From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 02 11:10:38 2011 Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Dec 2011 16:10:39 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVh7-000168-1S for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:38 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVh3-000160-Tw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:36 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVgk-0002lg-5a for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:18 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=unavailable version=3.3.1 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]:56541) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVgk-0002lc-2G for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:14 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:52193) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVgf-0000fT-K6 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:14 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVga-0002hG-Lh for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:09 -0500 Received: from mailc2.tigertech.net ([208.80.4.156]:44247) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVga-0002fx-8l for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:10:04 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailc2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 463DE1BD7D24; Fri, 2 Dec 2011 08:10:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at c2.tigertech.net Received: from jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com (unknown [38.124.250.3]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailc2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8B40E1BD7B9D; Fri, 2 Dec 2011 08:10:01 -0800 (PST) From: Jay Berkenbilt To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Subject: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback Message-ID: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> Date: Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:09:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-Received-From: 140.186.70.17 X-Spam-Score: -5.9 (-----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -5.9 (-----) Type some text. Save it in the kill ring with C-a C-SPC M-f M-w Then do this again: M-w In emacs 23, the cursor would bounce between the point and the mark the second time M-w was pressed, since the highlighting of the region turned off after the first time. Or, if transient-mark-mode is nil, then the first M-w would bounce the cursor between the point and mark. In emacs24, M-w seems to never cause the cursor to bounce between the point and mark. I don't see anything in NEWS about this change, and I don't see anything in the documentation of kill-ring-save that discusses this or how to influence this behavior. I personally do not use transient mark mode, so this cursor movement is the only visual feedback I have that I have selected the region I intended to select. While I've been using GNU emacs since 1987 and this behavior is a relatively recent addition, I had no idea how much I've become accustomed to it! In GNU Emacs 24.0.92.1 (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.24.6) of 2011-12-01 on jberkenbilt-linux Windowing system distributor `The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11004000 configured using `configure '--prefix=/opt/emacs-24.0.92'' Important settings: value of $LC_ALL: nil value of $LC_COLLATE: nil value of $LC_CTYPE: nil value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil value of $LC_MONETARY: nil value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil value of $LC_TIME: nil value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: nil locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix default enable-multibyte-characters: t Major mode: Outline Minor modes in effect: shell-dirtrack-mode: t which-function-mode: t tooltip-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t column-number-mode: t line-number-mode: t view-mode: t Recent input: k i l l - r i n g C-s C-s C-a C-r c l i p b o a r d C-r C-r C-r C-a M-x m a n x t e r m C-x o C-s c l i p b o a r d C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-a C-s c l i p b o a r d C-s C-s C-a C-x C-f ~ / C-g C-f C-g C-x C-g C-g C-x o C-x 1 C-x C-l C-s y a n k C-a C-x b * s c C-y C-y C-x b s s C-s r a s C-g C-s r s a C-s C-a C-s p k c s 1 2 C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-a C-s p i c C-g C-g C-r p k c s 1 2 SPC C-s C-s M-x m a n p k c s 1 2 C-x o C-s k e y C-a C-s - o u t C-s C-x 1 C-x # C-x o C-s k C-a C-x o C-s k e y C-s C-s C-a C-x o C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-a C-x k C-a C-SPC M-f M-w C-h c M-w C-h f k i l l SPC r i n M-w M-w C-a C-SPC M-f M-w C-h n C-x 1 C-s d e l e t i o n C-s C-s C-a C-v C-s k i l l C-s C-s C-s C-s M-< C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s C-a M-x r e p o r t SPC e b m SPC b SPC Recent messages: Mark saved where search started When done with a buffer, type C-x # Mark saved where search started [3 times] Mark set M-w runs the command kill-ring-save Type C-x 1 to delete the help window. Mark activated Mark saved where search started [2 times] Mark set Mark saved where search started Load-path shadows: /home/ejb/elisp/startup hides /opt/emacs-24.0.92/share/emacs/24.0.92/lisp/startup Features: (shadow sort flyspell ispell mail-extr emacsbug man noutline outline easy-mmode multi-isearch tabify vc-rcs add-log cc-mode cc-fonts cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds shell pcomplete grep dired help-mode view vc-svn vc ediff-merg ediff-diff ediff-wind ediff-help ediff-util ediff-mult ediff-init ediff vc-dispatcher qmime qmime-compose qmime-view which-func imenu filecache server uniquify warnings compile ange-ftp comint ring message format-spec rfc822 mml mml-sec mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader cc-styles cc-align cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs smtpmail auth-source eieio byte-opt bytecomp byte-compile cconv macroexp assoc gnus-util password-cache sendmail regexp-opt rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr mail-utils project advice help-fns advice-preload jka-compr cus-edit easymenu wid-edit cus-start cus-load edmacro kmacro cl time-date tooltip ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel x-win x-dnd tool-bar dnd fontset image fringe lisp-mode register page menu-bar rfn-eshadow timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax facemenu font-core frame cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev minibuffer loaddefs button faces cus-face files text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process dbusbind dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty emacs) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Fri Dec 02 11:24:26 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Dec 2011 16:24:26 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVuU-0001QL-62 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:24:26 -0500 Received: from mtaout22.012.net.il ([80.179.55.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWVuQ-0001Q9-If for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:24:23 -0500 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout22.012.net.il by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVL00B0040E7Q00@a-mtaout22.012.net.il> for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 18:24:05 +0200 (IST) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.124.120.75]) by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVL009LD4846TU0@a-mtaout22.012.net.il>; Fri, 02 Dec 2011 18:24:05 +0200 (IST) Date: Fri, 02 Dec 2011 18:23:00 +0200 From: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback In-reply-to: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Jay Berkenbilt Message-id: <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) > From: Jay Berkenbilt > Date: Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:09:53 -0500 > > Type some text. Save it in the kill ring with > > C-a C-SPC M-f M-w > > Then do this again: > > M-w > > In emacs 23, the cursor would bounce between the point and the mark the > second time M-w was pressed, since the highlighting of the region turned > off after the first time. Or, if transient-mark-mode is nil, then the > first M-w would bounce the cursor between the point and mark. In > emacs24, M-w seems to never cause the cursor to bounce between the point > and mark. It still does that to me, in the current trunk tip. Does it work in "emacs -Q" for you? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 00:32:10 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 05:32:10 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWiCo-0005hX-K6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 00:32:10 -0500 Received: from md5i.com ([75.151.244.229] helo=maru.md5i.com) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWiCg-0005hL-Ez for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 00:32:09 -0500 Received: from md5i by maru.md5i.com with local (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1RWiCG-0001fO-Ht; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 00:31:36 -0500 From: Michael Welsh Duggan To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 00:31:36 -0500 In-Reply-To: <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 02 Dec 2011 18:23:00 +0200") Message-ID: <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, Jay Berkenbilt X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Jay Berkenbilt >> Date: Fri, 02 Dec 2011 11:09:53 -0500 >> >> Type some text. Save it in the kill ring with >> >> C-a C-SPC M-f M-w >> >> Then do this again: >> >> M-w >> >> In emacs 23, the cursor would bounce between the point and the mark the >> second time M-w was pressed, since the highlighting of the region turned >> off after the first time. Or, if transient-mark-mode is nil, then the >> first M-w would bounce the cursor between the point and mark. In >> emacs24, M-w seems to never cause the cursor to bounce between the point >> and mark. > > It still does that to me, in the current trunk tip. > > Does it work in "emacs -Q" for you? > It appears to be inconsistent. Sometimes it will happen, sometimes it will not. I first noticed this many months ago, but at the time couldn't cause it to happen on command, and as such forgot about it for a while. Today, I tried again with emacs -Q built from bzr revno 106562. I definitely see this behavior, without fail. emacs -Q (In *scratch* buffer) C-p C-p C-p C-SPC C-e M-w It's a lot more noticeable with tmm off. GNU Emacs 24.0.92.1 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit) of 2011-11-30 on maru -- Michael Welsh Duggan (md5i@md5i.com) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 02:10:58 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 07:10:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWjkQ-0008Bs-98 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 02:10:58 -0500 Received: from mtaout21.012.net.il ([80.179.55.169]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWjkN-0008Bk-Hi for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 02:10:56 -0500 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout21.012.net.il by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVM0080094ZJN00@a-mtaout21.012.net.il> for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 09:10:35 +0200 (IST) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.127.123.99]) by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVM008SN99LBZ60@a-mtaout21.012.net.il>; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 09:10:34 +0200 (IST) Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 09:09:29 +0200 From: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback In-reply-to: <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Michael Welsh Duggan Message-id: <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) > From: Michael Welsh Duggan > Cc: Jay Berkenbilt , 10195@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 00:31:36 -0500 > > >> Type some text. Save it in the kill ring with > >> > >> C-a C-SPC M-f M-w > >> > >> Then do this again: > >> > >> M-w > >> > >> In emacs 23, the cursor would bounce between the point and the mark the > >> second time M-w was pressed, since the highlighting of the region turned > >> off after the first time. Or, if transient-mark-mode is nil, then the > >> first M-w would bounce the cursor between the point and mark. In > >> emacs24, M-w seems to never cause the cursor to bounce between the point > >> and mark. > > > > It still does that to me, in the current trunk tip. > > > > Does it work in "emacs -Q" for you? For the record, Jay replied off-list that "emacs -Q" has the same problem for him. > It appears to be inconsistent. Sometimes it will happen, sometimes it > will not. I first noticed this many months ago, but at the time > couldn't cause it to happen on command, and as such forgot about it for > a while. Today, I tried again with emacs -Q built from bzr revno > 106562. I definitely see this behavior, without fail. > > emacs -Q > (In *scratch* buffer) > C-p C-p C-p C-SPC C-e M-w This is not the right recipe. The first M-w does NOT show the region by momentarily moving point to its other end, because the default is to have transient-mark-mode on, which already shows the region. You need to type M-w twice or more in a row to see point move. Anyway, I don't see it on any machine to which I have access, FWIW. I tried both unoptimized and optimized builds, on Windows and on GNU/Linux, and they all behave as expected. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 10:19:33 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 15:19:33 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWrNE-0003NV-9V for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:32 -0500 Received: from md5i.com ([75.151.244.229] helo=maru.md5i.com) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWrNB-0003NO-LY for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:30 -0500 Received: from md5i by maru.md5i.com with local (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1RWrMo-0003mX-L5; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:06 -0500 From: Michael Welsh Duggan To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:06 -0500 In-Reply-To: <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 03 Dec 2011 09:09:29 +0200") Message-ID: <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Michael Welsh Duggan >> Cc: Jay Berkenbilt , 10195@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 00:31:36 -0500 >> >> >> Type some text. Save it in the kill ring with >> >> >> >> C-a C-SPC M-f M-w >> >> >> >> Then do this again: >> >> >> >> M-w >> >> >> >> In emacs 23, the cursor would bounce between the point and the mark the >> >> second time M-w was pressed, since the highlighting of the region turned >> >> off after the first time. Or, if transient-mark-mode is nil, then the >> >> first M-w would bounce the cursor between the point and mark. In >> >> emacs24, M-w seems to never cause the cursor to bounce between the point >> >> and mark. >> > >> > It still does that to me, in the current trunk tip. >> > >> > Does it work in "emacs -Q" for you? > > For the record, Jay replied off-list that "emacs -Q" has the same > problem for him. > >> It appears to be inconsistent. Sometimes it will happen, sometimes it >> will not. I first noticed this many months ago, but at the time >> couldn't cause it to happen on command, and as such forgot about it for >> a while. Today, I tried again with emacs -Q built from bzr revno >> 106562. I definitely see this behavior, without fail. >> >> emacs -Q >> (In *scratch* buffer) >> C-p C-p C-p C-SPC C-e M-w > > This is not the right recipe. The first M-w does NOT show the region > by momentarily moving point to its other end, because the default is > to have transient-mark-mode on, which already shows the region. You > need to type M-w twice or more in a row to see point move. Sorry, I forgot to type the second M-w. I usually use emacs without tmm, and that is why I made that error. > Anyway, I don't see it on any machine to which I have access, FWIW. I > tried both unoptimized and optimized builds, on Windows and on > GNU/Linux, and they all behave as expected. I just tried this again in a random buffer in my running non -Q emacs. The first M-w caused the cursor to bounce, the second did not, the third did, the fourth and fifth did not. This is why I called the behavior inconsistent. I just tried it in emacs -Q again, and had it bounce three times out of 15 tries. When it does bounce, and the mark and point are on different lines, I also see the line indicator change along with the bounce. When it does not bounce, the line indicator does not change. I am running in an unoptimized debug build with assertions turned on, and am familiar with gdb. If there is any way I can help debug this, please let me know. -- Michael Welsh Duggan (md5i@md5i.com) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 10:22:54 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 15:22:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWrQU-0003SB-9v for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:22:54 -0500 Received: from md5i.com ([75.151.244.229] helo=maru.md5i.com) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWrQS-0003S5-RH for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:22:53 -0500 Received: from md5i by maru.md5i.com with local (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1RWrQ7-0003tQ-Cr; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:22:31 -0500 From: Michael Welsh Duggan To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:22:31 -0500 In-Reply-To: <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> (Michael Welsh Duggan's message of "Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:06 -0500") Message-ID: <874nxhy91k.fsf@maru.md5i.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) Michael Welsh Duggan writes: > I just tried this again in a random buffer in my running non -Q emacs. > The first M-w caused the cursor to bounce, the second did not, the third > did, the fourth and fifth did not. This is why I called the behavior > inconsistent. I just tried it in emacs -Q again, and had it bounce > three times out of 15 tries. When it does bounce, and the mark and > point are on different lines, I also see the line indicator change along > with the bounce. When it does not bounce, the line indicator does not > change. I should mention that when I say I tries this N times, I mean without moving the mark or point. -- Michael Welsh Duggan (md5i@md5i.com) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 11:39:34 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 16:39:34 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWscg-0005Di-1c for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 11:39:34 -0500 Received: from mtaout21.012.net.il ([80.179.55.169]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWscd-0005DY-2F for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 11:39:32 -0500 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout21.012.net.il by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVM00A00YKNCI00@a-mtaout21.012.net.il> for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 18:39:08 +0200 (IST) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.229.57.150]) by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVM00AROZL7CW30@a-mtaout21.012.net.il>; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 18:39:08 +0200 (IST) Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 18:38:03 +0200 From: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback In-reply-to: <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Michael Welsh Duggan Message-id: <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) > From: Michael Welsh Duggan > Cc: ejb@ql.org, 10195@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:06 -0500 > > I just tried this again in a random buffer in my running non -Q emacs. > The first M-w caused the cursor to bounce, the second did not, the third > did, the fourth and fifth did not. This is why I called the behavior > inconsistent. I just tried it in emacs -Q again, and had it bounce > three times out of 15 tries. Does "C-h l" show all the 15 M-w keystrokes you did? > I am running in an unoptimized debug build with assertions turned on, > and am familiar with gdb. If there is any way I can help debug this, > please let me know. M-w calls sit-for after bouncing point to the position of mark; the default waiting period is 1 sec. How about instrumenting sit-for with calls to `message' and seeing what's going on there? One possibility is that some input event terminates the wait immediately (see sit-for's code). Another possibility is that something happens in read-event, in which case you will need to use GDB. But I think it would be good to see what's going on in sit-for before you go to the C level. Another idea is to replace the call to sit-for in kill-ring-save with a call to sleep-for, and see if that changes anything. If it does, the probably culprit is sit-for and whatever it calls. Thanks. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 12:07:14 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 17:07:14 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWt3S-0005qf-In for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:07:14 -0500 Received: from mtaout22.012.net.il ([80.179.55.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWt3Q-0005qY-QF for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:07:13 -0500 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout22.012.net.il by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVN001000O7VQ00@a-mtaout22.012.net.il> for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:06:49 +0200 (IST) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.229.32.58]) by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVN0017S0VA5OF0@a-mtaout22.012.net.il>; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:06:47 +0200 (IST) Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:05:42 +0200 From: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback In-reply-to: <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: md5i@md5i.com Message-id: <83pqg5bn6h.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) > Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 18:38:03 +0200 > From: Eli Zaretskii > Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org > > M-w calls sit-for after bouncing point to the position of mark; the > default waiting period is 1 sec. How about instrumenting sit-for with > calls to `message' and seeing what's going on there? Of course `message' enters redisplay, so it could obscure the problem... From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 12:38:44 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Dec 2011 17:38:44 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWtXv-0006bA-Ky for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:38:44 -0500 Received: from md5i.com ([75.151.244.229] helo=maru.md5i.com) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RWtXn-0006as-Nt for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:38:41 -0500 Received: from md5i by maru.md5i.com with local (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1RWtXQ-0003Bv-48; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:38:12 -0500 From: Michael Welsh Duggan To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 12:38:12 -0500 In-Reply-To: <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 03 Dec 2011 18:38:03 +0200") Message-ID: <87y5utwo6z.fsf@maru.md5i.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Michael Welsh Duggan >> Cc: ejb@ql.org, 10195@debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 10:19:06 -0500 >> >> I just tried this again in a random buffer in my running non -Q emacs. >> The first M-w caused the cursor to bounce, the second did not, the third >> did, the fourth and fifth did not. This is why I called the behavior >> inconsistent. I just tried it in emacs -Q again, and had it bounce >> three times out of 15 tries. > > Does "C-h l" show all the 15 M-w keystrokes you did? > >> I am running in an unoptimized debug build with assertions turned on, >> and am familiar with gdb. If there is any way I can help debug this, >> please let me know. Yes, and the region does end up in the kill ring. > M-w calls sit-for after bouncing point to the position of mark; the > default waiting period is 1 sec. How about instrumenting sit-for with > calls to `message' and seeing what's going on there? One possibility > is that some input event terminates the wait immediately (see > sit-for's code). Another possibility is that something happens in > read-event, in which case you will need to use GDB. But I think it > would be good to see what's going on in sit-for before you go to the C > level. > > Another idea is to replace the call to sit-for in kill-ring-save with > a call to sleep-for, and see if that changes anything. If it does, > the probably culprit is sit-for and whatever it calls. I'm away from home until late tonight. I'll give this (or something similar) a try then. -- Michael Welsh Duggan (md5i@md5i.com) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 21:29:54 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 02:29:54 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX1px-0003Qg-Qh for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 21:29:54 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX1pv-0003QZ-GD for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 21:29:52 -0500 Received: from bb121-6-69-237.singnet.com.sg ([121.6.69.237]:39706 helo=furball) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RX1pV-0007k7-MK; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 21:29:26 -0500 From: Chong Yidong To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:29:16 +0800 In-Reply-To: <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 03 Dec 2011 18:38:03 +0200") Message-ID: <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, Michael Welsh Duggan , ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) Eli Zaretskii writes: > M-w calls sit-for after bouncing point to the position of mark; the > default waiting period is 1 sec. How about instrumenting sit-for with > calls to `message' and seeing what's going on there? One possibility > is that some input event terminates the wait immediately (see > sit-for's code). Another possibility is that something happens in > read-event, in which case you will need to use GDB. But I think it > would be good to see what's going on in sit-for before you go to the C > level. > > Another idea is to replace the call to sit-for in kill-ring-save with > a call to sleep-for, and see if that changes anything. If it does, > the probably culprit is sit-for and whatever it calls. FWIW, I can see this problem, and the following workaround seems to do the trick. Your pending input explanation is probably right. === modified file 'lisp/simple.el' *** lisp/simple.el 2011-11-19 19:49:56 +0000 --- lisp/simple.el 2011-12-04 02:25:33 +0000 *************** *** 3251,3256 **** --- 3251,3257 ---- ;; Swap point and mark. (set-marker (mark-marker) (point) (current-buffer)) (goto-char other-end) + (redisplay t) (sit-for blink-matching-delay) ;; Swap back. (set-marker (mark-marker) other-end (current-buffer)) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 22:29:52 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 03:29:52 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX2m0-0004lz-Eq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 22:29:52 -0500 Received: from md5i.com ([75.151.244.229] helo=maru.md5i.com) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX2ly-0004ls-CZ for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 22:29:51 -0500 Received: from md5i by maru.md5i.com with local (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1RX2lZ-0005KB-0w; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 22:29:25 -0500 From: Michael Welsh Duggan To: Chong Yidong Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 22:29:24 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> (Chong Yidong's message of "Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:29:16 +0800") Message-ID: <87ty5hvwtn.fsf@maru.md5i.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110018 (No Gnus v0.18) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) Chong Yidong writes: > Eli Zaretskii writes: > >> M-w calls sit-for after bouncing point to the position of mark; the >> default waiting period is 1 sec. How about instrumenting sit-for with >> calls to `message' and seeing what's going on there? One possibility >> is that some input event terminates the wait immediately (see >> sit-for's code). Another possibility is that something happens in >> read-event, in which case you will need to use GDB. But I think it >> would be good to see what's going on in sit-for before you go to the C >> level. >> >> Another idea is to replace the call to sit-for in kill-ring-save with >> a call to sleep-for, and see if that changes anything. If it does, >> the probably culprit is sit-for and whatever it calls. > > FWIW, I can see this problem, and the following workaround seems to do > the trick. Your pending input explanation is probably right. Yes, this seems to do the trick for me as well. > === modified file 'lisp/simple.el' > *** lisp/simple.el 2011-11-19 19:49:56 +0000 > --- lisp/simple.el 2011-12-04 02:25:33 +0000 > *************** > *** 3251,3256 **** > --- 3251,3257 ---- > ;; Swap point and mark. > (set-marker (mark-marker) (point) (current-buffer)) > (goto-char other-end) > + (redisplay t) > (sit-for blink-matching-delay) > ;; Swap back. > (set-marker (mark-marker) other-end (current-buffer)) > -- Michael Welsh Duggan (md5i@md5i.com) From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sat Dec 03 23:01:13 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 04:01:13 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX3GK-0005XG-O1 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 23:01:12 -0500 Received: from mtaout22.012.net.il ([80.179.55.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX3GH-0005X5-80 for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Dec 2011 23:01:10 -0500 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout22.012.net.il by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVN00700UZNDY00@a-mtaout22.012.net.il> for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:00:41 +0200 (IST) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.229.32.58]) by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVN007USV54CG00@a-mtaout22.012.net.il>; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:00:41 +0200 (IST) Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 05:59:37 +0200 From: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback In-reply-to: <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Chong Yidong Message-id: <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, md5i@md5i.com, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) > From: Chong Yidong > Cc: Michael Welsh Duggan , 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org > Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:29:16 +0800 > > Your pending input explanation is probably right. The question is: what input is pending? Looking at the event queue should reveal that. If that shows nothing appropriate, then try looking lower at the socket read. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 04 03:11:59 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 08:11:59 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX7B0-00032M-JI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 03:11:59 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RX7Ay-00032F-1s for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 03:11:57 -0500 Received: from bb121-6-69-237.singnet.com.sg ([121.6.69.237]:40370 helo=furball) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RX7AX-0003fA-1V; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 03:11:29 -0500 From: Chong Yidong To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 16:11:20 +0800 In-Reply-To: <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 04 Dec 2011 05:59:37 +0200") Message-ID: <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, md5i@md5i.com, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> Your pending input explanation is probably right. > > The question is: what input is pending? It's an X selection request event. I'm not sure where the request is coming from---Gnome's clipboard manager, maybe. Setting interprogram-cut-function to nil also inhibits the problem. OTOH, I don't see why the pending input doesn't trigger for Emacs 23, since M-w copies to the primary selection there too. Maybe it's a subtle effect of one of the changes to the primary selection code a few months ago. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 04 06:26:19 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 11:26:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXAD4-0008MB-Qg for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:26:19 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXAD2-0008M4-Br for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:26:17 -0500 Received: from eliz by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RXACb-00019Q-C0; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:25:49 -0500 Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:25:49 -0500 Message-Id: From: Eli Zaretskii To: Chong Yidong In-reply-to: <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> (message from Chong Yidong on Sun, 04 Dec 2011 16:11:20 +0800) Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, md5i@md5i.com, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) > From: Chong Yidong > Cc: md5i@md5i.com, 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org > Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 16:11:20 +0800 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > >> Your pending input explanation is probably right. > > > > The question is: what input is pending? > > It's an X selection request event. I'm not sure where the request is > coming from---Gnome's clipboard manager, maybe. Looks like readable_events should filter out a few more event types, when passed READABLE_EVENTS_FILTER_EVENTS in `flags'? I could think of additional events that should not end sit-for, e.g. keyboard language switch. > OTOH, I don't see why the pending input doesn't trigger for Emacs 23, > since M-w copies to the primary selection there too. ?? Doesn't M-w copy to the clipboard now? > Maybe it's a subtle effect of one of the changes to the primary > selection code a few months ago. Probably. But selection requests shouldn't interrupt sit-for regardless, since (AFAIR) they can come in out of Emacs's control. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 04 10:59:58 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 15:59:58 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXETt-0006vu-33 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:59:58 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXETq-0006vm-Fv for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:59:55 -0500 Received: from bb121-6-69-237.singnet.com.sg ([121.6.69.237]:40426 helo=furball) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RXETN-0005rR-Al; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:59:26 -0500 From: Chong Yidong To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 23:59:15 +0800 In-Reply-To: (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 04 Dec 2011 06:25:49 -0500") Message-ID: <87obvopbu4.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, md5i@md5i.com, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) Eli Zaretskii writes: >> It's an X selection request event. I'm not sure where the request is >> coming from---Gnome's clipboard manager, maybe. > > Looks like readable_events should filter out a few more event types, > when passed READABLE_EVENTS_FILTER_EVENTS in `flags'? I could think > of additional events that should not end sit-for, e.g. keyboard > language switch... selection requests shouldn't interrupt sit-for > regardless, since (AFAIR) they can come in out of Emacs's control. I don't think sit-for should ignore selection requests. If so, doing (sit-for 10) would cause Emacs to stop responding to selection requests from other applications for 10 seconds. That doesn't sound right. The workaround of putting the (redisplay t) in kill-ring-save works because Fredisplay calls swallow_events(), which has code in it to process selection request events. I think the right fix is for input-pending-p to call swallow_events(), as below. Thoughts? *** src/keyboard.c 2011-12-01 18:27:52 +0000 --- src/keyboard.c 2011-12-04 15:58:03 +0000 *************** *** 10522,10527 **** --- 10522,10528 ---- || !NILP (Vunread_input_method_events)) return (Qt); + swallow_events (0); get_input_pending (&input_pending, READABLE_EVENTS_DO_TIMERS_NOW | READABLE_EVENTS_FILTER_EVENTS); From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 04 12:00:24 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Dec 2011 17:00:24 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXFQO-0008Ij-13 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 12:00:24 -0500 Received: from mtaout22.012.net.il ([80.179.55.172]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXFQL-0008IZ-UL for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 12:00:23 -0500 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout22.012.net.il by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVO00H00V4FUR00@a-mtaout22.012.net.il> for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 18:59:43 +0200 (IST) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.124.128.163]) by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVO00HEVV7IU910@a-mtaout22.012.net.il>; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 18:59:43 +0200 (IST) Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 18:58:40 +0200 From: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback In-reply-to: <87obvopbu4.fsf@gnu.org> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il To: Chong Yidong Message-id: <83k46cb7en.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> <87obvopbu4.fsf@gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, md5i@md5i.com, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) > From: Chong Yidong > Cc: md5i@md5i.com, 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org > Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 23:59:15 +0800 > > I don't think sit-for should ignore selection requests. If so, doing > (sit-for 10) would cause Emacs to stop responding to selection requests > from other applications for 10 seconds. That doesn't sound right. What happens if an application receives a selection request while it is busy with some long calculation? won't the response be delayed in that case as well? > I think the right fix is for input-pending-p to call swallow_events(), > as below. Thoughts? I'm no expert on this, but it looks OK. It only swallows selection requests, though; are these the only ones that can cause this kind of problems? From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Sun Dec 04 22:30:10 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2011 03:30:10 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXPFp-0006fl-Jr for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 22:30:09 -0500 Received: from ironport2-out.teksavvy.com ([206.248.154.183]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXPFn-0006fe-Dw for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 04 Dec 2011 22:30:08 -0500 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Av4EAKk53E64rweH/2dsb2JhbABEqAmCLoEGgXIBAQQBViMFCws0EhQYDSSIGrRTiyEEiC2aFoRP X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.71,297,1320642000"; d="scan'208";a="150886582" Received: from 184-175-7-135.dsl.teksavvy.com (HELO ceviche.home) ([184.175.7.135]) by ironport2-out.teksavvy.com with ESMTP/TLS/ADH-AES256-SHA; 04 Dec 2011 22:29:37 -0500 Received: by ceviche.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 030BA660D4; Sun, 4 Dec 2011 22:29:35 -0500 (EST) From: Stefan Monnier To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback Message-ID: References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> <87obvopbu4.fsf@gnu.org> <83k46cb7en.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 22:29:35 -0500 In-Reply-To: <83k46cb7en.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 04 Dec 2011 18:58:40 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, ejb@ql.org, Chong Yidong X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) > What happens if an application receives a selection request while it > is busy with some long calculation? won't the response be delayed in > that case as well? Yes, and that's a problem as well. Stefan From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Dec 05 10:18:19 2011 Received: (at 10195) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2011 15:18:19 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXaJ9-0000x7-26 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 05 Dec 2011 10:18:19 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXaJ6-0000wr-2W for 10195@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 05 Dec 2011 10:18:16 -0500 Received: from bb121-6-69-237.singnet.com.sg ([121.6.69.237]:40630 helo=furball) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RXaIP-0004Et-F8; Mon, 05 Dec 2011 10:17:34 -0500 From: Chong Yidong To: Eli Zaretskii Subject: Re: bug#10195: 24.0.92; M-w may no longer provide visual feedback References: <20111202110953.0484349381.qww314159@jberkenbilt-linux.appiancorp.com> <83aa7bc597.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3c6xltz.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <8362hyces6.fsf@gnu.org> <878vmty979.fsf@maru.md5i.com> <83r50lbogk.fsf@gnu.org> <87wradxe6b.fsf@gnu.org> <83obvpaswm.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5ussqmv.fsf@gnu.org> <87obvopbu4.fsf@gnu.org> <83k46cb7en.fsf@gnu.org> Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2011 23:17:25 +0800 In-Reply-To: <83k46cb7en.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sun, 04 Dec 2011 18:58:40 +0200") Message-ID: <87hb1fyrne.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.92 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 10195 Cc: 10195@debbugs.gnu.org, md5i@md5i.com, ejb@ql.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) Eli Zaretskii writes: > I'm no expert on this, but it looks OK. It only swallows selection > requests, though; are these the only ones that can cause this kind of > problems? They are the only ones I can think of. I'll go ahead and check in a fix along those lines. The READABLE_EVENTS_FILTER_EVENTS looks pretty sketchy to me; it's not clear that disregarding focus events like that is the right thing to do. But I'd rather not touch that part of the code now. From debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Mon Dec 05 10:21:16 2011 Received: (at control) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Dec 2011 15:21:16 +0000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXaLy-00011P-It for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 05 Dec 2011 10:21:15 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RXaLx-00011J-5Y for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 05 Dec 2011 10:21:13 -0500 Received: from bb121-6-69-237.singnet.com.sg ([121.6.69.237]:40632 helo=furball) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RXaLP-0004Qk-Uu for control@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 05 Dec 2011 10:20:40 -0500 From: Chong Yidong To: control@debbugs.gnu.org Subject: close 10195 Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2011 23:20:33 +0800 Message-ID: <87hb1fdozi.fsf@gnu.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: control X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -6.6 (------) close 10195 thanks From unknown Sun Jun 22 00:53:28 2025 Received: (at fakecontrol) by fakecontrolmessage; To: internal_control@debbugs.gnu.org From: Debbugs Internal Request Subject: Internal Control Message-Id: bug archived. Date: Tue, 03 Jan 2012 12:24:04 +0000 User-Agent: Fakemail v42.6.9 # This is a fake control message. # # The action: # bug archived. thanks # This fakemail brought to you by your local debbugs # administrator