Morris Subject: Re: bug#12760: letf doc is not very helpful Message-ID: References: Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:52:52 -0400 In-Reply-To: (Glenn Morris's message of "Mon, 29 Oct 2012 03:52:50 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.2.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 12760 Cc: 12760@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) > -> Like `cl-letf', but with some extra backward compatibility. > This is so vague as to not be useful. The only difference (handling of funbound symbols for symbol-function) is one I'd rather not document because it's deprecated. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 29 13:43:17 2012 Received: (at 12760) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Oct 2012 17:43:17 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38461 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TStMq-00007n-C6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:43:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:54979) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TStMp-00007h-2W for 12760@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:43:15 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TStKP-0006yg-1I; Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:40:45 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: Stefan Monnier Subject: Re: bug#12760: letf doc is not very helpful References: X-Spook: cryptanalysis S Key United Nations kibo TELINT Etacs X-Ran: (|Y(G%1a/<5TvU9HKouABd9NY3zd].v6{G}1.r;n.dg{d<`~XO0wUd/eTFsbL6Qi\ay*F@ X-Hue: black X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:40:44 -0400 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:52:52 -0400") Message-ID: <8d301dvmr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 12760 Cc: 12760@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) Stefan Monnier wrote: >> -> Like `cl-letf', but with some extra backward compatibility. >> This is so vague as to not be useful. > > The only difference (handling of funbound symbols for symbol-function) > is one I'd rather not document because it's deprecated. Maybe you want to mark letf obsolete (as labels and flet are). From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Oct 30 03:08:28 2012 Received: (at 12760) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Oct 2012 07:08:28 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38843 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TT5w4-0006WT-0h for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:08:28 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:40253) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TT5vx-0006WG-Nn for 12760@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:08:27 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TT5tV-0003yc-TQ; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:05:49 -0400 From: Glenn Morris To: Stefan Monnier Subject: Re: bug#12760: letf doc is not very helpful References: X-Spook: CIA weapons of mass destruction UOP morse ICE e-cash X-Ran: h.\O>$!h"Ci|IhNr0b(|z+\p'~v49V^}IZsuYjsspkp*|p*JQ%]6zN\j67W2"1r^`i]V!I X-Hue: white X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes X-Attribution: GM Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:05:49 -0400 In-Reply-To: (Stefan Monnier's message of "Mon, 29 Oct 2012 09:52:52 -0400") Message-ID: <4gtxtcxwvm.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 12760 Cc: 12760@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) Stefan Monnier wrote: >> -> Like `cl-letf', but with some extra backward compatibility. >> This is so vague as to not be useful. > > The only difference (handling of funbound symbols for symbol-function) > is one I'd rather not document because it's deprecated. PS I honestly can't see why "A is different to B in some unspecified way that I'm not going to tell you lest you try and use it" is preferable to "A is essentially exactly the same as B, apart from cases C and D. Such usage is deprecated." From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Oct 30 03:37:27 2012 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Oct 2012 07:37:27 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38848 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TT6O7-0007B3-97 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:37:27 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([208.118.235.10]:41483) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TT6O4-0007Av-Ga for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:37:25 -0400 Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TT6Ld-0000wf-UY for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:34:54 -0400 Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:34:53 -0400 Message-Id: Subject: control message for bug 12760 To: X-Mailer: mail (GNU Mailutils 2.1) From: Glenn Morris X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -4.8 (----) close 12760 From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Tue Oct 30 08:34:15 2012 Received: (at 12760) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Oct 2012 12:34:15 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39182 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TTB1L-0007C0-4B for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 08:34:15 -0400 Received: from ironport2-out.teksavvy.com ([206.248.154.182]:43311) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TTB1J-0007Bt-IO for 12760@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 08:34:13 -0400 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Av0EAG6Zu0/O+LET/2dsb2JhbABEtBGBCIIWAQUnLyMQCw4mEhQYDSQuh3O6CZBEA6MzgViDBQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.75,637,1330923600"; d="scan'208";a="203136705" Received: from 206-248-177-19.dsl.teksavvy.com (HELO pastel.home) ([206.248.177.19]) by ironport2-out.teksavvy.com with ESMTP/TLS/ADH-AES256-SHA; 30 Oct 2012 08:31:41 -0400 Received: by pastel.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 9663059419; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 08:31:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Stefan Monnier To: Glenn Morris Subject: Re: bug#12760: letf doc is not very helpful Message-ID: References: <4gtxtcxwvm.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 08:31:40 -0400 In-Reply-To: <4gtxtcxwvm.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> (Glenn Morris's message of "Tue, 30 Oct 2012 03:05:49 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.2.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 12760 Cc: 12760@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) >>> -> Like `cl-letf', but with some extra backward compatibility. >>> This is so vague as to not be useful. >> The only difference (handling of funbound symbols for symbol-function) >> is one I'd rather not document because it's deprecated. > PS I honestly can't see why "A is different to B in some unspecified way > that I'm not going to tell you lest you try and use it" is preferable to > "A is essentially exactly the same as B, apart from cases C and D. Such > usage is deprecated." You might be right. Here is the exact situation: - The extra handling of `symbol-function' in `letf' was added because some existing uses of `flet' (which uses `letf' internally) need it. - I don't know of any code that uses `letf' in a way that `cl-letf' can't handle. So maybe a better solution is to rename the current `letf' into cl--flet-letf, and then to make `letf' an alias to `cl-letf'. Stefan From unknown Fri Jun 20 07:14:25 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2012 12:24:03 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator